That Banger review legitimately hurt my brain cells, even called them out for it and mentioned the interview which I read two times. So damn good. Don't care about Fantano so I didn't know he reviewed it. So whoever says DSO are a Nazi band is a fucking moron and more and more people are jumping on that boat. Glad this is up, gonna send it to a few people. Furthermore, I would like to adress what you said about the power of a word, it's very scary seeing so many words like Nazi, rape, fascist, pedos being thrown around like it's nothing. Their frequency lessens their potency, they lose their weight so to speak and many don't realize the implications. Stupidity is boundless but now we have the internet. These are absurdly funny times we're living in and I am not talking about politics exclusively. The amount of morons online is staggering and considering how much info is on our disposal, that makes everything even more absurd. Keep up the good work as always Wyatt, cheers dude!
Undeniably. I am not even into Black Metal so much, but I consider DSO as one of the best musical acts I have ever heard in my life. Drought changed how I looked at metal music.
The idea that the new DsO has bad lyrics is fucking laughable. The Furnaces of Palingenesia is one of very few metal albums where the lyrics make out one of the most important parts of the listening experience. That guy at Banger is a brainlet.
This was such a necessary video and I highly agree with your statements! It would be such a shame if the band is going to fall off due to an individual who has a controversial background, as if it applies to all of the band members, whose lyrical content has nothing to do with anything you can find in a Mikko Aspa solo project. You have all the right in the world to not support them in any way, but when you are a supposed big name in the music community whose opinion is heard by a lot of people, you have to be more careful with your research and how you label an entire band. And theneedledrop and especially BangerTV could have handled this situation way better, but instead, like you said, it's like they make DsO fans look guilty just by listening to this album!
I can't stand that blonde dude from Banger. He's by far the worst one. It's the icing on the cake that he's supposed to be a comedian but gets so offended at everything. Steve Hughes is the real metal comedian.
I've been listening to DSO since 2004 and their music, lyrics and beliefs have never displayed anything even close to national socialist, neo-nazi topics at all.
Thanks for the link to this great interview - I just learned of this controversy and the interview is crystal clear on the subject. We need more artists that operate beyond the kindergarten level of the good vs evil narrative.
i really can't understand metalheads politically correctness, they listen to a genere born and grown with controversial lyrics and subversive point of view about everything; i don't think that furnaces of palingenesia is a political manifesto, it is a piece of art with a lyric narration that describes a world of horror, i don't see any militant intention in this album; there's nothing that can be seen as a realistic plan of changing the world or nothing like that. And even if there were i don't see any problem with that, goddamn it's just aesthetic experience. It is like even metalhead can't understand their genere, they behave like christian fundamentalist condemning hevy metal in the 80s. As an art lover i'm really sad about the public reception of what i think is one of the greatest metal album of the last years. Really guys, this makes me hate people much more than what a piece of music can do.
Because it's the norm: In this current age, People love to pull Political correctness and them act like they're the ones in the write while demonizing others and forgetting about actual problems.
That was a phenomenal interview. Banger is hot garbage and I'm glad I bought most of Deathspells discography on wax. Extreme music must be free from censorship of any kind and people who say otherwise are not real fans.
It's very simple and not about "real" fans or anything imo. You either censor everything or censor nothing, otherwise people will look like idiots (which they do). I believe that any art form should be suspect to criticism but not censorship, no matter how controversial or stupid it is.
Gladly someone finally takes up sides with DsO, Its sad that Fantano decides to ditch the video of a album he truly liked (8/10) i am truly bothered that everyone focuses on Aspa who isnt even a official band member and only serves as a session member. i also found it pretty funny since they're latest album serves more as a mockery and rejection of Nazism. This music is not for weaklings who bind themselves to the morals of this society, And that there is more to it then being a left or right winged idiot.
I find it hilarious that tnd and others will review rappers who openly brag about murder, advocate violence and various illegal activities. With zero disclaimers. Everyone knows and assumes that listening to those artists does not equal supporting their beliefs. but the second some non blm non leftist artist is even associated with controversy, its all "disavow, disavow, disavow".
they will disavow whatever their overlords tell them to. Punching Nazis is whats hot now, nevermind all the rappers that are actual criminals or the rock stars that are actual pedophiles, those guys are fine/
@@midwesternabyss679 except that it is a manufactured controversy where everyone and their grandmother are labeled as neo nazis for daring to have opinions that deviate from the mainstream. The real neo-nazis are a minority that consist of larping feds and inbred retards. The people being attacked are normal everyday people that refuse to comply to corporate fascism and censorship. I have a feeling from your simple comment that you are part of the problem. Would you punch my grandmother because your corporate overlords tell you she is a neo-nazi? I would not harm actual neo-nazis. That shit is real fascism.
I think part of it is that people relate more to racism and sexual harassment than they do to violence and murder. No one alive knows what it feels like to be murdered, but many know what discrimination and harassment feels like.
@@resmiintelect5994 nah, I wouldn't punch your grandma. Just like I wouldn't punch my dad knowing that he's against interracial dating. Just like I hope no one would punch me for being against the mainstream myself. But the fact of the matter is, is that racism of any kind is wrong, and people should know that.
I lost a lot of respect for Banger after that DSO review. They basically just put themselves in the same muckraking sandbox that MetalSucks plays in. Haphazard research for the sake of clicks and Patreon donations.
i generally agree that art should be separated from the artist, especially when the band clearly isn't talking about what makes the separation needed, but there are a few things to note here: for one, i don't think fantano is entirely ungrounded for what he did. like any other person, he doesn't know everything about everything he enjoys (in both the case of deathspell omega and assumably disma as well) and i admit too that i had been a fan of the band for a while before finding out mikko aspa's ties to nsbm. and if you really read what he said in his community post, he doesn't have a problem with listening to music made by people with those ties or a problem with reviewing it. he just wanted to be able to address the ties, so people would know who they're supporting by streaming and purchasing the record. but some people might not have a problem with that. as stated in the video, mikko aspa is the only one in the band who share those political views, and the other members who don't necessarily agree aren't willing to let them get in the way of the music. by cutting off support for one member, you cut off support for all of them, even if they don't deserve it. though i can see the argument being made for not wanting to support people who are willing to put up with aspa's views. things like this all just fall into very personalized opinion stuff i think, and it's wrong to condemn someone i think for not wanting to listen to a band because of aspa's views and/or not wanting to support them. the bangertv dudes were definitely wrong for presenting the information in a very all encompassing way, and for dismissing the band's undeniably impressive skill and the music's pretty blatant message, but i can't say that mikko's actions aren't worth discussing. and i think the general "how are you getting offended and you're a black metal fan???" remark being shared in the comments is a bit laughable, as the genre has kind of outgrown its intended purpose in the advent of the internet, and having an interest in a specific style of music shouldn't reflect your association with the culture. you may want to keep it for yourself and have black metal only be what you want it to be, but there comes a point when you have to accept the impossible nature of that, and just know that what the genre might mean to you won't always mean the same to someone else, and that enforcing your perspective onto someone else will ultimately lead to the segregation of those perspectives, which means we could never get another band like deathspell omega! tl;dr - media is cut up into two segments: the art (the music itself) and the product (the context and stuff). deathspell omega is a great band who have a terrible person sing for them, and you should/do have the right to let that affect your opinion on the band and whether you're willing to give them your money on the product, but don't let that inherently shape how you view the art
@@mrmildman2370 the “line” is up to each individual and where they personally choose to draw it. There is no universal line that applies to everybody in terms of where to stop separating the art from the artist. Each person has to decide their own line for themselves.
the entire "how can you dislike nazis but like black metal??" argument is just an extremely basic view on black metal that a lords of chaos fan would agree with. black metal isn't just "ohhh we're so evil and we hate", black metal can be depressive, nihilistic, anti religion, hell sometimes even pro religion or discussing social issues even if it's rare. and hate doesn't always mean hate towards specific groups. black metal's hate is more towards the world and life in general. and imagine if we used this argument for genres like death metal or goregrind? "how can you dislike murder and torture if you're into goregrind??", looks pretty silly now doesn't it?
Say what you want about Mikko Aspa and his involvement with Deathspell Omega, but the fact remains that DsO is easily one of the most important, original and influential bands in all of extreme metal, and there is much value to be had in the genius of their music. Don’t throw the baby out with the bath water...
Are his vocals so unique that they really couldn’t hire someone else though? If he’s just a vessel and has no creative influence, then he should be easily replaceable.
@@emmanarotzky6565 his vocals are unique, and fit DsO perfectly, but if you read the interview with the band, it’s stated that part of the reason they continue to work with him is that this tension fires the creative juices. As an Artist myself, I totally understand what they mean, because sometimes I work with other artists with whom I have disagreements with, whether they be political or whatever, and that sense of tension can be invigorating in a way that isn’t present when I work with more “agreeable” sorts. Of course this kind of nuance will be completely lost on the broader culture, but it’s a reality for many artists
@@leperlord7078 I can’t remember which one, but there are only like 4 interviews with the band, so it shouldn’t be hard to find. They are interesting reads, so if you’re a fan I highly recommend them!
Great job, man. 1. We have known all of this shit about Mikko Aspa for a long time. The new interview cleared up a lot about the political vision of DsO and Hasjarl himself. 2. But there is an important point for me here: Even in the case that DsO and Hasjarl were nazis, we the left people we can not do another thing to admire Hasjarl´s astonishing music work. It is so unattainable by the rest of guitar players of the wolrd (nor just extreme guitar players) in terms of originality, atmosphere, novelty and skill that we WOULD HAD TO SPEAK ABOUT IT we wanted or no. Just Horror Ilogium from Portal is at a similar level. The rest of us guitar players are shit in comparison with these two geniuses, that´s a fact... no matter what their political visions are. We have to listen to them and shut our mouths. 3. As Zappa said: SHUT UP AND PLAY YOUR GUITAR.
personally, i don't give a fuck about DSO's political preference. I ain't sitting with them. I'm a fan of their music, being what they're about with that and how they've perform it and I'm a black guy.
This is a great video that everyone whose opinion on DSO is influenced by Aspa's politics should watch. DSO are not NSBM by any definition, and like you said, calling people who aren't Nazis Nazis is bad and has the potential to make the word lose its meaning. However, I do think there's a line that, when crossed, warrants that label (or "Neo-Nazi" in more formal contexts), and as an individual Aspa has crossed it. Even so, for the majority of his output the label "Neo-Nazi music" would be incorrect. I'm pretty far-left myself and think bigotry should be revealed and rejected, but it's incomprehensible to me how people can drop bands they like because they disagree with them politically or whatever, especially in cases where it's just one member being racist or something and the lyrics aren't about that shit... and even if it's lyrics, if the message doesn't resonate with the listener, why is it a big deal? Just say "I disagree with the message, but the music sounds good". Keep it a guilty pleasure if that's what it takes. In many cases there's also a whole lot of ambiguity due to shock value. Because sometimes shock value includes Nazi references, it can in some cases be hard to know for sure whether a band is actually NSBM or not, and personally I think it's best to make it as clear as possible even at the risk of alienating fans. I mean, if a band are not Neo-Nazis, they probably don't want their fanbase to be made up of Neo-Nazis, and if a band actually are Neo-Nazis, they probably don't want fans that they wish were dead. (Ironically NSBM fans are often among the first to go "X IS NOT NSBM" whenever there's a controversy, considering they spend the rest of their time arguing that bands that are obviously not NSBM are NSBM. Even a broken clock is right twice a day, I guess...) Anyway, Aspa is a great vocalist with a unique voice and style. Nothing can negate that. He's the perfect vocalist for DSO and it's a shame anyone has a problem with the band because of him. Presumably a lot of the same people have no problem listening to Mayhem or even Burzum, so it can also get kind of hypocritical.
I love black metal but know little about DSO so you're comment was helpful for me. I agree 1) leftist politics is best politics and 2) art can and should be separated from artists most of time. If the lyrics were fascistic it would take very good music for me to want to keep listening because sod listening to fascist nonsense. Glad to know that's not the case here. Also noticed a lot of bands preach fascism not because they believe it but just to shock, which I find immature and sad / try-hard, not to mention the part it plays in encouraging fash to mobilise and oppress - never a good thing. IMO it doesn't even fit the ethos of black metal culture, which is all about free expression and rebellion against theocratic conservative oppression of said expression while neo-nazis and other fascists are the ultimate conformers and simps to authority and its bullshit traditions.
You lay down with dogs, you get fleas. Or, don't work with Nazi's or pedophiles if you don't want your work tainted with their shit. That's common fucking sense. DSO has no one to blame but themselves.
@@Scrinwaipwr who do you think started using simps as an insult first nigga? Also lol at a self proclaimed leftist calling muh fascists and neo nazis ultimate comformers tell me you were born privileged without telling me you were born privileged
It's nice to see someone having a clear headed view on the whole DsO and NSBM thing here. I suspect that it's still going to blow even more out of proportion and ironically mean the album will be more successful. Also, I believe they confirmed their was a fourth member in that interview (drummer)? Perhaps just a session musician. But you can speak with the bassist on some metal forms.
Taurus Mortuus why not aid DsO in keeping any knowledge of their “secular” lives a secret? To be able to make such a mark on underground musick and French art as a whole, and only ever do a couple of interviews(conducted by factions of the old guard of black metal and the esoteric. No corpse paint antics in the woods... No going back and forth with civilians online,that will always be beneath them. No spamming social media with merch and videos of them rehearsing (which is one of the lamest things the internet has brought out of “black metal” musicians. They’re not interested in ingratiating their fans. It’s pretty boring
What ever happened to just saying I don't like Mikko Aspa but Deathspell still make good music? Wait what am I saying that wouldn't give people something to make a fuss about.
Because back then, nobody gave two shits. But in this day in age, everyone is so obnoxiously PC and have to shame people for doing the 'separate the art from the artist'.
For some reason, people have a hard time to detach a person's work from the person. This has always annoyed me, since I've never idolized any entity, but instead, I simply think that there's good and bad things to almost everything, heck, I could even give credit to parts of the Bible, where credit is due.
Everything on the right of Trotsky is NSBM, even if its not metal. Not a fan of deathspell omega and i'm tempted to buy the album just because those shmucks said not to buy it.
Tbh this is overreacting, DsO isn’t peste noire level by any means and people should just get over people having contrasting political views and enjoy the music
I'm here cause Anthony took the review down. I'm more likely to listen to something if someone says 'I took it down cause I don't want to get cancelled'. Free thinking is necessary to live.
The knee-jerkiness regarding black metal just makes me as a leftist, hate other leftists for weaponizing political correctness. It’s just opportunism at the end of the day and it accomplishes nothing. DSO is one of my favorite black metal bands and I will continue to listen to them while advocating anti-fascism.
If controversial topics trigger these people, they should be reviewing, *** NOT *** black metal. You don't have to agree or disagree with someone's personal views or actions to appreciate the music.
The bangertv video was such bullshit. 6 months or so before that review they had a video on avant-garde French black metal where both the founder of seasons of mist and the host gush over DSO. Same with Fantano. It’s just reactionary bullshit with little to no research done
BangerTV seemed to make it easy to jump the 'Fuck DSO train" and Fantano only buckled down because some cuck on his subreddit went all reeing to him on Twitter about it (probably showing that twitter that goes attacking bands because of "Nazi/facist connections" when it's just an antifa twitter account harassing bands and shit) and he didn't want another Fader incident.
@@AtrocityEquine01 I heard about the reddit stuff and I get the desire to not have another Fader incident on his hands but the timing of it bothers me a bit. Black metal seems to be the new buzzword for nazi and bowing to antifa or like-minded folks is a losing proposition. You'd think he'd know about Mikko considering his interviews and being in Clandestine Blaze. Same with bangertv. Aren't they journalists (in a loose sense of the word)? Every few months there's the new "nazi sympathizer" band and everyone just jumps on board, ignoring the fact they loved them before they made the nazi list.
@@Krieg41 It basically is. I personally blame Antifa Twitter because EVERYTHING is Nazi/Fascist to them, and when presented with evidence to the contrary, they just shrug it off. Well the thing with BangerTV and Fantano is that they refused to do any research because they didn't care. Back then, we didn't care about overly PC stuff, but now it's a big thing because it's now convient to complain
AtrocityEquine Antifa Twitter is pretty hilarious. I once saw a Twitter post from a guy from Canada complaining about feeling unsafe on a bus because a man wearing a Hellhammer shirt. He said it was depicting a lynching and he complained to the bus company. They actually replied and apologized. Never mind the guy was literally minding his own business, having some perpetually frightened guy taking pictures of him in secret. Ridiculous! The most frustrating part of those videos were the moral inconsistency of the people making them. One month they’re great, next nope, nazis. Then when they get called out they ignore the criticism or defend themselves without ever explaining what stopped them from doing their due diligence before the fear train came rolling in. I really imagine living in that much fear everyday...
as he stated in the post hes comfortable with the Burzum review up because he stated in a disclaimer in the beginning of the review that Burzum is "controversial" so in all honestly i understand where he's coming from on that standpoint
@@wyattxhim i can see you point i just don't think that his argument on deathspell holds if you consider that his stands against deathspell posture doesn't apply to burzum as well since they basically come from the same place.It's too convenient for me, which also make me think that the burzum review is there for it's more of traffic move more than anything.
Damn Wyatt you're a real one!! Where have all the sane and sensible people gone to? Thank you for speaking your mind regarding these things, its a fresh drink of water on a desert of bullshit!!
@@wyattxhim people need to utilize the Metal Archives lol it exists for this reason. If I have the slightest feeling of something being Nazi I hit the archives. MA mods are better at digging up dirt on bands than people who are on Twitter too much
I've listened to deathspell omega and clandestine blaze, and never cared to know who the members were. Why would I? I'm only interested in the music, if these people are looking for fangirl or fanboy groups, they are in the wrong genres. Ironically the quote from the interview doesn't implicate someone as nazi as much as it does make them more offensive (intentional, I'm sure).
Oh yeah. That dude from BangerTV is definitely very cringy and I cannot stand him. He's very pretentious and tries to act like a comedian. As for the band themselves, I've never actually heard Deathspell Omega personally but I've heard friends mention them from time to time, though I cannot recall certain things about what was said. This is not one of them. As for the whole Nazi thing, I find it just absurd that people can just throw that word around without consequence. Let's say that even if they were an NSBM band, so fucking what? Who gives a shit? I may not agree with the ideology of that sub-genre within black metal but I do not judge folks who listen to it and I do not think it should be censored. However, if you're going to go over for those views, be expected to face some backlash when it comes up. Other than that, as you said: regardless of their politicial views, they care more their music and sharing it with their fans. That's the whole point of metal. I find it funny that BangerTV doesn't say shit about bands like Goatmoon. Fucking hypocrites man.
Personally my stance here is that I'd rather not listen than be wilfully blind. I think the latest album blew up in controversy, due to it having more fringe lyrics. I get that people claim it's satire, but it's still a grey area for interpretation. Also if Asspa is so non essential to DsO they could just get a new vocalist. I get people won't like that but if they truly want to distance themselves from these claims that's the way. I think people are ignoring the red flags here just cuz they love the music so much. I do completely agree on TND portion, he handled it terribly. If he actually cared about the politics he'd make a video addressing the controversy and NSBM itself. He also continues to have poor priorities, like he made a video on Ariel Pink being shitty due to politics. But he fails to address the numerous sexual assault allegations against Sun Kil Moon, Mark Kozelek, a band he's given two 9 ratings. People can listen to what they want regardless of the creators views. Personally I wouldn't stand up for someone or a band with extreme ties. Just like how I wouldn't stand up for Mark Kozelek masturbating in front of his fans.
So you don’t support freedom of expression? Or anything that goes against your idea of right and wrong? You sound like someone that has the true fascist leanings like many of the individuals with your same mindset. Ironic to say the least.
My two cents on this whole DsO situation from almost 3 years ago is this: I don't like them as people (and the Finnish guy is a trashbag of a human being), but they are such a talented and forward-thinking band that has spawned LEAGUES of imitators over the years that it would be foolish to just brush 'em off just because the one vocalist happens to be a neo-Nazi. However, on the other hand, I can understand why Blayne from BANGERTV would feel this way; I get it. But he should have explained it a little more than just simply brushing it off like that. Kudos to you, Wyatt, for taking on this uncomfortable topic on your own terms!
Also I find it funny theneedledrop deleted the deathspell review for being controversial but deathspell aren’t political but has his vektor reviews and the reviews you mentioned that he’s talked pretty positively of not saying vektor or Disma are political but aren’t they controversial too ?
Totally agree. Banger TV All Metal and theneedledrop seem to have succumbed to the currently "mandatory" "political correctness" fashion (a worldspreaded fever that's lasting too much). In my opinion, as far as Deathspell Omega or any other artist "under suspicion" - no matter if reasonable or just "by proximity", in the best McCarthy's witch hunt style - don't openly use their music as a vehicle for N. propaganda or proselytism, there should not be any problem enjoying and /or judging their art for what it is. But of course the hypocritical Banger guy didn't even read the lyrics he makes scorn about.
@@dracula7919 I've been already where the self-righteous "owners of the truth" are. The thought (and language) police, the inquisitors, the social media lynchers, the "defenders of the freedom of speech" (ironically addicted to censorship, falsehood and summary parallel trials). You know nothing about me. Maybe I've been more politically lelftist and "socially conscious" than you can imagine. So probably it's me who has grown as a person. I despise NSBM (and Communism as well), but in my book nobody is NSBM or communist (or racist, misogynist, homophobic, etc) until he or she has expressely said it or has proved to be such thing with unquestionable FACTS. And even then, if I like their art, and their art is not used as an explicit vehicle for proselytism and indoctrination, of course I can enjoy it. I could at least take that clown from Banger (supposedly a MUSIC critic) for a honest and coherent person, no matter how wrong he was, if he showed himself equally angry, insulting and disrespectful towards a given artist he has discovered is (presumably) a communist. But I'm afraid that Stalin concentration camps, political crimes, pogroms and murderous antisemitism are "mysteriously" and systematically "overlooked" and "forgotten". But what do I know, after all? I'm aware that there's people who force themselves to "dislike" what they really liked just a minute ago as soon as they discover the artist (real or supposed) right wing ideology or some private life data. More than grown up persons, those are probably the chosen ones, just a step from postmodern saintliness.
Then that wouldn’t be freedom of art in their case. Regardless the backfire from people is understandable although it took people 15 years to notice this and all of sudden they’re acting like angels as if they weren’t aware of common knowledge stuff …
Bark off to those who thinks DSO is a NSBM. I'm asian and I worship DSO. they are godlike elite black metal band currently. those pricks who can't stand some little history of some individuals should just bark off from listening to black metal. 27 years listening to black metal and im still listening to it even if the bands are NSBM though i don't have any collections of NSBM materials. if anyone can listen to satanic music, why can't they listen to another form of evil music?
I just found this Interview of deathspell omega from 2000, quite interesting. Specially the following quote: "How do you see French scene these days ? What you think of strong NS influence with French black metal ? DO : The best days of the French scene are gone for long. Nowadays, bands like Mütiilation or Antaeus are still going strong, but the other great bands have vanished. Among the newcomers, there's not much worthy material. The NS influence of the French scene is something I don't care about. NS People don't evolve in the same realms as we do, they don't fight for the same values as us. Black Metal is Satanic, Pagan Metal is NS, but these styles don't have much in common. I of course am very proud of the brilliant actions of intolerance that took place during the National-Socialist era in Germany, and in Europe during WW2. To gaz the jews and so many liberal thinking people was fantastic. We, in Deathspell Omega, are definitely fascistic thinking people, and proud of it, but we don't feel close to this new wave of political pro-life bands" genius.com/Deathspell-omega-interview-northern-heritage-2000-annotated
See here's the thing about this interview, and a lot of people (especially Antifa twitter) don't mention: This was done by Shaxul, the band's _first_ vocalist. This was done for the soul purpose of shocking the shit out of the audience and pissing people off. This was way before the band adopted the esoteric/Georges Bataille worship writing.
That makes no sense. The needle drop has reviewed Peste Noire who is friends with the lead singer from M8L8TH. I doubt Nazi associations are the cause of him taking it down tbh.
Well it's more or less because Anthony doesn't want another Fader incident. Ever since the Fader crap, Anthony has become an obnoxious political sod who spams his political bias on twitter, even once saying "Centrism is dad rock" despite finding the mocking of "centrism" bad.
@@AtrocityEquine01 Centrism is being ignorant. One side wants to CONSTANTLY strip rights away from social minorities. The other side wants to fight back. If you think the middle is the best place to be, you are enabling violations of human rights. To do nothing when evildoers take away freedom, is the same as supporting it.
what is the question here? has anyone claimed dso are nsbm or just denounced them for being in the wrong for collaborating with a nsbm person. does being instrumental to a band for a decade exclude Asppa from being DsO? the critique of DSO requires moral assessment of the fact that they hired and gave voice and artistic platform (job) to an open nazi sympathizer (based again on facts, not interpretations) for a decade. don’t think we have to bullshit ourselves around the fact of who asppa is or that having him on board is controversial because it requires individual judgment of whether or not we accept neutral art/goods from a person who is immoral in their other behavior. we don’t need to relativize the immorality of nazi ideology. there are the arguably relative degrees such as that asppa has no creative say in DSO and that they personally distance themselves from his views, but neither inherently alters the fact. this video did not really offer substantial counterclaims or arguments in support of DSO besides being a big fan and feeling bad for being guilt tripped, neither of which helps. people have the right to denounce DSO based on the objective facts. for others if we can live with the fact and accept that it’s there, then there’s no need to bullshit ourselves around it…
Everything in blackmetal is "problematic" these days, it has everything to do with hipsters discovering BM and forcing their views onto a thriving scene... if you don't like something: don't listen to it, but i will, and i want to do that without being harrassed or threatened about it... current scene is a cringe fest, moreso than it was already lol
Has Deathspell Omega ever written a song about white supremacy, Nazism, etc? No? Well, I guess that means they aren't a Nazi band. You know, I've not seen the Nazi witch hunters go after any legitimate NS bands yet (save for maybe Goatmoon, but they're a grey area); it's always really big bands with at best some questionable connections, but never outright racists. I wonder if this is because actual NS bands are pretty underground and pose little threat to metal as a whole. They're going after "bigger prey," so to speak, and trying to "weed out the racists that are successful" rather than trying to block new ones. In short, I get the logic, but it's not fully realized.
@Patrick Bertlein it just seems a bit cartoony, almost a parody of sorts. The confusion arises from the inconsistencies I see in their self-image. Sure, they use a LOT of Nazi imagery, but their music goes back and forth on that. They're certainly not a purely NS focused band, which creates some questions.
Great video! So glad that RUclips recomended me this. Agree with you in all points. Miko Aspa just sings, Hasjarl is the main creativity force of the band. Start 'hating' a band just for statements that are not even in DsO's lyrics anywhere is pretty stupid. One thing is this guy and other DsO.
You are extremely on point dude i appreciate this video. You make a lot of good points and its too easy to just cast stones right now. Also funny its more of a trend because most of these people disowning these bands used to buy their records, merchandise and attend shows. So I'm extremely neutral on the whole thing. Music can be dangerous. Like the internet in general isn't dangerous?
Blaine gives the reason that offensive and extreme lyrical subject matter should upset metal fans...WTF? Does he get outraged about Cannibal Corpse Necropedophile? How about Deicide Kill the Christian? 🤔
In order for a band to be NSBM, shouldn't the lyrics of their songs and the overarching theme of their aesthetics and imagery be explicitely about nazism, if not openly and actively praising nazism? Thing is, Fantano has probably known for a while about his ties and never gave it more thought. Because he never cared and never had to. But because of RUclips's new policies, giving a high review to a band with alleged ties to neo-nazis may have been threatening his channel with demonetization or some sort of negative impact on his channel from the RUclips's algorithm. From that stand point, Fantano's actions are entirely rational. He was acting in the interests of his channel as his main source of revenue. If this video had a negative impact on his income, there was no reason to leave it there. The excuse he gave was just damage control.
@@wyattxhim Fantano I think tried to justify that it was before his opinions changed...but that still leaves the question why, especially for someone who's so political left.
Yeah... Uh... Furnaces had some of the greatest lyrics I've heard in black metal. That banger tv moron isn't even worth the effort of explaining how utterly wrong he is. Furnaces reads as sort of a deconstruction of how authoritarian regimes come to power by feeding off of people's resentment. It's quite creative that they have the energy of contrarian political dispositions playing out on the record too. Such a good band.
Haven't even gotten around to listening to this album yet. But, because of all this controversy going around I decided to go ahead and buy the LP. Thanks bangertv!
@@Ghoulstille They're still around being annoying muh satire. Also noticed they seem to hate people who use runes. Their whole "But the riffs" is also insulting.
Black Metal is for the elite. Call it whatever you like. Black Metal will never be for the masses and that is a good thing. Anything that bands can do to gatekeep the normies, larpers, and posers should be celebrated, including overt NSBM themes or alignment.
That Banger review legitimately hurt my brain cells, even called them out for it and mentioned the interview which I read two times. So damn good. Don't care about Fantano so I didn't know he reviewed it. So whoever says DSO are a Nazi band is a fucking moron and more and more people are jumping on that boat. Glad this is up, gonna send it to a few people.
Furthermore, I would like to adress what you said about the power of a word, it's very scary seeing so many words like Nazi, rape, fascist, pedos being thrown around like it's nothing. Their frequency lessens their potency, they lose their weight so to speak and many don't realize the implications. Stupidity is boundless but now we have the internet. These are absurdly funny times we're living in and I am not talking about politics exclusively. The amount of morons online is staggering and considering how much info is on our disposal, that makes everything even more absurd. Keep up the good work as always Wyatt, cheers dude!
Preach it.
For the record, Banger TV never used the terms "NSBM" or "nazi" in their video.
Bill Hansen “Nazi punks fuck off” on the skulls of their rating system. Which seems to me they did use that word “Nazis”
@@BillHansenTheMetalEvangelist Those cunts called DsO 'white power pedophiles'.
Zes Zes Zes Haha ya seriously.....they didn’t specifically say “Nazi” though
Deathspell Omega = one of the best Black Metal bands ever
- one of
the best
ever
Undeniably. I am not even into Black Metal so much, but I consider DSO as one of the best musical acts I have ever heard in my life. Drought changed how I looked at metal music.
Absolutely
...and now I am going to listen to Deathspell Omega \m/
Thanks for being a voice of reason and logic on this man.
The idea that the new DsO has bad lyrics is fucking laughable. The Furnaces of Palingenesia is one of very few metal albums where the lyrics make out one of the most important parts of the listening experience. That guy at Banger is a brainlet.
Smells like... weakness
Just listened to Paracletus for the first time. I loved it. I need to know more about this band.
You have to listen to it at least 50 more times.
Well said. I honestly didn't know much of the history of DsO members when I first listened to them. I just know that I freaking love their music.
Blayne is one of the reasons I stopped watching Banger TV. Too much politics with them. Deathspell Omega are amazing!!!
True.
This was such a necessary video and I highly agree with your statements! It would be such a shame if the band is going to fall off due to an individual who has a controversial background, as if it applies to all of the band members, whose lyrical content has nothing to do with anything you can find in a Mikko Aspa solo project. You have all the right in the world to not support them in any way, but when you are a supposed big name in the music community whose opinion is heard by a lot of people, you have to be more careful with your research and how you label an entire band. And theneedledrop and especially BangerTV could have handled this situation way better, but instead, like you said, it's like they make DsO fans look guilty just by listening to this album!
I can't stand that blonde dude from Banger. He's by far the worst one. It's the icing on the cake that he's supposed to be a comedian but gets so offended at everything. Steve Hughes is the real metal comedian.
Slaughter Lord is god!!
jumpfart666 Steve Hughes is god!
He's fucking cancer.
Damn straight he is, a true metalhead
@@clitoralrosary9474 what makes you say that then
I've been listening to DSO since 2004 and their music, lyrics and beliefs have never displayed anything even close to national socialist, neo-nazi topics at all.
Thanks for the link to this great interview - I just learned of this controversy and the interview is crystal clear on the subject.
We need more artists that operate beyond the kindergarten level of the good vs evil narrative.
People like Fantano are "repulsed" by them? Brb buying their merch.
BUY the LP's of DSO are some of the BEST Booklets ever in music
Thank you for doing such an informed and straight forward review!
You just gained a subscriber. Nice video my fellow logical human being.
i really can't understand metalheads politically correctness, they listen to a genere born and grown with controversial lyrics and subversive point of view about everything; i don't think that furnaces of palingenesia is a political manifesto, it is a piece of art with a lyric narration that describes a world of horror, i don't see any militant intention in this album; there's nothing that can be seen as a realistic plan of changing the world or nothing like that. And even if there were i don't see any problem with that, goddamn it's just aesthetic experience. It is like even metalhead can't understand their genere, they behave like christian fundamentalist condemning hevy metal in the 80s. As an art lover i'm really sad about the public reception of what i think is one of the greatest metal album of the last years. Really guys, this makes me hate people much more than what a piece of music can do.
Because it's the norm:
In this current age, People love to pull Political correctness and them act like they're the ones in the write while demonizing others and forgetting about actual problems.
So true, there are too many people ruinning more and more the entire scene with their weakness.
That was a phenomenal interview. Banger is hot garbage and I'm glad I bought most of Deathspells discography on wax. Extreme music must be free from censorship of any kind and people who say otherwise are not real fans.
It's very simple and not about "real" fans or anything imo. You either censor everything or censor nothing, otherwise people will look like idiots (which they do). I believe that any art form should be suspect to criticism but not censorship, no matter how controversial or stupid it is.
Censoring something would only ever lend it more potency if anything else.
Yeah there is no place in black metal for these "moralfags". They clearly think this is merely fashion
Gladly someone finally takes up sides with DsO, Its sad that Fantano decides to ditch the video of a album he truly liked (8/10) i am truly bothered that everyone focuses on Aspa who isnt even a official band member and only serves as a session member. i also found it pretty funny since they're latest album serves more as a mockery and rejection of Nazism. This music is not for weaklings who bind themselves to the morals of this society, And that there is more to it then being a left or right winged idiot.
@Kalervo Gummola The ona also encourages Anarchism.
Spoken like a true weakling.
Banger tv is irrelevant to black metal
Deathspell Omega are producing excellent music, with lyrics which require above-SJW IQ. Their message goes beyond politics.
makes it funnier considering some act smug and denounce them because Muh pretentious
When are people going to learn that controversy = publicity
BangerTV: Don't listen to DSO
Me: Well I'mma listen to it anyway.
Controversy creates cash
Last time I checked DSO have never confirmed their line up.
I normally like Banger, but GOD was this a huge misstep for them.
Liking BangerTV was your first misstep.
They gave Bodom's new album a freaking 3 star rating and called it "pop punk". Fuck Banger! That new album is a solid 4!
I find it hilarious that tnd and others will review rappers who openly brag about murder, advocate violence and various illegal activities. With zero disclaimers. Everyone knows and assumes that listening to those artists does not equal supporting their beliefs. but the second some non blm non leftist artist is even associated with controversy, its all "disavow, disavow, disavow".
they will disavow whatever their overlords tell them to. Punching Nazis is whats hot now, nevermind all the rappers that are actual criminals or the rock stars that are actual pedophiles, those guys are fine/
@@resmiintelect5994 I hope punching neo-nazis will always remain in fashion.
@@midwesternabyss679 except that it is a manufactured controversy where everyone and their grandmother are labeled as neo nazis for daring to have opinions that deviate from the mainstream. The real neo-nazis are a minority that consist of larping feds and inbred retards. The people being attacked are normal everyday people that refuse to comply to corporate fascism and censorship. I have a feeling from your simple comment that you are part of the problem. Would you punch my grandmother because your corporate overlords tell you she is a neo-nazi? I would not harm actual neo-nazis. That shit is real fascism.
I think part of it is that people relate more to racism and sexual harassment than they do to violence and murder. No one alive knows what it feels like to be murdered, but many know what discrimination and harassment feels like.
@@resmiintelect5994 nah, I wouldn't punch your grandma. Just like I wouldn't punch my dad knowing that he's against interracial dating. Just like I hope no one would punch me for being against the mainstream myself. But the fact of the matter is, is that racism of any kind is wrong, and people should know that.
I lost a lot of respect for Banger after that DSO review. They basically just put themselves in the same muckraking sandbox that MetalSucks plays in. Haphazard research for the sake of clicks and Patreon donations.
Wait, you had respect for BANGER TV in the first place? Lmao.
@@zlodrim9284 well they give DsO 5/5 in their another video
Doing research would imply being open-minded, which they aren't.
i generally agree that art should be separated from the artist, especially when the band clearly isn't talking about what makes the separation needed, but there are a few things to note here:
for one, i don't think fantano is entirely ungrounded for what he did. like any other person, he doesn't know everything about everything he enjoys (in both the case of deathspell omega and assumably disma as well) and i admit too that i had been a fan of the band for a while before finding out mikko aspa's ties to nsbm. and if you really read what he said in his community post, he doesn't have a problem with listening to music made by people with those ties or a problem with reviewing it. he just wanted to be able to address the ties, so people would know who they're supporting by streaming and purchasing the record.
but some people might not have a problem with that. as stated in the video, mikko aspa is the only one in the band who share those political views, and the other members who don't necessarily agree aren't willing to let them get in the way of the music. by cutting off support for one member, you cut off support for all of them, even if they don't deserve it. though i can see the argument being made for not wanting to support people who are willing to put up with aspa's views.
things like this all just fall into very personalized opinion stuff i think, and it's wrong to condemn someone i think for not wanting to listen to a band because of aspa's views and/or not wanting to support them. the bangertv dudes were definitely wrong for presenting the information in a very all encompassing way, and for dismissing the band's undeniably impressive skill and the music's pretty blatant message, but i can't say that mikko's actions aren't worth discussing.
and i think the general "how are you getting offended and you're a black metal fan???" remark being shared in the comments is a bit laughable, as the genre has kind of outgrown its intended purpose in the advent of the internet, and having an interest in a specific style of music shouldn't reflect your association with the culture. you may want to keep it for yourself and have black metal only be what you want it to be, but there comes a point when you have to accept the impossible nature of that, and just know that what the genre might mean to you won't always mean the same to someone else, and that enforcing your perspective onto someone else will ultimately lead to the segregation of those perspectives, which means we could never get another band like deathspell omega!
tl;dr - media is cut up into two segments: the art (the music itself) and the product (the context and stuff). deathspell omega is a great band who have a terrible person sing for them, and you should/do have the right to let that affect your opinion on the band and whether you're willing to give them your money on the product, but don't let that inherently shape how you view the art
Agreed
Would you listen to Lost Prophets now? Where's the line?
@@mrmildman2370 the “line” is up to each individual and where they personally choose to draw it. There is no universal line that applies to everybody in terms of where to stop separating the art from the artist. Each person has to decide their own line for themselves.
@@mrmildman2370 why would you want to listen to a shit band with a shit singer? The problem arises when the art is good
the entire "how can you dislike nazis but like black metal??" argument is just an extremely basic view on black metal that a lords of chaos fan would agree with. black metal isn't just "ohhh we're so evil and we hate", black metal can be depressive, nihilistic, anti religion, hell sometimes even pro religion or discussing social issues even if it's rare. and hate doesn't always mean hate towards specific groups. black metal's hate is more towards the world and life in general. and imagine if we used this argument for genres like death metal or goregrind? "how can you dislike murder and torture if you're into goregrind??", looks pretty silly now doesn't it?
Say what you want about Mikko Aspa and his involvement with Deathspell Omega, but the fact remains that DsO is easily one of the most important, original and influential bands in all of extreme metal, and there is much value to be had in the genius of their music. Don’t throw the baby out with the bath water...
Are his vocals so unique that they really couldn’t hire someone else though? If he’s just a vessel and has no creative influence, then he should be easily replaceable.
@@emmanarotzky6565 I honestly dont think anyone can replace him
@@emmanarotzky6565 his vocals are unique, and fit DsO perfectly, but if you read the interview with the band, it’s stated that part of the reason they continue to work with him is that this tension fires the creative juices. As an Artist myself, I totally understand what they mean, because sometimes I work with other artists with whom I have disagreements with, whether they be political or whatever, and that sense of tension can be invigorating in a way that isn’t present when I work with more “agreeable” sorts. Of course this kind of nuance will be completely lost on the broader culture, but it’s a reality for many artists
@@matternicuss Could u pls hook me up with that link/article interview where other members said that is why they continue to work with him?
@@leperlord7078 I can’t remember which one, but there are only like 4 interviews with the band, so it shouldn’t be hard to find. They are interesting reads, so if you’re a fan I highly recommend them!
Not to mention, he also reviewed In the Nightside Eclipse despite Faust murdering a homosexual.
Doooouble staaaandaaaards!
The dude from Bangertv is lame
Pissypants fucking moralizer
that video made me wish i could knock his ass out. infuriating display of worthless virtue signaling.
I can't stand that little whiny bitch either.
Soyboy
Just a Canadian that’s all.
Great job, man.
1. We have known all of this shit about Mikko Aspa for a long time. The new interview cleared up a lot about the political vision of DsO and Hasjarl himself.
2. But there is an important point for me here: Even in the case that DsO and Hasjarl were nazis, we the left people we can not do another thing to admire Hasjarl´s astonishing music work. It is so unattainable by the rest of guitar players of the wolrd (nor just extreme guitar players) in terms of originality, atmosphere, novelty and skill that we WOULD HAD TO SPEAK ABOUT IT we wanted or no. Just Horror Ilogium from Portal is at a similar level. The rest of us guitar players are shit in comparison with these two geniuses, that´s a fact... no matter what their political visions are. We have to listen to them and shut our mouths.
3. As Zappa said: SHUT UP AND PLAY YOUR GUITAR.
I recently started getting into these guys. They sure do know how to make black metal
I'm gonna buy the new album to suppor DSO.
personally, i don't give a fuck about DSO's political preference. I ain't sitting with them. I'm a fan of their music, being what they're about with that and how they've perform it and I'm a black guy.
This is a great video that everyone whose opinion on DSO is influenced by Aspa's politics should watch. DSO are not NSBM by any definition, and like you said, calling people who aren't Nazis Nazis is bad and has the potential to make the word lose its meaning. However, I do think there's a line that, when crossed, warrants that label (or "Neo-Nazi" in more formal contexts), and as an individual Aspa has crossed it. Even so, for the majority of his output the label "Neo-Nazi music" would be incorrect.
I'm pretty far-left myself and think bigotry should be revealed and rejected, but it's incomprehensible to me how people can drop bands they like because they disagree with them politically or whatever, especially in cases where it's just one member being racist or something and the lyrics aren't about that shit... and even if it's lyrics, if the message doesn't resonate with the listener, why is it a big deal? Just say "I disagree with the message, but the music sounds good". Keep it a guilty pleasure if that's what it takes.
In many cases there's also a whole lot of ambiguity due to shock value. Because sometimes shock value includes Nazi references, it can in some cases be hard to know for sure whether a band is actually NSBM or not, and personally I think it's best to make it as clear as possible even at the risk of alienating fans. I mean, if a band are not Neo-Nazis, they probably don't want their fanbase to be made up of Neo-Nazis, and if a band actually are Neo-Nazis, they probably don't want fans that they wish were dead.
(Ironically NSBM fans are often among the first to go "X IS NOT NSBM" whenever there's a controversy, considering they spend the rest of their time arguing that bands that are obviously not NSBM are NSBM. Even a broken clock is right twice a day, I guess...)
Anyway, Aspa is a great vocalist with a unique voice and style. Nothing can negate that. He's the perfect vocalist for DSO and it's a shame anyone has a problem with the band because of him. Presumably a lot of the same people have no problem listening to Mayhem or even Burzum, so it can also get kind of hypocritical.
I love black metal but know little about DSO so you're comment was helpful for me.
I agree 1) leftist politics is best politics and 2) art can and should be separated from artists most of time.
If the lyrics were fascistic it would take very good music for me to want to keep listening because sod listening to fascist nonsense. Glad to know that's not the case here.
Also noticed a lot of bands preach fascism not because they believe it but just to shock, which I find immature and sad / try-hard, not to mention the part it plays in encouraging fash to mobilise and oppress - never a good thing.
IMO it doesn't even fit the ethos of black metal culture, which is all about free expression and rebellion against theocratic conservative oppression of said expression while neo-nazis and other fascists are the ultimate conformers and simps to authority and its bullshit traditions.
You lay down with dogs, you get fleas. Or, don't work with Nazi's or pedophiles if you don't want your work tainted with their shit. That's common fucking sense. DSO has no one to blame but themselves.
@@Scrinwaipwr the pendulum swings.... even your lexicon is influenced by the knotseas lmao
@@bloodrain1776 uh huh, sure.
@@Scrinwaipwr who do you think started using simps as an insult first nigga? Also lol at a self proclaimed leftist calling muh fascists and neo nazis ultimate comformers tell me you were born privileged without telling me you were born privileged
Good to know that I'm not the only one frustrated with this.
thank you for this video, the banger and needledrop statements are so hypocritical and under-researched
Just false outrage, predictable and boring.
Well said Wyatt
It's nice to see someone having a clear headed view on the whole DsO and NSBM thing here. I suspect that it's still going to blow even more out of proportion and ironically mean the album will be more successful.
Also, I believe they confirmed their was a fourth member in that interview (drummer)? Perhaps just a session musician. But you can speak with the bassist on some metal forms.
The drummer is the main guys (Hasjarl/Christian's) brother.
@@GyroLamb Do you have any information on this? I believe the only source of information that's been provided is that Khaos is Hasjarl's brother.
Taurus Mortuus why not aid DsO in keeping any knowledge of their “secular” lives a secret?
To be able to make such a mark on underground musick and French art as a whole, and only ever do a couple of interviews(conducted by factions of the old guard of black metal and the esoteric.
No corpse paint antics in the woods...
No going back and forth with civilians online,that will always be beneath them.
No spamming social media with merch and videos of them rehearsing (which is one of the lamest things the internet has brought out of “black metal” musicians.
They’re not interested in ingratiating their fans.
It’s pretty boring
I love your channel so much, a genuine open minded individual who doesnt care for political correctness and knows how to seperate art and artist
God I hate Fantano
What ever happened to just saying I don't like Mikko Aspa but Deathspell still make good music? Wait what am I saying that wouldn't give people something to make a fuss about.
Because back then, nobody gave two shits. But in this day in age, everyone is so obnoxiously PC and have to shame people for doing the 'separate the art from the artist'.
Took the words out of my mouth!
For some reason, people have a hard time to detach a person's work from the person. This has always annoyed me, since I've never idolized any entity, but instead, I simply think that there's good and bad things to almost everything, heck, I could even give credit to parts of the Bible, where credit is due.
Everything on the right of Trotsky is NSBM, even if its not metal. Not a fan of deathspell omega and i'm tempted to buy the album just because those shmucks said not to buy it.
Right before I watched this I got an ad from a German insurance company lol
Made me wanna check out Deathspell Omega.
Tbh this is overreacting, DsO isn’t peste noire level by any means and people should just get over people having contrasting political views and enjoy the music
I'm here cause Anthony took the review down. I'm more likely to listen to something if someone says 'I took it down cause I don't want to get cancelled'. Free thinking is necessary to live.
You don’t have to agree with someone’s politics to enjoy their art/music anyway!
The knee-jerkiness regarding black metal just makes me as a leftist, hate other leftists for weaponizing political correctness. It’s just opportunism at the end of the day and it accomplishes nothing. DSO is one of my favorite black metal bands and I will continue to listen to them while advocating anti-fascism.
Absolutely fantastic video! You're turning into one of my favorite people I follow - remember the time when you used to annoy me sometimes.
This is the same person that gave Rivers of Nihil negative review.
That band does suck tho 😆😆
If controversial topics trigger these people, they should be reviewing, *** NOT *** black metal. You don't have to agree or disagree with someone's personal views or actions to appreciate the music.
The bangertv video was such bullshit. 6 months or so before that review they had a video on avant-garde French black metal where both the founder of seasons of mist and the host gush over DSO. Same with Fantano. It’s just reactionary bullshit with little to no research done
BangerTV seemed to make it easy to jump the 'Fuck DSO train" and Fantano only buckled down because some cuck on his subreddit went all reeing to him on Twitter about it (probably showing that twitter that goes attacking bands because of "Nazi/facist connections" when it's just an antifa twitter account harassing bands and shit) and he didn't want another Fader incident.
@@AtrocityEquine01 I heard about the reddit stuff and I get the desire to not have another Fader incident on his hands but the timing of it bothers me a bit. Black metal seems to be the new buzzword for nazi and bowing to antifa or like-minded folks is a losing proposition. You'd think he'd know about Mikko considering his interviews and being in Clandestine Blaze. Same with bangertv. Aren't they journalists (in a loose sense of the word)? Every few months there's the new "nazi sympathizer" band and everyone just jumps on board, ignoring the fact they loved them before they made the nazi list.
@@Krieg41 It basically is. I personally blame Antifa Twitter because EVERYTHING is Nazi/Fascist to them, and when presented with evidence to the contrary, they just shrug it off.
Well the thing with BangerTV and Fantano is that they refused to do any research because they didn't care.
Back then, we didn't care about overly PC stuff, but now it's a big thing because it's now convient to complain
AtrocityEquine Antifa Twitter is pretty hilarious. I once saw a Twitter post from a guy from Canada complaining about feeling unsafe on a bus because a man wearing a Hellhammer shirt. He said it was depicting a lynching and he complained to the bus company. They actually replied and apologized. Never mind the guy was literally minding his own business, having some perpetually frightened guy taking pictures of him in secret. Ridiculous!
The most frustrating part of those videos were the moral inconsistency of the people making them. One month they’re great, next nope, nazis. Then when they get called out they ignore the criticism or defend themselves without ever explaining what stopped them from doing their due diligence before the fear train came rolling in. I really imagine living in that much fear everyday...
what i think it's weird is that anthony took down the deathspell review but the burzum reviews still on the channel
as he stated in the post
hes comfortable with the Burzum review up because he stated in a disclaimer in the beginning of the review that Burzum is "controversial" so in all honestly i understand where he's coming from on that standpoint
@@wyattxhim i can see you point i just don't think that his argument on deathspell holds if you consider that his stands against deathspell posture doesn't apply to burzum as well since they basically come from the same place.It's too convenient for me, which also make me think that the burzum review is there for it's more of traffic move more than anything.
Banger TV ain't aware of the fact that Mikko ain't the original member of the band. He came afterwards.
Great vid, love your channel keep up the good work. Purchased FAS on vinyl the other day. Album SLAYS
Damn Wyatt you're a real one!! Where have all the sane and sensible people gone to? Thank you for speaking your mind regarding these things, its a fresh drink of water on a desert of bullshit!!
Black Metal artists not be fascists challenge
People being 15 years late to common knowledge to make themselves look like white knights challenge
@@wyattxhim people need to utilize the Metal Archives lol it exists for this reason. If I have the slightest feeling of something being Nazi I hit the archives. MA mods are better at digging up dirt on bands than people who are on Twitter too much
@@NOISECOREMafiaTV I know most people would roll their eyes at that take but it’s true.
I have never heard dso before but i will now thats for sure!
Anders Johansson how was it
I've listened to deathspell omega and clandestine blaze, and never cared to know who the members were. Why would I? I'm only interested in the music, if these people are looking for fangirl or fanboy groups, they are in the wrong genres. Ironically the quote from the interview doesn't implicate someone as nazi as much as it does make them more offensive (intentional, I'm sure).
Nicole12 is family friendly music
Oh yeah. That dude from BangerTV is definitely very cringy and I cannot stand him. He's very pretentious and tries to act like a comedian. As for the band themselves, I've never actually heard Deathspell Omega personally but I've heard friends mention them from time to time, though I cannot recall certain things about what was said. This is not one of them. As for the whole Nazi thing, I find it just absurd that people can just throw that word around without consequence. Let's say that even if they were an NSBM band, so fucking what? Who gives a shit? I may not agree with the ideology of that sub-genre within black metal but I do not judge folks who listen to it and I do not think it should be censored. However, if you're going to go over for those views, be expected to face some backlash when it comes up. Other than that, as you said: regardless of their politicial views, they care more their music and sharing it with their fans. That's the whole point of metal. I find it funny that BangerTV doesn't say shit about bands like Goatmoon. Fucking hypocrites man.
Personally my stance here is that I'd rather not listen than be wilfully blind. I think the latest album blew up in controversy, due to it having more fringe lyrics. I get that people claim it's satire, but it's still a grey area for interpretation.
Also if Asspa is so non essential to DsO they could just get a new vocalist. I get people won't like that but if they truly want to distance themselves from these claims that's the way. I think people are ignoring the red flags here just cuz they love the music so much.
I do completely agree on TND portion, he handled it terribly. If he actually cared about the politics he'd make a video addressing the controversy and NSBM itself. He also continues to have poor priorities, like he made a video on Ariel Pink being shitty due to politics. But he fails to address the numerous sexual assault allegations against Sun Kil Moon, Mark Kozelek, a band he's given two 9 ratings.
People can listen to what they want regardless of the creators views. Personally I wouldn't stand up for someone or a band with extreme ties. Just like how I wouldn't stand up for Mark Kozelek masturbating in front of his fans.
So you don’t support freedom of expression? Or anything that goes against your idea of right and wrong? You sound like someone that has the true fascist leanings like many of the individuals with your same mindset. Ironic to say the least.
disagreeing with the art should be a sign that you're not cut out for it, good riddance and such
Seriously you got a ton of nazis in your comment section. If I were you I’d get rid if them.
I think I have over the past recent months with my RABM video and my low tier satirical political videos
Well said! And I have to ask what is the banner in the background?? Fucking awesome
My two cents on this whole DsO situation from almost 3 years ago is this: I don't like them as people (and the Finnish guy is a trashbag of a human being), but they are such a talented and forward-thinking band that has spawned LEAGUES of imitators over the years that it would be foolish to just brush 'em off just because the one vocalist happens to be a neo-Nazi. However, on the other hand, I can understand why Blayne from BANGERTV would feel this way; I get it. But he should have explained it a little more than just simply brushing it off like that. Kudos to you, Wyatt, for taking on this uncomfortable topic on your own terms!
Also I find it funny theneedledrop deleted the deathspell review for being controversial but deathspell aren’t political but has his vektor reviews and the reviews you mentioned that he’s talked pretty positively of not saying vektor or Disma are political but aren’t they controversial too ?
How are Vektor political in some controversial way ?
Totally agree. Banger TV All Metal and theneedledrop seem to have succumbed to the currently "mandatory" "political correctness" fashion (a worldspreaded fever that's lasting too much).
In my opinion, as far as Deathspell Omega or any other artist "under suspicion" - no matter if reasonable or just "by proximity", in the best McCarthy's witch hunt style - don't openly use their music as a vehicle for N. propaganda or proselytism, there should not be any problem enjoying and /or judging their art for what it is. But of course the hypocritical Banger guy didn't even read the lyrics he makes scorn about.
No its just called growing as a person.
@@dracula7919 I've been already where the self-righteous "owners of the truth" are. The thought (and language) police, the inquisitors, the social media lynchers, the "defenders of the freedom of speech" (ironically addicted to censorship, falsehood and summary parallel trials). You know nothing about me. Maybe I've been more politically lelftist and "socially conscious" than you can imagine. So probably it's me who has grown as a person.
I despise NSBM (and Communism as well), but in my book nobody is NSBM or communist (or racist, misogynist, homophobic, etc) until he or she has expressely said it or has proved to be such thing with unquestionable FACTS. And even then, if I like their art, and their art is not used as an explicit vehicle for proselytism and indoctrination, of course I can enjoy it.
I could at least take that clown from Banger (supposedly a MUSIC critic) for a honest and coherent person, no matter how wrong he was, if he showed himself equally angry, insulting and disrespectful towards a given artist he has discovered is (presumably) a communist. But I'm afraid that Stalin concentration camps, political crimes, pogroms and murderous antisemitism are "mysteriously" and systematically "overlooked" and "forgotten".
But what do I know, after all? I'm aware that there's people who force themselves to "dislike" what they really liked just a minute ago as soon as they discover the artist (real or supposed) right wing ideology or some private life data. More than grown up persons, those are probably the chosen ones, just a step from postmodern saintliness.
Why wouldn’t they just choose a different front person? There’s plenty of great vocalists. Seems off.
Then that wouldn’t be freedom of art in their case.
Regardless the backfire from people is understandable although it took people 15 years to notice this and all of sudden they’re acting like angels as if they weren’t aware of common knowledge stuff …
Bark off to those who thinks DSO is a NSBM. I'm asian and I worship DSO. they are godlike elite black metal band currently. those pricks who can't stand some little history of some individuals should just bark off from listening to black metal. 27 years listening to black metal and im still listening to it even if the bands are NSBM though i don't have any collections of NSBM materials. if anyone can listen to satanic music, why can't they listen to another form of evil music?
Who cares as long as they play their instruments to the level of madness.
I just found this Interview of deathspell omega from 2000, quite interesting. Specially the following quote:
"How do you see French scene these days ? What you think of strong NS influence with French black metal ?
DO : The best days of the French scene are gone for long. Nowadays, bands like Mütiilation or Antaeus are still going strong, but the other great bands have vanished. Among the newcomers, there's not much worthy material. The NS influence of the French scene is something I don't care about. NS People don't evolve in the same realms as we do, they don't fight for the same values as us. Black Metal is Satanic, Pagan Metal is NS, but these styles don't have much in common. I of course am very proud of the brilliant actions of intolerance that took place during the National-Socialist era in Germany, and in Europe during WW2. To gaz the jews and so many liberal thinking people was fantastic. We, in Deathspell Omega, are definitely fascistic thinking people, and proud of it, but we don't feel close to this new wave of political pro-life bands"
genius.com/Deathspell-omega-interview-northern-heritage-2000-annotated
See here's the thing about this interview, and a lot of people (especially Antifa twitter) don't mention:
This was done by Shaxul, the band's _first_ vocalist. This was done for the soul purpose of shocking the shit out of the audience and pissing people off. This was way before the band adopted the esoteric/Georges Bataille worship writing.
@@AtrocityEquine01 Read the new interview with them on Bardo Methodology. DsO abandoned that thinking a looong time ago.
Sorry! Meant to tag @barock
@@theywhoneverwas All good man.
That makes no sense. The needle drop has reviewed Peste Noire who is friends with the lead singer from M8L8TH. I doubt Nazi associations are the cause of him taking it down tbh.
Well it's more or less because Anthony doesn't want another Fader incident.
Ever since the Fader crap, Anthony has become an obnoxious political sod who spams his political bias on twitter, even once saying "Centrism is dad rock" despite finding the mocking of "centrism" bad.
@@AtrocityEquine01 Centrism is being ignorant. One side wants to CONSTANTLY strip rights away from social minorities. The other side wants to fight back. If you think the middle is the best place to be, you are enabling violations of human rights. To do nothing when evildoers take away freedom, is the same as supporting it.
what is the question here? has anyone claimed dso are nsbm or just denounced them for being in the wrong for collaborating with a nsbm person. does being instrumental to a band for a decade exclude Asppa from being DsO?
the critique of DSO requires moral assessment of the fact that they hired and gave voice and artistic platform (job) to an open nazi sympathizer (based again on facts, not interpretations) for a decade.
don’t think we have to bullshit ourselves around the fact of who asppa is or that having him on board is controversial because it requires individual judgment of whether or not we accept neutral art/goods from a person who is immoral in their other behavior. we don’t need to relativize the immorality of nazi ideology. there are the arguably relative degrees such as that asppa has no creative say in DSO and that they personally distance themselves from his views, but neither inherently alters the fact.
this video did not really offer substantial counterclaims or arguments in support of DSO besides being a big fan and feeling bad for being guilt tripped, neither of which helps. people have the right to denounce DSO based on the objective facts. for others if we can live with the fact and accept that it’s there, then there’s no need to bullshit ourselves around it…
NSBM - Nice Super Black Metal , so yeah , definitely
Thanks for sharing the link to the interview. That's all.
Separate the art from the artist. But only for leftists, of course.
And even if they actually were, who cares? This is EXTREME music, if somebody gets offended by everything easily then this is not your cup of tea...
Paracletus - the best of DSO
Deathspell Omega Are New Super Mario Bros ?????
Everything in blackmetal is "problematic" these days, it has everything to do with hipsters discovering BM and forcing their views onto a thriving scene... if you don't like something: don't listen to it, but i will, and i want to do that without being harrassed or threatened about it... current scene is a cringe fest, moreso than it was already lol
Has Deathspell Omega ever written a song about white supremacy, Nazism, etc? No? Well, I guess that means they aren't a Nazi band.
You know, I've not seen the Nazi witch hunters go after any legitimate NS bands yet (save for maybe Goatmoon, but they're a grey area); it's always really big bands with at best some questionable connections, but never outright racists. I wonder if this is because actual NS bands are pretty underground and pose little threat to metal as a whole. They're going after "bigger prey," so to speak, and trying to "weed out the racists that are successful" rather than trying to block new ones.
In short, I get the logic, but it's not fully realized.
@Patrick Bertlein it just seems a bit cartoony, almost a parody of sorts. The confusion arises from the inconsistencies I see in their self-image. Sure, they use a LOT of Nazi imagery, but their music goes back and forth on that. They're certainly not a purely NS focused band, which creates some questions.
RUclips got my Nicole 12 video down :(
Very nice videos you got there.
Nice to see u around pal.
Great video! So glad that RUclips recomended me this. Agree with you in all points. Miko Aspa just sings, Hasjarl is the main creativity force of the band. Start 'hating' a band just for statements that are not even in DsO's lyrics anywhere is pretty stupid. One thing is this guy and other DsO.
You are extremely on point dude i appreciate this video. You make a lot of good points and its too easy to just cast stones right now. Also funny its more of a trend because most of these people disowning these bands used to buy their records, merchandise and attend shows. So I'm extremely neutral on the whole thing. Music can be dangerous. Like the internet in general isn't dangerous?
Wtf? I like Deathspell Omega even more now.
I've bought records from Mikko Aspa many times. It's a good store.
Cheers from Russia. Great video
Blaine gives the reason that offensive and extreme lyrical subject matter should upset metal fans...WTF? Does he get outraged about Cannibal Corpse Necropedophile? How about Deicide Kill the Christian? 🤔
At one time I listened to Goatmoon and Satanic Warmaster but than a Vegan pro-censorship "progressive" next to a NIN and Epica poster told me not to.
This dude wears his hat the right way 🤘🏼
In order for a band to be NSBM, shouldn't the lyrics of their songs and the overarching theme of their aesthetics and imagery be explicitely about nazism, if not openly and actively praising nazism?
Thing is, Fantano has probably known for a while about his ties and never gave it more thought. Because he never cared and never had to. But because of RUclips's new policies, giving a high review to a band with alleged ties to neo-nazis may have been threatening his channel with demonetization or some sort of negative impact on his channel from the RUclips's algorithm. From that stand point, Fantano's actions are entirely rational. He was acting in the interests of his channel as his main source of revenue. If this video had a negative impact on his income, there was no reason to leave it there. The excuse he gave was just damage control.
but then that still leaves the question.... why even have those previous reviews up still
@@wyattxhim Fantano I think tried to justify that it was before his opinions changed...but that still leaves the question why, especially for someone who's so political left.
Yeah... Uh... Furnaces had some of the greatest lyrics I've heard in black metal. That banger tv moron isn't even worth the effort of explaining how utterly wrong he is.
Furnaces reads as sort of a deconstruction of how authoritarian regimes come to power by feeding off of people's resentment. It's quite creative that they have the energy of contrarian political dispositions playing out on the record too.
Such a good band.
Haven't even gotten around to listening to this album yet. But, because of all this controversy going around I decided to go ahead and buy the LP. Thanks bangertv!
Im so glad you made this video, I was so pissed when Banger Tv said that shit. What a joke. Hails
Toilet Ov Hell are the ones who started this drama it seems to me
Specifically the guy who runs ToH. BASICALLY he posted a tweet screeching how he doesn't wanna discuss DsO because Muh Aspa.
Wow i totally forgot about that blog for nearly the past 2 years.
@@Ghoulstille They're still around being annoying muh satire.
Also noticed they seem to hate people who use runes. Their whole "But the riffs" is also insulting.
Black Metal is for the elite. Call it whatever you like. Black Metal will never be for the masses and that is a good thing. Anything that bands can do to gatekeep the normies, larpers, and posers should be celebrated, including overt NSBM themes or alignment.
...Even so...it's not just different views...it's not just Social security vs no taxes...It's criminal and killing thoughts. What do you think?
Squeamish choir boys reviewing the wrong niche.