I love jet lag and I have watched every season. I’m 77 years old and I’m just so impressed by these young men who were able to come up with all of these different iterations of jet lag. Every time I watch them I am more and more impressed.
I agree with their justification of cards and audience interpretation. It's skewed because when they spend 3 hours on one train ride we see 15 seconds of that but when they spend 15 minutes clearing a curse we see all 15 minutes and it feels like that was a huge waste of their time when in reality more of their time is spent on transit.
Yah but their justification of not paying too much attention to the cards is wild. After you hide, essentially all your focused on is card management. Not to say there aren't other things you need to worry about but with that said, by and large the most important part is your cards when your hiding.
@@davidross918 Not entirely true, since finding a good hiding spot and rationalizing it against the questions that may uncover it probably eats far more time than most expects. Sam's case is very unique in that he immediately pulled the move card which then meant that finding a hiding spot didn't matter at all in his zone, at which point one could immediately start preparing for the future location. But that aside, (I've yet to watch the whole thing) like they said the audience focuses a lot more on the cards for various reasons, mostly because they're easy to follow. While I think the actual thing that makes or breaks these games are the questions, knowing how to play around them is key more so than the cards. There's incredible potential in terms of time sink when going over questions, mapping out distances and choosing your spot with all of this in mind. EDIT: Note that Sam's hiding spot in the last episode wasn't really elaborated upon but he probably on the fly decided relatively late that being under a bridge for the photos was going to serve him well which we've seen before.
And, crucially, the viewers have close to complete information about where the seeker's heads are at and what kinds of cards when will cause them problems or send them in the wrong direction. whereas the hider is just having to guess based on where they are and what questions they are asking. they could mirror out their maps maybe but they're going to miss any mistakes that the seekers make, like underestimating how far down the peninsula Ben could have gotten.
I think they should guarantee everyone 2 runs but have a 24 hour break the moment everyone has taken their first run. Would make it more fair for the 3rd player and solve the exhaustion problem on the final days
but it would increase their production costs. fact they start playing day after they get there is also indication they want to minimise time spent in country
@@mremumerm time constraints aside, a full days break in between the first and second series of runs would probably alleviate a lot of the fatigue, so I'm with allu there. They are busy people though, especially Sam, I'm not sure how much time they can reasonably spend filming a single season as this would likely make it 7 or 8 full days in another country travelling, vs 4 or 5 like most seasons are
And after the 24 hour break, the order should be randomized. That way they can all spend the 24 hours planning as if they were the ones who would be taking the next run, but not knowing for sure until that morning.
@@mremumerm I don't think they start playing immediately the day after they get there. During this season all 3 guys indicated that they had spent time in the country doing stuff before the game began. Ben and Adam said that they had done trial runs of the game within Tokyo, and Sam talked about having gone up to Mt. Fuji a few days earlier/prior to filming.
As someone who is... pretty critical on the couch when watching Jet Lag (and I agree with many of the comments, though I don't usually comment) I also don't think the sort of analysis of the game isn't always meant to be criticism of the players. I'm sure there are people who are frustrated with you, the players, genuinely and who are being mean. But for me, this is my favorite show, I love strategy and I love getting into the nitty gritty of it. I enjoy screaming USE THE VETO at the screen or pacing in front of my TV about why Sam didn't use that curse. But ultimately this is a game with humans, who are working long days and where human "error" makes or breaks the game (from both hider and seeker side). So of course it's easy to see in a one hour cut of your day which moves might have been more optimal.
There's a paradox in that genuine misplays make the content more engaging. I want them to play optimally and yet if they do the content would be worse off, in a way. They're very human in the way they play and that's what I love. They've made a great game and they're not the best at it. This is GOOD!
@@PoliceAlarm It's very similar to sports. We want everything to be fair, but we also want something to talk about / complain about. It drives engagement.
Agreed. It's unfortunate though because I liked the idea of a longer game so everyone gets two guaranteed runs. Maybe some sort of break in the middle would be nice?
But then a problem would occur because in most countries, from what I know is the schedule changes on a day of the week (Sundays normally) for the day of rest, that would mean that a run might be affected by this, unless you set the start date to allow for this rest day on the Sunday
Maybe increasing the off time each day would solve this issue. But we also need to factor in the weather, which was really hot this time and may be fine in the next iteration.
I think Sam explained the most important essence of Jet Lag, and it's that the players trust each other. Seeing the trio become so competitive but still do things in good faith (albeit they wish for each other's trains to explode 😂), is a constant reminder that the game is just all for fun and it lessens the frustration I have as a viewer with their misadventures and errors.
We could call in a bomb threat 😂😂 i love casually being willing to make your friend think they might die just to win a little game with no real prize whatsoever
it helps that first an foremost they want to make an entertainment product. and they already tested the limits of what the audience will approve (looking at you sam) in terms of rule-bending.
@@TheCodysbiggestfanWhat do you mean “no real prize”? They get the biggest trophy you have ever seen. And remember kids, the “real prize” is always the friends we make along the way!
We’re not disappointed, we were rooting for sam and engaging with the show! Dont be so hard on yourselves about it, just take the feedback for the next runs 😉
The discussion of how information is conveyed to the audience, what's explained, what's not, and at what point things are revealed gets really interesting, especially towards the end of this.
Great chat. I met Tom Scott in October after his Lateral live recording and told him I hope he'll be on Jet Lag one day. Then I felt stupid thinking he must have known then and I just learnt he didn't! They only asked him in November 😁😁 Can't wait for next season!
i think maybe it would be good for all of yall to incorporate break days inbetween? like a day where all of you can rest halfway through and no one is allowed to check train scedules etc? that way your body and mind can be more rested and errors might not occur. love the format and it was the best season to watch yet!!
Jet Lag: Hide and Seek is probably one of my favorite game concepts and I'm glad they are so committed to fine tuning. Definitely need to work on the end game but I'm a sucker for good navigation challenges and on a country scale makes for a fun watch. And they do more with a single handheld and an interesting location than all of Beast Games did with all the Amazon money. I do think one card slot in the hand needs to be dedicated to accumulating time bonuses up to a set limit. And curses don't have a card cost but a minute/hour cost. That way the hider is gambling time spent against the potential time wasted and there's a greater decision than just dropping 5min. And its an easier variable to balance against. My argument is that the over-saturation of low value time bonuses devalues late-game questions. A good hiding spot may require several questions but a string of bad draws will equate to free questions for the seekers. A bad hiding spot may not need any questions but the hider can go in with an already optimized hand. Also, they need end-game spesific activities and hider counter-play that would have them engage with the location. Like the hider can neutralize a tentacle location by spending an hour there. Or the hider can complete a scavenger hunt/quiz of the place to lock in some time bonus. Lets them scope out an area and showcase a small town we'd never otherwise know of. A fun interplay would be for the hider to set up a bunch of challenges in his zone and that awards more critical information. That way it sort of gives the feel that the seekers are now coming onto the hiders turf and taps into a hone vs. away team theme.
There is so so much more than we are aware of and in all fairness, this has to be kept in mind by the audience. I was also quite disappointed by the finale and ultimaltely with Sam's descision but he's only human and was tired af after 6 straight days of travel. It's kinda like watching football where every spectator seems to know it better than be players... This being said, much love to the boys
Sam says that, as players, they focus on other aspects of the game besides the cards. However, in the last episode, he mentioned choosing the final hiding spot based on 'vibes,' which made it seem like no thought was put into that decision. I've seen a lot of people criticize that. But on the Layover he said that he spend his time researching, just that no place popped as 'the one'. I looked at the map, and picking the station in the area he did was definitely the best choice. The issue seems to be the viewers' impression that he picked the train at random.
Agreed. If in the episode Sam had said "I spent the last several hours researching, and it seems that all my options are about equally 'meh', so I'm just going to leave it up to chance," the result would have been the same and it would have killed most of the audience complaints.
I think a good way to make the Veto card be more likely to be used, would be to simply put a delay on how soon you can re-ask the same question. Neither over nor under powered and results in it not just being a throw-away card.
Great idea. I think it's fine to just completely ban the question though. We've already seen them find ways to ask other questions, because they didn't want to give them double cards. But your idea works well too.
As a blind person let me answer your question, I one love the bird sound idea and also got a cane that would let me know there is a dropoff and track coming, I'm blind not stupid, but them using a natural sound you already hear around is indeed not foolproof, I wouldn't blindly wind up on the tracks but I definitely see myself full confidence stride up to a wall or a empty space with a bird thinking "oh stairs" to add onto the other senses, yes that would help deduct it, depending on how high the sound of the stair bird is to a flying or ground hopping bird, and they have I think tactile paths of yellow lines or dots in their stations too to follow so I wouldn’t diverted fast from that but use to go to a stair sound in an unknown station. Also I love Jetlag, I started watching when I saw more and was visually impaired, and now still I never felt like I missed much, Sam reading out all the questions and cards, the amazing sound design and sound for things like curses I hear it before the speech and know what it is: the tower sound was so awsome and unique and great to understand, the explaining and fun dialogue. I do miss all graphics and maps ect, but still follow along, I also used to be a visual and graphic designer and am still a designer in other ways and got a photographic memory so call me having an advantage over other blind folks, but Jet lag is pretty accessible for me (:
I do agree with Sam that that run almost definitely didn't have a chance of being a winning run even if he played that jammed door curse. They were in a heavy metro area with a lot of train options, so even if they got locked out of a train they'd have several other options at all times so the amount of luck needed to delay them for the full three hours would've been astronomical to the point of it not really being a chance at all. Should he have played it anyways? Yes, but if Ben and Adam were anything to go by they were all dead tired. Doing this for 11 - 12 hours a day for 6 days is rough. Admittedly the combo would've been amazing, but like they said it was hours after he had played it and probably forgot about it.
i feel like the real fumble in that run was moreso not using the veto on one of the key area-narrowing questions; throwing an appropriate wrench in the works could've messed with them long enough burn more questions and accrue more cards.
@@lordalex027 Choosing the ban 3 questions curse instead would have been a good play too to ban the tallest building question and maybe some tentacles that work well in the area
@@1e1001you’re still missing the point. High train frequency means that every failed dice roll would result only in like 3-5 minutes of time delay. Same for train stations - some are so close, that you can just walk to a different one, instead of waiting 15 minutes for a reroll. Even more - seekers can adjust and instead of 3 stops with 1 question each just do 1 stop with 3-4. With good luck, Jammed Door would have won something around 30-45 minutes. Sam needed 3 hours.
@@allu7112honestly this. I think Sam’s biggest mistake was picking Jammed Door in the first place, knowing an area he was dealing with. Both Mediocre Travel Agent and Drained Brain were better imo.
Ive always been impressed how great your teamwork is. If any of you disagree on what to do, you discuss it calmly and decide what to do with no hard feelings if you don't get your way. very mature and great to watch.
From an audience perspective, I think part of the reason the audience were way more focused on the cards than the players were is because they kept including adverts trying to get us to buy the cards. Like I'm not faulting them for that, people have been asking for a home game for ages and they clearly worked hard on it, but with that context I think it makes a lot of sense that the viewers were going "ah yes, clearly these cards are the point of the game".
My suggestion for a suspenseful finale is additive times. The best 2 runs will be counted at the end of gametime. This incentivises the competitive side and brings it more into a sport-category.
I love Jet Lag, I think the boys did great and had fun along the way. Winning the game shouldn’t be the end all be all, it’s the ride along the way. I absolutely love them and Im very excited for more to come.
I really just want my yelling to magically reach one of the boys when they have a veto card and all they can see are really REALLY unique buildings. Lol fully engaged with it and it was one of the best seasons yet great work all. 😊
Curses had nice explanations in text format. It could be also done with power ups, that way the pacing is the same, but dedicated watchers can pause and read a more detailed explanation
A few other factors that make me root for the hider, even though I'm definitely invested in the game from a tactical perspective as well as a sightseeing one: - because the hider is purely reactive once they're in their zone (they can't really move, and they only get cards based on the seekers actions) they feel like the underdog, and we love rooting for an underdog - The hider making it a long time is the only way to change the game state-If they get caught immediately, the leaderboard stays the same. Rooting for someone to change the status quo is a much better narrative than rooting for someone to maintain it. Add to that, as was pointed out in the episode, that the hider's strategic situation is accessible to the audience in a way that the seekers' isn't, and I think you'll find that even players who aren't focused on the destinations still get invested in hider strategy
It would be really helpful if there was a 10-15min introduction video explaining the rules and features of the game. It's more fun to watch when you can fully follow 😊
1:12:00 Bingo. We as the audience like to know the whole game, not just so we can try it at home, but also so we can play along strategies with you. You don't know how many times, while watching a season, I went to a map application and looked up the area to see the different possibilities.
I agree with Adam that the Strava map shouldn't need to be north-south oriented. I actually wasn't sure whether that was a requirement or not, but I like that the rotation being unknown adds some more difficulty to matching it.
Whether nice or horrible, it's still a good thing because they're talking about Jet Lag, which at the end of the day is what you really want. That means people care about the show, probably enough to want more.
29:43 countering their points here. i actually think knowing where the hider is sometimes makes me root for the seeker more. or maybe it feels a bit more even than just rooting for the hider because you can understand if the decisions the seekers are making will be beneficial or not, similar to how we analyzed the hiders cards so much in this series.
also adding, i dont think it needs to be revealed every time (like in adams example) or at the start of the run, but i do enjoy (like i think happened in switzerland) knowing where the hider is before the endgame, you can smile or wince at every choice being made rather than just one side!
31:20 Thinking about that moment, they actually did tell where Ben was by him visiting the Teddy Bear Museum, but in such a way that you could look it up if you wanted to know, or stick with an "Oh it's that place" if you didn't. If you root for the hider, you want to know where they are. If you root for the seekers, you don't. Is the purpose of the show for the audience to try to solve where the hider is, or are you watching to look at different ways you could find someone in a country using yes/no questions?
I feel like the actual disconnect is between the game and the entertainment show. I think this is especially tricky if you’re the game maker, the producer AND the player. I feel like as the game maker then playing the game you’d want to play the game well strategically, but a producer would be finding ways to force you into playing the game entertaining-ly. And ultimately what they’re saying is the actual strategy in the game doesn’t come across well in the edit so as an entertainment show I think you really NEED to lean into the strategy that does come across well on camera - ie the cards. They may not strategically have a great chance of having huge impact but when they do that is GOLD for a viewer and you’re not going to get that without watching. And the problem with Sam admitting to giving up trying in the final episode when he realised he couldn’t win (although I’m not convinced this is totally true) is that in the edit they’re FORCED to make it seem like Sam has a chance whilst we’re watching him seem to give up and that is just crappy to watch and doesn’t honour the viewer imo. And if Sam had played better in that final run it would have been even closer and that would have built tension.
I get it. People were too blinded of the game as card challenges rather than a Hide and Seek. The focus were too much on them that it looked like it was a big impact when you realise that's only a fraction of their time traveling and hiding for hours... the whole day. Coming on the final day, they definitely have to be mentally exhausted. Travelling for 6 hours is already too much for me, imagine them doing it every day. Great job boys, ya'll did a crazy and amazing season❤
I think something else that contributes to the perception that Sam played the last round badly is that Ben and Adam played it really well. Pretty much every question they asked more or less halved the possible area, and they didn't seem to be wasting any time (though of course, it's hard to be certain of that having only seen the edit).
This was my equal favorite episode of Jet Lag with the Race across America with Michelle. I do think the criticism is a bit overplayed and wasn't that bad looking back on the season
the most frustrating thing about this season, by FAR, was The Discourse. it was insufferable, people constantly bitching and complaining instead of enjoying what i would argue is their best season yet. absolutely fantastic.
I think Taran is wrong at least for me personally. I don’t root for the seeker only. I root for Ben. If Ben is hiding I’m rooting for him. If Ben is seeking I’m rooting for him. If it’s a season where Ben and Adam are teamed up I’m rooting for them.
I would like to see a format where each person started from same spot and followed up their own run with a 2nd run for a total time. So you need to plan out 2 connected locations and ways to get to them. Plus if all starting from same spot it balances the you might get a bad start based on getting out of the last one. Also, maybe a planning day before the next person since you do not need to start ASAP.
Obviously we love the guys and the format, is there a possibility these games could be played with new players, it’s not because we’re bored but when the players have all the strategies because they’re too experienced at the games as they wrote the questions and cards
A lot of people accused jet lag of "scripting" the win by Ben. My response to those people is: do you really think they would script a win that included such an obvious misplay by one of the players? It would be infinitely easier to script that win if they simply claimed Sam drew another 5 min bonus instead of a jammed door curse. Talks of missed strategies aside, the hide-and-seek style of game is by far my favorite, and this season was even better than their previous. Sure, things could be improved down the line with future games, but the jet lag boys should celebrate producing such a fantastic season.
1:07:30 This was probably the nicest break-up of the episodes. I personally find the forced cliffhangers by inserting a commercial in the middle of a sentence to be incredibly cliché and dumb. Yes there were cliffhangers in terms of one piece of evidence at the start of a hide, but it didn't seem forced like the continuation games like I saw during Tag.
fans: 'ugh new Survivor is so filled with game bots - borrringgg' also fans: 'on day 3 at 12:05:34 at this station why didn't Sam combine this card and that card to create the most optimum play!!' bruh
35:15 One of the reasons people thought it may have been scripted, and the only scripting people really thought happened was the card pull itself, is because they thought the season would be used as an instructional video for the game they're selling.
About the expansions packs of the home game… maybe make an expansion with blanco front cards and a suggestion list of questions, that can be bought. This way people can make their own challenges or buy a suggestion list for that specific place.
Ben’s success this season is in part to how the chasers Sam and Adam work together. Sam seems to want to do with less. Adam seems to wants to do more to narrow or focus the board.
I think that Japan season was perfect. I saw all the variables from the exhaustion to the long train rides and I thought I painted a great hide and seek story. Don’t ever script or super optimize everything.
Perhaps an idea for future Hide and Seek season would be to record the hiders journey/thought process and upload that as an unlisted video with a link in the main episode. Those who want to know can know and those who want to not know can not
Sam, if you happen to read this, you don't have to worry about defending your choice of card usage. I was just bummed that you didn't use them, because I was rooting for you and wanted you to win!
I think the airport was the favorite run, and it's fun to recognize things in hiding locations. But I think it's more important that the game is played genuinely than artificially trying to get to locations that are recognizable. That's a problem I feel with mainstream shows like this, they seem to fake things to make it interesting. But being genuine I think is a big part of why Jet Lag is fun.
I think Sam and Adam did make a mistake but it wasn’t their entire fault. When they asked for largest body of water and Ben vetoed it they forgot what was their question. If they had remembered the question. They would have come to the conclusion that Ben doesn’t want to reveal it because it has to be the ocean. Then they would have been clued in on the google map error. So I’m just saying it was both a personal error as well as a technical error too
Nothing against the game it is amazingly put together that I never could but I think if I could change one thing about hide and seek is just let everyone get 2 runs instead of the six day thing. Thank you for creating hide and seek that is just my recommendation.
It's difficult because there needs to be a set timeframe for booking flights/hotels/etc, so having x amount of days fits better than x amount of runs. There's a case to be made for deliberately setting a long window and just ending the game after two runs each (and that's kinda what ended up happening here, the game window was long enough to comfortably allow everyone the same amount of runs, even with ben's monster run in the mix); there just has to be a balance between having enough leeway for a fair game and not giving so much that you're bloating the schedule (and thus production costs) by adding too many extra days
Maybe the location of the hider was know in the start of the series to familiarized the gameplay. But more to the end you ramp up the drama and put yourself in the shoes of the seekers by not knowing the hiders location.
I watched and enjoyed the season, I don't understand the problem, as long as the videos are good why should I care that Sam play badly? Lol, good for Ben
On the Veto card: The way Veto is working now is just a stop this question double its cost, which is very misleading and only able to get like 10min out of, unless you can play it at the end of a 15min timeframe after the question, which can result in higher numbers. But it normally should be used strategically to mess with the catchers, which is priceless.
I have to say that knowing how vetoes work didn't make me less frustrated about them not being played, just annoyed that everybody seems to have thought of them wrong (though you covered your lack of card engagement pretty thoroughly). The veto cards aren't for denying the seekers critical information. They are for misdirection and psychological warfare. Because the winner is determined by who hides the longest we can determine what roles the cards play. *Bonus time: the most straight forward, they just give you more time. *curses: they give you more time by slowing the seekers down (jammed door), distracting them (travel agent), or slowing down how fast the seekers can ask questions (needing to leave the station to ask questions). *vetoes and random questions: allow you some control over what information the seekers get. However, because the seekers might (rightly) assume that you would likely veto a question that gives them too much information, that means that you can veto questions that you don't care about and make them think that you didn't want to answer that question. The only reason to discard a veto or curse that is in your hand is because you can't pay the casting cost 😈👹😈
All I'm hearing is that they need a game master / overview team next game. Just a person that keeps track of everything instead that they need to do that all on their phones. Seemed like a massive distraction.
Find someone who looks at you the way Sam looks at strava maps.
😂
LMFAO
Or Trees
LMAOOOO
I love jet lag and I have watched every season. I’m 77 years old and I’m just so impressed by these young men who were able to come up with all of these different iterations of jet lag. Every time I watch them I am more and more impressed.
I agree with their justification of cards and audience interpretation. It's skewed because when they spend 3 hours on one train ride we see 15 seconds of that but when they spend 15 minutes clearing a curse we see all 15 minutes and it feels like that was a huge waste of their time when in reality more of their time is spent on transit.
Yah but their justification of not paying too much attention to the cards is wild. After you hide, essentially all your focused on is card management. Not to say there aren't other things you need to worry about but with that said, by and large the most important part is your cards when your hiding.
@@davidross918 Not entirely true, since finding a good hiding spot and rationalizing it against the questions that may uncover it probably eats far more time than most expects.
Sam's case is very unique in that he immediately pulled the move card which then meant that finding a hiding spot didn't matter at all in his zone, at which point one could immediately start preparing for the future location.
But that aside, (I've yet to watch the whole thing) like they said the audience focuses a lot more on the cards for various reasons, mostly because they're easy to follow. While I think the actual thing that makes or breaks these games are the questions, knowing how to play around them is key more so than the cards. There's incredible potential in terms of time sink when going over questions, mapping out distances and choosing your spot with all of this in mind.
EDIT: Note that Sam's hiding spot in the last episode wasn't really elaborated upon but he probably on the fly decided relatively late that being under a bridge for the photos was going to serve him well which we've seen before.
And, crucially, the viewers have close to complete information about where the seeker's heads are at and what kinds of cards when will cause them problems or send them in the wrong direction. whereas the hider is just having to guess based on where they are and what questions they are asking. they could mirror out their maps maybe but they're going to miss any mistakes that the seekers make, like underestimating how far down the peninsula Ben could have gotten.
I think they should guarantee everyone 2 runs but have a 24 hour break the moment everyone has taken their first run. Would make it more fair for the 3rd player and solve the exhaustion problem on the final days
but it would increase their production costs. fact they start playing day after they get there is also indication they want to minimise time spent in country
@@mremumerm time constraints aside, a full days break in between the first and second series of runs would probably alleviate a lot of the fatigue, so I'm with allu there. They are busy people though, especially Sam, I'm not sure how much time they can reasonably spend filming a single season as this would likely make it 7 or 8 full days in another country travelling, vs 4 or 5 like most seasons are
however, this could give a considerable advantage to the first player, who has an extra 24 hours to plan
And after the 24 hour break, the order should be randomized. That way they can all spend the 24 hours planning as if they were the ones who would be taking the next run, but not knowing for sure until that morning.
@@mremumerm I don't think they start playing immediately the day after they get there. During this season all 3 guys indicated that they had spent time in the country doing stuff before the game began. Ben and Adam said that they had done trial runs of the game within Tokyo, and Sam talked about having gone up to Mt. Fuji a few days earlier/prior to filming.
As someone who is... pretty critical on the couch when watching Jet Lag (and I agree with many of the comments, though I don't usually comment) I also don't think the sort of analysis of the game isn't always meant to be criticism of the players. I'm sure there are people who are frustrated with you, the players, genuinely and who are being mean. But for me, this is my favorite show, I love strategy and I love getting into the nitty gritty of it. I enjoy screaming USE THE VETO at the screen or pacing in front of my TV about why Sam didn't use that curse. But ultimately this is a game with humans, who are working long days and where human "error" makes or breaks the game (from both hider and seeker side). So of course it's easy to see in a one hour cut of your day which moves might have been more optimal.
There's a paradox in that genuine misplays make the content more engaging. I want them to play optimally and yet if they do the content would be worse off, in a way. They're very human in the way they play and that's what I love. They've made a great game and they're not the best at it. This is GOOD!
@@PoliceAlarm Yes exactly! If it were too predictable it wouldn't be so fun to watch.
@@PoliceAlarm It's very similar to sports. We want everything to be fair, but we also want something to talk about / complain about. It drives engagement.
The exhaustion in the final two episodes was evident. I think it detracted from what was overall an excellent season.
Agreed. It's unfortunate though because I liked the idea of a longer game so everyone gets two guaranteed runs. Maybe some sort of break in the middle would be nice?
I think a 24 hour rest break in the middle would be really helpful.
But then a problem would occur because in most countries, from what I know is the schedule changes on a day of the week (Sundays normally) for the day of rest, that would mean that a run might be affected by this, unless you set the start date to allow for this rest day on the Sunday
Maybe increasing the off time each day would solve this issue. But we also need to factor in the weather, which was really hot this time and may be fine in the next iteration.
Part of me wondered if Sam was playing more of a "PLEASE just find me and get this over with" after moving and answering those questions.
I think Sam explained the most important essence of Jet Lag, and it's that the players trust each other.
Seeing the trio become so competitive but still do things in good faith (albeit they wish for each other's trains to explode 😂), is a constant reminder that the game is just all for fun and it lessens the frustration I have as a viewer with their misadventures and errors.
We could call in a bomb threat 😂😂 i love casually being willing to make your friend think they might die just to win a little game with no real prize whatsoever
it helps that first an foremost they want to make an entertainment product. and they already tested the limits of what the audience will approve (looking at you sam) in terms of rule-bending.
@@TheCodysbiggestfanWhat do you mean “no real prize”? They get the biggest trophy you have ever seen. And remember kids, the “real prize” is always the friends we make along the way!
We’re not disappointed, we were rooting for sam and engaging with the show!
Dont be so hard on yourselves about it, just take the feedback for the next runs 😉
The discussion of how information is conveyed to the audience, what's explained, what's not, and at what point things are revealed gets really interesting, especially towards the end of this.
Great chat. I met Tom Scott in October after his Lateral live recording and told him I hope he'll be on Jet Lag one day. Then I felt stupid thinking he must have known then and I just learnt he didn't! They only asked him in November 😁😁 Can't wait for next season!
Tom scott plus has a jet lag type episode. This next season is gonna be amazing
Hey, maybe you contributed in a small way to how fast he said yes!
i think maybe it would be good for all of yall to incorporate break days inbetween? like a day where all of you can rest halfway through and no one is allowed to check train scedules etc? that way your body and mind can be more rested and errors might not occur. love the format and it was the best season to watch yet!!
Jet Lag: Hide and Seek is probably one of my favorite game concepts and I'm glad they are so committed to fine tuning. Definitely need to work on the end game but I'm a sucker for good navigation challenges and on a country scale makes for a fun watch. And they do more with a single handheld and an interesting location than all of Beast Games did with all the Amazon money.
I do think one card slot in the hand needs to be dedicated to accumulating time bonuses up to a set limit. And curses don't have a card cost but a minute/hour cost. That way the hider is gambling time spent against the potential time wasted and there's a greater decision than just dropping 5min. And its an easier variable to balance against.
My argument is that the over-saturation of low value time bonuses devalues late-game questions. A good hiding spot may require several questions but a string of bad draws will equate to free questions for the seekers. A bad hiding spot may not need any questions but the hider can go in with an already optimized hand.
Also, they need end-game spesific activities and hider counter-play that would have them engage with the location. Like the hider can neutralize a tentacle location by spending an hour there. Or the hider can complete a scavenger hunt/quiz of the place to lock in some time bonus. Lets them scope out an area and showcase a small town we'd never otherwise know of.
A fun interplay would be for the hider to set up a bunch of challenges in his zone and that awards more critical information. That way it sort of gives the feel that the seekers are now coming onto the hiders turf and taps into a hone vs. away team theme.
Their first game in Japan gave me the confidence to navigate and I went. It’s now my favorite place to visit.
I love these interviews! Had to click on this the second I saw it.
Thanks RHAP for helping me discover jetlag!!
There is so so much more than we are aware of and in all fairness, this has to be kept in mind by the audience. I was also quite disappointed by the finale and ultimaltely with Sam's descision but he's only human and was tired af after 6 straight days of travel. It's kinda like watching football where every spectator seems to know it better than be players... This being said, much love to the boys
Sam says that, as players, they focus on other aspects of the game besides the cards. However, in the last episode, he mentioned choosing the final hiding spot based on 'vibes,' which made it seem like no thought was put into that decision. I've seen a lot of people criticize that. But on the Layover he said that he spend his time researching, just that no place popped as 'the one'. I looked at the map, and picking the station in the area he did was definitely the best choice. The issue seems to be the viewers' impression that he picked the train at random.
Agreed. If in the episode Sam had said "I spent the last several hours researching, and it seems that all my options are about equally 'meh', so I'm just going to leave it up to chance," the result would have been the same and it would have killed most of the audience complaints.
Yeah I completely agree, I was so pissed about it
I was thinking there had to be a way to get a transfer to another train though within 60minutes in a busy area like he was but maybe I was wrong.
I think a good way to make the Veto card be more likely to be used, would be to simply put a delay on how soon you can re-ask the same question. Neither over nor under powered and results in it not just being a throw-away card.
Great idea. I think it's fine to just completely ban the question though. We've already seen them find ways to ask other questions, because they didn't want to give them double cards. But your idea works well too.
this season was one of my favourites!! so shocked to hear that there was negative feedback
As a blind person let me answer your question, I one love the bird sound idea and also got a cane that would let me know there is a dropoff and track coming, I'm blind not stupid, but them using a natural sound you already hear around is indeed not foolproof, I wouldn't blindly wind up on the tracks but I definitely see myself full confidence stride up to a wall or a empty space with a bird thinking "oh stairs" to add onto the other senses, yes that would help deduct it, depending on how high the sound of the stair bird is to a flying or ground hopping bird, and they have I think tactile paths of yellow lines or dots in their stations too to follow so I wouldn’t diverted fast from that but use to go to a stair sound in an unknown station. Also I love Jetlag, I started watching when I saw more and was visually impaired, and now still I never felt like I missed much, Sam reading out all the questions and cards, the amazing sound design and sound for things like curses I hear it before the speech and know what it is: the tower sound was so awsome and unique and great to understand, the explaining and fun dialogue. I do miss all graphics and maps ect, but still follow along, I also used to be a visual and graphic designer and am still a designer in other ways and got a photographic memory so call me having an advantage over other blind folks, but Jet lag is pretty accessible for me (:
I do agree with Sam that that run almost definitely didn't have a chance of being a winning run even if he played that jammed door curse. They were in a heavy metro area with a lot of train options, so even if they got locked out of a train they'd have several other options at all times so the amount of luck needed to delay them for the full three hours would've been astronomical to the point of it not really being a chance at all.
Should he have played it anyways? Yes, but if Ben and Adam were anything to go by they were all dead tired. Doing this for 11 - 12 hours a day for 6 days is rough. Admittedly the combo would've been amazing, but like they said it was hours after he had played it and probably forgot about it.
as they explained, the jammed door wouldn't just affect trains, but would also mean that any questions they ask are gated behind dice rolls
i feel like the real fumble in that run was moreso not using the veto on one of the key area-narrowing questions; throwing an appropriate wrench in the works could've messed with them long enough burn more questions and accrue more cards.
@@lordalex027 Choosing the ban 3 questions curse instead would have been a good play too to ban the tallest building question and maybe some tentacles that work well in the area
@@1e1001you’re still missing the point. High train frequency means that every failed dice roll would result only in like 3-5 minutes of time delay. Same for train stations - some are so close, that you can just walk to a different one, instead of waiting 15 minutes for a reroll.
Even more - seekers can adjust and instead of 3 stops with 1 question each just do 1 stop with 3-4.
With good luck, Jammed Door would have won something around 30-45 minutes. Sam needed 3 hours.
@@allu7112honestly this. I think Sam’s biggest mistake was picking Jammed Door in the first place, knowing an area he was dealing with. Both Mediocre Travel Agent and Drained Brain were better imo.
oh boy! we’re so back! ✈️
Ive always been impressed how great your teamwork is. If any of you disagree on what to do, you discuss it calmly and decide what to do with no hard feelings if you don't get your way. very mature and great to watch.
From an audience perspective, I think part of the reason the audience were way more focused on the cards than the players were is because they kept including adverts trying to get us to buy the cards. Like I'm not faulting them for that, people have been asking for a home game for ages and they clearly worked hard on it, but with that context I think it makes a lot of sense that the viewers were going "ah yes, clearly these cards are the point of the game".
Yay Jetlag team on RHAP! This season was a joy to watch and your content is so funny, positive and engaging
1:15:45 tom scott mention ⚠️ very competitive indeed. cant wait to see him next season its going to be so good.
You guys are amazing, you have a great thing going and I cant get enough of it. Keep up the great work and hope to see a new season going soon again!
I like hearing about production changes. I went back and looked at their thumbnails and they did change from previous seasons
My suggestion for a suspenseful finale is additive times. The best 2 runs will be counted at the end of gametime. This incentivises the competitive side and brings it more into a sport-category.
Honestly I really loved the finale, I do think sam misplayed a bit here and there but it was so fun especially with the move
Absolutely fantastic season! Thanks for this Taran and Sasha
haha it was fun seeing the boys' takeaway from the cesspool going on on reddit is "looks like the people watching are pretty smart"
As a New Yorker I NEED the NYC version of this game.
it's all very simply explained by the name of the game: Jetlag.
These guys are the greatest thing on youtube and I can't wait for the next season!
I love Jet Lag, I think the boys did great and had fun along the way. Winning the game shouldn’t be the end all be all, it’s the ride along the way. I absolutely love them and Im very excited for more to come.
this was by FAR the best season yet! and the most interesting game system so far!!
I really just want my yelling to magically reach one of the boys when they have a veto card and all they can see are really REALLY unique buildings. Lol fully engaged with it and it was one of the best seasons yet great work all. 😊
Whatever anyone has to say and criticize, this is my favorite season yet. It's what I looked forward to watching every week.
These three Jet Laggers are practically babies and they've got it figured out. I'm impressed and a little jealous.
Me watching this confused bc I loved this season 🤣
Always love a discussion with the Jetlag boys! Great season
As a regular fan I liked this season of hide and seek way more than Switzerland
YESSSSSS, we get to see our boys again this week!
I really enjoyed the tension and high stakes of the finale, I didn't find it underwhelming at all.
Curses had nice explanations in text format. It could be also done with power ups, that way the pacing is the same, but dedicated watchers can pause and read a more detailed explanation
A few other factors that make me root for the hider, even though I'm definitely invested in the game from a tactical perspective as well as a sightseeing one:
- because the hider is purely reactive once they're in their zone (they can't really move, and they only get cards based on the seekers actions) they feel like the underdog, and we love rooting for an underdog
- The hider making it a long time is the only way to change the game state-If they get caught immediately, the leaderboard stays the same. Rooting for someone to change the status quo is a much better narrative than rooting for someone to maintain it.
Add to that, as was pointed out in the episode, that the hider's strategic situation is accessible to the audience in a way that the seekers' isn't, and I think you'll find that even players who aren't focused on the destinations still get invested in hider strategy
I'm always rooting for Ben, Hider, Seeker or any other role. Ben FTW
It would be really helpful if there was a 10-15min introduction video explaining the rules and features of the game. It's more fun to watch when you can fully follow 😊
1:12:00 Bingo. We as the audience like to know the whole game, not just so we can try it at home, but also so we can play along strategies with you. You don't know how many times, while watching a season, I went to a map application and looked up the area to see the different possibilities.
I agree with Adam that the Strava map shouldn't need to be north-south oriented. I actually wasn't sure whether that was a requirement or not, but I like that the rotation being unknown adds some more difficulty to matching it.
Whether nice or horrible, it's still a good thing because they're talking about Jet Lag, which at the end of the day is what you really want. That means people care about the show, probably enough to want more.
They all look so sad! I loved this season (maybe it's just because Ben is my fave and he kicked ass) and I hope people aren't being mean. ❤
Loooove Jet Lat! Thanks for the Jet Lag coversge, RHAP!
I loved the cards, i loved the season, all of it was great
29:43 countering their points here. i actually think knowing where the hider is sometimes makes me root for the seeker more. or maybe it feels a bit more even than just rooting for the hider because you can understand if the decisions the seekers are making will be beneficial or not, similar to how we analyzed the hiders cards so much in this series.
also adding, i dont think it needs to be revealed every time (like in adams example) or at the start of the run, but i do enjoy (like i think happened in switzerland) knowing where the hider is before the endgame, you can smile or wince at every choice being made rather than just one side!
31:20 Thinking about that moment, they actually did tell where Ben was by him visiting the Teddy Bear Museum, but in such a way that you could look it up if you wanted to know, or stick with an "Oh it's that place" if you didn't. If you root for the hider, you want to know where they are. If you root for the seekers, you don't. Is the purpose of the show for the audience to try to solve where the hider is, or are you watching to look at different ways you could find someone in a country using yes/no questions?
I feel like the actual disconnect is between the game and the entertainment show. I think this is especially tricky if you’re the game maker, the producer AND the player. I feel like as the game maker then playing the game you’d want to play the game well strategically, but a producer would be finding ways to force you into playing the game entertaining-ly. And ultimately what they’re saying is the actual strategy in the game doesn’t come across well in the edit so as an entertainment show I think you really NEED to lean into the strategy that does come across well on camera - ie the cards. They may not strategically have a great chance of having huge impact but when they do that is GOLD for a viewer and you’re not going to get that without watching.
And the problem with Sam admitting to giving up trying in the final episode when he realised he couldn’t win (although I’m not convinced this is totally true) is that in the edit they’re FORCED to make it seem like Sam has a chance whilst we’re watching him seem to give up and that is just crappy to watch and doesn’t honour the viewer imo. And if Sam had played better in that final run it would have been even closer and that would have built tension.
As the hider you could tell the journey of thoughts where you went hiding without saying the actual destination
I get it. People were too blinded of the game as card challenges rather than a Hide and Seek. The focus were too much on them that it looked like it was a big impact when you realise that's only a fraction of their time traveling and hiding for hours... the whole day. Coming on the final day, they definitely have to be mentally exhausted. Travelling for 6 hours is already too much for me, imagine them doing it every day. Great job boys, ya'll did a crazy and amazing season❤
I think something else that contributes to the perception that Sam played the last round badly is that Ben and Adam played it really well. Pretty much every question they asked more or less halved the possible area, and they didn't seem to be wasting any time (though of course, it's hard to be certain of that having only seen the edit).
yeyyyy loved this!
Awesome interview. Wondering what next season will be. Battle 4 Europe?
This was my equal favorite episode of Jet Lag with the Race across America with Michelle. I do think the criticism is a bit overplayed and wasn't that bad looking back on the season
the most frustrating thing about this season, by FAR, was The Discourse. it was insufferable, people constantly bitching and complaining instead of enjoying what i would argue is their best season yet. absolutely fantastic.
It was their best season, yet their strategies were not always as good as prior seasons
@ you are proving my point.
I think Taran is wrong at least for me personally. I don’t root for the seeker only. I root for Ben. If Ben is hiding I’m rooting for him. If Ben is seeking I’m rooting for him. If it’s a season where Ben and Adam are teamed up I’m rooting for them.
I really enjoyed this season and am disappointed that this episode seems to be mainly justifying why it wasn't good! It was good!!
I'm sad to find out that Ben and Adam aren't roommates like Bert and Ernie.
I would like to see a format where each person started from same spot and followed up their own run with a 2nd run for a total time. So you need to plan out 2 connected locations and ways to get to them. Plus if all starting from same spot it balances the you might get a bad start based on getting out of the last one. Also, maybe a planning day before the next person since you do not need to start ASAP.
Obviously we love the guys and the format, is there a possibility these games could be played with new players, it’s not because we’re bored but when the players have all the strategies because they’re too experienced at the games as they wrote the questions and cards
A lot of people accused jet lag of "scripting" the win by Ben. My response to those people is: do you really think they would script a win that included such an obvious misplay by one of the players? It would be infinitely easier to script that win if they simply claimed Sam drew another 5 min bonus instead of a jammed door curse.
Talks of missed strategies aside, the hide-and-seek style of game is by far my favorite, and this season was even better than their previous. Sure, things could be improved down the line with future games, but the jet lag boys should celebrate producing such a fantastic season.
1:07:30 This was probably the nicest break-up of the episodes. I personally find the forced cliffhangers by inserting a commercial in the middle of a sentence to be incredibly cliché and dumb. Yes there were cliffhangers in terms of one piece of evidence at the start of a hide, but it didn't seem forced like the continuation games like I saw during Tag.
fans: 'ugh new Survivor is so filled with game bots - borrringgg'
also fans: 'on day 3 at 12:05:34 at this station why didn't Sam combine this card and that card to create the most optimum play!!'
bruh
35:15 One of the reasons people thought it may have been scripted, and the only scripting people really thought happened was the card pull itself, is because they thought the season would be used as an instructional video for the game they're selling.
Sam trying to explain a let down ending to compensate his 'giving up' is crazy
About the expansions packs of the home game… maybe make an expansion with blanco front cards and a suggestion list of questions, that can be bought. This way people can make their own challenges or buy a suggestion list for that specific place.
Ben’s success this season is in part to how the chasers Sam and Adam work together.
Sam seems to want to do with less.
Adam seems to wants to do more to narrow or focus the board.
They should call the podcast: " You know, like, basically"
Kind throws one off to hear this non stop...
I think that Japan season was perfect. I saw all the variables from the exhaustion to the long train rides and I thought I painted a great hide and seek story. Don’t ever script or super optimize everything.
Perhaps an idea for future Hide and Seek season would be to record the hiders journey/thought process and upload that as an unlisted video with a link in the main episode. Those who want to know can know and those who want to not know can not
Jet Lag, Who does your graphic design? it's amazing!
Adam's eyes when the bird is mentioned lol
I'm curious what the time lag is for these games. Did it take place a few days or a few weeks before airing the first episode, or a few months??
a podcast about reality tv? yk what hell yea
Sam, if you happen to read this, you don't have to worry about defending your choice of card usage.
I was just bummed that you didn't use them, because I was rooting for you and wanted you to win!
I think the airport was the favorite run, and it's fun to recognize things in hiding locations.
But I think it's more important that the game is played genuinely than artificially trying to get to locations that are recognizable.
That's a problem I feel with mainstream shows like this, they seem to fake things to make it interesting.
But being genuine I think is a big part of why Jet Lag is fun.
I think Sam and Adam did make a mistake but it wasn’t their entire fault.
When they asked for largest body of water and Ben vetoed it they forgot what was their question. If they had remembered the question. They would have come to the conclusion that Ben doesn’t want to reveal it because it has to be the ocean. Then they would have been clued in on the google map error. So I’m just saying it was both a personal error as well as a technical error too
I don't think they would've come to that conclusion
🤔 Taran would be an EXCELLENT Jet Lag guest!
Nothing against the game it is amazingly put together that I never could but I think if I could change one thing about hide and seek is just let everyone get 2 runs instead of the six day thing. Thank you for creating hide and seek that is just my recommendation.
It's difficult because there needs to be a set timeframe for booking flights/hotels/etc, so having x amount of days fits better than x amount of runs. There's a case to be made for deliberately setting a long window and just ending the game after two runs each (and that's kinda what ended up happening here, the game window was long enough to comfortably allow everyone the same amount of runs, even with ben's monster run in the mix); there just has to be a balance between having enough leeway for a fair game and not giving so much that you're bloating the schedule (and thus production costs) by adding too many extra days
@ That’s fair. Good point.
@@steatopigeon don't really think they can book hotels in advance, since they have no idea where they will be at end of day.
Maybe the location of the hider was know in the start of the series to familiarized the gameplay.
But more to the end you ramp up the drama and put yourself in the shoes of the seekers by not knowing the hiders location.
Taran for Jet Lag season 14!
An 1hr plus???? My god we are eating
I watched and enjoyed the season, I don't understand the problem, as long as the videos are good why should I care that Sam play badly? Lol, good for Ben
Though them being tired at the end Isn't cool, they should take it easy
I wanna see hide seek in Disneyland with all curse cards.
On the Veto card:
The way Veto is working now is just a stop this question double its cost, which is very misleading and only able to get like 10min out of, unless you can play it at the end of a 15min timeframe after the question, which can result in higher numbers.
But it normally should be used strategically to mess with the catchers, which is priceless.
I love Jet Lag The Game 😄
Best hide and seek episode was tag season 2
I have to say that knowing how vetoes work didn't make me less frustrated about them not being played, just annoyed that everybody seems to have thought of them wrong (though you covered your lack of card engagement pretty thoroughly). The veto cards aren't for denying the seekers critical information. They are for misdirection and psychological warfare.
Because the winner is determined by who hides the longest we can determine what roles the cards play.
*Bonus time: the most straight forward, they just give you more time.
*curses: they give you more time by slowing the seekers down (jammed door), distracting them (travel agent), or slowing down how fast the seekers can ask questions (needing to leave the station to ask questions).
*vetoes and random questions: allow you some control over what information the seekers get. However, because the seekers might (rightly) assume that you would likely veto a question that gives them too much information, that means that you can veto questions that you don't care about and make them think that you didn't want to answer that question.
The only reason to discard a veto or curse that is in your hand is because you can't pay the casting cost 😈👹😈
1:00:00 Sam, When I make H&S Oahu (If I record it) I would LOVE your critique
Hide and seek is the best format
All I'm hearing is that they need a game master / overview team next game. Just a person that keeps track of everything instead that they need to do that all on their phones. Seemed like a massive distraction.