Never Too Early for Zugzwang! || Leela vs Stockfish || TCEC Superfinal Season 17
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- Опубликовано: 17 окт 2024
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Leela Chess ZERO vs Stockfish
TCEC Superfinals GAME 96
French, advance variation (C02)
1. e4 e6 2. d4 d5 3. e5 b6 4. h4 c5 5. c3 Nc6 6. Nf3 Bd7 7. Bd3 Qc7 8. O-O cxd4 9. Bf4 a6 10. a3 dxc3 11. Nxc3 b5 12. Rc1 Qb6 13. Be3 Qb8 14. Re1 Nge7 15. b4 h6 16. h5 Qb7 17. Bf4 Rc8 18. Qd2 Rc7 19. Bg3 Rg8 20. Rc2 Rc8 21. Ne2 Na7 22. Nfd4 Rxc2 23. Qxc2 Nac6 24. Bh7 Rh8 25. Bd3 Rg8 26. Bh7 Rh8 27. f4 Nxd4 28. Nxd4 Qc8 29. Rc1 Qxc2 30. Bxc2 Nc6 31. Bf2 Nb8 32. Bd3 Be7 33. Rc7 Kd8 34. Rc2 Ke8 35. g4 Rg8 36. Kg2 Kd8 37. Kg3 Rh8 38. Rc1 Rg8 39. Bg1 g6 40. hxg6 fxg6 41. Be3 h5 42. g5 Ke8 43. Rc7 Kf7 44. Bb1 Rd8 45. Nf3 d4 46. Nxd4 Rc8 47. Rb7 Rd8 48. Be4 Re8 49. Kf2 h4 50. Kg2 Rc8 51. Bf2 Be8 52. Rb6 Bd7 53. Kh2 a5 54. bxa5 Bd8 55. Rb7 Bxa5 56. Nxb5 Kg8 57. Nd6 Rf8 58. Be3 Bc6 59. Bxc6 Nxc6 60. Ne4 Rf7 61. Rxf7 Kxf7 62. Bf2 Ne7 63. Bxh4 Nd5 64. Bg3 Bc7 65. Kh3 Ba5 66. Kg4 Ke7 67. Bf2 Kd7 68. Kf3 Kc6 69. Be3 Bc3 70. Bc1 Bd4 71. Ke2 Bc5 72. Kd3 Bf8 73. Kc4 Nb6+ 74. Kc3 Be7 75. Kd3 Nd5 76. Kc4 Bd8 77. Nf6 Nb6+ 78. Kb3 Na8 79. Bd2 Bb6 80. a4 Nc7 81. Kc4 Ba7 82. Kd3 Bc5 83. Ne4 Bf8 84. Kc4 Ba3 85. Nc3 Na6 86. Be3 Bb4 87. Ne2 Be1 88. Nd4+ Kd7 89. Nb3 Kc6 90. a5 Bg3 91. Nd4+ Kd7 92. Bd2 Bh2 93. Ne2 Kc6 94. Be3 Nc7 95. Bc1 Nd5 96. Bd2 Ne7 97. Kd3 Kb7 98. Ke4 Nf5 99. Kf3 Nh4+ 100. Kg4 Nf5 101. Kh3 Bg1 102. Nxg1 Nd4 103. f5 exf5 104. B e3 Ne6 105. Ne2 f4 106. Nxf4 Nxg5+ 107. Kg4 Nf7 108. Nxg6 Ka6 109. Kf5 Nxe5
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0:00 Hello everyone
1:02 1:25 Completely new game
2:42 Sneaky tactic
2:46 Give you a couple of seconds
2:57 Enjoy the show
3:42 Suffer a terrible fate
4:40 A lot of madness
4:55 Triple attack
5:12 Nasty discoveries
5:22 Lastly but not leastly
6:57 Double up on the C file
7:55 13:10 13:27 Captures captures
8:25 Slicey bishops
10:17 Lol
18:38 Bad arrows
19:03 Leela gif
19:57 It was in this position
20:30 Completely lost
21:13 Morphy saga
That's a lot of effort, damn. Thanks!
@@yndihalda I think he does it for himself too, so he can find later that stuff easier if he decides to use it.
it was in this positionerio agadmatorino!!!
Please lookout if the innovation "...will suffer a terrible fate!" repeat!
No „sorry about that” in this video 😢
I matched with Leela on Tinder and her profile said:
*Single but exceptionally good at mating.*
I get "Acces Denied" :(
I don't get why Stockfish resigned in that position. Maybe Leela didn't know how to give mate with knight and bishop!
nah, she probably watched danny rench's tutorial
@@disasterpiece7583 :))))
Leela can do it because she thinks in terms of key squares
Maybe. I mean, it's a pretty rare endgame, and as leela is not taught but figures stuff out by playing, she would have had to figure it out within 50 moves before a draw. I mean, she probably could have, but who knows man, neural networks are weird sometimes. Can do amazing things but fail at simple tasks.
Leela knows to mate with knight and bishop, every time with move 50.. really we tried it several times, it's amazing.
i'm just here to enjoy the show
I have been enjoying the show since 2018
@@douglasquaid7550 same :)
@@denisa.3517 Same ruclips.net/video/V475Jezxqfc/видео.html
I'm just here to realize I know nothing about chess
I'm just here to get congratulations
The rules required multiple cameras during games to make sure they weren't consulting with any humans.
no disgusting human moves affiliated
You laugh, but human+AI can be much more powerful than just AI
Kekkles Any proof of this? I’m genuinely curious.
@@fox2569 You can find Kasparov talking about it on RUclips.
@@kekkles4001 That's just Kasparov's opinion. How could you ever prove such a thing? At what point in this game, for example, would you ask a human to choose the move? How would you know if you had changed the result or not? How would you know if you had improved the position from what the computer would have done? You'd probably use engines to analyze it, which begs the question. These engines are nearly 3500 rating. These engines playing Carlsen or Fischer or Kasparov would be like these champions playing a 2200. Believing that humans introduce improvement is just our ego. We don't want to admit we have no place at the cutting edge of chess anymore, but we insist we are still needed because we are biased and self-absorbed, as usual.
That position at 17:44 where the white knight and bishop controlled the black bishop and knight's squares was beautiful
Toby ... Bf2 would have avoided the loss. I think Stockfish blundered a piece.
Star Gazer nah he literally covers that white queens in that scenario
2:39
Agadmator: Asks me to find a move and then proceeds to explain it 10 moves ahead for 4 different variations
Me: yeah sure, I saw that
me: there is an obvious pawn to capture there
agadmator: let me show you how capturing that pawn will lead to your destruction
I watched this game live on TCEC's website, and donated to their cause.
Stockfish not interested in trading his only active piece (the knight) -> Stockfish proceeds to put it on b8
Nothing as annoying as being suffocated by your opponents' stupid pawns and agonizingly watching your opponent slowly make progress to destroy you.
It's interesting that so many of Leelas and Alpha zeros wins over stockfish involves exactly this pattern: giving up material to develop a dominant white bishop pair, closing the position with pawns and black being up material but with useless pieces.
yeah, thats quite crazy and fascinating
Honestly I think this says more about Stockfish than about its opponents. Stockfish is built on the fundamentally flawed assumption that a good move will lead to material gain or checkmate within the foreseeable future, but these games inarguably prove that this is not the case. Leela and Alpha beat Stockfish by playing positionally, which is something Stockfish can never do
Books: develop your pieces, don' t push the h pawn, don' t move too many pawns.
1:19
Crazy right?
Leela points out that it’s not wrong for HER. Humans are incapable of keeping that many balls in the air without losing track of something-it’s just way too complicated to calculate. If you’re a GM you’re playing with fire. If you’re lower rated blundering is inevitable.
Books: The time in the development has no value in position with closed pawn's structure...
@@rubensilvera1164 LoL ruclips.net/video/V475Jezxqfc/видео.html
smirkypants well explained
This stockfish dude should probably give up chess, doesn't seem like his thing.
@V O ikr ruclips.net/video/V475Jezxqfc/видео.html
And start a comedy club
Well he regularly gets beatean by players with a zero Elo score :))))
I thought the same thing lol
I am here just to show this to my friends in the bar and in the library !
Great comment.
And don't forget the hospital!
@@manu-ox4fe lolmfao
What if after a certain point in the game, the two engines switch black/white? I'm curious if Leela can somehow save the position after move 30
The game doesn't show us what moves Leela would have done as black, but the fact that she played the (non-book) moves she did as white means she believed all responses for black were losing.
As black, the position is lost. Even an A.I./NN Engine would agree and SF would win. Even if it were Lc0 vs. SFNN the outcome would remain the same.
i am here to enjoy the show as i cant find the move...i am one of them"for those of you who wants to enjoy the game..."
What is Leela’s relationship status? Asking for a friend.
single, but potential mates need to beat her and her dad A0 at chess :/
When you realise that one of the developers of LeelaC0 is also a developer of Stockfish.
So are they stepsiblings?
Marcos Giráldez Montaño maybe rival cousins?
ruclips.net/video/dQw4w9WgXcQ/видео.html
omg what are you doing, stepengine?
I feel like you should award Leela a Karpov head for that slow positional midgame stuff.
I second that. Karpov would be proud of such game.
I’d love to see a side by side evaluation from each engine as the game goes
2:30 4 minutes explanation about why you can't capture the pawn, but should I ever encounter this position, my brain would instantly think *oooh! a free pawn!*
Leela: Did you do it
Stockfish: yes
Leela: what did it took
Stockfish: 3 pawns
Wait for the endgame.
Yes, enjoyed the "giving back" reference.
I hated it!
Wouldn't this be some sort of immortal if played by others? Seems like some sort of masterpiece.
For humans it's a masterpiece. For Leela it's Tuesday. She does this kind of thing all the time against the French....
Considering she won this as black as well.... against stockfish on 176 threads, yeah certainly a masterpiece.
@@Radjehuty THAT win, with black, was amazing. With white I think there's at least 10 other similar games where Leela beat Stockfish in similar fashion, against the French and other openings where white gets a space advantage that I've seen so far.
Seems like Stockfish is becoming everyone's punching bag these days...
19:50 "Stockfish tried to be funny"
Always play the funniest move -GM Ben Finegold
4:25 I don’t know if you’ll read this comment, but I really appreciated how you went into much further detail than usual on a not completely obvious line. Often you tend to leave them when a certain side is winning but not up material, and as a newer player I really appreciate you going into a bit more depth 4 or 5 moves ahead to why the position is so winning. Hopefully you replicate this in upcoming videos :)
@10:23 - StockFish becomes StuckFish
19:05 Hilarious!!
19:07 "And it was in this position that Leela made it rain"
This is not a fun channel.....
@@freedomofspeech2700 Who are you, Magritte?
@@RobFlaxMusic you are taking my name to ask my name ..HaH! 😁
@@freedomofspeech2700 No, I'm pointing out the absurdity of your comment, and you've revealed a lack of awareness. (Google "Magritte" + "The Treachery of Images" to learn what I was referencing... "This is not a fun channel" is a dumb comment to make on a fun channel.)
Your comment was dumb, and I didn't want to get into it, but you appear to be a chess player. So let's play:
By any measure, "this is not a fun channel" is a nonsensical comment. If you meant that with regard to "this channel isn't fun," then why are you watching?
If you meant that "chess is serious, and you shouldn't make jokes here," then recall my comment was a reply to Agadmator making a joke.
If you meant "this channel isn't about entertainment," then you're mistaken-Agadmator has explicitly said that this channel is in part for entertainment, and that if some GM's watch his channel it's "for entertainment," and not the analysis.
If you meant anything else you're not thinking clearly, and playing a silly move.
...And it was in this position that Shivam Shrivastava resigned the game, as there is nothing more to be done here.
@@RobFlaxMusic lol
One don't need to be a supercomputer to get in bad positions like this while playing black!
I get positions like this 80% of the time while playing black and trying to close the position.. x.x
Me too, and the other 20% I just lose the end game if,I haven't lost the game in the middle game already.
One sugestion from me:
You should show both games for TCEC finales with predefined opening moves , that way we can see both engines how perform on same opening.
Especially for this game because I believe this was the only opening of the final where one of the engines won as both black and white.
2:39 it's hilarious how Agadmator keeps explaining the move for 3 minutes
This was a brutal mid-game for Stockfish. Tons of inactive pieces and waiting moves while Leela gradually improved its position.
Leela... Sacrifices a pawn.
Agadmator: I see this as an absolute win.
Agad, what was the final score of the match? Or did you not mention it because you are going to show one more game?
Agad created his own memes, and they are awesome and never get old even after 100000 times
Loving all these engine game analysis. Honestly, they are far more interesting than human games.
Thanks for your video. At 20:00, what is the white move to prevent a draw because insufficient materials? If white captures knight, then black king takes white pawn and if white does not take black knight, then black knight will move to c4 or c6 to attach white pawn.
You can checkmate with a knight and bishop.
Very enjoyable game Anthony, thanks for choosing this. ;)
Enjoying these engine games a lot. Ty
I dont even play chess anymore but I'm addicted to your videos! Keep it up
5:22 “Lastly but not leastly” - Agadmator May 14th, 2020
Agad, a real master of his craft.
The gold standard of chess analysis
Keep it up!
Brilliant, instructive video with coherent narration. Bravo
I'm usually here to enjoy the show but did find the (first) move. That's all that's needed because then the opponent should resign, right?
THANK YOU Agadmator. Your videos are very educational for a sub-2000 player like me as well as being quite entertaining.
Everyone loves a zugzwang
Pretty much the best and only way to beat Stockfish is to just slowly grind it down from a superior position into oblivion.
I agree
@@12jswilson kombatrolled ruclips.net/video/V475Jezxqfc/видео.html
At 10:30, instead of 45. ... d4, why not (45. ... Rc8. Then, if [46. Ba7 Kc6.] Or, if [46. Rxc8 Bxc8] ) or other variations? Therefore, the Knight can escape and through trading down, the advantages of white are a bit nullified...
Thanks for using my/our suggestion, keep it up. :)
2:31 look at white setup. It’s just brilliant!! All whites pieces are completely developed, active and working together. Black had no chance.
Wow! These guys play like engines.
I did enjoy the gif reference !😂
you mean 20:00
Leela: it's absolutely winning for me
Stockfish: I see it too
Did we get the results of the match?
‘Lastly but not leastly”. ..I like it!
If they don't force the openings, do the engines favour any openings in particular?
01:00 Black plays b6. White can play c3 so then Ba6 is not possible due to Bxa6 Nxa6 Qa4+ winning the B on a6. But what do I know? Leela goes h4.
White plays h4, then castles kingside? What is happening.
01:53 White sacrifices a central pawn. Wow. Did not expect that.
White gives up d4 pawn to control d4 square with a Knight. Black is up a passed d-pawn, but it cannot move.
Very instructive display by Leela.
Good perception!
@@ivanimre8473 Thank you Imre. It was a beautiful strategic game by white.
How long typically do
1. the chess engines take to make a move and
2. these chess engine vs chess engine/AI games typically last
compared to e.g. a GM vs GM game?
How long they take to move depends on the time control obviously. The Season 17 superfinal in this case (90 min + 5 sec increments) had an average game time of 3 hours and except the first couple of moves, stockfish tipically moved every 50 sec or so in the middle game
What chair are you using, agad?
Instant like, then watch and enjoy such a great content creator
utentedigooification me to buddy. Everytime i dont start out by likening the video i allways forget. And thats a shame
@@hanshansen1990 sub here bross ruclips.net/video/V475Jezxqfc/видео.html
King Niggaz why dude ?? This has nothing to do with anything
Same!
11:36 what if black plays knight c6? I think black is getting some odds in the game again..what u think?
What was the result of the Superfinal?
1:02 We don't have a completly new game
Lol now we have visual aids to better understand the perfect illustration of players behavior!! Very nice Agad!!
Perhaps Leela gives back material because in her self learning process the number of moves until a win was less when simplifying the position first. Keeping unnecessary material for a clear win risks stalemate or blocks certain faster combinations so giving it back must have shown faster winning chances. Alternatively, since this appears not to be the case, when every path is a win, Leela chooses one randomly and cannot decide between wins since a win is a win. So whether it takes 100 or 5 moves the engine cannot differentiate since it's only goal is an end result win. Certainly the win paths should be trimmed for the shortest one. The goal should be winning quickly not just winning... maybe more draw possibilities that are spurious are also throwing it off. Less pieces would be less draws. Regardless it feels like the tuning around this is not ideal. It cannot be an optional parameter either as this is fundamental to the training that already has occurred. The engine is not flexible if any slight variation requires expensive retraining. Anyway what a great game
What's depth (number of prediction moves)?
Who is stockfish and leela... Are they a.i. system
6:37/6:38
I understood "deez nuts" the first time hearing 🤣
Yeah! More Leela vs Stockfish!
You forgot the standings :(
and in move 4 we have completely new game and both engines agree is a win for white.
After the top of move 66, Human beings: “Ok I think we get the idea.”
Engines, after top of move 109: “Yes...yes we think we do too...”
9:42
Stockfish: I am up a pawn and have two protected passed pawns, I must surely be winning
Leela: I beg to differ
At 18:59 why wasn't d4 pushed for fork. @agadmator
i found the first "pause the video" move without pausing :D
i never pause the video and always find the move
@@IFASOOLI I always pause the video and never find the move.
Ahmad Sabbagh if i never pause the video and always find the move, and you always pause the video and never find the move; then, there exists someone who’s an agadmator subscriber and always pauses the video and always finds the move. The demorganian in me had to do this. Also, I am about to list all the possible solutions but I am sparing youtube that.
@Ragnar seriously?
✌what up insta! haha
Ragnar yeah i just saw it hahahahaha im showing it to my friends at the library and the bar
When a position is closed down so a player’s pieces are basically immobile, why players sac a knight for 2 pawns?
20:08 it's not draw ?
Did stockfish made a handshake with leela?
Great video! Very instructive :)
So alpha zero is not really a chess angine right? that's why it's not on the list of the participating ones? @agadmator
Aanrei Taylor It is an engine, but Deepmind/Google doesn't have it participate.
Engines that aren't publicly available can't participate in tournaments
19:55- Engines have a sense of humor? That's scary.
13:27 Black to move Bc6 pinning night and to queen. Won’t this defen for black?
If the position is the same, but the two white rooks swapped places, does that count as a repetition?
I wonder if anyone has ever done a ladies night variation where the queen becomes the object needing to be checkmated instead of the king
Powerful win by Leela ... always in control right from the start!
7:54, instead of 29. Rc1 Qxc2 why not Rxh7? If Qxh7 by Leela, Qxc1 because the rook is hanging... On the other hand, if Qxc8, the queen is defended by both the knight and the bishop...
Did he watch all games and picked that one or was it a random pick?
Let's pause a moment to give praise to the brillinant software develpers producing the greatest chess games in the history of the game!
So pumped for Morphy saga to continue
In norwegian, it is called 'trekktvang', which roughly translates to 'forced to move'. It has a veery similar pronunciation as 'zugzwang', except the 'z' sound is a 't'. Does the word 'zugzwang' stem from some germanic language?
The german word for zugzwang is ... zugzwang ;-)
@@SpliffieBee ah... Then it being similar in norwegian makes sense, as both are germanic languages.
@@SpliffieBee ah... Then it being similar in norwegian makes sense, as both are germanic languages.
When will your podcast with MVL begin?
Engine logics: at 18:11 already all is lost but just for curiosity, why does the bishop not take at least a pawn?
hhgygy Nxf4 forking and winning another pawn looked too decisive for stockfish to handle.
@@faznaz7455 Actually it's all the same, it's just a human would die at least killing an enemy soldier wouldn't he?
hhgygy Stockfish doesn’t think that way but it’s definitely an interesting view. Stockfish will always prioritise objective chess (i.e. striving for perfection).
It is not really winning a pawn. White recaptures with the knight, forking the two black pawns and winning at least one of them.
Why not d4 by black after bishop e3 by white? Doesn't this win a piece for black?
Maybe it's because you pin your own queen after knight captures pawn and knight captures knight?
14:18 white could have played Nf6 to force a Knight trade and white will have a passed F pawn. The king will be stock preventing the passed F-pawn and the Bishop will be forced to capture the passed A-pawn in the future
19:15 Well yeahhhhhh😂
Nice gif hahahaha I enjoyed that. Plz do more of that
Please provide game 95 as well where Leala beats Stockfish as black with the same opening. I would really like to hear how Leala beats Stockfish with a french defence
I was so not ready for the gif