Stirling Squadron | 'Night Flight' over Europe (1944)
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- Опубликовано: 27 дек 2023
- A dramatised 1944 story highlighting the importance of map reading in the conduct of the air war over Europe. While tacitly acknowledging secret radar and radio navigation aids, it tackles the subject of how to cope when the high-technology fails.
The story follows a mission by the crew of a Short Stirling heavy bomber from a fictional airfield "Prangmere" to bomb the German city of Duisburg.
My Czechoslovak grandfather was a navigator in Short Stirlings in the final two years of the war, as part of the Czech RAF. He was based in Cornwall and their main task was to go out U-Boat hunting, which they became pretty adept at. Alas, it was this specific task that did for him at the age of 60 in 1980. He'd always been short-fused with bad headaches after the war and in 1979 he had a brain scan which identified the tumour. After further medical research his consultant said it was likely caused by his three years of staring closely into radar CRT tube for hours on end. Apparently, back in those days there was not the same effective coating on the tube screen and effectively he was unwittingly exposed to sustained periods of electron radiation. He also started off his pilot and navigation training in the Luftwaffe, before managing to escape. But that's a long story...
A little RAF humour at the start when the airbase location is identified as "PRANGMERE", a play on the slang for a crash and Tangmere RAF fighter station. Shades of Pilot Officer Prune and Tee Emm.
I never thought the Stirling got enough notice.
My father was a Navigator on sterlings and used to drop equipment to the resistance in Norway and France and was at the crossing of the Rhine towing Gliders.
Stirlings.
Which Squadrons was he assigned to?
I know there's a lot of love for the Stirling in these comments but there was a reason that Harris wanted them phased out and having an all Lancaster force ASAP. The Stirling (and Halifax) flew lower and slower than the Lancaster. As a result they were usually the first target identified by enemy fighters and gunners. Their crews took disproportionate losses compared to Lancs. Harris understandably wanted this to stop.
The improved versions were cancelled.
The RAF didn't need another type of heavy, and Harris loved the Lancaster bomb bay.
Plus a lower slower bomber really creates problems for a bomber stream and is horribly vulnerable going to Germany in the face of the German integrated air defences.
Many German night fighter techniques involved having aircraft already on patrol so the bigger issue wasn't so much time to altitude but much greater vulnerability to flak.
Crew flying other bombers supposedly cheered when they heard in the briefings that Stirlings would be flying nearby, as the Stirlings attracted the flak and night fighters, thus making things safer for the Lancs and Halifaxes.
@@JeffreyWilliams-dr7qeNeither one seemed to care where or on whom the bombs fell.
@@JeffreyWilliams-dr7qe Thanks for your reply Jeffrey. Sometimes we forget that most of the casualties in WW2 were civilian "thanks" to modern weapon technology. Not to mention modern politics. I appreciate you agreeing with my previous post. I only wish that I wasn't right.
I saw a comment recently on another Stirling film where the person had known a Stirling pilot who had flown it through most of his time during WW2. He had nothing but praise for the Stirling and wouldn't swap it for the Lancaster or Halifax. I suppose if the plane you've got to know well has brought you through, and done what was asked of it, even glider towing in this case, you probably have an affection for it.
A Canadian pilot, Murray Peden, who flew the Stirling with 214 Squadron loved the aircraft and said it handled like a fighter. His book 'A Thousand Shall Fall' is superb, a must read.
Yes it doesn't seem to matter what type it is if she's looked after you you will have an emotional attachment.
The MkV was an excellent transport a/c and served well out East.
@@rogueriderhood1862I agree. It’s a great book!
My father in law crewed both sterling's and Lancasters. He started out as radio man and then to Bombaimer. He was in the RAAF. Made 40 missions. He ended up with his family in San Diego, California. He was a great father in law.
Short Stirling was a BEAUTIFUL Aircraft - Under rated in my opinion. ❤
What precisely was beautiful about it, from an operational persepctive? It had a rubbish operational ceiling and rate of climb when bombed up leaving it vulnerable to all aspects of European weather, terrain, low and high level Flak, searchlight penetration and fighters. On top of that, its MTOW bomb load was rendered pathetic to offer any practical range to German targets, and its central ventral bombay design (plus that of its internal wing bays) constraining to what ordnance it could carry. The Stirling was a classic case of superb in concept, flawed in design, failed in execution. Noted that you did say "under rated (sic)" paraphrased 'in your opinion'.
@@theblytonian3906 All true, but it should be remembered that the Stirling was the only 4 engine heavy bomber we had and is a massive aircraft, much larger than a Lancaster or Halifax. The Lancaster developed from the dreadful Manchester which was a medium twin, and the Halifax also grew from a medium twin design. The Stirling was always supposed to be a 4 engine bomber and its wings were clipped, literally in fact, when the air ministry limited the wingspan to 100ft. Had they not done this and the 112ft wing from the Sunderland was used as intended (without the modifications needed to the section by shortening it) it may well have been a very different animal. The Lancaster also benefited from a catapult launch requirement for the Manchester, which gave a larger than normal bomb bay and stronger floor which allowed the design to be scaled up. The Halifax used the same bomb cell concept that was used on the Stirling and other earlier designs as bombs bigger than 500lbs didnt exist at the time. Technological development was extremely rapid and being designed in the mid 30's, the Stirling was left behind despite having good performance when initially designed, and then crippled by the air ministry 100ft spec. Still, it was a useful aircraft until the end of the war and its a shame none survive.
Perhaps "BEAUTIFUL" in the sense that it was the best & only 4-engine heavy available before the new generation Lancs & Halifaxes! A sight better than taking Whitleys, Manchesters, Hampdens, Blenheims & even Wimpys over the Reich in those early, dark days. Everyone had to "run what they brung" to the start of the war, but everyone also pursued improvements ASAP.
Gotta love the Sterling for "cutting it"--barely-- before production could get up sufficiently on better types.
I believe, when last used in Sept '44 at Le Havre, it was because it was "only" just across the Channel, so that the better "heavies" would be free to do the "heavy" lifting over Germany.
My Dad flew Stirling's with 199 squadron. It was while flying this aircraft he was awarded the DFM after the aircraft was engaged by 2 german night fighters
That's interesting! My uncle was with 199Sqn at Lakenheath as a FE in 1943. His primary crew pilot was F/O Hagues with whom he also did all his training, but also flew with pilots W/C Bray, PO Humphries and F/S Kyle in Stirlings. No connection by any chance? 🙏
Also have the Squadron photo if you want to DM?
My father flew in Stirlings (and Halfaxes) during the war as a flight engineer. This may be a fictional film but interesting nevertheless especially as my father never talked about his experiences.
Hi Roger, I have also known many WW2 airmen, now passed, who never spoke of their experiences. It's their absolute right if course to deal with that period of time as they choose, but also a pity in a way because it precludes us from giving them the full recognition they deserve, but perhaps that is why they chose silence. Anyway I also enjoyed the film.
RAF Bomber Command lost 55,573 aircrew killed out of a total of 125,000 members from Britain, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand - a staggering 44 percent death rate.
Still lower than the casualties the British Army took on the first day of the Battle of the Somme. Those paltry deaths allowed Britain to pretend it was fighting a war, when the real fighters (the Soviets) were dying by the millions in the mammoth task of bleeding Gerry white.
@@javiergilvidal1558 I take your point about the massive losses on the Eastern Front suffered by civilians and the Red Army, but "allowed Britain to pretend it was fighting a war" is harsh. Although the British army was not active in Western Europe between June 1940 and June 1944 they were fighting in other places - particularly North Africa, Burma and Italy, the RAF were bombing Europe, and the Royal Navy and merchant fleet suffered heavy losses in the Atlantic and on the Arctic convoys.
Just love this film (first time I've seen it) Especially poignant for me as my uncle was a F/Eng in Stirlings & flew many ops.
Short stirlings four engine bombers the first of RAFs heavy bombers , to enter service in 1939,. though fast and maneuverable, it lacked a high combat ceiling, compared to the newer Heavy four engine bombers coming on line, like the avro lancaster and the Handley page Halifax bomber, they could reach 20.000 ft (nearly twice as much bomb capacity as a American B17 flying fortress, which flew at 25.00ft up to 30.000 ft ) where's the Short Stirling operated at 16.500 to 12.000 which drew criticism, making it more vulnerable to enemy flack and night fighters, they were withdrawn from bombing mission, as more Lancasters and Halifax bombers came off the production line.
interesting to note that the stirling was flying well below the germans flack that was fused to detonate at the lancs and halifax higher altitude so unless they scored a direct hit the stirling was missing all the fun ....it was also the fastest of the 3 at lower altitudes and more agile
Brilliant mix of crew. M.
A lot worked towing gliders on D-Day and in Meteorological squadrons right up to the end of the war. Sketchy business. Got to love the mix of accents. Brits, Canadians, Aussies, Kiwis and maybe a Saffer(?) just getting the job done.
What a great film!
Supposedly RAF crew flying other bombers cheered in their briefings when they heard that Stirling squadrons would be in the mix, because the Stirlings attracted the night fighters and flak, flying lower and slower as they did. Then the other planes, Lancs and Halifaxes, didn't get so much opposition.
Jolly good show.
It flew well and was exceptionally manoeuvrable. The Halifax I and II usually went fatally out of control in the event of an engine failure because of very bad vertical stabiliser and rudder design. The crews quite liked the Sterling.
"Get cracking", "get stuffed"! Also the Australian Änd don't forget to select the photo ???
Flying a Short Stirling, yeah good luck surviving that tour. Every other RAF bomber is flying above you and faster.
Thank the penguins at The Air Ministry who clipped the wings of the Stirling to enable it to fit inside existing hangers.
That's a lie that was scotched decades ago. In 1936 the Type C hangar was introduced which had doors that could open to 120 feet. 1936 was the year the specification of the Stirling was issued (B.12/36) as well as the one that lead ti the Halifax and Lancaster via a diversion to Manchester (P.13/36). The real reason for the 100 foot wingspan limit was to limit the size of the aircraft as it was considered that to manually fly anything larger would be too much for a single pilot.
There is no evidence that the wings were clipped to fit hangars. The Stirling was as a massive aircraft with a lot of features not demanded of the later ‘heavies’.
Got to admit I thought it was the hanger theory as well. Thanks for the correction.
@@geordiedog1749 you can search a thread on PPRUNE aviation history and nostalgia for a lot of info about it
@@andrewmountford3608 the Manchester and the HP.56 were also designed with catapult assisted launches in mind.
That certainly wasn't a 1944 op! More like conditions in '40/41. Stooging along on your own? Bad show old boy. By '44, the pukka gen was sticking in the stream with a couple of hundred other nice types!
Is there any evidence to suggest that bomber crews would tune into radio entertainment during these flights and piped it through the aircraft?
I remember working with a man who had been a mid upper gunner on (maybe) a Lancaster. He told me a tale of setting of on a raid and the crew turned on to the Tommy Handley BBC comedy show. (Wartime -and after, BBC listeners will well remember that one). So they then failed to hear a recall message and flew on. after landing they blamed it on a failure of the radio.
I didn't think Stirling's were still doing ops over Germany in 1944, this was due to their speed & payload & only flying at a max of 18000ft. Great visuals & Englishness of the time, going forward. Brave just to take off really.
The Stirling was the first of the 4 engined RAF heavy bombers and was constructed at shadow factories.
Delayed by the RAF understandabley concentrating on fighter production it entered service in 1941.
There were teething problems, and the specifications it was built to limited it in some ways.
Never the less it was vastly superior to its predecessors, well liked by its crews but was soon superceded by later types.
It didn't help that the specifications said it had to fit in a 100ft hanger, limiting it's wingspan to 99ft.
With a larger wingspan this may have been able to climb higher than its original max altitude,16,500 ft .
Though it was also limited by it's bomb bay which although it could carry up to 14 x 1,000lb bombs, couldn't accomidate the larger 4,000lb 'cookie'.
As you said a remarkable aircraft, limited by design.
He found the chocolate covered roaches quite tasty.
Is Prangmere just fictional....
Is this rightly described as a ‘propaganda’ film or is it actually a RAF training film? It smacks more of encouraging professionalism rather than persuasion, much like those training films I and many others have watched as servicemen.
Didn't really encourage me either way. Mind you I kept expecting a Night Fighter to attack and chase them off course so that they really needed to map read to get home!
just the fate of the free world on yer shoulders not much
Oh yeah, no pressure….😂
They were very brave men flying with limited resources.
@@simonclark29041978And somebody will say the same in another 75 years.
Think about the fact that most of these chaps were too young to vote and in civilian life no one would lend them a car , yet here they are flying 50 tons of aeroplane wth 5 or 6 tons of bombs deep into Germany.
They could take a Butt Report copy with them to egg them on? What? Eh! Oh….
Great film! I think Stirlings had been withdrawn from frontline bombing duties by 1944 though...
Best book on the Stirling I read was 'Stirling at War' by Johnathan Falconer. It's astonishing what the crews went through knowing they were likely to be killed in a Stirling. Shorts should have been allowed to tweak the design to improve performance, longer wings for a start...
Still used for radio countermeasures by 100 Group Bomber Command. Also flying over occupied Europe on arms and supplies drops for SOE could be as risky.
I can't remember when, or if, they withdrew them from 'gardening' missions...dropping naval mines. They were apparently quite good at that too, but so was the Lanc'. Was a glider tug too (perhaps its best role?), a lot were lost during Op Market Garden trying to resupply the Paras at Arnhem.
Prangmere….nice bit of humour.
It was the fictional airfield used in Tee Emm, the often humourous Training Memorandum, and usually the home (when he wasn't helplessly lost - again) of Pilot Officer Percy Prune.
I say old man! I never got lost!! The road signs were taken down. It was a security measure you know!
I have a copy of Prangmere Mess by Anthony Armstrong. Long time since I read it, I recall being suitably amused by it.
✨🏴✨🥰✨👍✨♥️✨🤗✨.
Mad games of Russian roulette.
100
Australian accents
New zealand...
🤔 One of the aircrew had a New Zealand shoulder badge. It is visible in the ops room sequence.
And Canadian, along with the Kiwi, not an Aussie. Think I heard a Scot and a Taffy, too.
Definitely South African or Rhodesian. Not Australian, Canadian or New Zealand
The bomb aimer is pretty clearly Canadian.
Fajny film