Artificial Intelligence Bike Fitting : Explained & Tested! My Velo Fit
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- Опубликовано: 28 июл 2024
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0:00 What is MYVELOFIT AI?
0:55 Why traditional bike fitting clinics are great?
1:27 Biggest problem with traditional bike fitting
2:00 Advantage #1 : Convenience
2:30 Advantage #2 : Accuracy
2:50 How I will test the AI
3:37 The full process of using and testing the AI
8:25 My girlfriend bike fitting
9:10 Advantage #3 : Unbiased
9:56 Advantage #4 : Knowledge
10:25 Advantage #5 : Expert Review
10:37 Advantage #6 : Fit any bikes
10:52 Advantage #7 : Low cost
11:25 Disadvantage #1 : Margin of errors
11:48 Disadvantage #2 : No Front view
12:06 Disadvantage #3 : You need your own tools
12:30 Who is MYVELOFIT For?
12:48 Who is MYVELOFIT NOT For?
13:25 Want to try the AI?
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Thank you so much for this video. I can’t wait to try it out as it will be so helpful.
Thanks Lucas!!
I recently did a Guru fitting which was part of the deal buying the frame. Guru system, similar to other such fit systems, is based on plotting the positions on an x/y graph, each setting amounting to a coordinate on that graph.
Guru also plots angles and can do instant setting changes of seat and bars while pedaling. The angles plotted can be referenced to a range of “normal/advisable” angles for comfort, power etc
While I think the process produced some usable data, I regard it as a start point which requires a hundred km test ride, and lots of minor tweaks to the seat fore/aft, seat level setting, height, reach to bars, drop, and the similar stuff at cockpit…shifter positions, angle in/out, bar height, spacers used etc. in other words, no such fitting produces a guaranteed setup. And, for any practically useful application the machine needs to be set up using the actual saddle and bars intended for the new bike.
Furthermore, every rider has different bodily restrictions even if precisely similar physical dimensions, and such stuff as individual flexibility, leg length disparity, and persistent injuries features strongly. The rider will notice (if paying attention) detailed adjustments necessary. But will the rider know how to do it properly. A good fitter can be a great resource.
I think Charles’ report is fair, and addresses these points, but I’d diminish the content about suspect bike fitter motives. Everyone makes a living is true, even Mr Ouimet. There are lots of good fitters doing great work. Fit system tech has its place, but so does bio mechanics, and a host of other analytical perspectives. What we, the consumer public, have access to is a small sample of what team riders get. “Bike fitting” is a part of, but not the only consideration to proper set up.
I agree with you man! Great points you just shared. Again for the bike fitter motives, I even says in in the video : ''Not all of them obviously''. I know there is a lot more genuine bike fitters than shady ones out there. I've just heard stories of some guys recommending stupid products to the customers who knew nothing.
@@CharlesOuimet I apologize if my comment came off as a big negative. I do not perceive you to be doing a bike fitter take down at all. I like your presentations, and tune in to those that appeal to my interests.
I’m going to do a post on my channel about my fitting, and also using the guru data to reset my other bikes as possible. I’d like to mention your channel, and want to pronounce your name properly. I imagine “Oui” as in “yes”, but the “met” is, as in “may” or is the ending T pronounced, as in having “met” at a cafe? I know the rule for pronouncing ending consonants is C, R, F and L…and sometimes T…
Just want to do right!
Keep the vdos coming and best of luck Charles!
@@theunabiker4133 no prob dude! Looking forward to your video! Send it over to me. It's oui like yes and met like " we met last night" or just '' we met'' 🤣
Being a bikefitter myself, the software is beautiful, but it doesn't even do half of what we do... It says nothing about your frontal ankle-knee alignment, doesn't tell you what wedges to install or what insoles would be a match for your feet... a bikefit really starts with your feet and knees... Not to mention hood rotation position, handlebar width, saddle choice... don't get me wrong the software is really really nice, I would use it as a helpful tool for example, but it is no substitute for an "expensive" bikefit. It dials in your position a little bit, but you can't compare it to a professional bikefitter spending 4 to 5 hours of his/her time to get your body dialed in on your bike from every angle. That is why it costs $300 and it includes the insoles and the wedges (at least at my business it does) you can almost say it is reasonably priced for the service you get ;-) that is just my opinion.
I agree with you man! And I've said it, it's a ball park fit, not to compare with the great and precise service of a pro bike fitters. But a great starting point to people have a decent fit for a while, and then get a bit use to cycling before getting a real fit if they want better comfort or performance
We agree. Our goal is not to replace the value that professional fitters bring (that's our roots), but to provide high quality tools (more to come) and knowledge to help more riders find a sound position on the bike and let them dial it in and adjust over time. As I'm sure you're aware, finding a good fitter can be hard, getting an appointment can be even harder, and going back with any frequency gets expensive. We would never discourage getting a professional fit from a reputable fitter, but we feel there is huge hole in the fit world as many riders can't access a good fit, and certainly not as frequently as might be ideal. We believe pretty strongly in bike fit being a journey rather than a single event, and we're here to support that process. Would love your feedback on our product if you get the chance to try it out!
Mhm-and for $500 I’m gonna let some “specialist” tell me that I gotta raise my seat by 5mm. Most bike fitters say/schedule the procedure for about 2-2.1/2 max! Of which about 20-30min is a warm up! That goes into the bike fit. Are you kidding me !?? 😂 I am gonna pay you $250 an hour-to watch me pedal, so YOU can tell me-my seat is too low or too high-I have a great sense of what the body does and feel. AI will tel you that info geometrical wise and position according to software, for $75-unlimited. I repeat-unlimited! Are you gonna accept riders for 1 year unlimited ?, as many bike fits as they like for small 10 min adjustment. I’m beyond curious
I’ve had 2 bike fits from 2 different fitters and I would say this AI tool would do a better job than they did. A good bike fitter is rare in some areas so having this tool is a fantastic alternative
@@tonypowers123 Had a fit several years ago. Lowered saddle 6 mm and moved forward 8 mm. I knew what felt right before I went for the fit as I had ridden more than 100,000 miles.
I've just starting using this software and am pretty impressed. It's obviously got limitations, but I think it's a very useful tool for getting a good starting point and tweaking your fit within the suggested ranges. For my current road bike fit (recently advised by a pro fitter) it suggested my saddle height was in range and I could see that it was toward the higher end of the suggested range. I have run my saddle up to 10 mm lower without issues but never any higher, so this result makes sense to me. The only suggestion was to move my saddle more rearward, which was interesting because I was experimenting with a more forward position than I normally use. Reach and back angle were all in range, although my elbow bend was a little high (probably from the more forward saddle position). For $75 unlimited annual use I think it's a no-brainer for those who don't need a $300 pro-fit i.e. most people if we're being honest!
Thanks for sharing!! Agreed with you buddy 💯
This is great! I will definitely have a look at it.
I began biking this past spring and after having my bike built I did a professional fitting. It does feel very comfortable but it cost about $300. This will be helpful when it comes time to cut my stem down
Exactly!
I tried it. I had knee pain and could not get a bikefitting due to lockdown - this is when I found MyVelo Fit. I think it has improved since then as your screenshots look a bit different. Well, what happened to me was that the seatpost on my main bike was broken and the saddle went down slowly about 2 centimeters. And I copied that position to my other bikes. And i did not notice as it was so slow, the whole process probably took months and I got used to that wrong low position.
The AI found that I was too low, but the end position the AI found for me was something I cannot really ride. I have long legs and a short torso and long arms. It would put me too far back and I would loose the control on the frontwheel, plus I would need very short stem and lots of spacers. But this is something individual and would probably work better for someone with more normal proportions.
The AI found my major setup mistakes and defined the trend. The body needs some time to adopt. Meanwhile ( this was some months ago ) I am much closer to the AI recommended position. I got great support from the team there when I had issues with the interface.
You need to make sure you have a good test setup for reproducable quality videos. Mark the positions of trainer, camera and tripod for the camera so that you have the same angle for all videos. Use a normal lense, not the fisheye as it distorts. Warm up and put some power on the pedals, no empty pedaling@50 watts but something like 200 or so.
I think it is a very good tool, but you need to be patient and ideally go with the pro subscription for one year if you have to do large corrections and have to adopt to these. Besides the recommendations there is still the angle measurement and you can also work directly with those values to set up different bikes. For example I found that a knee angle of 110° works better with my riding style than 109, so I can compare the measurement of the bike where I feel good to another one just comparing the angles.
Wow thanks for sharing such great feedback. Agreed with you man!
It took me years of cycling and owning different bikes to get my perfect position which also included having a custom frame made for me. Some frames were too small and some slightly too big and once I got that figured out and the type of riding I ultimately settled for, the frame builder took that information and got the frame dialed. This bike I have now I can spend hour after hour riding and I don't get any issues. All the specs with the geometry are on paper now so I just apply that should I need a new bike. We all eventually get there so don't stress obsessively over this stuff, the APP could be wrong, what I mean by that is I don't believe this APP is worth the asking price because it could still be wrong, and a fitter who knows what they are doing would probably be a better way to go.
Looks very good. I suggest that once we stablish ourselves within these angle measurements, we take care at something we don't do correctly and that is giving power to some forgotten muscles involved in cycling. For example; my weight lifting destined to alleviate my sore pelvic muscles and numbness of arms, biceps, and shoulders was incomplete in the sense I worked out my wrists, forearms, arms and stopped there. I lately included shoulders and back upper muscles and the result was amazing. I got full support starting at the wrist level all the way up to the shoulders. The same with my pelvic floor; I started including Kegel exercises and that's when my endless search for the right saddle came to an end. Hope Mr. Ouimet can come up with a video about the correct foot position including cleat, for aft etc.
Interesting video. In my opinion, the fundamental flaw (and bias actually) is that this software, like most others, only observe the human body from a two-dimensional point of view AND, usually, one side of the body. Human beings are three-dimensional and the majority have differences and developmental biases between the left and right side of the body. In addition, the AI does not consider arch support, q-factor, q-angle, and cleat position, which are arguably more important than saddle height.
really it amazing!
Yes!
Salute Charles good video 🙏👍🔥🇵🇷💯
Thank you for watching Luis!!
Interesting video! As far as I know, AI uses average data, so this meaning maybe it works well for you, but there will be a great number of people out of the Gauss bell, that will find this doesn´t work for them by any means: leg lenght discrepancies, hip rotations, feet lenght discrepancies or problems with their feet.. etc But other tools like Retül that is widely used by bike fitters, works the same that this AI tool, using averages... forgetting that everyone is individual and unique. The good thing about this is at least is cheaper than bad bike fitters...
Would be interesting to also make a video of your LH side as most people show a difference between LH and RH side (something a good bike fitter looks at). Also, what happens with your position when you do the videos under load (85-100% FTP). Almost all cyclist will drop their heels under load more or less (yes, even Mathieu van der Poel) and that changes your position.
An indoor trainer that’s worth it’s weight will be more than the cost of a fitting if you don’t already have access to one
Hello, Charles thankyou for making this video, can you just make one how do bike fit of any cycle. How to adjust saddle. It would be much helpful♥️💯🚲👯♂️👯♂️
Thanks! I think there is plenty of videos on RUclips who can teach you how to adjust anything on a bike!
I have now ride 73km and i got more power and my left feet doesnt sleep after 30-40km. I can feel som litle bit of pain on the right knee. But it doesnt hurt. Its better after using MVF. So I am happy. I will recomend this for people who dont wanna spend 300 dollars on pro bikefit 👍
Wow nice to hear!!
I have now tried for almost 3 hours. The change for me was the hight on the saddle. They say that i was needed to go up 2 cm. But they still complaining about that i need to take the saddle 5 mm back. But i cant go more back. I am gonna try a 50 km on zwift tomorrow and see how my body reacts. I am happy so far. But i still gonna go to a pro bikefitter. A camera cant replace a human with experince. But like you say. This is a good product for beginners. Not for advanced People.
Exactly! Glad you tested it out
Get a different seat post!
Charles check out leomo remote fitting.
I'll check it out, thanks!
so, what's the long term review ? my experience is just ride lots and "listen to your body" meaning if you start to feel you should be further forward up/down etc. make the change and try it until you feel other changes would help. commutes where you are racing for personal best times and long distance loops get you dialed in- also, physiology changes too.
What about knee tracking? There is no video from the front or back needed?
“AI” also known as if/else haha! But seriously this seems like a good alternative for those not ready to spend over 100$ on bike fit. I can see many problems with the recommendations made but it’s still much better than no fit at all (or a fit from someone who doesn’t know what he’s doing)!
exactly!!
Doesn’t make sense. moving your saddle height up and down didn’t affect the saddle height result? Does that mean that saddle height give or take. 20mm isn’t an issue?
Hello can you set this app in your phone?and do you have to pay for it?
there is a free version!
I can’t find my velo fit in my iPhone app?
you can use on the web browser from your phone
What do you think self about your ressult? Something u can use in the future and drop the bikefit guys in the store?
I think the results are great starting point. For every new bike I will run the AI and get a ballpark fit. Then if I feel there is a need, I will consult a fitter. But I'm starting to have lots of experience in this so I know how to fit myself !
@@CharlesOuimet thank u. I am gonna try this out today. Need it before one week in Spain and 700km in front of me.
@@mangel3490 I almost suggest you don't do it unless you are having significant issues. Making big changes right before a high mileage week can sometimes cause issues. If you do decide to make changes I'd make sure to take some detailed notes on your current position before making changes (there is a spot to record you measurements). I'm not saying that the changes might be wrong, it's more that even going from a bad position to a good position and not giving it time to adapt can lead to issues.
If you'd like you can reach out to support after you upload your first video and we can give you a bit more feedback to help decide if you want to make major changes a week before a big volume trip.
@@jessejarj smart. Thank u!
Steve Hogg trained fitter in Austin TX charges $600!!!
Thats a crime
Not here to bash the tool from the get go, but I'm a bit confused about some of the results. Initially it says that your saddle height is correct, but is says it's also correct when its 20mm lower.
With the lower saddle, I did sit a bit further back on the saddle to have the right leg extension, which is also good. There is no "perfect fit" it's a mettre of finding what works great! I prefer to be a bit more on top of my BB with higher saddle, but lower with a bit more setback is also a good position
@@CharlesOuimet Fair enough, thanks for the clarification.
I noticed this too, and it undercut my desire to try this app a bit. I get that there’s more than one way to get all the angles into the desired range, and that human bike fitters would also give you a variety of fits, but it doesn’t feel right that so much of the recommended position would be determined by the starting position. Especially the example of an extreme starting position (saddle 20mm down and 40mm back), where it recommended further dropping the saddle an additional 5mm.
I’d rather see it be more strict at first, moving you towards a more narrowly defined ideal fit regardless of the starting point, and then give suggestions to tweak it based on desired outcomes.
I tried your code but seems invalid. Is still active?
Hey, I just tested and it still works on my end!
That’s cool, but my bike fitter makes coffee, tea and has free bagels… 😤😁🤜🏽🤛🏽
We'll work on the coffee and free bagels in the next update... tough to compete with that.
@@myvelofit 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ahahah true! You remove the great clinic experience, but can have a year long of coffee supply with the price difference 😂😂
That’s a good point!… I’m paying for those free bagels! 😆
@@CycoWarriorx nothing is free in life 😂😂😂
Hahaha wow love the sci-fi style! 🧑🔬🤖🛸
Hehe 😅😅😁
Sadly, 7 months later and they have done little to nothing to improve the software. No different views, no further features or analyses etc. Seven months in software development is a lifetime so I'm guessing they haven't gotten the traction they needed to fund further development work.
Hi! They have been hard at work with their new bike SIZING software. It's now live and free to use. I have a new video on it ready, should be posted next week!
Girlfriend’s saddle is obviously too high!!!
We fixed it!
Also you can inspect element and get all the measurements for free lolol
We fixed that one ages ago. Older fits still have the data attached in the html but newer ones don't.
Gotta support the one who are changing the game!
Funny how everything is called ai today
As a bike fitter I look forward to correcting the fits done on this application end of the day you are paying for experience, advice and expertise. If it was so easy we would not spend years studying sports science and anatomy in order to insure the correct fit for the customer
As mentioned, it's not perfect, but it does give a great ball park fit. Which is most often good enough for a great majority or people. 300$ fit is overkill for some weekend enthusiasts who doesn't have any injury! I think it a good way to get started and then seek professional help to dial it a perfect position 👍🏽
@@CharlesOuimet I find your actions very parasitic and your the same person who will be begging the bike industry for stuff and perks at the same time slandering the hands that feed you.
You might come across better if you took @Dean Bodart's approach to explaining the shortcomings of this software rather than being arrogantly dismissive.
Bike fitters ARE shady 🦹🏻♂️🧛🏾♂️
99%
When you go buy your self a car-any make-model, let’s say…-sport car- $100 000, $200 000- are you gonna go get another/different steering wheel, different seats, different LENGTH pedals, bigger/smaller tires ?, maybe ask for a higher roof cause you are too tall !? 🤢
Should I keep going !? I don’t think so.
So then,
Why would you pay 10 000, 15 000, stack fit-and then, the guy that sold it to you tells you, mmm-duh, you need a bike fit, and then, the Bike Pro Fitter tells you-duh, your bike is too big/too small.
This is ludicrous, and should be absolutely eradicated. There’s gotta be a law-
If-they-sell you-the wrong size frame-even if you find out 6 months or a year later, they should replace it 100% with the correct size-according to their recommended Pro Bike Fitter, that you just paid $500, so he/she can tell you, you bought the wrong size and I can only do so much 😅🤮
Someone had a bad experience!
Tested it and even if it could give a good starting point, it is too much dependent on how you set your camera and the alignment/disalignement of it or the bike.
2 pretty similar camera setups gave me 2 completely different fit results. Another problem is that the 2 sides are very often different and it doesn't provide a front/back fit.
Moreover, angles are important but too theoretical...a perfect and proportionate human can benefit from them but a man with very long legs and short torso or viceversa will always have a compromise fit.
In my opinion a good and balanced pedal movement and a good weight equilibrium on the bike is more important than angles
Anyway as I said, good starting point and that's all
Thanks for sharing! I haven't had these issues but I'll discuss with the founder! Agreed that it's a great starting point
@@CharlesOuimet their system anyway does a good job to adapt the video to the frame but in my opinion camera alignment is so important: I did 9 videos and even if I try to replicate every time the same camera position and height, sometimes the same bike position seems so different because of some sort of misalignment. Front and back analysis would be nice too
Please reach out to our support team if you haven't already. We test for various camera placements/angles (within reason) for reliability and have consistent results. We'd love to try and help resolve your issues and figure out what may have gone wrong.
@@myvelofit Thank you. I'm gonna do it for sure