You see Cepholapocalypse you’re forgetting the most important use for these weapon coating bottles. They act as paperweights in my inventory space to hold down all the books I’m collecting to read later.
one use i've found for some of the weaker coatings, mainly simple toxin, has actually been to just waste bosses' legendary resistance charges so i can set up some other powerful effects asap. there's other ways to force lots of saving throws like this but simple toxin is obviously available super early and i found it pretty useful against early bosses like w'wargaz
Doh! I didn't realize that toxins weren't supposed to work until the end of the enemy's next turn. I was wondering where the damage went! Toxins still help stack arcane synergy, so they're worth for sharpshooter or GWM builds, but oof I wish it just added to attack damage like I thought.
To me the toxin implementation is extremely strange. They work nothing at all like their tabletop counterparts, and really feel like a waste of clicks in their current form!
A word about sleep from coatings. If you have sneak attack as a reaction, it wakes up enemy immediately. I facepalmed myself about it so many times. You can still use sneak attack as a real button press though, which is funny, but as a reaction it basically cancels the effect )
There is one further way to prevent that. You can press K while having your rogue selected, go to the reaction tab and tick the box for "ask" on all sneak actions. That way, when you do hit them with the weapon and put them to sleep, the game will NOT automatically apply sneak attack, but it will ask you if you want to apply it. Thus, you can select at that time if this is normal situation where more dmg the better, or if you just applied a sleep effect and you will not be wanting to sneak attack them.
Another great and very helpful video! One additional thing worth mentioning (that I may have missed) is that several items give you a buff if you poison an enemy, so if you don't need your BA for something else you can proc that with one of the poisons or toxins.
I thing coating weapons in fire could be included in this list because of how similar it is to those: you use a bonus action to make your weapon attacks stronger. I'd probably put it in high b tier because the damage is good, especially in the early game..
Basic fire surface should work. You can also dip into things that are on fire like a burning torch or burning candle. Just drop one on the ground next to you and then you can start dipping. With a candle you might need to interact with it first before you can dip but interacting with it is a free action. Oh and I’ve heard you can also dip into an enemy or ally that is coated in an effect.
@@carnivoriousleaf basic fire is enough. All my characters have a candle in their inventory and use it whenever I have nothing better to do with my bonus action. you can drop it on the ground and light it for no action, then dip your weapons in it for a bonus action, then pick it up for free. It adds 1d4 fire damage to each attack.
@@carnivoriousleafTo add to others replied, candles and torches work fine. HOWEVER, the candle is an extra item you need to be carrying and it is always going to be stacking by other candles you are picking up if you are like more RPG players (hoarders). The cool thing about the torch is that only ONE of the torches is LIT in your inventory; the one you are "carrying". You see, the torch, unlike the weapon, doesn't leave your inventory when you equip it! It's ridiculous, but when you have your weapon equipped, above it, in your character screen, there is a torch, and it's the same exact torch that is in your inventory! What this means: there is a constantly lit torch in your inventory that is lit, which means it doesn't stack! Dropping this torch with the special icon guarantees a lit item drops near you which you can dip your weapons in! No guessing whether it will be lit or not, and also, it helps a little that the item is larger, the flame bigger, the light bigger, making it easier to see and interact with when you are picking the target of the dip action!
Yeah, the fact that an average of around 2,5 minutes of talking /consumable feels actually informative and not pointlessly drawn out is very impressive.
A perk of toxins is that it's easy to synergise with boots of stormy clamour/reverb builds since they cause reberb stacks when *any* condition is applied. So it's a handy way get BoSC to trigger if your base weapon does not have a condition on hit.
It kinda adds some saving grace, but still rather meh. I mean, do you really want to ve using equipment that requires a consumable to do anything? Maybe early on when you really dont have anything better.
@@mittag6326 it's handy for when you have nice equipment that does not apply a condition on hit, like knife of the undermountain king, so they can participate in your reverb build.
Toxins can also be stacked and works outside of turn based. With stealth archer: the trigger of toxin damage can put them into the recoil animation preventing them from out of combat healing. It essentially stun locks them in between your control-click cooldown. Cheesy as hell? sure. Powerful? hell yes.
Yes! Thank you! I was hoping this would be available soon. I'm literally getting ready to send my camp transmutation wizard on a crafting spree, perfect timing.
All of these new tier lists have been so helpful. I like so many others have just been hoarding potions, elixirs, oils, etc. However after getting a more in depth look at their benefits, I’ve incorporated them into my runs and it is both incredibly effective and so fun. I’ve become addicted to min maxing in this game and am going to do a new HM run where I am consistently using everything the game gives me as opposed to just relying on broken builds. (I’m still gonna run broken builds though lol)
Imo you think too bad about Con save targeting things. Yeah, these are no good by themselves, but the bleeding condition is widespread and it gives your targets a disadvantage on con saves. Reverberation also decreases con saves. Drow poison is widespread from the beginning of the game so you tiger barbarian + archer become a really decent controlling and damaging combo, and in act 3 you get the amulet that applies poison condition on every enemy you hit, so you can apply reverberation + bleeding + drow poison / paralyzing poison just with a single attack, which can be arrow of many targets or any multi-target ability. That's where things get really nasty.
Did you hear that Baldur's Gate will be getting inbuilt mod support even for console? If popular mods like "5e Spells" and the Artificer class mod gets added into that, would you make videos on them?
This is super helpful! This and the potion list reinforces for me that the Transmutation Wizard is secretly OP. you can mass produce almost any of these with that Wizard. The only exception is the crawler mucus where the ingredient is super rare. Which makes sense. i wish there were a chart with all this data. maybe for channel Members?
I think I forget about applying these even more than the elixirs and elemental arrows. I think I threw a bottle of poison for the first time the other day and I really liked how the bottle breaking did 3 piercing damage.
First, worth noting for poisons and oils and such, dual wield builds are inherently get more use out of poisons getting it applied to 2 weapons, instead of 1, for the same investment. However, those builds ALSO use their bonus action very effectively, so unless you are pre-combat buffing, the toxins, poisons and oils need to be compared to the effectiveness of just using the bonus action for attacking. As far as the basic poison, I LOVE it for use with boots of stormy clamor, which applies a condition of some kind, even if they resist, and if they fail, applies 2 conditions. Boots count applying the same condition the target is suffering, again, counts as applying a condition and they get another reverberation stack. With 1 other source of applying conditions, a dual wielder can prone an enemy guaranteed every turn, with the extra bonus action from thief.
I love this tierlist as up until now most of those coating were a dead weight in my backpack. Now I can experiment with the ones you picked and stop saving them for the later fight that never comes. Same thing with the potions tierlist, which I also loved.
I really wish BG3 had detailed and accurate tooltips for everything like both the Pathfinder crpgs have. It might partly be because of the difference between the systems and how much more important every detail is in PF, but I still feel you could totally do better. Maybe when the official modding tools come out I will try my hand at it.
regarding Oil of Freezing there are other sources of Encrusted with Frost too! the Coldbrim Hat adds two turns of EwF when you apply a condition on an enemy and the Winter's Clutches add the same when you deal cold damage. Markoheskir's ability Kereshka's Favour's variant Frost of Dark Winter also adds EwF. in a team that abuses the wet condition and cold damage you can actually build around Encrusted with Frost and use Oil of Freezing to speed things up.
While this is defined kind of as niche, another thing with Bane, is it has an amazing synergy with Warlocks and Bards that have the ability drain tadpole ability... lowering an already lower stat (CHA) means Bane will hit way more often. This means future saves also get -1d4 meaning even EASIER CC from said bard or warlock. Even if the ability drain on a Sorc being followed up by a weapon user with Bane still works really well to reduce future saves. that means spells are more likely to not be saved for half and CC less likely to be outright saved.
One coating that I feel might make S+ tier is oil of accuracy because it offsets sharpshooter feat penalty [+2 archery, +2 accuracy, +1 longbow (gotten early)= +5 vs -5 penalty].
I would love to see some more funny and opinion based videos. I loved your “fun” tier list. Two I thought of off the top of my head would be a “Tier list of Troll Spells” for multiplayer. You said in another video that Feign Death “actively hurts you by casting” and my immediate thought was “ooo I should use this when I play with friends to mess with them” because I’m… the worst? Also I think it would be fun to take some of those terrible spells and make weird builds that make the terrible spells “good” in a creative way. Love the content, keep it up!
Elixirs are the besttt! Never used bloodlust before this playthrough and love it!!! Laezel and Astarion keep attacking and attacking and attacking. They’ll wipe out 4-5 enemies in act 3 in one go. Crazy.
Obviously always also carry candles around with you. Deploying them costs no actions whatsoever, they give you fire-coating for a bonus action and you can just pick them up again after combat. Basically free +dmg coating if you aren't using any other and a good way to assist your other character if they apply the oil of combustion.
Another negative with the Arsonists Oil is that its not that easy to make. I don't think any vendors sell it directly, you have to find/buy Frosted Ears (what the heck is a frosted ear anyway?) . . . it just seems too awkward (along with the opportunity cost of not using a different coating) to bother building a strategy around to be worth the effort.
That's very true! Given the way you have to finesse it to work, I also don't like it as a primary strategy (even aside from not usually using wet at all because it's broken). Invaluable for any party with a fire-damage character though!
I may have just misunderstood what was meant here, but I think there's an inaccuracy at 10:30 in the discussion about toxins. I just tested it and I was able to apply the toxin debuff 5 times to the same enemy in one turn (rogue/fighter, so 6 total weapon attacks in a turn with action surge, extra attack, and fast hands). They even moved out of melee range on their turn and I applied a 6th debuff with the opportunity attack, and they took damage from all 6 of them. I still totally agree that the way they're implemented does limit their value, but builds with a lot of attacks per turn can probably get the most out of them.
Hi, isn’t Malice/blind effect better than paralysis in situations if you hit a caster/ranged that is in a high ground and advantageous position ? That forces them to leave their position to attempt to get in melee range of you which means they become misplaced and we gain advantageous attacks against them. PS: thank you for making those tier-lists and help us have better use for most of our inventory than paperweight 🤭
I think shrinking an enemy also decreases their weight so it makes them easier or just able to be thrown if you are playing with a thrower in your party.
I just can't get excited about Oil of Freezing (and the Encrusted with Frost condition). I feel like anything you hit enough to trigger the effect (and they get a save!) . . . well its going to be dead by that time anyway. Sure you could try to build around, but why make your life difficult. Control effects need to be easy to apply to really be effective.
The way I see Encrusted with Frost, the best thing you get from it is disadvantage on dex saves. When combined with snow burst ring, you drastically increase the chance that the enemy fails its prone save
I tend to agree! That's one I never use myself, and I think a general bias in my lists is that if I never use something, I try to imagine the best use case for it and can end up overcorrecting and rating it too high as a result
Hey, great video I just wanted to ask it if curiosity if you were still going to do a subclass multi-class tier list I remember in one of your old videos you said that was something you wanted to do but I recently looked at all the possible combinations and while I'm not sure on the exact number it's easily in the high hundreds and I wanted to know if you were still planning on doing it
18:24 We always say that the tooltips will get fixed in the patches. They won't. Movement speed will still say 0, tooltips will be misleading. They never bother with these low hanging fruit
Oil of combustion is just to dangerous for me to use. so many enemies make it into melee (or I make it into melee with atleast one character), and with it ignoring resistance, its just far to dangerous to myself and will often end up discouraging attacks rather than encouraging them. Its best to use, do volley/multi arrow, then next turn swap it off with another oil to prevent the friendly fire. that makes it kinda rough and makes me never use it. so I wouldnt put it past B tier myself. Also, I dont like 'uncontrolled' AOE explosions due to destroying loot around targets often unpredictably. This can also discourage the attack.
Nowhere! Or rather, by using them and then inspecting the entry in the combat log (for some of them, which show the save) or checking the game files with a hex editor (for the ones that for some reason have the save hidden). These items were I think an extreme afterthought so the tooltips are confusingly written, uninformative, contain typos, and are often outright wrong (tell us how you really feel Ceph)
I have a build request if you would be so kind and if it works. i want to create a a Bardadin with 2 levels of Fightter for Action Surge and 1 level of Wizard for spells, I also wanted the the TAV to be the party face. Is thuis possible?
Throw is a bonus action for berserker barbarians, but probably I'm talking about applying them to weapons which is a bonus action for everyone (unless I misspeak, which has been known to happen!)
I'm suprised by his opinion about wizardbane. I mean, he says shield is one of the best spells in the game. And it basically takes -5 from enemy attack roll. Wizardbane takes -3. Sure, it takes it from spells, which often still deal half damage if you pass a save. But even though the effect is smaller, it will apply on your entire party and for multiple turns. It doesn't come that often, but against enemies with nasty CC like hold person, this can render them quite useless.
Shield is something you choose to use when you need it . And it protects your squishiest character (the wizard) from all the enemies. Wizardbane protects you from one enemy only (unless you spread your attacks, but then, it means you also spread your damage instead of focusing each enemy one by one to kill them fast) Also having counterspell in your party means you won't be hit by the most dangerous spells from your opponents anyway, so spellcasters are often not the main threat.
Great video. Pretty important topic that you didn’t address: how are the saves from these coatings impacted by acuity? Would a character that can stack acuity very quickly then get massively higher value out of these? Or are the coating DCs fixed regardless of acuity? I have a vague memory that maybe acuity does apply, which would really change the calculus of value here.
They aren't - the save DCs for these are fixed and don't change with items or effects (though if you can reduce enemy saves with eg bane or cutting words, that will help land them more reliably)
@@Cephalopocalypse Thanks! I thought there was a chance since acuity *does* work on Bow of Banshee as well as the Snowburst Ring + Drake cold-bow prone combo ... so thought maybe there would be a chance. But guess not. Thanks again!
I thought puddles are infinite. What exactly did they patch out? Because it's it's camp specific, why not just put a puddle next to a waypoint and go back to THAT every time?
Hey, great video I just wanted to ask it if curiosity if you were still going to do a subclass multi-class tier list I remember in one of your old videos you said that was something you wanted to do but I recently looked at all the possible combinations and while I'm not sure on the exact number it's easily in the high hundreds and I wanted to know if you were still planning on doing it
you forgot a bigger deal of blind (malice) it prevents the enemy from making ranged attacks. that can be a huge flip. they cant use spells outside melee, they cant shoot, its amazing to shut down dangerous enemies at range.
I always liked the damage dealing poisons in DnD, but their implementation in BG3 sucks for all the reasons you mentioned. Lower damage, delayed and it doesn't benefit from multiple players applying them. Meanwhile Purple worm Poison in DnD deals 12d6 poison damage, and passing the constitution saving throw just halves it. I don't think having these just do their single die of damage immediately on the failed save would be too broken, lots of these other coatings would still be way better.
Mushroom lady merchant in the myconid village sells purple worm toxin in Act 1. It is expensive though and not really worth it, but figured I would share as it was made out that it can’t be obtained until Act 2.
As a rouge with knifes I was using all those coating pretty frequently as it was feeling good role play wise. But never seen that they are doing anything at all. Now it all make sens. Love drow poision as a concept but I belive that my enemy never went sleep from this xD
One more thing about the Oil of Diminution: It actually *reduces* your weapon accuracy by -1!! I believe it's the only one of these that is actually harmful to your character
u have too much s-tier mucus is not that grear as s-tier suggest, since its rare enough and comes up later in game, where bosses and minibosses have too much CON since it have inoculation mech, boss is very likely to just spend 4 turns in inoculation, while u should kill it in that amount of rounds anyway Its good, but not s-tier good Oil of combustion is reliable yes, but enough of build do not have enough fire damage to just casualy prok this, and fire is not that reliable of a damage type anyway Also, how is that s-tier when it can actively kill your patry? I dont always have karlach/any fire-resistance race in melle, and going out of your way to get fire resist for that makes it not that good Yes, a lot of time you would like to work towards fire resist anyways, but its still not s-tier, since its still damages yout melle characters
I feel like you should include dip in fire in this list. It takes the same slot, is free from any fire source or by carrying candles around. So its unlimited and adds a 1D4 fire damage with no save
It might be helpful to have a description of poison, oil, and toxin somewhere on the screen so you don't have to explain it every single time drawing this video out by at least 18 minutes.
So if the DC saving throw for a poison is 11, then the game throws a D20 and gives +2 on honor mode and another +1 if their CON is 12, or another +2 if their CON is 14, and so on. Do I have that right? You keep saying DC11 is easy for them to meet. And sure, it is. But you kinda make it sound impossible when it's realistically 20-25% to land, no?
You have a 65% chance to succeed a DC11 roll with a +4. So flipped around, your DC11 poison will hit 35% of the time against a +4 con save enemy. The video definitely makes it sound harder for an enemy to fail a con save than it is. There are like a dozen types of weapons that let you lacerate once per short rest, inflicting disadvantage on con saves. You have a 28% chance of landing your DC11 poison against a +7 con save enemy that has disadvantage on the roll.
quick note you can get purple worm toxin in act 1 me and my friends are lvl 6 and due to doing things in a weird order have just entered the myconid colony and the vendor who's husband went missing sold us purple worm toxin
That sounds right! I think it becomes available to any merchant with an alchemy items pool once the party hits level 6, but it's random whether it shows up on a given day
Nicely done. I'm onto my second playthrough and have been making good use of various oils and poisons all the way through. The Drow sleepyjuice is particularly powerful early on. When it goes off, it's a huge win. My dual wield build used it to great effect against the Kuo Toa last night. Oil of Accuracy is just sweet. Well have to give this oil off combustion malarky a go 😂
I really slept on oil of combustion. One of my favourite choke point tactics (especially with doorways, but narrow bridges/halls etc work just as well) is to do whirling blades and then drop hunger of hadar on it. Yesterday, as they slowly walked through the blades, I read back to myself the oil and thought I'd give it a go (as all the enemies are clustered). Now, I'm sure there are more powerful ways of doing this but with the level I am and what I had available, this is how it went down. My barb (happy that she could finally do something lol) threw a fire flask into the mix so they were all pretty much on fire. My rogue who, is using the oils, sniped the one in the middle and holy shit balls, the carnage. If I had multi attack it could have been ridiculous. Let's just say they never reached me lol.
Ty, this tierlist r really useful and can expand our ways to play the game. For example i can build a Tiger Barbarian with reverberation and drunk items and make those toxins oils far more efective.
you still have the barrels tierlist, i hope you dont forget about it
Runepowder >>>>
@@baltemys6097**SPOILER ALERT** I used a rune powder barrel to decimate like 90% of the sharan temple 💀
Yeah, would be quite valuable to hear how how their damage is calculated and all that mechanics stuff
@@slaminjaminotter7286House of Grief*
@@nicholaskersey3771 I am going to eat you
Drow poison combined with arrow of many targets is my beloved strat
I also used this but it falls off in act 2 where everyone is immune to sleep. but it rocks tough fights like githyanki
This is probably the most useful to me since I’ll stop ignoring these mechanics entirely now
You see Cepholapocalypse you’re forgetting the most important use for these weapon coating bottles. They act as paperweights in my inventory space to hold down all the books I’m collecting to read later.
Extremely accurate
Holy shit SOMEONE gets it
flawed hell dusk + arrow of many targets + oil of combustion, my favorite combo (:
Just tried it out, but doesn’t quite work as well as expected. The same attack won’t both trigger and apply, only one or the other.
Oil of Diminution can be used on your own party . . . for exploration and going into holes. So it does have potential out of combat uses!
Should definitely do a tier list of dialogue choices :D
Angering Vlaakith and questioning her divinity should be S+ Tier
Yes, this please good sir
Poking every scrying eye is A tier
one use i've found for some of the weaker coatings, mainly simple toxin, has actually been to just waste bosses' legendary resistance charges so i can set up some other powerful effects asap. there's other ways to force lots of saving throws like this but simple toxin is obviously available super early and i found it pretty useful against early bosses like w'wargaz
Doh! I didn't realize that toxins weren't supposed to work until the end of the enemy's next turn. I was wondering where the damage went! Toxins still help stack arcane synergy, so they're worth for sharpshooter or GWM builds, but oof I wish it just added to attack damage like I thought.
To me the toxin implementation is extremely strange. They work nothing at all like their tabletop counterparts, and really feel like a waste of clicks in their current form!
Turns out I had no idea how any of these worked. Thanks!
A word about sleep from coatings. If you have sneak attack as a reaction, it wakes up enemy immediately. I facepalmed myself about it so many times. You can still use sneak attack as a real button press though, which is funny, but as a reaction it basically cancels the effect )
There is one further way to prevent that. You can press K while having your rogue selected, go to the reaction tab and tick the box for "ask" on all sneak actions. That way, when you do hit them with the weapon and put them to sleep, the game will NOT automatically apply sneak attack, but it will ask you if you want to apply it. Thus, you can select at that time if this is normal situation where more dmg the better, or if you just applied a sleep effect and you will not be wanting to sneak attack them.
Another great and very helpful video! One additional thing worth mentioning (that I may have missed) is that several items give you a buff if you poison an enemy, so if you don't need your BA for something else you can proc that with one of the poisons or toxins.
I thing coating weapons in fire could be included in this list because of how similar it is to those: you use a bonus action to make your weapon attacks stronger.
I'd probably put it in high b tier because the damage is good, especially in the early game..
You can coat your weapons in fire? Like just a basic fire surface or a alchemy fire surface?
Basic fire surface should work. You can also dip into things that are on fire like a burning torch or burning candle. Just drop one on the ground next to you and then you can start dipping. With a candle you might need to interact with it first before you can dip but interacting with it is a free action. Oh and I’ve heard you can also dip into an enemy or ally that is coated in an effect.
@@carnivoriousleaf basic fire is enough.
All my characters have a candle in their inventory and use it whenever I have nothing better to do with my bonus action. you can drop it on the ground and light it for no action, then dip your weapons in it for a bonus action, then pick it up for free.
It adds 1d4 fire damage to each attack.
@@carnivoriousleafTo add to others replied, candles and torches work fine. HOWEVER, the candle is an extra item you need to be carrying and it is always going to be stacking by other candles you are picking up if you are like more RPG players (hoarders). The cool thing about the torch is that only ONE of the torches is LIT in your inventory; the one you are "carrying". You see, the torch, unlike the weapon, doesn't leave your inventory when you equip it! It's ridiculous, but when you have your weapon equipped, above it, in your character screen, there is a torch, and it's the same exact torch that is in your inventory! What this means: there is a constantly lit torch in your inventory that is lit, which means it doesn't stack! Dropping this torch with the special icon guarantees a lit item drops near you which you can dip your weapons in! No guessing whether it will be lit or not, and also, it helps a little that the item is larger, the flame bigger, the light bigger, making it easier to see and interact with when you are picking the target of the dip action!
Great video once again, I keep trying other takes on BG3 on RUclips but yours are just so much better. The level of nuance and detail is great!
Yeah, the fact that an average of around 2,5 minutes of talking /consumable feels actually informative and not pointlessly drawn out is very impressive.
A perk of toxins is that it's easy to synergise with boots of stormy clamour/reverb builds since they cause reberb stacks when *any* condition is applied. So it's a handy way get BoSC to trigger if your base weapon does not have a condition on hit.
It kinda adds some saving grace, but still rather meh. I mean, do you really want to ve using equipment that requires a consumable to do anything? Maybe early on when you really dont have anything better.
@@mittag6326 it's handy for when you have nice equipment that does not apply a condition on hit, like knife of the undermountain king, so they can participate in your reverb build.
@@mittag6326 consumables are easy to get in large quantities in this game. So a build relying on using them at every fight is completely doable.
Toxins can also be stacked and works outside of turn based. With stealth archer: the trigger of toxin damage can put them into the recoil animation preventing them from out of combat healing. It essentially stun locks them in between your control-click cooldown. Cheesy as hell? sure. Powerful? hell yes.
There's an illithid power that adds stat drain to your attacks. Stat drain is a condition.
Cool video. I've played 450 hours of BG3 mostly on tactician and I knew none of this before now.
I’m at 520 hours and never even thought to throw them 😅
you forgot about fire coating, can be very easy to get with just a candle in inventory
Yes! Thank you! I was hoping this would be available soon. I'm literally getting ready to send my camp transmutation wizard on a crafting spree, perfect timing.
All of these new tier lists have been so helpful. I like so many others have just been hoarding potions, elixirs, oils, etc. However after getting a more in depth look at their benefits, I’ve incorporated them into my runs and it is both incredibly effective and so fun. I’ve become addicted to min maxing in this game and am going to do a new HM run where I am consistently using everything the game gives me as opposed to just relying on broken builds. (I’m still gonna run broken builds though lol)
1300 hours in and this is the first I’m hearing about oil of freezing!
Thanks for another detailed analysis!
Imo you think too bad about Con save targeting things. Yeah, these are no good by themselves, but the bleeding condition is widespread and it gives your targets a disadvantage on con saves. Reverberation also decreases con saves. Drow poison is widespread from the beginning of the game so you tiger barbarian + archer become a really decent controlling and damaging combo, and in act 3 you get the amulet that applies poison condition on every enemy you hit, so you can apply reverberation + bleeding + drow poison / paralyzing poison just with a single attack, which can be arrow of many targets or any multi-target ability. That's where things get really nasty.
Did you hear that Baldur's Gate will be getting inbuilt mod support even for console?
If popular mods like "5e Spells" and the Artificer class mod gets added into that, would you make videos on them?
Yes! And yes, once that launches I'm very likely to cover some mods
Patch 7 is out today!
This is super helpful! This and the potion list reinforces for me that the Transmutation Wizard is secretly OP. you can mass produce almost any of these with that Wizard. The only exception is the crawler mucus where the ingredient is super rare. Which makes sense.
i wish there were a chart with all this data. maybe for channel
Members?
I think I forget about applying these even more than the elixirs and elemental arrows. I think I threw a bottle of poison for the first time the other day and I really liked how the bottle breaking did 3 piercing damage.
First, worth noting for poisons and oils and such, dual wield builds are inherently get more use out of poisons getting it applied to 2 weapons, instead of 1, for the same investment. However, those builds ALSO use their bonus action very effectively, so unless you are pre-combat buffing, the toxins, poisons and oils need to be compared to the effectiveness of just using the bonus action for attacking.
As far as the basic poison, I LOVE it for use with boots of stormy clamor, which applies a condition of some kind, even if they resist, and if they fail, applies 2 conditions. Boots count applying the same condition the target is suffering, again, counts as applying a condition and they get another reverberation stack. With 1 other source of applying conditions, a dual wielder can prone an enemy guaranteed every turn, with the extra bonus action from thief.
I hadn't considered the inoculation effect working with the boots! That's pretty funny and definitely super powerful!
@@Cephalopocalypse I wouldn't have thought of it, either!
I love this tierlist as up until now most of those coating were a dead weight in my backpack. Now I can experiment with the ones you picked and stop saving them for the later fight that never comes. Same thing with the potions tierlist, which I also loved.
Awesome, glad it helped!
I really wish BG3 had detailed and accurate tooltips for everything like both the Pathfinder crpgs have. It might partly be because of the difference between the systems and how much more important every detail is in PF, but I still feel you could totally do better.
Maybe when the official modding tools come out I will try my hand at it.
regarding Oil of Freezing there are other sources of Encrusted with Frost too! the Coldbrim Hat adds two turns of EwF when you apply a condition on an enemy and the Winter's Clutches add the same when you deal cold damage. Markoheskir's ability Kereshka's Favour's variant Frost of Dark Winter also adds EwF. in a team that abuses the wet condition and cold damage you can actually build around Encrusted with Frost and use Oil of Freezing to speed things up.
While this is defined kind of as niche, another thing with Bane, is it has an amazing synergy with Warlocks and Bards that have the ability drain tadpole ability... lowering an already lower stat (CHA) means Bane will hit way more often. This means future saves also get -1d4 meaning even EASIER CC from said bard or warlock.
Even if the ability drain on a Sorc being followed up by a weapon user with Bane still works really well to reduce future saves. that means spells are more likely to not be saved for half and CC less likely to be outright saved.
One coating that I feel might make S+ tier is oil of accuracy because it offsets sharpshooter feat penalty [+2 archery, +2 accuracy, +1 longbow (gotten early)= +5 vs -5 penalty].
I would love to see some more funny and opinion based videos. I loved your “fun” tier list. Two I thought of off the top of my head would be a “Tier list of Troll Spells” for multiplayer. You said in another video that Feign Death “actively hurts you by casting” and my immediate thought was “ooo I should use this when I play with friends to mess with them” because I’m… the worst? Also I think it would be fun to take some of those terrible spells and make weird builds that make the terrible spells “good” in a creative way. Love the content, keep it up!
Such a great list, I’m definitely been enlightened. Keep it up brother
I hope you do other gear. Love to see a shields tier list, glove tier list, etc ❤
Coatings other than oil of accuracy exist?
Awesome video explaining everything!!!!!
Might be worth including candle in this. Infinite free dipped weapon damage.
This dude does not mess around
Great tier lists, I hardly ever used these or elixirs before the videos
Elixirs are the besttt! Never used bloodlust before this playthrough and love it!!! Laezel and Astarion keep attacking and attacking and attacking. They’ll wipe out 4-5 enemies in act 3 in one go. Crazy.
i wonder if combining oil of freezing, winter's clutches, and an ice arrow would make it a little more useful
Obviously always also carry candles around with you. Deploying them costs no actions whatsoever, they give you fire-coating for a bonus action and you can just pick them up again after combat. Basically free +dmg coating if you aren't using any other and a good way to assist your other character if they apply the oil of combustion.
Another negative with the Arsonists Oil is that its not that easy to make. I don't think any vendors sell it directly, you have to find/buy Frosted Ears (what the heck is a frosted ear anyway?) . . . it just seems too awkward (along with the opportunity cost of not using a different coating) to bother building a strategy around to be worth the effort.
That's very true! Given the way you have to finesse it to work, I also don't like it as a primary strategy (even aside from not usually using wet at all because it's broken). Invaluable for any party with a fire-damage character though!
I may have just misunderstood what was meant here, but I think there's an inaccuracy at 10:30 in the discussion about toxins.
I just tested it and I was able to apply the toxin debuff 5 times to the same enemy in one turn (rogue/fighter, so 6 total weapon attacks in a turn with action surge, extra attack, and fast hands). They even moved out of melee range on their turn and I applied a 6th debuff with the opportunity attack, and they took damage from all 6 of them.
I still totally agree that the way they're implemented does limit their value, but builds with a lot of attacks per turn can probably get the most out of them.
Hi, isn’t Malice/blind effect better than paralysis in situations if you hit a caster/ranged that is in a high ground and advantageous position ?
That forces them to leave their position to attempt to get in melee range of you which means they become misplaced and we gain advantageous attacks against them.
PS: thank you for making those tier-lists and help us have better use for most of our inventory than paperweight 🤭
In my tier list of tier lists, I have no choice but to rate Ceph's tier lists at S+. I will not be taking questions at this time.
Shrinking people then using a barbarian to throw them into each other is S tier fun.
Please do an illithid powers tierlist
I think shrinking an enemy also decreases their weight so it makes them easier or just able to be thrown if you are playing with a thrower in your party.
Have you ever done a Race Tier List? I’ve searched but haven’t seen anything
I just can't get excited about Oil of Freezing (and the Encrusted with Frost condition). I feel like anything you hit enough to trigger the effect (and they get a save!) . . . well its going to be dead by that time anyway. Sure you could try to build around, but why make your life difficult.
Control effects need to be easy to apply to really be effective.
The way I see Encrusted with Frost, the best thing you get from it is disadvantage on dex saves. When combined with snow burst ring, you drastically increase the chance that the enemy fails its prone save
I tend to agree! That's one I never use myself, and I think a general bias in my lists is that if I never use something, I try to imagine the best use case for it and can end up overcorrecting and rating it too high as a result
More excellent content. Thank you!
Hey, great video I just wanted to ask it if curiosity if you were still going to do a subclass multi-class tier list I remember in one of your old videos you said that was something you wanted to do but I recently looked at all the possible combinations and while I'm not sure on the exact number it's easily in the high hundreds and I wanted to know if you were still planning on doing it
18:24 We always say that the tooltips will get fixed in the patches. They won't. Movement speed will still say 0, tooltips will be misleading. They never bother with these low hanging fruit
Oil of combustion is just to dangerous for me to use. so many enemies make it into melee (or I make it into melee with atleast one character), and with it ignoring resistance, its just far to dangerous to myself and will often end up discouraging attacks rather than encouraging them. Its best to use, do volley/multi arrow, then next turn swap it off with another oil to prevent the friendly fire. that makes it kinda rough and makes me never use it. so I wouldnt put it past B tier myself.
Also, I dont like 'uncontrolled' AOE explosions due to destroying loot around targets often unpredictably. This can also discourage the attack.
where in the game can i see the save DC of these items?
Nowhere! Or rather, by using them and then inspecting the entry in the combat log (for some of them, which show the save) or checking the game files with a hex editor (for the ones that for some reason have the save hidden). These items were I think an extreme afterthought so the tooltips are confusingly written, uninformative, contain typos, and are often outright wrong (tell us how you really feel Ceph)
@@CephalopocalypseTy, this is sad, i'm loving my first playthrough and i'm struggling to understand and use many features
I have a build request if you would be so kind and if it works. i want to create a a Bardadin with 2 levels of Fightter for Action Surge and 1 level of Wizard for spells, I also wanted the the TAV to be the party face. Is thuis possible?
Dam, almost finishing my first playthrough and never used poisons or used any alchemy.
Let’s go top tier oil of accuracy!
Hold on am I missing something? Throw is not a bonus action is it? Id love to be tossing potions, and toxins but it takes up my normal action?
Throw is a bonus action for berserker barbarians, but probably I'm talking about applying them to weapons which is a bonus action for everyone (unless I misspeak, which has been known to happen!)
Can you apply to a thrown weapon and then throw weapon?
I'm suprised by his opinion about wizardbane. I mean, he says shield is one of the best spells in the game. And it basically takes -5 from enemy attack roll. Wizardbane takes -3. Sure, it takes it from spells, which often still deal half damage if you pass a save. But even though the effect is smaller, it will apply on your entire party and for multiple turns.
It doesn't come that often, but against enemies with nasty CC like hold person, this can render them quite useless.
Shield is something you choose to use when you need it . And it protects your squishiest character (the wizard) from all the enemies.
Wizardbane protects you from one enemy only (unless you spread your attacks, but then, it means you also spread your damage instead of focusing each enemy one by one to kill them fast)
Also having counterspell in your party means you won't be hit by the most dangerous spells from your opponents anyway, so spellcasters are often not the main threat.
Would love to see a tempest cleric/storm sorcerer build video
You're in luck! Check out "The One Shot Lightning Lord" build guide
@@Cephalopocalypse i completely forgot about that video! I have heard you mention it before but it slipped my mind, thanks :]
yah, but. SO many of the enemies are resistant to or outright immune to poison.
What, you mean these have another use aside from having pretty bottles in my backpack? 😂
Great video. Pretty important topic that you didn’t address: how are the saves from these coatings impacted by acuity? Would a character that can stack acuity very quickly then get massively higher value out of these? Or are the coating DCs fixed regardless of acuity? I have a vague memory that maybe acuity does apply, which would really change the calculus of value here.
They aren't - the save DCs for these are fixed and don't change with items or effects (though if you can reduce enemy saves with eg bane or cutting words, that will help land them more reliably)
@@Cephalopocalypse Thanks! I thought there was a chance since acuity *does* work on Bow of Banshee as well as the Snowburst Ring + Drake cold-bow prone combo ... so thought maybe there would be a chance. But guess not. Thanks again!
last one?????? nOoooooo i was loving this series
I will you pay money if you somehow did this for a pathfinder game
ty
hell yeah
🔥🔥🔥
last
I miss when you could keep a poison puddle at camp and endlessly dip weapons in it. I mean it was silly and a little broken, but it was fun.
I thought puddles are infinite. What exactly did they patch out? Because it's it's camp specific, why not just put a puddle next to a waypoint and go back to THAT every time?
@@seePyou they are infinite, but dipping only lasts a few turns. In older patches, dips in certain poison puddles lasted until long rest
Hey, great video I just wanted to ask it if curiosity if you were still going to do a subclass multi-class tier list I remember in one of your old videos you said that was something you wanted to do but I recently looked at all the possible combinations and while I'm not sure on the exact number it's easily in the high hundreds and I wanted to know if you were still planning on doing it
you forgot a bigger deal of blind (malice) it prevents the enemy from making ranged attacks. that can be a huge flip. they cant use spells outside melee, they cant shoot, its amazing to shut down dangerous enemies at range.
I always liked the damage dealing poisons in DnD, but their implementation in BG3 sucks for all the reasons you mentioned. Lower damage, delayed and it doesn't benefit from multiple players applying them. Meanwhile Purple worm Poison in DnD deals 12d6 poison damage, and passing the constitution saving throw just halves it. I don't think having these just do their single die of damage immediately on the failed save would be too broken, lots of these other coatings would still be way better.
Wow so they nerfed it to the ground for no apparent reason especially on contrast with how much op stuff they added
Mushroom lady merchant in the myconid village sells purple worm toxin in Act 1. It is expensive though and not really worth it, but figured I would share as it was made out that it can’t be obtained until Act 2.
Will you be doing a weapons tier list? For example act I weapons (blood of lathander, burning inn weapons, phalar aluve, tyr sword, ...) ranked
DYES TIERLIST WHEN?!?!?!
What tier is candle?
As a rouge with knifes I was using all those coating pretty frequently as it was feeling good role play wise. But never seen that they are doing anything at all. Now it all make sens. Love drow poision as a concept but I belive that my enemy never went sleep from this xD
One more thing about the Oil of Diminution: It actually *reduces* your weapon accuracy by -1!! I believe it's the only one of these that is actually harmful to your character
u have too much s-tier
mucus is not that grear as s-tier suggest, since its rare enough and comes up later in game, where bosses and minibosses have too much CON
since it have inoculation mech, boss is very likely to just spend 4 turns in inoculation, while u should kill it in that amount of rounds anyway
Its good, but not s-tier good
Oil of combustion is reliable yes, but enough of build do not have enough fire damage to just casualy prok this, and fire is not that reliable of a damage type anyway
Also, how is that s-tier when it can actively kill your patry? I dont always have karlach/any fire-resistance race in melle, and going out of your way to get fire resist for that makes it not that good
Yes, a lot of time you would like to work towards fire resist anyways, but its still not s-tier, since its still damages yout melle characters
I feel like you should include dip in fire in this list. It takes the same slot, is free from any fire source or by carrying candles around. So its unlimited and adds a 1D4 fire damage with no save
Crawler mucus is 10000% my favorite. Btw there are some crabs in act 3 by the docks where you can get the ingredients!
How DARE you put Purple Worm Toxin in D-Tier???? I use it in every fight and I beat the game in honor mode 😤😤😤
It might be helpful to have a description of poison, oil, and toxin somewhere on the screen so you don't have to explain it every single time drawing this video out by at least 18 minutes.
What about the Brood's mother Revenge compare to diluted oil, which one is better?
Any plans on ranking the battlemaster maneuvers? Would be interested.
Never used a coating in like 10 playthrough lol might try
So if the DC saving throw for a poison is 11, then the game throws a D20 and gives +2 on honor mode and another +1 if their CON is 12, or another +2 if their CON is 14, and so on. Do I have that right?
You keep saying DC11 is easy for them to meet. And sure, it is. But you kinda make it sound impossible when it's realistically 20-25% to land, no?
You have a 65% chance to succeed a DC11 roll with a +4. So flipped around, your DC11 poison will hit 35% of the time against a +4 con save enemy.
The video definitely makes it sound harder for an enemy to fail a con save than it is. There are like a dozen types of weapons that let you lacerate once per short rest, inflicting disadvantage on con saves.
You have a 28% chance of landing your DC11 poison against a +7 con save enemy that has disadvantage on the roll.
quick note
you can get purple worm toxin in act 1
me and my friends are lvl 6 and due to doing things in a weird order have just entered the myconid colony and the vendor who's husband went missing sold us purple worm toxin
That sounds right! I think it becomes available to any merchant with an alchemy items pool once the party hits level 6, but it's random whether it shows up on a given day
Nicely done. I'm onto my second playthrough and have been making good use of various oils and poisons all the way through.
The Drow sleepyjuice is particularly powerful early on. When it goes off, it's a huge win. My dual wield build used it to great effect against the Kuo Toa last night.
Oil of Accuracy is just sweet.
Well have to give this oil off combustion malarky a go 😂
I really slept on oil of combustion. One of my favourite choke point tactics (especially with doorways, but narrow bridges/halls etc work just as well) is to do whirling blades and then drop hunger of hadar on it. Yesterday, as they slowly walked through the blades, I read back to myself the oil and thought I'd give it a go (as all the enemies are clustered). Now, I'm sure there are more powerful ways of doing this but with the level I am and what I had available, this is how it went down. My barb (happy that she could finally do something lol) threw a fire flask into the mix so they were all pretty much on fire. My rogue who, is using the oils, sniped the one in the middle and holy shit balls, the carnage. If I had multi attack it could have been ridiculous. Let's just say they never reached me lol.
Ty, this tierlist r really useful and can expand our ways to play the game.
For example i can build a Tiger Barbarian with reverberation and drunk items and make those toxins oils far more efective.
Who can throw these as a BA?
Berserker Barbarian can throw as a bonus action while raging
This was such a good series of videos. It will change what I lug around and what I will sell. Thanks again for such good content.
I’m living for this series I don’t want it to end even though there’s nothing left
The simple toxin literally is the basic poison but adds damage amd you rate it lower? 😅what did i miss how does that make any sense?
It can't inflict the 'poisoned' effect, unlike poison, so it doesn't give enemies disadvantage.
Thanks
Thanks so much for the support! I really appreciate it :D