70 Ton Friction Press Shaft Part 2: Finishing Turning & Threading
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- Опубликовано: 22 дек 2024
- We'll finish the turning & threading on the friction press shaft, utilizing our following and steady rests. I've been real happy with how the new Precision Matthews lathe performing. It cuts nice and straight, and the high range of gears seem silky smooth.
Next up we'll work on machining the woodruff and straight keyways.
Part 1 • 70 Ton Friction Press ...
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The true value of your videos is not showing how to do it whenever things go right, but how to anticipate, react, correct, mitigate etc when things go sideways. Really love these videos where you have problems and deal with them on the fly. You can't teach someone how to deal with every possible problem but you can give them a foundation from which they can figure out a solution to problems. Absolute gold.
I would agree with that every word of it. That's exactly the magic that you put into your beautiful videos. You're not only teach us how to do things the right way, but when things go wrong you help us to find workarounds. Good job Mr booth there sir!!! 😉
Yep. Adams 25 yrs+ of machining experience shines through.
Difficult job….. but lathe work completed … to spec.
Thanks to Adam for sharing some of these ‘tips’
Regards
Robert
That's what I love too! He shows his mistakes and he shows how to deal with them. Sometimes he has to scrap a part which sucks but most of the time he's able to come back and get it working dead nuts! These parts are so beautiful and they must run so smoothly on the machines they're put in. My guess is they're probably a little too perfect for being put in a worn out machine the broke the old part 😄
I know i'm a bit long in the tooth, and coming to the end of my days, but it is such a pleasure to see a master at work, Thanks for the enjoyment you bring to an old engineer.
Really enjoyed that video Adam. Thanks. You investigated and solved problems that really come up in these jobs. Lathe looks like its working well. So, there's no need for you to hang on to that pesky Monarch. I can be there in 3 hours.. hit me up!
You should look into getting a randomized output VFD. It keeps long thin parts from being able to get a standing wave to form on them. If you notice, it takes a second or two for the chatter to become a problem. This is the time it takes the material to form a standing wave. By randomly changing the RPM of the motor, it makes it nearly impossible to form s standing wave.
G'day Adam... Just goes to show the Intricate problems that can arise on such a long shafted delicate assembly. The main thing is, your overcoming each problem as it arises. Well done. Catch you on the next Installment.
I cant imagine there are many guys around Adams age with as much passion and skill for this kind of work. It really is a privilege to sit back and learn from a master.
There is tons of guys around our age that do this. Were coming in for the ones that are or getting ready to retire out. Skill....well, thats how many times you screwed up before you figured out how to do it. You dont get skill by watchng videos like so many think. Passion, well, you need to go to work to make money.
Adam Booth is a consummate professional in every aspect as a RUclips creator, machinist, and videographer.
You can really tell the original shaft had some translation issues. It is nice to see Abom on his toes and we can see his tricks to keep things on track
It's so important to show the problems and solutions, good on you Adam
This was a straight-up Master Class. The amount of experience that was brought to bear on this shaft is kinda humbling. Getting to stand by and watch and listen to all of it was a great educational experience. Probably in the top 5 ABOM videos I can recall seeing. The content just keeps on getting better. When this project started, I kept thinking about turning a wet noodle, and now I have a basic idea about how to turn a wet noodle. :)
I'm sure that will come in especially handy if you get a job in the machine shop at a pasta plant! 😋
Without this I never would have known a long shaft could be difficult so many ways. Another great shop class, Adam . Thanks.
Some of the ways wouldn't be allowed in the RUclips Comments section.
Adam thank you for what you do. You could have finished 90% of these jobs faster and made more money if you weren't videoing for the habitual complainers plus, spend your time editing them. You are awesome and love your content. Thank you for spreading your knowledge with us.
Beautiful work, as usual, Adam! You always knock it out of the park with your work ethic and enthusiasm. You are what we all strive for when doing these kinds of jobs, perfection. Stay safe, my friend. Much love from South Texas!
Mr. Booth, would it be possible to get a follow up video on the new shaft working in the press.. Enjoy the good work you do.
meant to mention this in a reply to part one, but thanks a ton for the explanation in part one about why you'd use a 4 jaw rather than a 3 jaw on a part like this- had been thinking of asking for ages and the explanation made perfect sense. I'm a curious non-machinist and love getting to learn random stuff like that which I'd probably never figure out on my own.
I don't know if you get nervous as you machine more and more features, but I certainly did. After cutting tapers, threads, journals, key ways, or gears on a complex work piece, I knew each new feature took me into a longer re-machining if I bozo'd the last feature. Stay cool and calm and we'll enjoy the viewing.
Just a thought on the undersize thread, if the middle section of the shaft is in plain bearings which are single piece, one thread should be smaller to allow the shaft to be withdrawn without the thread dragging in the bearings.
That is one deceptively difficult job, would be hard to quote for!
The 'odd' thread he encountered is just one of the reasons that custom machining can't be accurately quoted. The shaft he built is one of a kind and a perfect part for a restoration. That part is worth a lot to the customer and should be priced accordingly.
Tricky job cutting that long shaft. It was good to watch you work through the problems. Lots of good tips. As far as the problem with the live center not seating right you may have altered the fit when you pressed that plug in the end. Great video.
I like you showed the real world challenges and how you resolved them , should be helpful in my garage machining follies .
Good to see some of your new gear in action.
Luck to find out about the 2 different threads. Well done rescuing the work done.
Lots of thanks for the filming work! Close ups, different angles, You name it. Don't forget all work editing the films!
Keep killing it Adam, I enjoyed watching you get through a project on the new lathe. I can’t wait to see you running the big boy American Pacemaker lathe. Take care.
I really loved this one, learned a bunch about steady and follow rest and long shaft work. I would have loved to see you to the last set up where you said you flipped the shaft back around to true up the center...sounds like a very finicky dial in. Thank you!
Great instruction old school ABOM video, love it mate so very help-full, thank you very much. Hope the content continues as your business starts rolling.
"Smells like a real Machine Shop".
Reminds me of when you dad said he just like smelling the oil . 😊
Thank you Adam for the work you perform
Great video. I wonder if the undersized thread was the result of a past repair. IE, the threads got mangled up, the shaft threads were recut and a new screw on collar machined (or the original welded up and re-threaded smaller to match).
man, you really are a veritable encyclopedia of machining! 👍👍👊👊
I have no idea what this is. I fell asleep watching bolt extraction videos because I have an issue with one halfway out of my engine. So I’m now 20:+ minutes in and I’m entertained. He said the word boring at a point but I’m really locked in. Machinery is so cool to me
In reading the comments I see there is a plethora of youtube quarter backs.
Short of centerless grinding; he got it done.
Maybe not as pretty as some would like, but in this case good enough is good enough.
As for the length of the video, there is a FF feature that can be deployed to reduce screening time.
Sorry guys, feeling a bit cranky today.
There's something magical about single point threading. Makes using a die seem crude in comparison.
Adam, that was a VERY intricate and difficult project. You, er.. ah.. "threaded" the needle on it, and ended up with a great finished product.
Love your insight in long shafting, I ran into this problem cutting a long shaft for a pump & had to move the tailstock to compensate for an old lathe being out of true center to cut out the taper, was very tedious & took quite some time for the adjustment compensation to run true, cut on !!!
Very nice work, Adam
This is another great video! Watching you work through things on the original part that are not quite what they seem to be and building a new part that is almost certainly much better than the original.
Your skill and experience really shined through on this one... 🙂
Love that lathe. Great job, thanks for sharing.
Great video. Shows how obstacles can be overcome and get perfect results. I think the cross slide dial is friction because its handwheel is wider than the part with the dial so fingers will not easily bump into the dial an shift it. The compound carries a thumbwheel and exactly behind that is the dial with a wider diameter that fingers can reach easily or held with the hand if not concentrating well, so it carries a set screw to lock it in place. Just my thinking.
Your knowledge is amazing. Getting those threads right and saving the part. Outstanding! Keep me watching Abom. Hopefully more Americans decide a trade or some type of skill is relevant and we can return to our former glory. Thank you!
Nice work. I'm looking forward to the milling part.
Awesome to see you working on more complex shafts like the one you used to do at Motion!
Interesting to see how the chatter problem gets addressed with this shaft. Very nice. Thank you.
Hey! I'm supposed to be working! Insted I'm here watching you work!
Nice Fireball Tool table...
Adam, great educational video, thanks. Maybe have shown in another video, but would like to see the procedure for setting up the center rest for a long unsupported shaft for facing the end and accurately placing the center drill on the shaft center.
Nicely done Adam. The new lathe is working really well, and you have explained what your doing perfectly 👍👍👍👍
Adam, awesome and educational video as always. I also wanted to comment on how much better the lighting is in the new shop. Huge step forward in quality in your videos. Great stuff man!
Back in the 80's I worked at refractory brick yard that had two of those old friction presses. They had some skilled guys in the tooling who responsible for that type of work. Not until now do I appreciate the work they were doing. When we were running those presses it would shake the entire building.
It is possible they had nuts made in fixed steps below nominal size to compensate for errors in shaft machining in order to allow them to salvage shafts that may have chattered and needed to be recut.
Not many people realize that this kind of machining is a high wire act. One slip and you have to start over.
Absolutely!!
But isn't this any job in any profession?
@@an2thea514 no its not .. working in store , or alot other proff is easier and doesnt take skill.. so its not the same ..
@@urosbodanec6302 1. You are wrong.
2. Working in a store isn't a profession. You can start working in a store without an apprenticeship/workers certificate/masters certificate. You can't do that in profession jobs.
Love machining prehard 4140, cuts like butter
And always an amazing finish
I'm just beginning my machining journey on an old Logan model 850. Really enjoy your content and have learned alot watching!
Maybe the threads are different to force you to install the nuts on the correct side. Is there any difference between the two otherwise? could it mess up some alignment in the machine if they got swapped? At work, we call features like that a poka-yoke.
McMaster-Carr is really the first place someone should look for anything.
I’d be curious to see how you clean up the machine, the coolant and chips on it, the floor and the tray. Seems like quite a mess and your machines always look amazing when you are done, @abom79
Excellent work, well done!
Excellent job. Long close tolerance shafts always require advanced skills to overcome chatter, taper, and finish, especially with high strength steels such as 4140. This one is a real beauty that should last many years.
I have used sheetmetal with a magnet on the back, stuck to the steady rest to keep chips out of the rollers. Rubber bands on the shaft also help keep swarf out of the rollers when running coolant.
Great work again Adam, bought a brand new Clausing Colchester lathe in 2018, experienced the same no tapper and cutting straight. Love new machines
Really interesting project. Watching your solutions to problems is a great learning tool.
Like always great video Adam.
Geof. Thanks.
Always interested in what other guys have done and are doing. Theres a wealth of knowledge out there that should be more widely known about and appreciated after all without engineering especially the mechanical stuff our modern world would not exist.
Thanks in part to the likes of Adam and others the general public get to see a glimpse of it via good old RUclips.
I don't think I've seen you using a follow rest in a video before so it was really interesting to see how you do that.
You did a wonderful job on the shaft.
The one end of the shaft was done on Friday and the other end on Monday and the machine operator was hung over on Monday and said that it was good enough for government work. rotflmsbo
Is there an issue with running with both rests??
OMG I was so scared about there being a different thread pitch.
You got very lucky you used the larger thread diameter to start with.
This is a fantastic experience,Adam.Thank you.
Thank you for sharing your knowledge
Nice work Adam. I'm glad to see that you have some of the same problems I have with chatter. Thanks for the video!
Phew! that could have been a major problem. Good thing you picked up the smaller nut! Re-finding the thread was cool.
Very cool demo! I'm curious... If you didn't have this new machine and its tight tolerances, would you have attempted this project with your older equipment? The aspect ratio of the part definitely made it a challenging turning project.
Your the man Adam you know none of them machines cut the same there all a different beast with one combination once you get it dialed in it will be all good
whew lawdy I bet machinist sleep real good at night; pitch diameter, half nuts engaged whenever, choking the tail stock, come off the end feed, groovy chamfer tools! total respect
The threads for the flanges were probably started on a Friday afternoon and finished on a Monday morning....by the apprentice. Lol.
Hahahahhahahahahahah
Can't be the apprentice, he wasn't using a dull beaver.
This has been more of a time consumer than I originally thought.
Man I could smell the smoke, great video tanks Adam
I always enjoy watching you get things "dead nut" perfect.
You only gave half the story. That’s not what made you who you are. Love you 💪🙃
I like to watch the smoke get pulled into the chuck when you are cutting down on that end.
perhaps there was some damage at one time and a new thread and nut was the solution. Will you mark the shaft in some way to match the nut numbers?
Thanks for sharing 👍
Very good show
That was intense and I'm just watching, nice work
Quite a few years ago I spent quite a few years cylindrical grinding.
She was a big machine, would take 22ft between centres. Longest shaft that I ground was 20 ft.
Many different dia along the length all needing to run bang true to each other. All us machinists were on piece work. Some of the turners would cut corners leaving excess material on some of the dias which I had to grind off but more importantly some dias were not running true so steadies could not be used initially without trueing up these dias.
The technique was to let the shaft just hang in the centres ( scary ) then starting at the tailstock end grind a band the width of the steady pad just far enough along before the shaft started to chatter. A good method was to reduce the width of the 4 inch thick x 48inch dia grinding wheel by half or less.
When the dia was ground true apply the steady then repeat this process until the centre of the shaft was reached.
When grinding rolls which were generally much stiffer but would still chatter especially when grinding the body steadies were used one at each end of the large dia. On a grinder the wheel passes over the area that is being ground where the steady is running so you had to adjust the steady as the wheel was cutting watching the sparks making sure that the intensity was the same or the dia would be different in that area.
Yes all a bit tricky and worrying especially on the very last pass when the size and finish had to be spot on. All work was checked by an inspector so no cheating.
I was chief engineer in a Scottish foundry and machine shop. We ground 40 feet shafts for the paper industry with a 2 thou camber included. Just for your info if interested.
Serious machining and some excellent filming. Breaking in the new lathe.
Gotta love threads! Always fun, but never easy hahaha Nice job, Adam!
Glad this tricky thing is your problem. Great work and results too.
Like the chips Thanks for sharing
I have found that if you need a good finish with extra low cutting pressure xxGT polished high rake inserts work well (I generally use DCGT). They are designed for aluminium and other soft non ferrous materials but they also do a great job on steel if you are only taking light cuts. That type of insert probably would have done a good job on that first operation where you had the severe chatter issues.
At 50:40, could the straight key slot with the woodruff on the end held a key with a step that fit down into the woodruff slot to prevent it from walking back out of the shaft?
If you get a chance, if it is safe to do, could you chuck up the old shaft so we can see where the damage/runout is? Thanks in advance!
I was thinking the same thing.
He can probably measure it on the bench with it sitting in a couple of V blocks. I also wonder if it would be a good one to experiment with shaft straightening. Between the press and heat straightening I wonder how close he could get it.
From the clip of the bent shaft running on the machine in part one ... I'd say the run out is somewhere in the region of 3/4" to a full 1" ... that shaft had one hell of a wobble on it on the drive pulley end.
Do you have a cylindrical grinder in your shop? I'm guessing no since you did the complete job in the lathe.
Every time I chase a thread
on my lathe I think of my high school machine shop teacher . He said you had to be certain the thread your cutting is finished before you take your work out of the lathe as you can't pick up the thread again. I have since done it many times to repair a damaged thread. Last time I did it was cutting on an internal thread on a draw bar for a 5c collet about a week ago. And I do it just exactly you did it .
Any gunsmith (like me) who blueprints a rifle action has to learn how to pick up on an existing thread in order to get it concentric with the bore of the action. Your shop teacher may have needed a shop teacher?
Never seen those thread triangles before.. Who makes them? I want a set
Nice to see that you solve that chatter issue. I think that a follower rest could prevent it on long and thin shafts like that one.
Excellent work!
Great video, thanks
Excellent work. Great video. Thank you for sharing
Learned a lot,thanks for the video🤗😎🤗😎
Nice work Adam, great to see you solved your chattering problems, is that typical for long shafts like that, even with your steady rest? does that occur because of the hardness of the steel? cant wait for part 3.