"We got so excited by the Left Behind books that we keep trying to start the End Times." Beautiful point, one I've been making for a long time. Look at those people who are trying to make Revelations happen but ignoring the sins and people they're stepping on to get there.
I really agree with you people know and believe the Bible and then times which in revelations is a not a good time so I think the undercurrent is what is driving a lot of the chaos.
So because human beings are imperfect God in imperfect,why not discuss the skeletons of Islam,no no no the goal here is the shaming of Christianity just like the atheist do.
I was thinking that maybe low emotional intelligence can be substituted for stupidity. That is something that is lacking in society. We are constantly giving into our emotions to have an experience for Christ rather than thoughtfully considering who he is and what we can do to serve at this time.
yep Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT" "...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE" - Bonhoeffer
I am reminded of the statement attributed to Gandhi “ I like your Jesus, I don’t like your Christians. “ Whether Christianity has been of more benefit than harm is a matter of judgement. The fact that large numbers of people who call themselves Christians throughout the church’s history have with their judgmental, arrogant superior attitudes have done so much damage to others in the name of their religion (and continue to do so today ) supports the view that the Christian church is very flawed , deserving skepticism and disdain.
Be careful not to equate intellectual achievement with moral development. If the problem is ignorance, education is the answer; but if the problem is arrogance, the answer is humility.
Great interview with John Dickson. The haunting question of whether Christian ethics can survive without Christian beliefs. 😬 I see this today in people whose parents or grandparents were devout Christians and yet the current generation is not. They believe all the ethics and values, but with no basis for them other than they have seen them work in their families. I believe that, over time, new values will creep in and, without a strong foundation, they will get washed away like sifting sand. 😣
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT" "...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE" - Bonhoeffer
33:40 Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT" "...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE" - Bonhoeffer
I think one of the problems with calling someone stupid or evil even if their words and behavior are showing elements of either, is that those words often are considered such totalizing insults towards a person. When a person feels shut down or condemned by someone else that often partially or totally shuts down their capacity or desire to keep an open-mind towards what the other person who called them stupid or evil is saying. I’m definitely not arguing that not labeling people with such harsh judgmental words will automatically make them open to hearing what you have to say, but it may allow for some to listen in a more nuanced and vulnerable fashion if they don’t perceive you as writing them off as dumb or evil to begin with. I do think this approach works best in one on one or very small groups where people have a relationship with one another beyond just debating political, religious, or cultural issues. Btw, this is def not all my ideas, but a combination of things I’ve read and listening to over the past 5 or so years plus what my own experience has occasionally shown me.
Great discussion. The only problem with the stupidity/close-mindedness bit is that everyone will apply it to "the other side" of whatever issue or argument is at hand. Very few people will look at themselves and ask how they are being stupid (in the sense Bonhoeffer means).
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT" "...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE" - Bonhoeffer
I’m not sure how much better it is than “stupid” but this verse comes to mind for the concept Skye is talking about: “The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge, but fools despise wisdom and instruction.” Proverbs 1:7 NIV
As Christians we really have to learn how to discern truth from empty philosophy like it says in Philippians 2:8 and 1 timothy 4:7 and other verses. There needs to be more of objectivity through the lense of truth. Conservative Christians raise a valid point because there are ungodly precedents being set by the left. But conservatives fail to see the ungodly motives that have seeped into their agenda as well. I think as Christians we tend to forget that we are sinners saved by grace and we forget that our hearts are just as deceitful as those we deem our enemies. And we are also guilty of not loving our enemies...even in politics...even though God commands us.
My church's sermon last sunday was over Acts 19, which describes an encounter with some Jewish exorcists in it. Your discussion on the Jews practicing witchcraft reminded me of that. Interesting such a practice goes that far back in history.
or check out the vid on RUclips :) Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT" "...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE" - Bonhoeffer
Regarding Bonhoeffer's use of the word "stupid", I wonder if "foolish" would be a better term, especially when talking about a temporary state of being rather than a hard-wired characteristic. Proverbs have a lot to say about fools and foolishness and one of them talks about the how there is very little hope for a fool. That seems to be what Bonhoeffer was referencing. Also, a mentor once told me years ago that knowledge was having facts whereas wisdom was knowing how to apply those facts to bring about good. The internet has a plethora of facts, some of which are also true, but without wisdom those facts are either useless or are used for division and harm.
When you talked about Bonhoffer, and were working over the usefulness of "stupid", I wondered what Bonhoffer's language was. I imagine he was writing in German which has more than one word and forms of the words that could be translated stupid. That political problems come about by lack of cognitive capability could easily be a misrepresentation of Bonhoffer's message--- or at least that's worth checking before getting stuck on using the english word.
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT" "...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE" - Bonhoeffer
jokes about conspiracy theories also hit differently now. Yesterday I was listening to Weird Al's song "Foil" which I and my family laughed at when it released years ago. Now some of the jokes sound an awful lot like how actual christians are thinking and talking right now.
Another great show. Loved the interview with John Dickson. My question would be can members of society hold to the values of Christianity and a belief/faith in God without engagement with the church. The discussion was about retaining the values without belief in a God. I think many deconstructed Christians stop short of atheism and hold onto belief in a God, however with more mystery and less rules (since no one agrees on the interpretation anyway).
Religious,Anti-Christ fascists always love to find a boogie man to use as a political bludgeon there focus is solely on the things below and their blood lust for power and control CRT is another great example
1980s Demonizing Halloween was thanks to Keith Green. He also attacked Santa Clause and all of Christmas. It was very unsettling and I did minimal Halloween with my kids because of him. I loved his music but was messed up by his teaching for a long time.
Me too. In the 80s heard Christian radio programs about Halloween and vowed my children would not participate. We as a family always did a fun activity on the 31st.
Well...Keith Green certainly did not invent the anti-Halloween message, even if he promoted it. We need to remember that Keith was very young. 28 at the time of his death, I believe. I was profoundly impacted by his music as well, but it is common for young people to be a little overzealous at times. Keith himself admitted to overstating his position on people going to the foreign mission field. He was a dear brother who was most certainly used by God for good in the lives of many people. But he was not a perfect man, and he wasn't automatically right about everything just because he was **KEITH GREEN**. He wouldn't want us to put him on that kind of pedestal.
I heard ". . .we don't have a good theology of principalities and powers..." when discussing the Qanon piece. Have any of you at the Holy Post read Dr Michael Heiser's book , The Unseen Realm?
Sadly too many Christians have stopped reading their Bible and only listen to people. Many do not know the voice of God because they don’t read for themselves…falling for all sorts of bad theology and false teachings
I picked up on that as well, I'm interested what practice in Stoicism is counter to Christianity. The ultimate goal of the Stoa was "eudaimonia" or "good spirit"/"living well" that aligns very well with the concept of "Shalom" and Paul's words on contentment in all situations.
@@lukemacri6557 I think the real problem is lack of knowledge. Most people don't know there is a tie between Plato and Christianity, so they feel that Stoicism is introducing paganism into Christianity. Of course, most Christians are completely unaware of Christian history. Take the current position of the Bible's historical accuracy, that really wasn't the position of the first Christians or Jews.
Katelyn's first mistake was sending a note. That's passive aggressive. People invariably respond better to personal interaction. With a reminder that you are also interfering with their personal time with their music. That being said, a suggestion for an agreed compromise that allows you both to have what you want: study time and music time ought to be prepared before hand. Like a time period that you most often study. It can't be open ended. You should also apologize for sending a note that allowed for a miscommunication. They might not respond as nicely in return, but your end is to get some quiet study time.
I understand Skyes point about how people think. I don’t think stupidity is the right phrase. Maybe willfully ignorant is a better way to say it. I know a lot of smart people who refuse to see the truth.
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT" "...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE" - Bonhoeffer
I agree with Sky! and "prosperity gospel" takes away from the Book, adds to the Book; gotta remind people to check the messages to the Churches in Revelations - they still apply.
And the escatology as well. Spot on. The whole question of thinking it through as Paul did with people, and working on issues of the heart as dies God, we are losing logic and heart.
Skye is so right about Bonhofer' s comment, if you don't use the word stupid then let's use the word fool. In Proverbs people who don't listen to wise advice are considered fools. Let's let those people pick which one. I say this in love.
Luther was against hews just like crusaders against so call pagans. I find him as an instrument of God but I wonder about his heart to be completely surrrenderd to God.
I’m liberal. It’s extremely bias to identify “bull-pin theory” with liberalism. How come it’s not just crazy? It seems Sky always has to find something to balance crazy conservative extremism with on the liberal side, to appear “fair”. It’s the one side of him I do not respect. Other than that I read all his books.
He’s right they may associate that with liberals. But It is a wrong association an extreme generalization and stereotype he is perpetuating. I was surprised by such a factually inaccurate statement from someone i recognize as a critical thinker. As a Liberal Christian I don’t believe God is unconcerned with our unethical treatment of animals. I don’t believe you can have the God in you heart and abuse animals. What does that belief have to do with PETA? Does that mean conservatives don’t care about abusing animals? I just looked up PETA. ITS A NONPARTISAN organization (become to political) unfortunately, nonpolitical is something that cannot be said more and more about Evangelical churches.
@@promomail1768 I believe he was speaking of stereotypes and the conservative mindset in general. In fact, I have seen this manifested in most of my conservative friends’ posts. Even mocking PETA in church.
@@lisarandleman6141 I don’t get it. It seems like they despise something only because they believe its a liberal cause. Doesn’t matter how worthy. If soup kitchens were all ran by liberals they would mock helping the poor.
The biggest problem for Christianity is the Christians. My kids used to go to church and church camp and my youngest loved taking care ot the kids in the nursery in the church child care. No more. They heard one to many Christians saying very judgmental and unkind and angry things. The angry Christians outnumber the kind ones. There is no hate like Christian love.
Can the Holy Post look at getting Dr. Debra Soh as a guest? She wrote "The End of Gender" and was a guest on Babylon Bee yesterday. It was GREAT interview, so much so that I bought her book afterward. I made this post in the Community section of Patreon as well.
I got to be Michael the archangel as a lad with the sword and the wings. That’s at least kinda metal 🤘 It was still Halloween for me. My parents weren’t the nuttier ones but we were in those circles enough to participate in costuming as men and women of god Catholic though so also a lot of post biblical people. Saints rather than prophets
@@glennsnapp290 I do credit it with some of my interest in historical costuming and making my own costumes rather than just picking a pop culture option from the big box store
29:46 my brother and I have been saying that very thing through the rise of trumpism. When you listen to some of the rhetoric that’s out there, we Christians are being compare to Nazis.
Trumpism is a term for the political ideologies, social emotions, style of governance,[9] political movement, and set of mechanisms for acquiring and keeping control of power associated with Donald Trump and his political base.[10][11] Trumpists and Trumpian are terms used to refer to those exhibiting characteristics of Trumpism, whereas political supporters of Trump are known as Trumpers.
To address Skye's quote of Bonhoeffer about stupidity, I believe there are two biblical narratives that may explain this concept. These are the ideas of ignorance and hard-heartedness. Typically hard-heartedness is attributed to unbelievers or unfaithful (Matthew 13, Ephesians 4, Hebrews 3-4). The hard of heart will see, but not see, and hear, but not hear or understand. The ignorant, on the other hand, may respond to the truth because they were deceived. This was the apostle Paul's story (1 Timothy 1), and the story of Israel under the hand of the Pharisees and Leaders of Jesus' day. Almost every letter of the apostles warns of false teaching that can deceive the church. And the church is willfully ignorant of the Bible, which goes to the subject of catechesis that has been discussed by the Holy Post recently. The true saints may be ignorant, but they will never be hard-hearted. They have the Spirit of the living God!
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT" "...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE" - Bonhoeffer
6:13 “Jason, you were homeschooled, halloween, no halloween, what was your upbringing?” Me, also homeschooled as a kid: oh, I know where this is going. Jason: “Oh yeah, we had halloween” Me: 😱 I didn’t get to dress up as a non-Biblical character till I was an adult! 😆
We could dress up as superheroes nothing dark or associated with evil or darkness at all we also went to church in our costumes sometimes we were allowed to do trick or treating at the at the mall NEVER DOOR TO DOOR THO
(*pauses before the guest*) I finally thought I could root for Syke when he was talkin about going to bat for Halloween being a tool for Christians to use to evangelize, but then he went and threw in that "God will never give you more than you can handle," line. XD Booooooo. Now I'ma just root for Kaitlyn (with a "y"). I liked her wrap up to how to deal with irredeemable people. Her slow working on them from one topic at a time to bring them back was so full of compassion that I had to stop and applaud, raising questions from the husband and kids as to who said what. Every time we ask the question "What do we DO with those people???" someone should pull this clip of Kaitlin and the ladies from that church, and reminds us to just keep working on them with love and let the Lord change them. Amen, Kaitlyn with a y. Amen. Also, sorry not sorry about your mushrooms, Mister Phil. (Though, the husband found the comment about being halfway to a pedo hysterical since at the time of watching/listening, he was building a puppet for one of my church projects and making it talk like Elmo. lol)
So, I do usually find PETA's takes to be silly and not very effective, BUT I want to push against two of your critisisms: 1) the point that comparing pitchers to bulls is both demeaning to pitchers and to bulls being "illogical." This is actually a good point by PETA. For example, if you claimed your (white) coworker was slacking off "like a lazy Mexican", this is simultaneously demeaning to your coworker (the point made is that he is lazy) and to Mexicans (because there is an a priority assumption that Mexicans are lazy). The "logic" you claim doesn't stop this phrase from being demeaning to both parties at the same time. 2) The claim that certain things promote "desensitivity towards cows" isn't about the COWS feelings/emotions at our usage of words; it's about promoting culture among HUMANS that promotes desensitivity towards animals. For example, telling racist jokes isn't JUST bad because it might hurt the feelings of some black or brown people. It's bad because MANY people will start to kill the empathy they might have had for the struggles of the marginalized. I don't actually agree with PETA's take on the bullpen thing, but I do not agree with the "logic" of the arguments presented here on painting "tHe LeFt" as "absurd."
I commented about this too. I think the core thing concerning them is that it’s a reference to bullfighting. The bullpen being where a bull waits to go spend the last hour of its life getting agitated and slain for spectacle. That’s not off message for promoting letting animals live with dignity and without exploitation. It’s how Francis of Assisi rolled. “Brother wolf” and all that. And indigenous peoples with the sanctity of animal life thing. In India. In the Americas. It’s not really nutty. 🤷♂️ It’s not my personal passion. It’s not a big deal to throw a fit or fight to the death over. But it’s not nutty or without reason
The more I listen to Sky's interview, the more self serving bull hooey is absolutely seething in loads...😖😖 To keep it real, one of the greatest systems supporting nazi Germany was the evangelical church - let's just get real about that I am disappointed here with Sky who is so spot-on earlier to get sucked into the Vortex of this religious hooey
@@76JStucki Evangelicals of their day - with no different of a mindset than the majority of evangelicals today... that are quick to suck up to authoritarianism as long as it's an authoritarianism that meets their power and control needs
To help out, there were a lot of things wrong with the right last year. Invading the Capitol, for example. Ok the left, the movement to defund the police has been an utter failure. Everywhere that they've done it, murders have gone up. I'm all for police reform, but maybe defunding then was not the way to fix it. Maybe setting up an external citizen review group and holding guilty police officers to the fire would have been better. I'm all for accountability, but I'm actually against taking steps to make it easier to commit murders.
They don't. HP is just labeling the conference as Qanon. Its an label/accusation that gets made of people on the right, whether they are legit followers of Qanon or not.
What exactly is the point about admitting your skeletons? And to who? Should you guys go around the room and admit your skeletons in your closet as well?
I agree that the PETA thing is unnecessary, but hearing it for the first time now, pretty sure the concept with the “bullpen” is that it’s a reference to bullfighting - the sport where the point is agitating an animal for spectacle and then slaying it. Not that I care about the use of the term. It’s just that that would be a non-absurd concern, where it links to animal cruelty, where their stance is “bullfighting is a cruel fate for our animal brothers, let’s not flippantly reference a sport we think is cruel to practice” That’s not so out of place to say, popular depictions of the gentle and pious St. Francis. Or take indigenous traditions that revere the planet and animals as sacred. “The animals are our brothers, let’s treat them with dignity”. Of course bulls don’t have feelings about using the word bullpen for baseball. But a bull’s ideal last hour of their life is also probably not getting pissed off and killed. It’s overreaction most likely. But the concept is don’t promote the practice. Just saying I don’t see that as having to be gut reaction laughable. Not something I have a personal sensitivity about. And not that I’m against having a groan at people being over the top. Or vernacular roots to something that’s not accepted anymore. Like saying “we got spanked” when you lose. Generally societally agreed you aren’t supposed to spank your kids now. But It’s not such an atrocity that we’re not going to continue having the concept and using the term nonliterally. I’m just saying, in case no one actually followed why people care, I think that’s it, and I think it’s not that intrinsically absurd a stance. Also Caviezel had he just been Jesus in 2 hours of film - I could be like “I get it. He’s a wack job”. But he’s also in probably about a hundred hours of the very good Person of Interest. So it’s kinda like “man, you were surely friends with half normal people. What is your damage”
Big fan of the show. But extremely disappointed with the blanket association of pre trib rapture eschatology with kook conspiracies. Kooks who are into conspiracies just aren't reading it correctly. As someone very much ready for the imminent rapture of the believers followed by great tribulation on the world, I'm deeply disappointed in those who subscribe to every conspiracy imaginable. Keep sharing the Gospel and do your job seeing the Day is quickly approaching. A different brand of eschatology than you, Skye, doesn't turn someone into a kook. Wrong thinking about any of these thinking systems does.
Why can't we say it's a cookie system if in fact is a cookie system just because you believe in it doesn't make it hard a cookie session. Even scripturally it's blatantly false.
I don't think he was attacking the eschatological model per se. What he was attacking was the tendency (which is extremely common) to fit every news story into the model, as if we're going to figure it all out. Because that is kinda how conspiracy theories do take hold. People feel like they're putting together this intricate and esoteric puzzle. It's almost like an ego trip. But that isn't a feature of the eschatology itself, it's a misapplication. And I think that's what his comment was directed toward.
More conservative bashing. That’s really all this show is about. You think it’s fruitful to look back at history and “admit” we were wrong? Ok that’s cool. Who even cares? Right wing conspiracy theories? Does the Left have any? Are you guys aware of Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell? It’s so irritating that you guys are so cynical, sarcastic and condescending to people who who oppose your views. You say you aren’t either right or Left, but there’s a reoccurring theme of continual Right bashing on your show. Speaks volumes.... Why don’t you guys ever have someone on with opposing views?
Your very labeling system and content attribution demonstrate a level of disorientation in your thinking and reflects someone else has informed you're thinking and you're simply regurgitated rather than doing original thinking on your own.
@@greglogan7706 Hope you’re well. I read the reply prior to the edit. Curious why you omitted the last few sentences. Help me understand what deceit I’m engaged in. I don’t consider myself either a Leftist or Right wing guy, but I’ve given this podcast a chance over The last year or so and I just can’t anymore...They constantly make claims that they’re neither right or left, but it’s clear they’re Leftists at heart - aside from abortion issue of which they vote Left strangely enough.
As I listened to Sky's follow up I was intrigued by his interviewee's question "would raping, pillaging and violence" reflect Jesus.... Yet this Jesus is supposably was the 2nd member of the Trinity who had a whole nation go raping pillaging committing genocide abortion and all manner of evil and land theft - so it would appear that would appear that his theology system is not very consistent....
I love that Jason’s mike remains on throughout the convo. His laugh brings me joy.
Haha, I actually keep it muted and unmute when something funny comes up. I now reflexively unmute in any zoom call when I laugh.
Great interview! Spread the word.
Very Catholic, but still deeply enjoy your thoughtful discussion every week. Thank you all for doing the Lord's work.
"We got so excited by the Left Behind books that we keep trying to start the End Times." Beautiful point, one I've been making for a long time. Look at those people who are trying to make Revelations happen but ignoring the sins and people they're stepping on to get there.
I really agree with you people know and believe the Bible and then times which in revelations is a not a good time so I think the undercurrent is what is driving a lot of the chaos.
@@ridgebhouse what’s frustrating is that many people seem eager to add fuel to the fires of chaos in the name of their faith.
So because human beings are imperfect God in imperfect,why not discuss the skeletons of Islam,no no no the goal here is the shaming of Christianity just like the atheist do.
Thank you for your ministry and sharing the truth. I love & appreciate you.
Wow the prosperity gospel as witch craft and divination, never thought of it that way but boy do I totally see it. I just got smarter, Thank you Skye!
Reading the comments before and now I can’t wait to get to that part! Never thought of it that way either!!
If we base our decisions biblically, we can come up with the right answer legally.
I was thinking that maybe low emotional intelligence can be substituted for stupidity. That is something that is lacking in society. We are constantly giving into our emotions to have an experience for Christ rather than thoughtfully considering who he is and what we can do to serve at this time.
The word I kept thinking of instead of 'stupid' was 'intellectually stubborn'
yep
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT"
"...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE"
- Bonhoeffer
I am reminded of the statement attributed to Gandhi “ I like your Jesus, I don’t like your Christians. “ Whether Christianity has been of more benefit than harm is a matter of judgement. The fact that large numbers of people who call themselves Christians throughout the church’s history have with their judgmental, arrogant superior attitudes have done so much damage to others in the name of their religion (and continue to do so today ) supports the view that the Christian church is very flawed , deserving skepticism and disdain.
Do you attribute the harm to which you refer, to acceptance of Christianity or to rejection of it?
Be careful not to equate intellectual achievement with moral development. If the problem is ignorance, education is the answer; but if the problem is arrogance, the answer is humility.
My childhood Halloweens were just as Kaitlyn described. Bible characters at church!
Ughhh that Miami of OH jacket hurts my soul.... hahaha
Ignorant is probably a better term than stupid.
Great interview with John Dickson. The haunting question of whether Christian ethics can survive without Christian beliefs. 😬
I see this today in people whose parents or grandparents were devout Christians and yet the current generation is not. They believe all the ethics and values, but with no basis for them other than they have seen them work in their families.
I believe that, over time, new values will creep in and, without a strong foundation, they will get washed away like sifting sand. 😣
I think the discussion of “stupidity” would have been helped by Biblical discourse from Proverbs (fool, scoffer, mocker).
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT"
"...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE"
- Bonhoeffer
33:40 Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT"
"...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE"
- Bonhoeffer
I think one of the problems with calling someone stupid or evil even if their words and behavior are showing elements of either, is that those words often are considered such totalizing insults towards a person. When a person feels shut down or condemned by someone else that often partially or totally shuts down their capacity or desire to keep an open-mind towards what the other person who called them stupid or evil is saying. I’m definitely not arguing that not labeling people with such harsh judgmental words will automatically make them open to hearing what you have to say, but it may allow for some to listen in a more nuanced and vulnerable fashion if they don’t perceive you as writing them off as dumb or evil to begin with. I do think this approach works best in one on one or very small groups where people have a relationship with one another beyond just debating political, religious, or cultural issues. Btw, this is def not all my ideas, but a combination of things I’ve read and listening to over the past 5 or so years plus what my own experience has occasionally shown me.
Great discussion. The only problem with the stupidity/close-mindedness bit is that everyone will apply it to "the other side" of whatever issue or argument is at hand. Very few people will look at themselves and ask how they are being stupid (in the sense Bonhoeffer means).
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT"
"...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE"
- Bonhoeffer
I’m not sure how much better it is than “stupid” but this verse comes to mind for the concept Skye is talking about: “The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge, but fools despise wisdom and instruction.”
Proverbs 1:7 NIV
As Christians we really have to learn how to discern truth from empty philosophy like it says in Philippians 2:8 and 1 timothy 4:7 and other verses. There needs to be more of objectivity through the lense of truth. Conservative Christians raise a valid point because there are ungodly precedents being set by the left. But conservatives fail to see the ungodly motives that have seeped into their agenda as well. I think as Christians we tend to forget that we are sinners saved by grace and we forget that our hearts are just as deceitful as those we deem our enemies. And we are also guilty of not loving our enemies...even in politics...even though God commands us.
My church's sermon last sunday was over Acts 19, which describes an encounter with some Jewish exorcists in it. Your discussion on the Jews practicing witchcraft reminded me of that. Interesting such a practice goes that far back in history.
Bonhoeffer on Stupidity is required reading for the times we are living in.
or check out the vid on RUclips :)
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT"
"...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE"
- Bonhoeffer
Regarding Bonhoeffer's use of the word "stupid", I wonder if "foolish" would be a better term, especially when talking about a temporary state of being rather than a hard-wired characteristic. Proverbs have a lot to say about fools and foolishness and one of them talks about the how there is very little hope for a fool. That seems to be what Bonhoeffer was referencing. Also, a mentor once told me years ago that knowledge was having facts whereas wisdom was knowing how to apply those facts to bring about good. The internet has a plethora of facts, some of which are also true, but without wisdom those facts are either useless or are used for division and harm.
Off the bat I'm surprised that you guys celebrate Halloween. WoW!!
When you talked about Bonhoffer, and were working over the usefulness of "stupid", I wondered what Bonhoffer's language was. I imagine he was writing in German which has more than one word and forms of the words that could be translated stupid. That political problems come about by lack of cognitive capability could easily be a misrepresentation of Bonhoffer's message--- or at least that's worth checking before getting stuck on using the english word.
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT"
"...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE"
- Bonhoeffer
Sky's comments at 29.ff are both chilling and spot on!!
😢😢
jokes about conspiracy theories also hit differently now. Yesterday I was listening to Weird Al's song "Foil" which I and my family laughed at when it released years ago. Now some of the jokes sound an awful lot like how actual christians are thinking and talking right now.
Another great show. Loved the interview with John Dickson. My question would be can members of society hold to the values of Christianity and a belief/faith in God without engagement with the church. The discussion was about retaining the values without belief in a God. I think many deconstructed Christians stop short of atheism and hold onto belief in a God, however with more mystery and less rules (since no one agrees on the interpretation anyway).
Leftist vegan here, I too think PETA's 'bullpen' issue is silly. They don't represent anyone on this issue.
Religious,Anti-Christ fascists always love to find a boogie man to use as a political bludgeon there focus is solely on the things below and their blood lust for power and control
CRT is another great example
@@greglogan7706 Totally agree, republicans are out of control.
Bob Larson pastor and christian shock jock was the leader of the war on halloween in the 80s and 90s.
1980s Demonizing Halloween was thanks to Keith Green. He also attacked Santa Clause and all of Christmas. It was very unsettling and I did minimal Halloween with my kids because of him. I loved his music but was messed up by his teaching for a long time.
Me too. In the 80s heard Christian radio programs about Halloween and vowed my children would not participate. We as a family always did a fun activity on the 31st.
Well...Keith Green certainly did not invent the anti-Halloween message, even if he promoted it. We need to remember that Keith was very young. 28 at the time of his death, I believe. I was profoundly impacted by his music as well, but it is common for young people to be a little overzealous at times. Keith himself admitted to overstating his position on people going to the foreign mission field. He was a dear brother who was most certainly used by God for good in the lives of many people. But he was not a perfect man, and he wasn't automatically right about everything just because he was **KEITH GREEN**. He wouldn't want us to put him on that kind of pedestal.
I heard ". . .we don't have a good theology of principalities and powers..." when discussing the Qanon piece. Have any of you at the Holy Post read Dr Michael Heiser's book , The Unseen Realm?
Sadly too many Christians have stopped reading their Bible and only listen to people. Many do not know the voice of God because they don’t read for themselves…falling for all sorts of bad theology and false teachings
Christianity was majorly impacted by Plato when it was beginning, so how is combining it with Stoicism different?
I picked up on that as well, I'm interested what practice in Stoicism is counter to Christianity. The ultimate goal of the Stoa was "eudaimonia" or "good spirit"/"living well" that aligns very well with the concept of "Shalom" and Paul's words on contentment in all situations.
@@lukemacri6557 I think the real problem is lack of knowledge. Most people don't know there is a tie between Plato and Christianity, so they feel that Stoicism is introducing paganism into Christianity. Of course, most Christians are completely unaware of Christian history. Take the current position of the Bible's historical accuracy, that really wasn't the position of the first Christians or Jews.
For the record, Phil, there are no good witches in Narnia. You might be thinking of The Wizard of Oz...
Katelyn's first mistake was sending a note. That's passive aggressive. People invariably respond better to personal interaction. With a reminder that you are also interfering with their personal time with their music. That being said, a suggestion for an agreed compromise that allows you both to have what you want: study time and music time ought to be prepared before hand. Like a time period that you most often study. It can't be open ended.
You should also apologize for sending a note that allowed for a miscommunication. They might not respond as nicely in return, but your end is to get some quiet study time.
Nice "What's in the Bible" church history song reference there, Skye. "From Jesus Christ to Billy Graham..."
I understand Skyes point about how people think. I don’t think stupidity is the right phrase. Maybe willfully ignorant is a better way to say it. I know a lot of smart people who refuse to see the truth.
I see it as a lack of critical thinking skills and a propensity toward conformation bias.
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT"
"...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE"
- Bonhoeffer
I agree with Sky! and "prosperity gospel" takes away from the Book, adds to the Book; gotta remind people to check the messages to the Churches in Revelations - they still apply.
And the escatology as well. Spot on. The whole question of thinking it through as Paul did with people, and working on issues of the heart as dies God, we are losing logic and heart.
Oh, and calling people chicken? those animals can be terrifying. Fowl are foul tempered and can be so aggressive!!
I am just dumb enough, that is, stupid enough - to believe the Bible...
Ever heard that before?
BS can now stand for "Bigfoot poop."
gullible, instead of 'stupid'. (late to the party)
‘Skeletons in Christianity’s Closet’.
The fact that you people consider yourselves saved, as well as that others consider you saved, is horrifying.
Jim Caviezel also plays Jesus on the “NKJV Word of Promise “ audio Bible. I own a copy and can’t listen to it anymore knowing what a nut job he is.
Why would we have to defend God? He doesn't need us; we need Him.
Skye is so right about Bonhofer' s comment, if you don't use the word stupid then let's use the word fool. In Proverbs people who don't listen to wise advice are considered fools. Let's let those people pick which one. I say this in love.
Luther was against hews just like crusaders against so call pagans. I find him as an instrument of God but I wonder about his heart to be completely surrrenderd to God.
I’m liberal. It’s extremely bias to identify “bull-pin theory” with liberalism. How come it’s not just crazy? It seems Sky always has to find something to balance crazy conservative extremism with on the liberal side, to appear “fair”. It’s the one side of him I do not respect. Other than that I read all his books.
He’s right. That idea of hurting an animal’s feelings, for example, is something that conservatives associate with leftists.
He’s right they may associate that with liberals. But It is a wrong association an extreme generalization and stereotype he is perpetuating. I was surprised by such a factually inaccurate statement from someone i recognize as a critical thinker. As a Liberal Christian I don’t believe God is unconcerned with our unethical treatment of animals. I don’t believe you can have the God in you heart and abuse animals. What does that belief have to do with PETA? Does that mean conservatives don’t care about abusing animals? I just looked up PETA. ITS A NONPARTISAN organization (become to political) unfortunately, nonpolitical is something that cannot be said more and more about Evangelical churches.
@@promomail1768
I believe he was speaking of stereotypes and the conservative mindset in general. In fact, I have seen this manifested in most of my conservative friends’ posts. Even mocking PETA in church.
@@lisarandleman6141 I don’t get it. It seems like they despise something only because they believe its a liberal cause. Doesn’t matter how worthy. If soup kitchens were all ran by liberals they would mock helping the poor.
All I'm saying is Jonathan Roumie would never (probably) and he is the only Jesus actor I recognize ✋
Lot of laughs here.
The biggest problem for Christianity is the Christians. My kids used to go to church and church camp and my youngest loved taking care ot the kids in the nursery in the church child care. No more. They heard one to many Christians saying very judgmental and unkind and angry things. The angry Christians outnumber the kind ones. There is no hate like Christian love.
PETA is not a good metric for animal rights issues by any margin based on their history
Re: PETA - in the r/baseball thread on Reddit, my favorite suggestion was "Arm Pit".
🤣🤣🤣🤣
Can the Holy Post look at getting Dr. Debra Soh as a guest? She wrote "The End of Gender" and was a guest on Babylon Bee yesterday. It was GREAT interview, so much so that I bought her book afterward.
I made this post in the Community section of Patreon as well.
A good word, instead of "stupid," would be "numb"
Despite the Economic crisis its still a good time to start up an investment.
Most intelligent words I've heard💯
Investing in cryptocurrency is one of the best chance of making money.
I wanted to trade Crypto but got discouraged by the fluctuations in price
@@pinned_bychrissain107 That won't bother you if you trade with a professional like Mr Steven Hatzakis
I have heard a lot about investments with Mr Steven Hatzakis and how good he is, please how safe are the profits?
I always thought it was called ball pen
I say blast classic Veggie Tales through the wall at the noisy neighbor!
Regarding the actor who "played" Jesus is still taking OPM to act for paying audiences.
I also dressed as Bible characters to go to Harvestfest. My parents went as Jacob and Esau one year which was amazing. Lots of girls going as Esther.
There were so many Esthers!
I got to be Michael the archangel as a lad with the sword and the wings. That’s at least kinda metal 🤘
It was still Halloween for me. My parents weren’t the nuttier ones but we were in those circles enough to participate in costuming as men and women of god
Catholic though so also a lot of post biblical people. Saints rather than prophets
We had one kid show up as John the Baptist’s head on a platter! Good times.
@@glennsnapp290 I do credit it with some of my interest in historical costuming and making my own costumes rather than just picking a pop culture option from the big box store
@@glennsnapp290 now that’s baller
29:46 my brother and I have been saying that very thing through the rise of trumpism. When you listen to some of the rhetoric that’s out there, we Christians are being compare to Nazis.
What exactly is Trumpism?
Trumpism is a term for the political ideologies, social emotions, style of governance,[9] political movement, and set of mechanisms for acquiring and keeping control of power associated with Donald Trump and his political base.[10][11] Trumpists and Trumpian are terms used to refer to those exhibiting characteristics of Trumpism, whereas political supporters of Trump are known as Trumpers.
Possible solution for noisy neighbors - noise cancelling headphones.
How come the poor fellow in the lower left hand corner never gets addressed by Phil but just the young lady in the upper right hand corner...🤔🤔
He’s the broadcast/audio engineer.
He is occasiomally addressed, but he is not actually a panelist on the podcast.
If you've got something to say, out with it.
To address Skye's quote of Bonhoeffer about stupidity, I believe there are two biblical narratives that may explain this concept. These are the ideas of ignorance and hard-heartedness. Typically hard-heartedness is attributed to unbelievers or unfaithful (Matthew 13, Ephesians 4, Hebrews 3-4). The hard of heart will see, but not see, and hear, but not hear or understand. The ignorant, on the other hand, may respond to the truth because they were deceived. This was the apostle Paul's story (1 Timothy 1), and the story of Israel under the hand of the Pharisees and Leaders of Jesus' day. Almost every letter of the apostles warns of false teaching that can deceive the church. And the church is willfully ignorant of the Bible, which goes to the subject of catechesis that has been discussed by the Holy Post recently. The true saints may be ignorant, but they will never be hard-hearted. They have the Spirit of the living God!
Just to provide some clarity (paraphrasing) "#STUPIDITY is ... a #MORAL 'DEFECT"
"...#STUPIDITY is in essence NOT AN INTELLECTUAL DEFECT but a #MORAL ONE"
- Bonhoeffer
I have read Von Hofer. I understand, what he said..
katlyn and Skibare both correct.
Perhaps the rephrase could be "foolishness is a more dangerous enemy to good than malice"
6:13 “Jason, you were homeschooled, halloween, no halloween, what was your upbringing?”
Me, also homeschooled as a kid: oh, I know where this is going.
Jason: “Oh yeah, we had halloween”
Me: 😱
I didn’t get to dress up as a non-Biblical character till I was an adult! 😆
We could dress up as superheroes nothing dark or associated with evil or darkness at all we also went to church in our costumes sometimes we were allowed to do trick or treating at the at the mall NEVER DOOR TO DOOR THO
Skeletons in the closet? That's Halloween stuff right there.
(*pauses before the guest*) I finally thought I could root for Syke when he was talkin about going to bat for Halloween being a tool for Christians to use to evangelize, but then he went and threw in that "God will never give you more than you can handle," line. XD Booooooo. Now I'ma just root for Kaitlyn (with a "y"). I liked her wrap up to how to deal with irredeemable people. Her slow working on them from one topic at a time to bring them back was so full of compassion that I had to stop and applaud, raising questions from the husband and kids as to who said what. Every time we ask the question "What do we DO with those people???" someone should pull this clip of Kaitlin and the ladies from that church, and reminds us to just keep working on them with love and let the Lord change them. Amen, Kaitlyn with a y. Amen. Also, sorry not sorry about your mushrooms, Mister Phil. (Though, the husband found the comment about being halfway to a pedo hysterical since at the time of watching/listening, he was building a puppet for one of my church projects and making it talk like Elmo. lol)
Also, I think Jason oughta go out as a cinnamon roll for Halloween next time.
I took Skye's "never more than you can handle" comment as sarcastic.
@@jjdiaz667 =P Oh, I know. My comment was more of a groooooooan, bad joke than a legit complaint.
So, I do usually find PETA's takes to be silly and not very effective, BUT I want to push against two of your critisisms:
1) the point that comparing pitchers to bulls is both demeaning to pitchers and to bulls being "illogical." This is actually a good point by PETA. For example, if you claimed your (white) coworker was slacking off "like a lazy Mexican", this is simultaneously demeaning to your coworker (the point made is that he is lazy) and to Mexicans (because there is an a priority assumption that Mexicans are lazy). The "logic" you claim doesn't stop this phrase from being demeaning to both parties at the same time.
2) The claim that certain things promote "desensitivity towards cows" isn't about the COWS feelings/emotions at our usage of words; it's about promoting culture among HUMANS that promotes desensitivity towards animals.
For example, telling racist jokes isn't JUST bad because it might hurt the feelings of some black or brown people. It's bad because MANY people will start to kill the empathy they might have had for the struggles of the marginalized.
I don't actually agree with PETA's take on the bullpen thing, but I do not agree with the "logic" of the arguments presented here on painting "tHe LeFt" as "absurd."
I commented about this too. I think the core thing concerning them is that it’s a reference to bullfighting. The bullpen being where a bull waits to go spend the last hour of its life getting agitated and slain for spectacle.
That’s not off message for promoting letting animals live with dignity and without exploitation.
It’s how Francis of Assisi rolled. “Brother wolf” and all that.
And indigenous peoples with the sanctity of animal life thing. In India. In the Americas.
It’s not really nutty. 🤷♂️
It’s not my personal passion. It’s not a big deal to throw a fit or fight to the death over.
But it’s not nutty or without reason
Wow, we truly need to lighten up as a society. This is getting out of hand.
@@PattyEverAfter you want them to "solve" "bacon tasting good?"
The more I listen to Sky's interview, the more self serving bull hooey is absolutely seething in loads...😖😖
To keep it real, one of the greatest systems supporting nazi Germany was the evangelical church - let's just get real about that
I am disappointed here with Sky who is so spot-on earlier to get sucked into the Vortex of this religious hooey
Could the church in Germany in the 1930's really be called "evangelical?"
@@76JStucki
Evangelicals of their day - with no different of a mindset than the majority of evangelicals today... that are quick to suck up to authoritarianism as long as it's an authoritarianism that meets their power and control needs
Spider-Man is one of the foremost historians??
Delete the post from the person trying to sell product and the 26 responses.
At least with BS we got news of the butt.
To help out, there were a lot of things wrong with the right last year. Invading the Capitol, for example. Ok the left, the movement to defund the police has been an utter failure. Everywhere that they've done it, murders have gone up. I'm all for police reform, but maybe defunding then was not the way to fix it. Maybe setting up an external citizen review group and holding guilty police officers to the fire would have been better. I'm all for accountability, but I'm actually against taking steps to make it easier to commit murders.
I didn't even know qanon had conferences.
I didn't know their conferences had $600 tickets! Someone's making a lot of money off those folks.
@@srchoy why else would there be a Qanon if they weren’t making money off of it?
They don't. HP is just labeling the conference as Qanon. Its an label/accusation that gets made of people on the right, whether they are legit followers of Qanon or not.
What exactly is the point about admitting your skeletons? And to who? Should you guys go around the room and admit your skeletons in your closet as well?
I agree that the PETA thing is unnecessary, but hearing it for the first time now, pretty sure the concept with the “bullpen” is that it’s a reference to bullfighting - the sport where the point is agitating an animal for spectacle and then slaying it.
Not that I care about the use of the term.
It’s just that that would be a non-absurd concern, where it links to animal cruelty, where their stance is “bullfighting is a cruel fate for our animal brothers, let’s not flippantly reference a sport we think is cruel to practice”
That’s not so out of place to say, popular depictions of the gentle and pious St. Francis. Or take indigenous traditions that revere the planet and animals as sacred. “The animals are our brothers, let’s treat them with dignity”.
Of course bulls don’t have feelings about using the word bullpen for baseball. But a bull’s ideal last hour of their life is also probably not getting pissed off and killed.
It’s overreaction most likely. But the concept is don’t promote the practice.
Just saying I don’t see that as having to be gut reaction laughable. Not something I have a personal sensitivity about. And not that I’m against having a groan at people being over the top. Or vernacular roots to something that’s not accepted anymore. Like saying “we got spanked” when you lose. Generally societally agreed you aren’t supposed to spank your kids now. But It’s not such an atrocity that we’re not going to continue having the concept and using the term nonliterally.
I’m just saying, in case no one actually followed why people care, I think that’s it, and I think it’s not that intrinsically absurd a stance.
Also Caviezel had he just been Jesus in 2 hours of film - I could be like “I get it. He’s a wack job”. But he’s also in probably about a hundred hours of the very good Person of Interest. So it’s kinda like “man, you were surely friends with half normal people. What is your damage”
Big fan of the show. But extremely disappointed with the blanket association of pre trib rapture eschatology with kook conspiracies. Kooks who are into conspiracies just aren't reading it correctly. As someone very much ready for the imminent rapture of the believers followed by great tribulation on the world, I'm deeply disappointed in those who subscribe to every conspiracy imaginable. Keep sharing the Gospel and do your job seeing the Day is quickly approaching.
A different brand of eschatology than you, Skye, doesn't turn someone into a kook.
Wrong thinking about any of these thinking systems does.
Why can't we say it's a cookie system if in fact is a cookie system just because you believe in it doesn't make it hard a cookie session.
Even scripturally it's blatantly false.
I don't think he was attacking the eschatological model per se. What he was attacking was the tendency (which is extremely common) to fit every news story into the model, as if we're going to figure it all out. Because that is kinda how conspiracy theories do take hold. People feel like they're putting together this intricate and esoteric puzzle. It's almost like an ego trip. But that isn't a feature of the eschatology itself, it's a misapplication. And I think that's what his comment was directed toward.
More conservative bashing. That’s really all this show is about. You think it’s fruitful to look back at history and “admit” we were wrong? Ok that’s cool. Who even cares?
Right wing conspiracy theories? Does the Left have any? Are you guys aware of Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell? It’s so irritating that you guys are so cynical, sarcastic and condescending to people who who oppose your views. You say you aren’t either right or Left, but there’s a reoccurring theme of continual Right bashing on your show. Speaks volumes....
Why don’t you guys ever have someone on with opposing views?
You are completely misrepresenting this presentation - not sure what your problem is - But you are personally engaged in deceit.
Your very labeling system and content attribution demonstrate a level of disorientation in your thinking and reflects someone else has informed you're thinking and you're simply regurgitated rather than doing original thinking on your own.
@@greglogan7706 Hope you’re well. I read the reply prior to the edit. Curious why you omitted the last few sentences. Help me understand what deceit I’m engaged in. I don’t consider myself either a Leftist or Right wing guy, but I’ve given this podcast a chance over
The last year or so and I just can’t anymore...They constantly make claims that they’re neither right or left, but it’s clear they’re Leftists at heart - aside from abortion issue of which they vote Left strangely enough.
@@greglogan7706 Not even sure how to reply to this one. I’m sorry
As I listened to Sky's follow up I was intrigued by his interviewee's question "would raping, pillaging and violence" reflect Jesus.... Yet this Jesus is supposably was the 2nd member of the Trinity who had a whole nation go raping pillaging committing genocide abortion and all manner of evil and land theft - so it would appear that would appear that his theology system is not very consistent....