I've had a blast creating modern metal tones in the Helix. My go-to is the Badonk. I can't seem to get away from it. I do use Ownhammer IR's. The Helix is bad ass. Great video man!
I would love to see a comparison of the modern metal tone that you created (which kicks ass, I must say) and the Kemper tone in this vid. The Helix can FOR SURE create great modern metal tones, it just seems this vid didn't dial in a great one.
This is a fantastic video and perfectly sums up how I've felt about helix in the past. I too nearly bought a kemper. BUT to anyone who has watched this and is/was put off helix, they're definitely worth checking out. I myself had a similar journey with helix to this guy, I had a big rig and pedalboard etc, sold all that and went purely helix, but next to the other guitarist in my band at the time, who has a victory kraken, I just always felt like it lacked something. So I too went over to a helix with a preamp and power amp, in my case this was a victory V4 Kraken Pre-Amp and a Cornford roadhouse 30 6L6 combo as a power amp and cab. I then found that I still was missing something, so I started using an overdrive pedal, and before I knew it I was basically back where I started, so I was going to sell the Helix and buy a kemper because I "knew" I would be able to get a great modern metal tone with it, because everyone on RUclips says so! Then just before I pulled the trigger on a kemper stage, I heard 3 bands that were using helix exclusively for guitar tones; Valis Ablaze, the human veil and a local band called DLVRR and they all sounded sick so I decided the issue wasn't the helix, it was me. I spoke to the guy from DLVRR and he put my onto Nick Hill's videos and low and behold, I copied what he did and it sounded sick, so I sold everything else and threw myself into properly learning the Helix. 1 year later, I've now sold all my gear including my helix rack and replaced it with 2 overdrive pedals and 2 HX stomps (pedal form factor helix.) now I've got killer tone and everything I could possibly need on a 600x300mm lightweight pedalboard 🔥
To be perfectly fair most mix and record at home guitarist HAVE probably owned a kemper (myself included). It is touted (and is) as one of the greatest tone carving ingredients in a mix especially for high gain tone-genre-specific metal. But I by no means would call it superior (or any less) than a Helix. So many guitarist like myself looking for a high gain tone have found even better options and sculpting methods with the helix. So many have swapped the kemper out as their main unit. This video is a very great reprensentation of what both can normally do out of the box but by no means does it show the multitude and extensive ways you can carve a tone with both. Who did it better. Well I suppose you'll have to try-em both out and listen by ear. Of the many guitarist who use Kemper do too are the many (popularly followed) youtubers who have made astonishing tracks (and albums with the Helix. To me its amazing enough that the so-assumed line 6 could build such a quality machine for less the price. If the Helix was available at the same time the Kemper came to market though I would have honestly chose the Kemper. So many Line 6 products became a laughing stock by then and any guitarist would have known to choose the prior.
I think this is fair enough, and I am a very happy Helix user, but not a modern high gain player. I think what the big takeaway is how Line 6 have done such a great job of allowing users to configure the unit to work for them, whatever you do, whatever you play, whatever you have. The Helix will fit into that and make life a whole lot easier.
Good video. I've also had the Helix for a few years (since 1st shipment) and my experiences are similar. I'm good with Helix only for everything except high gain. For that, I go 4 cable into a REVV Generator 7-40 Mk II and Mesa 2x12 Recto Cab. That sounds brutal. I'm definitely looking forward to update 2.8 for the Helix since it will have the REVV Generator 120 model.
Yo Darrell, thanks for commenting. I think I was the first person to get the helix in Michigan. (At least one of the first people) I think the Revv model (in the helix) will still lack in feel, fullness and aggression like all the other models do. I really believe they know that. That's why they're reluctant to do more high gain models. They need to fix the algorithm or something in the software to address this. Kemper did and their tones sound better than a few years ago
Most impulse responses are just basically an Eq, and that is why they don't feel dynamic. It's called "dynamic impulse response", look it up and you will realize why most of these systems which make music more convenient are missing the connection to your brain and body that you get when playing a real speaker in a room. This one fact is why I haven't plunged more money into a new system with current IR technology. My research found that the sheer amount of processing to pull this trick off digitally would be astronomical and super expensive. I think aside from having to mic a room, you would also have to figure out how to mic and maybe even take pressure reading of the inner side of the cabinet, and cross-reference all that data with the Kemper style sine sweep. (Guessing) I do however use a real amp and a Two Notes Torpedo live, which is now on two mics and moving up two 2048 samples, which I for some reason that it was already on but I guess not. I would love to see your thoughts on a real amp through one.
@@torchlord11 if I get ahold of that gear, I'll definitely check it out. Something ive noticed with playing my Kemper thru a Friedman ASC 12 is that I actually do get that air push bouncy feel. Have you tried one?
@@TONEWARSgearshow No I have not, my gear buying has been limited since I've been saving for another car. I saw one being sold on Facebook Market place for a good price, bought couldn't pull the trigger. I decided to just stick with my Coreblade tube amp and Port City Os Wave cabinet, which I'm pretty happy with. I wasn't ecstatic that a tube went bad on me and I didn't know the TSC took that tube out of the circuit. I wouldn't mind trying one out but I'm guessing my Axe Fx Ultra probably wouldn't be up to the task sounding that great. I've considered getting one and using it, so I could use all the cabinets for the Torpedo Live.
Thanks for a great vid and really glad you included the sounds combined in a mix because honestly, yes you can still hear the difference, but to a much lesser extent and more importantly they were all good sounding mixes, so the question then becomes how big is your budget
You would also need a power amp, Electro Harmonix has a 44w Power Amp pedal for only 150 bucks however. If you get lucky, you could get one for pretty cheap
Great video as always dude. I use my Helix with OH IRs and clearly (at least for me) sound much better. I’m not a High gain guy anymore, now just more like a mid gain guy. For me (and my budget) I have what I need right know. Keep going! Your channel is very helpful!
Actually I have to say, I disagree, you can make it sound really amazing as a high gain, stand-alone unit. You just have to add some post-EQ and a high cut at about 8-10 kHz, and you will get the same tone out of it as a kemper. Dual cabs also help
Hey another strong Vid. I appreciate the hard work and quality. It takes a lot of hard work to attain your level of talent as well as the time for video editing and production. Good to see your channel gaining momentum. I was wondering if you are setting the amps up in the Helix with the Master all the way up and brining in the pre amps to taste. Give me an idea of the gain settings here, with the amp, pedal combo. I'm a non master volume old school plexi guy, with the TS 808 in the front. I'm curious here for tone reference, Thanks again!
Thank you Kindly. Just a suggestion, try an experiment with a Marshall 1959 with the master on 10 dial in the tightest most gain you can while rolling the bottom. Now bring in the screamer start with level 4, tone to taste and gain 6 and up. You should get a tight Fortin Nameless tone without flub, fizz and be real close. Also try an exernal drive pedal in front of the Helix. Crazy as it sounds, responds as an amp does! If you need 'more' try the JCM800, 2000 as well as a hot EQ as a boost, strip the 0-200HZ like Fortin does. That said still love your tones. Cheers!
You have me re thinking everything. Should I get a Seymour Duncan Powerstage to run with Mesa cab or save up and get my dream amp, a Mesa Triple Crown and run 4 cable method?? Hmm
From what I've heard the Powerstage has clipping issues. I would get something else. Also, there's other digital platforms that might have a great version of your dream amp
In person Kemper sounds solid state to me , helix sounds like a well polished pod, I wonder what the big difference hardware wise is between the helix and the ax8
If I may ask, did you use any post amp EQ on the Helix patches? I've found that you can get a much smoother high gain tone with a low pass set at around 5-6k, as well as cutting a db or two with a relatively wide Q at around 3/4k with a parametric EQ. Obviously that does nothing to change the playing response, but it tames the high end fizz incredibly well. I do strongly agree that the third party IRs make a colossal difference against the stock cabs though.
@@TONEWARSgearshow I've found that I've had to be pretty brutal with the low pass to get a smoother high gain tone (everything above 6k is just fizz). You can definitely get into the same tonal ballpark as the Kemper with the Helix, it just takes a fair amount of tweaking. Thankfully the Helix comes with all the necessary tools to do so (except for the 3rd party IRs of course).
@@McDylbot I hear you on that. There's still two major things missing with the helix regarding high gain tones- dimension and feel. It's two dimensional as opposed to three dimensional like the Kemper. The strings feel like rusty, old strings on the helix as opposed to Kemper.
Jared! What's up man? For me, I liked the stock helix tones best of the three. I've listened three times to be sure I'm not biasing myself. Personally, I'm not a mega gain metal guy. I'm more of a rock player. Live, I only use hss strats, so I do have trouble getting a metal tone for when I do need it. I appreciate your approach to it though. I have found with the helix, I like to add a dual cab, same cab on both but one with a bright dynamic mic and one with a dark condenser. Then, ill sum that to mono using the mic pre with the gain under 5 and the volume raised. Then I'll use Jason Sadites LA compressor. I find those two make all the difference in the world. I have all the free Redwirez and Ownhammer IR's, I prefer the stock cabs personally. That's a rare opinion in the helix world, but thats what works for me. Btw... I'd really love to get a download of your song!
I'm so glad that the helix works for you and you found sounds that you really like. I think that the helix is the best product out there and 4 cable method. It has a lot to offer and the routing and switching capabilities are unmatched.The fx are also very good. They just need to fix the amp modeling so that it sounds more realistic and Fuller and more aggressive. If they can do that they would have a top notch product in every category
@aaron kerr - The Kemper sounds were slightly better overall than the Helix only and the Helix with IR's added. But I preferred the Helix only over the Helix with IR's in this video.
Idk? Ask Ola Englund he did the Same video 3 years ago and sounded awesome! Build 2.81 sounds and feels better by the way using Mikko sound labs cab ir's,
They didn't buy my opinion I thought it sounded great and yea I get a great metal tones out of helix if I had tons of cash I'd have the real amps but this works for me.
I went to a Helix for an axefx2 setup just to try it before most likely moving to a Kemper or an AXEFX3 and the second I got it I told people it doesn’t feel right when you “dig into it” with a pick. So I hear you when you described it exactly the same way. I love everything about the Helix floor unit because it’s all in one but I struggle with that “feel” part. I own a ridiculous about of actual amps also so I have lots to compare will. Oddly, the only amp I feel like you can dig into on the helix that feels the best is the Badonk or whatever that one is that’s the new Big Bottom from the older L6 products.
And you're right. The feel is so important I couldn't believe the difference after not playing the helix for many months. When I came back to it I felt like I was playing 20 year old rusty strings
Great tones man, I hit subscribe. I'm a new helix user and i was wondering - when recording at home vs playing through FRFR > where do you set the main helix volume control? I seem to be pushing it to 12 o clock and it somehow becomes a bit shrill at home even with IRs and all sorts of hi/lo cuts. Planning to use an FRFR with band soon.
If havent heard charles caswell of berried alive you may want to check him out his tones are the most sickest and modern as it gets and used podhd 500x now the helix standalone..
Can you clarify, if you have one of these modeling pedalboards, can they be played through an actual guitar cab without going through an amp? What about the FRFR speakers? Are they stand along (along with the board that is) or do you still need an amp head as well?
Good questions. You need a power amp (tube or solid state) to run these digital platforms to a passive cab. There are many great, compact options to choose from. The FRFR cab is self powered and is a stand alone product. I hope this helps
Thanks so much! I’ve been researching these a bit over the last few weeks. It seems like the Friedman FRFR is the way to go. For the pedalboard, the Helix and Headrush seem comparable. I’m a metal player, could you recommend one over the other?
That's pretty much what it does best, imo. If it didn't have the built in dirt options; I would feel much differently. The drives are what make it feel more "realistic". To me at least. Which is what makes it a little less enjoyable for me on the lower gain amp(s) side of things.
The mystery tone sounded double tracked or like it had a doubled effect in stereo, the helix struggles with high gain , it can match the kemper but it takes more tweaking added effects and eq'ing and processing power
Both products were recorded in stereo. The Kemper sounds double tracked Compared to the helix because it's much Fuller, fatter and more aggressive. The tone is much richer.
I feel the same about the helix i like my ax8 better for my metal tones, its about how the unit responds than the helix and i love the helix but for different stuff, to intégrate the variax for my cover band works great.
If you have a chance, check out these tone match patch tutorials from Ryan at PSS. In this collection is a brutal one for the Fortin Nameless and others you may enjoy. Very flexible and well done. He does very good work. Enjoy.ruclips.net/p/PLFf4WCqq3Aa0V2OVcD4vEmIhQdgykS_uN
Thanks for the review dude! I couldn't wait to see it & you never disappoint man! When side by side you can absolutely hear the lack of balls from the Helix. And so nobody starts ripping me, yes I own the Helix LT & still love it! But you certainly can not argue with these sound clips. I'm an 80's guitarist. Grew up in the absolutely best time ever to be one as well. So with 90% of what I'm playing the Helix LT through my Friedman ASC12 is a killer rig! Here's the but we all knew was coming. When playing Trivium for example, I'm just missing something & this video proves my initial thought. I too had a huge rig with my Marshall JCM800 model 2205 & a full rack of effects. That rig kills but I want to down size & retire gear that is irreplaceable. The Helix LT was my first choice but the Kemper is INCREDIBLE! GAS never stops & I'm now leaning towards the Synergy rack with stereo power supply & the Helix in 4CM. Looks like it's back to more gear but as guitarists half the fun is the GAS that never sleeps & you can NEVER have too much equipment!! Thanks again! I'll keep you posted on what I decide to go with. Keep doing the good stuff!!!!!!! 🤘😁🤘
@Poopy Productions That's crazy man! I love mine! The Helix rocks well absolutely & can get some brutal sounds but have you tried any Synergy stuff?? Engl module, Diezel module & more are just incredible! The tools available today blow my mind! There are so many choices & 98% sound pretty good with a lot of the modelling stuff nearly indistinguishable from the actual gear it's modelling! I only wish this stuff was available back when I first started playing! Keep doing the good stuff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!🤘😁🤘
Great video! I just wanted to comment that I liked the Helix Only with the Scream 808 and built in CAB IR the most for the mixed song.. it just fit better. It let the bass guitar and low end of the drums come through. Personally I love my HX Stomp and third party IR's so I was astounded to hear how good you got the stock IR sounding. But that's only my opinion. Great job!
Now I actually understand what you mean by saying the feel on the hi gain settings on the Helix.... This is exactly what I have noticed with lacking dynamics, tone feel and the Pick attack response to it...... Surprisingly I was much more Happier With the Zoom G5n when it comes to the tone feel and response Ahhhhhh Damn 😪😪😪😪 I shouldn't have got the helix It's a big shame for Line 6.. Please do make a review on Ax8 aswell bro,, I am definitely not happy with the Helix😪
This just showed up in my feed. I could not agree with you more. Line6 Seems to agree with you as well as the last major updates have included high caliber high gain amp models. The newest update will include the Revv. I think what Line6 did was give EVERYONE a great tone. Country, blues rock, worship, alt rock, hard rock, and yes, metal. If you add a great IR: 3sigma is excellent and easier to work with than Ownhammer; or add Glenn Fricker's IR set, you have a crunch machine. Of course the helix will never replace a mesa (every mesa sounds different anyway; so a even a mesa can't replace a mesa). ONE MAJOR TWEAK that helped me was the use of EQ/BOOST before any gain pedal or amp. I believe if you began to work with pre amp and pre distortion pedal eq as tone modifiers and boosts, you could get the tones you want without the external gear. You may already be doing that; all though I suspect not. Jon Symmons does that with almost every crushing tone he gets and I learned it from him. Just my opinion: I felt like everyone of the tones you got sat very well in the mix. I would challenge anyone to identify them without the written cue. Glenn Fricker did an awesome video comparing amps and amp sims. The amp sim one. Long story short, I am impressed with your honesty, impressed with your skill and now I subscribe to you. Excellent , informative video. Thank you. -----Ben
Thank you Ben! Great points too. In the past when I used the helix for my all in one sound, I used the Precision drive pedal for my overdrive. Huge difference. I'm glad line 6 is doing the Revv! I hope it's everything it's cracked up to be. I'm about to review the SinMix helix metal pack. So far, it's the closest thing to good high gain tones
@@TONEWARSgearshow can I send you some tones that I have done. You will need the Owhammer HH2 pack, but I am sure you alteady have it. I am considering selling presets and would love your feedback.
I thought you was using a EVH 5150 III 50W 6L6. I saw that in your video comparing the evh EL34 vs 6L6. At the end we all love the tube amps, if not the modeler don't exist and don't try to recreates all the good stuff about tube and dynamics. I have a AX8 and is very good. I using with my EVH 5150 III 100w and sounds really Good but I was thinking to my the friedman Asc-10 because I would like to have a FRFR speaker and see if work good.
That amp belongs to a friend of mine. Eventually, I will buy an amplifier and keep it at the house to keep myself grounded. Regarding the Friedman ASC 10, I would definitely recommend buying 1. You will love it
TONE WARS yeah the axe fx iii is light years better than an old axe fx. I would recommend axe fx but they lose their value really quickly because it’s just technology and technology always devalues. Also at least in my experience ax fx ii and older is confusing to use. I heard axe fx iii is easier and lets you reamp your guitars. Which I thought was awesome. cheers! 😊 I’m currently frustrated and wanna throw my axe fx ii XL out the damn window, but that’s just me :D
Dang, I guessed it - the Kemper. Ha ha! Man, I appreciate what you've been doing. Allow me to share my personal revelation, so to speak. I had been practicing a lot with the HX Stomp (great product, praise Line 6 for that marvel) until approx. two weeks ago. My fave patches at the time were the Engl and the Mesa-based ones (stock, or stock with minimal tweaking). Then, I powered back my Atomic Amplifire 6 (curiosity) and decided to go with a few stock patches. Jarrod, literally all of them sounded better, notably better! Some of them sounded almost exactly like an amp - the response and dynamic ranget. There's something about the Helix dynamic range and that top-end fizz; it does not convince me enough, and I always, I man always feel awkward playing it - my mind tells me that someone's cheating it, LOL. I am sure you can get it far better with deep-dive editing. This guy does not have the time for that, sorry! Side note, one will hardly fell the difference in the mix and I am so glad that you've included that in the video. Anyway, I am building a mimi-board based around a pair of preamps. Modelling is cool, but does not excite me as much as cranked amp. I have tried it, and it ain't for me in the long run. Thanks & rock on, brutha!
Thank you for sharing your experience with everyone. Helix in 4cm is amazing. It's just ok as a tone machine. I've heard great things about the Atomic. I have to try it out
Great video, this was the reason I sold my helix. Now I run my real tubes in longer IR's and better effects. Line6 should make poweramp models for your Synergy's ;)
With just Helix, I could hear that ANNOYING digital high gain fizzle that drives me f’n nuts. Sorry but I couldn’t use Helix in that manner at all; the IRs and Overdrives were better than that imo.
Everyone has a different ear for what they like....That being said, I am not going to pay $2000 for a Helix when my HD500 sounds just fine.....(stand alone) Plus, if it breaks, I can buy another off EBAY for $200.
I've had a blast creating modern metal tones in the Helix. My go-to is the Badonk. I can't seem to get away from it. I do use Ownhammer IR's. The Helix is bad ass. Great video man!
That precision drive is a beast!
I would love to see a comparison of the modern metal tone that you created (which kicks ass, I must say) and the Kemper tone in this vid. The Helix can FOR SURE create great modern metal tones, it just seems this vid didn't dial in a great one.
This is a fantastic video and perfectly sums up how I've felt about helix in the past. I too nearly bought a kemper. BUT to anyone who has watched this and is/was put off helix, they're definitely worth checking out.
I myself had a similar journey with helix to this guy, I had a big rig and pedalboard etc, sold all that and went purely helix, but next to the other guitarist in my band at the time, who has a victory kraken, I just always felt like it lacked something. So I too went over to a helix with a preamp and power amp, in my case this was a victory V4 Kraken Pre-Amp and a Cornford roadhouse 30 6L6 combo as a power amp and cab. I then found that I still was missing something, so I started using an overdrive pedal, and before I knew it I was basically back where I started, so I was going to sell the Helix and buy a kemper because I "knew" I would be able to get a great modern metal tone with it, because everyone on RUclips says so!
Then just before I pulled the trigger on a kemper stage, I heard 3 bands that were using helix exclusively for guitar tones; Valis Ablaze, the human veil and a local band called DLVRR and they all sounded sick so I decided the issue wasn't the helix, it was me. I spoke to the guy from DLVRR and he put my onto Nick Hill's videos and low and behold, I copied what he did and it sounded sick, so I sold everything else and threw myself into properly learning the Helix.
1 year later, I've now sold all my gear including my helix rack and replaced it with 2 overdrive pedals and 2 HX stomps (pedal form factor helix.) now I've got killer tone and everything I could possibly need on a 600x300mm lightweight pedalboard 🔥
To be perfectly fair most mix and record at home guitarist HAVE probably owned a kemper (myself included). It is touted (and is) as one of the greatest tone carving ingredients in a mix especially for high gain tone-genre-specific metal. But I by no means would call it superior (or any less) than a Helix. So many guitarist like myself looking for a high gain tone have found even better options and sculpting methods with the helix. So many have swapped the kemper out as their main unit. This video is a very great reprensentation of what both can normally do out of the box but by no means does it show the multitude and extensive ways you can carve a tone with both. Who did it better. Well I suppose you'll have to try-em both out and listen by ear. Of the many guitarist who use Kemper do too are the many (popularly followed) youtubers who have made astonishing tracks (and albums with the Helix.
To me its amazing enough that the so-assumed line 6 could build such a quality machine for less the price.
If the Helix was available at the same time the Kemper came to market though I would have honestly chose the Kemper. So many Line 6 products became a laughing stock by then and any guitarist would have known to choose the prior.
Btw your channel is gaining real momentum mate, good quality content.
Thank you! I'm really enjoying doing this
So glad your intro song was leveled, nice :)
I think this is fair enough, and I am a very happy Helix user, but not a modern high gain player. I think what the big takeaway is how Line 6 have done such a great job of allowing users to configure the unit to work for them, whatever you do, whatever you play, whatever you have. The Helix will fit into that and make life a whole lot easier.
Good video. I've also had the Helix for a few years (since 1st shipment) and my experiences are similar. I'm good with Helix only for everything except high gain. For that, I go 4 cable into a REVV Generator 7-40 Mk II and Mesa 2x12 Recto Cab. That sounds brutal. I'm definitely looking forward to update 2.8 for the Helix since it will have the REVV Generator 120 model.
Yo Darrell, thanks for commenting. I think I was the first person to get the helix in Michigan. (At least one of the first people)
I think the Revv model (in the helix) will still lack in feel, fullness and aggression like all the other models do.
I really believe they know that. That's why they're reluctant to do more high gain models. They need to fix the algorithm or something in the software to address this. Kemper did and their tones sound better than a few years ago
Most impulse responses are just basically an Eq, and that is why they don't feel dynamic. It's called "dynamic impulse response", look it up and you will realize why most of these systems which make music more convenient are missing the connection to your brain and body that you get when playing a real speaker in a room. This one fact is why I haven't plunged more money into a new system with current IR technology. My research found that the sheer amount of processing to pull this trick off digitally would be astronomical and super expensive. I think aside from having to mic a room, you would also have to figure out how to mic and maybe even take pressure reading of the inner side of the cabinet, and cross-reference all that data with the Kemper style sine sweep. (Guessing)
I do however use a real amp and a Two Notes Torpedo live, which is now on two mics and moving up two 2048 samples, which I for some reason that it was already on but I guess not.
I would love to see your thoughts on a real amp through one.
@@torchlord11 if I get ahold of that gear, I'll definitely check it out.
Something ive noticed with playing my Kemper thru a Friedman ASC 12 is that I actually do get that air push bouncy feel. Have you tried one?
@@TONEWARSgearshow No I have not, my gear buying has been limited since I've been saving for another car. I saw one being sold on Facebook Market place for a good price, bought couldn't pull the trigger.
I decided to just stick with my Coreblade tube amp and Port City Os Wave cabinet, which I'm pretty happy with. I wasn't ecstatic that a tube went bad on me and I didn't know the TSC took that tube out of the circuit.
I wouldn't mind trying one out but I'm guessing my Axe Fx Ultra probably wouldn't be up to the task sounding that great. I've considered getting one and using it, so I could use all the cabinets for the Torpedo Live.
Thanks for a great vid and really glad you included the sounds combined in a mix because honestly, yes you can still hear the difference, but to a much lesser extent and more importantly they were all good sounding mixes, so the question then becomes how big is your budget
Been looking at going with a helix and just a 2x12 cab for home and practice use. Sounds damn good
You would also need a power amp, Electro Harmonix has a 44w Power Amp pedal for only 150 bucks however. If you get lucky, you could get one for pretty cheap
Great video as always dude. I use my Helix with OH IRs and clearly (at least for me) sound much better. I’m not a High gain guy anymore, now just more like a mid gain guy. For me (and my budget) I have what I need right know. Keep going! Your channel is very helpful!
Thank you so much
Actually I have to say, I disagree, you can make it sound really amazing as a high gain, stand-alone unit. You just have to add some post-EQ and a high cut at about 8-10 kHz, and you will get the same tone out of it as a kemper. Dual cabs also help
Hi, can you share an example of the tone? I tried to have a really heavy tone with the HX stomp
Bertrand Comeau check out Nick Hill
Hey another strong Vid. I appreciate the hard work and quality. It takes a lot of hard work to attain your level of talent as well as the time for video editing and production. Good to see your channel gaining momentum. I was wondering if you are setting the amps up in the Helix with the Master all the way up and brining in the pre amps to taste. Give me an idea of the gain settings here, with the amp, pedal combo. I'm a non master volume old school plexi guy, with the TS 808 in the front. I'm curious here for tone reference, Thanks again!
Thank you for the kind words!! The master was at 6 the 808 settings are as follows
Volume 10
Tone 5
Gain 0
Thank you Kindly. Just a suggestion, try an experiment with a Marshall 1959 with the master on 10 dial in the tightest most gain you can while rolling the bottom. Now bring in the screamer start with level 4, tone to taste and gain 6 and up. You should get a tight Fortin Nameless tone without flub, fizz and be real close. Also try an exernal drive pedal in front of the Helix. Crazy as it sounds, responds as an amp does! If you need 'more' try the JCM800, 2000 as well as a hot EQ as a boost, strip the 0-200HZ like Fortin does. That said still love your tones. Cheers!
You have me re thinking everything. Should I get a Seymour Duncan Powerstage to run with Mesa cab or save up and get my dream amp, a Mesa Triple Crown and run 4 cable method?? Hmm
From what I've heard the Powerstage has clipping issues. I would get something else.
Also, there's other digital platforms that might have a great version of your dream amp
In person Kemper sounds solid state to me , helix sounds like a well polished pod, I wonder what the big difference hardware wise is between the helix and the ax8
It really depends on what profiles you're using. Some are horrible and some are amazing and then there's everything in between
If I may ask, did you use any post amp EQ on the Helix patches? I've found that you can get a much smoother high gain tone with a low pass set at around 5-6k, as well as cutting a db or two with a relatively wide Q at around 3/4k with a parametric EQ. Obviously that does nothing to change the playing response, but it tames the high end fizz incredibly well. I do strongly agree that the third party IRs make a colossal difference against the stock cabs though.
Good question. I did a low cut in the IR around 90 and I cut the highs to around 10k
@@TONEWARSgearshow I've found that I've had to be pretty brutal with the low pass to get a smoother high gain tone (everything above 6k is just fizz). You can definitely get into the same tonal ballpark as the Kemper with the Helix, it just takes a fair amount of tweaking. Thankfully the Helix comes with all the necessary tools to do so (except for the 3rd party IRs of course).
@@McDylbot I hear you on that. There's still two major things missing with the helix regarding high gain tones- dimension and feel. It's two dimensional as opposed to three dimensional like the Kemper. The strings feel like rusty, old strings on the helix as opposed to Kemper.
Jared! What's up man? For me, I liked the stock helix tones best of the three. I've listened three times to be sure I'm not biasing myself. Personally, I'm not a mega gain metal guy. I'm more of a rock player. Live, I only use hss strats, so I do have trouble getting a metal tone for when I do need it. I appreciate your approach to it though. I have found with the helix, I like to add a dual cab, same cab on both but one with a bright dynamic mic and one with a dark condenser. Then, ill sum that to mono using the mic pre with the gain under 5 and the volume raised. Then I'll use Jason Sadites LA compressor. I find those two make all the difference in the world. I have all the free Redwirez and Ownhammer IR's, I prefer the stock cabs personally. That's a rare opinion in the helix world, but thats what works for me.
Btw... I'd really love to get a download of your song!
Hello Aaron! Here's the link to our songs on Spotify
open.spotify.com/artist/4PSV9RlO0FByd7AV2ULm0h?si=7t3_BSGOSN2At32ZBYLJ6A
I'm so glad that the helix works for you and you found sounds that you really like.
I think that the helix is the best product out there and 4 cable method. It has a lot to offer and the routing and switching capabilities are unmatched.The fx are also very good.
They just need to fix the amp modeling so that it sounds more realistic and Fuller and more aggressive. If they can do that they would have a top notch product in every category
@aaron kerr - The Kemper sounds were slightly better overall than the Helix only and the Helix with IR's added. But I preferred the Helix only over the Helix with IR's in this video.
Hey Jarrod,how do you feel the FX in the Helix compares to the Kemper,or an AxeIII??I have never gotten on with the Helix amp models either..
Hello Scott. I think the fx are very comparable. I really have nothing bad to say about the helix fx.
Idk? Ask Ola Englund he did the Same video 3 years ago and sounded awesome! Build 2.81 sounds and feels better by the way using Mikko sound labs cab ir's,
He also got a paycheck from Line 6 for doing that.
Some opinions can be bought
They didn't buy my opinion I thought it sounded great and yea I get a great metal tones out of helix if I had tons of cash I'd have the real amps but this works for me.
I went to a Helix for an axefx2 setup just to try it before most likely moving to a Kemper or an AXEFX3 and the second I got it I told people it doesn’t feel right when you “dig into it” with a pick. So I hear you when you described it exactly the same way. I love everything about the Helix floor unit because it’s all in one but I struggle with that “feel” part. I own a ridiculous about of actual amps also so I have lots to compare will. Oddly, the only amp I feel like you can dig into on the helix that feels the best is the Badonk or whatever that one is that’s the new Big Bottom from the older L6 products.
Thank you very much for commenting. That Badonk is actually a pretty good amp model
And you're right. The feel is so important I couldn't believe the difference after not playing the helix for many months. When I came back to it I felt like I was playing 20 year old rusty strings
Great tones man, I hit subscribe. I'm a new helix user and i was wondering - when recording at home vs playing through FRFR > where do you set the main helix volume control? I seem to be pushing it to 12 o clock and it somehow becomes a bit shrill at home even with IRs and all sorts of hi/lo cuts. Planning to use an FRFR with band soon.
I think you should try to equalize tone on Helix using few eq before and after preamp. There is so many options that helps you to hit the point
Helix changed a whole lot in couple of last updates. Throw in some ML Studio Lab Mesa IRs and put it against a Kemper. I dare you to do that. :)
I'll take that dare
TONE WARS Cool! Can’t wait for your opinion on that :)
If havent heard charles caswell of berried alive you may want to check him out his tones are the most sickest and modern as it gets and used podhd 500x now the helix standalone..
Can you clarify, if you have one of these modeling pedalboards, can they be played through an actual guitar cab without going through an amp? What about the FRFR speakers? Are they stand along (along with the board that is) or do you still need an amp head as well?
Good questions. You need a power amp (tube or solid state) to run these digital platforms to a passive cab. There are many great, compact options to choose from.
The FRFR cab is self powered and is a stand alone product.
I hope this helps
Thanks so much! I’ve been researching these a bit over the last few weeks. It seems like the Friedman FRFR is the way to go. For the pedalboard, the Helix and Headrush seem comparable. I’m a metal player, could you recommend one over the other?
@@JFRiley honestly, if you're a metal guy, Kemper is the best option hands down. Between the Helix and the Headrush? Go helix
what Synergy Modules are you using?
That's pretty much what it does best, imo. If it didn't have the built in dirt options; I would feel much differently. The drives are what make it feel more "realistic". To me at least. Which is what makes it a little less enjoyable for me on the lower gain amp(s) side of things.
Are you referring to the helix or the Kemper?
@@TONEWARSgearshow the Helix. For Marshall stuff and most any mid gain stuff; other platforms are better for me.
The mystery tone sounded double tracked or like it had a doubled effect in stereo, the helix struggles with high gain , it can match the kemper but it takes more tweaking added effects and eq'ing and processing power
Both products were recorded in stereo. The Kemper sounds double tracked Compared to the helix because it's much Fuller, fatter and more aggressive. The tone is much richer.
I feel the same about the helix i like my ax8 better for my metal tones, its about how the unit responds than the helix and i love the helix but for different stuff, to intégrate the variax for my cover band works great.
If you have a chance, check out these tone match patch tutorials from Ryan at PSS. In this collection is a brutal one for the Fortin Nameless and others you may enjoy. Very flexible and well done. He does very good work. Enjoy.ruclips.net/p/PLFf4WCqq3Aa0V2OVcD4vEmIhQdgykS_uN
Thanks for the review dude! I couldn't wait to see it & you never disappoint man! When side by side you can absolutely hear the lack of balls from the Helix. And so nobody starts ripping me, yes I own the Helix LT & still love it! But you certainly can not argue with these sound clips. I'm an 80's guitarist. Grew up in the absolutely best time ever to be one as well. So with 90% of what I'm playing the Helix LT through my Friedman ASC12 is a killer rig! Here's the but we all knew was coming. When playing Trivium for example, I'm just missing something & this video proves my initial thought. I too had a huge rig with my Marshall JCM800 model 2205 & a full rack of effects. That rig kills but I want to down size & retire gear that is irreplaceable. The Helix LT was my first choice but the Kemper is INCREDIBLE! GAS never stops & I'm now leaning towards the Synergy rack with stereo power supply & the Helix in 4CM. Looks like it's back to more gear but as guitarists half the fun is the GAS that never sleeps & you can NEVER have too much equipment!! Thanks again! I'll keep you posted on what I decide to go with. Keep doing the good stuff!!!!!!! 🤘😁🤘
@Poopy Productions That's crazy man! I love mine! The Helix rocks well absolutely & can get some brutal sounds but have you tried any Synergy stuff?? Engl module, Diezel module & more are just incredible! The tools available today blow my mind! There are so many choices & 98% sound pretty good with a lot of the modelling stuff nearly indistinguishable from the actual gear it's modelling! I only wish this stuff was available back when I first started playing! Keep doing the good stuff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!🤘😁🤘
Great video! I just wanted to comment that I liked the Helix Only with the Scream 808 and built in CAB IR the most for the mixed song.. it just fit better. It let the bass guitar and low end of the drums come through. Personally I love my HX Stomp and third party IR's so I was astounded to hear how good you got the stock IR sounding. But that's only my opinion. Great job!
Thank you!!
Now I actually understand what you mean by saying the feel on the hi gain settings on the Helix.... This is exactly what I have noticed with lacking dynamics, tone feel and the Pick attack response to it...... Surprisingly I was much more Happier With the Zoom G5n when it comes to the tone feel and response
Ahhhhhh Damn 😪😪😪😪 I shouldn't have got the helix
It's a big shame for Line 6..
Please do make a review on Ax8 aswell bro,, I am definitely not happy with the Helix😪
Man I got rid of my helix around the same time you did. Got an Atomic Amplifire and in my opinion it's much better. Fewer options albeit
Helix is best as a 4cm unit. The tone, feel, fullness and response just aren't there
This just showed up in my feed. I could not agree with you more. Line6 Seems to agree with you as well as the last major updates have included high caliber high gain amp models. The newest update will include the Revv. I think what Line6 did was give EVERYONE a great tone. Country, blues rock, worship, alt rock, hard rock, and yes, metal. If you add a great IR: 3sigma is excellent and easier to work with than Ownhammer; or add Glenn Fricker's IR set, you have a crunch machine. Of course the helix will never replace a mesa (every mesa sounds different anyway; so a even a mesa can't replace a mesa). ONE MAJOR TWEAK that helped me was the use of EQ/BOOST before any gain pedal or amp. I believe if you began to work with pre amp and pre distortion pedal eq as tone modifiers and boosts, you could get the tones you want without the external gear. You may already be doing that; all though I suspect not. Jon Symmons does that with almost every crushing tone he gets and I learned it from him. Just my opinion: I felt like everyone of the tones you got sat very well in the mix. I would challenge anyone to identify them without the written cue. Glenn Fricker did an awesome video comparing amps and amp sims. The amp sim one. Long story short, I am impressed with your honesty, impressed with your skill and now I subscribe to you. Excellent , informative video. Thank you. -----Ben
Thank you Ben! Great points too. In the past when I used the helix for my all in one sound, I used the Precision drive pedal for my overdrive. Huge difference. I'm glad line 6 is doing the Revv! I hope it's everything it's cracked up to be.
I'm about to review the SinMix helix metal pack. So far, it's the closest thing to good high gain tones
@@TONEWARSgearshow can I send you some tones that I have done. You will need the Owhammer HH2 pack, but I am sure you alteady have it. I am considering selling presets and would love your feedback.
I thought you was using a EVH 5150 III 50W 6L6. I saw that in your video comparing the evh EL34 vs 6L6. At the end we all love the tube amps, if not the modeler don't exist and don't try to recreates all the good stuff about tube and dynamics. I have a AX8 and is very good. I using with my EVH 5150 III 100w and sounds really Good but I was thinking to my the friedman Asc-10 because I would like to have a FRFR speaker and see if work good.
That amp belongs to a friend of mine. Eventually, I will buy an amplifier and keep it at the house to keep myself grounded.
Regarding the Friedman ASC 10, I would definitely recommend buying 1. You will love it
i prefer the old hd500's metal tones compared to the Helix. they're a bit darker
What does IR mean?
Impulse response
Thanks. I was debating getting a Helix for a few months but now I'll pass. All the best.
You lost something dude!
I still prefer the axe fx over a kemper and kemper over helix.
Thanks for commenting. I must try the Axe fx!! I tried the Ax8 and loathed it. I heard the AX III is awesome
TONE WARS yeah the axe fx iii is light years better than an old axe fx. I would recommend axe fx but they lose their value really quickly because it’s just technology and technology always devalues. Also at least in my experience ax fx ii and older is confusing to use. I heard axe fx iii is easier and lets you reamp your guitars. Which I thought was awesome. cheers! 😊 I’m currently frustrated and wanna throw my axe fx ii XL out the damn window, but that’s just me :D
@@silverdragon0000120 have you tried the Synergy stuff? Compact, lightweight, tons of options and sounds incredible
TONE WARS no I haven’t. Never knew they existed lol will definitely check out tho.
@@silverdragon0000120 ive done several reviews of their products. Feel free to check them out. Salvation Audio is also affiliated
Play to a click please!!!
Dang, I guessed it - the Kemper. Ha ha! Man, I appreciate what you've been doing.
Allow me to share my personal revelation, so to speak. I had been practicing a lot with the HX Stomp (great product, praise Line 6 for that marvel) until approx. two weeks ago. My fave patches at the time were the Engl and the Mesa-based ones (stock, or stock with minimal tweaking). Then, I powered back my Atomic Amplifire 6 (curiosity) and decided to go with a few stock patches. Jarrod, literally all of them sounded better, notably better! Some of them sounded almost exactly like an amp - the response and dynamic ranget. There's something about the Helix dynamic range and that top-end fizz; it does not convince me enough, and I always, I man always feel awkward playing it - my mind tells me that someone's cheating it, LOL. I am sure you can get it far better with deep-dive editing. This guy does not have the time for that, sorry! Side note, one will hardly fell the difference in the mix and I am so glad that you've included that in the video.
Anyway, I am building a mimi-board based around a pair of preamps. Modelling is cool, but does not excite me as much as cranked amp. I have tried it, and it ain't for me in the long run.
Thanks & rock on, brutha!
Thank you for sharing your experience with everyone. Helix in 4cm is amazing. It's just ok as a tone machine. I've heard great things about the Atomic. I have to try it out
Great video, this was the reason I sold my helix. Now I run my real tubes in longer IR's and better effects. Line6 should make poweramp models for your Synergy's ;)
With just Helix, I could hear that ANNOYING digital high gain fizzle that drives me f’n nuts. Sorry but I couldn’t use Helix in that manner at all; the IRs and Overdrives were better than that imo.
Mario OR, I’ll just keep using my tube amp and have great tones without fucking with stupid settings like that 😎 “dum dum”
Man just play everyone is so picky and the funny thing is... y’all act all picky just to play cover songs. Bajajajsjaja Get lost
Everyone has a different ear for what they like....That being said, I am not going to pay $2000 for a Helix when my HD500 sounds just fine.....(stand alone) Plus, if it breaks, I can buy another off EBAY for $200.
Fizzzzzzzy
? For the Win! LOL
Figures it was the Kemper.
No, not realistic enough
Helix sounds LEGIT though
It's a good product for sure.