Grenfell firefighter in tears as footage of tower played to inquiry
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- Опубликовано: 25 июн 2018
- Michael Dowden, who yesterday admitted to being out of his 'comfort zone' dealing with the fire, was shown clips shot by members of the public and was questioned as part of the ongoing inquiry into the tragic incident which killed more than 70 people last year. Shortly after the lunch break earlier today, Dowden was shown a particularly distressing video of a person shouting 'get out of the tower'. The footage, shot by a member of the public at around 1.20am, showed the flames engulfing the cladding outside the building. Dowden (left) was seen turning his head away from the television screen which showed the horrific scenes (right).
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The fact that this Watch Manager (Station Officer in my day) was left in charge of a fire like this for over an hour is an absolute disgrace which leaves me lost for words. There must have been shed loads of very senior officers on megabucks salaries hiding behind every bush and wheelie bin in Kensington. This needs investigation.😡
Tom Bowen, Absolutely 100% correct, it seems like the usual, senior managerial hierarchy pushing responsibility downhill, any right minded person following these proceedings will suspect scapegoating.
Well said 👍🏻
@Carron Gibson I hope he knows how many people don’t blame him. While people should have be told to leave when it was getting out of control the ultimate blame lies with the morons that put and allowed flammable material on a building…not just a high rise, but ANY building people frequent. I have so much respect for the LFB and firefighters all over the World.
The already seems like a cover-up where the fire brigade is being blamed for not changing a well-established procedure for fighting high-rise fires. My understanding is that the stay put policy is fundamental to the way that firefighters train to fight fires in high-rise buildings. When the building was built it was safe with suitable fire breaks and fire doors to contain a fire to one flat. The enquiry needs to focus on those responsible for the changes both internally and externally to the building.
To say that the stay put policy should have been changed makes it sound like an easy decision. How would it be organised? Would firefighters have to visit every flat to escort residents out?
I don't think it's working, if that's their intention. The firefighters I've heard so far have made it clear that stay put is not the LFB's rule, but the policy of the individual property owner. LFB uses it as guidance. In all cases, if the compartment is compromised, it should be evacuated. If the compartment is intact but the way out is impassable, they should stay inside the compartment, regardless of any stay put policy. These are both FSG situations (fire safety & guidance), to whom stay put doesn't apply. The only people affected by any stay put policy, as DAC Andrew O'Loughlin testified, are those whose compartments are not compromised and the way out is clear, and in any case, all readings of the stay put option describe it as guidance, not a regulation. Escaping building occupants must be permitted, accommodated, and helped if necessary.
What changed at about 2:45 AM (I think that's the time) is the group with intact compartments but smoke-logged escape routes, or fire in their escape routes. That is not related to stay put. That is FSG. Those people were told to evacuate if at all possible. Stay put had been canceled long before then, but the change didn't make much difference. People who were already safe were told to take the exit that was already known to be safe.
I knew nothing about any of this before watching the hearings, and this much has become obvious to me. But a writer for The Sun will find a way to blame someone if they're determined.
Mr Millett is a disgrace to try to place blame on any of the LFB for their attempts on the night. The only guilty parties here are the people who performed the shoddy work and those who paid for.
They were under equipped though, and there should of been appliances stationed closer with longer ladders. i was watching the footage live and remember the first lot turning up and they were mostly doing crowd control because their hoses werent doing anything as they were 5-10 minutes too late to catch it .
So much respect for these firefighters, They did the best with what they had
I wonder how many innocent civilians world-wide have lost their lives in unserviced, or poorly constructed buildings.
A future of a deployed operational in a fire service to be a legacy of a tower to increaes a effect of a fire service to protect life.A thought for all persons as fire service or a service deployed on a night.
Still makes me feel sick that fingers were pointed at these incredible men after the disaster.
Have the firefighters not done enough?
They were put in an impossible situation, It pisses me off how people blame the firefighters, None of this would of happened if it wasn't for the council
Pringle hasn’t a bloody clue about Grenfell . I wonder what he does for a living? He seems to resent the FRS.
This is all wrong! Why is the media looking to blame? I have spent many years living in developing countries. whenever i moved into a new high-rise apartment, the first thing I did was check out the emergency escape routes - always. a bus - emergency escape, how many people nowadays in developed countries check out and practise emergency escape routes anywhere? When things turn bad, use your instincts!
This is poor building regulations and negligent TMO, not the fire service, who did their absolute best in the face of disaster. And Jenrick has just let developers do what they want even more. Thousands still living in ACM clad blocks but Jenrick happy to ignore it all and take the money. Disgusting government and despicable of them to deflect blame onto the fire service.
I think hero is pronounced like it is in heroin.
Early faults by the fire brigade command resulted in the deaths.
Firstly who sent the fire brigade back to the station after they thought they had put out the initial fire in the kitchen when it was still a live fire situation.
Then there is the stay put order, when it is always advisable to vacate a fire situation.
I have seen the fire brigade deal with a fire, then left, then the fire started up again as it had not been properly extinguished, exactly the same as Grenfell.
I have also been involved in a block of flats fire ( two stairs ) where we in the unaffected stair were evacuated 25 minutes after the fire brigade were called out. But then again that was when they realised that there was no water in the fire hydrant and it would take another 35 minutes for them to connect a fire hose from a half mile away, and the fire had by that time jumped through the 4 top flats.
My personal experience of the fire brigade.
"Then there is the stay put order, when it is always advisable to vacate a fire situation."
Nonsense. You clearly don't know anything about it.
72 people died because of the stay put order, and you think that that is OK.
Probably no one would have died if evacuation had been called for at the start of the fire.
They did as they were trained fire doors would of helped. Fire resistant cladding would too. Good story Brian about something non related or of any use. As a fire commander I’m sure you would of done better in a situation this country has never seen before. Sit down and shut up!!
We are not talking about fire doors or fire resistant cladding or their training you idiot.
From your reply I can only assume that you yourself work in the fire brigade and are attempting to cover up for the gross faults of the fire brigade with regards to the Grenfell tragedy.
My stories show how this is not the first time that they have left a fire scene of a fire whilst its still active, nor the first time that they delayed evacuation.
You can bet now that instant evacuation will be the training as opposed to leaving people to die whilst they try to contain the fire, with fire always assume the worst can happen and did happen at Grenfell.
I personally always had the greatest respect for the fire brigade until I seen first hand them at work.
How about washing the windows of a second story flat whilst the fire raged on the third story, yes I have seen them do that.
I should point out that I think that the some of the fire fighters are incredibly brave going into burning properties, but it appears that the higher ranks are not up to scratch.
bryan pringle not a fire man you idiot. Just a person that understands that lower ranked officers do as they are told which was in a high rise residents stay in their property until safe. Would you prefer no plan and officers going in and others running out causing more chaos in a chaotic situation? He is not to blame. Yes higher ranks are fire brigade council etc. Not one man following orders
If you're going to wear rank and 'be in charge' then you have to be accountable. He should have realised he was out of his depth and moved it up the chain. Because he failed to do this, he failed those who died and should immediately resign. Whether he was trained in high rise evacs is not the question..... lets face it telling people to remain in a burning building is ludicrous and actually does not require training...more common sense. A man's mettle is quickly tested in these circumstances.
Don't be ridiculous.
Soothing Sounds, With the benefit of hindsight we’re all heroes, this bloke is being scapegoated. He needs our full support, not finger pointing & blame.
Where were the top dogs he’s not high ranking he’s a family man doing as he’s told. You think he wanted anyone to die. Grow up look elsewhere to blame
First, he could not move it up the line. It is the responsibility of a more senior rank to take over from him. This should have happened after make pumps 6, not 20. Of course he was out of his depth at a fire of this scale. That’s why the LFB spends many millions employing and training senior command ranks, none of whom stepped up to the mark. Disgrace.
Second, the ops procedures for flats and maisonettes clearly indicate that full evacuations should not be undertaken in such premises due to the internal compartmentation arrangements and danger of evac to residents and firefighting ops. You need to read the design code CP3 Chap4 Pt1 1971 for an explanation - it’s not my job to educate idiots.
Lastly isn’t it a shame we don’t all have your “mettle”. Sadly, the biggest lump of metal is between your ears.
Tom Bowen thank you. So sick of arm chair experts. Please keep saying what your saying. Mikes a good man.