Whoa, so many posts making recommendations based on almost no data. Wasted energy and fear-mongering! The test will give you information to determine your next step, if any need be taken. Maybe no concern other than keeping the oil levels under observation. Every vehicle has trade-off issues, and folks stroke their own egos by presenting themselves as wise, based on nothing of substance, or at best an irrelevant anecdote.
I agree here. If your van is running well otherwise and all you need to do is add oil to keep it happy then nothing wrong with status quo. If there was some major mechanical issue that was causing detrimental damage to the engine then that's a different story. If you're used to your routine maintenance schedule then stick with it.
Good points. By the time the catalytic converter(s) are damaged, any warranty will be long expired! Then it's on you to pay for the repairs if you decide to keep the car.
I have 4 of these vans bought 2016-2020 for our business. Our 2018 consumes about a quart every 1500-2000, the others do not consume any oil. They have been very reliable with the only problems were early failure of the cooling fan replaced under recall on the 2016s and a headlight wiring problem (wires on pass side burn out). Dealer wanted about 1400.00 to replace harness, electric shop nearby charged me about 75.00 to rewire bad part!. The control arms on the front suspension go bad at about 120,000 miles, which seems about right for a front drive vehicle with lots of stop/go driving. Brakes are lasting about 50,000. The 2016s both have about 150,000 miles and run just as I bought them new so I expect I could get 300-400k. We also service the tranny about every 50k and apart from being a bit quirky they are pretty bulletproof and actually fun to drive. They have a great suspension, handle and drive well.
Not one person would blame you a bit. Relax. It’s not your fault that these big car manufacturers cut corners. We all deal with it. You are innocent. And your channel will always be an inspiration. Thanks for sharing this issue, we can trust you to lay it all out there for us. Happy trails. ❤️ Susan.
Well...if you were in Florida and you decided to get the test. I have a suite used for guests. In the case that you might have to replace the engine, you could use the suite and have less worries. Don’t stress ! I love your stress free days.
Honestly, I was a little stressed at first. But now having a bit more knowledge, I am feeling much better. Thanks for the offer! Very kind of you. I kind of feel like I might have missed my window for visiting Florida this year. But... anything is possible.
No modern engine with under 100k miles should burn/use ANY oil. That "1 quart of oil usage per a thousand miles" is nuts. General rule of thumb. An engine is worn out if it burns/uses one quart of oil at each oil change. Get the test done! The recall notice will give you legal protections.
Seems a lot of oil usage to me also. I have a 16 year old X-Trail diesel we also run a 22 year old Yaris as a runabout. The X-Trail does 6.5 to 7K miles a year. Over 4.5k a year towing a 1.5 tonne caravan. I check the oil before our main 3 trips a year. Never low.. oil replaced at annual service.
That's not true at all. For example, Honda is beginning to use 0w-16 and Subaru is using 0w-20 on a boxer engine. A quart of usage or more between oil changes has become normal once again. We became spoiled from the 5w-30 and 10w-30 era which is the magic usage to mpg zone.
Thanks MUCH for the post, video and share! I can understand your concern, and as others have pointed out and said, I would do the test, and I don;t think it would harm you or the engine. BUT it is unfortunate not to get answers from FCA about what happen IF consupmtion during the test on a bad engine, cause failure. All the BEST to you, and as you pointed out, for the most part ithe Van has served you well for over 5 years. Cheers! :)
I have a 2016 ProMaster City with over 246,000 miles. Since I got it I've been using a quart of oil every 1500 miles.(about a quart per week.). One solution I found that helps especially in hotter weather is going to the 5 20 oil. That extends me up to 2200 miles for a quart of oil.. and I seem to get better gas mile... Just two to three miles per gallon... But every bit helps.
Larch Larch, I was leaving Atlanta two years ago and a neighbor told me about this place in Ashville that had great Biscuits and fried chicken, so I drove 200 miles out of my way to get a plate. When I left to go North there was a heavy fog coming around those mountains. I would like to go back and stop by Blueridge Adventure Vans near Ashville, plus I'd like to hunt up the "Spoon Lady" in the Square while I eat my biscuits!
It is something we all can learn from. Yes there are people who don't pay attention to their vehicles and there are one's how do. Better to be aware and watch, thank you
My 2020 Ram Promaster City hopefully has none of these issues. I paid $2k extra to get a 5 year or 72k extended warranty from Ram after the one year factory warranty expires.
One of the problems with any warranty is whether or not a particular problem will be covered. My understanding is that Dealerships do not make a profit doing warranty work, and are loath to do them. Another problem is denying there is a problem by saying 'that's normal for that vehicle.' Oil consumption should never be 'normal'. I have a feeling that $2K went down the drain. I hope I'm wrong.
I’ve worked as a technician for Toyota for well over twenty years! This is a test I’ve done many times over the years! Anything under a qt & a half I s now considered normal on aluminum motors between oil changes. If you loose two qts is evidence of a problem! Do the test but It sounds like your engine is within specs! Normally the test can be done again in 6-8 months, so I wouldn’t be to worried if it passes!
That's great advice. I'm about to trade in my car for a 2017 PMC, an even exchange for a 2018 car. They gave me the Carfax, looking into it and showing her to my friend/carer/mechanic. One step closer, "Homer" is parked in front, they gave me the PMC to try. So much space for my mobility devices!
Get the test!! Hyundai is replacing motors under recall also. They are hooking up to Computer while running Diagnosis. And can make decisions within minutes after computer info...Some of them seen replaced have over 100k miles...
Scott, my daughter got a recall notice about two months ago, but I did not have her vin number to put in as the post card required. I don't think she checked it out yet but I will show her your video. I just checked her oil on Monday and it was down a half quart after retuning from Florida via Atlanta. Us Subaru owners with the Boxer engine are used to this. If you travel at speeds on hot summer days you can through a quart in 800 miles like I did helping my daughter move back North from Atlanta. I was driving a U-haul truck and pulled over in South Carolina to wait for them. They had stayed behind to finish cleaning out the apartment, then I got a call that the oil light had come on and they had to get off the road to find an auto supply store as the rest stop places did not have the A-20 oil Subaru's require. Ever since then I carry two quarts onboard. Mine was a 2015 Forrester and this happened in 2018 with about 60,000 miles on it. Keep us informed ! She did have her oil changed on Tuesday!
@@StaticCamperVan She did get the letter when she responded to the card. She is a pretty good driver and doesn't usually go over 65. So we will do the test like you are and keep tabs on the level. She has one 400 mile camping trip to Worlds End in upstate PA. My son lives in Corning, NY and he is going to come down with the granddaughter and camp out for the week. My Subaru I check every thousand miles now. I keep buying lottery tickets so we can get larger Pro-Master 139" from Dave & Matts in Gypsum, Colorado. They keep it simple.
Scott, a late comment to an old video, I went thru the same exact thing with my Kia Sorrento, they do make it tough for you to prove the high oil consumption. Even after it failed their test they took photos of the inside on my engine to make sure it was clean and I had been changing the oil regularly. (Save ALL receipts!) Bottom line, the whole thing took 6/7 months for which time I had a loaner vehicle. They installed a Korean remanufactured engine, NOT A NEW ONE. Now 80k miles later my car is ok with very minimal oil burn. They make it hard for any body that is cursed with one of their faulty engines. Any one going thru this, jump the hoops before the warranty expires which is what they are hoping for.
Sorry to hear that. Chrysler has actually been very good about replacing the faulty engines. The only problem is that there’s never been a fix for the variable valve timing system that is causing the oil consumption. So even though it is a new engine, the problem is going to be back.
They probably wont replace your engine based on your own findings but they may give it a piston ring job which may be able to be done in frame and done fairly fast. 👍👍🌟🌟🌟🌟👍👍
I just saw your vid. My job has 2 City's we use as delivery vehicles. Our 2016 City used a quart of oil in 3 days during mother's day weekend. It was also driven for almost 10 hours a day for those 3 days!
@@StaticCamperVan A few times we have forgot to check the oil and the engine has died on us. After we put 3 quarts in it, it starts right back up. All I can think of why it does that is there is not enough oil flow to run the intake valves since it is the multi-air engine
@Viperman200221 the computer monitors the oil level and if the level drops too low, the computer will shut the engine down. It’s odd, I was told that a scan tool was needed to reset the computer after refilling the level.
@@StaticCamperVan Basically a built-in fail-safe, nice. We have never had to use a scanner to reset the computer. Pour in the oil then it fires up after the 2nd or 3rd try to start it.
Thanks for the heads up, I’m going to have my PMC looked at, as it is up to 60000 miles I’d rather get that engine test done, only because there is an established recall, and it could result in a brand new engine.
Scott, it's important to check your oil regularly, as you do. Kudos to you for that. You may want to know that the engine oil systems are designed so that (under normal driving conditions) operating an engine with up to 1 quart (1 litre) less oil than recommended, will not, by itself cause damage. Not normal driving condition would include,, for example, racing around a track where sustained high g-forces would move the oil away from the oil pickup tube that is located at the bottom of the oil pan. But I don't think you have plans to lap Indy or Daytona in your CamperVan, so you should be good. It's also important to note that overfilling the engine oil past the recommended level - the top line on the dipstick - in itself may cause engine damage. I mention this as some might want to compensate for increased oil consumption by overfilling, which would not be a wise thing to do. Also, don't substitute oil for coffee, or coffee for oil. They are not interchangeable.
I took my promaster city van into the dealer who topped off the oil then "sealed" the engine. Now to put 1500-1700 miles on it then back to the dealer for the next step evaluation.
Good video. I like your sincerity. Any consumption of engine oil for a modern vehicle is not acceptable, no matter what the Dealership or Manufacturer asserts. Maybe if it's a clunker with over 200K miles, but not a new vehicle. My company is leasing a number of these vans. Evidently my management did not do the research and decided on price and gas mileage. In any event, I hope the defect was fixed in production in later models, but I'm not confident. Will have to check the oil level on mine often!
I have a scion XB. These can also be prone to high oil consumption. It is also has one of the most reliable engines Toyota has made. It is 10 years old and has 100k miles. I’ve only ever replaced brakes. No other parts. If it started consuming oil, I would just start topping it up.
Hey there static Unfortunately the oil change is NOT free. They charge for the oil change at the beginning of the test My pmc eats some oil and I do have to add some every 3000 miles or so.. I got the recall and will wait it out for now. Check out the pmc forum online as a sub forum on the Promasterforum.com. Many great threads on this topic with the actual step by step procedure about the engine replacement.. Best of luck Still love my van and my build out..
Hello Scott . we were enjoying your video. as always. regarding your engine well we just purchased a 2019 with 8,000 miles on it . and got a extended warranty on it . good for 5 years or 75000 miles. so since your van is also your home . and your traveling a lot . and driving up mountain s . you probably put more wear tear on your engine . then most people like us who only drive to the. store . and since you have no idea what the future holds . you might want at least consider looking into a extended warranty . just to have some comfort . and so you can have peace of mind . instead of always wondering what's going to happen next . nice video great job .
I have to say i had a 2008 Chrysler Town and Country and it absolutely went like a rocket. I bought it from a second dealer with 63k miles and sold it back to them several years later. I was thinking of vanlife at the time but a van with Windows dont work for me....
I understand you apprehension as it is your home and there's no place like home...l'm sure you'll make the right choice in the end. If it was me l'd do the test, plan a trip that would consume the miles 😊
Thanks Kat. I appreciate your always considerate comments. I was planning on driving through a very remote and mountainous area. I actually searched Google for dealerships in that area. There were none. So, I decided to hang around San Diego instead. All in all, not a bad place to be in the winter.
I had another Chrysler product, a 2002 PT cruiser. I had it for 19 years and only drove it a little less than 70,000 miles. The only major repair I had done to it was when the water pump started to leak the mechanic said we should change the timing belt while I'm in there because apparently it was easy to access near the water pump. Checking the owner's manual, it said you should change the timing belt, which is a rubber tooth belt, every 7 years or 70,000 miles. At the time the PT only had about 40,000 miles on it but it was 11 years old. When he removed the timing belt it had thousands of cracks in it, and could have broken at any moment, which would have had Pistons contacting the valves and basically destroying the engine. It also was a 4 cylinder 2.4 l engine, although it was not called tiger shark or multi-air as your engine is. Don't know if they are the same design, but check your owner's manual and look into the design and maintenance of the timing belt for your engine. The PT never used any oil in between oil changes.
Ha! I had a PT Cruiser, too. I got rid of it when the throw-out bearing in the transmission started to fail. The fix was going to cost upwards of $2500. I liked how inexpensive that car was. But it was a ticking time bomb of expensive repairs in the future.
@@StaticCamperVan the PT was a good and reliable car for me, although I didn't really put that many miles on it over the years. Mine was a second year model, and my brother-in-law had a 2001, which had multiple expensive issues with the air conditioning. When my air conditioner quit blowing cold air, which was absolutely necessary here in Florida, I just went to an auto parts store and bought a can of freon with the connecting hose and gauge. Watched the youtube video to learn how to fix it, and pumped the system back up with leak sealing freon, and that was it, never had another problem with the AC. Can't really say anything too bad about it except it didn't really get very good gas mileage. If I had put a lot of miles on it, and had to do the timing belt repair multiple times, I probably would think less of the vehicle. Again, check your owner's manual about timing belt maintenance, just in case your newer 2.4 l has the same design as my old 2.4 l engine.
I did the test and was able to check the oil during the test. The seals didn’t affect the dip stick. My engine was fine but I do think it goes through *some* oil, but most vehicles I’ve had do, so it never seemed weird. I’ve had mine for 3 years w/o issue.
Hey Scott.. checking your oil regularly is just good preventative maintenance. Can let you know if there's a problem before it becomes a break down/stranded on the side of the road. I always glance under my vehicle as well..course my van sits up high so it's easy 😁 As far as oil consumption..when they started putting smaller engines that work harder..things are gonna wear out faster. My van has a big V8..gets lousy gas mileage but isn't working too hard going down the road. You'll find as the oil gets dirty..bout time to change the oil..it'll use a bit. My van has 190K and uses somewhere around a quart per 1000-1500 miles. Those are real numbers..not someone just saying a vehicle shouldn't use any oil 🤨 Regardless of the type of oil..keep an eye on your mileage and condition of the oil as to when it needs changing. Usually in 5K range. Regular oil changes are way cheaper than engine replacement ! 😁
My ‘18 model flunked the test. I don’t know the amount of oil it used, advisor didn’t say. Just that it was enough. Waiting on F/C to supply the dealer with correct engine replacement now. Less than 30k miles on it. Otherwise, I’ve had no problem with it. And I’m in same boat as you. It’s my home. My advisor told me it’s probably a 2 day job at least. So, alternate lodging will be required. Gotta work on that still. Good luck to you.
We are all aware that the RAM ProMaster City is a re-badged Fiat Doblo? My company is buying some of these to replace vans going off lease. I will be checking the oil level often. Hopefully Stellantis has corrected the TigerShark engine defect in newer production models. I hope so!
I have a2015 PMC also, it passed the test easily. I knew it would because it doesn't use any significant amount of oil . I only did the test because of the recall notice. FYI this has been a prety good vehicle for me. Prior to this I had a 2013 Subaru Crosstrek that had the engine replaced at 50,000 K because of excessive oil consumption. And people consider Subarus to be "quality". I think modern engines are likely to use a bit more oil because they are spec'd with such light weight oil 0W20 to improve gas mileage.
The oil consumption issue will be a problem for all of the Tigershark engines at some point because it’s a defect in the variable valve timing system. Good to hear your van has been reliable. Mine has been the most reliable vehicle I’ve ever owned.
The engine will just stop on you when you get below a certain level of oil, that’s what happened to mine. Which is a pretty nice feature to never blow it out. But it will lose total power which is pretty dangerous too, but it will at least shut off your engine. I’m living in mine too. It’s trusting with you have a large greyhound in the car. I’ve driven mine from Texas all the way to Hudson Valley, New York. I have the exact same one as you. I bought mine used tho. Mine had 74, 000 on it used. Good luck with it. I have traveled all over in mine too, and really do love it too. It’s just always frustrated with all the computer software.
Interesting. Someone asked me a question about the engine shutting down. I didn’t know what he was talking about until now. I’m checking my oil regularly. My engine doesn’t use even close to the 1 Quart per thousand miles that is required to be replaced under warranty. Happy to hear you are liking your van, too.
About 2 yrs ago I took my 2016 to a local mechanic ro check engine stopping in winter at stopped intersections. This wasnt the problem to the engine stopping but he did show me I had no oil I had just changed it 1.5 months previouse at another trusted location. There were no leaks. This was at about 75K miles. Today im at 126k. The latest oil change said change at 128k. By 125k or just over a month later, my Oil Change light started displaying.
I own a 2018 PMC that only has 20k miles. I also spend a lot of time camping/sleeping/eating out of my van so it's a major money saver. I extensively test drove Ford and Nissan before deciding on Ram. I felt the Ram was roomier and just drove better, but really the deal I was getting at Ram was significant better. At 4500 miles the van stalled and would not start at a stop light . They had to replace the fuel line. At 5000 miles I noticed I was down a quart and I took it in for an oil change. At 8000 miles I was down another quart so I had an oil consumption test and they said it was fine. This was all before this recent recall. Oil has been fine since and I been changing oil myself at 5k miles with synthetic. I do notice the van does have a lot of black soot in the tail pipe and though nobody claims they hear it, I hear a little bit of spark knock. I've taken it to two dealerships who claim they hear nothing. What's strange is I don' hear it with super unleaded or when it's cold outside. Also Chevron gasoline with it's additive cleaner seems to help. There is no power or performance loss, I just hear a faint feathering on load I never noticed before and don't hear on new models I've driven. Some mechanic told me he did not hear it and that it just sounded like a 4 cylinder, he also said that given I drive only city miles and very slow that maybe it just needs an "Italian tune up" (basically running it really hard and fast to clean out deposits). I know the quality and history of Chrysler is not great. But I still love my converted van. It otherwise runs very strong and has been very functional and reliable returning more and more money back on the investment. How long it will last remains to be seen but I do have powertrain warranty. My plan is to drive it another 3 or 4 years and then upgrade to an EV van when range and prices get to where I want anyways. I can only wonder what it will be worth given it has two giant holes in the roof :)
It would appear that not many of these engines are considered bad enough for replacement. The last dealership I took my van to told me they have yet to have a ProMaster City fail the oil consumption test. But they have had several Dodge and Jeeps fail the test. If you have time to tinker, you might try looking at the Ignition Coils. It’s a pretty common issue. I took my van to three different dealerships before it was figured out. They claimed it wasn’t showing a code for the faulty ignition coil, the first time.
As long as your oil is not below the lower level at oil stick. don't waste your time. I will suggest you not to do the oil test now until you get to high millage and your van start to consume too much oil then do it. remember the statute of limitations for recalls is 10 years
I got the notice for my 2017. I just checked the oil and it's down less than a quart in 4k miles. Reminds me of my 2000 Subaru. Head gasket problem. Huge problem over many years. The fix is outrageous, like $3000. Lots of labor. I got very annoyed, just bad engineering. They sent me a bottle of radiiator stop leak. Insulting. At some point these repairs can total the vehicle. I don't know how long they let you file a claim. It's a nice enough engine, even has a decent tow rating, but now I wonder if I want to stress the engine. No info on why this is happening. FCA screwed some diesel owners big time. They have to have some clue why it 'suddenly' starts using oil. Would they tell us? I hate internal combustion. I don't want another one. These engines cost billions of dollar to develop. They are incredibly complex. And they leak oil? My 1954 VW bug could do that. Like the new text intro. Good info. Tough to make these channels work.
Hey Scott, just check the oil level in my PMC after 1000 miles, it hasn’t moved since the oil change.(fingers crossed) I had a look at the Jeep and Dodge Dart forums as well. Some owners are saying that Fiat / Dodge Ram are providing a ‘fix’ to the Tigershark engine that involves modifying the software in the Power Control Module (PCM) in order to decrease the vacuum into the cylinders (the supposed reason for the high oil consumption) at critical times. That, IMHO, is a bandaid fix to loose fitting piston rings. I’m planning on monitoring my oil consumption closely, and when I’m sure that it’s burning more than 1qt/ 1000 miles, I’ll take it in for the test. That way, there will be no doubt that it’s in fact a loose engine and a candidate for a replacement, and that they won’t apply the bandaid solution. Good luck!
Yes, the piston rings and the valve guide seals are loose. BUT this is by design, the manufactures fist priority is good gas mileage. Like any engineering, there is a trade off, oil use or gas mileage. People shop by comparing gas mileage.
@@keithc5729 That may well be. However, what wasn’t in the design was the potential high oil consumption. That’s where the recall was announced. So far, my engine isn’t exhibiting a high oil consumption. FYI.
My 2017 promaster city failed the test and they rented me a full size van for a month for free while they replaced the engine. I moved all my stuff into the rental, but I was without my solar system for a month. Had to recharge at the library each day. Pretty inconvenient, but I have a new engine.
Hey, I actually brought mine in and found that they needed to replace the engine. Didn't top off the engine oil after the test and sent me back out and scheduled me for over a week out. during that time, My engine went to crap and by the time I brought it in, was basically on its last legs. they replaced what "RAM" had told them to replace and that was it. No care for what the delay and no oil did to the rest of the engine. They tried to give it back to me just barely chugging along. They wanted to charge me another $3K to look at the rest of the engine. "WESTBURY DODGE". I doubt that "RAM" said to not top off the oil after the test when there is no oil left inside. I'm double sure that they didn't tell Westbury Dodge to send the customer back out when they know that the car has major defects!!! Definitely not the place to take ur car for a recall or pretty much anything else for your Promaster or PMC. Recommendation. take it to the dealership you bought it from or one that you feel comfortable they will do the job correctly, Over here in NY, I tried 3 different ones to get this fixed. 1. Bayside Jeep, Dodge They took my appointment, didn't write it down, when i got there, they said they didn't have the appointment. Found the person who took it and still told me, "oh well, nothing we can do now, you can leave the car but we're not sure we're gonna get to it and we will have to park it on the street during the night and if you get it ticket, ur responsible for it." Got right back in the car and left. They do not stand behind their appointments, and I'm sure as heck that they won't stand behind their work! 2. Major World (Long Island City) They actually had my appointment, didn't mention that they were going to charge me for an oil change for the test. Thought it was a bit shady considering that they are forcing me to pay for a test to see if the recall needs to be done. Argued with them re: charging for a recall, at the end of it all, left and took it to #3. 3. Westbury Dodge - They did everything right the first day. After that was sent to the person who deals with the Promasters named Derec... That's when everything went wrong. Was not given any info on what they were doing or why I was bringing the car in. Like I said, May be a wonderful choice for anything else but DO NOT GO HERE for anything regarding Trucks or Promasters, The person (DEREC) that they put in charge of dealing with Trucks and Promasters is not competent at all. You already read about my experience in part with what is above. I think that would be enough to deter me. I still have to get in touch with the Corporate office to see if they had instructed Westbury not to refill the oil after the test. For now, took it to my regular mechanic who fixed up everything and the truck is in good working condition.
@@StaticCamperVan it's too bad that the actual dealership is so inept to handle things like this. It is absolutely imperative that you do get it fixed. But even before you go in, keep an eye on your oil level because due to this recall, it basically burns off oil too fast and becomes dirty too quickly. Even after the fix, I don't see that it's gotten much better, I still keep an eye on my oil levels and get my oil change done with full synthetic and still getting oil changes every 3k to 4k miles. I never wait for the full 5k as it will be running without oil. Good luck with yours as well
Don't Worry! I have the 2.4 in a Jeep renegade, same story. Don't worry. Just keep an eye on your oil level. Everything is fine. Modern engines are designed to get good gas mileage. The seals are looser, so they burn more oil. Ram will not give you a new engine, the repair is just a software update to the engine and transmission. I am not even bothering to bring mine in.
Thanks for dropping a level headed comment. I don’t understand why people are getting so riled up over this. Not all engines are needing replacement, so why worry excessively? I’ve been to two different dealers so far and they both have said the fix is not software related, Fiat will simply replace the affected engines.
I'm a 2015 promaster owner too. I'm having trouble with the oil consumption. I did the test and now it's gotten worse over time. my van actually vibrates while at a stop light. the dodge dealership said I'm under warranty to get a new engine. I'm also living out of my van too. Scary
My 2018 Pro Master City has done the same thing since new. I took it in a few months ago and they ran a test to where I brought it back after 1500-1800 miles. They said it passed and I was good, which is total BS because it goes through oil like crazy. Fast forward to today I got a class action lawsuit postcard in the mail about it. All I want is an engine that will last and not burn through oil like crazy. Looking into the details of this settlement crap now.
Sorry to hear your engine is burning lots of oil, too. I have a newer video that is an update to this one. The dealership that did the test on my engine told me they "fixed" the oil consumption. Which is laughable. My engine has used more oil ever since.
My co-worker went through the lemon law crap with 1 of his Jeep vehicles. He ended up getting run around for almost a year and his punishment to Fiat-Chrysler is his wife bought another Jeep. The infotainment system failed on that one at 60 miles... I'm semi loyal to GM due to the fact I can blindly fix LS and 3.8 engines. I haven't had a Chrysler since my Mom's Colt Vista wagon which was a Mitsubishi.
Start the recall test & put the motor through it's paces, put the motor under load conditions mountainous climbs long distances extreme stop & go etc. Now is your chance to get this resolved. Make sure they replace your motor while its covered otherwise you could be paying out of pocket when the miles start to rack up, oil consumption is only going to get worse. If the motor seizes up during their test, they will most certainly have to replace 👍
@@StaticCamperVan Great news! I was thinking about how difficult it would be for you if were to need a swap or major overhaul. Thanks for the update! Happy travels Scott👍
that's true, I have one 2016 and it uses about a quart every 1000 miles. One time the engine quits on me and when I checked there's NO OIL at all, luckily I just add the oil and the engine started again. I did the test and they said they gonna replace the engine, but it past more than 6 months and the dealer never call me...
A quart is just under 1 liter. And your van should probably hold about 4 litres of oil, or thereabouts. So even if it did use a quart over the 1500 miles, you wouldn't have used enough oil to damage the engine. I would get the test done. The worst that would happen is that you get two free oil changes! You have already done your own test, and have an idea of how much oil it is likely to use. I couldn't see the dipstick clearly in the video, but you said it didn't use much.
I own a 2015, Thanks for the heads up!, my engine also almost sounds like a little diesel, it that normal??, and I sometimes smell oil burning in the cab, that cannot be good. Thanks for your videos!
My engine isn’t the smoothest at idle. But it doesn’t sound like a diesel. I’ve had two bad ignition coils. When the coils were needed replacement, the engine was pretty rough sounding.
Do the test. If you don't do the test and want to sell the van later, you may not be able to do the test then, and the buyer will be reluctant to buy a vehicle that has not had the test.
They now have a update for this that seems to fix it. Letters were sent out for a PCM update for the oil using and owners claims it works. Have you gotten that?
I almost bought a new Promaster City last Fall. After a test drive, I stopped at the service dept and asked about the oil consumption...what should I expect? He told me a quart for every 1000 miles. Didn’t buy it. Hope the problem is solved.
No vehicle is perfect. Performing regular preventative maintenance and checks and getting to know your vehicle is about the best we can do. They don't make them like they used to.
I researched extensively... so wanted a Ram Promaster Hightop.... I talked to sooo many mechanics and researched endlessly... decided to stay away from all their cars/cargo vans ....concluded Chrysler Fiat ... Italian owned ....not a stable product. Wishing you the best Scott
So I just saw this video on 9-4-22. Do you have any further update as I haven’t seen any in your videos. Although I don’t think I’d watch each and everyone of your videos. I’m interested as I’m serious considering purchasing a Ram or Ford Transit City.
I've had some updates in vlogs since this video. I was denied any real fix for the oil consumption. A dealership in San Diego told me they "fixed" the issue but refused to tell me what that fix entailed. The engine now uses a little more oil than it used to. But the engine still runs well and I haven't had much else go wrong with this van.
From what I’ve heard, Fiat has fixed the oil consumption for new production. I rarely camp these days but do live in my van full time. This van has been great. Very reliable and comfortable.
My company have 12 these vans we use it service and all of them was tested by ram dealership was told nothing was wrong with engine. Vans use 2 quarts of oil every two weeks. If motor is low on oil the engine stall out..
The official recall test requires seals put on and then the van is to be driven 1500 miles. If the engines use more than a quart of oil during the test, the engine will be replaced under warranty
You should consider that, if a mfg defect exists (as attested to by the recall) that is not 'apparent,' you may well be able to recover in Small Claims Court (w/o an attorney and his fees) because, (your argument) there was no way to know that the defect existed unless and until the egine over heated and 'blew up.' One lesson I learned was to hire a stenographer to create a transcript of the proceedings. When I sued General Motors years ago, the SC Judge asked me why I had a court stenographer. I responded "In case I lose, I want to preserve a basis for my appeal." Funny, I did win and GM paid for teh repairs and court cost (not the stenographer's fee)
My engine doesn’t consume enough oil to be included in the recall. My engine uses about 1/8 a quart of oil or less every 1500 miles. Under the recall requirements, engines that use more than one quart of oil per 1000 miles will be replaced.
It saddens me to hear of both the issue and the test procedure. Burning a quart of oil every thousand miles is what an “old junker” does, not a rig with fewer than 100k miles. Most of the decent car brands have oil change intervals from 5k to 10k miles. This is a dying car company simply flopping around like a fresh caught fish in the wet grass. They currently offer no timetable for hybrid or electric vehicles. Chrysler Fiat will not be doing business in 2030.
I went in for the test a week ago. They've done the test before and it was fine. Last week they redid the check and said I had to leave the car and wait for a replacement engine. Over 3 hours of back and forth the car is at dealer ship and I'm told the are 900 engines on back order for US. We lost my wife's Honda to an engine fire last year and this puts us down to one car (my son-in-law's) 4 seater for 4 people. No estimate for how long without my car.
I have a 2017 it uses oil .... I got a notice also; went to a dealer and the dealership wanted me to pay for the oil change and start the test.. So I walked out... Should not the manufacturer pay all costs ??
Hmm, that’s interesting. I wonder what Fiat would have to say about that? It might be worth your time to make a call or try another dealership. Now I’m curious if something has changed regarding the test procedure.
As consumers we should never accept it when the Dealership says 'burning that much oil is normal for this vehicle.' It might be typical for the badly designed vehicle, but not 'normal' in my opinion,
Thus link was provided by a very nice person in the comments below: static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2020/MC-10176578-9999.pdf After doing a bit more research, it appears this particular recall affects very few ProMaster City vans. But obviously, if your vehicle has a 2.4L Tigershark engine, you should have it checked out.
2017 Ram ProMaster City camper van here. I haven’t received a recall notice for my van as of just yet, but I am aware of the recall. I noticed my van burns approximately the same amount of oil as you described, under similar if not the same driving conditions. I’m due for an oil change this summer. Will ask about recall on my vehicle at the dealership at that point in time as well. In the interim, I just add some oil as needed. Keep us updated, Scott! I’ll report my updates on your update videos posted in the future as well! By the way, check out Bob Wells and HOWA’s website for nomads if you run into major engine troubles and need some help with repair costs! Bob Wells and HOWA have an emergency fund they may be able to help you out with if the need arise! Wishing you all the best, my Ram PMC nomadic brother. Only a part-timer here, but I know the struggles all too well! Stay safe and good, brother cool.
Great to hear your van is probably ok. Sounds like we are taking the same approach. It’s unlikely that I will make an update video on this. Mostly because the majority of the comments here are showing that very few people have listened to what I have said. If there’s any major changes, I might make another video on the subject.
After many years of bad car buying decisions and experiences, I've come to the conclusion it is better to find a proven reliable make and model used vehicle (read Toyota & Honda), do the research and identify the common problems and how to correct them, and ALWAYS have a good mechanic thoroughly check out the vehicle before you buy. You will probably be very happy with a used Toyota Sienna. Buying a new model is always risky. Even some models and years of Toyotas had engines with badly designed piston rings; Toyota had to fix them.
Bought my PMC used from the dealership that used it as a delivery vehicle. I received the recall notice for the oil test and took it in for other warranty work. Got the PMC back the next day, but they never said anything about bringing it back after 1500 miles. Should I assume the dealership I took it to is not doing the test correctly?
Doesn’t sound like they started the oil consumption test. If they had, they should have given you some instruction. You’ll see some yellow markings on your dipstick, oil fill cap and oil drain plug if the dealership has started the test.
Bummer.): But yes...it is Life. Car issues are frustrating if you are not a mechanic, or married to one.(; Good luck. The good news is...it didn"t leave you stranded out in the middle of nowhere. Stay well. You will figure it out.
![KSI - Thick Of It (feat. Trippie Redd) [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/At8v_Yc044Y/mqdefault.jpg)
Whoa, so many posts making recommendations based on almost no data. Wasted energy and fear-mongering! The test will give you information to determine your next step, if any need be taken. Maybe no concern other than keeping the oil levels under observation. Every vehicle has trade-off issues, and folks stroke their own egos by presenting themselves as wise, based on nothing of substance, or at best an irrelevant anecdote.
I agree here. If your van is running well otherwise and all you need to do is add oil to keep it happy then nothing wrong with status quo. If there was some major mechanical issue that was causing detrimental damage to the engine then that's a different story. If you're used to your routine maintenance schedule then stick with it.
Good points. By the time the catalytic converter(s) are damaged, any warranty will be long expired! Then it's on you to pay for the repairs if you decide to keep the car.
Definitely do the test, don’t over think it
Just do it😉
Are you going to do the test or not?
Why are you still waiting, overthinking it still, get it tested, I was a certified gas and diesel mechanic, stop listening to unsubstantiated posts
Why are you still waiting, overthinking it still, get it tested, I was a certified gas and diesel mechanic, stop listening to unsubstantiated posts
Test was done a long time ago: ruclips.net/video/uMBDKAcSoPk/видео.html
I have 4 of these vans bought 2016-2020 for our business. Our 2018 consumes about a quart every 1500-2000, the others do not consume any oil. They have been very reliable with the only problems were early failure of the cooling fan replaced under recall on the 2016s and a headlight wiring problem (wires on pass side burn out). Dealer wanted about 1400.00 to replace harness, electric shop nearby charged me about 75.00 to rewire bad part!. The control arms on the front suspension go bad at about 120,000 miles, which seems about right for a front drive vehicle with lots of stop/go driving. Brakes are lasting about 50,000. The 2016s both have about 150,000 miles and run just as I bought them new so I expect I could get 300-400k. We also service the tranny about every 50k and apart from being a bit quirky they are pretty bulletproof and actually fun to drive. They have a great suspension, handle and drive well.
Super helpful thank you for taking the time to write all that!
Not one person would blame you a bit. Relax. It’s not your fault that these big car manufacturers cut corners. We all deal with it. You are innocent. And your channel will always be an inspiration. Thanks for sharing this issue, we can trust you to lay it all out there for us.
Happy trails. ❤️ Susan.
All that extra coffee weight is taxing the engine.
You stay on top of your van and engine maintenance I personally think your engine will be fine 🙂.
Thanks for the positive message.
The other doom and gloom comments aren’t really helpful.
Me too. You Will be fine. Keep driving.
Well...if you were in Florida and you decided to get the test. I have a suite used for guests. In the case that you might have to replace the engine, you could use the suite and have less worries. Don’t stress ! I love your stress free days.
Honestly, I was a little stressed at first. But now having a bit more knowledge, I am feeling much better.
Thanks for the offer! Very kind of you. I kind of feel like I might have missed my window for visiting Florida this year. But... anything is possible.
Very common test for all manufacturers. I wouldn’t overthink it.
No modern engine with under 100k miles should burn/use ANY oil. That "1 quart of oil usage per a thousand miles" is nuts. General rule of thumb. An engine is worn out if it burns/uses one quart of oil at each oil change. Get the test done! The recall notice will give you legal protections.
Seems a lot of oil usage to me also. I have a 16 year old X-Trail diesel we also run a 22 year old Yaris as a runabout. The X-Trail does 6.5 to 7K miles a year. Over 4.5k a year towing a 1.5 tonne caravan. I check the oil before our main 3 trips a year. Never low.. oil replaced at annual service.
That's not true at all. For example, Honda is beginning to use 0w-16 and Subaru is using 0w-20 on a boxer engine. A quart of usage or more between oil changes has become normal once again. We became spoiled from the 5w-30 and 10w-30 era which is the magic usage to mpg zone.
17 promaster city bought new 12 mi. At 55k started using oil. Half quart every 1000 miles like clockwork.
Thanks MUCH for the post, video and share! I can understand your concern, and as others have pointed out and said, I would do the test, and I don;t think it would harm you or the engine. BUT it is unfortunate not to get answers from FCA about what happen IF consupmtion during the test on a bad engine, cause failure. All the BEST to you, and as you pointed out, for the most part ithe Van has served you well for over 5 years. Cheers! :)
I have a 2016 ProMaster City with over 246,000 miles. Since I got it I've been using a quart of oil every 1500 miles.(about a quart per week.). One solution I found that helps especially in hotter weather is going to the 5 20 oil. That extends me up to 2200 miles for a quart of oil.. and I seem to get better gas mile... Just two to three miles per gallon... But every bit helps.
Scott you should come out to the mountains around Asheville North Carolina. I think it's your vibe and plenty of free camping in the National Forests.
Larch Larch, I was leaving Atlanta two years ago and a neighbor told me about this place in Ashville that had great Biscuits and fried chicken, so I drove 200 miles out of my way to get a plate. When I left to go North there was a heavy fog coming around those mountains. I would like to go back and stop by Blueridge Adventure Vans near Ashville, plus I'd like to hunt up the "Spoon Lady" in the Square while I eat my biscuits!
It is something we all can learn from. Yes there are people who don't pay attention to their vehicles and there are one's how do. Better to be aware and watch, thank you
My 2020 Ram Promaster City hopefully has none of these issues. I paid $2k extra to get a 5 year or 72k extended warranty from Ram after the one year factory warranty expires.
One of the problems with any warranty is whether or not a particular problem will be covered. My understanding is that Dealerships do not make a profit doing warranty work, and are loath to do them. Another problem is denying there is a problem by saying 'that's normal for that vehicle.' Oil consumption should never be 'normal'. I have a feeling that $2K went down the drain. I hope I'm wrong.
I’ve worked as a technician for Toyota for well over twenty years! This is a test I’ve done many times over the years! Anything under a qt & a half I s now considered normal on aluminum motors between oil changes. If you loose two qts is evidence of a problem! Do the test but It sounds like your engine is within specs! Normally the test can be done again in 6-8 months, so I wouldn’t be to worried if it passes!
Great info, Thanks! I figure at the very least, I get a free oil change out of this.
That's great advice. I'm about to trade in my car for a 2017 PMC, an even exchange for a 2018 car. They gave me the Carfax, looking into it and showing her to my friend/carer/mechanic. One step closer, "Homer" is parked in front, they gave me the PMC to try. So much space for my mobility devices!
Get the test!! Hyundai is replacing motors under recall also. They are hooking up to Computer while running Diagnosis. And can make decisions within minutes after computer info...Some of them seen replaced have over 100k miles...
Scott, my daughter got a recall notice about two months ago, but I did not have her vin number to put in as the post card required. I don't think she checked it out yet but I will show her your video. I just checked her oil on Monday and it was down a half quart after retuning from Florida via Atlanta. Us Subaru owners with the Boxer engine are used to this. If you travel at speeds on hot summer days you can through a quart in 800 miles like I did helping my daughter move back North from Atlanta. I was driving a U-haul truck and pulled over in South Carolina to wait for them. They had stayed behind to finish cleaning out the apartment, then I got a call that the oil light had come on and they had to get off the road to find an auto supply store as the rest stop places did not have the A-20 oil Subaru's require. Ever since then I carry two quarts onboard. Mine was a 2015 Forrester and this happened in 2018 with about 60,000 miles on it. Keep us informed ! She did have her oil changed on Tuesday!
Hope your daughters engine is one of the good ones. From the sounds of it, this recall affects very few engines.
@@StaticCamperVan She did get the letter when she responded to the card. She is a pretty good driver and doesn't usually go over 65. So we will do the test like you are and keep tabs on the level. She has one 400 mile camping trip to Worlds End in upstate PA. My son lives in Corning, NY and he is going to come down with the granddaughter and camp out for the week. My Subaru I check every thousand miles now. I keep buying lottery tickets so we can get larger Pro-Master 139" from Dave & Matts in Gypsum, Colorado. They keep it simple.
Best of luck 👍
Perhaps make sure there's not a time limit to do the test. They'll screw you every chance the get.
I'm working on my 1,500 miles now.
Best of luck!
It’s always something. I hope you can get the test done and still take your trip. Be well and stay safe.
Scott, a late comment to an old video, I went thru the same exact thing with my Kia Sorrento, they do make it tough for you to prove the high oil consumption. Even after it failed their test they took photos of the inside on my engine to make sure it was clean and I had been changing the oil regularly. (Save ALL receipts!) Bottom line, the whole thing took 6/7 months for which time I had a loaner vehicle. They installed a Korean remanufactured engine, NOT A NEW ONE. Now 80k miles later my car is ok with very minimal oil burn. They make it hard for any body that is cursed with one of their faulty engines. Any one going thru this, jump the hoops before the warranty expires which is what they are hoping for.
Sorry to hear that. Chrysler has actually been very good about replacing the faulty engines. The only problem is that there’s never been a fix for the variable valve timing system that is causing the oil consumption. So even though it is a new engine, the problem is going to be back.
That's rough news - recall. Hope your van has the test, although you've explained well your hesitance.
It looks like my engine isn’t one of the affected engines since it is well within specs. But we’ll see once I actually get the test done.
Sir, I would definitely go for the test.
And take a 1500 mile trip up and down the mountains, find stop and go traffic and join in, and tow something!
They probably wont replace your engine based on your own findings but they may give it a piston ring job which may be able to be done in frame and done fairly fast. 👍👍🌟🌟🌟🌟👍👍
I just saw your vid. My job has 2 City's we use as delivery vehicles. Our 2016 City used a quart of oil in 3 days during mother's day weekend. It was also driven for almost 10 hours a day for those 3 days!
That engine would definitely qualify for replacement under the recall
@@StaticCamperVan A few times we have forgot to check the oil and the engine has died on us. After we put 3 quarts in it, it starts right back up. All I can think of why it does that is there is not enough oil flow to run the intake valves since it is the multi-air engine
@Viperman200221 the computer monitors the oil level and if the level drops too low, the computer will shut the engine down. It’s odd, I was told that a scan tool was needed to reset the computer after refilling the level.
@@StaticCamperVan Basically a built-in fail-safe, nice. We have never had to use a scanner to reset the computer. Pour in the oil then it fires up after the 2nd or 3rd try to start it.
Thanks for the heads up, I’m going to have my PMC looked at, as it is up to 60000 miles
I’d rather get that engine test done, only because there is an established recall, and it could result in a brand new engine.
Great Helps heads up on info you did, very considerate. I 🙏 that now being 2yrs all has been well. 👍🏻
All has not been well but manageable
Scott, it's important to check your oil regularly, as you do. Kudos to you for that. You may want to know that the engine oil systems are designed so that (under normal driving conditions) operating an engine with up to 1 quart (1 litre) less oil than recommended, will not, by itself cause damage. Not normal driving condition would include,, for example, racing around a track where sustained high g-forces would move the oil away from the oil pickup tube that is located at the bottom of the oil pan. But I don't think you have plans to lap Indy or Daytona in your CamperVan, so you should be good. It's also important to note that overfilling the engine oil past the recommended level - the top line on the dipstick - in itself may cause engine damage. I mention this as some might want to compensate for increased oil consumption by overfilling, which would not be a wise thing to do. Also, don't substitute oil for coffee, or coffee for oil. They are not interchangeable.
Thank You for the info. I will check my oil dip stick more often and get my van to the dealership.
I took my promaster city van into the dealer who topped off the oil then "sealed" the engine. Now to put 1500-1700 miles on it then back to the dealer for the next step evaluation.
You are overthinking this. Do the test. If the oil gets too low then the engine light will warn you.
Good video. I like your sincerity. Any consumption of engine oil for a modern vehicle is not acceptable, no matter what the Dealership or Manufacturer asserts. Maybe if it's a clunker with over 200K miles, but not a new vehicle. My company is leasing a number of these vans. Evidently my management did not do the research and decided on price and gas mileage. In any event, I hope the defect was fixed in production in later models, but I'm not confident. Will have to check the oil level on mine often!
I have a scion XB. These can also be prone to high oil consumption. It is also has one of the most reliable engines Toyota has made. It is 10 years old and has 100k miles. I’ve only ever replaced brakes. No other parts. If it started consuming oil, I would just start topping it up.
Good post, TNx 4 awareness
Might think about doing the test. If they say you get a new engine, you can probably schedule when and where.
Hey there static
Unfortunately the oil change is NOT free.
They charge for the oil change at the beginning of the test
My pmc eats some oil and I do have to add some every 3000 miles or so.. I got the recall and will wait it out for now.
Check out the pmc forum online as a sub forum on the Promasterforum.com.
Many great threads on this topic with the actual step by step procedure about the engine replacement..
Best of luck
Still love my van and my build out..
Aww, shucks. Haha. Thought I’d get a free oil change out of it.
Thanks for the info. Glad to hear your still happy with your van, too!
Hello Scott . we were enjoying your video. as always. regarding your engine well we just purchased a 2019 with 8,000 miles on it . and got a extended warranty on it . good for 5 years or 75000 miles. so since your van is also your home . and your traveling a lot . and driving up mountain s . you probably put more wear tear on your engine . then most people like us who only drive to the. store . and since you have no idea what the future holds . you might want at least consider looking into a extended warranty . just to have some comfort . and so you can have peace of mind . instead of always wondering what's going to happen next . nice video great job .
I have to say i had a 2008 Chrysler Town and Country and it absolutely went like a rocket. I bought it from a second dealer with 63k miles and sold it back to them several years later. I was thinking of vanlife at the time but a van with Windows dont work for me....
Sorry to hear this Static...safe travels ☕️🌊🌲🚐 hopefully u make it east successfully 👍 if you decide too.
I understand you apprehension as it is your home and there's no place like home...l'm sure you'll make the right choice in the end. If it was me l'd do the test, plan a trip that would consume the miles 😊
Thanks Kat. I appreciate your always considerate comments.
I was planning on driving through a very remote and mountainous area. I actually searched Google for dealerships in that area. There were none. So, I decided to hang around San Diego instead. All in all, not a bad place to be in the winter.
@@StaticCamperVan 😊
Hey a recommended video about a ProMaster engine recall. I should let Static know about this one. Oh wait, actually this is Static's video.
Hahaha
I had another Chrysler product, a 2002 PT cruiser. I had it for 19 years and only drove it a little less than 70,000 miles. The only major repair I had done to it was when the water pump started to leak the mechanic said we should change the timing belt while I'm in there because apparently it was easy to access near the water pump. Checking the owner's manual, it said you should change the timing belt, which is a rubber tooth belt, every 7 years or 70,000 miles. At the time the PT only had about 40,000 miles on it but it was 11 years old. When he removed the timing belt it had thousands of cracks in it, and could have broken at any moment, which would have had Pistons contacting the valves and basically destroying the engine. It also was a 4 cylinder 2.4 l engine, although it was not called tiger shark or multi-air as your engine is. Don't know if they are the same design, but check your owner's manual and look into the design and maintenance of the timing belt for your engine. The PT never used any oil in between oil changes.
Ha! I had a PT Cruiser, too. I got rid of it when the throw-out bearing in the transmission started to fail. The fix was going to cost upwards of $2500. I liked how inexpensive that car was. But it was a ticking time bomb of expensive repairs in the future.
@@StaticCamperVan the PT was a good and reliable car for me, although I didn't really put that many miles on it over the years. Mine was a second year model, and my brother-in-law had a 2001, which had multiple expensive issues with the air conditioning. When my air conditioner quit blowing cold air, which was absolutely necessary here in Florida, I just went to an auto parts store and bought a can of freon with the connecting hose and gauge. Watched the youtube video to learn how to fix it, and pumped the system back up with leak sealing freon, and that was it, never had another problem with the AC. Can't really say anything too bad about it except it didn't really get very good gas mileage. If I had put a lot of miles on it, and had to do the timing belt repair multiple times, I probably would think less of the vehicle. Again, check your owner's manual about timing belt maintenance, just in case your newer 2.4 l has the same design as my old 2.4 l engine.
I did the test and was able to check the oil during the test. The seals didn’t affect the dip stick. My engine was fine but I do think it goes through *some* oil, but most vehicles I’ve had do, so it never seemed weird. I’ve had mine for 3 years w/o issue.
So what prevents someone from removing oil through dip stick? Very easy to do if inclined.
Hey Scott.. checking your oil regularly is just good preventative maintenance. Can let you know if there's a problem before it becomes a break down/stranded on the side of the road. I always glance under my vehicle as well..course my van sits up high so it's easy 😁 As far as oil consumption..when they started putting smaller engines that work harder..things are gonna wear out faster. My van has a big V8..gets lousy gas mileage but isn't working too hard going down the road. You'll find as the oil gets dirty..bout time to change the oil..it'll use a bit. My van has 190K and uses somewhere around a quart per 1000-1500 miles. Those are real numbers..not someone just saying a vehicle shouldn't use any oil 🤨 Regardless of the type of oil..keep an eye on your mileage and condition of the oil as to when it needs changing. Usually in 5K range. Regular oil changes are way cheaper than engine replacement ! 😁
👍🏼✌🏼
Love your honesty
My ‘18 model flunked the test. I don’t know the amount of oil it used, advisor didn’t say. Just that it was enough. Waiting on F/C to supply the dealer with correct engine replacement now. Less than 30k miles on it. Otherwise, I’ve had no problem with it. And I’m in same boat as you. It’s my home. My advisor told me it’s probably a 2 day job at least. So, alternate lodging will be required. Gotta work on that still. Good luck to you.
Sorry to hear that your engine is a bad one. It must be a little hard to plan ahead since you’re waiting on Fiat now. Best of luck to you.
We are all aware that the RAM ProMaster City is a re-badged Fiat Doblo? My company is buying some of these to replace vans going off lease. I will be checking the oil level often. Hopefully Stellantis has corrected the TigerShark engine defect in newer production models. I hope so!
I have a2015 PMC also, it passed the test easily. I knew it would because it doesn't use any significant amount of oil . I only did the test because of the recall notice. FYI this has been a prety good vehicle for me. Prior to this I had a 2013 Subaru Crosstrek that had the engine replaced at 50,000 K because of excessive oil consumption. And people consider Subarus to be "quality". I think modern engines are likely to use a bit more oil because they are spec'd with such light weight oil 0W20 to improve gas mileage.
The oil consumption issue will be a problem for all of the Tigershark engines at some point because it’s a defect in the variable valve timing system. Good to hear your van has been reliable. Mine has been the most reliable vehicle I’ve ever owned.
The engine will just stop on you when you get below a certain level of oil, that’s what happened to mine. Which is a pretty nice feature to never blow it out. But it will lose total power which is pretty dangerous too, but it will at least shut off your engine. I’m living in mine too. It’s trusting with you have a large greyhound in the car. I’ve driven mine from Texas all the way to Hudson Valley, New York. I have the exact same one as you. I bought mine used tho. Mine had 74, 000 on it used.
Good luck with it. I have traveled all over in mine too, and really do love it too. It’s just always frustrated with all the computer software.
Interesting. Someone asked me a question about the engine shutting down. I didn’t know what he was talking about until now.
I’m checking my oil regularly. My engine doesn’t use even close to the 1 Quart per thousand miles that is required to be replaced under warranty.
Happy to hear you are liking your van, too.
About 2 yrs ago I took my 2016 to a local mechanic ro check engine stopping in winter at stopped intersections.
This wasnt the problem to the engine stopping but he did show me I had no oil
I had just changed it 1.5 months previouse at another trusted location.
There were no leaks. This was at about 75K miles. Today im at 126k.
The latest oil change said change at 128k. By 125k or just over a month later, my Oil Change light started displaying.
I own a 2018 PMC that only has 20k miles. I also spend a lot of time camping/sleeping/eating out of my van so it's a major money saver. I extensively test drove Ford and Nissan before deciding on Ram. I felt the Ram was roomier and just drove better, but really the deal I was getting at Ram was significant better. At 4500 miles the van stalled and would not start at a stop light . They had to replace the fuel line. At 5000 miles I noticed I was down a quart and I took it in for an oil change. At 8000 miles I was down another quart so I had an oil consumption test and they said it was fine. This was all before this recent recall. Oil has been fine since and I been changing oil myself at 5k miles with synthetic. I do notice the van does have a lot of black soot in the tail pipe and though nobody claims they hear it, I hear a little bit of spark knock. I've taken it to two dealerships who claim they hear nothing. What's strange is I don' hear it with super unleaded or when it's cold outside. Also Chevron gasoline with it's additive cleaner seems to help. There is no power or performance loss, I just hear a faint feathering on load I never noticed before and don't hear on new models I've driven. Some mechanic told me he did not hear it and that it just sounded like a 4 cylinder, he also said that given I drive only city miles and very slow that maybe it just needs an "Italian tune up" (basically running it really hard and fast to clean out deposits). I know the quality and history of Chrysler is not great. But I still love my converted van. It otherwise runs very strong and has been very functional and reliable returning more and more money back on the investment. How long it will last remains to be seen but I do have powertrain warranty. My plan is to drive it another 3 or 4 years and then upgrade to an EV van when range and prices get to where I want anyways. I can only wonder what it will be worth given it has two giant holes in the roof :)
It would appear that not many of these engines are considered bad enough for replacement. The last dealership I took my van to told me they have yet to have a ProMaster City fail the oil consumption test. But they have had several Dodge and Jeeps fail the test.
If you have time to tinker, you might try looking at the Ignition Coils. It’s a pretty common issue. I took my van to three different dealerships before it was figured out. They claimed it wasn’t showing a code for the faulty ignition coil, the first time.
Your test satisfies me. Van seems Good!! Also, I have the same van- 2016
2016 RPC ✌
As long as your oil is not below the lower level at oil stick. don't waste your time. I will suggest you not to do the oil test now until you get to high millage and your van start to consume too much oil then do it. remember the statute of limitations for recalls is 10 years
I got the notice for my 2017. I just checked the oil and it's down less than a quart in 4k miles. Reminds me of my 2000 Subaru. Head gasket problem. Huge problem over many years. The fix is outrageous, like $3000. Lots of labor. I got very annoyed, just bad engineering. They sent me a bottle of radiiator stop leak. Insulting. At some point these repairs can total the vehicle. I don't know how long they let you file a claim. It's a nice enough engine, even has a decent tow rating, but now I wonder if I want to stress the engine. No info on why this is happening. FCA screwed some diesel owners big time. They have to have some clue why it 'suddenly' starts using oil. Would they tell us? I hate internal combustion. I don't want another one. These engines cost billions of dollar to develop. They are incredibly complex. And they leak oil? My 1954 VW bug could do that.
Like the new text intro. Good info. Tough to make these channels work.
Yes! Do the test as they stipulate. If the engine gets damaged, then they should surely replace it, I would think.
They replaced mine
Hey Scott, just check the oil level in my PMC after 1000 miles, it hasn’t moved since the oil change.(fingers crossed) I had a look at the Jeep and Dodge Dart forums as well. Some owners are saying that Fiat / Dodge Ram are providing a ‘fix’ to the Tigershark engine that involves modifying the software in the Power Control Module (PCM) in order to decrease the vacuum into the cylinders (the supposed reason for the high oil consumption) at critical times. That, IMHO, is a bandaid fix to loose fitting piston rings.
I’m planning on monitoring my oil consumption closely, and when I’m sure that it’s burning more than 1qt/ 1000 miles, I’ll take it in for the test. That way, there will be no doubt that it’s in fact a loose engine and a candidate for a replacement, and that they won’t apply the bandaid solution.
Good luck!
Yes, the piston rings and the valve guide seals are loose. BUT this is by design, the manufactures fist priority is good gas mileage. Like any engineering, there is a trade off, oil use or gas mileage. People shop by comparing gas mileage.
@@keithc5729 That may well be. However, what wasn’t in the design was the potential high oil consumption. That’s where the recall was announced. So far, my engine isn’t exhibiting a high oil consumption. FYI.
Hope it all works out! Just make sure whatever dealer you take it to has a good rep! Ck Yelp! Best Wishes, take care!
My 2017 promaster city failed the test and they rented me a full size van for a month for free while they replaced the engine. I moved all my stuff into the rental, but I was without my solar system for a month. Had to recharge at the library each day. Pretty inconvenient, but I have a new engine.
Hey thanks for sharing, it’s nice to hear a positive story regarding all this
Hey, I actually brought mine in and found that they needed to replace the engine. Didn't top off the engine oil after the test and sent me back out and scheduled me for over a week out. during that time, My engine went to crap and by the time I brought it in, was basically on its last legs. they replaced what "RAM" had told them to replace and that was it. No care for what the delay and no oil did to the rest of the engine. They tried to give it back to me just barely chugging along. They wanted to charge me another $3K to look at the rest of the engine. "WESTBURY DODGE". I doubt that "RAM" said to not top off the oil after the test when there is no oil left inside. I'm double sure that they didn't tell Westbury Dodge to send the customer back out when they know that the car has major defects!!! Definitely not the place to take ur car for a recall or pretty much anything else for your Promaster or PMC. Recommendation. take it to the dealership you bought it from or one that you feel comfortable they will do the job correctly, Over here in NY, I tried 3 different ones to get this fixed.
1. Bayside Jeep, Dodge
They took my appointment, didn't write it down, when i got there, they said they didn't have the appointment. Found the person who took it and still told me, "oh well, nothing we can do now, you can leave the car but we're not sure we're gonna get to it and we will have to park it on the street during the night and if you get it ticket, ur responsible for it." Got right back in the car and left. They do not stand behind their appointments, and I'm sure as heck that they won't stand behind their work!
2. Major World (Long Island City)
They actually had my appointment, didn't mention that they were going to charge me for an oil change for the test. Thought it was a bit shady considering that they are forcing me to pay for a test to see if the recall needs to be done. Argued with them re: charging for a recall, at the end of it all, left and took it to #3.
3. Westbury Dodge - They did everything right the first day. After that was sent to the person who deals with the Promasters named Derec... That's when everything went wrong. Was not given any info on what they were doing or why I was bringing the car in. Like I said, May be a wonderful choice for anything else but DO NOT GO HERE for anything regarding Trucks or Promasters, The person (DEREC) that they put in charge of dealing with Trucks and Promasters is not competent at all. You already read about my experience in part with what is above. I think that would be enough to deter me. I still have to get in touch with the Corporate office to see if they had instructed Westbury not to refill the oil after the test. For now, took it to my regular mechanic who fixed up everything and the truck is in good working condition.
So sorry to hear about your troubles. Good that you know a reliable mechanic to get you squared away.
@@StaticCamperVan it's too bad that the actual dealership is so inept to handle things like this. It is absolutely imperative that you do get it fixed. But even before you go in, keep an eye on your oil level because due to this recall, it basically burns off oil too fast and becomes dirty too quickly. Even after the fix, I don't see that it's gotten much better, I still keep an eye on my oil levels and get my oil change done with full synthetic and still getting oil changes every 3k to 4k miles. I never wait for the full 5k as it will be running without oil. Good luck with yours as well
Don't Worry! I have the 2.4 in a Jeep renegade, same story. Don't worry. Just keep an eye on your oil level. Everything is fine. Modern engines are designed to get good gas mileage. The seals are looser, so they burn more oil. Ram will not give you a new engine, the repair is just a software update to the engine and transmission. I am not even bothering to bring mine in.
Thanks for dropping a level headed comment. I don’t understand why people are getting so riled up over this. Not all engines are needing replacement, so why worry excessively? I’ve been to two different dealers so far and they both have said the fix is not software related, Fiat will simply replace the affected engines.
I'm a 2015 promaster owner too. I'm having trouble with the oil consumption. I did the test and now it's gotten worse over time. my van actually vibrates while at a stop light. the dodge dealership said I'm under warranty to get a new engine. I'm also living out of my van too. Scary
Sorry to hear you have trouble, too. Best wishes to you getting it sorted.
No need to change your plans. You passed the test based on your own observations.
My 2018 Pro Master City has done the same thing since new. I took it in a few months ago and they ran a test to where I brought it back after 1500-1800 miles. They said it passed and I was good, which is total BS because it goes through oil like crazy. Fast forward to today I got a class action lawsuit postcard in the mail about it. All I want is an engine that will last and not burn through oil like crazy. Looking into the details of this settlement crap now.
Sorry to hear your engine is burning lots of oil, too. I have a newer video that is an update to this one. The dealership that did the test on my engine told me they "fixed" the oil consumption. Which is laughable. My engine has used more oil ever since.
My co-worker went through the lemon law crap with 1 of his Jeep vehicles. He ended up getting run around for almost a year and his punishment to Fiat-Chrysler is his wife bought another Jeep. The infotainment system failed on that one at 60 miles... I'm semi loyal to GM due to the fact I can blindly fix LS and 3.8 engines. I haven't had a Chrysler since my Mom's Colt Vista wagon which was a Mitsubishi.
Bringing back memories of the mighty Colt Vista! Not good memories. But memories non the less.
@@StaticCamperVan I actually loved the mini, minivan. It was a stupid fun car and great for a 16 year old with stoner friends 🤣
Start the recall test & put the motor through it's paces, put the motor under load conditions mountainous climbs long distances extreme stop & go etc. Now is your chance to get this resolved. Make sure they replace your motor while its covered otherwise you could be paying out of pocket when the miles start to rack up, oil consumption is only going to get worse. If the motor seizes up during their test, they will most certainly have to replace 👍
That thousand mile consumption is the manufacturers wiggle room. I went thru something very similar with U.S. Suzuki on a motorcycle.
Sorry to hear that Scott, hope you get some resolution about it.
Thanks. It looks like my engine isn’t a bad one and won’t be included in the recall.
@@StaticCamperVan Great news! I was thinking about how difficult it would be for you if were to need a swap or major overhaul. Thanks for the update! Happy travels Scott👍
that's true, I have one 2016 and it uses about a quart every 1000 miles. One time the engine quits on me and when I checked there's NO OIL at all, luckily I just add the oil and the engine started again. I did the test and they said they gonna replace the engine, but it past more than 6 months and the dealer never call me...
Sorry to hear you’re having trouble with your engine.
A quart is just under 1 liter. And your van should probably hold about 4 litres of oil, or thereabouts. So even if it did use a quart over the 1500 miles, you wouldn't have used enough oil to damage the engine.
I would get the test done. The worst that would happen is that you get two free oil changes! You have already done your own test, and have an idea of how much oil it is likely to use. I couldn't see the dipstick clearly in the video, but you said it didn't use much.
I own a 2015, Thanks for the heads up!, my engine also almost sounds like a little diesel, it that normal??, and I sometimes smell oil burning in the cab, that cannot be good. Thanks for your videos!
Best of luck with your PMC.
@@StaticCamperVan Hey Static what does your engine sound like at idle? Thanks bro!
My engine isn’t the smoothest at idle. But it doesn’t sound like a diesel.
I’ve had two bad ignition coils. When the coils were needed replacement, the engine was pretty rough sounding.
@@StaticCamperVan Hmmm ok thanks brother, God Speed!
I have found most all cars, trucks use oil just a bit. I had a BMW X5 that used oil.
Do the test. If you don't do the test and want to sell the van later, you may not be able to do the test then, and the buyer will be reluctant to buy a vehicle that has not had the test.
Thanks for sharing
They now have a update for this that seems to fix it. Letters were sent out for a PCM update for the oil using and owners claims it works. Have you gotten that?
I almost bought a new Promaster City last Fall. After a test drive, I stopped at the service dept and asked about the oil consumption...what should I expect? He told me a quart for every 1000 miles. Didn’t buy it. Hope the problem is solved.
Thanks. My engine isn’t affected. Which shouldn’t be too surprising because this has been one of the most reliable vehicles I’ve owned.
No vehicle is perfect. Performing regular preventative maintenance and checks and getting to know your vehicle is about the best we can do. They don't make them like they used to.
I researched extensively... so wanted a Ram Promaster Hightop.... I talked to sooo many mechanics and researched endlessly... decided to stay away from all their cars/cargo vans ....concluded Chrysler Fiat ... Italian owned ....not a stable product. Wishing you the best Scott
A modern engine shouldn't use that much oil. It will also ruin your catalytic converter.
What about your resell value if you don't do the test?
Not sure. I know the resale value is pretty dismal already.
So I just saw this video on 9-4-22. Do you have any further update as I haven’t seen any in your videos. Although I don’t think I’d watch each and everyone of your videos. I’m interested as I’m serious considering purchasing a Ram or Ford Transit City.
I've had some updates in vlogs since this video.
I was denied any real fix for the oil consumption. A dealership in San Diego told me they "fixed" the issue but refused to tell me what that fix entailed. The engine now uses a little more oil than it used to. But the engine still runs well and I haven't had much else go wrong with this van.
We just purchased a 2021 Promaster City for a van conversion. Will keep an eye on the oil. How do you like your van for camping so far?
From what I’ve heard, Fiat has fixed the oil consumption for new production.
I rarely camp these days but do live in my van full time. This van has been great. Very reliable and comfortable.
@@StaticCamperVan Thanks. Enjoy!
My company have 12 these vans we use it service and all of them was tested by ram dealership was told nothing was wrong with engine. Vans use 2 quarts of oil every two weeks. If motor is low on oil the engine stall out..
The official recall test requires seals put on and then the van is to be driven 1500 miles. If the engines use more than a quart of oil during the test, the engine will be replaced under warranty
You should consider that, if a mfg defect exists (as attested to by the recall) that is not 'apparent,' you may well be able to recover in Small Claims Court (w/o an attorney and his fees) because, (your argument) there was no way to know that the defect existed unless and until the egine over heated and 'blew up.'
One lesson I learned was to hire a stenographer to create a transcript of the proceedings. When I sued General Motors years ago, the SC Judge asked me why I had a court stenographer. I responded "In case I lose, I want to preserve a basis for my appeal."
Funny, I did win and GM paid for teh repairs and court cost (not the stenographer's fee)
Static CamperVan, can we have an update please? Have you had the test done? Has a Dealership done the repairs? How's it going?
My engine doesn’t consume enough oil to be included in the recall. My engine uses about 1/8 a quart of oil or less every 1500 miles.
Under the recall requirements, engines that use more than one quart of oil per 1000 miles will be replaced.
Thanks for the update. A class action lawsuit has been filed; don't know what an owner needs to do to participate. All the best!
It saddens me to hear of both the issue and the test procedure. Burning a quart of oil every thousand miles is what an “old junker” does, not a rig with fewer than 100k miles. Most of the decent car brands have oil change intervals from 5k to 10k miles. This is a dying car company simply flopping around like a fresh caught fish in the wet grass. They currently offer no timetable for hybrid or electric vehicles. Chrysler Fiat will not be doing business in 2030.
It is sad what Fiat is selling
I had my engine replaced from this recall. Doesnt burn oil or over heat anymore.
I went in for the test a week ago. They've done the test before and it was fine. Last week they redid the check and said I had to leave the car and wait for a replacement engine. Over 3 hours of back and forth the car is at dealer ship and I'm told the are 900 engines on back order for US. We lost my wife's Honda to an engine fire last year and this puts us down to one car (my son-in-law's) 4 seater for 4 people. No estimate for how long without my car.
I have a 2017 it uses oil .... I got a notice also; went to a dealer and the dealership wanted me to pay for the oil change and start the test.. So I walked out... Should not the manufacturer pay all costs ??
Hmm, that’s interesting. I wonder what Fiat would have to say about that? It might be worth your time to make a call or try another dealership.
Now I’m curious if something has changed regarding the test procedure.
@@StaticCamperVan up here in Ontario,Canada the oil change is Not free. 2016 PMC. Have not decided yet on test.
As consumers we should never accept it when the Dealership says 'burning that much oil is normal for this vehicle.' It might be typical for the badly designed vehicle, but not 'normal' in my opinion,
My pro master burns almost 3 quarts between oil changes
I’m sorry to hear that. I hope you can get a new engine.
Static Campervan - can you provide the specific recall information? Google has no such recall listed although there are other recalls identified.
Thus link was provided by a very nice person in the comments below:
static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2020/MC-10176578-9999.pdf
After doing a bit more research, it appears this particular recall affects very few ProMaster City vans. But obviously, if your vehicle has a 2.4L Tigershark engine, you should have it checked out.
1 quart per 1000 miles is too much oil usage.
Do the test, then drive around mountain areas. Lots of them to choose from in the west.
Hope it works out. Mine is the Fiat Doblo 1.4 Petrol version. Not available in USA I heard. Hope mine is OK. Haven't received a letter yet.
This recall is for the 2.4L Tigershark engines. The ProMaster City is a very different vehicle than the Doblo.
2017 Ram ProMaster City camper van here. I haven’t received a recall notice for my van as of just yet, but I am aware of the recall. I noticed my van burns approximately the same amount of oil as you described, under similar if not the same driving conditions. I’m due for an oil change this summer. Will ask about recall on my vehicle at the dealership at that point in time as well. In the interim, I just add some oil as needed.
Keep us updated, Scott! I’ll report my updates on your update videos posted in the future as well!
By the way, check out Bob Wells and HOWA’s website for nomads if you run into major engine troubles and need some help with repair costs! Bob Wells and HOWA have an emergency fund they may be able to help you out with if the need arise!
Wishing you all the best, my Ram PMC nomadic brother. Only a part-timer here, but I know the struggles all too well! Stay safe and good, brother cool.
Great to hear your van is probably ok. Sounds like we are taking the same approach.
It’s unlikely that I will make an update video on this. Mostly because the majority of the comments here are showing that very few people have listened to what I have said.
If there’s any major changes, I might make another video on the subject.
You'd think they would have an hour equivalent to the mileage, since they have an hour reading for the oil change intervals too.
Mine has two quarts left when light comes on to change
After many years of bad car buying decisions and experiences, I've come to the conclusion it is better to find a proven reliable make and model used vehicle (read Toyota & Honda), do the research and identify the common problems and how to correct them, and ALWAYS have a good mechanic thoroughly check out the vehicle before you buy. You will probably be very happy with a used Toyota Sienna. Buying a new model is always risky. Even some models and years of Toyotas had engines with badly designed piston rings; Toyota had to fix them.
Bought my PMC used from the dealership that used it as a delivery vehicle. I received the recall notice for the oil test and took it in for other warranty work. Got the PMC back the next day, but they never said anything about bringing it back after 1500 miles. Should I assume the dealership I took it to is not doing the test correctly?
Doesn’t sound like they started the oil consumption test. If they had, they should have given you some instruction.
You’ll see some yellow markings on your dipstick, oil fill cap and oil drain plug if the dealership has started the test.
Bummer.): But yes...it is Life. Car issues are frustrating if you are not a mechanic, or married to one.(; Good luck. The good news is...it didn"t leave you stranded out in the middle of nowhere. Stay well. You will figure it out.
Can someone post a video on how to change the fuel filter on a promaster city?