I’m really loving the 7mm fan bois bickering down below like little zoomer college kids. “If you do this mine is better. No, mine is better because x,y,z. A cArTrIdGe MuSt Be MoDeRn!¡” Meanwhile, all the adults are laughing with our standard and magnum 30 cals. Cheers gentlemen!
@@soonerfrac4611 So only children shoot 7mm and .30 caliber rounds are reserved exclusively for "adults"? Just want to make sure I've got that clear. Also are you claiming that there are no viable "modern" .30 caliber rounds? (300 Blackout, 300 PRC, 300 Norma Mag)
I hit the wrong button as I was saying I don’t think 2.5 cents would matter so I have to say the 7MM . I really like your channel you really give a lot of good information and your excitement is contagious thanks .
I'm a hand loader so the 280 AI. Is my choice. I prefer non belted cartridges all day every day. In the event there is ammo shortages I can always make 280AI out of a host of cartridges( 25-06 .270 .280 30-06 )with minimal effort.
Valid points and a noticeable push from you for the 280 ai, but the availably of the 7 mag both in guns and ammo bullet weight clearly pushes the 7mag to the top.
Yaassss!!! 7 Rem! I have to say over these last few years I have been obsessed with the 7 Remington Magnum. It’s been more than capable and it has given me this confidence hunting here in Alaska. I have had zero issues with taking game and it is fun to shoot at distance for practice.
The 280AI uses less powder, has less recoil, does not have a belted case, provides more cartridge capacity in a shorter handier rifle, all while delivering essential the same performance as the 7 Mag. 280 AI for the WIN!
@@69yenko65 I’ve seen more 280AI ammunition for sale in the last 2 years than any of the popular cartridges 7RM included. I have both and I love my 7RM but my 280AI has a sweet spot in my heart.
My preference is for the 40 S&W over 9mm, and over the last 2 years it’s been pretty consistent on the shelves. In fact, a lot of oddball calibers have been on the shelves, doesn’t mean they are more available. Usually means nobody is buying them, it usually means that everyone is buying the mainstream calibers. The 280 AI should be better represented, sadly it’s not. That’s why it’s a travesty that the parent cartridge isn’t on here as the GOAT.
All great points. If there were more rifles chambered in this as well as ammo availability I would 100% agree. Unfortunately those are two huge issues with the 280ai.
7 mag. It’s a no brainer. As ammo dried up in the stores during the latest “crisis” the last thing saw on the shelves was 300 mag, Win and short, 7 mag, and 350 legend. BTW, my Thompson Compass hold 4 in the mag. This was not the case with my Browning or Ruger.
I moved during the pandemic and I can say in the west and in the Midwest 280 ai was not hard to come by well into 2021. 7 mag was widely available as well but after 2020 Wisconsin deer opener good luck finding one
As a handloader, I have found that much more performance can be achieved in the 7 mag vs factory ammo. It's like the factory stuff is leaving a lot on the table. My vote is for 7mm Rem Mag
Thank you. Handloading makes the 7mag a fantastic performer at all bullet weights. It wins for me as well. Plus the more recoil is mitigated with a brake or suppressor if needed.
@Craig Sanford i agree if recoil is not an issue. I felt like the .270 was invented to murder me when I loaded it at those levels (I'm a lean fellow). I settled on the 30-06 when I became a proficient handloader though- because I can load it down or up depending on my needs- as with most cartridges in 7mm and 30cal. They are all super versatile, and it's hard to beat the 7mm projectile. I think the 7m has too much space for the range I need. But for someone that can honestly take that much recoil and stay accurate, it's hard to fault it. It's beyond my tolerances though.
Absolutely Codyway! The 7mag reloading data is very stingy. I can get a 175gr. going 3000fps and a 150gr. going 3200fps comfortably and with great accuracy.
I absolutely love the .280AI. Very impressive ballistics with the amount of powder needed. 7mag has been around for years and is one of the most popular cartridges on the market that is proven. Those who handload know how impressive the .280AI performs. I understand most people voting for 7 mag because it’s been around and proven for years. I own and love both, but I am sold on the .280AI!
Agreed. I hand load and shoot the .280AI out 900m in F-class. Also a lot fun hitting heavy silhouette targets at 500m. However, definitely a reloader’s cartridge
about 20 years ago I bought a regular 280. not because I needed one or even wanted one but because i had gone to the store for primers and saw a Rem 700CDL with the most stunning piece of wood I have ever seen on a factory rifle. No way could Ileave the store without it. Its not particularly accurate but i just like looking at it.
I have owned and shot the 7mm Remington Magnum for over forty years and my experience has been in a hunting application the recoil is a non-factor. Recoil only becomes a problem at the Range when multiple shots are taken during practice and load development. My own experience has been when shooting Deer even large Bucks 250 lb or larger they are typically DRT. My vote is for the 7mm Magnum if you do your part it is always a clean Kill. Also, My Browning BBR holds three in the magazine and one in the chamber when hunting.Normally. with the 7mm Mag you only need 1 shot
Just bought a 280 ackley. Being a lefty I'm limited on options for rifle and caliber choices but settled on a savage 110 ultralite. Currently don't have an available 7 rem mag that I want. I just like 7mm in general both are winners in my book.
7 Mag wins when you seat the bullets out to full length properly. Sometimes you need a longer throat though. 280AI will hit its peak with a 24" barrel. 7 Rem needs a 26 or 28" barrel to hit its peak. In a 24" barrel, the 7rem is basically just a less efficient 280AI, but with the longer barrel, 7 Rem's extra powder gets to burn in the tube instead of flying out the end of the barrel unburnt. When that happens you can see gains of 200FPS over 280AI with the same length barrel. In most ordinary hunting situations, 280AI is probably better, but for optimal trajectory, 7mag wins. 28 Nosler is even better though.
You realize you can seat the .280 AI out to full length as well (~3.6"), right? And the .280 AI doesn't have the capacity of the 7mm Rem Mag, but is SAAMI spec'd to 4,000 PSI higher max average chamber pressure; 61,000 for the 7mm Rem Mag, verses 65,000 PSI for the .280 AI.
@@williammarshall3043 A practical hunter that could easily shoot elk at 1200 yards. But. Shoot what you like and can shoot well. Different strokes for different folks.
@@williammarshall3043 Talk to the game bird hunters with 32"+ barrels. Barrel length really only matters with ease of traversing heavy brush, and the weight.
I vote for the 280AI, I don't have one but I'd love to have one and being that it will perform basically on par with the 7mm rem mag with less recoil would be awesome maybe my next rifle will be a 280AI
IT DOESN'T equal 7 mag performance. This ITS REAL CLOSE BS is getting nauseating. You can push a 150 gr 7mm mag bullet to 3300 fps. The best the 280 AI can get is around 3000. HOW ID THAT ALMOST EQUAL. 300 FPS is a huge advantage in trajectory and wind drift when your shooting 4& 500.yds.
@twolak1972 correct it does not equal 7mm rem mag what I'm stating is you have roughly 150fps differences in factory loadings that means yes the 7mm rem mag will shoot flater faster farther but it's a closer trajectory than my .308 compared to a 7mm rem mag. And if you look at 7mm rem mag as an ideal or benchmark western cartridge and all the bc advantages from 7mm bullets then a lightweight rifle chambered in 280AI and ethical shooting distances make pretty good since to me. Besides if I wanted a 7mm rem mag I'd get a 7mm rem mag or step up to the 28 nosler but why should I go for more recoil.
Between the two I vote 7mm mag, because I know 15 years from now ammo will still be readily available, there isn't any cartridge developed in the last 25 years that significantly improves on the performance of the 7mm mag.
I've heard a theory that might have a smidge of truth. In order to force the purchase new guns the industry is chambering and producing ammo for the "new" calibers very much limit all offerings in "old". Yesterday I noticed at my local Farm and Fleet that they were stocked with fresh 6.5 creed, 6.5 PRC, 6.8prc, and 27 nosler, these are not the typical farm and fleet types of calibers, but there they were in several bullet options. It might be that in 15 years or less your 7mm ammo won't be readily available. That the new caliber ammo is being produced and on the shelves BEFORE the tried and true isn't a good omen in my mind.
Have had three 7mm Rem Mags over the years since 1976. Used more than any other cartridge, it has never let me down. 99.9 % one shot kills. 7 mag will always be my favorite all time caliber and Rifle. (My others in gun cabinet: .243, .270, .300 Win Mag, and .300 Weatherby). All are sweet shooters.
Have the Rem 700 7mag. 26” barrel, Magpul stock, Nightforce SHV scope. Almost 12lbs, recoil not bad with break. Have the Kimber Montana 280AI with Tract Optics scope. ~8lbs all up, shoots lights out. Similar ballistics, I vote for 280 AI
I was following this series intently as I pondered my next hunting rifle. Oddly, I had already narrowed it down to 7mag and 280AI before this video. This confirms everything I thought, but still isn't making my decision easier. Since I mostly hunt farm country in NY, a 300-yd shot is likely my limit; and it's all whitetail or black bear, but I do plan on eventually heaving west for elk. Right now I'm leaning toward the 7mag because of rifle/ammo availability. Barrel length isn't a major factor since you still can't own suppressors in NY, tho I will certainly but a break on whichever I get.
I just picked up the x-bolt speed in the 280 ai and think it’s a great,accurate, and efficient caliber. No real issues finding reloading components. And the barrel is 2” shorter than a mag caliber rifle.
I looked at most of the gun shops on line in northern Alberta and saw the one I bought in a small community in Neerlandia. It was at the co-op. Other stores had the 280AI but not in browning which I wanted. It has the recoil of a 243 with the muzzle brake and is very accurate.
Got my ultralight camilla in 280ai back in November and found ammo pretty easy for months picking up several hundred just in case. Looked today and I couldn't find any but well over a 6 month span ammo was easy to find online, even picked up 6 boxes locally.
never heard of .280AI, and certainly have never seen it's ammo on the shelves... i have heard of 7mm mag and occasionally see it on the ammo shelve. i chose the 30-06 over 40 years ago and even this stuff is getting hard to find...
Got to say 30/06 is what I have had the longest. It'll tip a big animal over backwards and everything involved was not difficult to locate anywhere. Ackley is a wildcat produced in competition with Weatherby which are rather dated platforms of incredible excellence. Long ago shooters discovered you can kill your quarry with a 303 British as well as a 308 Weatherby a lot cheaper than and absolutely just as dead. Guns like Ruger and good Remington ammo & Federal, Winchester gets the job done beautifully precise W/o the price drama.
You’re joking right? 280 AI is like finding hens teeth! Even hardware stores carry 7mm and -06! When I go into the LGS the racks with the most options are 308, 30-06, 300 win, 6.5, and 7Rem, in that order. There might be 5 boxes of 280 in the entire store, the others each have dedicated sections for ammo. 280AI is great for hand loaders. But if you are hand loading that ancient -06 that the 280 is based on will be very good, approaching 300wm velocities.
280 AI is the apex of performance in a non-magnum cartridge. There is no technically superior round in any aspect of non-dangerous big game hunting without stepping up to a magnum. If you were going to hunt something dangerous there’s a case for having a cartridge that starts with a 3. 30-06 is a close second. And 300 yards and under it’s no discernible difference. Coupled with the fact that the 280 AI is a little exotic while the ‘06 is ubiquitous, and the ‘06 is still king 116 years later.
@@Inveniam22 the 30-06 is far from dead. I dare say you’d be hard pressed to find a place that sells ammunition that doesn’t have a box of 30-06. And I think the same is true for rifles. Every model of hunting rifle I’ve ever seen comes in 30-06, and I think you’d have a hard time finding a place that sells guns that doesn’t have one. Also, I think it’s still the most popular hunting round in North America, if not the world, and has been for a very, very long time.
I love your channel and the break down of cartridges. I have been glued to these wars from the beginning. I am a Wyoming resident who is a fanatic of big game hunting. My family and I will be in St G for spring break vacation and I’d love to have you and you family meet mine. I am a hunter mentor with the first hunt foundation. I’m also a 280 Rem fan with the 700 action. Tom
My vote goes to the 7mm Rem Mag. I have owned one for 36 years. It has been around a long time and simply gets it done. I bet 280 AI ammo will be more expensive since it is not a readily available round.
It's great, but a belted cartridge can't be the best. It's just outdated and unnecessary. Take the belt off, index off the shoulder, and you have a winner.
280ai can't be found around here ; last I saw it Dec2021 was around $85/box. 7mag is on the shelves if you look hard enough, about $48/box. Other than this, my preference is the 280ai
280AI doesn't cost any more than 7mag ammo. If your gun store is charging almost double for 280AI they're just gouging, or you're comparing Nosler Trophy Grade ammo to Remington Core Lokt prices. I've never paid over $50 for 280AI ammo, Nosler or Federal Terminal Ascents.
I feel that when someone says an cartridge is “outdated” is one of the most ignorant, zoomer things you can say. It seems to be a popular thing to say, a cartridge is “outdated, we must have a more modern cartridge!” The real irony is that the 280 AI is based on a nearly 120 year old cartridge.
@@sneakybow1 Yes, that is exactly what it is because that is all that was available. I did see federal premium 7mm this past weekend at $58 a box. Haven't seen 280AI after 2021 year end.
My vote goes to the 7mm Rem Mag. During your tally, I think you forgot to give a point to the 7mm rem mag for rifle availability. I do not think 1.5 lbs of energy makes a difference in recoil. I think you are favoring the AI. I have never owned the AI. I have had a couple 7mm rem Mags, so maybe I am favoring it, LOL who knows. I just recently purchased a new 7mm rem mag in the Christensen Arms Mess LR. I do think both calibers were offered. That 70 fps t/- and more energy is what sold me on the cartridge. Also availability of the ammo. You keep referring back to a few years back when we could get ammo. Well, we are not living in that time now. I honestly have never seen 280 AI in the gun store here in Maine. I haven't intentionally looked for it though. I will start just t see. I do see 7mm rem mag once in a while. We here are still having a tough time getting ammo regularly.
I'm familiar with both. I also prefer lighter rifles. I think there is a noticeable step difference with the recoil. I put the 280 AI about midway between 7mag and 308. When I use the break, I'll say about 270 win like. Either way, I prefer the 280AI, but think the mag is an awesome cartridge.
7 rem mag = 280 AI performance with more recoil, less rounds in the magazine, a longer barrel, more expensive ammo (I reload), and a silly belt. I’ve owned a 7 rem mag and shot and hunted with a ton of it. I’ve shot and hunted with a 280 ack, but never had the pleasure of owning one. Terminal effect is equal, but in comparison the 280 ack is a sweetheart to shoot, carry, and reload. If I could find one I liked left handed (story of my life) I’d snap it up in a heartbeat.
Honestly I’ve seen 280 in more gun stores then common rounds the past two years. It’s takes longer to sell out vs more common rounds are gone the next day cuz everyone wants it
@@landonboomsma2594 in two years I think I saw one box of regular 280 rem and I still haven't seen any 280 AI. that is around here where I live in Maine. I have seen 7mm rem mag way more often.
When you first asked these questions to kick off "Cartridge Wars". What caliber would you choose if you had to pick just one cartridge to do the following. If you had a neighbor who was wanting to get into big game hunting and he ask you what cartridge would you recommend to him? And then the second question was. What one cartridge would you choose to just go out on a Saturday and just shoot to have fun? So one caliber to do both things. I see how your brackets got to the 7mm REM Mag as the winner. However this fall I was going to buy a new rifle and I really wanted a 6.8 Western. Long story short I couldn’t get what I wanted; so I decided to looked into these two cartridges: 6.5 PRC and the 7mm REM Mag. After reviewing tons of videos and reading a lot of material. I am now re-answering you two questions from cartridge wars and the winning is: 6.5 PRC!!! I really wanted the 6.8 to be the winner, but the extra recoil said to me that it wouldn't be a first choice to take out on a Saturday and shoot all day long. The 6.5 PRC. -- What an amazing cartridge. I love that it can compete with the 7mm out to 1000 yards in these categories: wind drift, bullet drop, velocity, and energy. What really blows me away is that the recoil is significantly less than the 7mm. If you went to a range and just shot a lot of rounds. You would be a lot happier shooting the 6.5 PRC. A lot of people are saying that you can take any animal with a 6.5 that you could take with a 7mm. So if I had to choose one cartridge, I would pick the 6.5 PRC. Don't take this bad, I am not knocking on you at all. You are a wealth of knowledge and I thought you did a great job as always. Thanks for sharing.
"7Mag Daddy"! Love loading for mine. It's like a faithful companion. Always delivers, doesn't complain about the powder/bullet concoctions I feed it, and never gets jealous when I go to any of its Weatherby stable mates first call.
Put both in a light rifle and you'll know why. Try to max out velocity with hand loads and you'll get a stiff bolt sooner with the magnum. 7mm RM is an excellent cartridge, but the efficiency really makes the difference. 280AI.
@@devinb3397 Higher preassure equals higher velocity. 280 will tolerate higher preassure due to design. Paired with greater efficiency the difference between the two is insignificant. Will the mag send heavier bullets faster? Maybe. But the 280AI handles up to 200 gr bullets very well.
Personally I own rifles chambered in both and really like both but I like my 280AI a little more. It's a more efficient cartridge and like you mentioned you can get away with a shorter barrel. Even though a couple inches don't seem like a lot when you're hunting with a suppressor it makes a big difference. The 7mm Rem Mag is a great cartridge and when it comes to performance they're tied it all comes down to efficiency and a more handy rifle nothing else.
The 280 AI based on the *actual* GOAT cartridge would be my vote if it had more availability. In my area I’ve certainly never seen any at my local Walmart, & rarely at the gun stores in town. The 7mm Rem on the other hand is basically everywhere, including some of the hardware and farm supply stores. But those stores more often than not also have 30-06 & 308 Win as well.
I own both , and think they both perform really well. I think the 7Mag will win over the 280Ai for really one reason . I have never met someone (and I’m not saying there isn’t) who have already owned a 280Ai before a 7mag . I see the average hunter or shooter getting into more ballistics and reloading coming across the 280AI after having already own a 7MAG due to the fact the 7Mag is already a well enough gun for overall for the average hunter and shooter. Even though the 280Ai has been around for a while also. In my location , having owned both rifles (and every location is different) 7mag has been way easier to get a old of factory ammo before the pandemic and even the Obama scare way back when. And I mention factory ammo cause the average hunter or shooter does not reload ammunition. Great Video, good points of perspective!
280AI for the win! And now you made me go and buy a 280AI. Got a left handed Savage Ultralight. found 100 pieces of Nosler brass and dies. This is my 5th 7mm rifle and will be a tie for Elk rifle next year. The 7SS is a pig (I built it that way) and I am trying to trim some weight where this Ultralight I can add a few more creature comforts and not worry about it being a 15lbs rifle. 🙂
I vote 280 AI even though my first rifle was a 7mm Remington Magnum in a BDL Remington Rifle and a Redfield Wide Field Range Finder 3 X 9 Scope. Still vote for the 280 AI in a 24 inch long barrel and muzzle brake.
Two awesome cartridges. 300prc is my favorite magnum tho. 7mm and 280 AI I can currently find ammo for however. That new rumored 7mm prc has my interest
I'm having a hard time seeing where the 7 PRC fits in. The 7mm field of cartridges is very crowded. The 7mm-08, 280 rem, 280 AI, 7mm rem mag seem to have the hunting general purpose well covered. I can only see the 7 PRC slotting between 28 Nosler and 7mm mag ... extending point blank range, high bc bullets for long range, and greater recoil. Some are going to love it but it won't be for most 7mm users. I'm starting to see it as a niche cartridge and possibly a bad idea .
If efficency rules, the 280 AI wins For net hunting purpose the 7rm wins Belted or non belted personal choice. With 280 AI you are a little different from masses, but that will not give you hunting advantage. The 280 AI has a kind of exotic charm and i like that The 7prc will be the next revolution in 7 caliber
I don't own a 280AI but I am very interested in getting one. I have fired many rounds from the 7mm Rem mag and also the 284win which is also very good for the case capacity, which is less than the 280AI. It looks like the 280AI falls between the rem mag and the 284win. I have compered the 7rem mag to the 284win and found the rem mag has an extra 135 fps lead but those cartridges were not loaded by the same people, so it might not be dead on. There is no doubt that the smaller cases are more efficient. The 284win is very popular in Australia for long distance competitions.
I vote 280AI. I have had rifles in both calibers and both worked great. But recoil is noticeably less with the 280AI, and I can get 5 cartridges in the 280AI I now have which, fully scoped and loaded, still weighs a little under 8 lbs. Reloading for the 280AI has been easy for me, and accuracy has been stellar. I started shooting the 280AI in the early to mid 90’s and have had outstanding success with it in the field. It has done everything I asked of it with ease and style.
I always wonder about this. I don’t buy ammo. I reload. But can’t you just order it? Like, a couple websites right now are telling me I can have as much 280 ack as I want in 2 months. So couldn’t the ammo availability problem be solved by either saving up and making a big purchase once a year or so or buying a little bit regularly with a long lead time? If I bought a box now (Apr 1) and then another box on may 1, and then another box on June 1… starting June 1 I could have a box show up to my house every month. No? Maybe it’s just the reloaded in me but that’s how I get reloading supplies.
If you load your own ammo the 280 ai is a no brainer! My first new big game bolt action was a 700 bdl my wife bought me for birthday in the early 80s. My son has a tikka stainless t3x 280 ai, These rifles are both excellent hunting rifles! Take your pick? No bad choices here!
As some on who owns at least one rifle cartridge in every caliber up to 338, the best all around cartridge is hands down is the 280AI. The advantages of the 280AI over the 7mag far out weigh the 50-100fps the 7mag has over the 280AI. Also most people don’t have multiple rifle cartridges and when someone states “I’ve shot the (fill in the blank) for 50 years, bla bla bla”. That just tells me they have very limited experience with anything else, and are obviously biased towards their cartridge.
Exactly! I’ve read over 300 comments on here so far and I have yet to read one that says I own both and I prefer the 7RM over the 280AI but I’ve seen tons that have read the opposite.
Have hunted with a 7 mag and the recoil from the rifle I was using seemed to be a little hard to me. Have not had the pleasure of ever firing a 280AI but I think that if I were shooting a lot say in a tournament I would rather have the 280AI. FOR THAT REASON I VOTE 280AI
It came down to two very similar performance cartridges. The other one very close to these two is the 6.8 Western...but it was to new to win a popularity contest.
At some point in this series you said something along the lines of 'a cartridge the whole family can shoot game targets ect'. That's a no Brainer. Less recoil and minimal fps loss.
I dont have a reloading book in front of me, but the 7 mag should have a more significant advantage for reloaders because of case capacity and underloaded factory ammo. So I think I would rather have the little extra at that point as well as MUCH more availability considering I have never seen 280AI in a store.
@@JAKDRZR Its really not that much more efficient. 280AI 150gr - 63.0gr to get 3107 fps 7 mag 150gr - 63.0gr to get 3248 fps 280AI 175gr - 59.5gr to get 2903 fps 7 mag 175gr - 62.5gr to get 2970 fps The reloading data (at least from Nosler) shows that the 7 mag is about equal or more efficient in some weights. I wouldnt call that much more efficient and personally I would rather have the 70-150 fps more.
@@Nick-sx6jm you can’t compare different types of powder. The 63gr in the 280ai is IMR 7828 while in the 7mag 7828 you need 68gr to go 3168 so it really is much more efficient.
@@Nick-sx6jm at 700 yards with my load it’s still 2050fps and 1640ftps energy. I will never shoot a animal that far anyway but that’s still a dead moose/elk. I don’t think they’d know the difference if the bullet was going 75fps slower.
I love my custom 280 AI. I’m shooting a Remington 700 LA with a Krieger 26.5” barrel. Timney trigger. Glass bedded. Gunsmithing done by John King. Pre barrel break in I’m shooting 175gr Hornady ELX at 2814. Now that barrel is broke in I’m going to push it up to 3k maybe over. Easily a .5” or better rifle. 1000 yard elk killer AND pleasant to shoot.
Update- I switched to factory Precision Hunter 162gr. Shooting at 2920fps. My barrel twist needed a slightly smaller bullet. But I’m getting better than .5” moa.
My vote goes to the venerable 7 mag. Availability, history, tradition and it's just one of those calibers set in stone of it's performance. It's the massive reason the 280 and 7 express never really took off in popularity. Thus, making it difficult to find rifles and ammo for them. And then you have the 7mm-08 brining up the rear. Between the mag and 08, all bases are covered.
i really loved this video i am currently a student at sdi and love it very informative school. I'm going to have to say the 280 ai it's a pretty awesome cartridge it is a nice do all cartridge and in one of your other videos talking about what cartridge to use on game you pretty had the 280 ai for every single game animal almost expect the varmints.
I would vote for the 280 AI, as a one gun solution! But lets be honest... Who wants one gun? I would be so much better armed with a 7-08 featherweight rifle & a long range/big game 300mag. SO.... Can I suggest a 3 or 5 gun battery series next? If your spending thousands of dollars on hunting trips all over the country or world why just have one gun?
It’s hard to go wrong with either one. The 7 Mag has the most pure performance but the 280AI isn’t far behind. P.O. Ackley really knew what he was doing with this design. The 280 makes a better range gun and it’s shorter barrel is handier in brush or a blind. I’d say, if you hunt and don’t handload or want the most options, go with the big 7. If you want something a little different that isn’t far behind and you spend more time on the range with your handloads, the 280AI might be your perfect choice. I vote for the 280AI.
280AI. Less powder for similar velocities, same bullet selection, and belted magnums are antiques. You have to burn a good bit more powder to achieve slight gains in velocity. Powder is getting more expensive by the day. 280AI is an easy to load for and accurate.
I’m currently building a custom tikka in 7 mag. I was gonna just rechamber my tikka 270 to a 280ai but ammo availability talked me out of it. Just waiting on my carbon barrel and I should be good to go.
Unfortunately, .277 cal barrels can't be rebored to .284 cal anyways. There's a .001" overlap in the old rifling. It's unfortunate because I was looking into the same thing before building my 280AI from scratch.
@@noahhorinek I was gonna change the barrel on it anyways and put a carbon barrel on it. Luckily with tikka all there standard actions use the same bolt so all I would need to change is the barrel then it would be good to go.
Short action is one of my main requirements (barrel length, weight) so I’d take the new 6.8 western, 6.5 PRC, 300 wsm. Nothing wrong with these two choices though.
7 Remington Magnum…. You can always become a reloader and decrease the powder to match the slower 280AI. You can not increase the 280AI powder to match the 7 Rem Mag.
That's actually wrong, but okay. Handloaded 280AIs can exceed 7mag velocities. Even Nosler has some loads that exceed 7mag velocities in Nosler9. My personal 280AI with N560, H1000, and H4831 runs about 30-75 fps faster than my old 7 mag with every bullet weight I tested. 120-190. Also, reduced loads are a tricky thing to get into, and not always the best thing for your rifle or brass.
This was a fun & interesting video series. For me, a 30 cal ~ 180 grain bullet is the perfect do all "goldilocks" hunting bullet from deer to elk or bear as far as diameter/weight/SD Then either a 308, 30-06 or 300 wsm to push it, you can't go wrong with any depending on need. 308 with 20" barrel , 30-06 with 22", or 300 wsm with 23". Probably hard to beat the 30-06 for the balance of everything. Federal terminal ascent is my pick for best factory ammo for terminal performance, weight retention, expansion, penetration & accuracy.
I think you need to commit here on your choice, but include your viewers as backup. I have a Ruger M77 MK II in 7mm Rem Mag. I bought the rifle in 2000, and while still unboxed and unfired, took it to my local gunsmith for the installation of a muzzle brake. I also purchased dies, powder/primers/bullets for my reloader. The first shots I put through that rifle were my 139gr Sierra BT for hunting rounds. The brake made all the difference. I was able to refine this load to deliver 100 yard group sizes that could be covered with a dime. (my Burris Signature scope can get some credit here). Let me contrast this, my hunting buddy had purchased a Winchester 7mm Rem Mag at the same time, as we were going on the same hunt. His range time, each time, consisted of 5 shots. After that, he suffered target flinch in anticipation of the recoil. Some years ago, my wife was drawn for elk here in Arizona. She used my Ruger M77 MK II. I took her to the range, and she put 20 rounds through it before we ended the session. Again, the muzzle brake made all the difference. My longest shot was for antelope at just under 400 yards, while trotting. I had attempted to lead the buck to compensate for that distance. Whoa is me, the bullet literally hit point of aim, but still went down quickly. That's my learned lesson. This rifle still delivers the same group sizes, as when my friends and I had a 200 yard ping pong ball competition. We had fill the balls with talcum powder, and each were given 5 shots to attempt to hit them at that range. Guess who won? I vote the 7mm Rem Mag.
My first large caliber bolt rifle was a Sako AV 7mm rem mag. Got lucky and came across a field model w/ beautiful wood and not so lucky with a hard rubber butt pad. I was good for 3 shots at the range and after 7 I was wasting ammo. It was a 10lb rifle and I got tired of carrying it all day when out hunting and eventually sold it. Great memories though --- hit crosshairs on a target at 200 yards witnessed by my friend, first antelope at 360 yards, first cow elk around 225 yards, first bull elk around 80 yards and less than an hour into legal hunting time opening day.... and it goes on!!! 30-06, 270 win, 308, 243 win, 338 federal, 7mm-08 since and now just recently 280ai. None will be as memorable as my first!
Without watching your video, my choice is the 280 Ackley (AI) Improved cartridge! I reload, so inexpensive 270 Winchester and/or 30-06 Springfield brass can be reloaded into 280 AI. 280 Remington/7mm Express Remington and/or 280 AI brass is expensive, but not actually required for the reloader. The 7mm Remington (Rem Mag) Magnum brass is expensive. The belted magnum cases can form a bulge above the belt when reloaded multiple times. You will most likely use more powder and have more felt recoil with the 7mm Rem Mag cartridge. Although you usually will be able to find factory rifles and ammunition for the 7mm Rem Mag. Having reloaded 40⁰ Ackley Improved cartridges for decades I can confirm the brass doesn't grown in length compared to standard shoulders. The AI shoulder is more efficient. Regardless on what you came up with the 280 Ackley Improved cartridge is the winner in my world!
Well goodie for you. I guess the extra 5 lbs of recoil from the 7 mag is a real shoulder snapper huh. The 280 AI doesnt have anything on the 7 mag. You mention 5 rounds to the 7mags 3. I have owned one for 32 years, shot hundreds of head of game and never needed the round under the 1st one. I might as well have ordered a ruger no.1 single shot . Your 5 round argument sounds like you shoot like shit and need every one on the field to fell game.
The .280 AI is the epitome of a modern 7mm cartridge - it's efficient, lower recoil, allows for a shorter barrel and higher magazine capacity. The 7mm Rem Mag is a great example of an old school cartridge - it's got more powder than it needs and it's even got an antiquated belt on it. (I've never heard anyone say "I love belted cartridges.") Y'all can vote how you want, but the .280 AI deserves the win in my opinion.
@@southernmarksman From a practical standpoint? Its not the belt specifically I admire, but I like belted cartridges because of their practicality and flexibility. Lower pressures, easy feeding, good range of bullets, good speeds... They all do what they're designed to, well. From an emotional standpoint, I think they have panache and history. No-one who watches Backfire is living, surviving and dying by hunting rifle alone. This is a hobby and a passion. I'm drawn to history and elegance. I like the sloped shoulders of a 300HH, I like the tapered body of a 375HH and its connection to a mystical Africa. I like that someone saw an 8x57 with a 220gr bullet and said 'That. But 800fps faster.' What can I say. You like what you like.
I see it says “cartridge wars season 1”. Makes me wonder what the next seasons might bring. Personally I would like to see a cartridge wars coyote calling rifle cartridge. Or predator rifle or whatever. Early prediction: 243 wins it lol
With ammo and rifle availability being what it is I think the 7mm Mag is probably the way to go, although I believe the 280 AI may be the better cartridge.
I have a kimber m84L with a wood stock in280AI. It is very light and can carry 3 plus 1 shots. I don't feel like it kicks like a mule either. An absolute dream to carry. My vote is for the 280AI.
7mag all day, since your basing all the info off of book and shelf ammo it makes sense to also vote on on availability. Never have I seen .280ai on the shelf anywhere, never.. I reload and still give the advantage to the 7mag, it’s a pretty amazing cartridge, and I love 300 wins and Weatherby’s ! Lol
7 mm Rem Mag is much easier to find where I'm at for ammo. You also have WAY more rifle chambered in it. For an available, capable, hunting/long range rifle, there is nothing that beats 7mm Rem Mag. It deserves an entire cartridge profile on it. I have no doubts it will win catridge wars.
I’ll say it again. Less than 2 inches of barrel length doesn’t matter. Even when hunting with a suppressor. I’ll give you the recoil argument because 1.5 lbs of extra recoil is significant. However painting it as “only 70 fps for 1.5 lbs of recoil” isn’t exactly honest. Putting it as “1.5 lbs of recoil for an extra hundred lbs of downrange power” is much more honest. That is significant when hunting extended ranges. Ammo and rifle availability isn’t near as close as it’s painted. 280 Ai is making a comeback, but it is nowhere near 7rem mag. Adding 280 Remington is also shady as it will hamper the ballistics. Even so combining the two still doesn’t put it near 7 rem mag for availability. Ammo capacity is a big deal. Fitting more rounds in the gun is always better. 280AI wins hands down. I still don’t see how the 7rem mag could lose. Obviously the video is biased towards 280AI, which is human nature. But this is my counter argument through the lens of my bias.
Voted 280 AI, but it's a case of "tastes great" vs "less filling". I'll add that not finding ammo all the time really isn't a factor. I just add in a hundred rounds for a new rifle when I buy it into the price if I don't already have some. Can't get why people will spend $1-3k, but forget to budget in ammo.
Hmmmm, lemme see...5 boxes of Hornady ELD-X 162 grain 280 AI @ $96 a box of 20 v 5 boxes of Hornady ELD-X 162 grain 7 Rem Mag @ $70 a box of 20. Or, handload a couple hundred 7 Rem Mag with the same 162 grain Hornady ELD-X bullet for around $100 bucks, with range brass I've got up the wazoo; left by guys who don't handload, only buy bulk off the rack. 🤔
@@bustabass9025 You need to shop around a bit. I bought a couple of boxes of Nosler 160 gr Ballistic tips for less than your Hornady's as a baseline and a hundred pieces of Nosler/Lapua brass for $75 last December. I have primers and powder & the hunting bullets I use are $1.40 each (Hammers) and aren't in any factory loads. My original point is that is that you should include the entire cost of the system when you buy a rifle - scope mounts, base, sling, swivels, and yes ammunition and reloading supplies like dies, etc.. I won't ever knock the 7mm RM, but my 280 Ackley with scope is about the same weight as a nekkid 7mm RM, and it's 2" shorter and handier. Also 1.5 to 2 times the barrel life and less recoil. If you prefer a heavier more cumbersome rifle with more recoil that your prerogative. I concede that being heavier and longer it would make a better club if you were out of ammo.
@@seventhmonkey1160 And my point is the 7mag is a tried, and true cartridge, and has more than held its own in spite of the new offerings in .284 caliber, since its release, some sixty years ago. I suspect it will continue to do so. As a thirty-plus year handloader, the last thing I worry about is running out of ammo, or recoil for that matter. In addition, the particular cartridge I want, with the desired projectile is pretty much instantaneously available at a fraction of the cost. No, "...need to shop around" for anything. Every rifle in my collection I handload for, all the way up to 30-378 Wby is pretty predictable as to how it's going to react with the loads I've worked up for it. I suppose if clubs are your thing, any of them, including your rather obscure .280 will fit that bill. Particularly if you didn't layout another several hundred up front for off the rack ammo when you bought your rifle, which incidentally you couldn't find anyway because of shortages. In any event, "prerogative" is a good thing. That's why we have so many choices. The only point that I will "concede" is that, it's good to consider the cost of ammo as an operating expense; perhaps if you don't handload. By comparison however, it is less of a cost concern if you are a handloader. You tend to accrue a lot of handloading components you need to develop the cartridges you want over thirty years. To sum it all up, you're free to choose what you want, and I am likewise. We like what we like for whatever reasons we like it. Other's opinions notwithstanding.
@@bustabass9025 Sigh... The 280 has been around since the 1950's and the 7mm RM since the early 60's. That makes the 7mm RM the new kid on the block. Heck, I've even been around longer than the 7mm RM. They both shoot the same bullet at about the same speed. To say that one or the other is more proven is pure ignorance. The 7mm RM is more available in rifles and ammo is easier to find, and about 50 whopping fps faster. In exchange you get to lug around a heavier slightly more cumbersome rifle. That's about it. It's still one of my all time favorite cartridges. I'm a reloader as well and the vast majority of what I have shot are my own loads. If you've only been at this game for 30 some years it's probable you were in diapers when I started developing my first rounds.
@@seventhmonkey1160 Comparative longevity doesn't make anything good, better, or best. The performance speaks for itself whether it's been around for seventy or seven years. Just because you prefer one thing over another, for whatever reason, doesn't mean that everyone else will or should embrace it. That's where the ignorance lies. So, you prefer the 280 AI. Good for you. I happen to prefer the 7mm Rem Mag. Far be it from me to try and convince you or anyone else for that matter different. Incidentally, the 280 AI was a wildcat cartridge until Nosler had it standardized in 2007. Hardly the proven track record you would have the world believe. Handloading data hasn't always been as readily available, as it was for S.A.A.M.I. cartridges. I'm not convinced. Besides, it only bests the 280 Remington by a smaller margin than the 7mag exceeds its velocity. To each your own.
I know a lot of people love the 7 mag but those people only shoot 20 shots a year and have no experience with the 280. I've owned both, early on the 7mm. I didn't know any better and had no idea of the problems with the belted magnums. Then I started reloading. I worked through those problems with headspacing and horrible accuracy and was enlightened to the ease and power of the 280. Compared to the 7mm mag the 280 is a breeze to reload and hit your target and I never looked back. I spent many years doping out 7 mags for friends that sweared they were the next coming until I showed them the groups I posted at 300 and the need to explain that a 2.5" group at 200 wasn't anything to write home about. Currently I'm shooting a 280 AI and 1moa is like phoning home. The 7 mag has gotten better over the years but it's still the ugly duckling and shooting less than par groups IMHO. The long story short is the Belted magnums just suck, have you seen any new offerings in the last 30 years ? There's a reason for that. Those in the know shoot a 280.
What a load of shit. My 7mm rem mag shoots .5 inch groups with 150 and 175 hand loads and I couldnt give 2 shits about the AI,s more efficient case. The belt is not a big deal.and does,nt affect accuracy as much as you think. FYI, The 7mm mag does not headspace on the belt but on the shoulder. I personally like the belt even IF it is only cosmetic. Tha 280AI offers no reason for me to switch over since it DOES,NT equal 7mm mag velocities but comes close like you said. 7mm rem mag ALL DAY , FOR EVERYTHING with hooves.
I have never understood the recoil dilemma for standard deer size game rifle cartridges. If you can shoot a 2 3/4 high brass 12 gauge, 7 mag, 30-06, even 300 mag. is not that much different. Oh, out of these two cartridges, I vote for the 30-06...
The 7mm PRC is going to be interesting. I’m expecting 180gr ELDM at 3000-3050fps. Or 190gr ATIP at 2900. The biggest limiting factor of the 7mag for me is twist rate, so it’ll be good to have Hornady standardise a 1-8 or faster so we can really use those new 180’s. Probably the only cartridge I’d swap my 7mag barrel out for
I think the answer is 280AI, but the 7mm mag holds a place in my heart too. People will vote based on personal bias though so it'll probably go to the 7mm
People can’t fathom that he has been saying it’ll be a custom rifle and that he reloads. This will go to 7mm Rem Mag because people can’t vote for things they don’t know personally
Had a custom 280 I built. Own a 7mag also. Shooting them both until you get above 150 it’s pretty much the same except for the amount of powder. I know where 20+ boxes of 280 are right now.
I’m a little surprised at how little love the WSM got. Generally more efficient than the longer 30 magnums, not terrible recoil, short action, not too overbore. The 7’s in this list would be my last choices probably, although I do find the AI interesting.
It's a really tough call. If I'm making a purchase I need right now, for say a trip in 6 weeks, I'm going 7mm simply based on availability. If I'm moving to a new "go-to" hunting rifle, maybe something semi-custom and I'm taking the time for load development and so forth I'd go with the 280AI. I decided that for the purposes of this discussion I was building for the future, so I voted 280.
I don't own either caliber so I'm not biased, but I must say since they are essentially twins, it all comes down to availability. I have never in my life seen any AI ammo on the shelves, let alone 280 AI. But I do quite often see 7 mag. For that I give it to the 7 mag.
❤280 ai amazing cartridge and if you need more than a 280 ai go with 300 wsm with a brake or supressor its the most efficient 30 caliber what the 308 win always wanted to be
Not sure how you work out that the 300WSM is what the 308 always wanted to be, given that the 308 (or specifically the T65) was a military service cartridge first and one of its big problems was that it was too powerful for a select fire rifle. As a hunting cartridge, the 308 Win is significantly more balanced than a 300WSM in virtually all circumstances except for long range hunting, which people seem to think is the only hunting worth doing these days.
@@lawnfarmr399 300 wsm spanks a 308 any way you look at it, especially if you reload. The 300 wsm is based off the 404 Jeffery case which is same as the nosler chamberings. 308 is boring af
@@69yenko65 Do you mean it spanks it ballistically? Because I thought that went without saying. But by that logic, you have to say all 30 cals are inferior to the 30-378, which didn’t even get a mention in this series as far as I know. For the vast majority of hunting situations, a 308 will do just as good a job as a 300WSM, and you have much less recoil, much longer barrel life, cheaper ammunition, more varied ammunition, much cheaper practice ammo, more ammo in the magazine, better short barrel performance, a wider selection of rifles and action types, and on top of all that, it will be much easier for 90% of shooters to shoot well. It’s boring because it’s common, and it’s common because it’s exceptionally good.
@@lawnfarmr399 the ammunition topic is a wash because I reload my own stuff. Recoil? put a brake on it and a limbsaver pad and when you wanna hunt, cap it. The 308 isn't the end all round lol it isn't exceptional at anything, it does the job with less recoil, cheap and that's exactly why it's common for people such as yourself.
@@69yenko65 yes but most people don’t reload (shock horror). Those people will probably be able to practice twice as much for the same level of barrel wear and money with a 308, which is going to be much more beneficial to them then the extra velocity. Also, muzzle breaks aren’t a magical fix, they have serious drawbacks, just go and ask a guide if they enjoy guiding someone with a braked 300 magnum. If ever you touch that bastard off without ear pro given a fleeting shot opportunity, boom there goes some of your hearing. I’m not saying the 300WSM isn’t the right cartridge for you, I know nothing about you, I’m saying for the average hunter (ie one that doesn’t invest the time to become proficient past 300 yards, or doesn’t have the opportunity to) the 308 is a better option than the 300WSM, and for long range hunting, the 300WSM is better. I was reacting to the idea that the 300WSM is what the 308 always wanted to be, which simply shows a massive lack of understanding of cartridge design.
I bought a Savage 110 Ultralight with the Proof Research barrel based on this channel's review of same. My son convinced me to get it in 280 AI. I was skeptical at first but after some research concluded he was right. It is super accurate and recoil is very manageable especially compared to my 300 WM, which i retired after buying the Savage. We reload so we have plenty of ammo. I cant say anything bad about the 7 mag but can say a lot of good things about the 280 AI and that rifle.
I've never seen a box of 280AI on the shelf in any store, there's a good chance you can find 7mm rem mag anywhere they sell ammunition, brass for reloading can be bought or picked up at any range, it's likely you won't be the only person in hunting camp with a 7mm rem mag either, almost every manufacturer will have a gun in 7mm rem mag, price of ammunition is considerably less expensive. For the record I've never owned either, I have a 7mm saum and a 6.5prc. My vote would go for a 6.5prc or a 270wsm
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Pin this please.
I have not seen any 280 since 90' in Florida but 7mm I was buy for less then $25 a box
I’m really loving the 7mm fan bois bickering down below like little zoomer college kids. “If you do this mine is better. No, mine is better because x,y,z. A cArTrIdGe MuSt Be MoDeRn!¡”
Meanwhile, all the adults are laughing with our standard and magnum 30 cals. Cheers gentlemen!
@@soonerfrac4611 So only children shoot 7mm and .30 caliber rounds are reserved exclusively for "adults"? Just want to make sure I've got that clear. Also are you claiming that there are no viable "modern" .30 caliber rounds? (300 Blackout, 300 PRC, 300 Norma Mag)
I hit the wrong button as I was saying I don’t think 2.5 cents would matter so I have to say the 7MM . I really like your channel you really give a lot of good information and your excitement is contagious thanks .
I'm a hand loader so the 280 AI. Is my choice. I prefer non belted cartridges all day every day. In the event there is ammo shortages I can always make 280AI out of a host of cartridges( 25-06 .270 .280 30-06 )with minimal effort.
280 Rem ammo is still pretty hard to find where I live. The same is true of the AI. 7 RM not so much-pretty much everywhere.
Valid points and a noticeable push from you for the 280 ai, but the availably of the 7 mag both in guns and ammo bullet weight clearly pushes the 7mag to the top.
Yaassss!!! 7 Rem! I have to say over these last few years I have been obsessed with the 7 Remington Magnum. It’s been more than capable and it has given me this confidence hunting here in Alaska. I have had zero issues with taking game and it is fun to shoot at distance for practice.
The 280AI uses less powder, has less recoil, does not have a belted case, provides more cartridge capacity in a shorter handier rifle, all while delivering essential the same performance as the 7 Mag. 280 AI for the WIN!
7 mag for the win based on ammo availability alone
@@69yenko65 I’ve seen more 280AI ammunition for sale in the last 2 years than any of the popular cartridges 7RM included. I have both and I love my 7RM but my 280AI has a sweet spot in my heart.
My preference is for the 40 S&W over 9mm, and over the last 2 years it’s been pretty consistent on the shelves. In fact, a lot of oddball calibers have been on the shelves, doesn’t mean they are more available. Usually means nobody is buying them, it usually means that everyone is buying the mainstream calibers.
The 280 AI should be better represented, sadly it’s not. That’s why it’s a travesty that the parent cartridge isn’t on here as the GOAT.
All great points. If there were more rifles chambered in this as well as ammo availability I would 100% agree. Unfortunately those are two huge issues with the 280ai.
@@appaloosaman9616 I have never seen 280ai ammo in person ever.
7 mag. It’s a no brainer. As ammo dried up in the stores during the latest “crisis” the last thing saw on the shelves was 300 mag, Win and short, 7 mag, and 350 legend. BTW, my Thompson Compass hold 4 in the mag. This was not the case with my Browning or Ruger.
By that logic it should be 308. That was never off the shelf. Also 9mm.
@@TeensierPython both where off the shelf
I moved during the pandemic and I can say in the west and in the Midwest 280 ai was not hard to come by well into 2021. 7 mag was widely available as well but after 2020 Wisconsin deer opener good luck finding one
@@TeensierPython it’s more about the best all round hunting rifle. If you just looked at ammo and recoil the .22LR would win obviously
It takes you 4 shots to hit you target ? I shoot a 280AI in a T/C Encore and in a hunting situation never had to take more than one shot.
I own bought and don’t think you can go wrong with either. However, If I could only have one rifle for life I’d pick one chambered in 280ai.
As a handloader, I have found that much more performance can be achieved in the 7 mag vs factory ammo. It's like the factory stuff is leaving a lot on the table.
My vote is for 7mm Rem Mag
Thank you. Handloading makes the 7mag a fantastic performer at all bullet weights. It wins for me as well. Plus the more recoil is mitigated with a brake or suppressor if needed.
@Craig Sanford i agree if recoil is not an issue. I felt like the .270 was invented to murder me when I loaded it at those levels (I'm a lean fellow). I settled on the 30-06 when I became a proficient handloader though- because I can load it down or up depending on my needs- as with most cartridges in 7mm and 30cal. They are all super versatile, and it's hard to beat the 7mm projectile. I think the 7m has too much space for the range I need. But for someone that can honestly take that much recoil and stay accurate, it's hard to fault it. It's beyond my tolerances though.
Same can be said for hand loading a 280AI. Both have significant gains by loading vs factory.
And with rl26. A 7mag is a rocket with 26+ inches of barrel.
Absolutely Codyway! The 7mag reloading data is very stingy. I can get a 175gr. going 3000fps and a 150gr. going 3200fps comfortably and with great accuracy.
I absolutely love the .280AI. Very impressive ballistics with the amount of powder needed. 7mag has been around for years and is one of the most popular cartridges on the market that is proven. Those who handload know how impressive the .280AI performs. I understand most people voting for 7 mag because it’s been around and proven for years. I own and love both, but I am sold on the .280AI!
Agreed. I hand load and shoot the .280AI out 900m in F-class. Also a lot fun hitting heavy silhouette targets at 500m. However, definitely a reloader’s cartridge
7mm Rem Mag hands down you can find it on the selves
about 20 years ago I bought a regular 280. not because I needed one or even wanted one but because i had gone to the store for primers and saw a Rem 700CDL with the most stunning piece of wood I have ever seen on a factory rifle. No way could Ileave the store without it. Its not particularly accurate but i just like looking at it.
I have owned and shot the 7mm Remington Magnum for over forty years and my experience has been in a hunting application the recoil is a non-factor. Recoil only becomes a problem at the Range when multiple shots are taken during practice and load development. My own experience has been when shooting Deer even large Bucks 250 lb or larger they are typically DRT. My vote is for the 7mm Magnum if you do your part it is always a clean Kill. Also, My Browning BBR holds three in the magazine and one in the chamber when hunting.Normally. with the 7mm Mag you only need 1 shot
I have had a 7 Mag since 73 and 280 later
I’ve got to go with the 280AI, I’ve owned three 7mags, but didn’t like them, but I love the 280AI
Sold my 7mm rem mag for a 280ai build on a tikka action. One of my better decisions.
Just bought a 280 ackley. Being a lefty I'm limited on options for rifle and caliber choices but settled on a savage 110 ultralite. Currently don't have an available 7 rem mag that I want. I just like 7mm in general both are winners in my book.
7 Mag wins when you seat the bullets out to full length properly. Sometimes you need a longer throat though. 280AI will hit its peak with a 24" barrel. 7 Rem needs a 26 or 28" barrel to hit its peak. In a 24" barrel, the 7rem is basically just a less efficient 280AI, but with the longer barrel, 7 Rem's extra powder gets to burn in the tube instead of flying out the end of the barrel unburnt. When that happens you can see gains of 200FPS over 280AI with the same length barrel. In most ordinary hunting situations, 280AI is probably better, but for optimal trajectory, 7mag wins. 28 Nosler is even better though.
You realize you can seat the .280 AI out to full length as well (~3.6"), right? And the .280 AI doesn't have the capacity of the 7mm Rem Mag, but is SAAMI spec'd to 4,000 PSI higher max average chamber pressure; 61,000 for the 7mm Rem Mag, verses 65,000 PSI for the .280 AI.
Yeah but then you’re carrying a 26” barrel?
great information - but what practical hunter wants to carry a 26" barrel let alone a 28" barrel?
@@williammarshall3043 A practical hunter that could easily shoot elk at 1200 yards. But. Shoot what you like and can shoot well. Different strokes for different folks.
@@williammarshall3043 Talk to the game bird hunters with 32"+ barrels. Barrel length really only matters with ease of traversing heavy brush, and the weight.
I vote for the 280AI, I don't have one but I'd love to have one and being that it will perform basically on par with the 7mm rem mag with less recoil would be awesome maybe my next rifle will be a 280AI
Think you fully understand the 280AI - performance at each end of the gun - amazing combination.
IT DOESN'T equal 7 mag performance. This ITS REAL CLOSE BS is getting nauseating. You can push a 150 gr 7mm mag bullet to 3300 fps. The best the 280 AI can get is around 3000. HOW ID THAT ALMOST EQUAL. 300 FPS is a huge advantage in trajectory and wind drift when your shooting 4& 500.yds.
@twolak1972 correct it does not equal 7mm rem mag what I'm stating is you have roughly 150fps differences in factory loadings that means yes the 7mm rem mag will shoot flater faster farther but it's a closer trajectory than my .308 compared to a 7mm rem mag. And if you look at 7mm rem mag as an ideal or benchmark western cartridge and all the bc advantages from 7mm bullets then a lightweight rifle chambered in 280AI and ethical shooting distances make pretty good since to me. Besides if I wanted a 7mm rem mag I'd get a 7mm rem mag or step up to the 28 nosler but why should I go for more recoil.
Between the two I vote 7mm mag, because I know 15 years from now ammo will still be readily available, there isn't any cartridge developed in the last 25 years that significantly improves on the performance of the 7mm mag.
I've heard a theory that might have a smidge of truth. In order to force the purchase new guns the industry is chambering and producing ammo for the "new" calibers very much limit all offerings in "old". Yesterday I noticed at my local Farm and Fleet that they were stocked with fresh 6.5 creed, 6.5 PRC, 6.8prc, and 27 nosler, these are not the typical farm and fleet types of calibers, but there they were in several bullet options. It might be that in 15 years or less your 7mm ammo won't be readily available. That the new caliber ammo is being produced and on the shelves BEFORE the tried and true isn't a good omen in my mind.
7rum ,7STW, 7Weatherby mag
28nosler,7wsm
@@rickyanke9407 so Hornady, Federal, and Remington are trying to sell new guns for others? That would be a lot of competitors working together.
@@2Advocate2021 don't forget 7mm LRM and the new 7mm PRC that's coming out.
Have had three 7mm Rem Mags over the years since 1976. Used more than any other cartridge, it has never let me down. 99.9 % one shot kills. 7 mag will always be my favorite all time caliber and Rifle. (My others in gun cabinet: .243, .270,
.300 Win Mag, and .300 Weatherby). All are sweet shooters.
Have the Rem 700 7mag. 26” barrel, Magpul stock, Nightforce SHV scope. Almost 12lbs, recoil not bad with break. Have the Kimber Montana 280AI with Tract Optics scope. ~8lbs all up, shoots lights out. Similar ballistics, I vote for 280 AI
I was following this series intently as I pondered my next hunting rifle. Oddly, I had already narrowed it down to 7mag and 280AI before this video. This confirms everything I thought, but still isn't making my decision easier. Since I mostly hunt farm country in NY, a 300-yd shot is likely my limit; and it's all whitetail or black bear, but I do plan on eventually heaving west for elk. Right now I'm leaning toward the 7mag because of rifle/ammo availability. Barrel length isn't a major factor since you still can't own suppressors in NY, tho I will certainly but a break on whichever I get.
I just picked up the x-bolt speed in the 280 ai and think it’s a great,accurate, and efficient caliber. No real issues finding reloading components. And the barrel is 2” shorter than a mag caliber rifle.
Hey there Keith, looking for an xbolt speed myself. Where'd you find one in stock?
@@dakotacarter4439 I found mine in A small town in northern Alberta.
@@keithchikowski5583 can you please share info. I am looking for same
I looked at most of the gun shops on line in northern Alberta and saw the one I bought in a small community in Neerlandia. It was at the co-op. Other stores had the 280AI but not in browning which I wanted. It has the recoil of a 243 with the muzzle brake and is very accurate.
How are u liking that 280ai xbolt I can't decide between it and 7mm08 in the xbolt
7mm mag!
I would have to go with 7 mag ... I don’t know that I have ever seen a box of 280 ai for sale at any of my local gun stores.
It’s pretty common I usually see it in idaho and iowa where I’ve been lately
@@landonboomsma2594 I think it’s one of those things if you don’t use it you don’t notice it.
Got my ultralight camilla in 280ai back in November and found ammo pretty easy for months picking up several hundred just in case. Looked today and I couldn't find any but well over a 6 month span ammo was easy to find online, even picked up 6 boxes locally.
Savage 110 ultralite 280 ai with an Omega 300. Hard to beat inexpensive 500 yard hunting rig
You're right. That's a sweet setup.
I'd agree but I would switch out the Omega 300 for an AB Raptor.
never heard of .280AI, and certainly have never seen it's ammo on the shelves... i have heard of 7mm mag and occasionally see it on the ammo shelve. i chose the 30-06 over 40 years ago and even this stuff is getting hard to find...
Got to say 30/06 is what I have had the longest. It'll tip a big animal over backwards and everything involved was not difficult to locate anywhere. Ackley is a wildcat produced in competition with Weatherby which are rather dated platforms of incredible excellence. Long ago shooters discovered you can kill your quarry with a 303 British as well as a 308 Weatherby a lot cheaper than and absolutely just as dead. Guns like Ruger and good Remington ammo & Federal, Winchester gets the job done beautifully precise W/o the price drama.
30-06 is dead. 280 AI is the 7mm Mags modern brother
You’re joking right? 280 AI is like finding hens teeth! Even hardware stores carry 7mm and -06! When I go into the LGS the racks with the most options are 308, 30-06, 300 win, 6.5, and 7Rem, in that order. There might be 5 boxes of 280 in the entire store, the others each have dedicated sections for ammo.
280AI is great for hand loaders. But if you are hand loading that ancient -06 that the 280 is based on will be very good, approaching 300wm velocities.
280 AI is the apex of performance in a non-magnum cartridge. There is no technically superior round in any aspect of non-dangerous big game hunting without stepping up to a magnum. If you were going to hunt something dangerous there’s a case for having a cartridge that starts with a 3.
30-06 is a close second. And 300 yards and under it’s no discernible difference. Coupled with the fact that the 280 AI is a little exotic while the ‘06 is ubiquitous, and the ‘06 is still king 116 years later.
@@Inveniam22 the 30-06 is far from dead. I dare say you’d be hard pressed to find a place that sells ammunition that doesn’t have a box of 30-06. And I think the same is true for rifles. Every model of hunting rifle I’ve ever seen comes in 30-06, and I think you’d have a hard time finding a place that sells guns that doesn’t have one.
Also, I think it’s still the most popular hunting round in North America, if not the world, and has been for a very, very long time.
Thank you for another great video. 7MM Mag it is !!
I love your channel and the break down of cartridges. I have been glued to these wars from the beginning. I am a Wyoming resident who is a fanatic of big game hunting. My family and I will be in St G for spring break vacation and I’d love to have you and you family meet mine. I am a hunter mentor with the first hunt foundation. I’m also a 280 Rem fan with the 700 action. Tom
My vote goes to the 7mm Rem Mag. I have owned one for 36 years. It has been around a long time and simply gets it done. I bet 280 AI ammo will be more expensive since it is not a readily available round.
It's great, but a belted cartridge can't be the best. It's just outdated and unnecessary. Take the belt off, index off the shoulder, and you have a winner.
280ai can't be found around here ; last I saw it Dec2021 was around $85/box. 7mag is on the shelves if you look hard enough, about $48/box. Other than this, my preference is the 280ai
280AI doesn't cost any more than 7mag ammo. If your gun store is charging almost double for 280AI they're just gouging, or you're comparing Nosler Trophy Grade ammo to Remington Core Lokt prices. I've never paid over $50 for 280AI ammo, Nosler or Federal Terminal Ascents.
I feel that when someone says an cartridge is “outdated” is one of the most ignorant, zoomer things you can say. It seems to be a popular thing to say, a cartridge is “outdated, we must have a more modern cartridge!” The real irony is that the 280 AI is based on a nearly 120 year old cartridge.
@@sneakybow1 Yes, that is exactly what it is because that is all that was available. I did see federal premium 7mm this past weekend at $58 a box. Haven't seen 280AI after 2021 year end.
My vote goes to the 7mm Rem Mag. During your tally, I think you forgot to give a point to the 7mm rem mag for rifle availability. I do not think 1.5 lbs of energy makes a difference in recoil. I think you are favoring the AI. I have never owned the AI. I have had a couple 7mm rem Mags, so maybe I am favoring it, LOL who knows. I just recently purchased a new 7mm rem mag in the Christensen Arms Mess LR. I do think both calibers were offered. That 70 fps t/- and more energy is what sold me on the cartridge. Also availability of the ammo. You keep referring back to a few years back when we could get ammo. Well, we are not living in that time now. I honestly have never seen 280 AI in the gun store here in Maine. I haven't intentionally looked for it though. I will start just t see. I do see 7mm rem mag once in a while. We here are still having a tough time getting ammo regularly.
Exactly!!
I'm familiar with both. I also prefer lighter rifles. I think there is a noticeable step difference with the recoil. I put the 280 AI about midway between 7mag and 308. When I use the break, I'll say about 270 win like. Either way, I prefer the 280AI, but think the mag is an awesome cartridge.
7 rem mag = 280 AI performance with more recoil, less rounds in the magazine, a longer barrel, more expensive ammo (I reload), and a silly belt.
I’ve owned a 7 rem mag and shot and hunted with a ton of it. I’ve shot and hunted with a 280 ack, but never had the pleasure of owning one. Terminal effect is equal, but in comparison the 280 ack is a sweetheart to shoot, carry, and reload. If I could find one I liked left handed (story of my life) I’d snap it up in a heartbeat.
Honestly I’ve seen 280 in more gun stores then common rounds the past two years. It’s takes longer to sell out vs more common rounds are gone the next day cuz everyone wants it
@@landonboomsma2594 in two years I think I saw one box of regular 280 rem and I still haven't seen any 280 AI. that is around here where I live in Maine. I have seen 7mm rem mag way more often.
When you first asked these questions to kick off "Cartridge Wars". What caliber would you choose if you had to pick just one cartridge to do the following. If you had a neighbor who was wanting to get into big game hunting and he ask you what cartridge would you recommend to him? And then the second question was. What one cartridge would you choose to just go out on a Saturday and just shoot to have fun? So one caliber to do both things.
I see how your brackets got to the 7mm REM Mag as the winner. However this fall I was going to buy a new rifle and I really wanted a 6.8 Western. Long story short I couldn’t get what I wanted; so I decided to looked into these two cartridges: 6.5 PRC and the 7mm REM Mag. After reviewing tons of videos and reading a lot of material. I am now re-answering you two questions from cartridge wars and the winning is: 6.5 PRC!!! I really wanted the 6.8 to be the winner, but the extra recoil said to me that it wouldn't be a first choice to take out on a Saturday and shoot all day long.
The 6.5 PRC. -- What an amazing cartridge. I love that it can compete with the 7mm out to 1000 yards in these categories: wind drift, bullet drop, velocity, and energy. What really blows me away is that the recoil is significantly less than the 7mm. If you went to a range and just shot a lot of rounds. You would be a lot happier shooting the 6.5 PRC. A lot of people are saying that you can take any animal with a 6.5 that you could take with a 7mm. So if I had to choose one cartridge, I would pick the 6.5 PRC.
Don't take this bad, I am not knocking on you at all. You are a wealth of knowledge and I thought you did a great job as always. Thanks for sharing.
"7Mag Daddy"!
Love loading for mine. It's like a faithful companion. Always delivers, doesn't complain about the powder/bullet concoctions I feed it, and never gets jealous when I go to any of its Weatherby stable mates first call.
Put both in a light rifle and you'll know why.
Try to max out velocity with hand loads and you'll get a stiff bolt sooner with the magnum.
7mm RM is an excellent cartridge, but the efficiency really makes the difference.
280AI.
Huh? What does that mean? Those max loads in the 7mm are going to be going quicker than the 280 regardless especially with anything over 160gr
@@TexanUSMC8089 Less powder and same velocity equals greater efficiency.
I throw bullets in my 280AI at and over that of 7mmRM.
@@devinb3397 Higher preassure equals higher velocity. 280 will tolerate higher preassure due to design. Paired with greater efficiency the difference between the two is insignificant.
Will the mag send heavier bullets faster? Maybe. But the 280AI handles up to 200 gr bullets very well.
@@johanlindh737 source? The 7mm is faster in every single way lol
@@devinb3397 Not significantly...
7 mag. You can and will find it everywhere. That’s more important than we once imagined.
Personally I own rifles chambered in both and really like both but I like my 280AI a little more. It's a more efficient cartridge and like you mentioned you can get away with a shorter barrel. Even though a couple inches don't seem like a lot when you're hunting with a suppressor it makes a big difference. The 7mm Rem Mag is a great cartridge and when it comes to performance they're tied it all comes down to efficiency and a more handy rifle nothing else.
The 280 AI based on the *actual* GOAT cartridge would be my vote if it had more availability. In my area I’ve certainly never seen any at my local Walmart, & rarely at the gun stores in town. The 7mm Rem on the other hand is basically everywhere, including some of the hardware and farm supply stores.
But those stores more often than not also have 30-06 & 308 Win as well.
These days the ones that sale the most the ammo isn't always on the shelves when you need them.so stock up.
@@robertwolfe2971 I'm a handloader but if I wasn't the ammo thing would be a concern for sure...
I live and hunt in Alaska, and the plain old 280 Remington works just fine.
I own both , and think they both perform really well. I think the 7Mag will win over the 280Ai for really one reason . I have never met someone (and I’m not saying there isn’t) who have already owned a 280Ai before a 7mag . I see the average hunter or shooter getting into more ballistics and reloading coming across the 280AI after having already own a 7MAG due to the fact the 7Mag is already a well enough gun for overall for the average hunter and shooter. Even though the 280Ai has been around for a while also. In my location , having owned both rifles (and every location is different) 7mag has been way easier to get a old of factory ammo before the pandemic and even the Obama scare way back when. And I mention factory ammo cause the average hunter or shooter does not reload ammunition. Great Video, good points of perspective!
280AI for the win!
And now you made me go and buy a 280AI. Got a left handed Savage Ultralight. found 100 pieces of Nosler brass and dies. This is my 5th 7mm rifle and will be a tie for Elk rifle next year. The 7SS is a pig (I built it that way) and I am trying to trim some weight where this Ultralight I can add a few more creature comforts and not worry about it being a 15lbs rifle. 🙂
I vote 280 AI even though my first rifle was a 7mm Remington Magnum in a BDL Remington Rifle and a Redfield Wide Field Range Finder 3 X 9 Scope. Still vote for the 280 AI in a 24 inch long barrel and muzzle brake.
Two awesome cartridges. 300prc is my favorite magnum tho. 7mm and 280 AI I can currently find ammo for however. That new rumored 7mm prc has my interest
I'm having a hard time seeing where the 7 PRC fits in. The 7mm field of cartridges is very crowded. The 7mm-08, 280 rem, 280 AI, 7mm rem mag seem to have the hunting general purpose well covered. I can only see the 7 PRC slotting between 28 Nosler and 7mm mag ... extending point blank range, high bc bullets for long range, and greater recoil. Some are going to love it but it won't be for most 7mm users. I'm starting to see it as a niche cartridge and possibly a bad idea .
If efficency rules, the 280 AI wins
For net hunting purpose the 7rm wins
Belted or non belted personal choice.
With 280 AI you are a little different from masses, but that will not give you hunting advantage.
The 280 AI has a kind of exotic charm and i like that
The 7prc will be the next revolution in 7 caliber
I don't own a 280AI but I am very interested in getting one. I have fired many rounds from the 7mm Rem mag and also the 284win which is also very good for the case capacity, which is less than the 280AI. It looks like the 280AI falls between the rem mag and the 284win. I have compered the 7rem mag to the 284win and found the rem mag has an extra 135 fps lead but those cartridges were not loaded by the same people, so it might not be dead on. There is no doubt that the smaller cases are more efficient. The 284win is very popular in Australia for long distance competitions.
I vote 280AI. I have had rifles in both calibers and both worked great. But recoil is noticeably less with the 280AI, and I can get 5 cartridges in the 280AI I now have which, fully scoped and loaded, still weighs a little under 8 lbs. Reloading for the 280AI has been easy for me, and accuracy has been stellar. I started shooting the 280AI in the early to mid 90’s and have had outstanding success with it in the field. It has done everything I asked of it with ease and style.
Since I own a Browning A-bolt white gold medallion in 7mm Rem. mag I’ll take that as a win for me. Lol
In current times 7mag just based on ammo. Having that said, if 280ai wasn’t hard to find it wins hands down in my opinion.
I always wonder about this. I don’t buy ammo. I reload. But can’t you just order it? Like, a couple websites right now are telling me I can have as much 280 ack as I want in 2 months. So couldn’t the ammo availability problem be solved by either saving up and making a big purchase once a year or so or buying a little bit regularly with a long lead time? If I bought a box now (Apr 1) and then another box on may 1, and then another box on June 1… starting June 1 I could have a box show up to my house every month. No? Maybe it’s just the reloaded in me but that’s how I get reloading supplies.
If you load your own ammo the 280 ai is a no brainer! My first new big game bolt action was a 700 bdl my wife bought me for birthday in the early 80s. My son has a tikka stainless t3x 280 ai, These rifles are both excellent hunting rifles! Take your pick? No bad choices here!
As some on who owns at least one rifle cartridge in every caliber up to 338, the best all around cartridge is hands down is the 280AI.
The advantages of the 280AI over the 7mag far out weigh the 50-100fps the 7mag has over the 280AI.
Also most people don’t have multiple rifle cartridges and when someone states “I’ve shot the (fill in the blank) for 50 years, bla bla bla”. That just tells me they have very limited experience with anything else, and are obviously biased towards their cartridge.
Exactly! I’ve read over 300 comments on here so far and I have yet to read one that says I own both and I prefer the 7RM over the 280AI but I’ve seen tons that have read the opposite.
Have hunted with a 7 mag and the recoil from the rifle I was using seemed to be a little hard to me. Have not had the pleasure of ever firing a 280AI but I think that if I were shooting a lot say in a tournament I would rather have the 280AI. FOR THAT REASON I VOTE 280AI
How you going vote for 280ai because of the recoil but never fired one 🤔
I’m going by the amount of reported recoil.
7 rem mag.
It came down to two very similar performance cartridges. The other one very close to these two is the 6.8 Western...but it was to new to win a popularity contest.
Well done. Great series.
7mm REM Mag
7 Mag!
At some point in this series you said something along the lines of 'a cartridge the whole family can shoot game targets ect'. That's a no Brainer. Less recoil and minimal fps loss.
I just ordered a mark v deluxe 340 weatherby for my alaskan hunt with a 454 casull on the chest i appreciate all the info abd dedication you put in
I have a mark V deluxe in 340 wby from the 90s. Its a great gun and even better cartridge.
@@Nick-sx6jm ❤❤❤❤love the 340 so far
I dont have a reloading book in front of me, but the 7 mag should have a more significant advantage for reloaders because of case capacity and underloaded factory ammo. So I think I would rather have the little extra at that point as well as MUCH more availability considering I have never seen 280AI in a store.
The 280 ai is very underloaded from factory and picks up significantly when reloaded. It’s a much more efficient cartridge then the 7mm.
@@JAKDRZR Its really not that much more efficient.
280AI 150gr - 63.0gr to get 3107 fps
7 mag 150gr - 63.0gr to get 3248 fps
280AI 175gr - 59.5gr to get 2903 fps
7 mag 175gr - 62.5gr to get 2970 fps
The reloading data (at least from Nosler) shows that the 7 mag is about equal or more efficient in some weights. I wouldnt call that much more efficient and personally I would rather have the 70-150 fps more.
@@Nick-sx6jm you can’t compare different types of powder. The 63gr in the 280ai is IMR 7828 while in the 7mag 7828 you need 68gr to go 3168 so it really is much more efficient.
@@Nick-sx6jm at 700 yards with my load it’s still 2050fps and 1640ftps energy. I will never shoot a animal that far anyway but that’s still a dead moose/elk. I don’t think they’d know the difference if the bullet was going 75fps slower.
@@Nick-sx6jm you need to look at a different manual if they're burning that much powder in a 280AI to hit those numbers with 150gr projectiles
7mm mag
I love my custom 280 AI. I’m shooting a Remington 700 LA with a Krieger 26.5” barrel. Timney trigger. Glass bedded. Gunsmithing done by John King. Pre barrel break in I’m shooting 175gr Hornady ELX at 2814. Now that barrel is broke in I’m going to push it up to 3k maybe over. Easily a .5” or better rifle. 1000 yard elk killer AND pleasant to shoot.
Update- I switched to factory Precision Hunter 162gr. Shooting at 2920fps. My barrel twist needed a slightly smaller bullet. But I’m getting better than .5” moa.
Have both it’s the 280AI for me
7mm Rem Mag.
280 AI gets my vote. Non magnum cartridge with magnum performance, seems better to me.
My vote goes to the venerable 7 mag. Availability, history, tradition and it's just one of those calibers set in stone of it's performance. It's the massive reason the 280 and 7 express never really took off in popularity. Thus, making it difficult to find rifles and ammo for them. And then you have the 7mm-08 brining up the rear. Between the mag and 08, all bases are covered.
i really loved this video i am currently a student at sdi and love it very informative school. I'm going to have to say the 280 ai it's a pretty awesome cartridge it is a nice do all cartridge and in one of your other videos talking about what cartridge to use on game you pretty had the 280 ai for every single game animal almost expect the varmints.
I would vote for the 280 AI, as a one gun solution! But lets be honest... Who wants one gun? I would be so much better armed with a 7-08 featherweight rifle & a long range/big game 300mag. SO.... Can I suggest a 3 or 5 gun battery series next? If your spending thousands of dollars on hunting trips all over the country or world why just have one gun?
7mm mag!!!!!
Just stop it. You know it, I know it
It’s hard to go wrong with either one. The 7 Mag has the most pure performance but the 280AI isn’t far behind. P.O. Ackley really knew what he was doing with this design. The 280 makes a better range gun and it’s shorter barrel is handier in brush or a blind. I’d say, if you hunt and don’t handload or want the most options, go with the big 7. If you want something a little different that isn’t far behind and you spend more time on the range with your handloads, the 280AI might be your perfect choice. I vote for the 280AI.
280AI. Less powder for similar velocities, same bullet selection, and belted magnums are antiques. You have to burn a good bit more powder to achieve slight gains in velocity. Powder is getting more expensive by the day. 280AI is an easy to load for and accurate.
I’m currently building a custom tikka in 7 mag. I was gonna just rechamber my tikka 270 to a 280ai but ammo availability talked me out of it. Just waiting on my carbon barrel and I should be good to go.
Unfortunately, .277 cal barrels can't be rebored to .284 cal anyways. There's a .001" overlap in the old rifling. It's unfortunate because I was looking into the same thing before building my 280AI from scratch.
@@noahhorinek I was gonna change the barrel on it anyways and put a carbon barrel on it. Luckily with tikka all there standard actions use the same bolt so all I would need to change is the barrel then it would be good to go.
@@chaysewalker1542 I built my 25-06 fast twist on a Tikka. It's a great shooting rifle. Hope yours turns out well
7 mag.
My 2 cents is 280ai if your a reloader and a 7mag if you buy factory stuff. You can reload 280ai to the same as factory 7mag.
Short action is one of my main requirements (barrel length, weight) so I’d take the new 6.8 western, 6.5 PRC, 300 wsm.
Nothing wrong with these two choices though.
7 Remington Magnum…. You can always become a reloader and decrease the powder to match the slower 280AI. You can not increase the 280AI powder to match the 7 Rem Mag.
That's actually wrong, but okay. Handloaded 280AIs can exceed 7mag velocities. Even Nosler has some loads that exceed 7mag velocities in Nosler9. My personal 280AI with N560, H1000, and H4831 runs about 30-75 fps faster than my old 7 mag with every bullet weight I tested. 120-190.
Also, reduced loads are a tricky thing to get into, and not always the best thing for your rifle or brass.
@@macdaddy32 I have a 169 Hammer going right at 3000
@@macdaddy32 I have a 175 gr nosler ablr at 2959 out of a 26” barrel. 280ai. No pressure signs.
@@macdaddy32 RL 26 is pretty boss in the 280ai. Noslers reloading manual has it pushing a 175gr at 2903mv out of a 24” barrel.
That may be wrong to you Noah but I’ll stick to Noslers published data. Anyways 280 AI is a fine cartridge. Congrats on your results with yours.
This was a fun & interesting video series.
For me, a 30 cal ~ 180 grain bullet is the perfect do all "goldilocks" hunting bullet from deer to elk or bear as far as diameter/weight/SD
Then either a 308, 30-06 or 300 wsm to push it, you can't go wrong with any depending on need. 308 with 20" barrel , 30-06 with 22", or 300 wsm with 23". Probably hard to beat the 30-06 for the balance of everything.
Federal terminal ascent is my pick for best factory ammo for terminal performance, weight retention, expansion, penetration & accuracy.
I think you need to commit here on your choice, but include your viewers as backup. I have a Ruger M77 MK II in 7mm Rem Mag. I bought the rifle in 2000, and while still unboxed and unfired, took it to my local gunsmith for the installation of a muzzle brake. I also purchased dies, powder/primers/bullets for my reloader. The first shots I put through that rifle were my 139gr Sierra BT for hunting rounds. The brake made all the difference. I was able to refine this load to deliver 100 yard group sizes that could be covered with a dime. (my Burris Signature scope can get some credit here). Let me contrast this, my hunting buddy had purchased a Winchester 7mm Rem Mag at the same time, as we were going on the same hunt. His range time, each time, consisted of 5 shots. After that, he suffered target flinch in anticipation of the recoil. Some years ago, my wife was drawn for elk here in Arizona. She used my Ruger M77 MK II. I took her to the range, and she put 20 rounds through it before we ended the session. Again, the muzzle brake made all the difference. My longest shot was for antelope at just under 400 yards, while trotting. I had attempted to lead the buck to compensate for that distance. Whoa is me, the bullet literally hit point of aim, but still went down quickly. That's my learned lesson. This rifle still delivers the same group sizes, as when my friends and I had a 200 yard ping pong ball competition. We had fill the balls with talcum powder, and each were given 5 shots to attempt to hit them at that range. Guess who won? I vote the 7mm Rem Mag.
My first large caliber bolt rifle was a Sako AV 7mm rem mag. Got lucky and came across a field model w/ beautiful wood and not so lucky with a hard rubber butt pad. I was good for 3 shots at the range and after 7 I was wasting ammo. It was a 10lb rifle and I got tired of carrying it all day when out hunting and eventually sold it. Great memories though --- hit crosshairs on a target at 200 yards witnessed by my friend, first antelope at 360 yards, first cow elk around 225 yards, first bull elk around 80 yards and less than an hour into legal hunting time opening day.... and it goes on!!! 30-06, 270 win, 308, 243 win, 338 federal, 7mm-08 since and now just recently 280ai. None will be as memorable as my first!
Without watching your video, my choice is the 280 Ackley (AI) Improved cartridge!
I reload, so inexpensive 270 Winchester and/or 30-06 Springfield brass can be reloaded into 280 AI. 280 Remington/7mm Express Remington and/or 280 AI brass is expensive, but not actually required for the reloader.
The 7mm Remington (Rem Mag) Magnum brass is expensive. The belted magnum cases can form a bulge above the belt when reloaded multiple times. You will most likely use more powder and have more felt recoil with the 7mm Rem Mag cartridge.
Although you usually will be able to find factory rifles and ammunition for the 7mm Rem Mag.
Having reloaded 40⁰ Ackley Improved cartridges for decades I can confirm the brass doesn't grown in length compared to standard shoulders. The AI shoulder is more efficient.
Regardless on what you came up with the 280 Ackley Improved cartridge is the winner in my world!
Well goodie for you. I guess the extra 5 lbs of recoil from the 7 mag is a real shoulder snapper huh. The 280 AI doesnt have anything on the 7 mag. You mention 5 rounds to the 7mags 3. I have owned one for 32 years, shot hundreds of head of game and never needed the round under the 1st one. I might as well have ordered a ruger no.1 single shot . Your 5 round argument sounds like you shoot like shit and need every one on the field to fell game.
The .280 AI is the epitome of a modern 7mm cartridge - it's efficient, lower recoil, allows for a shorter barrel and higher magazine capacity. The 7mm Rem Mag is a great example of an old school cartridge - it's got more powder than it needs and it's even got an antiquated belt on it. (I've never heard anyone say "I love belted cartridges.") Y'all can vote how you want, but the .280 AI deserves the win in my opinion.
The most accurate rifle I've ever shot was chambered in 300 win mag, which has a belt lol
I love belted cartridges.
375 HH
8mm RM
300 HH
300 WM
7mm RM
264 WM.
Fantastic cartridges, the lot of them.
@@adamkadir3803 OK. Why?
@@southernmarksman From a practical standpoint?
Its not the belt specifically I admire, but I like belted cartridges because of their practicality and flexibility.
Lower pressures, easy feeding, good range of bullets, good speeds... They all do what they're designed to, well.
From an emotional standpoint, I think they have panache and history. No-one who watches Backfire is living, surviving and dying by hunting rifle alone. This is a hobby and a passion. I'm drawn to history and elegance. I like the sloped shoulders of a 300HH, I like the tapered body of a 375HH and its connection to a mystical Africa.
I like that someone saw an 8x57 with a 220gr bullet and said 'That. But 800fps faster.'
What can I say. You like what you like.
@@adamkadir3803 Thanks for the honest answer.
I see it says “cartridge wars season 1”. Makes me wonder what the next seasons might bring. Personally I would like to see a cartridge wars coyote calling rifle cartridge. Or predator rifle or whatever.
Early prediction: 243 wins it lol
With ammo and rifle availability being what it is I think the 7mm Mag is probably the way to go, although I believe the 280 AI may be the better cartridge.
I have a kimber m84L with a wood stock in280AI. It is very light and can carry 3 plus 1 shots. I don't feel like it kicks like a mule either. An absolute dream to carry. My vote is for the 280AI.
7mag all day, since your basing all the info off of book and shelf ammo it makes sense to also vote on on availability. Never have I seen .280ai on the shelf anywhere, never..
I reload and still give the advantage to the 7mag, it’s a pretty amazing cartridge, and I love 300 wins and Weatherby’s ! Lol
7 mm Rem Mag is much easier to find where I'm at for ammo. You also have WAY more rifle chambered in it. For an available, capable, hunting/long range rifle, there is nothing that beats 7mm Rem Mag. It deserves an entire cartridge profile on it. I have no doubts it will win catridge wars.
I own both. They both do a grear job. As a reloader I vote 280 AI. If I didn't it would be 7 mag. You really can't go wrong with either
You guys should do a review on the savage 110 high country!
I’ll say it again. Less than 2 inches of barrel length doesn’t matter. Even when hunting with a suppressor. I’ll give you the recoil argument because 1.5 lbs of extra recoil is significant. However painting it as “only 70 fps for 1.5 lbs of recoil” isn’t exactly honest.
Putting it as “1.5 lbs of recoil for an extra hundred lbs of downrange power” is much more honest. That is significant when hunting extended ranges.
Ammo and rifle availability isn’t near as close as it’s painted. 280 Ai is making a comeback, but it is nowhere near 7rem mag. Adding 280 Remington is also shady as it will hamper the ballistics. Even so combining the two still doesn’t put it near 7 rem mag for availability.
Ammo capacity is a big deal. Fitting more rounds in the gun is always better. 280AI wins hands down.
I still don’t see how the 7rem mag could lose. Obviously the video is biased towards 280AI, which is human nature. But this is my counter argument through the lens of my bias.
@@TexanUSMC8089 accuracy isn’t the problem. You’re using power to fire form your case to make it AI.
Very well put Sir.
Voted 280 AI, but it's a case of "tastes great" vs "less filling". I'll add that not finding ammo all the time really isn't a factor. I just add in a hundred rounds for a new rifle when I buy it into the price if I don't already have some. Can't get why people will spend $1-3k, but forget to budget in ammo.
Hmmmm, lemme see...5 boxes of Hornady ELD-X 162 grain 280 AI @ $96 a box of 20 v 5 boxes of Hornady ELD-X 162 grain 7 Rem Mag @ $70 a box of 20. Or, handload a couple hundred 7 Rem Mag with the same 162 grain Hornady ELD-X bullet for around $100 bucks, with range brass I've got up the wazoo; left by guys who don't handload, only buy bulk off the rack. 🤔
@@bustabass9025 You need to shop around a bit. I bought a couple of boxes of Nosler 160 gr Ballistic tips for less than your Hornady's as a baseline and a hundred pieces of Nosler/Lapua brass for $75 last December. I have primers and powder & the hunting bullets I use are $1.40 each (Hammers) and aren't in any factory loads.
My original point is that is that you should include the entire cost of the system when you buy a rifle - scope mounts, base, sling, swivels, and yes ammunition and reloading supplies like dies, etc..
I won't ever knock the 7mm RM, but my 280 Ackley with scope is about the same weight as a nekkid 7mm RM, and it's 2" shorter and handier. Also 1.5 to 2 times the barrel life and less recoil.
If you prefer a heavier more cumbersome rifle with more recoil that your prerogative. I concede that being heavier and longer it would make a better club if you were out of ammo.
@@seventhmonkey1160
And my point is the 7mag is a tried, and true cartridge, and has more than held its own in spite of the new offerings in .284 caliber, since its release, some sixty years ago. I suspect it will continue to do so.
As a thirty-plus year handloader, the last thing I worry about is running out of ammo, or recoil for that matter. In addition, the particular cartridge I want, with the desired projectile is pretty much instantaneously available at a fraction of the cost. No, "...need to shop around" for anything.
Every rifle in my collection I handload for, all the way up to 30-378 Wby is pretty predictable as to how it's going to react with the loads I've worked up for it. I suppose if clubs are your thing, any of them, including your rather obscure .280 will fit that bill. Particularly if you didn't layout another several hundred up front for off the rack ammo when you bought your rifle, which incidentally you couldn't find anyway because of shortages.
In any event, "prerogative" is a good thing. That's why we have so many choices. The only point that I will "concede" is that, it's good to consider the cost of ammo as an operating expense; perhaps if you don't handload. By comparison however, it is less of a cost concern if you are a handloader. You tend to accrue a lot of handloading components you need to develop the cartridges you want over thirty years.
To sum it all up, you're free to choose what you want, and I am likewise. We like what we like for whatever reasons we like it. Other's opinions notwithstanding.
@@bustabass9025 Sigh... The 280 has been around since the 1950's and the 7mm RM since the early 60's. That makes the 7mm RM the new kid on the block. Heck, I've even been around longer than the 7mm RM.
They both shoot the same bullet at about the same speed. To say that one or the other is more proven is pure ignorance.
The 7mm RM is more available in rifles and ammo is easier to find, and about 50 whopping fps faster. In exchange you get to lug around a heavier slightly more cumbersome rifle. That's about it. It's still one of my all time favorite cartridges.
I'm a reloader as well and the vast majority of what I have shot are my own loads. If you've only been at this game for 30 some years it's probable you were in diapers when I started developing my first rounds.
@@seventhmonkey1160
Comparative longevity doesn't make anything good, better, or best. The performance speaks for itself whether it's been around for seventy or seven years. Just because you prefer one thing over another, for whatever reason, doesn't mean that everyone else will or should embrace it. That's where the ignorance lies.
So, you prefer the 280 AI. Good for you. I happen to prefer the 7mm Rem Mag. Far be it from me to try and convince you or anyone else for that matter different. Incidentally, the 280 AI was a wildcat cartridge until Nosler had it standardized in 2007. Hardly the proven track record you would have the world believe.
Handloading data hasn't always been as readily available, as it was for S.A.A.M.I. cartridges. I'm not convinced. Besides, it only bests the 280 Remington by a smaller margin than the 7mag exceeds its velocity. To each your own.
I know a lot of people love the 7 mag but those people only shoot 20 shots a year and have no experience with the 280. I've owned both, early on the 7mm. I didn't know any better and had no idea of the problems with the belted magnums. Then I started reloading. I worked through those problems with headspacing and horrible accuracy and was enlightened to the ease and power of the 280.
Compared to the 7mm mag the 280 is a breeze to reload and hit your target and I never looked back. I spent many years doping out 7 mags for friends that sweared they were the next coming until I showed them the groups I posted at 300 and the need to explain that a 2.5" group at 200 wasn't anything to write home about. Currently I'm shooting a 280 AI and 1moa is like phoning home. The 7 mag has gotten better over the years but it's still the ugly duckling and shooting less than par groups IMHO. The long story short is the Belted magnums just suck, have you seen any new offerings in the last 30 years ? There's a reason for that. Those in the know shoot a 280.
What a load of shit. My 7mm rem mag shoots .5 inch groups with 150 and 175 hand loads and I couldnt give 2 shits about the AI,s more efficient case. The belt is not a big deal.and does,nt affect accuracy as much as you think. FYI, The 7mm mag does not headspace on the belt but on the shoulder. I personally like the belt even IF it is only cosmetic. Tha 280AI offers no reason for me to switch over since it DOES,NT equal 7mm mag velocities but comes close like you said. 7mm rem mag ALL DAY , FOR EVERYTHING with hooves.
I have never understood the recoil dilemma for standard deer size game rifle cartridges. If you can shoot a 2 3/4 high brass 12 gauge, 7 mag, 30-06, even 300 mag. is not that much different. Oh, out of these two cartridges, I vote for the 30-06...
The 7mm PRC is going to be interesting. I’m expecting 180gr ELDM at 3000-3050fps. Or 190gr ATIP at 2900. The biggest limiting factor of the 7mag for me is twist rate, so it’ll be good to have Hornady standardise a 1-8 or faster so we can really use those new 180’s. Probably the only cartridge I’d swap my 7mag barrel out for
I think the answer is 280AI, but the 7mm mag holds a place in my heart too. People will vote based on personal bias though so it'll probably go to the 7mm
People can’t fathom that he has been saying it’ll be a custom rifle and that he reloads. This will go to 7mm Rem Mag because people can’t vote for things they don’t know personally
True! I haven’t seen a single comment from anyone that said I own both and I prefer the 7RM.
Both are good. I lean toward the .280 AI.
Had a custom 280 I built. Own a 7mag also. Shooting them both until you get above 150 it’s pretty much the same except for the amount of powder. I know where 20+ boxes of 280 are right now.
I’m a little surprised at how little love the WSM got. Generally more efficient than the longer 30 magnums, not terrible recoil, short action, not too overbore. The 7’s in this list would be my last choices probably, although I do find the AI interesting.
7 mm mag is my pic
It's a really tough call. If I'm making a purchase I need right now, for say a trip in 6 weeks, I'm going 7mm simply based on availability. If I'm moving to a new "go-to" hunting rifle, maybe something semi-custom and I'm taking the time for load development and so forth I'd go with the 280AI. I decided that for the purposes of this discussion I was building for the future, so I voted 280.
I don't own either caliber so I'm not biased, but I must say since they are essentially twins, it all comes down to availability. I have never in my life seen any AI ammo on the shelves, let alone 280 AI. But I do quite often see 7 mag. For that I give it to the 7 mag.
You have to look at availability, reload ability, and price. Personally, I love the 270.
Yeah, but you have to say that with the last name of O'Conner / O'Connor.
❤280 ai amazing cartridge and if you need more than a 280 ai go with 300 wsm with a brake or supressor its the most efficient 30 caliber what the 308 win always wanted to be
Not sure how you work out that the 300WSM is what the 308 always wanted to be, given that the 308 (or specifically the T65) was a military service cartridge first and one of its big problems was that it was too powerful for a select fire rifle. As a hunting cartridge, the 308 Win is significantly more balanced than a 300WSM in virtually all circumstances except for long range hunting, which people seem to think is the only hunting worth doing these days.
@@lawnfarmr399 300 wsm spanks a 308 any way you look at it, especially if you reload. The 300 wsm is based off the 404 Jeffery case which is same as the nosler chamberings. 308 is boring af
@@69yenko65 Do you mean it spanks it ballistically? Because I thought that went without saying. But by that logic, you have to say all 30 cals are inferior to the 30-378, which didn’t even get a mention in this series as far as I know. For the vast majority of hunting situations, a 308 will do just as good a job as a 300WSM, and you have much less recoil, much longer barrel life, cheaper ammunition, more varied ammunition, much cheaper practice ammo, more ammo in the magazine, better short barrel performance, a wider selection of rifles and action types, and on top of all that, it will be much easier for 90% of shooters to shoot well. It’s boring because it’s common, and it’s common because it’s exceptionally good.
@@lawnfarmr399 the ammunition topic is a wash because I reload my own stuff. Recoil? put a brake on it and a limbsaver pad and when you wanna hunt, cap it. The 308 isn't the end all round lol it isn't exceptional at anything, it does the job with less recoil, cheap and that's exactly why it's common for people such as yourself.
@@69yenko65 yes but most people don’t reload (shock horror). Those people will probably be able to practice twice as much for the same level of barrel wear and money with a 308, which is going to be much more beneficial to them then the extra velocity. Also, muzzle breaks aren’t a magical fix, they have serious drawbacks, just go and ask a guide if they enjoy guiding someone with a braked 300 magnum. If ever you touch that bastard off without ear pro given a fleeting shot opportunity, boom there goes some of your hearing. I’m not saying the 300WSM isn’t the right cartridge for you, I know nothing about you, I’m saying for the average hunter (ie one that doesn’t invest the time to become proficient past 300 yards, or doesn’t have the opportunity to) the 308 is a better option than the 300WSM, and for long range hunting, the 300WSM is better. I was reacting to the idea that the 300WSM is what the 308 always wanted to be, which simply shows a massive lack of understanding of cartridge design.
I bought a Savage 110 Ultralight with the Proof Research barrel based on this channel's review of same. My son convinced me to get it in 280 AI. I was skeptical at first but after some research concluded he was right. It is super accurate and recoil is very manageable especially compared to my 300 WM, which i retired after buying the Savage. We reload so we have plenty of ammo. I cant say anything bad about the 7 mag but can say a lot of good things about the 280 AI and that rifle.
I've never seen a box of 280AI on the shelf in any store, there's a good chance you can find 7mm rem mag anywhere they sell ammunition, brass for reloading can be bought or picked up at any range, it's likely you won't be the only person in hunting camp with a 7mm rem mag either, almost every manufacturer will have a gun in 7mm rem mag, price of ammunition is considerably less expensive.
For the record I've never owned either, I have a 7mm saum and a 6.5prc.
My vote would go for a 6.5prc or a 270wsm