"I couldn't see her go down" - J. B. Ismay - Titanic Investigation Hearings (DAY 1)
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- Опубликовано: 17 авг 2023
- Extracted from the Official Transcript of the United States Senate Hearings into the sinking of the RMS Titanic and voice generated by AI.
This man had to suffer the rest of his life being branded a coward and a liar just from being a survivor. If he’d have stayed he may have died, who can blame him.
And rightfully deserved. Why are you feeling pity for what was the modern day equivalent of a wealthy corporate CEO who's negligent, selfish choices as acting director cost 1500 innocent men women and CHILDREN their lives, while he made sure to get his ass on a lifeboat?
His testimony reads like typical evasive corporate garbage to protect himself and his greedy corporation
There were survivors and survivors. Surviving with dignity entailed taking your chances and maybe balancing on an overturned boat for three hours with Officer Lightholler and others. Surviving without dignity was getting into a boat while the firemen and engineers were still down below keeping the lights on, and while hundreds of women and children were still on board. Easy for me to judge here in my cosy room though, but I’d hope to be braver than Ismay. I’ve read stacks about it and if he had his time over, I think Ismay would have wished to have acted differently.
@@bernie4268 Lightoller? He let boats go half full.
This helps me in my thinking that Ismey was brutally attacked for surviving. For what I have heard, the movie helped to give him a bad image, but he really tried to help passangers to aboard the boats when they didn't want to, and left when he saw no others ocupping a empty space. For me, at least for the moment, is just another survivor that was lucky.
Well, it would be convenient for him to answer in such way, though.
Several male passengers did put other female and children passengers on boats just to be close to them and sneak in when they saw an opening. Ismay wasn't the only one.
😂😂😂
Read the book , ''Maiden Voyage'' by Geoffrey Marcus. the best and most detailed reveal I've ever read; coveing every apect of this tragedy. and I have 26 books about the Titanic.
There is sworn testimony from a few survivors who said he was helping people into the boats (encouraging them, etc). On his getting into the lifeboats "We needed an oarsman, everyone [even some men and crew] were on the boat, he volunteered." Him being vilified was a smear campaign and caught on to the Nazi propaganda film about the Titanic, and it continued from them onto later motion picture versions.
A 1911 telegram exists from Ismay to the New York office expressing his desire that Olympic stop arriving early on Tuesday nights. He said he didn’t like passengers wondering which day they would dock and that consistent Wednesday morning arrivals were better than occasionally arriving early.
I never knew that.
That doesn't mean much.
Arriving early on the maiden voyage means a lot for media coverage. Everybody is paying attention.
After that arriving on time is fine. The marketing point has already been made.
@@fiachramaccana280doesnt mean much? Complete contradiction to how his character has been perceived for over 100 years..
It was Smith chasing the headlines
@@dylusional419 Smith was the captain. Not head of marketing. Ismay was in charge of that. But you dont get to be fleet commodore without understanding commercial realities. Look if you want to debate you need to come up with arguments that accord with known facts. Whataboutery is not debate. Not that the Ismay/Smith crybabies care......but....
@@dylusional419 Ismay gave very detailed testimony about Titanic's speed at every stage of the voyage. Clearly he was in close contact with Smith on the speed. They had a detailed plan for speed which did not take the unique conditions of the voyage into account. And they never altered that plan. The only change was to take a more southerly route to avoid ice. Which clearly failed. Not once did we hear a single word about changing the detailed prevoyage speed schedule. Which both had agreed in advance. The changed course proves that Smith knew icebergs were to be avoided. And the failure of Philips to pass on the last 3 ice warnings that showed ice fields directly in front of Titanic even on its changed course was a huge failure. We can argue about what Smith might have done if he had received those specific warnings. I like to think he would have altered course or slowed down. He wasnt a bad guy. But all that does is put more of the blame on Phillips.
In the end it was a series of unfortunate events caused by human error....but then again so are most accidents. Ismay/Smith and Philips all took rather reckless risks. California stopped. People argue that this was because it was a cargo ship without the same scheduling pressure. But thats the whole point. Titanic placed arriving on time/early ahead of safety. California made the opposite call. Lord may have screwed up on ignoring distress rockets. But he got the main decision right. It wasnt him speeding at 21 knots through an icefield.... that was Smith.
Thank you so much! I love these so much!
I will never understand why in the film Titanic by Cameron they dressed him as an evil and a coward person. He was very clear and even the people who he saved them could testify. He survived and anyone of us would think about himself in such chaotic situation.
Cameron simply followed the lead given by W. R. Hearst long ago. Hearst disliked Ismay personally and in business, and used his power over the newspapers to label him 'J. Brute Ismay.'
Then as now, those who control the media control the story. Quite sad, however, that James Cameron went along with it.
Can you imagine such a hostile cross-examination, THE DAY AFTER ARRIVAL in New York happening today? The man is traumatised!
The man, as you call him, was complicit
the man is a coward. So where did he get the nerve to get on a life boat?
@@georgeworthmore You are gratefully misinformed, he helped as many passengers to get on life both as possible. But it is proven that there were no more passengers or no women in children to be exact around the boat that he got on. You have to remember, Bruce was by all accounts was a passenger on the Titanic. He was not a part of the official crew.
Well. Don't sink ships
What about the 1500 people who froze in the Atlantic? Hard to feel sorry for him after he got to live.
Thanks so much for this amazing piece of history brought to life! This is truly incredible!
Thank you! Glad you like it!! 🤗
This is so awesome! More please!
Bruce Ismay was NOT the villain he was portrayed to be and people should definitely do their research before they choose to brand him as a selfish coward who supposedly manipulated Captain Smith into going faster to reach New York, only cared about saving himself and was the greedy, evil architect behind the disaster.
Here are the facts: Ismay was simply traveling as a passenger who had full faith in the captain, the officers and he had no influence over decisions made aboard. He had no desire to reach New York earlier whatsoever and during the sinking he spent the entire two hours urging women, children and men to enter the lifeboats…. he was rescued on one of the LAST lifeboats after assisting reluctant passengers, there was room for him, there were no other passengers near the boat and he got in……. If he stayed he merely would’ve been one more casualty.
After being rescued, he was in complete shock and utterly broken over the loss of his ship and so many passengers, he was medicated the entire voyage and according to witnesses expressed regret for having not gone down with the ship. He also had Captain Rostram of the Carpathia prevent the Olympic from coming to collect the survivors to spare them further horror/trauma.
I know what you are thinking at this point; he was the one who personally limited the number of lifeboats aboard Titanic ….. Titanic actually carried MORE lifeboats than was legally required at the time….. this applies to ALL ships! They did not see the necessity of excessive numbers of lifeboats because they assumed rescue would always be close enough and the boats could ferry passengers to a rescue ship as had been done during previous disasters. The Titanic disaster finally woke them all up! Unfortunately 1500 innocent people had to die a horrible death to highlight severely outdated regulations imposed by the British Board of Trade for large passenger liners.
Ismay was made a villainous scapegoat by the American press (William Randolph Hearst in particular) who made up bullshit claims about his actions, even that he had posed as a women to board a lifeboat, because they wanted someone to blame and Ismay was a perfect candidate for that given his status and position. Every single portrayal of Ismay in cinema (even 1997) further adds to this narrative in some way and is entirely wrong and tarnishes the facts.
Oceanliner Designs has a whole episode dedicated to Ismay and his time aboard Titanic and how his life and reputation were destroyed by the sinking. If you think I’m a BSer go see for yourself.
The Titanic may've had more boats than required by law but again on the other hand Walter Lord once said that shipowners at the time talked Board of Trade members into not mandating full lifeboat capacity .
What about the 1500 souls that perished thanks to the decision against full lifeboat capacity
Smith asked Fifth officer Lowe what an iceberg was made of. Lowe replied, "Ice."
Great answer!
😅
Ask a silly question expect a silly answer, the correct answer would be water but either way it's blatantly obvious what an iceberg is made of. It's like asking someone : "What's that red stuff called that flows through your veins and arteries"
Lowe actually replied "Ice I suppose sir"
@@mariamatheson5300 I have a feeling Lowe was a very direct person
Thanks for taking the time to do this! This was so interesting and glad I didn't have to read to follow along!
Thank you!! I'm glad you liked it!
Taking their time??? If they took their time (assuming a human made this) there wouldn't be so many mistakes with the captions and narrations. The channel owner is just trying to make quick cash. Siri could do a better job narrating this crap.
Do more of these . Found it fascinating
WTF is wrong with you? The captions and narration were AWFUL.
tyvm for the upload
Ismay had an English accent. AI doesnt have that?
This is not a recording of the actual conversation
@@adamshaw8214Are you alright? OG-comment recognised that this is not original audio by asking if AI (Artifical Intelligence) doesn't have an English accent.
So-called "Artificial Intelligence" algorithms apparently can't even tell the difference between the word "third" and "3D" 🙄 Would have thought with all this accelerated learning it's supposed to be doing that would be pretty basic by now @@mikipav1064
I'm glad you've taken such an interest in this important, if not critical, issue.
AI doesn't. It's programmed by human. With all the human frailties 😮
My God, did they ever crucify this man almost everything you hear or read about Bruce Ismay is an absolute lie due to people being jealous of his wealth and success the fact of the matter is, the man helped as many people as he could, and then stepped into a lifeboat just when there was no one else was around just as you or I would act.
He was nothing but compassionate and helpful to any survivor after everything was said and done he actually went above and beyond only to be unfairly judged in history, including in James Cameron‘s movie. If you want to know, the real story of him, go, watch the videos on ocean liner designs channel…
Well he sent a message asking White Star in New York to hold this ship the Cedric until he and the crew came so they could go on back home to England as soon as possible. That in itself was already suspicious. He made it look even more so by signing the message "Yamsi" his last name spelled backwards.
J. Bruce is NOT the villain of the RMS TITANIC's story. With the TITANIC, there are no villains to be found. It was a tragedy through-and-through and her crew did everything humanly possible to save lives, notify other ships and stations of their distress and keep the lights on over an hour and a half after they should have gone out.
While there aren’t villains, there are countless heroes and heroic spotlights to be found during that fateful night/morning.
Bruce showed his true colours when he aided people into the boats, only to board the lifeboat when no one else moved for the boat. That’s a display of heroism, even if it’s of minor note in comparison to the likes of Jack Phillips, the RMS Carpathia, Second Officer Lightoller and most especially the engineering crew of the TITANIC.
I believe that at the time it was difficult for people to accept that it was simply "an accident." A cultural aspect lost on us today was at the time most political leaders would have had some form of classical education and would be familiar with the concept of hubris. In their minds it must have happened because someone had the hubris to believe that the ship was perfectly safe (or "unsinkable") and not taken heed of ice warnings.
It is easy to see an inevitably disaster in hindsight, but the public wanted someone to blame, and Ismay was made the scapegoat.
The Captain is to blame, he is in full command and everything is his responsibility.
He had plenty of information and made very poor decisions. The ship was built fine, operation on the other hand... terrible.
That's fair. Even the Captain whose ultimately To blame, maintains his honor by going down with the ahip. This guy, didn't have to do that.
Arrogance and ignorance sank that ship. First from the people saying it was unsinkable, that God Himself couldn't sink it. Then there were MANY warnings about the icebergs straight ahead that were completely ignored and brushed off. One of the officers actually told another ship's officer to "shut up" after he desperately tried to warn about large icebergs directly in the Titanic's path, and coming up fast.
Other ships that had tried to warn the Captian, and his officers, stopped their ships for the night because it was too dangerous. The Captain should have known to do the same. The Captian also should have should known that by turning the ship instead of taking the hit head on, it would cause more damage on impact. It was said that had full knowledge of that information and didn't pay it any heed.
And then there was the ship whose Captain deliberately ignored the distress signals from the Titanic because he didn't want to be overwhelmed by desperate passengers bombarding his ship. The only ship whose Captian tried to save the passengers in the water, Carpathia, was too late and could only help the people already in the lifeboats. Which brings me to another point. It was completely unforgivable that were not nearly enough lifeboats on the Titanic.
Arrogance that the ship couldn't sink was part if the reason for that. There were most definitely people who should have been held accountable for all the lives that were lost that night. Call them villains, or simply negligent, makes no difference to me.
Yes they are
The people that make those laws allowing ships got just 1/3 of needed lifeboats.
The captain
Some oficiales that let lifeboats go with 15/20 passangers.
Please do more of these, absolutely riveting.
Love this. More please.
I hope you do the testimony of Lowe too where he and Ismay argued during the hearing about the fact Lowe told him to "go to hell".
Lowe told Ismay to “get the hell out of the way” after Ismay yelled “ Lower away! Lower away!”
Titanic historians and ship builders now believe that even if Titanic had enough lifeboats for everyone, she wouldn't have been able to launch them all. Remember it took an hour after the collision before the first lifeboat was launched. By 2.10am they were still trying to launch the collapsible boats. Imagine if by 2.10am they still had to launch another 20 boats. Those 20 boats would have been mostly destroyed in the final plunge.
You are probably correct. Because the training was hopeless and Captain Smith lost his nerve and gave poor instructions. His officers repeatedly approached him looking for instructions and eventually just took their own decisions. However there are two critical factors. With enough lifeboats Lightholler would have allowed men on the lifeboats. While steerage would have been allowed up to the boat deck earlier before most of the lifeboats had left. Would everybody have been saved? Almost definitely not. Would more have been. Almost definitely yes.
If the crew had been properly trained and the passengers had lifeboat assignments then there would've been no problems with boats for all
Ismay not only cut the number of lifeboats from 48 to 16, he actively campaigned to discourage treating Titanic as if it were subject to sinking and needing the lifeboats at all. It's little wonder then that Captain Smith canceled the lifeboat drill for the last morning of the Titanic's existence.
Don't make self-fulfilling prophecies.
Modern "Historians" are full of crap.
With Roughly 800-1000 able bodied men on that ship working together, they could have figured it out.
@@egm8602 Ismay did not have any involvement in the number of lifeboats, which was subject to Board of Trade regulations. The designer of the Olympics, Alexander Carlisle, stated that he expected the Board to increase the number in view of the increasing displacement of new liners. He therefore designed the ship for, but not with, 48 lifeboats. As regulations were not changed, the Olympics were equipped with a total of 20 boats.
In his evidence, he denied that anyone from White Star had put any pressure on him.
By the way, there had been a boat drill in Southampton before Titanicd sailed. Such drills involved the crew only, not passengers.
A rather extroardinary piece of history . Well worth the listen.
Please do more of these
The good senator must have been playing to the reporters in the audience. He was nearly treating Ismay as a hostile witness. The grilling was rather intense.
Basically, following the William Rudolph Hearst narrative about Ismay. Many inquiries back in those days wanted a villain and, like the Empress of Ireland's sinking, 2 years later, it was purely a whitewash for political reasons overall.
@@SolidAvenger1290 Still, it really didn't help that he tried to essentially flee the country almost immediately after getting there while being (badly) sneaky about it.
@@Davrn54 If you watch Ocealiner Designs video(s) on this, you'll know he essentially thought that any inquiry would be held in the UK, since the ship was built and owned by UK companies. So he wasn't trying to flee the inquiry, rather he was trying to make sure he would make it to it on time
I don't see any unfairness in the line of questioning. While I am sure that Mr. Ismay was still distressed only a day later, his answers were quite coherent and helpful.
@@igregmart The majority of the questions were pointless and asinine.
For.context, this sounds like the US inquiry which took place soon after the survivors arrived in NY.
There was another inquiry by the British board of trade which was more extensive.
Is that one on RUclips perchance.?
The US inquiry started on April 19th, the day right after the Carpathia's arrival, and it focused on the human side of the disaster. The British inquiry in turn concentrated on the technical side. With that, the two inquiries complemented each other.
Thank you for making this video.
Thank you for this. It's shocking how life-like the AI voices are! Really scary actually.
LOLOLOL!!! OMG I LOVE YOUR SARCASM 🥰
"I think it was nine point three zero in the morning"
Yeah, and amazing how authentic Ismay's Liverpudlian accent sounds ... 🤣
This is incredible, thank you for taking all this time and turning this into a sort of audio book! I always prefer listening to stuff so this is very welcome, great job!
Also you can really sea Mr. Ismay's grief in a pictures of the inquiry.
Thank you so much for your words! To be honest, it was really hard to put it all together, although only a few people will apreciate it. I'm glad you're one of them, enjoy it!
Toys 🧸🐻
Yes I also enjoy listening to things like this as appose reading lines.
Thanks to creator too
You get the feeling from the US hearing that they had already made up their mind about Ismay, and all of the questioning was done to try and expose him as a coward, a liar and a businessman who wanted to achieve speed over safety. That is not a fair assessment of Ismay. The man has had too much mud thrown at him over the last 112 years.
Everybody needs a villain. Who else better other than the "higher official" that survived.
I'm having trouble picturing half the rowers facing forward and half to the rear (reason Ismay gave for not seeing ship).
I believe there are photos of the survivors in lifeboats that illustrate what he meant by that.
He wouldnt have been able to see the ship anyways it was pitch black.
Any chance you can upload more of these from the other witnesses ?
I don't think so, it takes a lot of time and money to do it...
you should really do it...@@titanictreasures
@@titanictreasures I can see that .
Pretty awesome. You got any more?
Please do more full transcripts from the inquiry 🙏
Much obliged.
Other parts?
The questions keep being echoed…I’d would say “are you having trouble hearing me or are you deaf?” 😂😂
I get annoyed when people demonize Ismay for saving his own life. Its not like HE sank the ship. Nobody wants to die. It doesn't make you a coward.
And no-one should be obliged to die on a sinking ship for no reason whatsoever but pride and silly expectations. Him staying on that ship to die would've served no purpose for anyone.
Well, honor used to be a thing, saving children before yourself used to be a thing. He was the managing director of the white star line, which owned the titanic. A whole lot of children died of hypothermia or drowned that night. I don't fault him for saving his own life but I get why it made people angry. Also I don't believe his testimony that the deck was empty and there were no other passengers waiting to get in lifeboats.
@@WhisperSonnetand what children could he have saved ? He left before the ship began its final plunge, as they say.
He is obviously covering up😮
The problem was there wasn’t enough life boats which was the problem and he thought the ship was unsinkable. Not fully his fault except for the life boat situations
I do NOT vilify Ismay at all. Great video!!😊
too kind
Yeah…it’s easy to vilify him. We weren’t there… in both the sense of “we didn’t see it … and we don’t know what we’d do if it was us”
He did have a lot of information about the sinking if he had gone down with the ship we would have never found out about a lot of it. I get people are mad that he snuck on a boat when so many women and children were still on and sadly had to die but it would of most likely happened if he got on or not especially being the boat was already being lowered while he got on it. I don’t think he was as bad as a man history portrayed him anytime people tell stories they always like to make someone in that story the bad person.
@@josephchristiansen1803 Lightoller is the villain, he's a fool, he let boats go half full 300 people lost there lives when they could have been saved and mostly from the port side where lightoller was they should have been 1200 who died not 1496. It's lightoller fault he even told young 14 year old to get out of the boats then they were launched with empty spaces. He should have been sent to prison for what he did it's disgraceful. Philips isn't much better the fool.
Haha you're joking right??? They cut corners in the building of the boat in Belfast to the objections of Thomas Andrews. He persuaded the captain to go faster due to the lack of coal in the bunkers based on a fire in Belfast dock that was raised by the workers. That's why it went so fast because if it maintained a lower speed and ran out of coal it would have been bad for business stranded in the ocean. Look up the addergooole 14 documentary. 14 young men and women from county Mayo, Ireland, travelled third class and only 3 girls survived. While they were in bed weak and traumatised, white star line which he was MD of, sent men to the girls bed side for them to sign a document saying they settle for 25 pounds and take all blame of white star line yet... the girls who were ill were told by the men, sign this, its just confirmation this was your ticket. Never let the girls read the paper after wakening them up in hospital. They were delirious, Had PTSD and didn't know what was going on. He jumped on a boat to save himself while women and children weren't on boats. This is all factual btw. Do some actual research about the hidden truth about the disaster, the cover up too and then come back and say you dont vilify him you nob. He disappeared from the public with embarrassment and lived in Ireland then died. So if he was so innocent and everything was honky dory....why do that? and why not allow the men from the Belfast ship yard to testify at hearing about the cut corners and why would he have allowed the "judge appointed by the white star line"(complete conflict of interest if there ever was one) to not allow their evidence in the trial or union to speak. You really know very little to then say "I do NOT vilify him" simp comes to my mind about you. Do research. Know your stuff.
He suggested to the Captain to speed up the ship. It was the Captain who made that decision to speed up. It was the radio operator that ignored the ice warnings and the Captain of the Californian who ignored the Titianic.
There is only one witness to that alleged conversation, and now even some historians doubt the accuracy of that witness.
The wireless operators didn't just ignore the warnings.
They were overworked and overloaded with message traffic, unfortunately it 'slipped through the cracks'.
They had their set power turned all the way up for maximum broadcast range.
When a warning came from a nearby ship, it nearly deafened them because of their sets amplification.
He told them to shut up because of his knee jerk reaction.
@@phillydelphia8760 And of course Jack and Harold both acted very brave by staying at their posts right until the last minutes before the ship took her final plunge. Literally water about to our into their cabin before they left
@@johnking5174 name the historians and the sources. Book/page number etc....
The witness was reliable and had no obvious axe to grind. She simply reported what she overheard.
@@johnking5174 Arguably Jack stayed because he knew he was more than partly to blame for the accident. By not forwarding the Mesaba ice warning. And blocking out the Californian ice warning. They were critical warnings because they showed the Titanic was right in the middle of a large ice field.
Other ice warnings were not as important given locations etc.
Like Captain Smith he knew he would be blamed for screwing up.
He had honour I will give him that. But he had no future. As for guts that's debatable. True guts would have been to face up to the consequences of his mistakes.
Harald stayed cos Jack was his boss. And I will give him bravery also as he had done no wrong.
Early riser at 9 point three zero lol
Titanic
He stayed the night before at the Southwestern hotel which was a stone's throw away
"In the olden days" he says back in 1912.
Also "in the future" they would've said about the time of first world war
Even 40 years ago in 1912, ships were still Powered by wind.
I hate the AI voices but I'm so intrigued by this so I must thank you for putting it together.
People held off boarding her they could have he was helping people board. He was the scapegoat
Objection! Asked and answered! Objection! badgering the witness!
man i got excited to hear Ismay's voice and it was a shitty AI
Poor Ismay. It is sad but the mentality, even today, is that if you were not a woman or a child you are a coward and even if you survived by sheer happenstance oftentimes you are still branded a coward.
In most cases you would, in fact, be a coward. But the pandemonium of the sinking did not present a normal case. Ismay did nothing wrong, anymore than the sailors who at the end tried to launch collapsibles for themselves.
Or third class(poor)
Smith is more mad that women had to row, than that the lifeboats were half empty and WOMEN DIED.
Chief inquisitor Senator Smith has just been told Mr Ismay boarded the ship at Southampton yet he seems to think he boarded at Liverpool ??
Why didnt you build a ship within a ship? You know where a few decks could just disconnect and float with survivors? I mean it’s not that hard to figure out.
When AI reads lines you get bits like the third being read as "3D."
Not "Males and passengers" it's supposed to be "mails and passengers" as the Titanic was part of the Royal Mail Service, where the name RMS Titanic comes from. The ship was loaded with a fair bit of letters and parcels to be delivered across the US.
I know it has many mistakes. But for me, as non English speaker, it was really difficult to correct it. Thanks for your appreciation!
WHAT HAS AL READ GOT TO DO WITH IT?
This is interesting for AI
The AI voices add a subtle level of comedy which I appreciate.
lol Yep. "The time was nine point three zero". lol
Ismay sounds like Star Trek's Data
Is that Bill the Butcher speaking?
James Cameron needs to re write the script on Bruce Ismays roll in the movie Titanic.. He got the script wrong!
Yes, when you watch the film , you see an hypocrite coward guy. Shame on Cameron.
It was a clumsy question. He may have said, “ What material might an iceberg contain that might render it more difficult to see, especially at night” You see the ice in our freezer at home is made up of clear clean water. Ice in nature is likely to include rocks, solid mud, plant growth and the like and if the berg flipped over it might be showing a “dark” side to an approaching ship and not the clean white sight we are used to seeing. Hence it would be more camouflaged.
J.P Morgan owned the Titanic as white star line was a subsiderary of Merchantile JP Morgan owned.
Senator Smith sounds like Texas senator Ted Cruz
Sen Smith was from Michigan
Will there be more of these i wanna listen to more of these
I'm not sure, it takes a lot of time and I received a lot of bad comments because the American accent of the voice and bad transcription...
Ismay: the first 3 boats were filled. LYING Liar deserved to be demonized for life.
Although exonerated he was made to pay in other ways
They jinxed titanic by saying the ship was unsinkable
WHITE STAR NEVER SAID THAT. THE MEDIA DID
WSL said she was "practically unsinkable," not unsinkable without a doubt..
Shipbuilder Magazine said of WS's new superliners that they were "practically unsinkable" but somewhere in the retelling (early into it I'm sure) the adverb was dropped and everyone just went and said they were unsinkable
Kind of a shame what happened to him it was a no win scenario for him. Sadly the White Star Line kind of went with him. From what I read he did all the charitiibly could and put forth the upgrades to Olympic and Britannic before he resigned. What could have been had not the Titanic sunk.
Don't tell me they didn't know to have enough lifeboats. The World had Military Ships and knew about the safe evacuation of all souls. NOONE in their right mind would let a Ship go anywhere without enough lifeboats. It was GREED.
@@julianyc422 they were actually above the minimum number of lifeboats. The board of trade required 16 and Titanic had 20. It seems you have some sort of axe to grind based on all your comments on here.
I agree; no matter how many times I hear that spiel about more boats than required by the Board of Trade they were far from enough for everyone on board; and the outcome would've been far worse if the Titanic had ever been fully booked
Whatever the law and requirements at the time I'm sure everyone in seafaring at the time knew deep down they were doing sth wrong not supplying enough lifeboats. About that spiel on using lifeboats as ferries, many forget that the North Atlantic was most unusually calm that very night.
J.B. Ismay was a Lancashireman!
I appreciate the brief and exact way this is spoken.
This just shows AI isn't quite there just yet.
Still interesting, though.
Isamy helped FILL unfilled boats.
He did but whatever the law and requirements were I'm sure everyone in the shipping industry at the time knew deep down that they were doing sth wrong not supplying enough lifeboats. About that spiel on using lifeboats as ferries, many forget that the North Atlantic was most unusually calm that night (of all nights). Further still, it was also bad public relations and bad customer service to not supply boats for all whatever the British Board of Trade requirements were at the time .
Thanks
Wow! That means a lot! Thank you for the support!
In the movie, B-52 was Rose cabin.
Because Rose wasn't real. They didn't include Charlotte Cardeza (the occupant of the other super de luxe suite rooms) in the movie
Rose was real. She just changed her name to rose dawson@Firemarioflower
Lol rose was definitely not real
@@michaelspoto8720 Please tell me you're trolling
@@michaelspoto8720 There was of course no Jack and Rose romance on the Titanic but there was a Jack Thayer in 1st class (not 3rd) and a Rhoda Mary “Rosa” (not Rose) Abbott (née Hunt) in 3rd class (not 1st). They both survived the sinking
If any Titanic design and nature of damage allowed her to stay afloat to properly launch lifeboats.
"I couldn't see her go down" (J. B. Ismay). "I am glad I did not."
I didn't know she arrived in Southampton on Wednesday the 3 d
Yes, actually James Cameron arrived there to make the 3D film 🤣🤣 There are some audio mistakes, but most of it is correct.
Ismay was the very first to testify at the hearings, and his testimony produced no fewer than 58 pages
It's amazing to think we have these records at all. I mean how on earth did they capture them? I've never seen anyone write that fast. Unless they had typewriters.
Court stenographers are taught to take a transcription at that sort of speed. The either use shorthand, or a stenographer machine, which has five keys (or is it ten, once for each hand?). In any event, there are those who are trained to take down such remarks accurately at a normal speaking speed.
@@Mark3ABE Incredible regardless.
Damn I can't believe I haven't seen this. If this is an exact transcript I don't feel like he was bullshitting. I almost feel like he was fucking tramatized.
It's exact transcript
Isn't J. Bruce Ismay supposed to have a British accent, though?🤔
Bad AI aside, this is really fascinating. I'm learning for the first time that Ismay referred to what we call the Boat Deck as the Sun Deck.
It doesn't help Ismay's image as I heard from Sam Pence (Historic Travels) that White Star, in an effort to avoid lawsuits, sent representatives to hospitals where victims were recovering and tricked them into signing declarations that they wouldn't sue for damages, in exchange for 25 pounds. That's downright obscene.
However often you repeat this nonsense, it still will not make it true. I recall asking you for your source on several occasions. You have not so far managed to supply it.
I wonder why not? Perhaps because the idea of 'Non-Disclosure Agreements' only dates back to the 1940s?
@@dovetonsturdee7033 " However often you repeat this nonsense, it still will not make it true. I recall asking you for your source on several occasions. You have not so far managed to supply it. I wonder why not? "
Smith does my head in!!! Just keeps repeating what was said in the form of a question.
He was taking his time in the questioning of Ismay; he didn't want to rush through anything. I have to say that America really had a right to investigate; the tragedy did after all involve US jurisdiction
0:47 As she was exiting Southampton Harbor the Titanic almost collided with that other ship called - of all names - SS New York
Fun fact: the story of Ismay using a child to get on a lifeboat was part of a smear campaign by his business rivals
They knew they would be in the ice region on Sunday night. Yet Captain Smith did not slow down, and he did not check with the wireless operators to see if any reports were coming in. It all comes back to Captain Smith.
Whereever did you gate that from? Smith had received a number of ice warnings, and had altered to a more southerly course.
@@dovetonsturdee7033 Yes but the last one he had was much earlier in the day. There were others that had come in, including from the Masaba that showed ice in their path. And they did know they would be in the ice field that night. Yet after changing course he took no further action but relied solely on his lookouts.
What I find interesting is he was made out to be horrible because he got on a lifeboat yet a I can’t remember if it was a Japanese man or a Chinese man that got out of a lifeboat and let a woman take him place but what I want to know is what he was doing in the lifeboat in the first place since it was woman and children?
When come Day 2?
Probably never, it takes a lot of time to make it.
The first hearings in the US a couple of days after were the only ones of historical value. 6 months later back in the UK, it was a finger pointing mission and bickering about how well built she was & not breaking in 2 like so many testimonies stated.
Titanic engine
One thing that is oftentimes forgotten about is that America had a right to investigate; the disaster did after all involve US territorial waters. Further, there were many American passengers on the Titanic.
The ship was in International waters, the nearest state being Canada.
@@fmyoung Carpathia was also in International Waters. She returned to New York, obviously in US Territorial Waters, only after completing her rescue mission. At the time she received Titanic's distress call, she was three days out of New York.
@@dovetonsturdee7033 The Titanic yes but the Carpathia did eventually use US territorial waters when she brought the survivors to NY.
It's hip to be square!
You know, people say the ship wasnt going at full speed, which was 78. He stated "She works up to 80". So which one is it? 78 or 80?
I mean, yes, she wasn't going at full speed, but damn near it! If its pitch black on the horizon, due to a moonless night, and navigating through a maze of iceburgs' Why didnt the Capt slow it down to 70, or 65? Could have meant the difference between avoiding collision. How irresponsible on the Capt's part. He wasnt putting the safety of the passengers first. JB stated there no need to arrive at New York before 5am. Why rush? I blame the disaster on the Capt.
He was in room B-52? I guess you could say his room was a.... Love Shack. 😉
Oh god.....
Either that or he was a top bomber lol
I wonder how he could tell that the other people in the boat were third-class passengers. I know some of them were Lebanese.
The titanic ship never went anywhere near Liverpool.
IT WAS THE PORT OF REGISTRATION. AFTER THE SEA TRIALS, WHICH WERE SEVERELY SHORTENED, THEY SHOULD HAVE CALLED IN AT LIVERPOOL, BUT SALED FOR S'HAMPTON.
MORE SUSPICIONS FOR THE OLYMPIC SWITCH, BELIEVER'S.
Mr. Ismay seems to get a bad rap. Everything he's stated is absolutely true and he's not hiding anything at all. Very straightforward with all his answers. What's odd is that so soon after the accident that even he knew that if the Titanic would've just hit the iceberg straight on, it would've been fine. (Fine, meaning it would've stayed afloat).
He told Sen Smith he had no knowledge about the ship's progress let alone ice warnings (there were no fewer than six of them on the 14th alone). Cpt Smith handed him a warning from the Baltic (instead of posting it on the bridge for his officers to read....) - so, Ismay totally knew .
That ship would’ve sunk if even one of her compartments were flooded because it wasn’t capped it just filled up and overflowing the next compartment the builders sure weren’t thinking when they built her
That's not how it works. Internal flood water level doesn't go above external waterline. As long as the watertight bulkheads remain above waterline, the internal and external water levels equalise and flooding stops. With upto 4 compartments, Titanic's bulkheads would remain above waterline and achieve buoyancy. Its when the bulkheads go below waterline the "spillover" happens. So open tops weren't a problem.
Remember Olympic had the same compartment design. Olympic stayed afloat when HMS Hawke hit the stern and breached 2 compartments. Open tops wasn't an issue there.
Wow sounds so real 🤪. Maybe you can ask AI in a few years to make this video sound like it’s 1912 and it won’t sound ridiculous like this
That is a lot of annoying questioning that would really get me riled up if I were in his position.
"I heard the captain give the order."
"You heard him give the order?"
"Yes."
I mean, what did I just say? Are you deaf?
The world needed clarity around events. You want the two to discuss the time line of events like two mates in a podcast?
I'm in partial disagreement on these posts. Bruce Ismay was the Chairman the White Star Line and a survivor of the Titanic, yes. He repeatedly said "I think, I don't remember". How do you not recall that traumatic event? However, He should have had much more common sense to have had more life boats across the board on the worlds largest ship in 1912. Or maybe 100 years ago they were just naive after over 2,000 + ships were lost at sea? Just in a 500 year period.. Come on...really? He thought his construction was just so good and what happened in the past could no happen again - it's all about the money and the tickets they could sell. You can disagree, but riddle me this..why have a boat that size and not have life boats to carry ALL of them off - Just in Case?
Titanic was equipped with a brand new lifeboat davit that can easily accommodate *two* row of boats in case of one, but as of that time the regulations still limit the lifeboat capacity to 16. The rule would eventually have been implemented, of course, but Titanic’s sinking emphasized on the urgency of the matter. Very tragic
Arrogance. They wanted to destroy their rivals especially Cunard by having the entire ship perceived as a unsinkable lifeboat. So having lifeboats in deck would have been a contradiction to them. Warped thinking.
What difference would more lifeboats make? They didn't have enough time to load and launch the boats they had, more boats in the way would have probably slowed down the evacuation and spread the crew out further, costing more lives
@@AnneM76 every ship that era was built so it could be its own lifeboat. That’s the standard they aim to achieve
@@RobHall1984 they had time to launch all but two boats
I don't blame him for taking a seat but i bet families of all the children that died feel differently. I understand both sides.
he was a coward
If ismay thought that lifeboats weren’t that important then why hop into one when his ship was going down
“We were not at full speed the max speed is 80 and we were at 78.9”.
79 .9
No way in hell there wasn’t any people around the last lifeboats
On the costa concordia men were shoving women out of the way to get to safety. Give Bruce a break.
I have to agree
Most of them still weren't grasping the seriousness of the situation. Many people were still reluctant to leave. Until all the boats were gone, people still believed nothing would happen. Ismay's vicinity had no women and children. Only crew members. Its confirmed by Quartermaster Rowe's testimony.
@@gokulgopan4397 Women and children around or no Ismay knew it was wrong not to have provided boats for all whether or not that was common procedure back then
@@fmyoung it wasn't his decision. It was board of trade. The safety equipments were passed on the advisory committee meeting in 1910 as part of a joint decision. None of the liners at the time had enough for all (because it was the norm). There has been several incidents like Republic sinking where ferrying passengers was a success. It just reassured everyone that it would work. Titanic happened to be the one that got in a situation no one foresaw and had to go down to show how outdated the regulations were.
Apparently, there was a increase in 39% lifeboat capacity in the final design than the initial Design D.
markchirnside.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Titanic_Lifeboat_Increase.pdf
Crazy hearing somebody in 1912 saying “in the olden days”
One day your grandchildren will be surprised when you talk about the 80's. 😂
So it would be even weirder then if someone in Ancient Rome talked about the old days
Ralph Kramden memory 🤔 Ummm
Homina Homina Homina hom hom hom I don't think so I can't remember.. you'll have to ask Alice or Norton or maybe Trixie remembers..😂 Paaaleeeze 🤣🤣🤣 Great Job and Video 💯 👍✌️
The ship sank because it hit an iceberg. End of testimony.
But why and how? That is important, and the answer(s) aren't always so simple.
@@carlousmagus5387 I'm not downplaying the interesting human and technical story, or why people seek details..But in the main, the why and how is completely straight forward and well understood. The captain immediately understood the cost of his folly, and the builder made the calculation based on damage in minutes. The ship hit a massive object at speed. No rivets or steel type would have made a difference.
I guess....