Game Theory: Are Theories KILLING Video Games?
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- Опубликовано: 2 июн 2024
- Thanks to Capital One Shopping for sponsoring a portion of this video!
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A while ago over on Film Theory, I tried to figure out if we theory channels and fans RUINED Star Wars. Did our analysis make the creators feel like they had to do crazy things to surprise us and not play into our predictions? Well, it looks like we need to have that conversation AGAIN - this time about the video game industry. Listen, Game Devs need to let me be RIGHT!
Videos mentioned:
@Daggz video ► • The Problem with Indie...
@SaganHawkes video ► • The Downfall of Hello ...
@NightMind video ► • Crow 64: The Lost Nint...
@DrossRotzank video ► • Crow 64
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More THEORIES:
FNAF, The FINAL Timeline ►► bit.ly/2MlHYFe
FNAF, The Monster We MISSED! ►► • Game Theory: FNAF, The...
FNAF This Theory Changes Everything ► bit.ly/2JUQUn6
FNAF, You Were Meant To Lose ► • Game Theory: FNAF, You...
FNAF 6, No More Secrets ► bit.ly/2LVCq4u
Credits:
Writers: Matthew Patrick, William Ryan Sheehan "El Fodder", and Tom Robinson
Editors: Tyler Mascola, Forrest Lee, Dan "Cybert" Seibert, and Jerika (NekoOnigiri)
Assistant Editor: Caitie Turner (Caiterpillart)
Sound Editor: Yosi Berman
#FNAF #Bendy #HelloNeighbor #FiveNightsAtFreddys #BendyAndTheInkMachine #RuinGaming #MatPat #Theory #GameTheory #capitaloneshopping 
Игры
![Darren Waller - Who Knew (Her Perspective) [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/GytDjB8u6bM/mqdefault.jpg)
Honored to be included in this discussion matpat! Been watching you for like a decade now so it's insane to just casually show up in one of your videos like that, absolutely honored
Жжжж
Шшщщщ
@flower has eaten wdym ?
I know this daggz guy
@@jadedragon9262 oh ok who is he ?
Game company : "Oh no they guessed it. Quick, change it!"
Mat : "I think they changed it. Here's my theory on them changing it!"
Game company : "DANGIT"
Whyruclips.net/video/FSSFgWlDbJU/видео.html..
Wait is it fnaf, oh god!
Read my name!
@@The_Black_Star no, it's probably hello neighbor
No one’s safe from Matt…
Unless I make something alongside what I’m working on to completely throw off Game Theory entirely… 😈
I think another thing to note is that
When MatPat is correct, that doesn't mean your game is predictable, it means (like he said) your story is logical.
Fact. I don’t care if I know who’s the final villain is as long as it was hinted too and has a pay off
that makes a lot of sense
You use extra T's, my friend
MatPat
@@windums560 Ah thank you
@@homerunproduction ikrruclips.net/video/a1j9owBuwdQ/видео.html
After thorough thought on the subject, I've decided to not leave a comment with the word "jumpkick" in it, only because Matt asked so nicely, and I wouldn't want to disappoint him ❤
YOU FOOL
You just did.
@@alexdemary5274that’s the joke
@@alexdemary5274r/woosh
@@nullut2000Reddit user
I think its a great point that developers should let the fans have their win. The fans will get excited cus they picked up on the correct clues, and the developers laid out the clues in such a way, that there was indeed something to track, somthing to theorise about.
When theorists are able to guess it right, it's a medal of honour for the developers.
It means that their plot makes sense and isn't absolute bullsquid.
Fnaf be like:
Agree
@@rest1585 I’m still trying to understand where we thought mangle caused the bite of 87
@@cybellecrider9244 Fnaf 4 is the bite of 83 mangle caused the bite of 87.
Nice pun master of squids
My favorite case of a creator trying to throw fans off of the truth has to be when Alex Hirsch (the creator of gravity falls) saw that fans started guessing that Stan had a brother who wrote the journals, and he created a fake leak framing McGucket as the author of the journals. It was brilliant and did exactly what he wanted it to do, without sacrificing the story.
Yea! Alex Hirsch did a great job with that!
Alex Hirsch just does right by his add ins and do dads. I remember that even in the cypher hunt after someone accidentally found the next clue he asked the fan base to complete the puzzles for unreleased content.
Or how everyone was convinced Tad Strange existed and then he was a normal guy who liked bread
@@pb4705 I thought he was?
@@jaromweissvert4121there was lots of fan speculation that he'd be important, maybe even some sort of sidekick or rival to bill when all the fanbase had was a voice credit to his name in a future episode description. it was pretty funny when he was revealed to be just some guy
I just wish game developers would make a fun game with an intriguing story, instead of theory chasing 🥺
I love how Mat jumpkicks into his transitions. It’s really nice editing style and I might pick it up someday.
fr
Smooth “jumpkick” inclusion 👌
"I knew it" is way more rewarding than "I didn't see that coming", especially if that twist feels forced
And a confused "whaat...????" is even worse.
I know, the best is that you get more interested in the story, since you guessed it once, the author who made the plot thinks like you do, or follow your logic, so of course you'll read more to see if you can get more things right.
Like the opposite is also true, if you believe something gonna happen and it's completely the wrong conclusion you can even get annoyed with the story and plot because there was foreshadowing for one to be the villain, but it was someone else who already was proven to be wrong and it was bs all along...
The fans who were reading or following the story won't read because the logic don't make sense to them and it may even make them ignore the story.
GG
Like Rian Johnson's star wars, that feels like he changed every plot point to be the opposite of fan speculation, and is easily the worst star wars movie.
That's a fact that lines up I'd rather be right than be confused with the overall plot.
I'd rather have a great predicted story than a "twist" ending that's nonsensical and forced.
GoT anyone?
Any examples? Sounds like an interesting topic
@@criticalblaster458 star wars ep 7-9?? not sure cuz I haven't properly saw theories predicting it or its really just lazy writing & bad executions.
That's because- every theorist leaves less and less possibilities for big surprises.
Just imagine if Bioshock Fans early on said that Atlas would betray you and be Fontain.
Then there wouldn't be that great twist, but just a shell that needs something new and better.
Problem is: If the Game has allready build upon that early idea, then- you practically have to to it all over.
@@criticalblaster458 Last of Us 2: The revenge plot that doesn't end in actual revenge
As a Venezuelan, and a huge fan of Drossrotzant, I absolutely love that mat had mentioned his work and the impact it had on the topic
matpat never fails to jumpkick us
"Let us be right" and "I KNEW IT!" are rules for DMs running D&D tables too. Sure, make twists, but then keep your clues going in that same direction. Don't punish the players for being clever.
...unless they take it too far, and become smartasses - that's your cue to start messing with them...
Are you talking about dungeons and dragons
YES! I’ve had so man DMs switch up the story last minute and pull twists out of nowhere just to throw us off because we got too close to figuring it out.
@@lacrossestick132 Yeah I've heard some D&D horror stories about that.
If I become a game developer, I will have a FIXED lore that is pretty complicated and I am actually thinking of it but the timeline is confusing
So, essentially what I'm hearing is that, in a desperate attempt to be unpredictable, some developers panic and lose sight of their own game's congruity.
Auhgg
Pretty much
EXACTLY!!
That's how I felt about batim.
Not really to be unpredictable, sometimes the dev is just pressured into making a more convoluted story just because of the theorists' spectation
I think it's ridiculous that any type of media would do this (I believe the show runners of West World tweaked the finale of season 1 before of theorists) because most consumers don't read or are even aware of any of this.
0:11 "the game was unpolished, glitchy and nothing like how we predcited"
me: do you know how little that narrows it down?!
What is it
Hello neighbour?
thinking about your conclusion, game devs should do something like Alex Hirsch, creator of Gravity Falls. When fans found his big secret, he did not change his conclusion, he gave something which did not affect the story at all, but gave fans enough doubt about their conclusion that they still felt the effect of a shocking reveal.
I mean he did change some thing like added the whole zodiac wich was not important intill fans wanted it to be important so he felt he had to add it in at the last minute so they felt sadifided
Can you remind me what that bait and switch was?
and we got a lot of interpretations too, like having Stanley being sure Gideon was a fraud by not knowing his real name, the story always felt consistent
@@PneumaAsh It was an orchestrated leak by Alex Hirsch and his team where he produced an image of old man mcgucket being the real journal writer. They even took it down an hour after it was posted to make the leak seem more real.
@@PneumaAsh the old mcguffin i think his name was the 6 fingers it showed up then deleted immediately.
The funniest damage control ive seen a creator did when their fans' theories predicted the story was with Alex Hirsch with the author reveal. Some fans figured out that (spoilers) the author was Stan's twin brother and to salvage the climax Alex faked a photo "leak" with a single frame of McGucket writing the journal behind him and posted it to reddit-
Like mans willing to troll his entire fanbase just for the reveal 😭 but at least he didnt double down and do a last minute change. The author was still Ford and i appreciate that
alex hirsch is a god
Not only that, but in Dungeons, Dungeons, & More Dungeons (S2 E13) they made a gag that the whole twist of Ducktective was that he had a twin brother all along, and then the characters argue how predictable the twist was. Alex Hirsch played 4D chess with the fandom like Bill did with Ford. 😂
Alex used one of the oldest trick in making pursuers scramble: red herrings
The reveal of Ford was so damn satisfying after seeing all the theories develop over the course of the show
it was funny but what sucks is when they actually do change the script when it could be best the way it was
At the end of last year, I was able to use this video and the film theory video "How Star Wars Theories KILLED Star Wars: The Last Jedi!" for my graduation IRP. It was really cool to be able to use my favorite channel(s)'s videos for such an important paper and I learned a ton. It's not everyday that you explain the search trends of Among Us in APA format after discussing JJ Abrams' controversial Mystery Box 😆
Thank you MatPat and the theorist gang for making these awesome videos, paving the way for many others to be creative and theorize themselves.
I can also understand the developers vision of loosing that sparks when you think your gonna make a story snd slowly others will leatn about it, just to have everything already predicted after like 2 updates or before its even out, youd be like... oh, so much for the build up.
But on the otherside, as RR martin said, just build your story you want and planned it.
I’m 100% convinced that Scott has changed the fnaf lore like 50 times just to spite matpat.
yeah and that's extremely frustrating because, objectively, the fnaf story is pretty bad now. it's messy, it accidentally contradicts itself, and it could've been so much better if Scott just told the story instead of trying to keep fans guessing.
@@westtexas_4491 You also have to remember that the fans hated the original direction the lore was headed (it was all a dream), so Scott wanted to change the lore to make the fanbase happy. That is where you get the majority of your contradicting lore points.
The story itself isn’t actually that bad, it just gets so confusing at points that you lose sight of the pieces you’ve already collected and placed together. This best way I can explain the lore: It’s like a tangled clump of yarn, you can see one end that’s connected to the nicely packaged yarn and the other is lost in the clump. You can’t untangle it from one end so you try to find the other end of the yarn. FNaF is a lot like that. The original, neatly packaged story wasn’t well liked so Scott changed it, creating this clump of yarn, but it’ll be all the more satisfying when we finally find that other end, that missing piece and are able to unravel the story.
Im kinda convinced otherwise? I feel like the majority of FNAF's lore was shaped by the fandom lol
I mean yeah, not all of the first 7 games plot points make the most sense, but also keep in mind that writing a story in this style is probably decently difficult to make. I don't mind there being 1 or 2 small plot points that don't really fit, because the story makes sense in the bigger picture.
@@westtexas_4491 well. It purposely contradicts it's self.
It has like 3 timelines.
Game devs are either: "Dammit, this guy spoiled the twist! We need to change it now!" or "We already have an original plot but this theory is more interesting."
spam jumpkick now
you wont
regrt
Wow, this was a real jumpkick of an observation
I feel like the latter is genuinely fine. It comes out more interesting, though if the theory was flawed it may make it worse.
Neither feels like a trend they should follow tbh
Or: we don't have real lore we just make it seem like it for more popularity so let's pretend this is what we were thinking all along
I love how scott watches game theory and he goes in and changed stuff to make it even better but like well try to make it better like with the box u could’ve change what is in the box but make it better
Yes and that is this done write, will parts of the fnaf lore contradict what came before it never made the games and story completely fall apart. Security breach had a cohesive story that fit with the lore but steel wool wanted a suprise ending.
who else is here after the announcement of him leaving 😭
I am.
I am gonna say that if game developers ARE changing their lore last minute around what you're doing, that's just poor decision making on their part. Rushed last minute changes are always gonna be worse than the actual story you were going to go with, fulfilling audience expectations isn't a bad thing, and fact is, if someone watched a theory video and spoiled the game for themselves, that's on them. Like listening to fan feed back is one thing, but changing everything around so it's a surprise, is just a bad idea.
You're right and you should say it.
You can’t tell an interesting and compelling story if everyone expecting it has already figured it out. If that happened, I’d be severely upset and angry, before scrapping the entire story and just abandoning it altogether. I’m not wasting my life making something amazing, only for a theorist to figure it all out and ruin the atmosphere the story is supposed to set.
Read my name!
@@nickter745thebold8 this ^^^^^^
@@nickter745thebold8 well to bad. Lore speculation existed before mat and will continue after him. If it can be guessed before you release it then it might not as interesting and compelling as you think.
Woah, really great video, honored to be mentioned in it. Interesting hearing your perspective on this whole topic.
The "don't chase that Game Theory video" is such an iconic line from your channel, that I'm ecstatic that he finally addressed it.
Let's Go, I'm so proud of you
i love your channel
You're the icon of this channel now buddy
thats right be honored foohl the great master matt pat had chosen you
mat is so obsessed with theories that he made a theory involving his own theories that theorify the games that he discusses for the theory.
1:01 the music :awesome
The intro: awesome
The editing : awesome
The video: AWESOME
AWESOME!!!!
As a writer, seeing people's reactions to a twist is always satisfying.
As a consumer, guessing a twist before it happens is always satisfying.
Please, writers, realise that you're making something with the primary intent of being enjoyable to an audience. If you get angry and change things when they do something that will make them happy, you're doing a bad job.
ruclips.net/video/vzRFZ0GJhmk/видео.html
ruclips.net/video/wdAtA0sm5yg/видео.html
Just video
I think the worse part about this is alot of them who actively have a issue put out the clues like a Easter egg hunt.
They set the eggs can't really get angry when someone finds them.
The thing about twists is they have to make sense. If your audience ends up seeing it coming, then oh well. Don't hard U turn and start going down the Interstate backwards
Jumpkick
there's also some writers out there who writes just for themselves. only sharing it with others just because they just want to share without thinking too much about it, whether it appease the audience or not.
Fun Fact: Matpat was only able to predict the plots because the developers had put clues in the game that led to it
OMG!!!!
It literally shows that they did their job right so there's no shame in the story being predicted
Like how Disney had to refilm Rogue One because he got right the Kylo Ren soldiers 🤫
Yeah
Do you expect to form a theory with no evidence 😂😂😂
Its actually really fun when a theory is completly wrong
I got an ad of this guy and the first thing he said is that I was watching a game theory video, cool but, slightly freaky
I'm an author. In one of my creative writing courses in college, my professor basically drilled home the idea that was highlighted by George R.R. Martin in this video clip: When the twist happens in your story, don't make it an unexpected twist. When the reader reads the twist, they should say to themselves "I should have seen that coming" because you (the author) laid out the clues before. Crazy storyline twists without clues don't trigger the reader's dopamine response and make the story fall flat. Apparently that's the same thing with video games.
That makes sense
Exactly. Thank you for making this comment.
If only the TV show writers saw that for Game of Thrones season 8...aka 'needless unsatisfying plot twists: the season'.
But if someone, before you even released the Book says "this and that will be the big twist" then-
Well, you gotta think of something better, because you don't want to have that big reaction/suprise.
And that is the Problem. If you corner a Dev/Writer of the Possibilites of a Twist, then yeah- it'll be bad.
One of the best twisty series in my opinion is Gravity Falls. Watchers were rewarded for solving the twists and it was very satisifying!
When it comes to fan guessing the plot twists it's often not a "ugh that was so easy to guess" the reaction is more often "yes I actually guessed it"
Exhibit A: MUUUUSSIC MAAAAAAN
@Emily An Do what Alex Hirsch (Creator of Gravity Falls) did and create a fake leak.
@@taizomichael7294yes. That’s a perfect example of that kinda “Hell yeah! I got it” reaction
I CALLED IT , I FREAKIN CALLED IT
Reply 5, hmm
I just want to jumpkick out. By hearing that the companies are changing their games by watching fan theories.😢
your videos are always a great jumpkick to my morning (idk what that word means)
when devs change something last minute to "subvert expectations" or whatever, it just hurts the fans. and it hurts hard like a jumpkick the face
Opinionated.
I see what you just did there
@@tomorrowisyesterday3215 r/beatmetoit
As a Minecraft fan think about this, Minecraft Lore had got to be hardest thing to be theory for Matpat. Minecraft has such a massive creative community, also there's simply too many ideas could be added to the game and lore, making it unpredictable. But WB's Minecraft Movie without Steve as protagonist is disappointing. T_T
The devs are still awesome
This piece is quite remarkable; akin to a book I found equally enthralling. "Game Theory and the Pursuit of Algorithmic Fairness" by Jack Frostwell
MatPat became the man(+ the team) behind the theories
The theories don't kill the games, it's the writer/producers killing it by doing stupid last minute changes because they value "subverting the audiences expectation" or just suprising the audience way too high. It's the exact same with written stories like books and the like.
Whyruclips.net/video/FSSFgWlDbJU/видео.html..
Dont read my name!!..
Bruh the bots
Subvert their expectations by bot subverting their expectations and just keeping the game the same.
Matpat is killing the games
Theories make games so much more fun! But i do feel like some games do try to change things after seeing theories
Щ
Ж
Dont read my name!!..
Read my name❤️
Hi I watch your videos and I'm a fan
We also see this alot with Call of Duty, the fans don't get listened to and yet at launch every year their retail prices are the same depending on which edition you get. Do you really get more or is that just a marketing plea. Call of Duty is based on wars and combat, Something that is very real in our world. That's probably why it has the age rating that it has. Maybe it predicted the future with three games, Advanced Warfare, Call of Duty: Black Ops 3 and Infinite Warfare. I'm certain that actually going into war is way different than experiencing it in your own home. That probably explains why you don't have any videos of the sort. But continue what you are doing MatPat. I don't mean to do any harm to this channel because its fan-tastic. Im a fan btw if you got that joke. Ill admit that before I wasn't subscribed before this but watched your fnaf theory videos❤. I can't even tell you how many times I've watched the fnaf movie. You made a cameo! You are awesome!
Edit: Okay I literally searched up and you do have videos on Call of Duty!
Edit: Oh my, I'll just stick with your regular theory's. Hopefully I didn't spark anything 🙄🤐.
So my hulu keeps unpausing for no reason so when you said "Lemon party" it started the JJBA part 3 intro. it was hilarious. So funny I almost jumpkicked someone
To all the game developers out there, Matpat is right. Don’t worry about us finding out the lore of your games before you’re ready to release it all; it’s what makes the game fun. Finding out we were right about FNAF (in some cases) made it all the more exciting. It gives us something to talk about and reminisce over, it builds communities and friendships (from what I’ve seen, FNAF kids always migrate together). And at the end of the day, it’s nice find yourself correct about something.
…It most certainly does not.
@@nickter745thebold8 that's your opinion. I like it when a theory I formulated turns out to be right... Doesn't make me stop the movie/game I'm watching/playing. In fact it encourages me to play even more.
@@a_d3mon I feel this guy is generally not a theoriser of any media and doesn't like it. He is harping ab the same "why theories are bad" points in every reply on the top comments
Yup. We keep coming back to FNaF PRECISELY Bec each new game gives us more bits and pieces. A theory or head canon can NEVER replace the next part.
Haha yeah sure buddy, i doubt that
Mat has finally reached the "Are we the bad guys" level of doing theories.
@DONTCLICK shut up
Weed-chan... are we the baddies?
"Am I the drama?"
@@wariodude128 "Weed, come on, it's all behind us.
Let us blow it all out of proportion. Why not? I say we we can't have interesting games NO-ONE, no-one can."
He reached that back when Fnaf 4 came out and he did his 800th video on fnaf
Getting a theory on your game by matpat is a huge jumpkick
Idk, but I think that the game Matt was talking about at the beginning might have been Hello Neighbor based on what Matt said in some theories about the game and how it felt incomplete
Not entirely theorists fault but it sucks that this happens and games studios just need to stick with what they have and finish it
Not at all theorist's fault, because the developer has layed out most of the pieces for them. FNAF Security Breach was working off of hints that creator Scott Cawthon had already put out in previous games and in trailers. We especially know this happened, because the game has almost no Lore, what little story there is, is messy, doesn't make sense, and the gameplay doesn't fit. The creator admitting that he has done this is the final nail in the coffin.
Not entirely? More like not at all their fault.
Games studios are better than yters
fr
Hey do you mind doing a theory on evertale?
I can imagine actual game developers out there watching MatPat, just hoping he doesn’t cover the project they’re working on, so the entire lore and backstory isn’t revealed to the public, just because MatPat saw a 15 second advertisement of it.
Dont read my name!!😑.
Wow nice fake check mark there scammer.
EDIT: To clear up confusion this comment is about @The Game Shorts
Sorry your comment I filled with bots
Report the bots.
you know what, jsgwoam, you honestly deserve all these bots in your replies for being so obnoxious in every comment section and leaving comments on videos before even 10 seconds passed.
Love my boy superhorrorbro getting some representation
We’re really gonna miss you jumpkick …. Wait I mean Matt!
I totally agree, its a real jumpkick to the face when devs rush a game so the ending doesnt make sense
I see what you did sir.
*gives golf clap*
*joins in on golf clap*
also joins in golf clap
Also joins in the golf claps
Also joins in the golf clap
I think Gravity Falls does theory baiting perfectly. It leaves plenty of clues, some obvious and some not, for the viewer so that it's a fun experience for everyone. If that comes at the cost of some hardcore theorists figuring it out, that's okay! They even joke about that with one of the biggest twists in the series.
"Hardcore Theorists" are some of your most loyal fans. I can't understand when a lot of stories want to punish them with unforeshadowed asspull twists.
@@alexcoffey8804 (i assume) its cuz storywriters(storycrafters? cuz video games too?) either get angry that their hard work is seemingly going to waste because fans figure out the story, and then after that the writer changes the ending as one last "ha see you never saw this twist coming!!!( ͡0 ͜ʖ ͡0)" to try and get that reaction from the audience that they feel like they lost. What also could be happening is the author worrying that the fanbase would be dissapointed, and surely some of them would be, having expected a twist and then feeling robbed of that feeling of piecing the twist together in their head, just because they watched a youtube video and because they worry about those fans' dissapointment, it leads to them changing the twist or mystery last second to avoid that problem, ultimately leading to a rushed story
yes! gravity falls, steven universe, the owl house, these types of shows (and in turn stories) are always the best because they plant the clues for you to figure out then when it's revealed it feels so much better than a "wow plot twist that you never saw" because it feels like it fits more and makes more sense in the universe we follow along with
Do you mean series at whole or just the McGucket leak incident?
I miss Gravity Falls so much 🥺 nothing has replaced it for me.
Just Underrated Monthly Perfect! Kicking Information Contest King!
coming back to this video after ruin,
and it seems steel wool at least, listened, everyone assumed it was the mimic, and it was. and while. ruins still a tadbit weird. it feels far more like what security breach was meant to be, vs what we got.
Matpat: ARE MY THEORIES KILLING GAMES?
Also Matpat: *makes a theory about it*
Maybe making a theory about killing games with theories will kill the game of making theories about games.
It's like a very meta seppuku.
@@nothing4youhere540 I wanted to make a reply to the comment which basically says the same:
"It totally makes sense:
If making theory about games kills games
then making theory about killing games kills killing games.
perfect!"
But when I logged in to write it I noticed you already did 1 minute before."
@@bicyclesonthemoon No more Danganronpa and Among Us? :,(
/j
BIG BRAIN
A theory in a theory that's like 16 *Theory*
Matpat 2014: “Let’s solve a series of haunted animatronics.”
Matpat 2022: “What was in the box again?”
These bots
Did we ever find out what was in the box?
@@temmie5960 nope. Never brought up again.
@DONTCLICK shut shut it shut
It might have been a Robotic version of the crying child
Thank you, MatPat
Jumpkick
now that im thinking about it how do you feel about the fnaf story so far and what are the things u dont like about it and if u had a choice to change the roles of characters or story how would u do it
When I started watching Game Theory, I was around 12 or 13 years old, and I thought that it would be the coolest thing if I made a game that MatPat could make a theory about. Now I'm a college graduate with a degree in game programming and I still think it would be the coolest thing if I made a game that MatPat could make a theory about. I'd be super excited to have something in my game correctly predicted by theorists!
That's interesting to know! Maybe I could play one of your games someday :D
I'd play your games if my device was compatible with Steam D:
@@crystalcat1002 what device?
Remind me when you make a cool game
SAME HERE!!!
Wow. This one hit hard. The infamous delays to Breath of the Wild’s sequel came to mind after I watched this, which is a game that has been heavily theorized over, and of course the messy lore of Security Breach which was also talked about in the video. What a great message, I hope it ripples throughout the game developer world. Theorizing fans are excited fans, and excited fans keep communities alive.
It's my theory that BOTW2 was delayed because of what the devs saw from FromSoftware. They wanted to add Elden Ring gameplay aspects to BOTW.
Wouldn't be surprised if we get a whole underground region. And if I am right, they probably were originally only intending a "sky region" addition.
Bandit! hey, love your theories
@@hollowshield2315 ikrruclips.net/video/a1j9owBuwdQ/видео.html
I was literally thinking about this too🤣
woah! I didn't expect to be seeing you here.
Drossito appeared in a GT video and I didn't even know, I really should watch this channel more often.
MatPat, congrats on hitting 4.5M views on this Theory Vid! I know it may be a bit smaller video that you're use to getting but it's still great no matter! I miss MatPat hosting every theory video, so I've been adding to the millions that liked these theory vids before me so hopefully MatPat will make a comeback outta retirement someday soon!!! That's a theory for another day!
“And if you don’t want to include any real lore at all, fine, I’ll still be here claiming it’s a prequel to earth bound anyways” the most accurate game theory quote
The fact that Matpat owns the Sans is Ness meme and doesn't shy away from it is pretty respectable. A lot of others would try and hide their past lunacy and just prove the Streisand effect to be real.
@keep rolling at
But at that point, wouldn't that mean lore exists whether the developers want it there or not?
@@jeffjeff9037 i mean yh, but at the end of the day, they’re just theories
@@IEatSignificantAmountsOfAss what’s the streisand effect
When Matpat said "Let us have something" it immediately made me think of MUSIC MAN because the amount of satisfaction from him seeing that he got it right was insane and I think it's a big example of us actually getting something.
Exactly my thoughts as well
But it could've been a much more cooler Character tho.
Afterall, it could've been one of Vanny's Constructs.
Hell, it could've been a bunch of Robots mixed together.
Your Minecraft theories actually inspired me to put lore in my worlds.
Matpat: im gonna JUMPKICK that hello neighbor theory idea
I pray that game company’s will watch this, I feel games like these would be so much better.
emas (read backwards)
I think "that game" was Hello Neighbour...
at least some indie guys will
HMMMMM YES! PATHFINDER!
I'm planning on making a game one day, and I'll take this advice to heart.
I agree with mat with the “let us have something” line. If you are watching a murder mystery-type film, it obviously has clues leading to the culprit and as with any puzzle, there is someone who will put the pieces together. If someone figures out who the culprit is, do they just stop playing the movie? No, of course not
Whyruclips.net/video/FSSFgWlDbJU/видео.html..
perfect comparison
This is a great comparison like why would they leave clues if you dont want us to solve it
It would be funny if out of no where someone screams "Oh the pizza delivery guy did it" and the movie just fast forwarded to the credits
@@localhdmain6306 ikrruclips.net/video/a1j9owBuwdQ/видео.html
I don’t know why they always change the story to try to jumpkick you into making a theory
man what if sonic's legs did a JUMPKICK ( matpat you used a hard word to make a joke about )
Theories make sure dead games are alive again and makes everyone look into it again.
ruclips.net/video/SPLl7UgvuLE/видео.html
Finally it's here.
Dont read my name!!😑.
Yes, I agree. Also Damn that's alot of bots
This is why I'm waiting for Matt to do a SoT theory
Yea when he covers horror games IV never even heard of it makes me think more about the game and wanting to try it
I remember reading somewhere that it's ok when your audience figures out the plot twist beforehand; it means the twist is believable and makes sense.
And it's not a bad thing?
Plot twist should still make sense, it subvert expectations but not change it entirely
There's a fine line to balance, if a movie plot is so freaking obvious that the majority guess the plot twist, they won't be happy that it turned out to be such an obvious plot twist, they will think it was boring, but if the movie was pretty deep and complicating so that it took a lot of digging and thinking to figure out the plot twist, then fans would be very happy and satisfied that they figured it out.
On the opposite end, if your story is far too complicated and doesn't have coherent hints and foreshadowing, then fans won't like it because it's pointless and impossible to try to figure it out, there's no satisfaction with the conclusion because there was no way to figure it out in the first place. It's a fine line to ride and it isn't easy.
That's literally a JJ Martin qoute that's in the video.
@@Roadent1241 Nope
guys hes tricking us to comment when he told us not to comment jumpkick
You commented it!!!!! Let’s jumpkick on you!!
He should have mentioned Sans is ness
To all game developers:
As much as we like twists into the story, we also like getting our theories correct.
100% true
Well thats a jumpkick.
@@redbomb6797 okruclips.net/video/a1j9owBuwdQ/видео.html
If there’s a twist, we want it to make sense. We NEED it to make sense! Otherwise the ending isn’t satisfying.
Whether we got it right or wrong is whatever, but MAKE IT MAKE SENSE, MAMA!!!
@@tealablu3759 Right? It’s more fun to realize it was an error in judgement than to realize there was no point in trying at all
Matt Burnett, from Steven Universe, actually said something interesting about this type of thing : "'I knew it!' Is always better than 'I didn't see that coming.' It's a much more rewarding experience to be right." It's sad that most games of this genre always try to surprise us, when really, getting something right is just as nice as being surprised.
the best games do both--and do the "I didn't see that coming" with things that have actually been hinted about and could be figured out if you were smart/pieced together everything.
@@ethan5915 I agree, Bioshock is an incredible example of the latter. the pure essence of "whoa I didn't see that coming"
This is part of why The Last Jedi sucks, making completely universe breaking twists simply because the fans would never expect it, is cheap and dumb.
Edit: capitalized "sucks" instead of "the" for some reason. Glad I read my comments after I hit send lol
I think the issue is that when the viewer watches the video and the product echoes it, it's no longer surprising because the viewer didn't have to think about it.
Just look at how happy MatPat was when he saw the Security Breach trailer
The game he probably talking abt is Hello Neighbor Right? RIGHT?
See, what developers and writers seem to forget, is that if fans are theorizing about your story... it means the fans are *interested.* It means we're paying attention. Don't punish fans for enjoying and being engaged in your story by sabotaging your story just to try and surprise us.
Finally the dumb bots are here.
Anyways I agree with what you said
Devs are still amazing tho.
I feel like sometimes developers forget that the whole point of leaving these clues and hints is for us to piece them together as the story goes on and it sucks ,because the feeling of calling something out before it happens isn't out of superiority ,but it makes you feel like you truly understand and appreciate the work put into this and when writers or artists or developers actually follow through or fulfill that end it feels like a little nod from them to us like *I'm glad you got here* it is 1000000 times better than them changing it for us to be wrong, because then what are we even here for?
For mr Bone's wild ride
@@roberttheronin9803 okruclips.net/video/a1j9owBuwdQ/видео.html
@@eatyourcreal9365 yesss🔥🔥🔥
@@eatyourcreal9365 yessir🔥🔥🔥
Jumpkick
I'm alredy subscribed
i think someone should do the literature theorists for written works like comics and novels
2010s OBSESSION with subverting expectations murdered so many stories.
Right?
Exactly
Specify it's the late 2010s, most earlier games still had soul in them
Congratulations. I am your 666th like.
As a fanfic writer, I'm usually ecstatic when someone figures out the next plotpoint I'm introducing. It makes me happy knowing that it makes sense, and it makes them happy knowing they got it right. Companies shouldn't be changing the plots of their stories and games just because someone predicted them, and it always sucks when the Internet goes "oh! we figured this out!" so the story gets thrown into the trash.
So true haha
More than that, these companies don't take into account that their plot is going to become known anyway and it will have to defend itself from scrutiny for years to come.
Same, I do write original work and if I have a plot twist, I want to achieve an "Omg that makes so much sense" moment, but a "I knew it!" is just as great. The worst is if it doesn't make sense from a reader's perspective or if the clues haven't been laid out properly
It would make me absolutely furious if someone figured out what I was writing and I’d be forced to restart everything from scratch. It ticks me off like you wouldn’t believe.
@@nickter745thebold8 Why would you have to restart? That's just overly insecure.
there is a new add in merge mantion that is live action
A theory is peak advertising
Nothing like having a person you like tell you about a thing they like
If developers/writers don’t want us to solve the mystery, then that begs the question: why did you bother leaving clues?
it's basically just left for a speculation but when you have a fan that just basically spoiled everything before the big reveal, that's when it becomes a problem
So that after the twist the fans can go back/replay and be like omg its foreshadowed here, what an idiot i am for not thinking about this"
well .... games sell more when you're unsure...
The better thing to ask is: why did you leave so many clues? Because often enough, if it takes 1 game for the player base to deduce the plottwist as one of the biggest things to happen in the next game, even if it is a plottwist you preferred was kept secret but discoverable on second playthrough, then you simply left too many clues.
The key rule to plottwists is to leave out enough evidence to hint at a potential plottwist, but that there is more evidence on the contrary. Again, not too much to a point where it feels like the potential plottwist is being covered up making it more obvious. But just enough red herrings to show there is something is not right, but with enough normality for players to not dig too deep.
Let alone that the biggest killer of plottwists is devs adding certain files that can be detected by the second game that have super obvious names.
And if someone manages to guess it correctly even against your best efforts to avoid it being revealed, just admit defeat and toss them a bone or easter egg in the update.
@@akira8393 but no one spoiled anything because you don't know if it's right. you will still be excited about a twist even if matpat made a video about it correctly
Depends on the consumer. I stay away from spoilers as much as possible. My close friend however, dives DEEP and wants to know everything before whatever is it comes out, so he loves any and all theories!
My name's Tom sweeny and I....
@@asaelpaniagua huh?
@@dhilan_yt9412 probably better that you don't know
Keith David?
Jumpkick
I haven’t searched lemon party but out of curiosity is it something that’d make the FBI jumpkick my door in?
Do it.
I no longer have a bias towards security breach. *tosses Glamrock Freddy in a box for safe-keeping*
"If you design a story where the butler did it, and somebody guesses it. You can't just change it to be the maid. It won't make sense and it isn't worth "subverting expectations" if it ruins the story ultimately."
Some paraphrased author, probably.
Yeah, just the author of Game of Thrones, no biggie
@@thatkangajackie1841 ngl i have only heard of that movie like a year ago and neither i nor literally any of my friends still know basically anything about it so i read the "no biggy" very literally 🙃
This reminds me of that one scene from the matrix:
Oracle: "I'd ask you to sit down, but, you're not going to anyway. And don't worry about the vase."
Neo: "What vase?" [Neo knocks over a vase of flowers, which shatters on the floor.]
Oracle: "Ohh, what's really going to bake your noodle later on is, would you still have broken it if I hadn't said anything?"
I thought that said Onceler
okay, i doubt this is gonna get much attention but yeah, theory channels and for some games you specifically have changed the story of the games and what not, lets take a look at my biggest gripe with FNAF, the bite. FNAF 1 we are introduced to the bite of 87 in the first night, fast forward to (what was going to be) the final chapter, we see in the mini games a bite, we also see in the ini games the "toy" range, which unless we assume that the toy anamtronics in fnaf 2 were made based on characters in either freddie and friends or other material in universe they had to have come first, so either FNAF 2 happens in 1983 (or earlier) OR the bite in FNAF 4 happens in 1987
Matpat helped to jumpkick some games and trends
Ah, yes, I call this "the Moffat factor" where subverting expectations and "outsmarting" the audience is valued more than actually telling a compelling strory.
I call it “the Nolan factor” because of Westworld, but it’s the same premise.
MatPat is a brain burner!(Правдивое видео):. ruclips.net/video/cAQxPSwM4h0/видео.html
Still better than Chibnal
@@III-kk8rp Why is the Tsar of Bulgaria doing an impression of a paper shredder? Assuming Bulgarian Cyrillic is the same as Russian Cyrillic, that is
It’s hard to tell a compelling story when everyone else has already figured it out.
The developers should never change the game's story just because of fan theories, be they right or wrong. They should only make changes they belive are better than what they already have.
don't worry, I would never say jumpkick
Dan Harmon avoided threads for this reason. Take note.
Im so glad Hello Neighbour was in this discussion. I have always wanted to hear MatPat's thoughts on those tweets
Hello Neighbor is a crappy game
@@thegoldendiamond6762 it was so promising, disappointed to hear how it turned out. I hadn’t heard much of anything about it since the original alphas.
@@Nightbird8272 it ended up dissapointing bc from what i heard the company fired the devs and replaced them with new ones when alpha 2 came out
Me too. It was nice to see him address them.