Maxon Cinema 4D and Redshift PC Build Specs
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- Опубликовано: 24 фев 2022
- Welcome! Today We're Answering Subscribers Questions! Cinema 4D and Redshift PC Build Specs. We're going to read the Conversation. We're going to through the Specs. We're going to Itemize and see if We can provide a couple of Solutions. One with what He has. And two with what We think He needs. What We would recommend the Build situation should be. And because of the situation right now, it was a problem getting Our hands on a GPU. Right now it's getting to be a problem getting Our hands on the right CPU. Let's check those Specs.
Links as mentioned in Video:
1. MEG X570 GODLIKE - Motherboard - MSI Global
www.msi.com/Motherboard/MEG-X...
amzn.to/3sgReC0
2. GeForce RTX 3090 Graphics Card - NVIDIA
www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/...
amzn.to/35k1q3L
3. AMD Ryzen 9 5950X - Gaming Desktop Processors - AMD
www.amd.com/en/products/cpu/a...
amzn.to/3BW6KGL
4. NVIDIA RTX A6000 For Powerful Visual Computing - NVIDIA
www.nvidia.com/en-us/design-v...
amzn.to/3HgFbcf
5. Cinema 4D S24 Requirements
www.maxon.net/en/requirements...
6. Redshift Requirements
www.maxon.net/en/requirements...
7. AMD Workstation Processors - AMD
www.amd.com/en/processors/wor...
8. Socket sWRX WRX80 Motherboards - AMD
www.amd.com/en/chipsets/wrx80
9. Supermicro WRX80 Motherboard and Threadripper Pro 3955WX 16 cores 32 Threads CPU
amzn.to/3IzzaJn
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Mr, you blew this millennials mind. The user manual can answer 90% of the questions I have regarding a workstation build. Liked and subbed!
Hi Ragoons GG,
Welcome! Outstanding! We should see movement with Threadripper Pro Workstations by the end of March. Along with an MSI WRX80 Monster Motherboard with Lenovo. Crazy, right. Appreciate Your Comments! I'm honored!
I found you by searching for pcie lane allocation, i watched some of your videos and i must say i really enjoy your content!
Great job and keep going! :)
Hi Martin Prendes,
Welcome! Appreciate Your Comments! Thank You for Subscribing! Bifurcation and PCIe Lane allocations are very important going forward from PCIe 3.0 and beyond. Everything points to either a HEDT or Workstation to get those Resources from Shared to Dedicated! Working on next Video!
Great thoughts on, ws/Thank you.
Hi dennis stanosek,
Welcome! Appreciate Your Comments! Thanks for Watching!
This is amazing thanks
Hi TyFiHi,
Welcome! Excellent! Appreciate Your Comments! Thanks for Watching!
Thanks GILL. SPOT ON. #1 Resources.
Hi Max Hughes,
Good to hear from You! Thanks for working on that rabbit hole. Appreciate Your Comments and Support. Working on next Video. Going to Test DaVinci Resolve and DaVinci Resolve Studio with 2 or 3 different GPUs and show those Results given the HEDT TRX40. Testing takes time and patience!
Really interesting about CPU availability right now on Threadripper 3 HEDT and Threadripper Pro Workstation. I've never seen anything like this! Also still have a Thunderbolt Audio interface to Film!
BTW: Over 6,000 Subscribers! Amazing! An Honor and a Priviledge!
@@BuildOrBuy 6000 guys want your opinion.
Hi@@maxhughes5687,
Absolutely! Working on DaVinci Resolve data. First Benchmark Results then Build Specs!
BTW: Have You noticed nearly all the TRX40 HEDT and WRX80 Workstation CPUs are out of stock! Amazing!
Hi Max,
Just found this latest News... FYI!
1. AMD's Ryzen Threadripper Pro 5995WX Tops CPU Benchmark | Tom's Hardware
www.tomshardware.com/news/amds-ryzen-threadripper-pro-5995wx-tops-cpu-benchmark
2. PassMark Intel vs AMD CPU Benchmarks - High End CPUs
www.cpubenchmark.net/high_end_cpus.html
@@BuildOrBuy It is phenomenal .
Another phenomenal video! Absolutely crushed it.
Hi Way Ahead Ventures,
Welcome! Appreciate Your Comments! We're all about Options!
Hey just found your channel, my goodness.. blown away with your knowledge. I'll share this channel with my friends..... still find it hard to understand, for a fee can you recommend a build individually? Thanks.
Hi Ramon Rodriguez,
Welcome! Absolutely! Let's talk!
That Asus Pro WS WRX board is outright beautiful!
Hi Claus Bohm,
After reading Your other Video Comment, yes! The ASUS Pro WRX80 is a beautiful site of a Motherboard to behold with plenty of PCIe Resources for Multiple GPUs! What's Your time frame to Build? We are all waiting on the new series of Threadripper Pro CPUs due, We think, in October 2022! Not that far off!
@@BuildOrBuy I can wait to do it right, my last system was built in 2016, dual evga 1080ti hybrids with a water cooled i9-7980xe stored by a samsung m.2 in a mid tower phantek enthoo ... looks simple, sexy with the tempered display glass window and runs very cool. running all the major animation programs and Davinci.
Wow! Hatur nuhun (Thank you so much) Gill
This was very detailed explanation for my short question which exactly what I needed
I'm sure this will help us to consider our built in the futures!
Will consider to change the GPU first but in my country (Indonesia) some parts can jumped in price quite high and the stock are usually low
that's why I really want to maximized what I already got first
and yeah I already got 64gb 3200 of RAM, I think thats enough atleast for now...
Can't Thank you enough for this video
Loved the works and keep it up! 😍
Please read my comment before buying a useless A6000...
@@thuering6229 will do mate,
I'm not rushing into buying anything
Just trying to understand what I might need in the futures
Thanks for the comment
Absolutely! At least You have mainly two Options based on Our Discussion for consideration. Yes, component prices and availability are an issue everywhere. Nothing is ideal. Keep Us Posted on Your Project! Fascinating work You're doing!
Hi@@thuering6229,
Welcome! Thank You for Your Comments. What are You using to Render with?
Hi@@agesnajohdan6050,
Always check and compare to know Your Options! Success on Your Rendering!
TR Pro 5000wx just announced yesterday! But only for Lenovo P620 for now
Wait a whole year after Ryzen got ZEN3 and the TR PRO 5000 release is for OEM.
Hi Damien Chai,
Yes! And MSI is now going to join the WRX80 Platform! Initially only on Lenovo! We're working on a Video for DaVinci Resolve Workstation Build Specs to include this Info!
www.tomshardware.com/news/msi-ws-wrx80-motherboard-has-amd-threadripper-workstations-in-its-sights
HI@@maxhughes5687,
Thanks for taking care of this! Yes, to reiterate what I mentioned to Damien. MSI is now going to join the WRX80 Platform! Initially only on Lenovo! We're working on a Video for DaVinci Resolve Workstation Build Specs to include this Info! Expect We'll se the MSI WRX80 and Threadripper Pro 5000 CPUs on Lenovo in 3 to 6 months! Then the rest of Us will have access to both not on Lenovo!
www.tomshardware.com/news/msi-ws-wrx80-motherboard-has-amd-threadripper-workstations-in-its-sights
ir.amd.com/news-events/press-releases/detail/1051/new-amd-ryzen-threadripper-pro-5000-wx-series-processors
@@BuildOrBuy Thanks for the links. Pros that buy the TR PRO by the dozens covered the workstation for Video.
Hi@@maxhughes5687,
Absolutely! Was hoping to have a confirmation from MSI but nothing official yet. No press release. Curious that Lenovo will have the new MSI WRX80 Motherboard 1st.
Wow! That's a lot of info
Thanks.
Hi james wubbolt,
Appreciate Your Comment! Had to share this response. Instead of just a written Comment. Hoping the Video might be more helpful to more Subscribers.
I have a TRX40 XTREME motherboard, RYZEN Threadripper 3950X and 4 x 3090 RTXs, 1 x 2000w PSU, 1 x 850w PSU and I've been having problems. My motherboard and 2000w psu recently blew and I'm trying to find a replacement TRX40 compatible CPU in Europe but cannot find one. I had a computer shop in Paris put this together for me when I said I needed a computer for GPU rendering with Cinema 4D + Octane (similar to Redshift). Any ideas?
Hi Art By Aymeric,
Welcome! Bummer! Jump over that! We've been tracking CPU prices. Crazy right now! Since the AMD HEDT is being shelved, and based on current prices, suggest moving to the WRX80 Workstation Platform. Gigabyte (Thunderbolt 3), ASUS, ASRock (Thunderbolt 4) and Supermicro. The Threadripper Pro 5000 Series CPUs should be available by October 2022. If You need a System sooner, get a 3000 Series Threadripper Pro CPU! For the money, You'll have more Processing Power. The TRX40 HEDT was amazing! However, current prices have made that Platform more expensive than the WRX80 Workstation Platform! We're all eager to see the new Threadripper Pro CPUs! Gigabyte now has 3 - WRX80 Motherboards. We've only seen 2 of them Listed on NewEgg and Beach Audio. The List of WRX80 Motherboards is growing - MSI! And You'll also have enough X16 Slots, electrically for 4 GPUs instead of 2 - X16 and 2 - X8, electrically.
Gigabyte
1. WRX80-SU8-IPMI - Thunderbolt 3.
2. Gigabyte MC62-G40
3. Gigabyte MC62-G41
Socket sWRX WRX80 Motherboards | AMD www.amd.com/en/chipsets/wrx80
Hope that helps! A longer term and short term Solution! Options! Keep Us Posted on which Direction You choose! This Info helps Us to make better Videos!
@@BuildOrBuy Somewhat thanks! I literally bought the system 9 months ago and now there is no support, no options for the motherboard so I basically have to replace the CPU which I just spent 2000 euros on which is so annoying as I don't have the money, bad luck really investing in some top stuff only for the companies to discontinue right after
Hi@@renderinginprogress,
I hear what You're saying. And agree! However, We had no way of knowing at that time this would happen. However, based on the Technology, makes sense. You have 3 Options right now, TRX40 or WRX80. We love the TRX40 but no Upgrade path as We were originally led to believe. If You need a TRX40 Motherboard, still fairly easy to obtain. If However You require a TRX40 Threadripper CPU, that's where We draw the line since those CPUs are ridiculously over priced. Even higher than overpriced WRX80 Threadripper Pro CPUs! And as soon as the new Threadripper Pro 5000 series CPUs become available, We expect those at $100 per Core! Very reasonable. Option 3 - At 9 months, what about Your Warranty? Did You Contact both AMD and Gigabyte? If so, what did they say?
Hello,
I'm having this wierd problem with my pc. It restarts automatically while working. The timing getting short for every restart and eventually became dead. Not able to turn it on for weeks. And then suddenly one day it back to life with the same restarting problem. I've took it to local computer market to fix but didn't work. I've sent my motherboard to gigabite service center 3 times and they found bo problem with it. I don't know what to do. Please help.
I work with c4d, redshift, and keyshot. My pc specs is i7 8gen, motherboard z370, rtx 3060 bought 6 months ago, 32 gigs ram,
2 m.2 500 gb. 1tb hard drive, 650 watt power supply.
Hi Jawar Deen,
Welcome! Bummer having this problem! Going to be a hassle to Diagnose and Rectify! Just because any Vendor says the Motherboard is good does not make it so! Been there, dealt with that from both ASUS and Gigabyte!
1. 1st Question: When did this start? Can You nail it down. From the beginning or at a certain point in time? We don't know if this is Hardware or Software.
Did You check the Windows Logs? Could be a Driver issue. Start with Updating Motherboard Drivers then GPU Drivers. What Gigabyte Motherboard Model, Revision and Chipset - X370, OK! Did this start AFTER installing the new GPU? Which NVIDIA Drivers are You using? Studio Drivers? NOT Gaming Drivers!
2. To resolve this will require stripping down Your Build to Basics with a Clean install of the O/S.
RAM, Motherboard, CPU, and 1 GPU, one M.2 NVMe Drive! Then O/S. Watch and wait!
3. IF this is determined to be Hardware, start with PSU then Motherboard. Yes, different. New! Suggest larger PSU, 850 watt - EVGA, Seasonic, ASUS or Be Quiet. Quality PSU matters! And Same Motherboard just a new one! We've had Motherboards Tested We know were bad. RMA is useless. All kinds of Questions arise. ESD from Handling, Bad RAM Slots, CPU not correctly Torqued. Is RAM on QVL? Etc. Hope this will help to Troubleshoot Your situation! Keep Us Posted on Your Progress! Hope that helps!
hello sir
how to switch computer to gpu rander setting cinama 4d 3050 rtx my computer not use gup only system speed use plz help. outher softwer iclone adobe
use gup . but cinama 4d not gpu speed use ? plz help
Hi Wow Angel Kids,
Welcome! AMD Radeon ProRender based on OpenCL, however since You have an NVIDIA GPU, You'll need to use an external GPU Render Engine. GPU rendering capabilities are available within Cinema 4D via Connection Plugin.
www.maxon.net/en/cinema-4d/integration/render-engines
Another Render Engine option - CentiLeo Renderer
centileo.com/docs/index.php?COURSE_ID=3&LESSON_ID=43&LESSON_PATH=17.43
Select the GPUs and RAM Texture cache size. Hope that helps! Build Specs for Rendering are different from Render option Settings! Success on Your Rendering!
For Reference:
MAXON Cinema 4D | Radeon ProRender | AMD
www.amd.com/en/graphics/workstation-media-and-entertainment-solutions-media-maxon-cinema-4d
thanks sir 😍👍
Hi@@wowangelkids9307,
You're welcome! Glad to help! Thanks for Watching!
I would love to see a followup talk about latest 3400 xeons vs what we know about upcoming Tread-rippers …and if CPU matters as much since Redshift is mostly a GPU renderer.. (I know it does do CPU as well ….but i’m way more interested in CPU limitations in Cinema 4d using GPU based renderers like Octane and Redshift)
Hi CJ Adams,
Welcome! W-3400? W790 Chipset. More Questions than Answers right now! Anything Workstation would be ECC. The W790 based on PCIe Lane count is more HEDT than Workstation. Two Options, Intel W790 - DDR5 ECC Sideband or AMD WRX80 - DDR4 ECC. Parity. Big difference in DDR4 ECC vs DDR5 ECC. Expect next iteration of AMD Workstation to be DDR5. New Chipset, New Motherboards. Going to upset a lot of Users who were already upset when AMD abandoned HEDT! What You're asking is too early to know Anything beyond Specs. We need Research Data. Great idea, eventually! GPUs even. No more NVLink. Only GV100 or above will support NVLink. Crazy stuff. Making the Case of 1 GPU whether Consumer or Enterprise. Yes NVLink is NOT required for multiple GPUs on Redshift. Yes to reiterate Redshift can use multiple GPUs. Which makes the case for Slot Width of 2 Slots or less. Interesting going back and forth on Specs, Designs vs Implementations and Consumer vs Enterprise options. Changing one thing can change everything! About the time We get this figured out, something changes and We start all over again! Fascinating!
@@BuildOrBuy I agree its not as clear as i’d like.. i’m ok with non ECC honestly and dual 4090s. Anything more ill hit up RNDR or something else .. RNDR will do redshift and Arnold eventually so that may be a good option.. (IF they every actually do it) - For now i’m ok with things being a solid HEDT setup. Why i’m looking at the options.. Id love to see a video comparing for example how much it matters with GPU renderers i9 13900k vs threadripper pro vs xeon at this point
Hi@@cjadams7434,
Agreed! Render Network to the rescue! OK. 2 RTX 4090s, preferably 2 Slots Wide. Good choice. Aside from other factors such as Heat and PSU. HEDT Absolutely! That was the best of Features for Price and Performance. Both Intel and AMD created a much needed market between Consumer Desktop and Workstations. The W680 was quietly introduced. A neutered Chipset. No Bifurcation on Supermicro W680 Motherboards. Conspicuously absent! Now the W790. Hmm. Crystal ball forcasting, Probably 6 months out. Yes, a Render Comparison would be great! Right now to reiterate, up for conjecture on ETA.
@@BuildOrBuy Would be great to see. i know in the past the cpu tasks were more obvious.. things like viewport speed or simulations (non gpu) for example. can be easily measured side by side.. but since RS and octane mostly use GPU for heavy living.. how much cpu is enough? … i also am considering using the aorus waterforce or the msi suprime for the dual boards since they are closed loop water cooled.. should leave room and slots (physically open) for things like my Decklink BMD HDSDi board and my VR 6gig wireless card. one reason i’m looking at workstation mobos that have enough PCI-e lanes and many slots.. just to physically be able to not have contention with m.2 and such as well.
BTW i’m glad your ok.. saw you haven’t posted in a while. Always look fwd to your in-depth reviews of boards and chipsets.
Or..nvidia gv100?
No, defnitely WAY slower than a 3090 in terms of Redshift Rendering.
Hi Mike Quinton,
Definitely an Option. However, considering the Specs and Price, that might not be the best Option right now. Also... PCIe 3.0 vs PCIe 4.0 and the amount of VRAM - 32GBs VRAM vs 48GBs or 24GBs + 24GBs VRAM. Since the RTX A6000 appears to run hot, 2 RTX A5000s might be a better fit. Even though Redshift can utilize multiple GPUs, from what I've read, it does not scale well. Therefor, a Single or Dual GPU would be preferred. Are You using an NVIDIA GV100 for Rendering? I'm curious to see the next iteration of that GPU! And with new RTX 4000 GPUs, We start this hunt all over again with more PSU required! Appreciate Your Comment!
@@BuildOrBuy My brother is a EE in Texas and told me that many of these GPU's are underutilized. He said that if the user was Pixar or Disney Studios, the GV 100 would be a bargain at $34,000 a pop.
The thing is that for even an enthusiast, this card may be overkill but given the price of high end GPU's, the price difference is starting to close between something like a 3090 and the GV 100.
I talked to some folks who are in professional graphics and they said that cards like these are useful in a courtroom where evidence has to be substantiated and where either side can't argue about device deficiencies.
My big thing is that with all of the rave for the high end cards, I haven't seen anyone talk about these Quadro cards anymore; Engineers and scientists talk about this stuff along with pairing it with Mathematica in order to calculate the speed of galaxies. I'm not in that group.
HI@@mqcapps,
Fascinating! We'll keep that in mind if We ever get the chance to test one! Rendering is the only thing We encounter. And that's what We focus on for Content Creation. Amazing to know what some Viewers are doing with their GPUs! I now go by the Formula from Adobe for AE Multi-Frame Rendering CPU Optimization. Thanks for Sharing!
@@BuildOrBuy thanks for the response...but you may need pockets as deep as the challenger deep to get one on sale with coupon....
Or just optimise your project properly or switch to Unreal Engine 5 using Datasmith and Nanite. No single user should need 3+ RTX 3090s to achieve anything, that's insane.
Hi Valk-Kilmer,
Welcome! You'd be amazed at how many of those Requests We receive for installing Multiple GPUs. Hard to get most Viewers to accept 1 GPU even after asking about the Dataset size. Appreciate Your Comments! Thanks for Watching!
@@BuildOrBuy No problem just find the sheer cost involved for 3x GPUs your project really has to be worth it to justify that expense.
If you're working for a big studio like Blur etc that's okay but a guy in his bedroom making a small animation? No.
There are plenty of tools especially for Blender that can optimise your scene automatically to the point where even a heavy 4K scene with some denoising can be rendered on a 2060. In Maya/Max you have Mesh optimizers built in that can reduce polycount significantly without too much loss in detail.
I own a single RTX 3090 and it is plenty enough for the heaviest of work.
Hi@@Valk-Kilmer,
Thank You for Sharing! We Appreciate Your Comments!
Sorry, Gill, but half of the video is about a lot of bad advises. But let me explain.
First: your fixation on PCIe lanes on this channel is not always helpful. I am a "PCI Express Enthusiast" too, but i don't loose the look how a fewer or slower lanes affect real world performance. Example: In “Gaming” you lose - depending on the game - about 0-5% performance if you cut the PCIe performance into half. So a RTX 3090 connected with PCIe 4.0 x8 is still a high-end monster. But this is not about gaming, it’s about rendering. And that’s even less (!) depending on lanes: you can easily downgrade to x4 lanes without losing much rendering performance in nearly all professional applications! Because this is the way, most 3D renderers work these days: gather all data, put as much as possible into VRAM, process the data in VRAM and only use the PCIe for sending completed frames back and get some missing data. And even in 8K a PCIe 4.0 x4 with ~8 GB/s or x8 with ~16 GB/s is enough for this task. That was the first mistake. And you do that in a lot of videos, please have a look for real world benches, not an unimportant AIDA64 PCIe performance bench (or similar).
Then you advise a Quadro A6000 for him. “Doubled the power” you said, what an absolutely extreme bs. Please understand how Rendering is done - that’s not only about VRAM, it’s first and foremost about the cores. Btw. The GDDR6X VRAM on a RTX 3090 is a lot faster than the GDDR6 ECC RAM of the A6000. A more than $2000 more expensive for a GPU that is only 0-3% (!!!) faster than a RTX 3090 in Redshift Rendering. And no, 48 GB VRAM doesn’t help here, even for 8K rendering. If you overclock a RTX 3090 (what’s not really possible with a A6000, because you can’t enhance power limit over 300 watt) or buy an already OCed RTX 3090 (most of them are) it’s possible that a 3090 is even faster than an A6000.
Most motherboards don’t have a block diagram? Because they don’t want to know you about shared PCIe resources?! Sorry, but that’s real bs. Nearly all mid-range and all upper-class boards have a block diagram and it’s not a secret that all mainstream CPU & Chipsets only have a small number of PCIe lanes.
Problems with memory controller if you use all four DIMM slots? Maybe with Zen 1/1+, rarely with Zen 2, but not with Zen 3 (if you don’t go above DDR4-3600). So absolutely no problem with a Ryzen 5000 CPU and 4x 32GB RAM. It’s the current Threadripper / Threadripper Pro lineup with a bitchy memory controller. Threadripper Pro 5000 will do better - just because it’s Zen 3 base.
If it takes 8 minutes (!) for him to gather the data, the problem is definitely not an SSD. It must be a 5400rpm drive, maybe even external or a slow NAS.
Your advises should be:
- get a PCIe 4.0 NVMe for the CPU-attached first m.2 slot. A Seagate 530 or Western Digital SN850, both better than a Samsung 980 Pro. The very good Seagate is available with up to 4 TB. Put all your used media for that render on this drive. Put Windows and Software on a separated drive - doesn’t matter if SATA or PCIe 3.0 / 4.0 NVMe SSD.
- get a second RTX 3090 or wait for RTX 4090 in summer / fall 2022. It doesn’t matter (for professional rendering applications like Redshift, Blender, Arnold, V-Ray etc.) if the PCIe slot is downgraded to x8 lanes. If it’s a 3090: DON’T put them into a NVLink / SLI group. It’s decreasing performance. Professional apps are distributing the tasks on their own to all installed GPUs, they don’t need SLI for that.
- if you want to switch mainboard and CPU, wait at least for TR Pro 5000. TR Pro 3000 would be a DOWNGRADE for most applications, because single core performance is most times more important. Zen 3 is ~25% faster than Zen 2. I would wait for what's coming up in H2 2022.
Your not the first guy I've heard trying to hold on to the old tech. When you upgrade your tone will change. Gill suggest the new TR PRO with 128 cpu lanes and eight channel ram for an all purpose pro rig that can grow with the builder. Desktops don't have the I/O for anything but a single gpu, single NVMe card and antique dual channel ram. I had dual channel ram in 2002. 75 watts of the power to each gpu comes from the PCIe bus. Z570/Z690 motherboards aren't made for multi gpu builds. The Asus WRX80E has 16 Phase 80 Amp inductors on the board. It has two 8 pin EPS power cables, one 8 pin PCI power cable and two 6 pin PCI power cables plugged into the mobo. ROCK&ROLL
thuering A fake name helps you hide from accountability. Gill has a comment section and uses his real name. Even his wife Pat has more guts than you do.
"it’s not a secret that all mainstream CPU & Chipsets only have a small number of PCIe lanes." I found the number of X570/Z590/Z690 board owners that can't understand why a quad card with four NVMe drives won't work on their mainstream board to be the majority.
For pro work a 5950X is 3.4GB all cores. A TR PRO 3955WX is 3.9GB all cores. It's just rumors, but the 5955WX will be over 4.1GB all cores. We'll see. WRX80 runs eight channel ram at 4X the speed of data transfer on dual channel ram. PERIOD. I have no increase in latency going from 3200C14 dual to 3200C14 in eight channel. That's 14 14 14 14 34 at four times the transfer speed of dual channel. Yes I know, no gamer channel will ever mention that.
"Example: In “Gaming” you lose" The question to Gill wasn't about gaming. His question was about a platform for creator apps. Gill spoke about the limited resources on an X570 and the advantages of sWRX8 socket boards. THAT'S NOT BS.