Brilliant video. Every builder should watch this as part of their continuing education, whether they build like this or not. Adding a mini 2x6 floor in the attic so insulation can go all the way to the edge of the frame is such a cool/hot idea.
agree that rafters on top plates is not ideal. I was just thinking about solutions for vented attics this week (being victim of living in an 80's home). Given that in south, we put hvac, water heater, pop in can lights, etc into attic space, then the ideal solution is to do the Risinger sealed attic to feel good about it. The only vented roof options I could think of was to create some raised barrier, like ceiling rafters with sealed decking on top, then to sit the rafters on platform. Then you have to limit where and how you penetrate or use the attic. Or perhaps a 'traditional' framing method with 10' walls and put uitilities / insulated space in a drop ceiling that flows to wall.
@@PazLeBonI was curious too so I looked it up. It's "permanent wood foundation". It looks like basically instead of the basement walls being made of concrete and then surrounded by soil, just the floor is concrete and then the basement walls are made of pressure-tteated wood studs and OSB, and then surrounded by soil
baffles for venting that allows for insulation going all the way to the edge of the wall without blocking airflow to the truss cavity or rafter section. its all about venting.
I'm curious why the reference code you are calling out is ICC policies; which, I thought was mostly for multi-family, or commercial builds and IRC is for single family homes. Am i in error?
I get the 'advanced' framing advantages in some cases. However, in my local market ( CA) we are highly concerned with seismic/shear and no way i want to become known as the young high performance builder who goes around rubbing the city engineer's nose in the codebook. Maybe thats a battle for some other point in my career, i have enough regulatory and permitting headaches already😅 , and nothing im hearing here is such an evolutionary leap that it would be worth the switch. I forget where i heard it but I agree, even though my nerd side loves the build science; we are getting so overly concerned with efficiency (framing tricks and systems), we are losing sight of conservation (build and design smaller and better). Think thats a conversation we should be having too!
If I was in charge of setting a code for building, and I knew that I was liable for any deficiency that may come from that code, I would call for something that was well over what would actually work. Any veteran builders think that some code, and engineering is over-done?
Does James Hardie siding allow 24” OC fastening? Hard to believe 20 years later the siding remains flat, uniform, etc. ZipR panels all use thinner OSB so can’t rely on that, right? What is the right way?
Hi Jake. Loves this series and this video in particular. I'm currently designing my climate controlled workshop build, is there anything else you would add specifically for workshop/garage areas? In Ontario, Canada if that matters. Thanks again!
If your goal is to use the most wood possible, build 100% wood enveloppe - massive timber approach. Using studs is trying to engineer / optimize material.
Amusing to see that Inspectors not knowing their own rules is a universal thing! A different industry, but the sentiment is the same...... "If you can't do it..... Teach it." "If you can't teach it.... Examine it......." "If you can't do any of that, go and work for your Governing body as an Inspector."
@16:00 he states that the benefits of the header hanger over using a jack stud is it: eliminates one stud, uses less wood, leaves more space for insulation. What he doesn't mention is that the R value for a 2x6 stud is about 7, so how much of an insulation increase you really gaining? There's also no environmental benefit, as the amount resources and carbon emissions required to make the metal hanger is certainly greater than the amount necessary to produce a single jack stud.
The bottom line it all depends on whether you want a house that is solid and strong that can survive storms or looks super big to impress friends and the neighbors. I grew up in a farm home built in the 1700s, of approximately 2500 square-feet and my father added all the modern technology, my last trip to Pennsylvania it was still standing strong and proudly. The problem is that people want these big McMansions and don’t care how it’s built as long as they can get a bank loan to impress people, the contractors need to make a living so they have to cut costs in materials and labor. So the weak constructed house is flattened by a small storm, so insurance rates go up. Frankly I wouldn’t build a dog house built from OSB, and the nail gun construction is a joke. Hurricane Helene hit my home directly this September downed a 100 year oak tree on the east-side of the house no damage, this is a small solid home no OSB and the studs are on16 inch centers.
Interesting you are advocating for standard code (minimum) in the floor system with L/360 and not the better L/480. You usually talk about building better than code standards and minimum’s.
@@3nertia yeah, look up "thermo ply". They are 5/32 thick and made of cellulose fiber. Approved by the APA to replace OSB and plywood for exterior sheathing. Scary stuff.
My only beef is this standard is based on a 50 year house and will provide for that and probably half again for total lifespan. But I think if you can afford it you should be thinking multi generational home and those construction techniques.
@2:55 that argument doesn't work, because it just comes down to "do you want spend more now to have lower utility bills in the future?" There's no one right answer, because it's a matter of time preference, which will naturally vary among different people.
@@matt45540 No they're not always worth it, because that money could have been used for something else they value. If it were "always worth it", then you wouldn't need building codes forcing them to make the investment. It's their money, they should be the ones to make the decisions as to how their own money is spent.
This is not a comprehensive framing overview without discussing post frame framing (that can be in timber framing, pole barn or post-n-beam iterations). You have MUCH more room for insulation than 24” oc framing and the wall can be entirely thermally-broken with no additional effort. Materials prices are a little higher with post frame, but it’s a superior way to build. My standard post-n-beam frames are thermally-broken R38 walls and R53 roof assemblies. of course even more insulation can be added with upsized cavities or exterior foamboard.
@@matt45540 it actually dates back to the medieval and Egyptian days. Very traditional and very well-suited for modern open-concept type architecture since you don't need any load-bearing walls.
First cost is important but also cost of ownership this equals total cost over a period years … I used traditional framing bc it was cheaper first cost than adv. framing and installed exterior insulation and R15 in the cavity … I built in 2024
I'm sorry, but how is putting more studs in the wall cheaper first cost? Using OVE or Advanced Framing means fewer studs, fewer nails, and less framing labor, with marginally more insulation costs, which should save you more overall.
@@virtueofhate1778insulation codes vary by region, much like windshear and other things that are subjective to the climate are location.... Earthquake codes
Gotta start building like Matt (structurally speaking) heavy duty with pride. Make smaller old world style capes with high end utilities and finishes cool again, nothing makes me sicker than seeing these cheap but pricy 6k sq ft houses with 2 only boomers living in them..and every inside and outside light on while they tell you to go buy and EV 🙃..Engineered studs/lumber need to be the benchmark, straight as an arrow & strong, a much faster efficient build. Need to start investing in ourselves.
Lost me on the roof framing. Really tired of this idea that the roof is just a cap that never needs to be accessed for maintenance of any kind. Even a truss system can be engineered with access paths built in instead of requiring people to carefully navigate framing members buried in 10” of blown in insulation.
My house is 120 years old and I would bet in that time someone has gotten into the attic maybe 5 times after the initial build. Electric, insulation and plumbing in the 30's, new electric in the 80's, 90's more insulation. 2016 total gut. There is just no reason to get up there maybe, sprinkler system??
Once I did the performance math for 16oc vs 24oc, converting R to U values, calculating stud & cavity %'s, multiple U's by %'s, adding them up and convert back to total wall R value. I used several combinations and the gains were minor, I remember only +10% if double plate or not, in some cases 16oc out perform 24oc cause some 16" insulation batts are R-2 higher 24" batts. Throw in windows and air leakage in mix, and stud spacing doesn't really matter. In some area exterior insulation is must, making it even less important. IMHO, 16 oc is better though, stronger wall, and stud increments land closer for more conventional window/door openings.
A 10% gain on the largest portion of your power bills over the course of 100 years is huge. And you can put a door literally wherever you want you might just need an extra stud or two to meet code If you're only putting a door where a stud is conveniently that's just lazy
@@matt45540 It`s small factor in whole house performance, investing in air tightens, ERV and high performance windows will have much larger impact than stud spacing.
If you really want to blow your mind, do the figures on Post-Frame with 96"oc. Just looking at an 8ft x 8ft section of wall with no fenestrations to keep the math simple, the main cavity is less than 5% wood. What is 16oc? I think it's more than 3 times that. If you also insulate between the exterior girts, that layer is 23% wood, but it only has a 0.7-1.1% thermal bridge between the two layers, depending on if you're using 2x4 or 2x6 girts respectively. It's kind of ridiculous.
PLEASR. please stop using the dual camera trick where your talking head is sometimes looking at us and then our viewing angle is suddenly jerked over to one side. I guess this was considered cool once, but it's long past the novelty phase. Now it's just an irritating distraction. Thank you1. all the best
@PazLeBon its more than just lumber size. Its convenience, every time i want to hang a TV or anything on the wall i have to modify stuff to make it work, no thanks.
I mean if you do the math on 100’ of wall. there’s about 15 more board feet of lumber in a 2x6 wall on 24s vs a 2x4 wall on 16s. Thats not much of a difference but More lumber means more stronger 😉.
It’s just a plain and simple money grab by builders. Charge the same price for half the lumber. Good luck hanging anything on your walls. Ever wonder how a framer can afford a 100k truck? Now you know.
Brilliant video. Every builder should watch this as part of their continuing education, whether they build like this or not.
Adding a mini 2x6 floor in the attic so insulation can go all the way to the edge of the frame is such a cool/hot idea.
agree that rafters on top plates is not ideal. I was just thinking about solutions for vented attics this week (being victim of living in an 80's home). Given that in south, we put hvac, water heater, pop in can lights, etc into attic space, then the ideal solution is to do the Risinger sealed attic to feel good about it. The only vented roof options I could think of was to create some raised barrier, like ceiling rafters with sealed decking on top, then to sit the rafters on platform. Then you have to limit where and how you penetrate or use the attic. Or perhaps a 'traditional' framing method with 10' walls and put uitilities / insulated space in a drop ceiling that flows to wall.
An excellent demonstration of systems thinking, and buildings are nothing if not systems. Thank you, Jake.
Wow, what a wealth of knowledge Jake has! This was fascinating.
For my build, the PWF is framed at 12” OC, with the main level at 24” OC. Everything lines up perfectly
pwf?
@@PazLeBonI was curious too so I looked it up. It's "permanent wood foundation". It looks like basically instead of the basement walls being made of concrete and then surrounded by soil, just the floor is concrete and then the basement walls are made of pressure-tteated wood studs and OSB, and then surrounded by soil
@@RiffleVFXportfolio oh, that dont 'sound' great :) thanks, i just learned something ;)
That sound horrendous. Wood will rot in contact with dirt. Pressure treated or not.
@@RiffleVFXportfolio You don't need a concrete slab.
ton of information i found very interesting, thanks.
Matt Risinger - At 20:55 in the video what is the black ( looks like plastic )
Soffit vents
baffles for venting that allows for insulation going all the way to the edge of the wall without blocking airflow to the truss cavity or rafter section. its all about venting.
i would be curious what Tommy from This Old House thinks about 24 OC
I would not have it.
I'm curious why the reference code you are calling out is ICC policies; which, I thought was mostly for multi-family, or commercial builds and IRC is for single family homes. Am i in error?
I get the 'advanced' framing advantages in some cases. However, in my local market ( CA) we are highly concerned with seismic/shear and no way i want to become known as the young high performance builder who goes around rubbing the city engineer's nose in the codebook. Maybe thats a battle for some other point in my career, i have enough regulatory and permitting headaches already😅 , and nothing im hearing here is such an evolutionary leap that it would be worth the switch.
I forget where i heard it but I agree, even though my nerd side loves the build science; we are getting so overly concerned with efficiency (framing tricks and systems), we are losing sight of conservation (build and design smaller and better). Think thats a conversation we should be having too!
Very well done. Thank you for the video
If I was in charge of setting a code for building, and I knew that I was liable for any deficiency that may come from that code, I would call for something that was well over what would actually work. Any veteran builders think that some code, and engineering is over-done?
Does James Hardie siding allow 24” OC fastening? Hard to believe 20 years later the siding remains flat, uniform, etc. ZipR panels all use thinner OSB so can’t rely on that, right? What is the right way?
Yes,
Hi Jake. Loves this series and this video in particular. I'm currently designing my climate controlled workshop build, is there anything else you would add specifically for workshop/garage areas? In Ontario, Canada if that matters. Thanks again!
36” on center is all the rave with the kids these days, and we are going to be getting rid of studs completely here in 2025!
Pfff, I'm designing our retirement home with 96"oc. Like, seriously.
Oh, I won't be going anywhere next year.
My post frame house is 96"oc
Stronger than any stick framed code built house guaranteed
If your goal is to use the most wood possible, build 100% wood enveloppe - massive timber approach. Using studs is trying to engineer / optimize material.
@@BobbyBaloney I believe the idea is to use the least amount of wood, not the most. 😆
Do you mean, I have to pay more up front plus interest expense to mortgage future energy savings?
Amusing to see that Inspectors not knowing their own rules is a universal thing!
A different industry, but the sentiment is the same......
"If you can't do it..... Teach it."
"If you can't teach it.... Examine it......."
"If you can't do any of that, go and work for your Governing body as an Inspector."
@16:00 he states that the benefits of the header hanger over using a jack stud is it: eliminates one stud, uses less wood, leaves more space for insulation. What he doesn't mention is that the R value for a 2x6 stud is about 7, so how much of an insulation increase you really gaining? There's also no environmental benefit, as the amount resources and carbon emissions required to make the metal hanger is certainly greater than the amount necessary to produce a single jack stud.
Well done!!
It appears if you build 24 OC on non support inside walls, you do not need more insulation.
Great to learn a few things. Thanks. id still prefer the mental security of 16oc, in truth id go 12oc if had the budget haha
The bottom line it all depends on whether you want a house that is solid and strong that can survive storms or looks super big to impress friends and the neighbors. I grew up in a farm home built in the 1700s, of approximately 2500 square-feet and my father added all the modern technology, my last trip to Pennsylvania it was still standing strong and proudly. The problem is that people want these big McMansions and don’t care how it’s built as long as they can get a bank loan to impress people, the contractors need to make a living so they have to cut costs in materials and labor. So the weak constructed house is flattened by a small storm, so insurance rates go up. Frankly I wouldn’t build a dog house built from OSB, and the nail gun construction is a joke. Hurricane Helene hit my home directly this September downed a 100 year oak tree on the east-side of the house no damage, this is a small solid home no OSB and the studs are on16 inch centers.
Interesting you are advocating for standard code (minimum) in the floor system with L/360 and not the better L/480. You usually talk about building better than code standards and minimum’s.
Not sure I’d want to walk on L/480 if I was old. A little deflection helps with joints
Agree with double top plates.
24" on center wasn't uncommon before the 1980s and provided better insulation. But yeah everyone gets weird about it.
How are they saving money with using screws, screws are very expensive. I think those are 20 to 30 bucks a box.
Screw are a profit item in box stores. when you buy in bulk the cost drops dramatically making the additional hold worth the investment
Code became meaningless to me when they approved cardboard sheathing. Engineered, my back side.
Cardboard?
For real.
@@3nertia yeah, look up "thermo ply". They are 5/32 thick and made of cellulose fiber. Approved by the APA to replace OSB and plywood for exterior sheathing. Scary stuff.
@@3nertia look up thermo ply wall sheathing.
@@Serious-Man Seems like a bit of a misnomer to call that "cardboard" :/
It's disconcerting when you're not looking at the camera. Good information. Thanks for the vid!
My only beef is this standard is based on a 50 year house and will provide for that and probably half again for total lifespan. But I think if you can afford it you should be thinking multi generational home and those construction techniques.
Double 2x4 wall framing is less then single 2x6 framing material cost wise.
@2:55 that argument doesn't work, because it just comes down to "do you want spend more now to have lower utility bills in the future?" There's no one right answer, because it's a matter of time preference, which will naturally vary among different people.
There's a payback period, But the investments always worth it if you're going to be the owner of the home
@@matt45540 No they're not always worth it, because that money could have been used for something else they value. If it were "always worth it", then you wouldn't need building codes forcing them to make the investment. It's their money, they should be the ones to make the decisions as to how their own money is spent.
great video and you sound great at 1.5x
This is not a comprehensive framing overview without discussing post frame framing (that can be in timber framing, pole barn or post-n-beam iterations). You have MUCH more room for insulation than 24” oc framing and the wall can be entirely thermally-broken with no additional effort. Materials prices are a little higher with post frame, but it’s a superior way to build. My standard post-n-beam frames are thermally-broken R38 walls and R53 roof assemblies. of course even more insulation can be added with upsized cavities or exterior foamboard.
I like it too, but it's definitely not a traditional house layout and a lot of people are afraid of things that aren't traditional.
@@matt45540 it actually dates back to the medieval and Egyptian days. Very traditional and very well-suited for modern open-concept type architecture since you don't need any load-bearing walls.
Good on. cheers
First cost is important but also cost of ownership this equals total cost over a period years … I used traditional framing bc it was cheaper first cost than adv. framing and installed exterior insulation and R15 in the cavity … I built in 2024
How much exterior insulation? Must be a warm climate
@ I installed 2.5” R15.6 plus R15 in the cavity
@@garymitchell7551Oh nice, that’s solid. Foam? Most others are around R4 per inch.
@ the house is in northern Alabama and the insulation polyiso outside and Rockwool inside
I'm sorry, but how is putting more studs in the wall cheaper first cost? Using OVE or Advanced Framing means fewer studs, fewer nails, and less framing labor, with marginally more insulation costs, which should save you more overall.
Headers should always bear directly to the Jacks (Trimmers) in practice. In some jurisdictions it's required.
Literally what is meant by “they don’t make them like they used to”. Construction paper homes.
Is he okay?
And now housing is more unaffordable than ever.
lol
Welcome to capitalism ...
The most advanced framing for a house is ICF.
Do people ACTUALLY STILL argue about house wrap instead of ZIP? WHY??? ZIP is so obviously superior, its not even worth discussing, IMO.
Well, both are completely unnessesary if you know anything about how houses should be built in cold climate.
@@virtueofhate1778 we arent all in cold tho are we
@@PazLeBon Exactly and that's why it's kind of stupid to have some universal building standards regardless of the climate.
@@virtueofhate1778 sure, but safety things like spans etc make sense :)
@@virtueofhate1778insulation codes vary by region, much like windshear and other things that are subjective to the climate are location.... Earthquake codes
Gotta start building like Matt (structurally speaking) heavy duty with pride. Make smaller old world style capes with high end utilities and finishes cool again, nothing makes me sicker than seeing these cheap but pricy 6k sq ft houses with 2 only boomers living in them..and every inside and outside light on while they tell you to go buy and EV 🙃..Engineered studs/lumber need to be the benchmark, straight as an arrow & strong, a much faster efficient build. Need to start investing in ourselves.
Lost me on the roof framing. Really tired of this idea that the roof is just a cap that never needs to be accessed for maintenance of any kind. Even a truss system can be engineered with access paths built in instead of requiring people to carefully navigate framing members buried in 10” of blown in insulation.
If you remove all of your mechanicals from that space what do you really need to get up there for
My house is 120 years old and I would bet in that time someone has gotten into the attic maybe 5 times after the initial build. Electric, insulation and plumbing in the 30's, new electric in the 80's, 90's more insulation. 2016 total gut. There is just no reason to get up there maybe, sprinkler system??
Once I did the performance math for 16oc vs 24oc, converting R to U values, calculating stud & cavity %'s, multiple U's by %'s, adding them up and convert back to total wall R value.
I used several combinations and the gains were minor, I remember only +10% if double plate or not, in some cases 16oc out perform 24oc cause some 16" insulation batts are R-2 higher 24" batts. Throw in windows and air leakage in mix, and stud spacing doesn't really matter. In some area exterior insulation is must, making it even less important.
IMHO, 16 oc is better though, stronger wall, and stud increments land closer for more conventional window/door openings.
A 10% gain on the largest portion of your power bills over the course of 100 years is huge. And you can put a door literally wherever you want you might just need an extra stud or two to meet code If you're only putting a door where a stud is conveniently that's just lazy
@@matt45540 It`s small factor in whole house performance, investing in air tightens, ERV and high performance windows will have much larger impact than stud spacing.
If you really want to blow your mind, do the figures on Post-Frame with 96"oc. Just looking at an 8ft x 8ft section of wall with no fenestrations to keep the math simple, the main cavity is less than 5% wood. What is 16oc? I think it's more than 3 times that. If you also insulate between the exterior girts, that layer is 23% wood, but it only has a 0.7-1.1% thermal bridge between the two layers, depending on if you're using 2x4 or 2x6 girts respectively. It's kind of ridiculous.
@@chaseweeks2708 Agreed, post frames have great advantages, performance and cost. I watch RR Building, they make some great homes.
Or, the diff in price of a 2x4 or 2x6 stud......( A LOT...)
80's was 186$ 1000 boardfeet now 597 (was 1467)
I appreciate this guys knowledge but it's waaaay to drawn out.
PLEASR. please stop using the dual camera trick where your talking head is sometimes looking at us and then our viewing angle is suddenly jerked over to one side. I guess this was considered cool once, but it's long past the novelty phase. Now it's just an irritating distraction. Thank you1. all the best
Don't build with wood
Pumicecrete is by far the best building material on the planet
i would never buy a 24 OC home, thats just me.
even if framed with 4x12? ok
Lolll idiot
@PazLeBon its more than just lumber size. Its convenience, every time i want to hang a TV or anything on the wall i have to modify stuff to make it work, no thanks.
@@durangodave you can hang plenty off a 12 inch post , can rail it like a fence haha
I mean if you do the math on 100’ of wall. there’s about 15 more board feet of lumber in a 2x6 wall on 24s vs a 2x4 wall on 16s. Thats not much of a difference but More lumber means more stronger 😉.
It’s just a plain and simple money grab by builders. Charge the same price for half the lumber. Good luck hanging anything on your walls. Ever wonder how a framer can afford a 100k truck? Now you know.
Next Americans will "invent" that headers are in general an unnessesary complication if you just turn the other top plate on its side.
That is true to an extent, good idea
I'm gonna use this on my next job. Can I credit you?
Or I just go with post frame and ditch the headers entirely other than over the garage doors. :P
@@niktak1114 I can't take credit from something that has been the standard way of building for decades in northern Europe.
That would require notching all of the wall studs. American houses are too big to add that chore.