I Discovered Why There are No Dual Seater F-35s. - it is not what you think
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- Опубликовано: 29 апр 2024
- We have a look at the F-35, the F-22 and other 5th generation aircraft from the point of view of tactics and training. This is the second instalment of the series dedicated to 5th generation air warfare.
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0:00: ✈️ Evolution of fifth generation Fighters has revolutionized air operations and training for military pilots.
5:29: ⚔️ Enhanced cooperation and autonomy required for wingmen in fifth-generation aircraft.
10:28: ⚔️ Stealth technology in fifth-generation aircraft enhances maneuverability and reduces detection range for efficient air-to-ground operations.
15:12: ✈️ Advantages of fifth-generation aircraft in air combat due to enhanced communication and stealth capabilities.
20:18: ⚔️ Importance of simulators and real flight training for fifth generation aircraft readiness.
It's nice to see that left arm performing full spectrum of Italian hand gestures one after another.
wont know for sure until he talks about Mama's gravey. Its like the italian SAT
You are looking well Millennium 7 , great to have you back
The photoshop was amazing, that new plane should really be sold!!!!
MS Copilot AI
If you have a few spare billion dollars, I believe Lockheed Martin will be able to help you out😉 I not Suhoi definitely will take you money.
"2 headed F35 can't hurt you, it doesn't exist!"
The 2 headed F35:
Sort of reminded me of the F-82 twin mustang
Great to see you back. Cheers!
What happened to him?
@@jebediahgentry7029 he looks like he had a rough time! worrying!"
@@simonschneider5913 I know righ
It’s pretty remarkable, all the insights I’ve gathered from this video. The density of information is incredible. It must be some kind of process, writing and editing this. Just excellent. Glad to see you’re on the mend.
Mostly editing, research and scripting are fun.
F117 were told not to try to evade missiles because the aircraft had the handling characteristics and agility of a weird angular doorstop and it could barely out manoeuvre the ground let alone a missile 😂
The pilot’s stress is likely going to skyrocket those loyal wingmen enter service, just like yours when there are multiple OTIS.😅
Very informative video BTW.
Especially when they see the Boeing logo stamped on top.
Stealth is not overrated. Although there are several ways to delay radar detection, stealth is the only one that allows an aircraft to fly safely and efficiently at high altitudes. It saves fuel and increases operational range.
I believe in the context of this video, "overated" does not mean stealth is bad, or even not good. Far from it. The point is that some people assign it much greater value than it really deserves. For example, one may believe that one stealth aircraft is more effective than two dozen 4th++ fighters. Other factors also comes into play, like range, weapons payload, sensor suites, pilot interface, etc. Stealth is not nothing, but it also isn't everthing.
"Stealth is not overrated."
It is extremely overrated. Stealth is always NICE TO HAVE. But it does not mean a stealth fighter is near invincible when facing non-stealth fighters.
And intentional antistealth capabilities are rapidly being integrated in more and more equipment, especially by Russia and China.
And while such abilites cannot completely remove the "nice" of having stealth, effectively ignoring 30-80% of the stealth effect means there will never again be near immunity for any stealth aircraft against any sort of competent enemy.
Remember, Serbia managed to hit a F-117 with OLD gear just by being smart about it.
While Russian S-400s in Syria detected and tracked F-35s and F-22s while they were trying to sneak past, many times beyond the range what USA at the time thought they were capable of at all, and several times beyond what their own best ability to track them were.
And since then, Russia has both started production of S-500 which adds hardware upgrades for antistealth, as well as done several major software upgrades to improve the ability of all their sensors, from S-200 to Su-57.
And yet, the overwhelming majority of people STILL thinks that stealth aircraft are flying around in the 1990s when almost noone had effective antistealth, providing a great advantage. AND people completely ignore that part of that advantage ALWAYS included very extensive and complex planning to make certain that stealth aircraft stayed far away enough from all sensors to avoid guaranteed detection, because not even in the 1990s were stealth aircraft actually immune from detection.
So yes, stealth is extremely overrated. But it remains and to some degree probably always will remain really nice to have.
But it was never the "immunity to interception" that it's often portrayed as.
I'd rather say "stealth" is not what the common folk think it is.
It is very overrated, a prime example of that is that most people actually believe that the active and (especially among those in the U.S.) passive measures to achieve LO turn the aircraft invisible to radar, either completely or beyond a certain range.
That many also actually believe that the only way an aircraft can track and target another BVR is through radar doesn't help with that.
LO is about not being able to be identified at beyond certain ranges and to make it harder for active seekers to keep track of the platform which is drastically different from not being seen.
The big boi radars on most ships, for example in the S-Band, will detect a one square meter target at several hundred kilometers laterally (though it won't be able to identify or reliably target it) but becomes near useless against a target flying at 8.000m height which isn't even close to the service ceiling of most fighters or fighter-bombers.
Both the F-22 and F-35 have been detected beyond ranges where they officially should be detected and though you can't lock a missile on that (at least reliably) you can still very much so effectively send an interceptor in that direction.
Even if that whole propaganda stig about the F-35 only being detectable by most fighter radars at 60km while itseld it'd be able to do so at twice, even thrice the range would be true, that doesn't help when a interceptor that already knows where the F-35 is down to an area or just a few square kilometers at worst while the F-35 still has no clue it has been detected.
And the momen we get into the high-resolution IRST's and multistatic passive radars the Europeans develop/developed all of that goes out the window anyways.
Amongst the general populous and those who only sporadically or as a mild hobby follow defense developments LO-measures are most definitely overrated and it's those people who make up the majority of the population, the discourse and the politics.
See the F-35 program where a large part of americans were immediately calling the F-35 useless with politics actually considering to trash the program just because of simple misconceptions, overblown flaws and sometimes just blatant lies.
Useless or invulnerable? Absolutely not.
But overblown and overrated? A hundred percent.
@@FTWIHA why the anger though?
Gus, you have excellent editing skills now!
Good to see you moving your arms freely! Interesting explanation of air assets combat and stealth paradigm.
I really like your thimb where F-35s reproduce by mitosis.
😂
Thank you for your video. Good to see you back, and in fine form!
Great video, I watched it all and I’m looking forward to the next parts mentioned!
Thank you for your new video! Thank you that you came back!
Awesome that you're back. Glad to see you're recovering well
Thank you. Most illuminating, as usual.
Great presentation and lesson.
Interesting and informative, many thanks.
You keep getting better. The contents of many previous videos are here in overview form, but you integrate those contents into a bigger, better whole. Compliments to Ottis.
Thanks, Gus. Great video.
nice to see you got a new wingspar, awesome video as always !
As always thanks Augie!
A most informative explainer to something that few bother to explain clearly, let alone learn. Revolutions in Military Affairs is a very much abused term but in 5th gen warfare, it's very real.
A wonderful video and great to see you have recovered.
9:50 there is an interview with an F-117 pilot that bombed middle of Baghdad and was flipped over from the bomb blast from how low he was flying. When he realized he survived it, he figured 'I understand this effect now', and proceeded to the next target. I don't think they're lacking them steel spheres. :D
Glad you're doing well!
Great video!
"two-ship leader" first sounded like "tushy pleaser" 😂. I'm sure the military can appreciate the joke 😂
Great to have you back! Thank you for the very informative video. I admit I'm very curious about both non-NATO 5th gen doctrine and peer to peer 5th gen fighting.
Grazie Grande!!!
Thanks
Definitely not what I thought. Good to know. Thanks for the repot. :D
You lost weight. Hope all well! Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us
Sorry to be the barrer of bad news a lot of annoying pops clicks and zips.
Playing it loose with edits too.
Other than that spot on.
There is a recent annoying bug in my M1 Mac such that either recording or playing back it stutters, creating high frequency spikes and a few hundredths of second delays. Very annoying because I don't have a solution.
Love the webcast
Great video, very informative !
I've also read stealth was especially interesting when combined with EW... as you need less power to mask your own radar signature. Each F-35 has both capabilities, which should be a great asset no matter the mission (A2A, A2G, SEAD/DEAD)
are you doing well health wise millenium? all the best
I am better, thanks.
Top, as usual. Daje
I wondered if AI was going to be the "backseater" but there's more to it as you explained.
Finally... this subject Finally arrived...
Oh... ooooh... silly me... sensei 🙏 it is great to see you in good health and spirit again. We really missed your classes.
With this subject Finally coming up i can start formulating my futuristic air combat story. I was looking forward to this.
So basically... you don't need a copilot when riding a dragon, YOU are the copilot, and you are lucky to sit there, sit tight and try to be at least as helpful as the weight you are causing the dragon to lug around... is that the right assessment?
PS. Dear OTIS, airplanes are called ships in a formatio for the same reason friends are called ships in a friendship. I hope that helps 😇
Ps ps. The NEZ you mentioned sensei, i heard DCS people often call it MAR as in Minimum Abort Range, it basically the same meaning but since that folk tend to go out of their way to imitate their real life counterparts i believe that's more likely to be the common term used up there.
On the topic of stealth by orientation, it would be interesting to see autopilot modes that can use the (onboard and incoming) sensor data along with known enemy radar sites to determine the most beneficial flightpath to a mission location.
Thanks!
Thank you!
Excellent video once again. Never gave it much thought how technological advances reshaped doctrine and training, but it indeed makes sense.
Off to Taormina, Sicily in a few days. Hope to see a few angels of the Italian Air Force. But the IAF mainly operates from Sardinia/Decimomannu isn't it? If I'm not mistaken Sigonella is more a hub for transports, tankers, MPAs and sensor platforms.
Trapani is a busy location but it is on the other side of the Island, Sigonella is actually a US NAS but I don't know what's there.
@@Millennium7HistoryTech Thank you so much. I hope I'll see an opportunity to go there.
I'll toast to your health with my first limoncello once I'm settled.
Thanks.
I can imagine 2 opposing fleets of highly spread out 5th Gen aircraft flying past each other without knowing about each other's presence. That would be hilarious. Back to WW1.
Awesome
Substantial video, thanks. Just a note that your voice pops a bit.
_"First rule of government accounting. Why buy one when you can have 2 at twice the price."_
thats exactly how germany operates ever since the russians went home! :) they were much more disciplined before, even if it was bad already back then...now they are doing exactly what you wrote about with 155mm shells.
Excellent video as always. I am curious though. What is your opinion on the purpose of the dual seats layout on the J20S? Is there a benefit to this setup on a gen 5 fighter?
likely a drone operator
Agreed.
Super interesting! How would Gripen E and I guess latest eurofighter fit in? Upgradable EW stealth compared to physical stealth. Is it not yet advanced enough?
I just want to say, the longer goatee looks sharp man. You look different but in a good way.
Hope all is well! Keep these videos coming. We all love them!
Nice video! I hope there are not any 5gen vs 5gen show in our lifetime. At least in real life.
Be careful banking your arms, you are in danger of increasing your RCS! Be well M7
I don't think it's a pinnacle of pilots capabilities I think the F22 is, the F35 is just a flying computer(The reason why Russians call it a flying brick) which takes a lot of the load from a pilot which makes it too easy to fly. I flied the Atlas Cheetah and it was an extreme aircraft and now the Gripen which is also a flying computer, you don't do much but only agreeing or disagreeing with it.
I think that, just like 5th gen forms a front line for the 4ths behind, the 5ths might have a front line of small expendable sensor UAVs to spot the opposing side's 5th gens.
Is this why the F-35 was not considered for the mission in the movie Maverick? The F-25 is not meant to work in close proximity with other fighters?
F-35 is a single seater. Tom cruise wanted to have real flights instead of simulations. That is why they needed F14s.
See the difference? In 25 minutes I gained an interesting insight into many of the less-known and especially less-considered differences between 5th and previous generation aircraft, something that I usually don't find on RUclips. That's neat. I wonder how tactics and training has been (is being) reshaped at the International Flight Training School. I guess that is the perfect place to coordinate, align, and apply new paradigms of training inside NATO among European air forces.
Fantastico
It is more profitable to make single seater than multiple seater fighter planes
Do we know if dual seaters are planned for NGAD and F/A-XX ?
Not that I know.
The use of 5 th generation aircraft has many technical advantage. This video is primarily based on peer-to- peer advisory where BVR is acceptable however, the political environment must also be considered. Boyd's underlying assumption was that air combat often breaks down to a dog fight for reason not related to technical capability. The case in mind is Vietnam where BVR attacks were limited. So with this in mind wonder if 5 th generation fighter will lead to unrestricted warfare since this is what they are designed for.
Two for the price of one! But in reality, 2x price. 😂
It seems like a highly networked pilot could potentially have less autonomy (and, indeed, not be needed at all). The better the networked sensors, the better the aircraft (piloted or not) can be integrated into the chain of command. It's a question of at what level is information (overload) best addressed? What is a pilot's role in the future except to be the eyes - and ordinance - of the theater commander. Maybe I'm jumping the gun, and you will address this in an upcoming video...
So 5th generation fighters operate more like Wolfpack submarines that can talk to each other
You could say in "merikan "football" terms everyone is Quarterback AND a wide receiver
14:43 What's the difference between NEZ and MAR(minimum abort range)?
NEZ is a missile + aircraft launcher performance in relation to the target, MAR is a target aircraft performance in relation to the launcher's WEZ. NEZ
Interesting changes comes with data fusion .2 airplanes can do a mision for 4 or more airplanes of 4 th generation
Had no idea there were that many Flag exercises...
Great vídeo, as always!
It seems to me that not only the wingman will become obsolete, but the pilot itself.
The current wars, are showing how important drones became, and it's in the verge of becoming AI controlled, so I think we'll not have a next generation pilots anymore.
It won't we 5th gen on 5th gen. If anything it would be 5th gen on S-500.
Did OTIS create video illustrations? 🤔
He helps, sometimes.
I believe that two seated 6th generation aircraft would probably be most effective- provided that the efforts to field UAVs succeeds in time, and alongside the 6th generation of manned aircraft. Whilst it's all well and good that UAVs are having autonomous decision making implemented. It just seems short sighted to stop there.
It seems like it would be more effective to use two seats; one for the pilot; and the other to manage external systems such as UAVs or planning. This would be especially relevant to beyond range the communication range of other systems in the area, or simply for minimizing detection. Although, I can imagine the difficulties with aircraft size.
I figure that if what I said were the case, then the 6th generation aircraft may- overall- appear somewhat similar to the flying-wing designs from Northrop Grumman because of the sheer amount of specialized sensors and communication equipment, let alone the flight endurance. But that doesn't seem to be the case.
I looking forward to hearing about 5th gen vs 5th gen fighter. Radar doesn’t works hence radar guided missile doesn’t works. Sounds to me that we are back to an old school dogfight.
Opening bombay doors increases RCS.
Tactics evolve as well
All these magic passive capacities ... through magic data fusion : Something interesting for EW .
There are big excesises in Europe also. FWIT, NATO air meet, Cold responce and so on.
Hey - you mixed the dates - April one is one month back...
Because you must be prepared 😛
I hope you are in better health now?
yes thanks
Heard this too many times before. When bullets start flying, then we will see.
Why did they not design a twin engine variant? Can't have been too much extra work surely?
Concordo con le sue analisi
talking AT-mine?!
👍
I not even close to a expect, but I was thinking what happenes when two 5
Gen go face to face and both are stealthy enough so no body can get a good enough lock until they have merged? Its back to fox-2 and lead. Or maybe it f35 vs f35(let's say Turkey didn't get the boot, both being in NATO have never stopped them and the Greek to be just about to start hitting the other)
But is there a list of F35 customers/countries with their tier knowing what they can decide for themselves and what they cannot?
A small point about single seater f-35: word on the street odds that the israelis have been requesting a two seat f-35, as they have done for the f-16 and f-15. I know very little about what the second person is used for,l (just a second set of eyes, weapons/targeting?), but I’d be curious to see what the data supporting the rationale is
Your comments about collaborative sensor tasking…Not exactly. There still will be a formation lead and individual sensors can be tasked or dedicated by their operators for certain things. The pilots aren't simply passengers when it comes to the sensors.
Autonomous drones and AI can reduce the need for trainers.
pls make video about western AWACS (e-3 or e-7 or both) and how it can specifically/hypothetically be used to assist F16s in Ukraine
the 5th generation tactics advantage due to lack of "wingman" will be short lived due to the advent of drones/UCAV's. the advantage of UCAV'S/drones for use as forward sensors or forward aggressors requires very significant additional pilot workload.
Welcome back M7, great analysis as always! Just a small gripe of mine is the seldomly used "AI" generated imagery.
I know it kinda fits the channel's aesthetic to include it, but i guess i find them discomforting for one reason or another.
Again, great vid!
0:46 collaborative "trageting" :P
5th gen term😂😂😂
Because they still can't make the single seat version work right.
What, no hand drawn diagrams? No coloring book?
I have a transformer that looks like the thumbnail
Great to see you back and seeming way more healthy.
Man, you've got some excellent content and insight, but you really need to get control over Otis! He's getting out of hand!
Da Lei I migliori video sull'aviazione militare. Semplicemente I migliori!
Non ha per caso notizie su un presunto abbattimento di f-35 israeliano che avrebbe dovuto bombardare l'ira?
No
"the dream of many young boys and girls" 😂 ### Amy is the best example of how beauty standards shift over time 😆
HAHAHAAA I LOVE THAT DUMB ROBOT!