John Delony’s Most Controversial Advice?
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- Опубликовано: 29 дек 2023
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My daughter was a competitive figure skating. It ended up costing us over $25k a year and now as an adult she has major knee and joint problems. I wish I had allowed her to enjoy her sport without having her coaches push her beyond her physical and emotional limits.
Ouch. Looks like that 25k a year backfired hard. Sometimes less is more.
My sister shocked me with the cost of having her 3 daughters in volleyball, but in your situation I hate to see that you put somuch into her talent only for it to have generated those injuries.
This happens when you’re a woke female😂
I make sure my money goes on spending on me..I make fun of people like you..
Well sorry about that but it was super stupid and selfish.
All those physical competitive sports will come back to haunt people
If you do then as kids full on your body isn't even totally formed yet!
$1000 a month on figure skating?
My father complained about the extra gas he had to use to pick us up at little league practice in the 70’s 😂
Everything, including gas, is more expensive now. I was surprised by the amount, but can understand what is happening.
It seemed to start about 35 years ago when kids were starting to join clubs to play whatever available sport they wanted to. I had my sons join a soccer league that no one kept score (officially) and ALL kids could join, no matter if they were good or not or even knew the game. And they had to have the opportunity to play at least a few minutes each game. It was a shot summer league, but there were kids there who played soccer year round. I remember one boy who was on the team one summer that played year round and when he was on our team he was on the field the entire game. Why? Because he knew what he was doing and scored lots of points. These was elementary school aged kids!
My take was kids needed to be kids and have time to daydream or follow all their interests. It worked for my family.
Ha ha ha .. yeah!
My Dad said he wasn't using his gas to go to little league, ride your bike.
I didn't get to play little league- they couldn't afford the time to run to town all the time.
If you can't afford it, you can't afford it. It's ok. It is what it is. Your daughter needs to understand the financial reality of the situation. Not everyone can afford it.
Very true and honest opinion here! If anyone does not listen to your advice here, they will almost certainly disappoint themselves AND their children!
John is 100% correct. Not controversial at all. Parents spend way too much money on sports that will never going to result in anything other than parental pride and ego.
Parents spend money on crap feminist sports like figure skating..that’s not even a sport..
go back to boys football and baseball and make America Great Again.
True.
I kind of agree with you. Sports return more than just a potential athlete going pro. But I certainly would drag my family down for a single sport
This
Amen
My daughter was in competitive cheerleading for 4 years and it was making us broke and had us debt. She loved it and I wanted to give her the world but after spending 10k a year on my 5-9 year old doing cheer is ridiculous and we had to stop. We now do recreational sports and are debt free and she’s happy and so are we.
....this was for elementary school girl cheerleaders???? Wtf?!?
That’s cute
@@janelleg597 Cheer camp is not cheap. And traveling to competitions, coaches, eating out, it all adds up.
I loved cheerleading! I understand why my mom had me wait until middle school when it was free. I wanted to dance so bad as a kid, but knew that my parents couldn’t afford it.
@@janelleg597It's competitive cheerleading so gymnastics coaching (at least $100 a month or so), monthly gym cost ($200-300/month), uniform ($500+ per season), travel costs (plane ride + hotel stay for 2-day competitions). It's very easy to get up there in costs. I paid for myself when I wanted to do it at the age of 16. I also paid for my sister to do her high school cheer (not as expensive, like $100/month). My sister and I are a year a part so I just worked a lot during high school.
John is right on with this. Parents lose their minds over kids sports. We have 2 boys who both compete in a sport that can have some absurd fees for travel, coaching a conditioning. We are very fortunate to be in a position to pay for these things, but we draw a line at what makes sense. At the end of the day we’re just happy that the kids enjoy it and they’re spending time on sports and not sitting at home on the PlayStation.
What’s crazy is, other parents in the sport will bully you! “Why aren’t they traveling to XYZ next week to compete, you guys can afford it”. Yes we can, but we’re not because we understand our kids aren’t making a career of this.
Instead, we anonymously provide an angel fund to our league to allow some folks less fortunate than us to participate and still get involved in non-travel events.
Do not ever be guilted into over spending on kids sports.
Very well said! Totally agree. "Peer" pressure comes from adults, neighbors, family
What a beautiful idea to contribute to a fund for the less fortunate who may also be gifted and to allow them to be one of the gang!
At one end of the spectrum, the parents want the child to achieve what they wanted to do as a kid, but could never achieve. At the other end, parents just want less struggle and more enjoyment for their kids than they had in childhood. You've really got to find a sensible balance. So many times, my parents checked with me, "Do you want to make a career out of this? if you are that serious about it, we will do what we can, to pay for it." But sports especially are a field fraught with pit-falls; injury, unexpected growth, health issues. So much can get in the way, even if you get that MINISCULE CHANCE to go professional. Even as a pre-teen, I always knew to keep the fantasies in check and think about what was reasonable and likely. I always told them, no, I was happy to be at an amateur level. I enjoyed it and at least didn't end up crippled by injuries like many other kids I knew.
Grew up on a farm never played sports my father had us working. I thank him for the work ethic he instilled in me. RIP
Way better than the comp sports lifestyle.
A coworker spent tens of thousands of dollars for her son to chase baseball leagues, travel, coaching, equipment, to help her son get college scholarships which he didn’t get. At the end of the day the money spent would have paid his college expenses.
The thing about baseball, that most parents don't understand, is that due to Title IX, baseball scholarships are generally only 1/4 scholarships, not "full rides." So yes, that money probably would have gone farther towards paying for college costs had it just been saved and invested.
I know someone who was really into baseball and was pretty good. They got scholarships to go to college out of state. An in state college without a scholarship would have been cheaper but they thought they were getting a better deal by going to the school that was giving them a scholarship.
I know a similar situation. Parents didn't look at the total cost! It's kinda like buying a car based on payments instead of the drive out cost. @@kylelaw7210
Even if a player scores a scholarship, the college coach can cut them anytime they want to.
@@pamelaburleson2063 I played baseball my 4 years of College; 2 years in JUCO, and the last 2 years in Division 1. I had full scholarships in both. Graduated in ‘18. Did title IX come after? Or how do you base your comment? Also, I had teammates with scholarships of 50%, 75, 80, etc… Im truly curious how you came with that 1/4
From experience, the happier you try to make kids,the more unhappy they are. I hear so many parents saying they just want their kids to be happy.
Agreed and disagree. The more you want to help your kids be happy should bring you happiness, but at the expense of the families livelihood absolutely not. as long as you’re not going under and going into severe debt for your kids, hobbies and interests that I don’t see that’s a problem.
@@EzzyR561 , the problem comes in when they face real life and find out they’re not going to be happy “adulting”. Yes, I’m very happy when my kids are happy, but life isn’t about happiness. Contentment is even better.
My daughter was a great swimmer. Cost us a lot and we sacrificed a lot to keep her in swimming. One day she said “ I’m done.” She didn’t swim any more.
Smart girl.
That's what my youngest daughter did with soccer. She was an outstanding player and was probably good enough to play at the college level (maybe not at the Division I level). Coaches hounded her to join the traveling team (she never did). Going into her senior year, she was done. It was no longer fun. Shame that certain adults can suck all the enjoyment out of what should be the time of her life.
At least with swimming she will not sustain joint, back or knee injuries that will keep her on pain meds for the rest of her life.
@@franziskaniyou don't know that.
@@lkj0822g Kids really don't realise the amount of pressure heaped upon them, until they either have a complete breakdown, of step away and suddenly their freedom hits them like a brick wall.
At 14 she's already over age for a track to the Olympics. Has he talked with skating coaches/professionals to learn more about what her potential to be a super star is? What does the daughter think the end goal is? And her mom? Loving the sport and "doing well" may not be enough to invest excessively. Every modern kid dreams of being a celebrity princess or a sports star who makes mega bucks. This needs to be treated as a hobby not even spending $1K per month but maybe some day she'll teach or coach skating herself. Unfortunately David is the evil stepfather if his wife does not 100% agree with him. Biomom needs to deliver the bad news.
14 is waaaaaaay past prime if she was on an Olympic track she would be sponsored or someone would pick up the tab. If she wants to do it for fun fine. Let her try other sports now...
Too late now to take up another sport. She's too old for ballet and to get onto a reasonably good high school team in a sport you need to have been in travel leagues in that sport, going to state and regional championships, by age 12 at the latest.
Time to focus on school and an after school job to save for college.
I would think that if she was on track for the Olympics, the coaches would be bending over backwards to make it work financially. That they are not means she probably is not destined for greatness.
....she's destined for Disney on Ice
There are a couple of colleges that have Ice Skating teams but that's about all at this point. With the current technique/judges, girls peak so early in figure skating it's ridiculous. She is already past it, unless she is doing ice dance? I think they could encourage her to compete, but maybe take her to a club that cater more to the population that's doing it for longevity in the sport than the olympic team in CO springs.
I like what John said at the very end about showing his son the budget and what they can afford for whatever activity he's interested in. Growing up in the 80s, I watched my mom pay the bills and already knew not to even bother asking for a Camaro in high school (or *any* car, for that matter). Never gonna happen. And I was totally OK with that. So, by showing the kids the family budget instead of "because I said so," they are raised to be a part of the team that is family. And it gives them a financial goal to work toward. They might get their own jobs, make their own money, and move forward. Who knows?
When Rachel said, “If u don’t do that [draw a line in the sand/set a boundary], nobody else is….There is nobody else on planet earth that puts up boundaries for us: we have to create those for ourselves.”, that really hit me. That is such a truth.
So much truth there. My mom was struggled with weight issues growing up, never played sports and thought exercise was a four letter word. So, when my sister and I were born, she wanted to change our outlooks on that part of life. So, she didn't particularly care if we played organized sports, but we had to do something "physical activity related." In other words, her goal was simply for us make physical activity a part of our lives for health and mental health reasons.
Both of us spent 10 years in our respective sports (martial arts for me and gymnastics for my sister), and we entered a few local competitions per year, but nothing broke the piggy banks...because they didn't have a lot in the piggy banks. We didn't go on to become Olympians or coaches, but our character and character traits and work ethics were definitely influenced by the experiences...and we carry that around with us in our adult lives - making us successful in our careers. You don't have to spend $1,000 dollars a month (like the caller) in order to "support" your 14 year old child...you only need to do what you feel you need to give your child the tools to become good or better people in life! And no one can tell you how much or how little money that takes!
I 100% agree with you John. Makes absolute sense. It will not damage our kids that there is such a thing as limits....and when a parents income cannot accommodate such things, I personally believe that "acknowledging" this fact not only "teaches" kids that there actually "are" limits...but it's only when we hit these limits that we're likely to start looking for creative alternative solutions.
“A stable, at peace mom and dad”
I burst into tears hearing that.. growing up at home as a child with my two late brothers I can relate..
my parents were always at each others throat about money.. every day in our house was a fight.. unpleasant and sad.. even when we went on vacations it would end up in a fight because of finances.. amongst other things..
My mom passed away from cancer at 52, My younger brother committed suicide at 27, my older brother died at 41 of obesity.. my father and I don’t talk today and I’m a mental mess to this day.. an it’s partly due to the dysfunctional family I grew up in..
so yeah I agree 1000% with this message…
Oh my goodness. So sorry for everything you’ve had to suffer.
Thank goodness John brought up the injuries piece of this. Hes spot on. ❤
I work at ortho office and can attest to just my neck of the woods and the constant stream of kids hurt of all ages and some badly. I also sadly see very anxious parents wanting their "free college" they hope kid well asap. The pressure is awful from coaches and parents but the parents I found the most sad. They aren't a machine, they are your child. I refused to think about sports with my 3 kids as $. I told them to study, volunteer, look for scholarships and they all got them.
My mom put me in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu in 1999 when I was 14 years old and it cost $50 a month. When I hit 18 I began fighting and getting paid, my first fight I got paid $200 then at 19 began training and competing in Muay Thai no dues so long as I trained and competed and helped keep gym clean. Ended up with 20 professional MMA fights the most I ever got paid was $15,000 and I loved every minute of it and it shaped me. There are plenty of things kids can do that won’t break the bank and martial arts is the most practical thing one can do. Being capable of defending yourself in my opinion is an absolute necessity that people overlook. I’m a firefighter paramedic now and I can tell you, you are own first responder.
Amen!
Yes BUT - I doubt the 14 yr old girl who is now entranced with figure skating is going to want to switch over to something cheaper like Jiu Jitsu
@@arthrodea True, but if her parents tell her they can no longer afford figure skating, she'll be forced to think about sports or activities she probably would've never considered.
Sadly most of us into Sports don’t realize this until after High School and College. Very few make it as a Pro Athlete.
Even if you expand occupations beyond just being a star athlete it seems difficult to earn a living. You could go into coaching, athletic training, gym teacher, sports commentating etc and it still doesn't seem like it opens many opportunities.
Earlier this month, I made the decision to pull the plug on my son’s travel soccer club. It was getting difficult to justify the amount I was spending, not to mention time and energy. Fast forward 3 weeks later and my son hasn’t touched a soccer ball. Kids move on quickly, I think I was more distraught about this decision than he was haha.
This I let my daugther know the budget and how I allocate funds .. it makes it much easier when she asks for spending money because she knows the financials
I’m sure that was a hard decision to pull him out of the travel club but that was probably the best decision for everyone.
It is possible that your son felt obligated to appear to like travel soccer because he realized how much you had invested. As soon as YOU pulled the plug he could allow himself to relax and show how he really felt about the sport. Also: soccer is notorious for injuries (although it is not as bad as football, boxing or cheerleading. Iceskating is also bad. The chance to end up taking pain meds for the rest of their life is much higher than the chance to win at the highest level - and only then they could make a career out of it.
When I was growing up I played sports cause that’s what I did. I didn’t really like it but that was what I thought my identity was. Once I started quitting sports late in high school and no one got angry I actually felt free. Thinking maybe your son is similar
Fast forward 2 or 3 years....drug problem
I did taekwondo in middle school and i loved it. My parents supported me as much as they could but eventually they struggled with money and i had to stop before getting my black belt. It sucked as a kid but other things mattered more than taekwondo, and i have 3 other siblings. I got over it eventually
Yeah my son just last month got his TKD black belt. I wanted to pull the plug on that two years ago and encouraged him just to do wrestling in highschool. He's got it now but his little brother and sister are still going down the path. Spending like $400/mo for these TKD belts and I swear they are just churning through the kids/families. One punch from a big bully and these kids are crying on the ground. If you pay enough money they'll give you the black belt even if you suck. Such a scam.
@@K4R3N 💯 It's paid choreography lessons. No real learning of martial arts.
@@MsSimpleMovies yes! That's what I called it too, "choreography". Might as well go to dance class and stop pretending. No shame in that at least.
@@K4R3N I was in TKD back in the early 90s. My first instructor came from the Korean military, hardly spoke any English and ran his studio like it was the military. We definitely learned how to take blows from others without crying. I just stopped in to watch a TKD class at a random TKD studio (it was in the same parking lot as where I was eating), and I couldn't believe what I saw....definitely choreography. I was sooo not impressed. I still think martial arts is one of the best physical activities you can enroll a kid in, but not sure I'd support TKD anymore...at least based on that.
@@joejoe-bs6jq yeah TKD got way watered down. I wouldn't mind if my kids joined a real boxing gym or BJJ studio instead. Those seem more legit these days, worth the money at least.
This couple are the best.
Young, clear instructions, nothing confuse difficult to achieve.
I have a friend whose a sports ortho. He sees a patient whose body wasnt made for sports and the child 's body is payong the price of the dreams of parents to see their son or daughter as champions. I completely agree with what John said.
Thanks John and Rachel!! This is a difficult topic and you’ve provided clarity between emotions and reality. 👏
I asked my parents if I could do gymnastics as a kid….. my parents response “nah, we’re poor, but you can play community soccer for $40.” As an adult I can see my parents were hurt they couldn’t give me certain things I wanted, but I truly value their ability to say no. The experience taught me a lot.
Thank you for saying it! More people need to hear it.
As a therapist myself who also has a son that plays travel hockey, I couldn’t agree more with this. Awesome word John. ❤
Great episode! This is a topic/question/response that needs to be broadcast as wide and far as possible!
Love what he said about the children not being the star! Children are precious, to be loved and cherished but they’re not the only members of the family unit. As to his point about the burden, I think by drawing appropriate boundaries for what will be spent these activities, the child doesn’t have the burden of having to continue on to fulfill hopes and dreams and they can say no more if they don’t want to do it, anymore
I’m glad I came across this and read the comments. My mom constantly put me in one thing and then would take me out. Deep down I knew it’s because she and my dad couldn’t afford to put me in most extracurricular activities for the long-term, but part of me was bitter and wished she would’ve kept me in longer, especially gymnastics. Well fast forward to this year, I spoke with a man who teaches kids sports and he informed me gymnastics is one of the most grueling activities with usually zero returns. You play your whole life and unless you’re Simone Biles, you will never enter the Olympics and you’ll walk away with lots of broken bones and wasted time. Sometimes rejection is truly God’s protection and I also asked the Lord to forgive me for holding that against my parents all these years
It's good you have opened your mind to the truth of God's protection. I hope you told your parents and gave them a hug
I don't think this advice is "controversial". To me, it is common sense, and therefore, it is not common. I think parents today live vicariously through their children. You see it every day, at Little League ballgames, cheerleading, gymnastics, private schools, you name it. I was always a "in all things, moderation" person. If something starts controlling your life, you need to take a long, hard look at what you're doing.
Oh you have no idea. Anytime Delony posts anything about travel sports he looses followers and gets slammed in the comments. Even It’s something like you’re kids don’t need travel sports, they get the same amount of joy when you spend time with them just kicking a soccer ball at home.
We have Big Pharma, Big Education, and now Big Athletics.
@@flashthecorgi2053 The problem with John, is that he is basically saying that kids should not play sports.
@@jimmymcgill6778 umm no he isn’t. In fact, his kids literally play sports (not travel) . He just wants people to stop mortgaging their souls and financial life for kids to play travel sports when the kids are perfectly fine kicking a soccer ball with their parents.
@@flashthecorgi2053 Yes he is.
John's advice is exactly my take on it. The families are child centered and not parent centered. I served my parents when I grew up- not the other way around. Sports cause the sacrificing of family time with relatives as well- I've seen it in my own family-even at the lowest level or sports participation.
I had two kids in travel baseball. Ones was REALLY good. They both got burned out by high school and I regret spending so much time and money missing other things. Even if they had continued playing it was a bad decision.
I hope you're not beating yourself up about it. You were doing what you thought was right / supportive of their interests in the moment.
Dr. John Delony is absolutely correct and there's nothing controversial about his advice!! Parents go nuts for the kids sports and then almost 90% kids end up suffering in school and/or with the worst injuries ever.
I think it's nuts the way parents pay thousands just to play ball. Wasn't like this when I grew up.
I wonder if it's far more expensive because of sport insurance
@@Talia_Balloons IDK but most of the kids didn't travel either, not out of state or even 2 hours away. When I heard 5000 and numbers like that, I thought it's daycare. I couldn't have just dropped that for sports.
We followed our daughter around the country as she played football here in England. She went as far as she could go with it then at 18 got a full ride scholarship to USA. She had the most amazing 4 years in Ohio. We made it absolutely clear that we weren't able to fund this. She accepted that and we are so grateful that was given the opportunity by her coaches to play in USA. A lot of her team mates got injured, torn acl etc. They had to give up & not play. Ultimately my daughter saw this as a great experience. We were lucky !
Good advice.
I will always be thankful to my mother to say No when I wanted a horse in such a great way by explaining me in a good conversation why we as a family can not do this. Even when I argued I can do a job that covers basics cost by going with me to all possible situations. I was 15 years old at that time. It was a lesson for life for me. My mother did not know "Babysteps" that time but she taught me to live without debts. And this discussion 40 year ago was a part of this teaching.
Saw a bumper sticker the other day that read “sorry my kid has practice”
It is absolutely an alter we are sacrificing the family on….
You are so correct!
John was right. Ok, I think Dad here should include his daughter in the financial planning of “the sport she loves”
They both set up “the budget” that he can support her monthly, if it goes beyond that she needs to contribute in any possible way she can. Then they both lay out the best plans “together”.❤
This can bond DAD/DAUGHTER relationship tightly as they work as A TEAM. She will be prouder too because she contributes greatly for her own dreams and happiness.
Keep in mind, this is a pay to play sport… Just because your kid is doing well in it doesn’t necessarily mean they are that good. There may be other kids that have parents that can’t afford it, but their kids are actually better at the sport….
This is a " I would've been an actor in hollywood if I hadn't eaten all those chicken nuggets" tier argument
@@axt2you must have had a pretty sheltered life if you don't think someone's financial status drastically affects their children's extracurricular exposure.
@@auemmjeeI disagree for the most part. Talent will shine through given any opportunity (at the Y or at paid for events/ training).
@@auemmjeebut its a no brainer. Its a fact of life. Most sports/competitative hobbies are pay to play.
Ice skating is notorious for only being for the children of affluent parents. Part of the Tonya Harding / Nancy Kerrigan dynamics. Tonya was looking for love (her relationship with her mother was not easy), at a very young age she married a no-good man, got advised by the board / her coaches to NOT divorce him. And when he attacked Kerrigan Tonya was held accountable (she was blamed for instigating that attack) and it destroyed her career. Try to perform at the Olympics with that pressure. She had to sue the associatin to let her compete at the Olympics, because by then it was not proven that she had ever KNOWN about what her spouse planned to do and did (for all we know he may have taken drugs and it was a crazy rather spontanuous idea).
It could be true that she knew he was up to something or that she even motivated him - but it is equally plausible that this dude just made up those claims so he would get a lighter sentence. She did divorce him, and he likely was pissed at her.
Either way: Hardings mother was low income, and Tonya was not really getting support from the association that was run by Kerrigan types (upper middle class people) that wrinkled their noses on people like the Harding family. They had to let her compete because she was so good - but she never was "accepted" because of her background.
Finally some Delony advice I can agree with! 😅
Loved John’s advice for once
😂 Imagine what somebody from a country with no opportunity would think about this conversation 😂
The United States is quickly becoming a country with no opportunity.
Well said Dr. Delony!!! 💯
my biggest issue with my daughter in competitive cheer was that even with all the practicing, coaching, private lessons, etc, she wasn't getting better, and oftentimes, i was the one teaching her and watching tutorial videos with her in my free time. then, the other parts like sitting out in the car for an hour during practice, the weekend practices, and competitions, etc. it's too much. as a parent, you really have to devote your own life to it. but when you have multiple kids, pouring all your time and energy into one of them isn't optimal. told her we'll stick with recreational cheer. two practice sessions a week for $200 a month.
Completely true. I’m 21, hopefully going into my first year of pro hockey. I played for a public high school and inexpensive local teams growing up. Just worked hard and got some breaks.
Most of the private school travel team kids fizzled out around u16 or u18 year. If you’re good enough, you’ll get found. Money doesn’t make a difference
You are correct
As a former athlete, I can also say I learned far more valuable life lessons working a job in the real world than I ever did playing sports. I’ve also never agreed with the premise that people who played sports growing up somehow learned more life lessons than people who didn’t. It’s a completely false premise with no research to support it.
Dr. John 👍👍👍👍👍
Coach can do coaching in home town. If he/she wants to be in any contest the coach can pay for own travel, also less hours of coach and more self training. Depending on age daughter could get part time job to help pay for it.
Thank you both. I never had the problem, I am a little klutzy, so I just rollerskated, hit the tennis against the brick house(my maternal grandparents), walk skateboard and bike around town. Inexpensive sports.
Had a friend whose daughter was heavily involved in club volleyball. Became a starter in the top high school, and was on track to get a full ride at a D1 school. Got the scholarship, and decided she didn’t want to play in college.
My kids love playing sandlot baseball every summer.......It makes for great fun filled evenings and memories.......
It’s not that much about love of the sport, it’s about ego. You like skating - OK, just go and skate several hours a day, it doesn’t have to be that expensive. You want to compete or be better than others? Why? What for? It can be justified if you make lots of money doing this but very few sportsmen become wealthy, those chances are extremely slim. It’s kind of buying lottery tickets or gambling.
And, I am gonna say something even more controversial than Dr. Delony said. It’s extremely beneficial to exercise / do recreational sports one hour a day, two hours at most. Anything more than that is just a waste of time. You can use that time reading, working, sleeping, volunteering, spending time with your family, learning new useful skills, etc. You don’t need to waste hours of your life chasing a ball or skating.
I completely agree. Regardless of your child’s talent all of those people are salespeople and will talk you into anything.
Totally agree with the advice
I think things like this can become a vortex that's hard to escape because as you lay out more and more money it gets harder to justify quiting, and I bet a lot of kids come to loathe their sport as it becomes more and more serious.
Also, this should be evaluated like picking a major at a university: a job too few parents take seriously. You should evaluate whether the expenses will pay off. Is this a viable career path? If not, treat it as a hobby not the center of their life.
Agree, is this sport even something that is done at NCAA level? Do colleges care? If not it's very low priority. Just do the sports/activities the school offers directly.
Even more important: is this a sport that is notorious for severe and lasting injuries ? football, cheerleading (that seems to be super expensive, too), gymnastics, skiing and also ice skating (ice dancers have it better, but the jumps of the ice skaters are really bad). football and boxing often lead to head injuries.
I totally agree with Dr John. I know too many of my friend’s and family’s children who are now in college and only one single child is *possibly* paying off the investment of insane money and time (and they are the one family I know who the EXPENSIVE sport did not dent their pockets, they are a very wealthy family). ONE child (young adult now). All of the other family’s are at a loss all these years later after spending what they could have paid off their homes with. These kids have also gone through a lot of negative emotions because they didnt get the scholarships, college teams, professional teams etc. Or they were having major surgeries at 19 and out of their sport forever.
I was a figure skating for years. I'm so greatful my parents allowed me to do it as long as they did.
I am an Asian, when we desire something we need to earn it. I needed a beautiful expensive doll I promised my dad the great grade or ace my exam. I asked my dad to send me to expensive schools I need to prove I excel in that school and found part time jobs to help him pay my intuition.
Of course when my dad had enough money I got the gift of love unconditionally. But as Asian kids we have our parents’ burden in our consideration. It taught us to “think things through before wasting our parents’ hard earned money”. Or we need to find the jobs to help paying.
I can agree but isn’t the burden of pleasing parents just as heavy?
I have a 7-year-old daughter and she is interested in gymnastics. Good to know how competitive sports works. Thank you for the advice.
maybe she could be dancing (boogie woogie and rock'n roll have also the gymnastics elements in it. The aerials and acrobatics etc.) Gymnastics sets her up for life long injuries. I have a family member that has endured pain for decades and tries to manage her pain meds (not taking too many of them). She was in gymnastics, only competing at the lower levels. Not expensive (or her parents would not have been able to afford). Well it may have resulted in low quality trainers, or she just had bad luck.
Injuries, and later knee, back and joint problems (that show up later in life, when they have given up on the sport) are very common. Plus surgery and rehab costs.
Absolutely correct. My sons are 50 years old now, but I can still remember the day they didn't want to play hockey anymore.
totally agree with john
I was a competitive runner in high school and continued to run to please my parents even though I had leg and foot and knee problems. Now in my 60s and having a super hard time. I wish I had not over pushed myself.
I agree with John even though it could come off as harsh and inconsiderate. As I exercise physiologist who also worked with athletes, but also worked with regular patients. only a few and I mean a few of these kids have to potential to make it a career for themselves. We’re talking about one out of every couple thousand kids that will make it to a major league or go pro. And the exercise science world these are genetically gifted people that make it that far and make a living off of the sport they come to love.
If she's 14 and not in the top ten or so, then it's an expensive hobby. Shift gears, leave the competitive portion and do the enjoyment part. Moderation.
At her age, it's compete or quit. And it's time to quit. Time for her to get a job.
She could coach and teach as a career and mostly just practice what she already knows@@christinebutler7630
At her age, she needs to be focusing on consuming loads of information either from school or on her own due to the brain's frontal cortex at its peak function during adolescence. That's what I'll be doing with my kids. I'll be producing Einsteins.
She can still skate without spending all that money. The chances that she's gonna turn out to be some Olympic level superstar are low. Just set a limit on what you spend on skating and tell her if she wants more, she's gonna have to pick up a job or something.
The intense training needed to succeed would not allow them to pick up a job. - But I agree, and ice skating is notorious for LASTING injuries. She might end up with being on pain meds for the rest of her life (or needing expensive surgery and rehab).
That's part of it. The other part is does she love it for "it" or does she love it for the competition? In other words, if you took the competition away, and the advanced training and coaching, etc, would she still love the sport? If not, then there's a different conversation.
Are you safe?
From as early as I can remember I wanted to do ballet. We moved just before my first child recital. After that I was too shy to ask my parents to start, knowing how expensive classes and costumes were. As a middle aged adult, I’m often asked if I’m a dancer and it makes me wonder. I’ve done hip hop, salsa, and other forms of dance as a hobby and it fills my soul. I have a successful career and turned out just fine, nurturing other talents and skills. Had it been the other way around I would always have felt guilty if my loving, generous, and stable parents sacrificed for a passing phase.
I remember my folks complaining about the cost of karate. I never wanted to participate in anything after that because I felt like such a burden.
This! My ballet lessons were $12/month in the 70s. I don’t think it was exorbitant, but my mother complained every time she wrote the check. I wasn’t planning on a big career in ballet, but it was fun and I felt good about myself. Quit before high school and never did other sports or other activities.
Good advice
Deloney show is my guilty pleasure. So dirty but the calls are so good!
An object like a Lexus is so much different than an activity that a young person loves doing. Activities like that keep kids off drugs, they keep kids from getting the wrong kind of friends, they help prevent unexpected pregnancies, and there’s so many other positive things I could list that a Lexus could never do. How silly to compare those things. Actually, having a sweet ride like that would likely do the opposite of what I just listed. Having a vehicle like that would provide the kid with a means of getting into trouble, making the wrong friends, having a place to have premarital sex, a private place to do drugs, and so many other things as well!
The very talent and prodigy are those who make it big. Sponsors see them and fund them.
Agree with John about not mortgaging future, but sports are the best training for life
The hardest lesson that a loving parent can teach their child is that life is not fair and we can’t always get what we want. It doesn’t matter how passionate we are about it. If we as parents don’t teach our children this lesson, the world will, and it will come as much more of a shock and hurt much worse that way.
Omg the $ with the travels . The soccer here in Nj is nuts
Live your life the way you want to. If you want to gamble on your kid becoming a pro figure skater, then go for it. They could make millions or they could end up working at McDonalds for the rest of their life. As long as you understand that there is risks that your child could fail and are willing to suffer those losses, then you have made a conscious decision.
I’m 6’5 and I made a conscious decision not to dedicate my life to basketball because I knew I had a less than 1% chance to make millions in the NBA, but a 100% chance to make six figures as an engineer. I have zero regrets as a 27 year old making $194k as an engineer today.
One thing that not enough people are capable of doing is backing down their lifestyle. I lost my job earlier this year and had to take a new position that brought in less money. That meant dialing back a few things and pushing back some of the big goals. I see a ton of friends who are not adjusting at all for rising costs and stagnant salaries. Even before all this happened, I had friends who bought a house that they couldn't afford long term. They refused to sell and downgrade. There were whole portions of that house that they never used because they'd just filled it with stuff that made the spaces impassible. I worry right now about some friends who are struggling to make ends meet, but are always rushing to sports, choir, side hustles, and other activities. My friend didn't have much growing up and is obsessed with making sure his kids get to do fun stuff. But they're all so stressed out all the time. It's tragic to see what people do to themselves.
Yes. And what are they really teaching the kids? Over-spending, No boundaries, foolishly bragging to strangers, etc.
I agree
She doesn't have to give up skating just the competition part. Fundraising could help too
Keep in mind that the pay to play coaches/organizations are earning money from each child. Conflict of interest perhaps?? They are essentially selling a product or service and playing upon parents wanting their child to make it "big". Tough call but you need to manage the expense like any other budget item. Good luck
These are the children whose parents paid for them when they were children and teenagers. They never made it big - now they try to make a living out of it. Some may have injuries or they wasted the time when they could have learned skills that lead to a much safer career and to more professional options.
As teens in the 80’s our parents put a $10 limit on each new pair of pants for our back-to-school shopping.
Anything above that, we had to find a job to work for the money which is exactly what my sister did when she wanted a pair of Levi’s that cost more than $10.
I didn’t want to work for clothes, so I was happy with $10 pants. His stepdaughter can pick up a part time job after school to fund anything over the parents budget.
That does not make sense. If - IF - she wanted to be successful - in skating not even winning the US. nationals would suffice to make a career out of her success. A career where she will have modest wealth and can earn money after she had to quit (ice skating is hard on the body even if she is lucky enough not to ruin her knees, joint or bakc). And she better be pretty and charming to attract the sponsors or not even being a world champion would help her a lot with earning money later. Sure she could become a trainer but this would not mean the big bucks.
She is almost too old with 14, breaks due to injuries are normal, and if she wanted to pursue this she would have to go in 150 %, with her training AND with the costs. Training 4 - 6 hours a day and school. No job at the side, she could not make enough money anyway for this kind of sport even if she would have time and energy left after hard and long training EVERY day.
Ice skating either needs public funding or wealthy parents (in the U.S. wealthy parents, and one parent at home to manage the career of the child). Tonya Harding was an outsider in iceskating (it showed, she was never accepted in this higher middle class circles of the U.S. association), they lived in a trailer and her mother worked her behind off. Tonya was training hard and went to school, more was not possible. I assume some trainers took her along - also because she was an exceptional talent and working so hard.
They should pull the plug. May save the daughter from life long injuries and from being on pain meds for life. (and them from expensive rehab and surgery bills).
I agree with John. No one wants to disappoint their children, but we also have the responsibility, as adults, to exemplify better decisions for them and provide stability and discretion. I'd love for my own kids to go to the best schools, hire the finest tutors & coaches, etc...but that's unrealistic for our lifestyles. If they want those things to happen, circumstances will have to change; grants & scholarships, working through schooling to pay it off as you go, etc.
Watch videos, learn the sport and become her coach. Pick the tournaments you want to go. Not all tournaments are worth it to go.
In my job (physical therapist) one thing that separates a next level athlete from high school…it’s not coaching, not camps, not summer ball, not aau….it’s the weight room….with that comes discipline, nutrition, consistency. You don’t need a personal trainer, work with your weight training instructor, school strength coach, whatever and get a routine and become a gym rat. Especially high school girls…80 percent of high school boys strength train, less than 20 percent of high school girls do consistently. That’s the lifestyle you will have in college if you want to be an athlete….starts with a 6am lift….better see if you want that lifestyle while you’re in high school.
She needs technique (for the skating and of course the more difficult stuff), jump and spin training, choreography ....
My sister was in club volleyball for a decade and it won her a full ride college volleyball scholarship. She decided she hated it a year in and dropped out of college before entering year 2. She put her daughter through club volleyball and also won her a full ride college scholarship. Her daughter is set to graduate in a year but she is completely sick of volleyball. Neither of them want to play anymore.
All 3 of our kids played competitive travel sports. My one daughter played travel volleyball and the other played travel lacrosse. We spent the most money on my son probably who was pretty good at baseball at an early age and played travel baseball until he was 15. It definitely can get out of hand. My wife and I talked about it a lot as we were shelling out money for tournaments and training and hotels and restaurants and travel. Looking back we definitely enjoyed it as a family but I completely understand that the money can get out of hand. From what I have heard ice skating and hockey can be super super expensive. The advice I would give parents who have young children is to decide ahead of time what your budget is for travel sports (if your family and kids are athletic). Set an expectation early with your kids that they can play travel sports if it fits within the family budget. And the other advice I would give parents is to understand that your child is NOT going pro! No matter how good little Johnny is at 8 years old - he is not going to go pro. :)
Competitive figure skating is extremely expensive at the higher levels not just with finances but with time most of the top skaters in the country with any chance of qualifying for international competitions are home schooled and train on and off ice 6 hours a day with strength coaches and choreographers and technical coaches. Tens of thousands each year is the norm not to mention the social impact for the kids. The dream comes true as a singles skater to go to the Olympics for just 2 skaters every 4 years.
My parents couldn't afford to let me play baseball like I wanted. Then when I was in 7th grade my mom asked my grandfather for the money to pay for it. So I got to play 1 year and even though I wasn't very good I still had fun. But now I can't do the same for my son because we only have a travel ball league in my area. They want $200 to tryout plus his gear. But there's no guarantee he'll get picked for a team. That's not right to me. Youth baseball was never meant to be done that way.
I have seen so many parents shower their kids with everything, just to see the kids change their minds, usually do to injuries…
If she wants to skate so badly and she is really that good, why doesn't she pound the pavement and get sponsorships, fundraise, etc.
She’s only 14. Still a child.
@1jw298 and you can still fundraise as a 14 year old. If she's that passionate, she'll make it happen
14 year olds are capable of a lot of amazing things.@@1jw298
@novakd1530 She's not drugged.
@novakd1530 And there is public support - in the U.S. ice skating younger teenagers almost always have upper middle class parents and one parent stays at home and has time to manage the career of the child.
14 is ancient for figure skating. Had a buddy spend 100k+ on each of his kids to play hockey. They were good, but they're both working low end jobs and not involved in the sport as adults.
Omg... That is quite something
John is gonna be like Are you Safe?
A lot of wisdom, many families are crazy with the kids being the focus and the center of everything. Whatever Johnny wants Johnny gets…I don’t think that is love.
When I was a kid, sports were not an option, my parents didn’t have money for that. I grew up lower class. I was happy that my parents could pay the rental fee to my clarinet. The kids these days don’t know the struggle and parents don’t want to come to reality. Stop giving your kids everything they want. You’re actually hurting them.
Yep - it seems the current generation just wants to be influencers and not have to work a 9-5 job. It's all about being a celebrity. My desire to take dance lessons at age 8 was because my best friend was. I was one of 6 girls and mom always said no because we couldn't afford for all of us to take lessons. I turned out okay with many different desires and activities that burned out with time :)
Thank you for sharing. I grew up poor. We lived in New York near Canada . We had ice on the inside of the windows in the winter. I remember praying that I could have a cake on my birthday.
My brother and I played hockey and it was definitely a struggle for my parents to pay for equipment. We never felt entitled to it, we bought second hand, took care of it, and wore it until we couldn't squeeze into it anymore.
Are sports really "not an option" if you're poor? You can walk to the park and shoot hoops for free. 🏀 I mean, it's definitely easier if you have resources, but *lots* of kids from poor families participate in athletics.
@@JeanValjean875 For sure, and that's one of the reasons why soccer(football) is the most popular sport in the world.
I have four daughters, and I can't imagine or afford to put them in major competitive sports that cost thousands. But as a father married to a wonderful wife, what we do is provide a safe, comfortable home, a refrigerator full of food, and a roof over their heads. The best thing is, is that they love us very much and appreciate and respect us.
good "controversial" advice. Love it
What end up happening 99.9999% of the time is you spend all this money and devote your lives and your child's childhood to this stuff and suddenly one day, the kid has had enough and quits. Or goes to college and quits. And you all have sacrificed immensely for nothing.
One thing I'm slowly coming to understand about modern parenting in America, is that there's a connection between our emphasis on and expectation of kids playing sports and the current work ethic crisis in the Millennial and younger generations. Yes, it's a generalization and there are always exceptions, but there is no denying that work ethic and the view of hard work in general has noticeably changed. Yes, kids work hard at a sport, but it's a different kind of work than a job where there is a guaranteed reward. My parents had a small business that I worked at when I was growing up. Looking back, I believe that I learned way more working with my parents in their business than my own kids did playing all of their sports.
That’s a good point.
If you review the research you'll find that 75% of Millennials work 40 hours a week and more than 25% have two jobs. How many Millennials do you know personally, Pamela? I think you've bought into the anti-Millennial propaganda. At 41 I'm among eldest of the Millennials. Most of the people in my Millennial circle graduated from grad school. A college friend of mine has 4 degrees and two rental properties and is a VP at an international cosmetics corp. I have a friend from high school who's a professor at a big ten university. Even my former best friend from high school who never went to college worked from age 14 and owns a home. My boyfriend is 28, works his ass off in property management and owns his own home. I know a guy who's 25 and works full-time in cybersecurity. I know a 35-year-old who works full time in sales and also takes care of his brother who has down syndrome. I'm probably the laziest person in my circle and I also started work at 14 and actually quit my sports at 16 because I wanted to work more, and then I graduated from high school a semester early and today I have more than 20 years of experience in PR and Marketing. The driver I occasionally hire for trips is 40 and did 12 years in the military. I know other Millennials who are doulas, teachers, top attorneys, accountants... Millennials who work in real estate, politics....one of my former bosses was younger than me and ultimately sold the media company he created to a larger media company and then went on to host a show FOX Sports. So, what type of Millennials have you been hanging around?
I do indeed "hang" with a lot of millennials and zoomers. Some even by choice. 😅 Seriously though, no propaganda, all personal observation. You make fair points and as I mentioned, it is a generalization. But, have you tried to hire someone lately? Not for a licensed position, but for something more on-the-job-training type. If so, you'd understand my "work ethic crisis" comment.
You mentioned that you started earning money at 14 and quit sports at 16 to earn more money. That actually exemplifies my point about sports seeming to have an inverse correlation to work ethic. @@auemmjee
@@auemmjeeI think she's referring to generation z. I'm a younger millennial, 29. I have had a handful ofgeneration z coworkers. They're lazy, point blank. There parents have coddled and spoiled them it seems.
This actually goes for sports that follow into adulthood. I have been a competitive equestrian since I was a kid, and while I don't regret it per se, it's hugely impactful on my finances. Many people in the horse world literally shackle themselves to a life of manual labor and permanent financial struggle for horses and it's heartbreaking. They might say they don't regret it but I would say if they could take a break for a bit and do it on the cheap for 5-10 years, their life would be forever changed for the better. I NEVER recommend parents buy horses for their kids or newly graduated kids buy. It's too much.