ive never watched any (im not made of money) but i've always sorta gotten the vibe that those masterclasses are less about learning and more about the parasociality of "look at this guy whos work you love! wouldn't it be fun to hear them talk about the thing?"
Yes, I think we shouldn’t think of Masterclass as a beginner’s guide to a new skill or hobby they want to acquire, but more of a novelty experience for those who are fans of a “teacher” on the site and can spare money to listen to them talk about their craft, and the site itself seems to advertise itself as the latter with that dramatic lighting, music, and overall production of their ads.
As someone who had it through a friend, the only class I found to be really useful was Walter Mosely's on fiction. He managed to be both engaging and encouraging, albeit vague. The rest were very meh. To make it funnier, I had never heard of Walter Mosley before that XD
Neil Gaiman has written many television scripts and a couple movies, so it kinda makes sense for him to reference Robert McKee’s Story. But I’m glad to know I’m not missing much from not taking the Masterclass.
I think this would sting a lot more if Neil didn’t have a tumblr account where he regularly answers people’s questions about writing. This feels less like “the way he’s sharing advice with the world” and more like he was approached by masterclass and figured “why not?”
Tbf Gaiman has that same talking-to-a-child tone in his other (free) podcast appearances like on the show hosted by David Tennant. It’d never bothered me, in fact I actually like it, but what can seem contemplative and soothing in a free podcast may come across as condescending and irritating in a course you paid a lot to.
I want to thank you for making this video. I really thought, until now, that I had missed something by not taking these Masterclass(es) on writing, but it seems like that's not the case. It's sad that the quality is found wanting though. :(
As someone who has watched both, Neil Gaiman's class and Brandon Sanderson's class (free on RUclips) it is interesting to notice how similar their advice and philosophy was - not that this devalues one or the other. As opposed to this video, I believe that you should get your advice from people who you want to hear from. If it's obtainable for you and you genuinely think it would help, then do it. Anything that makes you want to write is good. Sometimes, for some people, you realize that once you hear the same advice from 4 different authors that there is nothing left for you to receive advice on. I believe that if every author in the world had to give a single piece of writing advice to someone looking to start, they would all say the same thing. "Just start writing!" Once you realize this then I recommend spending your most precious resource, time, on doing that.
Gaiman, I believe, is as good with money and building his persona than he is a writer.... Truth is those highly successful writers won't give up the true secrets.....
Hey, I must to ask whats the owl thingy you are playing with? I must need it. Thanks! And from comics side scott mccloud - understanding comics is another great resource to have
That seems like a great book, I’ll have to check it out, thanks! And the round owl thing has actually been in my family for ages, I have no idea where it came from… sorry!
I'm in the U.S., and here we have a library service called Hoopla (I don't know if it exists outside the U.K.?). Hoopla has ebooks, audiobooks, television, movies, and educational material like the Masterclasses--all free, although with a cap on the number of borrows per month, if your library subscribes to it. Incidentally, he said in a relatively recent Tumblr post that he did, in fact, extemporise everything he says in that Masterclass. Which may explain the slow and measured delivery.
You know, you took a while to get to the content yourself... However you didn't slow mo and you were actually pretty amusing so I will let you off. I also appreciate the review. I like the man's work but I'm not paying that much for the advice. I will get that book on editing however. That looks interesting.
I think a few of your points feel like legitimate criticisms, for example, "write more short stories" is common and maybe redundant advice; maybe the editing portion is reductive. But I think you could have easily included a bit of additional context and lacking that context makes some your points questionable. Throughout you repeat that Neil Gaiman "chose" to include this and that in the Masterclass. I think this somewhat misunderstands how the Masterclass works. Neil Gaiman is quite prolific on tumblr (he answers writing advice questions there all the time) and openly stated that Masterclass recorded 3 days of content with him and were going to distill it into 6 hours. I think it's fairly safe to assume multiple people worked on the project. That also means that the limited time spent on editing, or the fact he didn't talk about the struggles of being a writer, could have been edited out to make the whole thing more cohesive. Comparing a book to a Masterclass also seems questionable because you're assuming someone is only going to take Gaiman's Masterclass, not other ones. I just don't think that's a very justified complaint. You point out that you aren't interested in their other classes, so you just... don't seem like the right target audience, especially since you note that you liked Gaiman's book on writing more at the end of the video. In essence, it seems like the main problem here is that you just aren't the audience for a Masterclass. Anyways, I hope you don't take this critique too harshly, it looks like you're just starting out on this channel and you have a lot of potential so I subbedd. I hope my comment helps ya out in the algorithm as well!
Thanks for your comments! (And the sub) I agree, he probably didn’t have a lot of control over the finished content of the course, and he probably didn’t intend for people to sign up for the site just to see his course, but I think it’s still fair to question his initial decision to do the course in the first place when books on writing are very common by well-established authors. Anyway thanks so much for watching!
@@OwlCriticism maybe i should have just posted my alternate comment, "blink twice if they're holding you at gunpoint, Neil"; that always feels like the vibe of awkward author interviews like the masterclass
"Write more short stories" is pretty terrible advice from Gaiman since he's a short story and vignette writer and that's basically his only talent. His ability to turn short stories into novels sucks and he needs to take the opposite of his own advice and practice writing novels more rather than just relying on his publishing contacts to circumvent having had to.
Feel free to ignore this but some constructive criticism from a new viewer: there's far too much waffling, it's like there's three introduction sections before you even get to the point of the title
I’m also a new viewer and I enjoy the waffling. Maybe because I’m used to long form content on youtube and don’t have TikTok brain with the attention span of a goldfish. I’m sure there’s plenty of content creators that will rant about these subjects in one minute or less with no time for nuance or extra context if that’s what you’re looking for. I don’t think Owl needs to change his style to fit an algorithm. So agree to disagree
@@fanpandatastic There’s no need to be patronising, and at no point did I say it needs to be one or the other. I also enjoy lots of long-form content, but that’s the point: content. If there’s no substance to most of a video then many people won’t bother to watch it. I’m just giving my two cents in case he finds it helpful; respectfully, I don’t really care about yours.
No, but he does have a book/autobiography. It's called On Writing. I didn't like the autobiography parts, but it does have some solid advice in there. The biggest hang up I have about the whole thing is that he has this belief that if you're a bad writer, you'll never be a good writer. And if you're a good writer, you'll never be a great writer. This coming from a guy that has been writing since he was 10 and sold his first published book for 400,000 dollars, I think he's a bit biased, but the actual writing advice is good.
The Graveyard book put me off Neil Gaiman and reading novels in general for life lol the ending to that piece of bullshit is so terrible. The man can write prose but his stories suck when he can't just string together vignettes and avoid having to make an overall thematic point. Teenager has his only social contact's memory erased then gets kicked out into post Blair Britain with no survival skills to die on the street I mean WTF is he thinking is he too busy in his American mansion to have walked around this country in the last twenty years I mean come on.
I see your point, but don’t let The Graveyard Book put your off his books or fiction generally. American Gods is his best imo. Maybe give that one a go
@@OwlCriticism I was exagerating I don't read prose fiction for autism related reasons. I just happened to lose interest around the time I got really pissed off at the Graveyard book. Just not as much as I hate the Amber Spyglass which I hate about as much as its author hates The Last Battle or The Imitation Game (2014 film) where I can write an essay about what sucks about almost every scene. I still read short stories around october before NANOWRIMO but need to stop doing that challenge because only writing in a single month is a bad habit once you've completed it a few times. I consume enough fiction I just avoid prose unless its non-fiction. I have an over active visual imagination so there's no escapism in prose since it requires me to overly engage in something I need respite from. I only enjoy visual mediums since looking at things is the only way I can turn my imagination off. Novels leave me exhausted and drained for about three months I just can't regularly read them. I'm a mythology nerd so stuff like American Gods just annoys me unfortunately. I get that Gaiman is the same but I don't see the point in fiction by people who are similar to me. I also really hate the same Gary Stu anti-hero character Gaiman puts in everything (Crowley in Good Omens, Silas in Graveyard book, Dream in Sandman) and Shadow in American Gods sounds too much like the same guy in reviews to make me interested. Coraline is better since that Gary Stu is the villainess instead that time round.
ive never watched any (im not made of money) but i've always sorta gotten the vibe that those masterclasses are less about learning and more about the parasociality of "look at this guy whos work you love! wouldn't it be fun to hear them talk about the thing?"
Yes, I think we shouldn’t think of Masterclass as a beginner’s guide to a new skill or hobby they want to acquire, but more of a novelty experience for those who are fans of a “teacher” on the site and can spare money to listen to them talk about their craft, and the site itself seems to advertise itself as the latter with that dramatic lighting, music, and overall production of their ads.
As someone who had it through a friend, the only class I found to be really useful was Walter Mosely's on fiction. He managed to be both engaging and encouraging, albeit vague. The rest were very meh. To make it funnier, I had never heard of Walter Mosley before that XD
😂 Pay for overpriced course -> become poor -> write about being poor and miserable -> become successful writer
…or an English teacher
Neil Gaiman has written many television scripts and a couple movies, so it kinda makes sense for him to reference Robert McKee’s Story. But I’m glad to know I’m not missing much from not taking the Masterclass.
I think this would sting a lot more if Neil didn’t have a tumblr account where he regularly answers people’s questions about writing. This feels less like “the way he’s sharing advice with the world” and more like he was approached by masterclass and figured “why not?”
I recomment George Saunders's A Swim in a Pond in the Rain. as a writer ressource
Took a screenshot of all your recs - as much as I love a class, I do love a book I can find second hand and write notes in!
Same ❤
‘Do we have a Smoke & Mirrors here?’
Neil darling, this whole streaming service you’re on is smoke and mirrors
One might want to check out Brandon Sanderson's lectures on Writing fantasy and science fiction, for free on youtube.
Tbf Gaiman has that same talking-to-a-child tone in his other (free) podcast appearances like on the show hosted by David Tennant. It’d never bothered me, in fact I actually like it, but what can seem contemplative and soothing in a free podcast may come across as condescending and irritating in a course you paid a lot to.
Here's some input from an even newer viewer: I love the waffle. It's what makes video essays great and it's all there for a reason
Thank you for the list of recommendations!!
Cooking IS witchcraft! Spot on...
I’d so much rather take a class that actually involves interaction with the teacher and isn’t just prerecorded
Holy cow. That joke about acting was so funny.
I want to thank you for making this video. I really thought, until now, that I had missed something by not taking these Masterclass(es) on writing, but it seems like that's not the case. It's sad that the quality is found wanting though. :(
Brandon Sanderson has a class taped and is currently on RUclips I feel like that's better value for money
Never heard of them, I’ll have to check them out, thanks!
@@OwlCriticism Hope you like him, he's one of my favorite authors currently. Cheers! I'm glad the algorithm recommended your channel.
As someone who has watched both, Neil Gaiman's class and Brandon Sanderson's class (free on RUclips) it is interesting to notice how similar their advice and philosophy was - not that this devalues one or the other.
As opposed to this video, I believe that you should get your advice from people who you want to hear from. If it's obtainable for you and you genuinely think it would help, then do it. Anything that makes you want to write is good. Sometimes, for some people, you realize that once you hear the same advice from 4 different authors that there is nothing left for you to receive advice on.
I believe that if every author in the world had to give a single piece of writing advice to someone looking to start, they would all say the same thing. "Just start writing!" Once you realize this then I recommend spending your most precious resource, time, on doing that.
Gaiman, I believe, is as good with money and building his persona than he is a writer....
Truth is those highly successful writers won't give up the true secrets.....
Shoutout to Tanith Lee's _Red as Blood, or Tales from the Sisters Grimmer._
No but please do make a video about Piranesi! I'm very curious what you have to say about it
It’s on the list!
what did the owl do to get turned into a mug? did he want to leave to become an accountant? someone needs to get to the bottom of this mystery
I love this video lmao he’s done interviews you can find on RUclips with better advice than this masterclass lol
I think this is one of my favorite RUclips channels at the moment, you should easily have 100k subs after the Lolita essay
Hey, I must to ask whats the owl thingy you are playing with? I must need it. Thanks! And from comics side scott mccloud - understanding comics is another great resource to have
That seems like a great book, I’ll have to check it out, thanks! And the round owl thing has actually been in my family for ages, I have no idea where it came from… sorry!
Don’t tease me with the stoner review
For real! Hahah, mentioning Stoner AND Piranesi like that! I'm even looking into reading Somerset's works now because of that.
6:35 The babysitter part was...an experience.
elabroate plsssssssssssssssssssssss
I'm in the U.S., and here we have a library service called Hoopla (I don't know if it exists outside the U.K.?). Hoopla has ebooks, audiobooks, television, movies, and educational material like the Masterclasses--all free, although with a cap on the number of borrows per month, if your library subscribes to it.
Incidentally, he said in a relatively recent Tumblr post that he did, in fact, extemporise everything he says in that Masterclass. Which may explain the slow and measured delivery.
You know, you took a while to get to the content yourself... However you didn't slow mo and you were actually pretty amusing so I will let you off.
I also appreciate the review. I like the man's work but I'm not paying that much for the advice. I will get that book on editing however. That looks interesting.
Phew, you had me worried. And do! It’s a good resource.
Bird by bird is top notch!!
plss do a video on piranesi
A subscription to MasterClass for a circumcision, blimey.
I have that exact same cement owl figure.
??? Where did you get it? I’ve never seen anything like it
I inherited it, along with 200 other owl figures, when my aunt passed. My own parliament.
I really enjoy your videos. Thank you.
I think a few of your points feel like legitimate criticisms, for example, "write more short stories" is common and maybe redundant advice; maybe the editing portion is reductive. But I think you could have easily included a bit of additional context and lacking that context makes some your points questionable.
Throughout you repeat that Neil Gaiman "chose" to include this and that in the Masterclass. I think this somewhat misunderstands how the Masterclass works. Neil Gaiman is quite prolific on tumblr (he answers writing advice questions there all the time) and openly stated that Masterclass recorded 3 days of content with him and were going to distill it into 6 hours. I think it's fairly safe to assume multiple people worked on the project. That also means that the limited time spent on editing, or the fact he didn't talk about the struggles of being a writer, could have been edited out to make the whole thing more cohesive. Comparing a book to a Masterclass also seems questionable because you're assuming someone is only going to take Gaiman's Masterclass, not other ones. I just don't think that's a very justified complaint. You point out that you aren't interested in their other classes, so you just... don't seem like the right target audience, especially since you note that you liked Gaiman's book on writing more at the end of the video. In essence, it seems like the main problem here is that you just aren't the audience for a Masterclass.
Anyways, I hope you don't take this critique too harshly, it looks like you're just starting out on this channel and you have a lot of potential so I subbedd. I hope my comment helps ya out in the algorithm as well!
Thanks for your comments! (And the sub) I agree, he probably didn’t have a lot of control over the finished content of the course, and he probably didn’t intend for people to sign up for the site just to see his course, but I think it’s still fair to question his initial decision to do the course in the first place when books on writing are very common by well-established authors. Anyway thanks so much for watching!
@@OwlCriticism maybe i should have just posted my alternate comment, "blink twice if they're holding you at gunpoint, Neil"; that always feels like the vibe of awkward author interviews like the masterclass
"Write more short stories" is pretty terrible advice from Gaiman since he's a short story and vignette writer and that's basically his only talent. His ability to turn short stories into novels sucks and he needs to take the opposite of his own advice and practice writing novels more rather than just relying on his publishing contacts to circumvent having had to.
Oooo explain why you don't like the stage show please?
Thanks for making this you've crystallized my thoughts exactly. Cute jeans.
Patiently waiting for the Piranesi video
This is great! SO High Quality!
"Figure out what your characters wants" LOL
Feel free to ignore this but some constructive criticism from a new viewer: there's far too much waffling, it's like there's three introduction sections before you even get to the point of the title
I’m also a new viewer and I enjoy the waffling. Maybe because I’m used to long form content on youtube and don’t have TikTok brain with the attention span of a goldfish. I’m sure there’s plenty of content creators that will rant about these subjects in one minute or less with no time for nuance or extra context if that’s what you’re looking for. I don’t think Owl needs to change his style to fit an algorithm. So agree to disagree
@@fanpandatastic There’s no need to be patronising, and at no point did I say it needs to be one or the other. I also enjoy lots of long-form content, but that’s the point: content. If there’s no substance to most of a video then many people won’t bother to watch it. I’m just giving my two cents in case he finds it helpful; respectfully, I don’t really care about yours.
@@fanpandatasticyou sound like you must love TRO
Amen.
@@Veronicafinch I made that comment 7 months ago, so you’re either a liar or not a very loyal watcher lmao
Those who cant do, teach. Those who cant teach, youtube. Those who are too rich to youtube, masterclass.
I only watched R.L. Stine, James Patterson, and Dan Brown on my free trial. R.L. Stine was more fun.
I don't read, I just watched this because the guy in the chair is kinda cute.
8:22 And zero pounds/dollars at the library!
you sound a lot like that owl guy
Couldn't you record the classes or take notes?
he also missed being in the bbc adaption of lud in the mist, which a gross transphobic novel written by one of the founders of biological essentialism
7:21 doesn’t Stephen king also have a master class?
not that i can find anywhere
No, but he does have a book/autobiography. It's called On Writing.
I didn't like the autobiography parts, but it does have some solid advice in there.
The biggest hang up I have about the whole thing is that he has this belief that if you're a bad writer, you'll never be a good writer. And if you're a good writer, you'll never be a great writer. This coming from a guy that has been writing since he was 10 and sold his first published book for 400,000 dollars, I think he's a bit biased, but the actual writing advice is good.
@@trevorminton6084 He does talk about _On Writing_ in this video, though.
I really take issue with people drinking non-existent coffee from mugs.
It was gin. That's my gin mug.
The Graveyard book put me off Neil Gaiman and reading novels in general for life lol the ending to that piece of bullshit is so terrible. The man can write prose but his stories suck when he can't just string together vignettes and avoid having to make an overall thematic point.
Teenager has his only social contact's memory erased then gets kicked out into post Blair Britain with no survival skills to die on the street I mean WTF is he thinking is he too busy in his American mansion to have walked around this country in the last twenty years I mean come on.
I see your point, but don’t let The Graveyard Book put your off his books or fiction generally. American Gods is his best imo. Maybe give that one a go
@@OwlCriticism I was exagerating I don't read prose fiction for autism related reasons. I just happened to lose interest around the time I got really pissed off at the Graveyard book. Just not as much as I hate the Amber Spyglass which I hate about as much as its author hates The Last Battle or The Imitation Game (2014 film) where I can write an essay about what sucks about almost every scene. I still read short stories around october before NANOWRIMO but need to stop doing that challenge because only writing in a single month is a bad habit once you've completed it a few times.
I consume enough fiction I just avoid prose unless its non-fiction. I have an over active visual imagination so there's no escapism in prose since it requires me to overly engage in something I need respite from. I only enjoy visual mediums since looking at things is the only way I can turn my imagination off. Novels leave me exhausted and drained for about three months I just can't regularly read them.
I'm a mythology nerd so stuff like American Gods just annoys me unfortunately. I get that Gaiman is the same but I don't see the point in fiction by people who are similar to me. I also really hate the same Gary Stu anti-hero character Gaiman puts in everything (Crowley in Good Omens, Silas in Graveyard book, Dream in Sandman) and Shadow in American Gods sounds too much like the same guy in reviews to make me interested. Coraline is better since that Gary Stu is the villainess instead that time round.
So I guess I'm lucky, then, that I don't even like his writing😆