What’s the optimal width tyre for you? 🛞 Would you rather ride use tyres bigger than 60mm or smaller than 40mm? Let us know in the comments down below! 💬
I am with you. MOST of us prob ride gravel with tarmac on our routes. IMO, it's not just what the tire can do offroad, but also how fast it rolls on tarmac/on gucci gravel. I have some 47c Renee Herses that kill it offroad, but as soon as I am on road, they are so sluggish compared to a fast rolling gravel tire.
bicyclerollingresistance has already tested a bunch of gravel tires on machines that simulates road surface. Just pick one that has the lowest rolling resistance but with enough treads for your gravel route.
You absolutely have to test the heavier ones on climbs! The heavy 50mm will drain much more power and drastically impact your endurance more, especially on road compared to a narrower tyre. So it's matter of balance with the profile of your route, avg gradient, surfaces, bike weight (eg. bikepacking), weather conditions and so on. No mention of the elephant in the room: pressure. So many factors! At least that's my very own experience.
I recently put a set of 700x50c panaracer gravel kings on my gravel bike. I'll never go narrower again, I was blown away by the level of comfort a wider and larger volume tyre gives.
A slick? Is there a 50 Slick Version? The typical Gravel Profile does exactly nothing on Mud and for the rest very little. So i ride with Slicks on my Gravel in Summer and when the Mud comes i go to long Lugs for mud.
Hate to break it to you but I’ve been running 50mm GK’s for 3 years and fancied a change. Put on Terevail Washburn’s in 42mm. So much more comfortable and supple, yet still happy to bomb down chunky stuff. Maybe I should’ve bought them in 47mm instead.
Killer topic! It is amazing how long it took the industry to start to adopt the wider stance. In the 2000s we were using our CX bikes with a 33mm limit now we are on 45s and 50s. We as a gravel race team are sponsored by Challenge. We aided them with the development of their GateAway. We really tried to get them to go to a 45mm instead of the launch of the 40s. Hence now they are making all their gravel tires in both sizes. Talking to Jason of Challenge at this years Unbound, he said that near all the frame/bike manufactures will be moving toward a 50 of even a bit wider in the near future. I am the Goldy Locks choice with the 45s ; ) Thanks Boys for all you do!
Comming from mountainbiking, we went through the same 15 year ago moving from shallow 25" rims with tubed tires to 29" tubeless with 60mm tires in a short amount of time (running 29x2.40 tires with 1.2 bar @ 70kg). I run 38mm on my Giant Defy 2024 in a gravel setup - works wonderfully :) It was a revolution and still is. I am totally sure the same is going to be for Gravel. But going further than 50mm's tires and a suspended fork you might as well call it a mountainbike.
writing before watching; I recently raced on gnarly gravel, forest ducts, sand and cx segment all in one race, i had cinturatos m 50mm, safely to say those tires were game changer, I was able to race on all terains - sand segment overtakes were the coolest ❤ The tires gave me a big advantage there were clearly stronger guys and girls than me but they could only race me on asphalt or premium gravel, lucky for me there wasnt many of that. Funnily at the start we were talking and one guy said "you know i think we have to wide tires for this race (also 500mm) " Now i think wider tire in diffrent terrains = clear advantage
About 2.1 % of gravel bike owners race. If that much. Heavy fat tires are slow on road. Light gravel tires cost a yit load of money and tend to wear out too fast
Here in the champagne gravel paradise - Finland the gravel is mainly so smooth that finer threads and 40 mm is usually sufficient for the riding we do. You guys should come here and try it. People are amazed on how good the gravel is here.
"Technically speaking, if it's not crushed Kimmeridgian limestone from the Champagne region of France, it really should just be called sparkling gravel."
It's the same here in SE Sweden, but I run 45mm front and 40mm back. Just gives you more grip in the corners and means you can do some of the rougher forest tracks too.
Not sure if you know of Dylan Johnson. But he always has good analysis of best gravel set hps for races and has run 2.1 mtb tires at quite a few races as they are fast, less Chance of puncture and actually more aero.
Dylan Johnson is a true influencer - he and Keegan (and a handful of others) are changing the gravel bike market before our eyes. Big tires are here to stay - and all the reason for companies to convince us to purchase another bike. 😀
@@cyklandetidsoptimisten Not always see wind tunnels testing data showing 53 less drag than 50 and equal to 45 at about 8 minutes in ruclips.net/video/w3yspNTvVPo/видео.htmlsi=Ork5BIa38rQpyLmX
Been riding a 2.1 inch 650b setup, the width is perfect, would just like this in 700c for a higher BB. Im putting my money on 700c x 50mm as the ultimate gravel cross country setup.
Agreed. The Race Kings are a thinner casing than many gravel specific tires, which counterintuitively makes these wider XC MTB tires actually faster than the narrower thicker walled gravel tires.
Gravel is such a wide spectrum that the optimal tyre fully depends on the route you’re riding on the day. For most UK riding, I’ve got Schwalbe Thunder Bolts in 57c on my Lauf Seigla and they are incredibly fast and comfortable. What you will find is that relatively low volume MTB tyres (2.1” or 2.2”) have thinner casings and roll faster than 50c gravel tyres which are too beefed up for that size since they use the same construction as the 40c tyres. About the test here, I think Connors rigid bike showed the true results while the suspension fork on Sis bike nullified the impact of the larger tyres, which can also help draw other conclusions like wether or not you want a suspension for and run 40c tyres which will definitely be faster on tarmac if your rides often involve that. Also worth considering is that the larger tires will offer significantly more comfort in long races or full day rides so over a long ride they may prove much faster in the end - which is my experience by the way
All good points. I'm also running Thunderburts (2.35s). Did a ride on some "Silca grade 2" gravel this morning running 19psi front, 21psi rear. Very comfortable.
The other aspect not touched on is tyre availability. In the 50mm range, you start having access to thin casing 2.1" MTB tyres which have faster rolling resistance values than the majority of gravel bikes. So in real world purchasing, it would have been good if they threw in a 4th tyre which would have been a 2.1/2.2" MTB tyre. I personally have swapped (with the data from the man Dylan Johnson) to running 2.1" Thunder Burt tyres with actually a mild gain in speed > 40mm Tufo Thunderos (which are one of the fastest gravel tyres with tread) with he benefits of additional grip/comfort etc. That being said, my "gravel routes" are usually 60%+ minimum offroad.
@vantarpon6849 For lighter gravel rides (Cat 1 or 2) 24R, 23F. For majority dirt/chunkier gravel/singletrack focused rides I'll drop 2-3psi F&R. Am running a Vittoria Airliner Lite in the rear though and am 100kg (220lbs) including the bike.
@enotracoon9244 only slightly. Choosing between the best on offer in sizes (e.g. 2.1 Thunderburts vs. something like a Tufo Thundero 40/44 or S-Works Pathfinder 42) is more of a question of what is your normal split for on-road/off-road. I run 2.1 Thunder Burts because gravel courses for me are at minimum about 2/3 offroad. The fastest MTB tyres (basically) prioritize speed at the sacrifice of tread thickness and casing/sidewall thickness (both are fine for gravel bikes offroad because softer surfaces wear tyres slower and higher volume = provides pinch flat protection). The fastest gravel tyres can sacrifice sidewall thickness but not as much tread thickness because the average end user (most gravel riders) use their bikes for maybe 1/3 offroad and 2/3 on road. I had both of these tyres and they were fantastic, when I got a 2nd wheelset with 35mm GP5000 for commuting/occasional road rides/some more priority to puncture protection from debris/cuts etc) then I went the 2.1 TB route. If it's more like 50/50 then it's more of a question of your appetite to wear tyres out quicker/replace more often and/or how rough that 50% off-road is (e.g. if it's super smooth champagne gravel then perhaps nudges it into 40/42s).
50mm all the way - I'm in the Purbecks UK - Rolling hills, flint, rocky downhills, forest gravel trails and sandy trails. The 50mm handles all with ease. I'd be interested to go even wider.
Great vid! I'm running 2.25" (57mm) tyres this winter and they're great! I haven't really noticed a difference on the flat, but going uphill on tarmac is definitely a bit slower. That said, gravel riding is about so much more than speed. The wider tyres have given me a 'go anywhere' mindset and I've been exploring places I never dared before. They feel so comfortable and float through mud that swallows my friends' narrower tyres. They can also climb grassy and muddy slopes that would otherwise have me wheel spinning. Plus, as mentioned in the film, wider tyres just look better.
If a 50mm tire shows no noticeable difference in speed compared to a 40mm, there’s absolutely no justification for choosing the smaller size. The larger tire provides significantly better control, superior puncture resistance, and far greater comfort. Why settle for less when there’s no performance drawback?
@@markconnelly1806 In the world of tubeless tires, wider tires tend to have better puncture resistance. Sealant works by sealing punctures as air escapes, with a wider tire, the larger air volume and lower pressure slow down the rate of air loss, giving the sealant more time to do its job. This is why the same sealant is generally more effective in mountain bike tires compared to road tires.
People with bikes that say they only hold a narrower tire should double-check if their front fork will actually hold bigger. My bike claims a max of 42, but that's only true on the rear. The front fork will clear a 48, and even a 50 if you trim down the knobs some. So just like adding a suspension fork can make you faster and more comfortable, I run a 47 pathfinder pro on the front along with my 42 rear and it's great. I get the comfort and control of a wider tire at least on the front end where it matters most until I get around to buying my next bike. I've even run that 47 on a 700 up front and a 650b wheel with a 48 on the rear and it rides great - perfect for rougher courses.
Absolutely! Most claims for tire clearance are pretty conservative and frames will fit more. I ride a 45mm Cinturato Gravel M in the front and a 42mm Pathfinder in the back. Lots of grip even on mud in front and easy rolling in the back. Perfect mix imo.
@@christianb.1028 Yeah I think you might not be expert if you are running the same tires front and back. The different ends of the bike do different things. Using the same tire for both is kinda silly if you think about it
yes - i used to run a 47mm nobbly mountain bike tyre on the front of my norco threshold cross bike that officially would only take 35mm. It made a huge difference in control compared to a matched 35mm front, lifted the front of the bike slightly and i thought it looked pretty cool! There was no way i could get anything close to that on the back though
I run 45mm on my Lauf True Grit and I like them a lot. I'm going to try to squeeze some 50mm on this weekend and go for a ride. I think wider is the way to go for comfort and grip. I'm running 2.5 front and rear on my MTB these days and love the grip and confidence.
Specialized Pathfinder Pro 2Bliss 700C x 42c is my favorite tyre for all around on my gravel bike. Amazing grip on every surface. Best compromise ever.
Specialized Pathfinder Pro’s in a 38 is what I have rode for several years however, recently I tired some 47’s for 435 miles. Some all road miles, some with lots of grades 1, 2 & a little grade 3 gravel. Now trying out some 42’s but it’s too soon to tell. I will say however the 47’s felt better than the 38’s on grade 2 & 3 gravel, but slower on tarmac.
Also my favorite tire but only for summer, in winter in the wet dirt they are very slippery, I use cinturo gravel 45s in winter, also liked megabytes, but I'm doing some singletrack on most rides on Vancouver Island.
Love the Pathfinder in 47 on dry surfaces, fast and comfortable, however i am changing to terratrails in 40 for the muddier tracks in in the woods during "winter"...
If you’re going to run one tyre only, it will always have to be a compromise. 40-45 / 700c with moderate tread pattern would seem the obvious choice. Riding in Scotland can mean a very mixed terrain form smooth fast forrest roads to rim banging loose stones the size of a child’s fist to technical single-track. 650b 45 or 50 if the terrain is mostly rough and off road. Lower profile 40mm on 700c if there is material distance on hard surface and covering longer distances. If I need more than 50mm then it’s time to take the XC bike.
Now it would be interesting to see what the differences are between these tires on asphalt and coarser gravel. This means everyone can choose the best tire width for their intended use. I think on asphalt or coarse gravel, or even mud the differences would be even greater. Few gravel riders choose routes as extreme as the professionals. For me it's mostly light gravel and a lot of asphalt, so in this application it would be important for me to know how big the differences are on asphalt. For others maybe what it looks like on rough gravel.
From experience, the gravel M is not the best choice for asphalt. Its good in mud and loose conditions, rough dry conditions. For the conditions you describe Pirelli make the H which would be a much better idea. Opinions will vary widely as to whats a good choice for recreational gravel riders, but it seems 45mm is the sweetspot right now.
Started on 40s when I took up gravel about 18 months ago. But shifted 45s earlier this year after a frustrating puncture-riddled Great Otway Gravel Grind. Though to be fair, that was caused by broken glass where I stopped to take a photo of the beautiful coastal scenery. Since I moved to 45s and lower pressure (thank you Silca), I've felt smoother overall and more in control on descents and on the rougher stuff. And I haven't crashed on the 45s (touch wood). PS an electronic tyre pressure gauge is a must. My track pump reads about 10 psi low - so I was running my tyres WAY too hard.
I'm thinking about building a "gravel monster bike" Take a hardtail mtb frame, but a ridged fork in it, grx groupset, race handelbar,... If you can make it so that your position is the +/- the same as your road/gravel bike it should be fast. And the tires will give you more room for error. Would love to see this video
When trying to decide which bike to sell between my hardtail MTB and flat-bar gravel bike, I tested them head to head on the same 15km route using Komoot on consecutive days with the same weather conditions... The 4.1kg heavier hardtail with 54c tires was only 1 minute slower (0.4 kph average) than gravel bike on 35c tires. The terrain was 50/50 gravel and asphalt and weather conditions. The biggest difference between those two bikes is the gravel bike was more tiring but much faster on asphalt going downhill.
Back in the day (2013) it was hard to find good tires in a 40c or larger, as 38c was pretty common. I ran a wider 29er rim and punched the 40's out to a touch wider. Managed to find some skinny 29er tires in a 50c/1.9" and could only fit that in the front. I rode that way up until 2016/2017, when the market really seemed to catch up. Now, I stick around the 45c in a gravel-specific frame, although I have been riding a gravel-oriented buildout of a 29er hardtail rigid and running a 2.1" tire that is plenty comfortable and fast in the Flint Hills. It definitely comes down to preference, how you ride, and how your bike is set up.
Recently went to a sort of "mullet" setup. Specialized Pathfinders (great multi-surface tires), 38c on the rear and 42c up front - best I could manage with available tire-clearance. Liking the improvement so far!
Don't you think that the results are distorted by Simon's suspension fork? And that it smooths all the results? Normally this test must determine the best compromise between tire mass versus gain in vibration absorption (Hence also the importance of the pressure put in each of the tires) Few gravel bikes are equipped with suspension forks
Having just done the UCI world bike path champs (age group) I can confirm that 47mm tires were too wide for smooth tracks, at the gralloch in Scotland they were perfect
Question1 fornus mere mortals What would be the safer and more comfortable choice? 45 - 50 - 60? Question 2 Which tires did you ride / threadpatern interest.
I rode 47mm Michelin power pro which is small tight block pattern, if you're not racing these would make a great tire as very good puncture resistant and very comfortable with good grip in most circumstances
For mere mortals buying the best quality tyres at the lowest possible cost also comes into it, regardless of width! I picked up a pair of Protection TR conti terra trails (650 x40) for £75.00. They’re light, quick and grippy on all surfaces and come out slightly larger than 40mm on 26mm internal width rims. I find them super comfy and fast.
Our roads are mostly terrible in Honolulu so a gravel bike is really a road bike for me. As I'm generally a touring cyclist and not into racing, wider is almost always better. I'm waiting to take delivery of a new Trek Checkpoint ALR 5 that comes with 40mm tires though for 700c wheels it'll go to 45mm. If I switch to 650b wheels (though careful cornering would be required), it will go to 56mm. My guess is I'll keep the 700c and move to 45mm when the original tires wear out...or I get bored with them.
Doing XC MTB in parallel since years, I switched to 2.4“ tires with 23/25psi on 30mm wheels a few years ago and destroyed all my KOMs with this setup. As long as aero isn’t so important wider setup will made it in Gravel as well. But on a course like Leuven or even more flat and more windy I would choose the best aero setup
The best and most enjoyable bike that I ride and nearly my every day choice is a 2013 CanondalenFlash Ulitmate rigid with drops while running 2.2mtb. Been riding that set up for six years and love it. Makes mtb tracks fun again and good for ‘gravel’. Only issue is just slightly heavier.
I rode both Cascadia Super Gravel and Unbound this year on 47mm Pathfinder Pros, up from 42mms in previous years. Pretty much maxed out the clearance on my Diverge or I would go bigger. Bombing down chunky terrain is where large volume tires really shines as you can go faster with more confidence while getting beat up less which are all important during long races or days in the saddle.
In have a Singular Peregrine, I run 2.1” 650b Vittoria Mescals for gravel use. I am a larger rider (@100kg) and find these perfectly well suited to UK gravel (I.e. not the nice tidy gravel that you were on! 😂). Wide tires give comfort and stability off road. Yes, they’re not as aero, but, off road it gives you the control and comfort you need. Reliability and comfort are more important when riding gravel than aero. If you are racing then hung a bit of aero in there as well. For most people and extra few millimetres will make an awful lot of difference to your gravel ride.
6:44 not 50s but I have a set of 47 mm 650b tires with brown sidewalls for my gravel bike. and I got to say, like you said, it looks cool 😎. And remember, 3/4 of cycling is just looking the part.
Fully agree. As a MTB guy I thought the road losers were nuts with their 40-50-60mm high rims. Now I want them too on my gravelbike with 30mm internal width... difficult to find though.
I have gone up to 50 mm tyres on my hybrid bike for riding on a mixture of roads and trails. They've never felt slow, and I love the smoother ride and extra safety especially on bad roads with cracks and potholes. They do add a bit of extra weight and wind resistance, but I think the advantages outweigh the drawbacks.
I'm a Clydesdale, so bigger is definitely better, especially if things get chunky, and as soon as there are corners or steeps. 45mm is an absolute minimum for me; my preference is 55mm and up. It's a funny mental game - I think a lot of us older riders are subconsciously programmed to equate the bumpy, rough ride of hard little tires with speed. I know my brain tells me that I'm going slower on larger tires that absorb the chatter. But reality doesn't hold true to this, and I often put in better times on larger tires. I think in part it's that I'm more comfortable with the sit-n-spin, that I better relax into a steady rhythm. Also, I recall reading an article that said that larger tires are more efficient over rough surfaces because the tread stays in smoother contact and less energy is lost in the wheel travelling up and down.
I have some 2-4 hour routes going 50/50 on tarmac and gravel. Upgraded from 38 to 45 mm in september and cant exactly tell who is faster on what. One day I went one of these roads on 56 mm fullsuspension mtb (both bikes are the same weight, ca 11,7 kg), that felt faster going down on gravel while I actually was at least 1 km/h slower (but the gearing was lighter). A significant diffference between 38 and 45 was the pathchoice. On 38 I avoided gravel as often I could, and tried to go on the dirtpart of the road. On 45 that was less important. When the gravel was really much and loose the 56 climbed better and felt safer descending. On Tarmac its hard to tell. On day I was on tarmac with little tyrepressure on 45 and that day was really slow , another day I pumped it up a bit too much and was able to match my fastest ride on a 5 km long tarmac-Strava segment on the 38 mm.. I dont know which is the faster on mixed surface, but maybe the 38? But the feel of the ride is different, the 38 is less comfort and more shattering on category 2 gravel (defined by silca photo). On gravel I usually have my 3 cm lefty damper in active position. On Tarmac some days active, some days stiff. Both 38 and 45 are good compromises for gravel and tarmac, but the 45 feels better descending on gravel. It feels better, but I cant tell if the speed is different. I do not have powermeter or speedometer, only Strava-data.
Gravel pros might have different considerations to the rest of us. I went with 40mm Pirelli gravel M for what seemed like a good compromise for all the conditions I ride at the time. I would go 45 next time, speed being less a concern than a smoother ride and better grip and control.
If I’m going to be spending majority of time on road I use my 45mm Cinturato M. If I’m going to be spending majority of time on dirt, especially single track, then I use my 2.1” Continental Rubans. My “gravel bike” is also a full rigid XC bike (used to have 100mm Fox 32SC) with flat bar and dropper.
Does it matter what do we call it? If it does it job,I personally couldnt care less if its labelled as mountain bike, or gravel bike, its a bike and I want it to go fast
One thing that wasn’t mentioned here regarding tire clearance, the option to run 650’s. I am running the 650x50 cinturato on my 3T. Looks awesome, feels even better. I can also switch to a 700x42 wheelset if the conditions are mellower.
I’m going to say my experience reflects these findings: not much difference in speed between tyre sizes out there in the wild. I run 38s and 47s (650b) on a couple of titanium Ribble CGRs I have (loved the first one so much I bought a second - so I can have both hardcore gravel & road - any road - setups) and 40s on a Canyon Grail I have had for a year now. At 68kg on a 12 kg bike (tools and water bottles exist in the real world) I can bang over most terrain with no fear for my rims with 30f & 32r in PSI. I prefer the 47s for the really rough stuff, but part of that is XTR MTB rims and a Lauf fork, which make the bunnyhops much better. From a speed perspective I’ve knocked off plenty of PRs & KOMs on each setup on all types of surfaces. It’s really about the legs on the day much more than tyre or bike choice.
The best thing about a gravel bike is that it is offering me a similar road-bike responsivness and agility on tarmac roads and the possibility to ride gravel sections and trails without riding like on eggs. I think that was the initial idea of a gravel bike. Having a bike that can do it all without compromizing too much in either direction. The best tyre for that use to me is a 37-40 mm tyre. Everything wider then 40 slows you down a lot on tarmac and everything narrower then 37 mm is way more uncomfortable and difficult to ride on gravel and trails.
I just did a gravel ride in Kansas yesterday on 50s. But really what I wanted come here to comment was our temperature was 33 and seeing you in jackets and full legs was quite a difference.
I've ran everything from 38 to 45's on my new Grail. The fastest tire I've ran is the Extralight Rene Hearse Snoqualimie 44. We don't have much sharp stuff here in Michigan so I don't worry about flats like you would have to out west.
How tall is Connor?! Look at time stamp 6:38. Conner and Simmon are next to each other sitting on their bikes and Connor looks like a giant! Holy cow. Thanks for the gravel tire testing. I run 40s. Might give 45s a try.
I am riding that exact same Pirelli Cinturato Gravel M in size 45mm. I find it well rolling tire that can do hard terrain also. I have done +200km on tarmac with those and also mtb-like paths with rocks. Could be wider but couldn't be narrower. On tarmac that tire is still rather fast and comfortable.
I think your time differences can be easily explained by the suspension fork. Without the front suspension the tire width and dampening has more impact on the speed of the bike than on the one with front suspension. Hence much closer times and faster overall speed (pushing 50W less too) Oh shot, just saw that everyone realized this already, oh well, good video and You got me to comment, well done guys 😂
These bikes are getting closer and closer to my hard tail XC bike from 15 years ago. I converted my hard tail to a 8kg rigid training bike when full suspension XC bikes got light enough and it is still my favourite bike.ive always run 2.1” tyres on it, which is pretty much what these gravel bikes are without drop bars.
I have two set of wheels for my gravel bike, one set for slicks for road duty with is 90% of my riding. The other set is for rougher roads and gravel. My slicks are the Rene Herse 700x35 Bon Jon Pass. The knobby tires are the Rene Herse 700x48 Oracle Ridge. I running both sets of tires with TPU tubes (Tubolito X-city tubes), helping keeping the tires light weight. I set the pressure to what the Wolf Tooth Tire inflation App, suggests. The 35mm tires are smooth but are the faster of the two sets. The 48 mm tires are smoother. I’ve used wider knobby tires for road rides, because they are more comfortable, They both are really great. In response to the GCN Video - I think the right tire is determined by road/trail surface. I ride 90% paved roads (commuting), so the slicks are on my gravel bike 90% of the time. GCN need to go back and try the same sized slicks and knobbies on that trail and see if that makes a difference. I’d like to see a mixed surface test with paved roads mixed in. The largest tire my frame will accept is 50mm but Rene Herse doesn’t offer a 50mm tire.
I love my Rene Herse 700C x 44 Snoqualmie Pass TC semi-slick Tires. I may change to the 700C X 44 Manastash Ridge TC knobby tires soon. They are supposed to be just as fast. If I could go 48 I would. Rene tires have wonderfully supple side walls for great rolling.
I don’t want to be negative - but. Track pumps are always ALWAYS away off on their pressure reading. Worth double checking with a digital gauge like the Topeak D2. My past three track pumps have all been more than 8psi high at 60psi.
You can't forget the clearance issue, or just gloss over it. My mixed surface rides almost never have the thick red clay that grabs the tread unrelentingly. It's rare that I encounter that kind of mud, but enough of my routes are tarmac/asphalt that I am considering going back from a knobby 45mm, to slicker 40mm. I expect it will be quieter and smoother on the paved surfaces.
I went from 40mm Bontragers to 45mm Pirelli Centurato R. I love them and won't go back, but I may try a different tread pattern--the Ms perhaps. My max clearance is 45mm...
Depends on what the percentage of the race course is on pavement vs. gravel.. And the roughness of the gravel. No one tire can be crowned "the fastest " for all situations. If the course is 70% gravel and 30% pavement, what would you guys choose? Or, maybe , now that you've tested the tires on gravel, go test them on pavement, then a third test on very chunky gravel.. that would be enough information, combined with knowing the percentage of a given race course that is pavement vs gravel or rough gravel, to help your audience make their choice on when to run which tires.. Waiting for your thoughts / or second and third tests.
Swenson rode a 63mm deep rear rim at SBTGRVL with Maxxis slick tires. He ran 2.4" MTB tires at Leadville, that equate to 61mm, but that was on an MTB with drop bars. Hardly a gravel tire or race.
@@Rob6020 huh? that was the B-side of the World Road Race championship! Strade Bianchi and Paris Roubaix were more gravel than that joke of a World's gravel course.
Maybe I missed it, but a discussion on the width of the tyre to the wheel is warranted for aerodynamics. Plus the effect of inserts and going at even lower pressures. Also of note: European gravel is about going as fast as possible over moderate stuff (thus narrower tyres); American gravel is about going hard and needing real protection over gnarly terrain (thus super wide tyres) - both interesting in their own way!
I ride 35mm gravelking tyres and ride is both good for rolling along roads and adequate on gravel. My bike came with 40mm fitted and riding on the road was like cycling in treacle
I run 50mm tires on mine, though they don't have much tread. One of my regular routes goes over a trail with some pretty loose gravel and the tires hold up pretty well. Schwalbe has a 50-584 studded tire that I'm looking at for winter.
Need to test on road too. In the U.K. at least gravel rides will have substantial road sections. In my experience anything over 43 is like pedalling through treacle on tarmac.
@@nstrug not confirmed by actual rolling resistance and aerodynamic testing though. Give the latest escape collective nerd alert podcast with Dylan Johnson a listen.
@@jameseastwood402 do you honestly think a 50mm knobbly at 25psi has the same rolling resistance on tarmac as a 40mm at say 35psi? Ever ridden an MTB on the road?
@@jameseastwood402 I assume you’re talking about where Dylan Johnson is speaking at 8:30 in the podcast. He’s talking about performance of off road tyres on gravel, not on tarmac.
I’m lucky enough to have a few wheel sets and plenty of clearance for larger tires on my gravel bikes. #1 Gravel bikes started coming with wider rims a few years ago but I went wider. My internal widths are 26.6mm, 28mm and 30mm. #2 Even narrow 36mm tires can fit wide rims. #3 My tires that I have chosen for my trails are 45c Kenda Alluvium, 45c Schwalbe Bite and Ultra-Bite and 36mm Challenge Strada Bianca for road. My trail wheels all have Cushcore gravel and one has the Tannus Armor Lite insert. All tubeless of course. I’m 150# 68kg and I can use tire pressure at 20psi without issues when needed. I usually use at 25 or 30PSI
I've got a 50 mm on the front and 40 mm on the back, so i guess i average out at 45! But more seriously this width-mullet approach has worked really well.
I've got 50 mm on the front wheel of my mountain bike, and a 45mm on the back, Purely by accident, the back tyre needed changing and I used a spare tyre that I already had. The set-up with a larger tyre on the front and the smaller one on the back seems to work ok, the bike feels good.
I'll be sticking with what I have. I got 47's on my 650 b's, and then I have 38's on my 700c. Really it's more because that's what I already have, and it works fine for me. The 47s on the 650s I've been using for cyclocross racing anyways, and the 38s I've actually been using more Road riding this fall.
I finally get the point of the video: wider tyres "make you go faster" because they absorb vibrations, and it's the thread patterns and pressure what makes you slower/faster. Maybe true for that specific gravel road, but wider tyres will always make more friction with the floor, and lower pressure will always make even more friction with the floor... More friction with the floor makes you slower period. I run slick 38mm tyres at very high pressure on my bike because I know that narrow tyres do make me lighter than wide tyres on tarmac, while they are still wide enough to work on any gravel road when it's dry. Thread patterns effect the speed the most. On that we do agree... I would not run knobby tyres if I ever wanted to ride on tarmac at any point in my ride because that's where I need to go faster in a real life situation because cars don't have mercy of me. Maybe I would not win a race against you on your specific gravel road... For that I would want to run thick knobby tyres. In conclusion: if you run slicks, 40mm or less. And if you run knobbies, 45mm or more. But the ones are for the roads, and the others are for the gravel. And you have to pick one or the other! Exceedingly thick tyres are not good for anything though when I was new to bikes I remember having big tyres because they looked cooler but in reality I do most of my riding on the road because ...... it's still a rigid bike...
I run 38mm and am 120kg. Am mostly ok for comfort, but my Giant Revolt has a 'flip chip' (extends the wheel base by moving the rear axle backwards a few mm) that meams I could go up to 53mm if I should want to. On the basis of this experiment, sounds much more like comfort and confidence is key. As with most things gravel...
Very interesting comp. I think there is no 1 clear answer , everything depends on many factors so it could be 40 or 50 and if you want a optimal compromize chose 45.
I live in an area where there are more single track routes designed for light mountain biking than gravel routes, so yes, wider is better for me. 50mm would be great, maybe even 60mm. I went to an XC mountain bike for this reason but I'm so used to underbiking the trails that I'm having a hard time adjusting to the suspension fork. I may just go ridged at some point, but I do love the wider tires I get with an xc.
Not sure how long the test track was here, but a big factor over longer distances is the fatiguing effect of the vibration on your muscles. That 'smoothness' that Si described could, in an endurance race, make a far greater difference than rolling resistance.
Great review. It would have been interesting to measure each wheel set mounted to confirm actual width. I have 19mm rim and with 45mm tyres, they measure at 43.5mm. I believe with the 50mm tyre and your 23mm internal rim, you were not 50mm. I suspect less. Next video would be what internal rim width do you need to get the tyre size you purchased: 40, 45, ad 50mm. I appreciate your content. Keep it coming.
I know this may be a controversial comment... but i don't get the point of putting wider and wider tyres on a gravel bike. From my knowledge, (and may i say a very limited one at that) I was under the impression that a gravel bike was a road bike with that added extra grip incase you wanted to do a little bit of off-road during your ride. If the whole idea of getting wider tyres 45+ to 60s is to ride on just gravel and dirt, then why not just use a Mountain bike? It just appears the original gravel bike is morphing into a mountain bike which we already had... so whats the point? 🤷🏼♂️
gravel or mtb might go down as the longest debate in human history -- fun stuff. 1. ride whatever you prefer, nor right/wrong way to do it. 2. If you ride 20km+ to or from the dirt -- or even between the dirt -- put drops on that bike; if you drive to the dirt put flat bar. everything else is relative. the frames/componets, etc are all smashing together in various combo... so look at the routes and choose bar appropriately. And then call it whatever you want... cross, gravel, monster cross, XC...
simply put .... it feels so much different than a mountain bike ... and as long as you don't go too much on single tracks the gravel bike is better suited to gravel than mtb's
Fro me, gravel rides are when the distance is still the main challenge, MTB rides are where the terrain takes the foreground. You can tackle pretty rough surfaces on a gravel bike, as long as they are consistent, for ever changing conditions and tight trails, an MTB is the better choice.
The short answer is aerodynamics. There is quite a range of what is called a “gravel” race but for many of the classic Midwest-USA races a gravel bike with extremely wide tires is the fastest bike to race. But the wider tires appear to be actually faster since rolling resistance is lower on wider mountain bike tires because they can use less material in the sidewall for the same amount of puncture protection (volume gives its own puncture protection). Dylan Johnson was testing 2.1in MTB race tires (I think, it may have even been 2.3) and they were consistently testing faster than 40mm and 45mm race gravel tires. (This is for races that are 80%+ gravel.)
Flying Stick : Right of Screen 2m29 A flying stick was thrown from the right hand side of the screen. Yet both ‘actors’ carried on professionally 😂 Later on ‘sticks’ were mentioned. What’s the secret sauce?! Coming from Mtb I found larger tires better as it got muddier, rooty & rocky. Whilst with roots & rocks, a full suspension was always faster. My Orbea can take upto 48mm. I had enjoyed 35mm tires on it, going on the roads. Nothing beats this comfort. The problem is that it’s not great for club rides. It leads to slightly slower speeds & more watt power.
Width isn't the only factor, side wall compliance and profile also matter and of course pressure and also roughness of the underground. Tubes or Tubeless too. Width is just part of the mix.
agreed. all the hysteresis chat on road tyres, how would gravel Tues be any difference? going 50mm I'm going conti Race-king black chili for that exact reason
I run the Cinturato M 50mm and it's a heavier tire..+650grams borderline xc mtb tire heavy. I noticed it quite a bit coming from a 44mm WTB Raddler (Which btw I believe is the best all around gravel tire on the market)...my times are slightly slower now on the gravel m..but! Its an awesome tire, this thing is grippy on dirt and road. My descent times are way better on the Gravel M 50mm...and it feels like an MTB grippy tire when you need it and a solid overall road tire when you want it.
Fun video. Would be interesting to see a part 2 where the different Tyre widths are used on technical terrain. Or with an accelerometer to measure vibrations. :)
Great video. It’s just crazy complicated in pressure. In a big believer in big tyres. But you have to drop the pressure for more deflection in the bigger tires or you might as well run the narrower tyre
I ride 35s-42s on my road bike. 45-2.2 on my gravel. 2.6 - 2.7 on my mtb. Road and gravel, no loss of any speed with wider tires; more comfortable and more control. Win-Win. Also, I don't compete and ride for the enjoyment so I'm far less concerned about things like marginal gains. Comfort and control first though speed not unimportant.
I can only run a 42 in the rear and run a 50 up front max. Currently on 40 front and 38 rear. Insanely better than the 32's it came with (cyclocross bike). Im around 190-200lbs. Next im gonna try 50 up front and max out the back with a 40 or 42 if i can find one. I think for bigger riders the tire size has a much bigger affect on the ride as the overall force is greater.
The minute differences between runs and the fact that they came to different results makes me very comfortable, saying that there is no realistic speed difference between the three tires
The trends towards wider tires on road bikes and on gravel bikes occured almost simultaneously, but people shouldn't be mistaken in assuming they're for the same reason. On road bikes it's empirically proven to reduce rolling resistance, but on gravel bikes it's mostly a capability and comfort kind of thing. People don't care about gaining 5 watts or losing
How long before gravel bikes morph into mountain bikes and we need a new revolutionary category to fill the ever widening gap between them and road bikes?
Flat bar gravel bikes with aerobars are the final destination. If it's smooth, you should be either in the aerobars or sitting upright drafting or in a tail wind. If it's rough, you're faster on a flat bar for more control and you don't need aero/narrow anything because you're going way slower on rough ground. I've tested it out and it's way faster on the the same courses.
I think it does depend on your bike or at least the one you are using. Personally I’m not a quick cyclist but I do put out a fair bit of power, the 45mm tyres are probably a safe option for most of us. I think unless you decide to have a custom bike it will have to be a decision you go with and stick by. Good tyres are important too so don’t overlook them.
I've been running Pirelli Cinturato M 50mm on 650b since the spring. Weather this year has been pretty bad, so I've never felt there was a good time to swap out to my narrower rubber. I've done several Glorious Gravel races. The 50mm tyre has been slower on the road sections, I have to put in more effort to cruise in the pack I'm in on tarmac. But the gravel sections (UK, so gravel = mud) it's been more comfortable with more confidence and I normally make big gains on other riders. And a couple of the races were atrocious weather, bad enough for XC MTBs to be competitive, and having tractor wheels gave me a massive advantage. I'm actually wondering if I can fit some 2.1" x 27.5" MTB mud spikes for the winter...
At this moment, I’m running 50 maxes ramblers. I have ran pathfinders 42 WTB 45. maxes or game changer I’ll probably won’t ever go back 50s to me seem to be the sweet spot.
What’s the optimal width tyre for you? 🛞 Would you rather ride use tyres bigger than 60mm or smaller than 40mm? Let us know in the comments down below! 💬
I rode 50mm for a while doing a long gravel commute. I found them slow and heavy and swapped them out.
They were comfy though!
50mm. A tad slower but two tads more comfortable... ;)
Light Mtb tires 2,20 or 2,25 are faster rolling than wider gravel tires.
I 've been using 32mm for years. Been loving them so far.
thunderburt 2.35" between 1.0 and 1.7 bar depending on terrain
Maybe the fork on Si's bike kinda leveled off the performance of the tires as it was the main component absorbing the bumps
I'm on the same opinion.
Exactly this! the fork was doing all the work..
exactly.. 45mm seem best option
@@BikesKomsCRO For his weight and his power, yes.
@@ZenEndurance si had a suspension grizl.. Connors test was more conclusive
Could you do a test of gravel tyres on the road? I mean, to get to some nice gravel paths I still have to do up to 20km on the road to get there.
Maybe a 50-50% road - gravel test? Thanks GCN to make it happen 🙂.
@@kotaib They could call it ''The perfect versatile tyre video''.
This would be great!!!!!
I am with you. MOST of us prob ride gravel with tarmac on our routes. IMO, it's not just what the tire can do offroad, but also how fast it rolls on tarmac/on gucci gravel. I have some 47c Renee Herses that kill it offroad, but as soon as I am on road, they are so sluggish compared to a fast rolling gravel tire.
bicyclerollingresistance has already tested a bunch of gravel tires on machines that simulates road surface. Just pick one that has the lowest rolling resistance but with enough treads for your gravel route.
I get the impression that Si probably starts his morning commute with 5 beeps 😂.
@@jezza359 hahaha
@@tonysadler5290 “his romantic moments” 😂
I'd hope he has his kids beep for him!
You absolutely have to test the heavier ones on climbs! The heavy 50mm will drain much more power and drastically impact your endurance more, especially on road compared to a narrower tyre. So it's matter of balance with the profile of your route, avg gradient, surfaces, bike weight (eg. bikepacking), weather conditions and so on. No mention of the elephant in the room: pressure. So many factors! At least that's my very own experience.
I recently put a set of 700x50c panaracer gravel kings on my gravel bike. I'll never go narrower again, I was blown away by the level of comfort a wider and larger volume tyre gives.
A slick? Is there a 50 Slick Version?
The typical Gravel Profile does exactly nothing on Mud and for the rest very little.
So i ride with Slicks on my Gravel in Summer and when the Mud comes i go to long Lugs for mud.
@@ambulowan Yeah, the gravel king comes in a slick version too but the widest is 40mm in the slick. Too narrow for me.
Your previous size was what?
Hate to break it to you but I’ve been running 50mm GK’s for 3 years and fancied a change.
Put on Terevail Washburn’s in 42mm.
So much more comfortable and supple, yet still happy to bomb down chunky stuff.
Maybe I should’ve bought them in 47mm instead.
@@TheRayDog I've always had 42 or 45mm before.
Killer topic! It is amazing how long it took the industry to start to adopt the wider stance. In the 2000s we were using our CX bikes with a 33mm limit now we are on 45s and 50s. We as a gravel race team are sponsored by Challenge. We aided them with the development of their GateAway. We really tried to get them to go to a 45mm instead of the launch of the 40s. Hence now they are making all their gravel tires in both sizes. Talking to Jason of Challenge at this years Unbound, he said that near all the frame/bike manufactures will be moving toward a 50 of even a bit wider in the near future. I am the Goldy Locks choice with the 45s ; ) Thanks Boys for all you do!
Comming from mountainbiking, we went through the same 15 year ago moving from shallow 25" rims with tubed tires to 29" tubeless with 60mm tires in a short amount of time (running 29x2.40 tires with 1.2 bar @ 70kg).
I run 38mm on my Giant Defy 2024 in a gravel setup - works wonderfully :)
It was a revolution and still is. I am totally sure the same is going to be for Gravel. But going further than 50mm's tires and a suspended fork you might as well call it a mountainbike.
writing before watching; I recently raced on gnarly gravel, forest ducts, sand and cx segment all in one race, i had cinturatos m 50mm, safely to say those tires were game changer, I was able to race on all terains - sand segment overtakes were the coolest ❤ The tires gave me a big advantage there were clearly stronger guys and girls than me but they could only race me on asphalt or premium gravel, lucky for me there wasnt many of that.
Funnily at the start we were talking and one guy said "you know i think we have to wide tires for this race (also 500mm) "
Now i think wider tire in diffrent terrains = clear advantage
Hell yeah, Sometimes I go riding in the Surrey Hills and that's very sandy terrain that makes me wish my MTB's 2.5" tyres (64mm) were even wider!
About 2.1 % of gravel bike owners race. If that much. Heavy fat tires are slow on road.
Light gravel tires cost a yit load of money and tend to wear out too fast
Here in the champagne gravel paradise - Finland the gravel is mainly so smooth that finer threads and 40 mm is usually sufficient for the riding we do. You guys should come here and try it. People are amazed on how good the gravel is here.
"Technically speaking, if it's not crushed Kimmeridgian limestone from the Champagne region of France, it really should just be called sparkling gravel."
I’d rather come to XC ski.
I raced FNLD GRVL and the dirt was indeed amazingly smooth!
@@benjaminmirt5029a mere thumbs up is inadequate for the comment. Well done.
It's the same here in SE Sweden, but I run 45mm front and 40mm back. Just gives you more grip in the corners and means you can do some of the rougher forest tracks too.
Not sure if you know of Dylan Johnson. But he always has good analysis of best gravel set hps for races and has run 2.1 mtb tires at quite a few races as they are fast, less Chance of puncture and actually more aero.
Let's just hope backwards-hat-Dylan doesn't pop in to comment.
GCN copies Dylan’s content, of course they know who he is 😂
Dylan Johnson is a true influencer - he and Keegan (and a handful of others) are changing the gravel bike market before our eyes. Big tires are here to stay - and all the reason for companies to convince us to purchase another bike. 😀
Wider tyres are not more aero.
@@cyklandetidsoptimisten Not always see wind tunnels testing data showing 53 less drag than 50 and equal to 45 at about 8 minutes in ruclips.net/video/w3yspNTvVPo/видео.htmlsi=Ork5BIa38rQpyLmX
Loving the 2.2” conti race kings on my lauf siegla :) I’m a wide boy and appreciate the wide clearance!
Been riding a 2.1 inch 650b setup, the width is perfect, would just like this in 700c for a higher BB. Im putting my money on 700c x 50mm as the ultimate gravel cross country setup.
Agreed. The Race Kings are a thinner casing than many gravel specific tires, which counterintuitively makes these wider XC MTB tires actually faster than the narrower thicker walled gravel tires.
Riding 2.1 Schwalbe Thunderbolts on my Seigla rigid and they are a game changer.
Gravel is such a wide spectrum that the optimal tyre fully depends on the route you’re riding on the day. For most UK riding, I’ve got Schwalbe Thunder Bolts in 57c on my Lauf Seigla and they are incredibly fast and comfortable. What you will find is that relatively low volume MTB tyres (2.1” or 2.2”) have thinner casings and roll faster than 50c gravel tyres which are too beefed up for that size since they use the same construction as the 40c tyres. About the test here, I think Connors rigid bike showed the true results while the suspension fork on Sis bike nullified the impact of the larger tyres, which can also help draw other conclusions like wether or not you want a suspension for and run 40c tyres which will definitely be faster on tarmac if your rides often involve that. Also worth considering is that the larger tires will offer significantly more comfort in long races or full day rides so over a long ride they may prove much faster in the end - which is my experience by the way
All good points. I'm also running Thunderburts (2.35s). Did a ride on some "Silca grade 2" gravel this morning running 19psi front, 21psi rear. Very comfortable.
The other aspect not touched on is tyre availability.
In the 50mm range, you start having access to thin casing 2.1" MTB tyres which have faster rolling resistance values than the majority of gravel bikes.
So in real world purchasing, it would have been good if they threw in a 4th tyre which would have been a 2.1/2.2" MTB tyre.
I personally have swapped (with the data from the man Dylan Johnson) to running 2.1" Thunder Burt tyres with actually a mild gain in speed > 40mm Tufo Thunderos (which are one of the fastest gravel tyres with tread) with he benefits of additional grip/comfort etc.
That being said, my "gravel routes" are usually 60%+ minimum offroad.
What pressures are you running?
@vantarpon6849 For lighter gravel rides (Cat 1 or 2) 24R, 23F. For majority dirt/chunkier gravel/singletrack focused rides I'll drop 2-3psi F&R. Am running a Vittoria Airliner Lite in the rear though and am 100kg (220lbs) including the bike.
is Thunder Burt noticeably slower compered 40mm tufos on tarmac?
@enotracoon9244 only slightly.
Choosing between the best on offer in sizes (e.g. 2.1 Thunderburts vs. something like a Tufo Thundero 40/44 or S-Works Pathfinder 42) is more of a question of what is your normal split for on-road/off-road.
I run 2.1 Thunder Burts because gravel courses for me are at minimum about 2/3 offroad. The fastest MTB tyres (basically) prioritize speed at the sacrifice of tread thickness and casing/sidewall thickness (both are fine for gravel bikes offroad because softer surfaces wear tyres slower and higher volume = provides pinch flat protection).
The fastest gravel tyres can sacrifice sidewall thickness but not as much tread thickness because the average end user (most gravel riders) use their bikes for maybe 1/3 offroad and 2/3 on road.
I had both of these tyres and they were fantastic, when I got a 2nd wheelset with 35mm GP5000 for commuting/occasional road rides/some more priority to puncture protection from debris/cuts etc) then I went the 2.1 TB route.
If it's more like 50/50 then it's more of a question of your appetite to wear tyres out quicker/replace more often and/or how rough that 50% off-road is (e.g. if it's super smooth champagne gravel then perhaps nudges it into 40/42s).
50mm all the way - I'm in the Purbecks UK - Rolling hills, flint, rocky downhills, forest gravel trails and sandy trails. The 50mm handles all with ease. I'd be interested to go even wider.
Just get a mountainbike and you can go to 2.35" on a fast XC machine.
Just go with MTB bike
@@porz1ngis have both
Wider? Buy a mtb
I use a Gravel Bike as my road bike and a drop bar MTB as my Gravel Bike. Suffice it to say I definitely prefer wider tires on everything
👍
My drop bar mtb with 2.2 race kings works on everything.
@@TheDarKris based
Great vid! I'm running 2.25" (57mm) tyres this winter and they're great! I haven't really noticed a difference on the flat, but going uphill on tarmac is definitely a bit slower. That said, gravel riding is about so much more than speed. The wider tyres have given me a 'go anywhere' mindset and I've been exploring places I never dared before. They feel so comfortable and float through mud that swallows my friends' narrower tyres. They can also climb grassy and muddy slopes that would otherwise have me wheel spinning. Plus, as mentioned in the film, wider tyres just look better.
If a 50mm tire shows no noticeable difference in speed compared to a 40mm, there’s absolutely no justification for choosing the smaller size. The larger tire provides significantly better control, superior puncture resistance, and far greater comfort. Why settle for less when there’s no performance drawback?
Uh, well there is a good reason for smaller tires. My bike doesn’t fit 50’s or even 45’s. And it’s a new bike!!!😂
It really depends on the specific terrain, both weight and aerodynamics are less favorable with a wider tire but they are more comfortable.
@@veggiemotothe are penalties are not as bad as youd think like 1 watt per 5mm of width to the tire
Tire width has nothing to do with puncture resistance. Do you mean pinch flats?
@@markconnelly1806 In the world of tubeless tires, wider tires tend to have better puncture resistance. Sealant works by sealing punctures as air escapes, with a wider tire, the larger air volume and lower pressure slow down the rate of air loss, giving the sealant more time to do its job. This is why the same sealant is generally more effective in mountain bike tires compared to road tires.
People with bikes that say they only hold a narrower tire should double-check if their front fork will actually hold bigger. My bike claims a max of 42, but that's only true on the rear. The front fork will clear a 48, and even a 50 if you trim down the knobs some. So just like adding a suspension fork can make you faster and more comfortable, I run a 47 pathfinder pro on the front along with my 42 rear and it's great. I get the comfort and control of a wider tire at least on the front end where it matters most until I get around to buying my next bike. I've even run that 47 on a 700 up front and a 650b wheel with a 48 on the rear and it rides great - perfect for rougher courses.
Absolutely! Most claims for tire clearance are pretty conservative and frames will fit more. I ride a 45mm Cinturato Gravel M in the front and a 42mm Pathfinder in the back. Lots of grip even on mud in front and easy rolling in the back. Perfect mix imo.
@@christianb.1028 Yeah I think you might not be expert if you are running the same tires front and back. The different ends of the bike do different things. Using the same tire for both is kinda silly if you think about it
yes - i used to run a 47mm nobbly mountain bike tyre on the front of my norco threshold cross bike that officially would only take 35mm. It made a huge difference in control compared to a matched 35mm front, lifted the front of the bike slightly and i thought it looked pretty cool! There was no way i could get anything close to that on the back though
I'm running 650b x 47 Vittoria terreno dry tire on DT swiss gr1600's and the combo is amazing
Got exactly the same set up on mine 👌🏼
From Poland with love! ❤
We really appreciate your work! ☺👍
I run 45mm on my Lauf True Grit and I like them a lot. I'm going to try to squeeze some 50mm on this weekend and go for a ride. I think wider is the way to go for comfort and grip. I'm running 2.5 front and rear on my MTB these days and love the grip and confidence.
Specialized Pathfinder Pro 2Bliss 700C x 42c is my favorite tyre for all around on my gravel bike. Amazing grip on every surface. Best compromise ever.
I’m deciding between the 42 and 47. Wrecking my brain trying to decide!!
Specialized Pathfinder Pro’s in a 38 is what I have rode for several years however, recently I tired some 47’s for 435 miles. Some all road miles, some with lots of grades 1, 2 & a little grade 3 gravel.
Now trying out some 42’s but it’s too soon to tell.
I will say however the 47’s felt better than the 38’s on grade 2 & 3 gravel, but slower on tarmac.
@JonRoth_MusicSourceProDJ , I use same tyres, used 38 for years but now much prefer 42s, haven't tried 47 yet.
Also my favorite tire but only for summer, in winter in the wet dirt they are very slippery, I use cinturo gravel 45s in winter, also liked megabytes, but I'm doing some singletrack on most rides on Vancouver Island.
Love the Pathfinder in 47 on dry surfaces, fast and comfortable, however i am changing to terratrails in 40 for the muddier tracks in in the woods during "winter"...
If you’re going to run one tyre only, it will always have to be a compromise. 40-45 / 700c with moderate tread pattern would seem the obvious choice. Riding in Scotland can mean a very mixed terrain form smooth fast forrest roads to rim banging loose stones the size of a child’s fist to technical single-track. 650b 45 or 50 if the terrain is mostly rough and off road. Lower profile 40mm on 700c if there is material distance on hard surface and covering longer distances. If I need more than 50mm then it’s time to take the XC bike.
🤗
I run 2.35 Thunderburts on my gravel bike. I am a bigger person at 90Kg and find them to be quick and comfortable.
Now it would be interesting to see what the differences are between these tires on asphalt and coarser gravel. This means everyone can choose the best tire width for their intended use. I think on asphalt or coarse gravel, or even mud the differences would be even greater. Few gravel riders choose routes as extreme as the professionals. For me it's mostly light gravel and a lot of asphalt, so in this application it would be important for me to know how big the differences are on asphalt. For others maybe what it looks like on rough gravel.
From experience, the gravel M is not the best choice for asphalt. Its good in mud and loose conditions, rough dry conditions. For the conditions you describe Pirelli make the H which would be a much better idea. Opinions will vary widely as to whats a good choice for recreational gravel riders, but it seems 45mm is the sweetspot right now.
Maybe try an uphill section to see if the increased weight of a larger tire has any effect
Started on 40s when I took up gravel about 18 months ago. But shifted 45s earlier this year after a frustrating puncture-riddled Great Otway Gravel Grind. Though to be fair, that was caused by broken glass where I stopped to take a photo of the beautiful coastal scenery. Since I moved to 45s and lower pressure (thank you Silca), I've felt smoother overall and more in control on descents and on the rougher stuff. And I haven't crashed on the 45s (touch wood). PS an electronic tyre pressure gauge is a must. My track pump reads about 10 psi low - so I was running my tyres WAY too hard.
I'm thinking about building a "gravel monster bike"
Take a hardtail mtb frame, but a ridged fork in it, grx groupset, race handelbar,... If you can make it so that your position is the +/- the same as your road/gravel bike it should be fast. And the tires will give you more room for error.
Would love to see this video
When trying to decide which bike to sell between my hardtail MTB and flat-bar gravel bike, I tested them head to head on the same 15km route using Komoot on consecutive days with the same weather conditions... The 4.1kg heavier hardtail with 54c tires was only 1 minute slower (0.4 kph average) than gravel bike on 35c tires. The terrain was 50/50 gravel and asphalt and weather conditions. The biggest difference between those two bikes is the gravel bike was more tiring but much faster on asphalt going downhill.
Back in the day (2013) it was hard to find good tires in a 40c or larger, as 38c was pretty common. I ran a wider 29er rim and punched the 40's out to a touch wider. Managed to find some skinny 29er tires in a 50c/1.9" and could only fit that in the front. I rode that way up until 2016/2017, when the market really seemed to catch up. Now, I stick around the 45c in a gravel-specific frame, although I have been riding a gravel-oriented buildout of a 29er hardtail rigid and running a 2.1" tire that is plenty comfortable and fast in the Flint Hills. It definitely comes down to preference, how you ride, and how your bike is set up.
Recently went to a sort of "mullet" setup. Specialized Pathfinders (great multi-surface tires), 38c on the rear and 42c up front - best I could manage with available tire-clearance. Liking the improvement so far!
Thanks!
Thank you! Dan
Don't you think that the results are distorted by Simon's suspension fork? And that it smooths all the results?
Normally this test must determine the best compromise between tire mass versus gain in vibration absorption (Hence also the importance of the pressure put in each of the tires) Few gravel bikes are equipped with suspension forks
not to mention you ride gravel bikes on none gravel surfaces.... now it's getting muddy surely the bigger tyre is a no brainer...
50mm/2.1s on 700s imo are optimal for bikepacking. Maybe different for racing but super comfy and resilient for most other rides
Having just done the UCI world bike path champs (age group) I can confirm that 47mm tires were too wide for smooth tracks, at the gralloch in Scotland they were perfect
Question1 fornus mere mortals
What would be the safer and more comfortable choice? 45 - 50 - 60?
Question 2
Which tires did you ride / threadpatern interest.
I rode 47mm Michelin power pro which is small tight block pattern, if you're not racing these would make a great tire as very good puncture resistant and very comfortable with good grip in most circumstances
47mm 650b Teravail Cannonball for the wife and I at the Gralloch. No issues at all. I used 50mm Pirelli Gravel M at the Wales event.
Much like on rally cars, the optimal tyre choice depends on the course you’re doing on the day. There will always be a compromise
For mere mortals buying the best quality tyres at the lowest possible cost also comes into it, regardless of width! I picked up a pair of Protection TR conti terra trails (650 x40) for £75.00. They’re light, quick and grippy on all surfaces and come out slightly larger than 40mm on 26mm internal width rims. I find them super comfy and fast.
Our roads are mostly terrible in Honolulu so a gravel bike is really a road bike for me. As I'm generally a touring cyclist and not into racing, wider is almost always better. I'm waiting to take delivery of a new Trek Checkpoint ALR 5 that comes with 40mm tires though for 700c wheels it'll go to 45mm. If I switch to 650b wheels (though careful cornering would be required), it will go to 56mm. My guess is I'll keep the 700c and move to 45mm when the original tires wear out...or I get bored with them.
Doing XC MTB in parallel since years, I switched to 2.4“ tires with 23/25psi on 30mm wheels a few years ago and destroyed all my KOMs with this setup. As long as aero isn’t so important wider setup will made it in Gravel as well. But on a course like Leuven or even more flat and more windy I would choose the best aero setup
I'm running Vitoria Terreno Dry 700x47 on my topstone carbon. Like it.
The best and most enjoyable bike that I ride and nearly my every day choice is a 2013 CanondalenFlash Ulitmate rigid with drops while running 2.2mtb. Been riding that set up for six years and love it. Makes mtb tracks fun again and good for ‘gravel’. Only issue is just slightly heavier.
I rode both Cascadia Super Gravel and Unbound this year on 47mm Pathfinder Pros, up from 42mms in previous years. Pretty much maxed out the clearance on my Diverge or I would go bigger. Bombing down chunky terrain is where large volume tires really shines as you can go faster with more confidence while getting beat up less which are all important during long races or days in the saddle.
Recently moved from 40mm to 45mm and barely noticed any drop in performance but the ride was vastly improved. Would move up to 50mm if they’d fit.
In have a Singular Peregrine, I run 2.1” 650b Vittoria Mescals for gravel use. I am a larger rider (@100kg) and find these perfectly well suited to UK gravel (I.e. not the nice tidy gravel that you were on! 😂). Wide tires give comfort and stability off road. Yes, they’re not as aero, but, off road it gives you the control and comfort you need. Reliability and comfort are more important when riding gravel than aero. If you are racing then hung a bit of aero in there as well. For most people and extra few millimetres will make an awful lot of difference to your gravel ride.
6:44 not 50s but I have a set of 47 mm 650b tires with brown sidewalls for my gravel bike. and I got to say, like you said, it looks cool 😎. And remember, 3/4 of cycling is just looking the part.
Fully agree.
As a MTB guy I thought the road losers were nuts with their 40-50-60mm high rims.
Now I want them too on my gravelbike with 30mm internal width... difficult to find though.
I have gone up to 50 mm tyres on my hybrid bike for riding on a mixture of roads and trails. They've never felt slow, and I love the smoother ride and extra safety especially on bad roads with cracks and potholes. They do add a bit of extra weight and wind resistance, but I think the advantages outweigh the drawbacks.
I'm a Clydesdale, so bigger is definitely better, especially if things get chunky, and as soon as there are corners or steeps. 45mm is an absolute minimum for me; my preference is 55mm and up.
It's a funny mental game - I think a lot of us older riders are subconsciously programmed to equate the bumpy, rough ride of hard little tires with speed. I know my brain tells me that I'm going slower on larger tires that absorb the chatter. But reality doesn't hold true to this, and I often put in better times on larger tires. I think in part it's that I'm more comfortable with the sit-n-spin, that I better relax into a steady rhythm. Also, I recall reading an article that said that larger tires are more efficient over rough surfaces because the tread stays in smoother contact and less energy is lost in the wheel travelling up and down.
I have some 2-4 hour routes going 50/50 on tarmac and gravel. Upgraded from 38 to 45 mm in september and cant exactly tell who is faster on what. One day I went one of these roads on 56 mm fullsuspension mtb (both bikes are the same weight, ca 11,7 kg), that felt faster going down on gravel while I actually was at least 1 km/h slower (but the gearing was lighter).
A significant diffference between 38 and 45 was the pathchoice. On 38 I avoided gravel as often I could, and tried to go on the dirtpart of the road. On 45 that was less important. When the gravel was really much and loose the 56 climbed better and felt safer descending.
On Tarmac its hard to tell. On day I was on tarmac with little tyrepressure on 45 and that day was really slow , another day I pumped it up a bit too much and was able to match my fastest ride on a 5 km long tarmac-Strava segment on the 38 mm..
I dont know which is the faster on mixed surface, but maybe the 38? But the feel of the ride is different, the 38 is less comfort and more shattering on category 2 gravel (defined by silca photo). On gravel I usually have my 3 cm lefty damper in active position. On Tarmac some days active, some days stiff.
Both 38 and 45 are good compromises for gravel and tarmac, but the 45 feels better descending on gravel. It feels better, but I cant tell if the speed is different. I do not have powermeter or speedometer, only Strava-data.
Gravel pros might have different considerations to the rest of us. I went with 40mm Pirelli gravel M for what seemed like a good compromise for all the conditions I ride at the time. I would go 45 next time, speed being less a concern than a smoother ride and better grip and control.
If I’m going to be spending majority of time on road I use my 45mm Cinturato M. If I’m going to be spending majority of time on dirt, especially single track, then I use my 2.1” Continental Rubans. My “gravel bike” is also a full rigid XC bike (used to have 100mm Fox 32SC) with flat bar and dropper.
50mm is pretty much 2”. If we’re talking about 2” tyres and I note the front suspension on that Canyon, is this, not now, a mountain bike?
Does it matter what do we call it? If it does it job,I personally couldnt care less if its labelled as mountain bike, or gravel bike, its a bike and I want it to go fast
@@22Jeffers dropbar mtb=best gravel bike.
Guess how MTB became a thing
who'd have thought.... almost like MTB's went through the exact same process from road bike to what we have now.
That’s clever. Just like putting wide tires on F1 cars basically makes them into an F150 truck. Because same tire width, duh.
One thing that wasn’t mentioned here regarding tire clearance, the option to run 650’s. I am running the 650x50 cinturato on my 3T. Looks awesome, feels even better. I can also switch to a 700x42 wheelset if the conditions are mellower.
2.35" on my mountain bike - it rolls fantastic on road (Bontrager Mount St Anne tires)
Crushed limestone surface where we’re located. Super smooth and preferable to a pothole laden tarmac. 45’s are perfect.
I’m going to say my experience reflects these findings: not much difference in speed between tyre sizes out there in the wild.
I run 38s and 47s (650b) on a couple of titanium Ribble CGRs I have (loved the first one so much I bought a second - so I can have both hardcore gravel & road - any road - setups) and 40s on a Canyon Grail I have had for a year now.
At 68kg on a 12 kg bike (tools and water bottles exist in the real world) I can bang over most terrain with no fear for my rims with 30f & 32r in PSI.
I prefer the 47s for the really rough stuff, but part of that is XTR MTB rims and a Lauf fork, which make the bunnyhops much better. From a speed perspective I’ve knocked off plenty of PRs & KOMs on each setup on all types of surfaces. It’s really about the legs on the day much more than tyre or bike choice.
The best thing about a gravel bike is that it is offering me a similar road-bike responsivness and agility on tarmac roads and the possibility to ride gravel sections and trails without riding like on eggs. I think that was the initial idea of a gravel bike. Having a bike that can do it all without compromizing too much in either direction. The best tyre for that use to me is a 37-40 mm tyre. Everything wider then 40 slows you down a lot on tarmac and everything narrower then 37 mm is way more uncomfortable and difficult to ride on gravel and trails.
I just did a gravel ride in Kansas yesterday on 50s. But really what I wanted come here to comment was our temperature was 33 and seeing you in jackets and full legs was quite a difference.
I've ran everything from 38 to 45's on my new Grail. The fastest tire I've ran is the Extralight Rene Hearse Snoqualimie 44. We don't have much sharp stuff here in Michigan so I don't worry about flats like you would have to out west.
Does a 45 even fit on the grail? I tried or fit a 42 Pathfinder (measured more like 45) on my grail, and it didn't fit in the rear.
How tall is Connor?! Look at time stamp 6:38. Conner and Simmon are next to each other sitting on their bikes and Connor looks like a giant! Holy cow. Thanks for the gravel tire testing. I run 40s. Might give 45s a try.
204 cm. In other words, the tallest professional rider ever.
I thought this as well, but I think Connor is also on a slight slope which makes him look even bigger 😂
Thought the same! I thought they were pulling a funny!
😂
I am riding that exact same Pirelli Cinturato Gravel M in size 45mm. I find it well rolling tire that can do hard terrain also. I have done +200km on tarmac with those and also mtb-like paths with rocks. Could be wider but couldn't be narrower. On tarmac that tire is still rather fast and comfortable.
I think your time differences can be easily explained by the suspension fork. Without the front suspension the tire width and dampening has more impact on the speed of the bike than on the one with front suspension. Hence much closer times and faster overall speed (pushing 50W less too)
Oh shot, just saw that everyone realized this already, oh well, good video and You got me to comment, well done guys 😂
These bikes are getting closer and closer to my hard tail XC bike from 15 years ago. I converted my hard tail to a 8kg rigid training bike when full suspension XC bikes got light enough and it is still my favourite bike.ive always run 2.1” tyres on it, which is pretty much what these gravel bikes are without drop bars.
I have two set of wheels for my gravel bike, one set for slicks for road duty with is 90% of my riding. The other set is for rougher roads and gravel.
My slicks are the Rene Herse 700x35 Bon Jon Pass.
The knobby tires are the Rene Herse 700x48 Oracle Ridge.
I running both sets of tires with TPU tubes (Tubolito X-city tubes), helping keeping the tires light weight. I set the pressure to what the Wolf Tooth Tire inflation App, suggests. The 35mm tires are smooth but are the faster of the two sets. The 48 mm tires are smoother. I’ve used wider knobby tires for road rides, because they are more comfortable, They both are really great.
In response to the GCN Video - I think the right tire is determined by road/trail surface. I ride 90% paved roads (commuting), so the slicks are on my gravel bike 90% of the time. GCN need to go back and try the same sized slicks and knobbies on that trail and see if that makes a difference. I’d like to see a mixed surface test with paved roads mixed in.
The largest tire my frame will accept is 50mm but Rene Herse doesn’t offer a 50mm tire.
I love my Rene Herse 700C x 44 Snoqualmie Pass TC semi-slick Tires. I may change to the 700C X 44 Manastash Ridge TC knobby tires soon. They are supposed to be just as fast. If I could go 48 I would. Rene tires have wonderfully supple side walls for great rolling.
Rene Herse 700C x 48 Hatcher Pass is pretty close to 50. I run these on my Ti bike, smooth as butter on rough roads.
I don’t want to be negative - but. Track pumps are always ALWAYS away off on their pressure reading. Worth double checking with a digital gauge like the Topeak D2. My past three track pumps have all been more than 8psi high at 60psi.
They are repeatable though, which is more important for a test like this than having a marginally wrong pressure.
You can't forget the clearance issue, or just gloss over it. My mixed surface rides almost never have the thick red clay that grabs the tread unrelentingly.
It's rare that I encounter that kind of mud, but enough of my routes are tarmac/asphalt that I am considering going back from a knobby 45mm, to slicker 40mm. I expect it will be quieter and smoother on the paved surfaces.
I went from 40mm Bontragers to 45mm Pirelli Centurato R. I love them and won't go back, but I may try a different tread pattern--the Ms perhaps. My max clearance is 45mm...
Depends on what the percentage of the race course is on pavement vs. gravel.. And the roughness of the gravel. No one tire can be crowned "the fastest " for all situations. If the course is 70% gravel and 30% pavement, what would you guys choose? Or, maybe , now that you've tested the tires on gravel, go test them on pavement, then a third test on very chunky gravel.. that would be enough information, combined with knowing the percentage of a given race course that is pavement vs gravel or rough gravel, to help your audience make their choice on when to run which tires.. Waiting for your thoughts / or second and third tests.
Swenson rode a 63mm deep rear rim at SBTGRVL with Maxxis slick tires. He ran 2.4" MTB tires at Leadville, that equate to 61mm, but that was on an MTB with drop bars. Hardly a gravel tire or race.
We should really look at what MvDP is using if we want to know what the fastest do. 🌈🏆🥇
@@Rob6020 huh? that was the B-side of the World Road Race championship! Strade Bianchi and Paris Roubaix were more gravel than that joke of a World's gravel course.
Maybe I missed it, but a discussion on the width of the tyre to the wheel is warranted for aerodynamics. Plus the effect of inserts and going at even lower pressures. Also of note: European gravel is about going as fast as possible over moderate stuff (thus narrower tyres); American gravel is about going hard and needing real protection over gnarly terrain (thus super wide tyres) - both interesting in their own way!
I ride 35mm gravelking tyres and ride is both good for rolling along roads and adequate on gravel. My bike came with 40mm fitted and riding on the road was like cycling in treacle
I run 50mm tires on mine, though they don't have much tread. One of my regular routes goes over a trail with some pretty loose gravel and the tires hold up pretty well. Schwalbe has a 50-584 studded tire that I'm looking at for winter.
Need to test on road too. In the U.K. at least gravel rides will have substantial road sections. In my experience anything over 43 is like pedalling through treacle on tarmac.
Feeling and reality are often quite disconnected...
@@jameseastwood402 …yet easily confirmed by looking at segment times vs RPE.
@@nstrug not confirmed by actual rolling resistance and aerodynamic testing though. Give the latest escape collective nerd alert podcast with Dylan Johnson a listen.
@@jameseastwood402 do you honestly think a 50mm knobbly at 25psi has the same rolling resistance on tarmac as a 40mm at say 35psi? Ever ridden an MTB on the road?
@@jameseastwood402 I assume you’re talking about where Dylan Johnson is speaking at 8:30 in the podcast. He’s talking about performance of off road tyres on gravel, not on tarmac.
I’m lucky enough to have a few wheel sets and plenty of clearance for larger tires on my gravel bikes. #1 Gravel bikes started coming with wider rims a few years ago but I went wider. My internal widths are 26.6mm, 28mm and 30mm. #2 Even narrow 36mm tires can fit wide rims. #3 My tires that I have chosen for my trails are 45c Kenda Alluvium, 45c Schwalbe Bite and Ultra-Bite and 36mm Challenge Strada Bianca for road. My trail wheels all have Cushcore gravel and one has the Tannus Armor Lite insert. All tubeless of course. I’m 150# 68kg and I can use tire pressure at 20psi without issues when needed. I usually use at 25 or 30PSI
I've got a 50 mm on the front and 40 mm on the back, so i guess i average out at 45! But more seriously this width-mullet approach has worked really well.
I've got 50 mm on the front wheel of my mountain bike, and a 45mm on the back, Purely by accident, the back tyre needed changing and I used a spare tyre that I already had. The set-up with a larger tyre on the front and the smaller one on the back seems to work ok, the bike feels good.
I'll be sticking with what I have. I got 47's on my 650 b's, and then I have 38's on my 700c. Really it's more because that's what I already have, and it works fine for me. The 47s on the 650s I've been using for cyclocross racing anyways, and the 38s I've actually been using more Road riding this fall.
I finally get the point of the video: wider tyres "make you go faster" because they absorb vibrations, and it's the thread patterns and pressure what makes you slower/faster.
Maybe true for that specific gravel road, but wider tyres will always make more friction with the floor, and lower pressure will always make even more friction with the floor... More friction with the floor makes you slower period.
I run slick 38mm tyres at very high pressure on my bike because I know that narrow tyres do make me lighter than wide tyres on tarmac, while they are still wide enough to work on any gravel road when it's dry.
Thread patterns effect the speed the most. On that we do agree... I would not run knobby tyres if I ever wanted to ride on tarmac at any point in my ride because that's where I need to go faster in a real life situation because cars don't have mercy of me.
Maybe I would not win a race against you on your specific gravel road... For that I would want to run thick knobby tyres.
In conclusion: if you run slicks, 40mm or less. And if you run knobbies, 45mm or more. But the ones are for the roads, and the others are for the gravel. And you have to pick one or the other!
Exceedingly thick tyres are not good for anything though when I was new to bikes I remember having big tyres because they looked cooler but in reality I do most of my riding on the road because ...... it's still a rigid bike...
Great video and analysis. I plan to bump up my tires from a size 42mm to 45mm and see how it goes.
I run 38mm and am 120kg. Am mostly ok for comfort, but my Giant Revolt has a 'flip chip' (extends the wheel base by moving the rear axle backwards a few mm) that meams I could go up to 53mm if I should want to. On the basis of this experiment, sounds much more like comfort and confidence is key. As with most things gravel...
Very interesting comp. I think there is no 1 clear answer , everything depends on many factors so it could be 40 or 50 and if you want a optimal compromize chose 45.
I live in an area where there are more single track routes designed for light mountain biking than gravel routes, so yes, wider is better for me. 50mm would be great, maybe even 60mm. I went to an XC mountain bike for this reason but I'm so used to underbiking the trails that I'm having a hard time adjusting to the suspension fork. I may just go ridged at some point, but I do love the wider tires I get with an xc.
Not sure how long the test track was here, but a big factor over longer distances is the fatiguing effect of the vibration on your muscles. That 'smoothness' that Si described could, in an endurance race, make a far greater difference than rolling resistance.
6:50 Si does look tiny
To say tiny is very diplomatic... 😂
He looks like Frodo on a bike 😂
Thought the exact same, some very weird optics as even the wheels on Si's bike look much smaller (tyres could be helping that though)
6:50 Literally looks like a dad and his son 😂
Especially since Si is 1.84m which is not small at all. Conclusion: Connor is a giant :D The positioning on the bike does the rest I guess haha.
😂 yeah, Si looks like a Borrower next to Conor
Great review. It would have been interesting to measure each wheel set mounted to confirm actual width. I have 19mm rim and with 45mm tyres, they measure at 43.5mm. I believe with the 50mm tyre and your 23mm internal rim, you were not 50mm. I suspect less. Next video would be what internal rim width do you need to get the tyre size you purchased: 40, 45, ad 50mm. I appreciate your content. Keep it coming.
I have a Grizl. Came with 45 , then went to 35 to take it more on roads and commute. Then came back to 45. It’s been a blast
Thanks for sharing the experience!
Live in the midwest, USA. Have only used 38mm, they work just fine.
I know this may be a controversial comment... but i don't get the point of putting wider and wider tyres on a gravel bike. From my knowledge, (and may i say a very limited one at that) I was under the impression that a gravel bike was a road bike with that added extra grip incase you wanted to do a little bit of off-road during your ride. If the whole idea of getting wider tyres 45+ to 60s is to ride on just gravel and dirt, then why not just use a Mountain bike? It just appears the original gravel bike is morphing into a mountain bike which we already had... so whats the point? 🤷🏼♂️
gravel or mtb might go down as the longest debate in human history -- fun stuff. 1. ride whatever you prefer, nor right/wrong way to do it. 2. If you ride 20km+ to or from the dirt -- or even between the dirt -- put drops on that bike; if you drive to the dirt put flat bar. everything else is relative. the frames/componets, etc are all smashing together in various combo... so look at the routes and choose bar appropriately. And then call it whatever you want... cross, gravel, monster cross, XC...
simply put .... it feels so much different than a mountain bike ... and as long as you don't go too much on single tracks the gravel bike is better suited to gravel than mtb's
Fro me, gravel rides are when the distance is still the main challenge, MTB rides are where the terrain takes the foreground. You can tackle pretty rough surfaces on a gravel bike, as long as they are consistent, for ever changing conditions and tight trails, an MTB is the better choice.
The short answer is aerodynamics. There is quite a range of what is called a “gravel” race but for many of the classic Midwest-USA races a gravel bike with extremely wide tires is the fastest bike to race.
But the wider tires appear to be actually faster since rolling resistance is lower on wider mountain bike tires because they can use less material in the sidewall for the same amount of puncture protection (volume gives its own puncture protection).
Dylan Johnson was testing 2.1in MTB race tires (I think, it may have even been 2.3) and they were consistently testing faster than 40mm and 45mm race gravel tires. (This is for races that are 80%+ gravel.)
Flying Stick : Right of Screen 2m29
A flying stick was thrown from the right hand side of the screen. Yet both ‘actors’ carried on professionally 😂
Later on ‘sticks’ were mentioned. What’s the secret sauce?!
Coming from Mtb I found larger tires better as it got muddier, rooty & rocky. Whilst with roots & rocks, a full suspension was always faster.
My Orbea can take upto 48mm. I had enjoyed 35mm tires on it, going on the roads. Nothing beats this comfort. The problem is that it’s not great for club rides. It leads to slightly slower speeds & more watt power.
Alright, I was thinking of going up to a 50, and now I definitely will- thanks for the test!
Width isn't the only factor, side wall compliance and profile also matter and of course pressure and also roughness of the underground. Tubes or Tubeless too. Width is just part of the mix.
agreed. all the hysteresis chat on road tyres, how would gravel Tues be any difference? going 50mm I'm going conti Race-king black chili for that exact reason
I run the Cinturato M 50mm and it's a heavier tire..+650grams borderline xc mtb tire heavy. I noticed it quite a bit coming from a 44mm WTB Raddler (Which btw I believe is the best all around gravel tire on the market)...my times are slightly slower now on the gravel m..but! Its an awesome tire, this thing is grippy on dirt and road. My descent times are way better on the Gravel M 50mm...and it feels like an MTB grippy tire when you need it and a solid overall road tire when you want it.
Fun video. Would be interesting to see a part 2 where the different Tyre widths are used on technical terrain. Or with an accelerometer to measure vibrations. :)
Great video. It’s just crazy complicated in pressure. In a big believer in big tyres. But you have to drop the pressure for more deflection in the bigger tires or you might as well run the narrower tyre
I ride 35s-42s on my road bike. 45-2.2 on my gravel. 2.6 - 2.7 on my mtb. Road and gravel, no loss of any speed with wider tires; more comfortable and more control. Win-Win. Also, I don't compete and ride for the enjoyment so I'm far less concerned about things like marginal gains. Comfort and control first though speed not unimportant.
I can only run a 42 in the rear and run a 50 up front max. Currently on 40 front and 38 rear. Insanely better than the 32's it came with (cyclocross bike). Im around 190-200lbs. Next im gonna try 50 up front and max out the back with a 40 or 42 if i can find one. I think for bigger riders the tire size has a much bigger affect on the ride as the overall force is greater.
The minute differences between runs and the fact that they came to different results makes me very comfortable, saying that there is no realistic speed difference between the three tires
Glad to hear that you guys are enjoying your late 90s MTBs in carbon with curly bars, you should try a modern XC MTB with flat bar and those tyres 😛
The trends towards wider tires on road bikes and on gravel bikes occured almost simultaneously, but people shouldn't be mistaken in assuming they're for the same reason. On road bikes it's empirically proven to reduce rolling resistance, but on gravel bikes it's mostly a capability and comfort kind of thing. People don't care about gaining 5 watts or losing
Actually it's also more efficient (faster) - see Dylan Johnson's comments about this.
How long before gravel bikes morph into mountain bikes and we need a new revolutionary category to fill the ever widening gap between them and road bikes?
Flat bar gravel bikes with aerobars are the final destination. If it's smooth, you should be either in the aerobars or sitting upright drafting or in a tail wind. If it's rough, you're faster on a flat bar for more control and you don't need aero/narrow anything because you're going way slower on rough ground. I've tested it out and it's way faster on the the same courses.
I honestly wonder if we will see the return of the 80mm travel fork for gravel. Will gravel bikes look more like XC race bikes, but with drop bars?
I think it does depend on your bike or at least the one you are using. Personally I’m not a quick cyclist but I do put out a fair bit of power, the 45mm tyres are probably a safe option for most of us. I think unless you decide to have a custom bike it will have to be a decision you go with and stick by. Good tyres are important too so don’t overlook them.
I've been running Pirelli Cinturato M 50mm on 650b since the spring. Weather this year has been pretty bad, so I've never felt there was a good time to swap out to my narrower rubber. I've done several Glorious Gravel races. The 50mm tyre has been slower on the road sections, I have to put in more effort to cruise in the pack I'm in on tarmac. But the gravel sections (UK, so gravel = mud) it's been more comfortable with more confidence and I normally make big gains on other riders. And a couple of the races were atrocious weather, bad enough for XC MTBs to be competitive, and having tractor wheels gave me a massive advantage. I'm actually wondering if I can fit some 2.1" x 27.5" MTB mud spikes for the winter...
At this moment, I’m running 50 maxes ramblers. I have ran pathfinders 42 WTB 45. maxes or game changer I’ll probably won’t ever go back 50s to me seem to be the sweet spot.