As for pickups I instantly thought about harpeji. It has separate pickups for each string and it's theoretically possible to make the system where only pickups at the front are active.
Yeah, had the same thought, but then if the neck is in a constantly spinning mode for mad open-chord arpeggio, the strings would intermittently cut off. Maybe it's a good compromise regardless?
@MattiasKrantzshorts that kind of content is totally in his wheelhouse. With a little persistence I feel like it could be possible. It seems like an everybody wins kind of prospect.
No matter what direction he takes with this thing, it's going to be a monster. I am now heavily invested in the development of this ridiculous cylindrical instrument.
When it comes to playing this thing, GIVE IT TO ROB SCALLON! He can play anything, especially if it has strings. He will make masterpieces. You won't regret it brother
@connyconiglione I'll admit Rob may have fallen off from his older content. But he's made some amazing work with a bunch of wacky instruments. I know he's a good musician, regardless. I think every guitar youtuber should get a crack at this. They've done contests like that in the past 🤷🏼♂️
I haven't read all the comments, so this might have already been suggested. You could play it in a horizontal configuration like a lap steel guitar. That in combination with a slide like others have said would probably be the most "practical" application. This is legendary!
I had a similar thought as yourself, you could also add a pedal to rotate it so your hands are free to play or a cover like on a P bass that goes over the strings to rest your hand on and if it was on good bearings, you cold spin it with a finger not being used, like with the pinky/little finger.
A piano has a pedal that mutes the strings except the ones played. A piece of wood with felt. There could be a c shape that rests on the strings not facing forward. And a c shape pickup that only amplifies the strings facing forward. Keep innovating!
I could imagine using a violin bow on the "strum" side and a slide on the "fret" side, and then tuning the whole thing to an open chord while it rotates. All of the actual string vibration would be generated by a combination of the rotation of the device + movement of the violin bow.
Looks awesome already! I figure putting it in an open tuning might work quite well. When trying to grip the neck or when rotating it will probably cause a lot of unwanted strings to vibrate, in an open tuning those will sound well at least. And you can worry about only fretting one side then. Which makes me think, I'd kill for a collab with Rob Scallon for this guitar. Feels like he would have a blast playing it, and you two sitting down and just talking about the quirks of this thing fits perfectly for his "unusual instrument" type videos. Either way, I'm looking forward to main channel video once this project is done.
@@mentox6592 If Rob is interested I would not have problem flying with it to him or he come here. Not sure how easily this pass the flight check though, the gatlin gun design already coming back to bite us!
I reckon that the most viable option to have this idea actually work would be to have the strings attached at either end of some carbon fiber reinforced slats that are able to be driven around a track that is within the neck of the instrument - the idea being that the front face is relatively flat but inside the neck the individual parts fold up to fit that surface area within a smaller volume of space, so the nut and bridge parts are almost like links in a chain driven by motors at each end. The hope is that the two ends can be precisely geared up to compensate for the difference in diameter, as well as the carbon rods being able to handle the string tension without warping
Is it gonna be better than a guitar, of course not but what makes this great is that it is outside the box, invententive and bold. Without adventurous experimentation we would'nt have half of the amazing stuff we have in the world. Keep expressing and never stop ;)
I have a few ideas: I think it would be very uncomfortable to spin de neck with your hands while playing, so you could have a pedal that makes it spin. Also the strings could be tunned in a way they make a minor chord and you could have a moving capo between frets, and maybe this capo have a way to change a little bit so it makes a major chord. Ive got this idea because i tought it would be very cool to just make spin the cilinder and keep the pick in the same place while it spins making a chord.
Mattias, what a stellar imaginative inventor! you seem to be able to build anything that you abstract in your mind's eye. I enjoyed trying to play it in my mind too; however, my conclusions were: 1) Get rid of the strings, this thing has the potential to add multiple new and unexpected dimensions to creating and performing music. The strings are going to act as a boat-anchor preventing this thing from soaring. 2) replace the archaic Pythagorean strings with the best available 3D (4D?) sliding and pressure sensitive midi sensors. They could wrap around the cylinder, 360 degrees, head to "bridge", and while you're at it invent some new approaches to touch sensors with feedback (the playing surface should feel alive). 3) Make the cylinder small enough that it feels good and cover the back side in a "half" canopy, such that the grip on the back of the canopy "feels" like a conventional guitar neck (don't forget keyboard players). (like a hollowed-out guitar neck with the spinning cylinder in it) Additionally, the "C" shaped canopy protects the sensors on the "back" side of the neck from accidentally being activated and gives the player different degrees of grip and compression. and 4) as others have suggested, spin using a servo motor controlled by a "WahWah" pedal, where the cylinder can rotate CW and CCW at different angular velocities and accelerations making changes in a microsecond. The advantage of your invention is that the musician-performer can add several new multidimensional spaces of emotions and aboriginal expressions, many of which have not even been discovered or fully exploited yet. Keep inventing, creating, and building!!!
I literally just got the notification for this video. I'd forgotten this channel even existed. Seeing this creation out of any sort of context is so bizarre. I love it.
Hello, this seems like a very interesting idea and I'm all in for it. I will have some recommendations on the design, dont know if you already have similar plans but I think that few of the "must-have"s for this type of thing would be: 1- Most important of all a motor, which I assume you will attach later, but it should have a way to stay locked so that the neck actually does not turn whatsoever. 2-For the problem of hitting the strings in the back, the first thing came to my mind is to switch the back half of the strings when not in use. Because when you don't do that, it will probably touch somewhere else and if not from your fingers, there will definitely be a noise. This would be an addition later on the project though, you could have modes where you switch a particular portion of the strings off depending on your needs. For this to be easy enough there should be a way to locate the spindle though, so that you can program it to switch on and off the frets that face forwards as you turn it automatically. This way you could turn it anyway you want and still have just the specific pickups running. I think those would be the most essential additions right now, good luck!
If you are planning on primarily playing chords on it, you can have the strings tuned to C Maj (No sharps or flats) and have buttons which fret the needed sharps/flats of other keys. Or if you keep it entirely chromatic, you can use buttons like an Autoharp which silence strings that aren't part of the key you want. You can still stop the guitar wherever and fret what you need
Could move in a direction akin to a futuristic hurdy gurdy, develop a chassis with an external key system played in the left hand while the right hand could drive rotation and elevation of the cylindrical fretboard within the chassis. Wild work, dont lose hope!
As far as something that could be used to move up and down the neck, shamisen players use a thing called a yubisuri. Its a finger sleeve that reduces friction on your fretting hand. it covers the space between your thumb and index while allowing your other fingers to be free. But i dont know if it'll completely noiseless unless you have something that dampens the strings. But i would probably make a second neck just to rest my thumb on that doesnt touch the other strings.
To utilise the spinning function while also playing, you won't be able to to press down on notes anyway. You could however use a slide to change pitch. And use a violin bow to sound the strings. You would have to tune the stings to an open chord, and play with your left hand hovering over the top like a lap steel guitar. This way you would genuinly have a unique and usable instrument.
I wish this was an instrument that had existed for a long while, because I think it would look and sound so cool with a professional trained on it playing it! I think they'd use a bow, though 😝
@@theothertonydutch I think it would probably need to be taller to have been made in the past - like a standing bass so that it would be easier to reach all around it with your bow and a sturdy stand so that you don't need to grasp the other side. If it stayed roughly this size, the fictional historic version would be best held like a violin with the motor controls on the chin rest. Writing pieces for it probably would be painful 😛
Step 1: fix a bow or a stationary pick to the body so that as the neck rotates, the strings are plucked by the pick or scrape against the bow. Step 2: fix a rod parallel to the neck and attach a guitar finger sleeve to the rod, fashioning it so that the finger sleeve can slide up and down against the strings as they spin. Step 3: connect a hand crank to the neck. You turn the crank with your right hand and fret the strings with the finger sleeve on your left hand, and the rotation automatically picks against the mounted pick (or bow).
I had this idea 20 years ago but I was coming at it from an upwright bass perspective. I believe it is an awesome idea! My idea was to have a fixed thumb sled on the back of neck that would raise it off the strings but allow full range up and down the neck.the sled would be kind of like a train on a track concept.I was also thinking foot pedal with variable speed forward and reverse to spin the neck. Keep going ,keep experimenting .this will be awesome!
I think the strings need to be horizontal or better yet, at a downward angle - and fretless. This way the notes will sound different as the cylinder turns and the fingers can fret the notes while the cylinder moves in a horizontal direction. Having the string perpendicular to the direction of spinning isn’t going to work - but changing the direction of the strings and removing the frets will totally work!
I think a back cover on the neck would be a good addition, having it connecting from the body to the top of the neck, preferably made of something light like carbon fibre. I’m almost imagining it’s use as a chapman stick mixed with the spinning mechanism of a hurdy gurdy. In that vein, I also suggest a wheel or turning handle with a brake system that can both stop the neck from spinning and lock it in place where needed, like if you wanted to use it like a normal guitar. It could also help to have adjustable resistance on the spinning so it can be more or less difficult to spin depending on what you want.
Electronically only enable the pickups you play with based on rotation position, so your thumb can rest on the string with pickups disabled for that string. Or just have pickups only on one side
would it ruin the vision adding like a neck-rail sorta thing that helps you hold it? 1:06 yep, that yeah, stretching will probably be a problem, but at least holding should be easier also cylinder is the best
No it could be fully hidden for the viewer. However making it rigid enough could be issue, but it also increase how much you need to stretch fingers to play which is probably the biggest issue🤔
@@MattiasKrantzshorts that's true, for rigidity is there a way to have it connected to the end of the neck (after the strings (unless they stretch across)) with like a ball bearing ring that still allows it to rotate but also lets you hold it?
You could fret it like crazy when it's not spinning or spinning slowly but you will need to engineer a sliding capo like on a Steinberger but with string side rollers for speed spinning. Spinning will also add centrifugal effect to dampen vibration. Many problems to solve but I applaud the innovative creativity. Salute!
Pickups should be switched on/off according to rotation. Off when in back (removing unintended sound from touching back-side strings). On when in front. Could be pretty easy to implement.
Awesome video! I haven't seen this project before, and my immediate thought was that it could be played similar to a lap-steel guitar, where you sit with it on your lap or on a stand. Obviously it would need to freely rotate, but I think it could work. Have you considered using a mechanism that locks each segment of the fretboard into place, but in a way that it can be turned to the next setting with a little bit of force? It could be a toggle where you can make it freely spin, or switch into the locked one - similar to how some house wheels have toggles for click scrolling and free scrolling. Another thought - let's get Rob Scallon to play this thing ASAP!
I'm not an engineer at all, but since it looks like you have individual pickups you could have every pickup go to an electromechanical rotary switch so that the strings on the back are always muted, but it would probably be impossible without a redesign and it might not be the most reliable. Just an idea
What will you do about the pickups? I suppose they will be stationary and facing the strings you play, but where will you put them? And how you wil manage the cables, since this whole thing is rotating
The plank idea could work. Try making it the whole length of the guitar and then attaching it with L brackets to the top and bottom connecting to a rod going through some skateboard bearings. It’ll definitely add to the thickness but it’ll spin! You could also remove some strings to make it thinner to accommodate the plank.
The hand rest idea sounds good, but the foam or fabric cloth will drag. Or you could have something which activates the pickup one string at a time. So your footswitch to rotate the thing will step through each string in turn (one foot press = next string [clockwise or anticlockwise setting too]). THis is so cool, would love to see this work.
I still think playing it in the lap like a slide guitar (maybe not directly in the lap if the back's open, but in that flat-down position) is going to be most comfortable for playing it as it is, especially since you can keep it spinning without having your fretting hand getting pulled around. Also the cylinder neck definitely is too cool to pass up on, even if there are more "practical" shapes
Maybe just have another neck for the guitar that's ofc not attached to the strings, just kinda separately there, like one of those rollers with a handle except without the handle yknow? It should probably help with stability if it's an issue. Also maybe have the neck thin enough so that you don't have to wrap your hand around it too much. That way it can act as a guide for your hand just to prevent you from having to lift it trying to prevent unintentional noise.
Amazing stuff! 👍 If you rotated JUST the neck core and frets, but have the strings fixed, it would auto-bow like a cello when you pressed a string against the (motorised) rotating fret... Then you could have a rear surface for the thumb, rotating fretboard in the middle, and some strings on the front.
So basically a gatling guitar. The problem with playing it will be while it's spinning with respect to the fretting hand. It might be doable with a slide/bottle neck if you mute at the nut with some fabric. A more purpose built solution might be a moveable ring around the whole neck circumference that would act as a slide (basically an inside out fret) , which given a sufficiently hard material and adequate contact could stop the string (muting may still be needed at nut). the ring might be hard to move while spinning or may wear itself or strings, and a ball bearing is a possible solution (like if you could just hold the bearing stationary while the neck spun inside it ).
Tony Levin Funk Fingers maybe the route for this. I think solving the problem that the original design has created is your amazing USP. Designing solutions for the design yet maintaining the original concept. Just as a "thing" this is pure art.
maybe instead of rectangular neck, there could be a rectangular frame for the pickups, 1 on each side under the strings, and you can then activate/deactivate your pickups individually. That way you can have just the front pickup for traditional play, but if you want to enable a rear pickup for thumb fretting, you could do that too.
I'm not exactly sure what the most effective way to play it would be either, but I think the idea is neat as hell regardless. A couple thoughts for you... For one, there's no hard and fast rule saying it has to be rotating at all times, you could have it where it snaps into 3 or 4 or so various different positions to like switch between bass vs guitar mode. Also, as others have suggested, perhaps you could play it with a bow, but that almost suggests it might be better without the frets if played with a bow. Another thought, there's nothing mandatory about the order of the strings, you could experiment with other string orders like interleaving low/high/low/high strings pre-tuned to play different chords when turned into different positions. Just my 3 cents on it, I wish you all the best and hope to see you play that bad boy one day!
I think it would be cool to put a pickup over top of the cylinder, so that only a selection of the strings are amplified at a time (something that looks like the cover on an old P Bass), or possibly two or three that you could select based on where you're playing things (on/off switch for each pickup)? Like, if you're playing bass with your thumb, and some higher stuff on the opposite side, it could be cool to have a split pickup sort of thing where it's the top and bottom (ish) rather than the usual playing portion of a guitar being amplified. Plus, if the pickup is stationary while the neck moves, you could get a really interesting Leslie effect by playing open strings and spinning the neck. That could be cool too.
Trying to give you a constructive criticism: I think this looks as beautiful as sadly useless now. Probably you should rebuild it with fix strings and an empty space for the thumb (scrap the bass for now or just use less strings) only Then you make the inner part spin and play it in a more similar way as an hurdy gurdy, no need to use the right hand to pick the strings or anything (could be used to spin manually or operate the velocity of the motor). Just an idea on what i would do with it, hope you get the right inspiration and finish this project!
What if you used a circular capo that would be designed similarly to a barbell collar? You could adjust it relatively easily and with the right tuning the guitar could work as an arpeggiator at the very least. If you could somehow make a slide that worked across the circumference of the neck then it might work well as a slide guitar in a a similar arpeggiator type way.
An idea to limit the noise from the strings round the back. If you're mounting a pickup under each string then you could have a rotary contact just like an electric motor. This would make it so that only the front strings are in use. As the neck rotates one string turns on as another turns off. You could connect all the ground wires together and have the live wires going to thin conductive strips around the main rotor with a brush to pick up the signals resulting them effectively being connected in parallel. It might sound a bit crackly but all the other strings would be muted.
Give it to Charles Berthoud. The guy needs a challenge. He'll probably make a video like "three Taylor Swift hits in the style of Tool all at once on one instrument" and the hardest part for him will be not to look bored. :-D
You could build a device that wraps around the fret board, and holds frets. Then spin it to pick the notes. Also you can use an open tuning on the strings to make it more functional. I doubt you could play it while spinning by hand though.
Honestly I would try and add a small frame to house where you.can lean the instrument against your body and play it upright like a cello. You might have to have some tension so The rotation axis will spin easy still yet won’t slip while playing. The other way is continuing the piano style and have hammers for taping each fret and making its mechanical assist guitar. Or maybe a hurdy gurdy approach
Make a sliding capo that can wrap around the whole thing, possibly like a spider capo? where you can hold and release specific strings on the fly. Could have it to where it can let the string be open, fretted, or dampened/muted?
A sliding thumb rest? A bar from the body that then loops and attaches at the top of the neck. It's grooved to allow the thumb rest to slide. Also a stepper motor attached to let's say a sewing machine pedal to rotate it.
If you do want the pickup to only affect the forward facing strings, could you mount it the inside of a plate attached to the body that stays static.... think like Rickenbacker bridge PU plate that goes over the strings?
The Gattling Axe, with a half guard running through the back of the neck & sensors that allow only the exposed part of the neck to be active when in use
The thumb thing is easy to overcome. String and tune it in octaves so the strings on the exact opposite sides are octave notes. Then play both strings at the same time as you roll around the cylinder.
Looks like it could be used as a slide guitar, use like a brass/glass slide to fret it while it spin. Set it in an open tuning and maybe use a sustainer/ebow too?
Im kind of hoping the pickup will be stationary while the strings spin over/under it so I can hear what it sounds like when the string isn't fixed above it.
If you don't have a rest or block on the neck itself to separate your left hand from the strings, I'd suggest a thin leather/pleather glove with the thumb covered but the other four fingers removed. The leather should greatly reduce friction on your hand, but the fingers would have full range of movement.
I suggest that you use your LH thumb to fret notes on the backside of the neck as your fingers fret notes on the front side. You could probably make some nice counterpoint that way.
I was looking at it imagining it in an open tuning and fretting it with some kind of circular capo you can move around it and then having a something of a pick fixed somewhere so it'll just pick the strings as you rotate it.
Or actually a second probably better idea would be a capo like thing with handles like a a pair of pliers you can grab and fret the neck at any position with so you can turn the entire thing with left hand and pick the notes however with you like right hand.
For some reason I imagine putting it on some kind of almost motorised sewing wheel. Where you use pedal to turn it around while having both hands free to press on the frets and play.
Fun project! Here is my 2 cents :) Since this obviously is not playable (in rotation mode) using the traditional "finger pressing against fetboard approach" of the guitar neck, i suggest several stationary bows and picks to interact with the strings when in rotation mode. And do the fretting action on the rotating neck with a metal device like a slide. You could have "slides" on several fingers to trigger several notes at the same time making chords.
Thanks! I am shure Mattias will see this. And, yes, from the top of my head this seems like one plausible solution making this a somewhat playable instrument. This is just one of many possible approaches. But i am quite confident it would work if developed and executed correctly @@joshtucker231
I was thinking a redesign might be better... Chain driven ends with a more traditional or even adjustable neck shape.. optional rear guard to allow hand/thumb placement like on a traditional neck..
Yes, that could be. Still redesign is a different path. I was thinking more in the line of how to make an existing design usable by innovating around the obvious limitations of this particular device. If starting from scratch one would most certainly end up with a different design, and most likely other issues. Like the vibrations of a chain, it that good or bad in a project like this? Pickups are sensitive to mechanical noise and vibrations, perhaps this is why we don't see a lot of chaindriven turntables out there. However in brainstorming for a prototype there is really no such thing as a bad idea. Even a really poor suggestion can fule development in to new directions :) @@evansmusic2009
I would take a bar of steel and run it from the body to the head. Attach it to the head with a bearing so that it can’t bend and impact or impede the spinning. This will be on the bottom so that you can brace your thumb against it like a regular guitar. Then you just fret the strings normally. Think of it as if you never change the way you play the guitar, it’s just a normal guitar, but the strings cycle in place. Lift your fingers and rotate the strings, but don’t move your hand (thumb) off the back bar. Also, I loved the idea someone said about using a foot pedal to make it work and control the speed of the spin. Don’t sleep on that. You can use a simple drill motor and a belt system to make it work
that's a COOL idea. Oh the possibilities when playing, you could just roll the next with your fret hand for the worlds longest guitar scale climb 😂 Or even a hollow neck cylindrical acoustic version. Cool stuff, thanks for making it!
What about a flexible sleeve rotating around an oval support? In theory this would make it easier to hold it and to play it still keeping the possibility to smoothly play while rotating
maybe instead of a thiccc set of strings you could have 4 sets of 6 going up and down and up and down, this way you can just use a slide or a bow in your left hand and play arpegios as you spin it (with the right tuning ofc) and whenever you stop spinning and start picking you always have a standard 6 string setup on both sides. also if you are going with an electricaly spinning with a pedal solution you can have a home button on it so the servo spins right back to the standard position
Forgive me if this has already been raised many times already, but were you inspired by Magic Alex and his rotating neck guitar for the Beatles (as seen in the Get Back Peter Jackson film for example)?
Maybe it will be possible to make a rheostat contact arc on the lower neck joint. I mean when you turn it, only strings on the front neck( which are in use) will transmit the signal.
could some kind of ratcheting mechanism maybe raise and lower foam pads near the bridge to mute strings on the unfretted side as the instrument rotates?
stand it upright go 44" scale. it will just stay, contact points from 0-180 so the remain side is deactivated electrically when used electric. perhaps less strings and a tighter radius. you don't need actual fingerboard.. just rings on a threaded center as frets
Maybe there could be push pull selection for z coil or individual string pickups, or buttons, so that all the strings were not ON at the same time, necessarily, but could be?
I think a heptagon profile, with seven radius-ed fretboards, would be kind of cool. I like the idea of an odd number. This could be playable using different playing techniques. Perhaps Rob Scallon could come up with some playing techniques.
Could you add a device that shuts off the other pickups depending on how its rotated? That way you wouldn't have to deal with noise coming from the other strings.
i would make a mute for the strings that arent on the intended playing surface right in front of the bridge (attached to the body). maybe it activates and deactivates when the computer spins, or maybe has a manual release.
It costs 400,000 dollars to play this instrument for 12 seconds
What
yeah it does
@@karolpopiak2031 She weighs one hundred fifty kilograms and requires two hundred dollar custom tool pickups
@@karolpopiak2031 it's a reference to tf2
WHO TOUCHED SASHA?! WHO TOUCHED MY GUITAR?!
As for pickups I instantly thought about harpeji. It has separate pickups for each string and it's theoretically possible to make the system where only pickups at the front are active.
Maybe it would work to put a crescent shaped pickup and suspend it over the cylinder.
The pickups are already done they are just not mounted right now!
Yeah, had the same thought, but then if the neck is in a constantly spinning mode for mad open-chord arpeggio, the strings would intermittently cut off. Maybe it's a good compromise regardless?
A horseshoe like pickup around the barrel seems to me the easiest to make and implement in the design
Like you could do both systems and make it work with a switch
give that guitar to Ichika Nito and he will play the most beautiful you ever heard
I could try to get in contact with him. But youtubers are haaard to get to respond
@MattiasKrantzshorts that kind of content is totally in his wheelhouse. With a little persistence I feel like it could be possible. It seems like an everybody wins kind of prospect.
dude he would love this thing
Yeah that guy plays any weird guitar really well lol!
Fr
No matter what direction he takes with this thing, it's going to be a monster. I am now heavily invested in the development of this ridiculous cylindrical instrument.
When it comes to playing this thing, GIVE IT TO ROB SCALLON! He can play anything, especially if it has strings. He will make masterpieces. You won't regret it brother
lol god no
@connyconiglione I'll admit Rob may have fallen off from his older content. But he's made some amazing work with a bunch of wacky instruments. I know he's a good musician, regardless. I think every guitar youtuber should get a crack at this. They've done contests like that in the past 🤷🏼♂️
I haven't read all the comments, so this might have already been suggested. You could play it in a horizontal configuration like a lap steel guitar. That in combination with a slide like others have said would probably be the most "practical" application. This is legendary!
my exact thoughts
I had a similar thought as yourself, you could also add a pedal to rotate it so your hands are free to play or a cover like on a P bass that goes over the strings to rest your hand on and if it was on good bearings, you cold spin it with a finger not being used, like with the pinky/little finger.
I was thinking the same thing. Maybe playing it like a slide guitar with a pedal to make it spin would be easier
A piano has a pedal that mutes the strings except the ones played. A piece of wood with felt. There could be a c shape that rests on the strings not facing forward. And a c shape pickup that only amplifies the strings facing forward. Keep innovating!
I could imagine using a violin bow on the "strum" side and a slide on the "fret" side, and then tuning the whole thing to an open chord while it rotates.
All of the actual string vibration would be generated by a combination of the rotation of the device + movement of the violin bow.
Looks awesome already!
I figure putting it in an open tuning might work quite well. When trying to grip the neck or when rotating it will probably cause a lot of unwanted strings to vibrate, in an open tuning those will sound well at least. And you can worry about only fretting one side then.
Which makes me think, I'd kill for a collab with Rob Scallon for this guitar. Feels like he would have a blast playing it, and you two sitting down and just talking about the quirks of this thing fits perfectly for his "unusual instrument" type videos.
Either way, I'm looking forward to main channel video once this project is done.
I second the notion of collaborating with Rob Scallon, but that could be hard to arrange because there’s an ocean between them.
@@mentox6592 If Rob is interested I would not have problem flying with it to him or he come here. Not sure how easily this pass the flight check though, the gatlin gun design already coming back to bite us!
I think a bow or slide would work well with open tuning
Rob Scallion collab would be siiiiick
I reckon that the most viable option to have this idea actually work would be to have the strings attached at either end of some carbon fiber reinforced slats that are able to be driven around a track that is within the neck of the instrument - the idea being that the front face is relatively flat but inside the neck the individual parts fold up to fit that surface area within a smaller volume of space, so the nut and bridge parts are almost like links in a chain driven by motors at each end.
The hope is that the two ends can be precisely geared up to compensate for the difference in diameter, as well as the carbon rods being able to handle the string tension without warping
Mattias always makes solutions to roblems nobody ever had. good stuff.
Maybe 3d print a curved slide, instead of fretting the notes
Yes it would be really funny to make some custom accesories. Also the round capo😆
Is it gonna be better than a guitar, of course not but what makes this great is that it is outside the box, invententive and bold. Without adventurous experimentation we would'nt have half of the amazing stuff we have in the world. Keep expressing and never stop ;)
I have a few ideas:
I think it would be very uncomfortable to spin de neck with your hands while playing, so you could have a pedal that makes it spin. Also the strings could be tunned in a way they make a minor chord and you could have a moving capo between frets, and maybe this capo have a way to change a little bit so it makes a major chord. Ive got this idea because i tought it would be very cool to just make spin the cilinder and keep the pick in the same place while it spins making a chord.
We need more people like you . That is how we can change the world and make it better . You are very smart to create new things
Mattias, what a stellar imaginative inventor! you seem to be able to build anything that you abstract in your mind's eye. I enjoyed trying to play it in my mind too; however, my conclusions were: 1) Get rid of the strings, this thing has the potential to add multiple new and unexpected dimensions to creating and performing music. The strings are going to act as a boat-anchor preventing this thing from soaring. 2) replace the archaic Pythagorean strings with the best available 3D (4D?) sliding and pressure sensitive midi sensors. They could wrap around the cylinder, 360 degrees, head to "bridge", and while you're at it invent some new approaches to touch sensors with feedback (the playing surface should feel alive). 3) Make the cylinder small enough that it feels good and cover the back side in a "half" canopy, such that the grip on the back of the canopy "feels" like a conventional guitar neck (don't forget keyboard players). (like a hollowed-out guitar neck with the spinning cylinder in it) Additionally, the "C" shaped canopy protects the sensors on the "back" side of the neck from accidentally being activated and gives the player different degrees of grip and compression. and 4) as others have suggested, spin using a servo motor controlled by a "WahWah" pedal, where the cylinder can rotate CW and CCW at different angular velocities and accelerations making changes in a microsecond. The advantage of your invention is that the musician-performer can add several new multidimensional spaces of emotions and aboriginal expressions, many of which have not even been discovered or fully exploited yet. Keep inventing, creating, and building!!!
I literally just got the notification for this video. I'd forgotten this channel even existed. Seeing this creation out of any sort of context is so bizarre. I love it.
I forgot about this channel too tbh!
Hello, this seems like a very interesting idea and I'm all in for it.
I will have some recommendations on the design, dont know if you already have similar plans but I think that few of the "must-have"s for this type of thing would be:
1- Most important of all a motor, which I assume you will attach later, but it should have a way to stay locked so that the neck actually does not turn whatsoever.
2-For the problem of hitting the strings in the back, the first thing came to my mind is to switch the back half of the strings when not in use. Because when you don't do that, it will probably touch somewhere else and if not from your fingers, there will definitely be a noise. This would be an addition later on the project though, you could have modes where you switch a particular portion of the strings off depending on your needs. For this to be easy enough there should be a way to locate the spindle though, so that you can program it to switch on and off the frets that face forwards as you turn it automatically. This way you could turn it anyway you want and still have just the specific pickups running.
I think those would be the most essential additions right now, good luck!
If you are planning on primarily playing chords on it, you can have the strings tuned to C Maj (No sharps or flats) and have buttons which fret the needed sharps/flats of other keys. Or if you keep it entirely chromatic, you can use buttons like an Autoharp which silence strings that aren't part of the key you want. You can still stop the guitar wherever and fret what you need
Could move in a direction akin to a futuristic hurdy gurdy, develop a chassis with an external key system played in the left hand while the right hand could drive rotation and elevation of the cylindrical fretboard within the chassis. Wild work, dont lose hope!
I think this project is really interesting, and I’m excited to follow your progress. Keep up the good work!
As far as something that could be used to move up and down the neck, shamisen players use a thing called a yubisuri. Its a finger sleeve that reduces friction on your fretting hand. it covers the space between your thumb and index while allowing your other fingers to be free. But i dont know if it'll completely noiseless unless you have something that dampens the strings.
But i would probably make a second neck just to rest my thumb on that doesnt touch the other strings.
To utilise the spinning function while also playing, you won't be able to to press down on notes anyway. You could however use a slide to change pitch. And use a violin bow to sound the strings. You would have to tune the stings to an open chord, and play with your left hand hovering over the top like a lap steel guitar. This way you would genuinly have a unique and usable instrument.
I wish this was an instrument that had existed for a long while, because I think it would look and sound so cool with a professional trained on it playing it! I think they'd use a bow, though 😝
Could you elaborate more on this? I think you're onto a point, but I do believe it needs further rationalization.
@@theothertonydutch I think it would probably need to be taller to have been made in the past - like a standing bass so that it would be easier to reach all around it with your bow and a sturdy stand so that you don't need to grasp the other side.
If it stayed roughly this size, the fictional historic version would be best held like a violin with the motor controls on the chin rest. Writing pieces for it probably would be painful 😛
check out chapman sticks or warr guitars, they're the closest thing to this that comes to mind
Reminds me of the valiha from Madagascar
@@abnunga thank you for teaching me about that instrument! It looks beautiful and sounds beautiful :)
Step 1: fix a bow or a stationary pick to the body so that as the neck rotates, the strings are plucked by the pick or scrape against the bow.
Step 2: fix a rod parallel to the neck and attach a guitar finger sleeve to the rod, fashioning it so that the finger sleeve can slide up and down against the strings as they spin.
Step 3: connect a hand crank to the neck.
You turn the crank with your right hand and fret the strings with the finger sleeve on your left hand, and the rotation automatically picks against the mounted pick (or bow).
I had this idea 20 years ago but I was coming at it from an upwright bass perspective. I believe it is an awesome idea! My idea was to have a fixed thumb sled on the back of neck that would raise it off the strings but allow full range up and down the neck.the sled would be kind of like a train on a track concept.I was also thinking foot pedal with variable speed forward and reverse to spin the neck. Keep going ,keep experimenting .this will be awesome!
I think the strings need to be horizontal or better yet, at a downward angle - and fretless. This way the notes will sound different as the cylinder turns and the fingers can fret the notes while the cylinder moves in a horizontal direction. Having the string perpendicular to the direction of spinning isn’t going to work - but changing the direction of the strings and removing the frets will totally work!
I think a back cover on the neck would be a good addition, having it connecting from the body to the top of the neck, preferably made of something light like carbon fibre.
I’m almost imagining it’s use as a chapman stick mixed with the spinning mechanism of a hurdy gurdy. In that vein, I also suggest a wheel or turning handle with a brake system that can both stop the neck from spinning and lock it in place where needed, like if you wanted to use it like a normal guitar. It could also help to have adjustable resistance on the spinning so it can be more or less difficult to spin depending on what you want.
Electronically only enable the pickups you play with based on rotation position, so your thumb can rest on the string with pickups disabled for that string. Or just have pickups only on one side
would it ruin the vision adding like a neck-rail sorta thing that helps you hold it?
1:06 yep, that
yeah, stretching will probably be a problem, but at least holding should be easier
also cylinder is the best
No it could be fully hidden for the viewer. However making it rigid enough could be issue, but it also increase how much you need to stretch fingers to play which is probably the biggest issue🤔
@@MattiasKrantzshorts that's true, for rigidity is there a way to have it connected to the end of the neck (after the strings (unless they stretch across)) with like a ball bearing ring that still allows it to rotate but also lets you hold it?
You could fret it like crazy when it's not spinning or spinning slowly but you will need to engineer a sliding capo like on a Steinberger but with string side rollers for speed spinning. Spinning will also add centrifugal effect to dampen vibration. Many problems to solve but I applaud the innovative creativity. Salute!
The reason I don't play it is because you won't hear anything. As you might have noticed the pickups are not installed in this version!
Pickups should be switched on/off according to rotation.
Off when in back (removing unintended sound from touching back-side strings).
On when in front.
Could be pretty easy to implement.
Awesome video! I haven't seen this project before, and my immediate thought was that it could be played similar to a lap-steel guitar, where you sit with it on your lap or on a stand. Obviously it would need to freely rotate, but I think it could work. Have you considered using a mechanism that locks each segment of the fretboard into place, but in a way that it can be turned to the next setting with a little bit of force? It could be a toggle where you can make it freely spin, or switch into the locked one - similar to how some house wheels have toggles for click scrolling and free scrolling.
Another thought - let's get Rob Scallon to play this thing ASAP!
I'm not an engineer at all, but since it looks like you have individual pickups you could have every pickup go to an electromechanical rotary switch so that the strings on the back are always muted, but it would probably be impossible without a redesign and it might not be the most reliable. Just an idea
the pickup doesnt need to turn, a stationary pickup close to the picking hand will hear the vibrations of the loudest string.
That's looking sooo good now! How is tuning? (Probably better than a piano at least)
What will you do about the pickups? I suppose they will be stationary and facing the strings you play, but where will you put them? And how you wil manage the cables, since this whole thing is rotating
They are custom made single string pickups. If you zoom in you might be able to see the mounts
The plank idea could work. Try making it the whole length of the guitar and then attaching it with L brackets to the top and bottom connecting to a rod going through some skateboard bearings. It’ll definitely add to the thickness but it’ll spin! You could also remove some strings to make it thinner to accommodate the plank.
The hand rest idea sounds good, but the foam or fabric cloth will drag. Or you could have something which activates the pickup one string at a time. So your footswitch to rotate the thing will step through each string in turn (one foot press = next string [clockwise or anticlockwise setting too]). THis is so cool, would love to see this work.
I still think playing it in the lap like a slide guitar (maybe not directly in the lap if the back's open, but in that flat-down position) is going to be most comfortable for playing it as it is, especially since you can keep it spinning without having your fretting hand getting pulled around. Also the cylinder neck definitely is too cool to pass up on, even if there are more "practical" shapes
Maybe just have another neck for the guitar that's ofc not attached to the strings, just kinda separately there, like one of those rollers with a handle except without the handle yknow? It should probably help with stability if it's an issue.
Also maybe have the neck thin enough so that you don't have to wrap your hand around it too much.
That way it can act as a guide for your hand just to prevent you from having to lift it trying to prevent unintentional noise.
Amazing stuff! 👍
If you rotated JUST the neck core and frets, but have the strings fixed, it would auto-bow like a cello when you pressed a string against the (motorised) rotating fret...
Then you could have a rear surface for the thumb, rotating fretboard in the middle, and some strings on the front.
What would you have for pickups? Annular rings near the bridge/neck?
So basically a gatling guitar. The problem with playing it will be while it's spinning with respect to the fretting hand. It might be doable with a slide/bottle neck if you mute at the nut with some fabric. A more purpose built solution might be a moveable ring around the whole neck circumference that would act as a slide (basically an inside out fret) , which given a sufficiently hard material and adequate contact could stop the string (muting may still be needed at nut). the ring might be hard to move while spinning or may wear itself or strings, and a ball bearing is a possible solution (like if you could just hold the bearing stationary while the neck spun inside it ).
Tony Levin Funk Fingers maybe the route for this. I think solving the problem that the original design has created is your amazing USP. Designing solutions for the design yet maintaining the original concept. Just as a "thing" this is pure art.
maybe instead of rectangular neck, there could be a rectangular frame for the pickups, 1 on each side under the strings, and you can then activate/deactivate your pickups individually. That way you can have just the front pickup for traditional play, but if you want to enable a rear pickup for thumb fretting, you could do that too.
I'm not exactly sure what the most effective way to play it would be either, but I think the idea is neat as hell regardless.
A couple thoughts for you...
For one, there's no hard and fast rule saying it has to be rotating at all times, you could have it where it snaps into 3 or 4 or so various different positions to like switch between bass vs guitar mode.
Also, as others have suggested, perhaps you could play it with a bow, but that almost suggests it might be better without the frets if played with a bow.
Another thought, there's nothing mandatory about the order of the strings, you could experiment with other string orders like interleaving low/high/low/high strings pre-tuned to play different chords when turned into different positions.
Just my 3 cents on it, I wish you all the best and hope to see you play that bad boy one day!
I think it would be cool to put a pickup over top of the cylinder, so that only a selection of the strings are amplified at a time (something that looks like the cover on an old P Bass), or possibly two or three that you could select based on where you're playing things (on/off switch for each pickup)? Like, if you're playing bass with your thumb, and some higher stuff on the opposite side, it could be cool to have a split pickup sort of thing where it's the top and bottom (ish) rather than the usual playing portion of a guitar being amplified. Plus, if the pickup is stationary while the neck moves, you could get a really interesting Leslie effect by playing open strings and spinning the neck. That could be cool too.
Trying to give you a constructive criticism: I think this looks as beautiful as sadly useless now. Probably you should rebuild it with fix strings and an empty space for the thumb (scrap the bass for now or just use less strings) only Then you make the inner part spin and play it in a more similar way as an hurdy gurdy, no need to use the right hand to pick the strings or anything (could be used to spin manually or operate the velocity of the motor).
Just an idea on what i would do with it, hope you get the right inspiration and finish this project!
What if you used a circular capo that would be designed similarly to a barbell collar? You could adjust it relatively easily and with the right tuning the guitar could work as an arpeggiator at the very least. If you could somehow make a slide that worked across the circumference of the neck then it might work well as a slide guitar in a a similar arpeggiator type way.
An idea to limit the noise from the strings round the back. If you're mounting a pickup under each string then you could have a rotary contact just like an electric motor. This would make it so that only the front strings are in use. As the neck rotates one string turns on as another turns off.
You could connect all the ground wires together and have the live wires going to thin conductive strips around the main rotor with a brush to pick up the signals resulting them effectively being connected in parallel. It might sound a bit crackly but all the other strings would be muted.
Give it to Charles Berthoud. The guy needs a challenge. He'll probably make a video like "three Taylor Swift hits in the style of Tool all at once on one instrument" and the hardest part for him will be not to look bored. :-D
You could build a device that wraps around the fret board, and holds frets. Then spin it to pick the notes. Also you can use an open tuning on the strings to make it more functional. I doubt you could play it while spinning by hand though.
Being round makes it resemble a Gatling gun when it spins.
Honestly I would try and add a small frame to house where you.can lean the instrument against your body and play it upright like a cello. You might have to have some tension so The rotation axis will spin easy still yet won’t slip while playing. The other way is continuing the piano style and have hammers for taping each fret and making its mechanical assist guitar. Or maybe a hurdy gurdy approach
Make a sliding capo that can wrap around the whole thing, possibly like a spider capo? where you can hold and release specific strings on the fly. Could have it to where it can let the string be open, fretted, or dampened/muted?
A sliding thumb rest? A bar from the body that then loops and attaches at the top of the neck. It's grooved to allow the thumb rest to slide.
Also a stepper motor attached to let's say a sewing machine pedal to rotate it.
If you do want the pickup to only affect the forward facing strings, could you mount it the inside of a plate attached to the body that stays static.... think like Rickenbacker bridge PU plate that goes over the strings?
Rotary slip ring connector with dead zones to isolate pickpups on thumb side.
The Gattling Axe, with a half guard running through the back of the neck & sensors that allow only the exposed part of the neck to be active when in use
Should give it to Bob Ross and let him paint Happy little bushes on it….
Maybe the back/thumb part could be the slider so one can play 2 types of styles at once 😂 Great invention. Keep going ❤
It may not be very cool when it's square, but it's hip to be square.
The thumb thing is easy to overcome. String and tune it in octaves so the strings on the exact opposite sides are octave notes. Then play both strings at the same time as you roll around the cylinder.
Looks like it could be used as a slide guitar, use like a brass/glass slide to fret it while it spin. Set it in an open tuning and maybe use a sustainer/ebow too?
Hook motor up to pedals. Have one for rotating clockwise, and one for counterclockwise. Then use finger picks and a slide. Play it like a pedal steel
Im kind of hoping the pickup will be stationary while the strings spin over/under it so I can hear what it sounds like when the string isn't fixed above it.
If you don't have a rest or block on the neck itself to separate your left hand from the strings, I'd suggest a thin leather/pleather glove with the thumb covered but the other four fingers removed. The leather should greatly reduce friction on your hand, but the fingers would have full range of movement.
wish i could give this a go! I can see some cool two handed tapping played on this!
I suggest that you use your LH thumb to fret notes on the backside of the neck as your fingers fret notes on the front side. You could probably make some nice counterpoint that way.
I was looking at it imagining it in an open tuning and fretting it with some kind of circular capo you can move around it and then having a something of a pick fixed somewhere so it'll just pick the strings as you rotate it.
Or actually a second probably better idea would be a capo like thing with handles like a a pair of pliers you can grab and fret the neck at any position with so you can turn the entire thing with left hand and pick the notes however with you like right hand.
You could also make a round guitar slide (or even just a regular one) then you can play it possibly while its spinning
How about using an accelerometer chip to only turn on the channel facing outwards?
For some reason I imagine putting it on some kind of almost motorised sewing wheel. Where you use pedal to turn it around while having both hands free to press on the frets and play.
When the Predator is playing the violin, you need a Gatling guitar
Fun project!
Here is my 2 cents :)
Since this obviously is not playable (in rotation mode) using the traditional "finger pressing against fetboard approach" of the guitar neck, i suggest several stationary bows and picks to interact with the strings when in rotation mode.
And do the fretting action on the rotating neck with a metal device like a slide. You could have "slides" on several fingers to trigger several notes at the same time making chords.
thats a solid idea damn i hope he see this
Thanks! I am shure Mattias will see this.
And, yes, from the top of my head this seems like one plausible solution making this a somewhat playable instrument. This is just one of many possible approaches. But i am quite confident it would work if developed and executed correctly @@joshtucker231
I was thinking a redesign might be better... Chain driven ends with a more traditional or even adjustable neck shape.. optional rear guard to allow hand/thumb placement like on a traditional neck..
Yes, that could be. Still redesign is a different path. I was thinking more in the line of how to make an existing design usable by innovating around the obvious limitations of this particular device.
If starting from scratch one would most certainly end up with a different design, and most likely other issues. Like the vibrations of a chain, it that good or bad in a project like this? Pickups are sensitive to mechanical noise and vibrations, perhaps this is why we don't see a lot of chaindriven turntables out there.
However in brainstorming for a prototype there is really no such thing as a bad idea. Even a really poor suggestion can fule development in to new directions :) @@evansmusic2009
I need to see Rob Scallon play this, I imagine he'd be very excited to see it
I would take a bar of steel and run it from the body to the head. Attach it to the head with a bearing so that it can’t bend and impact or impede the spinning. This will be on the bottom so that you can brace your thumb against it like a regular guitar. Then you just fret the strings normally.
Think of it as if you never change the way you play the guitar, it’s just a normal guitar, but the strings cycle in place. Lift your fingers and rotate the strings, but don’t move your hand (thumb) off the back bar.
Also, I loved the idea someone said about using a foot pedal to make it work and control the speed of the spin. Don’t sleep on that. You can use a simple drill motor and a belt system to make it work
Dang it, if you won’t do it, some day I will
how would you lock it in place so it doesn't shift around?
what if you somehow instead fret the strings with parts of the fretboard extending towards the strings?
that's a COOL idea. Oh the possibilities when playing, you could just roll the next with your fret hand for the worlds longest guitar scale climb 😂 Or even a hollow neck cylindrical acoustic version. Cool stuff, thanks for making it!
What about a flexible sleeve rotating around an oval support? In theory this would make it easier to hold it and to play it still keeping the possibility to smoothly play while rotating
This is so gorgeous. The world is better that this exists
maybe instead of a thiccc set of strings you could have 4 sets of 6 going up and down and up and down, this way you can just use a slide or a bow in your left hand and play arpegios as you spin it (with the right tuning ofc) and whenever you stop spinning and start picking you always have a standard 6 string setup on both sides. also if you are going with an electricaly spinning with a pedal solution you can have a home button on it so the servo spins right back to the standard position
Forgive me if this has already been raised many times already, but were you inspired by Magic Alex and his rotating neck guitar for the Beatles (as seen in the Get Back Peter Jackson film for example)?
Maybe it will be possible to make a rheostat contact arc on the lower neck joint. I mean when you turn it, only strings on the front neck( which are in use) will transmit the signal.
Okay but, I had a dream many years ago where I was hanging out with Les Claypool and he had a new bass that had a neck exactly like this.
could some kind of ratcheting mechanism maybe raise and lower foam pads near the bridge to mute strings on the unfretted side as the instrument rotates?
you just need to "fret the thing" and "we didn't exactly make this to be functional"- mattias krantz 10/25/23
Rob Scallon wouldn’t have any trouble playing this. 😂
He would, he's just a whole different level of committed
Electronic muting when strings are facing back. Add a switch to turn off the pickups to the strings when not in front.
stand it upright go 44" scale. it will just stay, contact points from 0-180 so the remain side is deactivated electrically when used electric. perhaps less strings and a tighter radius. you don't need actual fingerboard.. just rings on a threaded center as frets
Maybe there could be push pull selection for z coil or individual string pickups, or buttons, so that all the strings were not ON at the same time, necessarily, but could be?
Literally went "spinning is a nice trick" and made a guitar.
I think a heptagon profile, with seven radius-ed fretboards, would be kind of cool. I like the idea of an odd number.
This could be playable using different playing techniques. Perhaps Rob Scallon could come up with some playing techniques.
Could you add a device that shuts off the other pickups depending on how its rotated? That way you wouldn't have to deal with noise coming from the other strings.
i would make a mute for the strings that arent on the intended playing surface right in front of the bridge (attached to the body). maybe it activates and deactivates when the computer spins, or maybe has a manual release.
Ooooh who knows maybe this becomes a futuristic instrument or something likw that it looks so awesome !
Possibly split a pipe down the middle and mount it on the non-freting/reverse side of the neck to shield your thumb.
What about playing it like a double bass? What about a wah-wah pedal to control the rotation of the neck?