DEEP DIVE into Pathfinder 2e's NEW Kineticist class! (Part 3 of Kineticist series from Rules Lawyer)
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 8 июл 2024
- CORRECTION: All the "swap an impulse" abilities require that your new impulse feat have the same elemental trait (e.g., water to water). This limitation is on the class feature Reflow Elements, and all the feats that let you switch your impulses proc off of Reflow Elements. This means that the main strength of "multi-elementing" is expanding your choices, NOT the ability to have an on-call library of powers.
0:00 Intro
0:51 Analysis
10:25 Build Tips
17:10 The Six Elements
21:26 Some standout feats
26:23 Awesome feats!
34:09 Outro
LINK to the Rules Lawyer's Kineticist series (Part 1 - Overview, Part 2 - Combat, Part 3 - Deep Dive): • Guide to Kineticist fo...
"HunterIV4's Guide to the PF2e Kineticist": docs.google.com/document/d/1g...
Discussion thread on the draft: / hunteriv4s_kineticist_...
=============================
LIKE & SUBSCRIBE! I'm a lawyer who teaches and runs tabletop RPGs (Pathfinder, D&D, Starfinder) for kids, teens, and adults, and making videos related to TTRPGs and board games.
JOIN MY DISCORD to chat with our community and/or try the Pathfinder Beginner Box or our drop-in PF2e play system! / discord
SUPPORT MY PATREON for early access to many of my videos and access to exclusive content, and to support me! I do unpaid public-interest legal work and rely on the Patreon and private GMing.
/ theruleslawyer
For PF2E actual plays, SUBSCRIBE to my other channel, "RULES LAWYER DISCORD COMMUNITY CHANNEL":
/ @theruleslawyerliveplay
Follow me on TWITTER at: / theruleslawyer1
Pick up your Pathfinder 2e book on Amazon using my affiliate links below. As an Amazon Affiliate, I earn from qualifying purchases which helps me continue doing what I love!
Pathfinder 2e Core Rulebook: amzn.to/3BiFCSj
Pathfinder 2e Beginner Box: amzn.to/3eVsUBB 
Игры
![mgk - I Think I’m OKAY (with YUNGBLUD) (Sad Version) [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/7AC1uqQLIg4/mqdefault.jpg)
CORRECTION: All the "swap an impulse" abilities require that your new impulse feat have the same elemental trait (e.g., water to water). This limitation is on the class feature Reflow Elements, and all the feats that let you switch your impulses proc off of Reflow Elements. This means that the main strength of "multi-elementing" is expanding your choices, NOT the ability to have an on-call library of powers.
Kineticist take all the stuff away that i hate about caster. And they are far less complex. Thanks for reigniting my love for Kineticists!
I can't wait for it to be on Pathbuilder so I can make one for each element! 🤩
And the elemental barbarian to combo with it!
Right? I totally see me losing many many hours making characters...
More like 10 for each element. I think I'm gonna be at this for a while
I only planning one right now, and it's a dual gate water/metal lizardfolk tank build
Off topic, but RUclips saying this is 11 days old. Just RUclips things
One point that I wouldn't say you missed but that didn't get called out for Sanguivolent Vines- Not only does it do piercing damage to your enemies and apply half of the highest damage to your allies, but if any enemies that are in the area are also undead (AKA, healed by Void damage), they *also* take that healing as Vitality damage! This is pretty notable because you heal your allies in the area, explicitly don't heal your enemies in the area, and any enemies that would be harmed by healing still get hurt. It's the best of all worlds, and so, so cool.
Nonat: Where is the Kineticist Deep Dive?
Rules Lawyer: On your left
29:46 Ooze Form is another effect that grants immunity to critical hits starting at level 5, be it at a cost of a spell slot and tanking your AC. Still probably the best polymorph battle form though, simply because of crit immunity and how dwarfs with Vengeful Hatred can easily trigger it without the extra damage.
You seem to have missed an important detail when it comes to Reflow Elements. You can only swap out an impulse for another impulse *with the same elemental trait*, and you can't use it with composite impulses. If you're the avatar and have all 6 elements, and you picked for example an earth talent at level 18 and then omnikinesis at 20, you only have access to the earth level 18 feats, the other elements' level 18 feats are not available through omnikinesis. So you need to be really careful with which impulses you take when, to maximise access to as many impulses as possible.
Ah, that's a HUGE difference! Will add a correction.
@@JD-wu5pf Correct, I could have been clearer with that. That's why you want to spread out your higher level feats over as many elements as possible, so you can reflow into as many different talents as possible. If you spread out your level 14, 16, 17, and 18 feats over 4 different elements then you have access to a very large pool of impulses.
Can't wait for Kineticist to be available on AoN and Pathbuilder! Already been theory crafting some awesome builds haha. Keep up the great work Ronald!
Weapon infusion is a must pick for strength based kineticist, but still isn’t that crazy. Its just a lot of text that often won’t matter much. They could remove everything but the ranged part and it would still be good, and that’s not too say the melee part should be removed because it atleast keeps melee occasionally relevant. The extra damage types could be moved over to the versatile blast feat, with minimal power lost. BPS, is great for fire kine, but otherwise meh.
Backswing and sweep are invalidated by agile, reach has niche but is often invalidated by thrown. Agile and forceful are good if multiple elemental blast per turn is optimal which i don’t think will happen often.
I'm pretty sure backswing affects your NEXT attack. So you make your first attack backswing, then if it whiffs, you can make your second attack agile and you will be working with an effective -3 attack (-4 from agile and with the +1 circumstance bonus from backswing). I agree that saying its op is a bit early given there are a number of limitations on it (like not being able to use it with the free action blast when you channel). The main reason to take it is adding STR to ranged blasts.
@@jimbob929backswing works only if your next attack is with the same weapon. So it's unclear what happens if a weapon loses trait between attacks.
@@jimbob929Backswing is pretty useless because you can only apply one trait to your blasts at a time. So Agile with its unconditional -1 to MAP is always useful
This feels exactly like what a sorcerer should be. I love it
28:20 I was playing Spirit Island and felt like half the ability names felt very Pathfindery, so the connection is there!
The second air impulse that you focused on sounds more like Storm from the X-Men instead of anything from avatar.
Here's the wildest thing about Ignite the Sun: the 500ft of bright light it casts counts as natural sunlight.
Imagine an 18th level Kineticist making their way through Ustalav just incinerating all vampires without breaking a sweat xP
That actually came up in a 20th level one-shot my GM held. We were sent to an island to help the people from waves of undead, werewolves, and vampires terrorizing them so when I declared I had used the impulse, my GM asked what it did. As I was reading it, the rest of my party started laughing hysterically while the GM's jaw dropped. He then asked how long does it last to which I told him, "I can Sustain it for a minute... but then I could just do it again". I was then asked to swap it for something else.
Note: I had no idea what he had in mind for the one-shot. It was just an hilarious coincidence. Also, the sun gets 5ft bigger, letting its light reach ever-so slightly further.
@@acdcguy18 I hope you got to use it for at least one wave, because that would have been AMAZING to experience xD
But yeh, Kineticists in general have such wild setting power, it's nutty =P
@@GrimmDichotomy I did. It was the first wave that proc'd the whole thing. Swapped it for ALL SHALL END IN FLAMES (love that name) which I took at 20th since I had no overflows then took the kinetic pinnacle 20th-level feat to rechannel and enter my stance afterward.
I want to build a dual gate metal and fire dwarf charaxter that is basically the embodiment of a living forge itself! There are so many amazing charaxter concepts to make with this class
After seeing your combat demonstration with Azulas abilites, I instantly had t think about how strong a fire kineticist with the oracle dedication would be. The flames subclass focus spell incendiary aura would be incredibly powerful combined with a fire kineticist. And aside from that, it gets access to healing and utility spells like heoism, covering up that the fire kineticist does not have the defenses and healing ailites from the other elements.
I feel like this is how all casters should have been created from the start. Every caster should have just been 90% unique rather than just using spell list from DnD / PF1. Maybe in Pathfinder 3 :). The fact that every primal will often use the same spells can feel odd.
Having lots of abilities and options to use on your turn is just amazing. I know 4e was kind of designed this way... Hopefully we get more classes like this that completely change the way characters play rather than being a Martial or Caster.
I''m certainly making a Cactus Leshy Single Gate Wood Kineticist for my weekly game as soon as Foundry has the class added,
This book comes out....And the Fire Nation will attack.
I played a lvl 10 Wood/Earth Kineticist and had an absolute blast (pun intended). I had some amazing support between keeping the enemy sickened while both preventing tons of damage, doing a bit myself, creating difficult and hazardous terrain, and healing a respectable amount. I always felt like I had something ground breaking (again, pun intended) to do each turn.
I'm also now playing a lvl 2 dedicated Water (will fork to Wind at lvl 5) Kineticist that is focused on versatility and battlefield control. People underestimate the power to be able to move enemies. It plays completely differently than my Wood/Earth did (of course also vastly different levels) and choosing between Bludgeoning and Cold damage at level 1 has already proven very advantageous.
In short, loving this well designed and versatile class!
The water dedication: how is the healing? Since my new party has almost no healers it seemed like a good subclass pick. But I could also take something more defensive for Area control (Earth or Wood)
Easily my new favourite class. So many ideas...
Reskinning the wood into Bone and playing an anime vampire guy would be fun
Wood into bone and Water into Blood, beautiful! Then, if you wanna add to it, put Fire into the mix and do something like the fire spells from Castlevania's Dracula or the Bloodflame from Elden Ring.
There so may cool concepts around dedicated duel elements. Earth can combine with the others to form sand, lava, ore, mud and amber for example.
I like air and water for a storm kineticist.
@@philopharynx7910 Would work as an alt take on a Gozreh worshipper, I've set myself the challenge of figuring out a combo name for each.
I have an Air/Water Kineticist who's literally stolen Hei Feng's thunder upon birth. Got cursed to think alcohol tastes like ambrosia, to never be drunk, and to have her drunkenness transferred to people around her. Great fun
I still believe that Fire should’ve had Sonic damage.
Long live Sparky Sparky Boom Man!
Enjoyed the series. Very interested in an aerokineticist. Someday perhaps.
I *love* you for including that girl from the commercial. I had to rewind just to be sure!
Definitely I am going to use this class as main villains in my next campaign.
since you said to share character ideas, here goes mine, water/wood leshy kinetisist. i am a sucker for support abilities. ;D
You're not the only one! Someone made a Reddit post with exactly this, and SwingRipper made exactly this also for my Outlaws of Alkenstar campaign!
I have a water wood air kineticist in mind, his backstory would be a sailor, maybe from an archipelago seafaring culture to tie the nature elements. RP wise, water and air for obvious sailing aid and wood for shipbuilding, repairing and maybe fresh fruits (coconut!). Mechanically these 3 elements have a lot of support options available which I love.
Please flavor your Wood blast as shooting coconuts at people! (Wood Blast is even bludgeoning and I **will** argue the coconut water is vitality. There’s holy water and then there’s coconut water.)
I definitely will! Thanks for the great suggestion!
Now all I need to Kineticist support in Foundry and Pathbuilder.
Already done
I really like the Four Winds feat. Is there anything in PF2 that does something similar (repositioning allies)? Friendfetch is the closest I can find.
this used to be a psionics class in 2nd ed d&d. i used to be the party tank when i am hit i could withhold physical energy and then touch a target to release the energy.
So what happens if i start off with one element, pick up Counter Element at 6th and then branch off into another element? Do i lose access to it since i'm no longer hitting the prereqs and have to retrain, or are the prereqs just for being allowed to pick it up?
Definitely retrain.
The Ooze Form spell makes you immune to crits and precision damage.
I'm gonna be building a bulky water kineticist! We use free archetype and I'm probably gonna pick up Sentinel, although I might try wrestler, I'm still unsure.
One big question with Weapon Infusion is does the attack count as a Strike (as it is still an Elemental Blast) for lots of feats/abilities? If not, it makes it much less useful than it would otherwise be. More generally, does Elemental Blast count as a Strike?
3:50 In regards to "needing one hand free", has there been any comment about the Kashrishi heritage with the extra hands? It should work, right?
I'm going to try to make Kevin Levin or Ben Tennyson as a kineticist or a Elemental Instinct Barbarian with a kineticist dedication feat
One of my OCs can me made as a Strix with control over Water/Air. More of a support/control character.
How about a fourth video presenting everything for the Barbarian Instinct, including a build on the Foundry VTT. Add, in the build portion, upgrading to 2nd level with the Free Archetype of Kineticist.
[show where to set the Free Archetype option in Foundry VTT]
Thank you for all you do.
Weapon Infusion: I'm late to the party here, we had our first PF game(starter adventure) last weekend, and was wondering if you still felt the same way about this feat?
My experience was it was not overpowered, but I absolutely could be missing something(lots of things). Our Ranger and Fighter were using Bastard Sword + Buckler and Javelins, and the Ranger had Precision Strike. So the first thing I noticed playing the Kineticist(Water/Wood, Str2/Con4) was they did a lot more damage with Two-Handed d12, which Weapon Infusion doesn't have as an option(and Str4). I also hit less than the fighter, or and the Precision Strike of the Ranger added even more damage.
What I did have, was amazing versatility and essentially could Swap as a free action, or Draw in the case of their Javelins - but my damage dice was capped at d8. My Ocean's Balm and Hail of Splinters felt weak in heals/damage, but amazing at the frequency I could use them. I didn't outshine anyone in damage or heals, but had better action economy and versatility literally every round.
I used Thrown 20 mainly with weapon infusion, staying close to the others, but loved just knowing I could go long range with less Str damage if the need arose.
I couldn't make use of the +1 weapons we found, another plus for the other classes.
I agree the feat is very strong, just not overpowered, as it does not allow you to outshine any other class, but instead advances the classes versatility(not to mention fun).
In that linked guide, the author claims the fire critical blast works with the fire aura junction but the aura only works for fire impulses which confuses me. Does the persistent fire actually trigger the aura junction even though it's not an impulse but the source was?
The Kinetic Blasts ARE impulses, and therefore work with the junction, whether normally or with a critical strike.
The audio quality is really bad in this video, what happened?
Experimenting with some internet advice and it backfired. Apparently recording at a low volume to avoid distortion forces you to add Gain is its own distortion. Alas.
I have the urge to make a lava (earth+fire) kineticist , using the earth armor and fire capacity to make hulking Frontline (bonus points if i find a ooze ancestry to make it a danger marshmallow.
Hey Ronald, idk if you read this but want to know your opinion on the archetype, how does it stack in the grand scheme of things?
If your GM allows 3pp, Roll for Combat has a slime ancestry.
And if you're a dual gate with earth and one of metal or wood, you can use both element's armor impulses together to get the benefits of both!
Armor bonuses don't stack so what benefit would this give?
@@Leonson1 the higher base AC of Armor in Earth, with the shields from Metal Carapace or Hardwood Armor respectively.
@@HenshinFanatic Excellent point.
Where is the link to the draft guide?
Okay Ive been trying to dive into pathfinder 2e and I have a question for the community.
It seems to me that before the kineticist spell levels (or are they called spell ranks now?) went to level 10 at the highest.
but impulses are your kineticist level.
does this mean that kineticist will have level 20 spells?
Technically the kineticist doesn't have any spells at all. I imagine their level 20 abilities are about as powerfull as rank 8-9 spells
As far as I'm aware, spells like Ooze Form or Abberant Form are likely the only ways for a player to get immunity to crits, however those come with the downside of being polymorph effects, so you cant do normal stuff while morphed
Love your shirt
The earth, metal, and wood impulses have an "instant armor" impulse.
Would they work with something like an automatons chasis armor?
Battlezoo ancestries dragon by roll for combat have a similar thing where they can get natural armor as thier scales. But as a kineticist would these impulses still work?
I do believe they would; I mean, if the special armor suits can "sponge up" the runes that were on the original armor, that means that they effectively replaced it... temporarily, at least. This normally would mean that the underlying armor disappears, but for creatures like the Guardian Nagaji (who have armored skin) or the Automatons with chassis armor it probably means that their very skin or structure is turned into a pure elemental shell.
It may not be as powerful as a spell caster but from what I understand it can use its impulses as many times as it wants
I am 100% making a slime rancher, water kineticist. All my water abilities and all my fighting will be done with slimes.
Can't wait to see it online! Hope I can make one in my game, but this is the first time my GM has to update Foundry's PF2e module, so I hope it doesn't break anything.
Nice video but I'm not sure you mentioned how strong Weapon Infusion is. It's like three feats in one!
I’ve been thinking about a metal kineticist who’s precious metal themed and can create gold, and silver, etc. Almost Midas-like! Maybe their backstory is they’re trying to flee from people who’d want to exploit their powers for greedy reasons?
I also had an idea of them being able to create and imbue little tokens and talismans that help/protect their allies. (but I’m not sure how to make that work, I’m pretty new to the game 😅)
Maybe look at the Talisman Dabbler archetype for the charm flavor
There's a level 4 ability that lets you do precisely that, even turning any metal into another one. I've read people saying this even applies to stuff like Adamantine and all that.
Metal Kineticists can't create precious materials - that's one of the specifications, I'm afraid - and the metal they summon is quite low quality.
On the other hand, it IS still metal, and can be melted, which would allow a blacksmith character with access to a forge to create a metric crapton of equipment for next to zero cost. I mean, sure, it's rusty, pitted iron, but it is still iron!
(the reason why the metal summoned by metal kineticists sucks so much is because, as explained in the setting section, the entire metal plane is messed up big time - one of the Elemental Gods that oversees it is literally a RUST MONSTER THE SIZE OF A CONTINENT!)
Ignite The Sun? Escanor lives!
Am I missing something or is single gate going to be far superior early on just because of free action economy?
Air Single Gate is definitely a bit too strong early on, but I feel like the other ones are decently fine, to the point where you could justify picking Dual Gate at the beginning to do a weird combo or something. This class is already very strong with one element and no Junction, I feel that, unless you're minmaxing heavily, every choice you make has more to do with flavor than trying to improve your effectiveness so to speak.
A Fire Kineticist with the Sentinel Dedication seems like a really decent concept to build around...
I wonder though... Would medium or heavy armor proficiency be worth it? Is there a way to increase one's proficency beyond "Trained" in those categories?
I'm certainly stoked to see what can be done. Especially when the class becomes available on Pathbuilder.
Paladin multiclass lets you get expert in other armor proficiencies. I'm not sure the level because I'm at work and they block gaming sites.
@@philopharynx7910:
I don't find the Paladin Dedication to be all that useful here, especially with the Free Archetype Rule.
The anathema requirement alone is a downgrade in my opinion.
Further, any sort of healing that would be helpful from that via Lay on Hands can be fairly well supplanted by going dual-gate and taking Water (or Wood) for their healing options.
Answer to first question: It'd allow one to dump DEX in regards to AC (which is what I'm doing).
Answer to the second question: The Sentinel Dedication feat answers your question, "Whenever you gain a class feature that grants you expert or greater proficiency in any type of armor (but not unarmored defense), you also gain that proficiency in the armor types granted to you by this feat."
This means they'd become expert at 13th and at master at 19th in unarmoured to heavy armour using that archetype.
@@acdcguy18: That does answer quite a bit, thanks. I must have glossed over it.
I'll re-read the APG.
I'd also be curious to know if there's a way to get it to Legendary, so that by 19th level, heavy armor proficiency also hits Legendary. I'd imagine that involves getting Unarmored Defense to Legendary, so I figure it's more than likely not to happen.
That "Bulwark" armor trait is going to be a necessity, going into higher levels.
@@simondiamond9628 The only way I know how to get legendary AC is either being a champion or monk. If your table is using the dual class variant, that'd be your best bet.
Ooze Form can grant crit immunity 😅
I'm thinbking about a plate wearing singel gate fire kineticists that get's to the front line by rocket booster and burn everything to the ground. So I would choose humand and take Armor proficiency twice for the heavy armor proficiency.
Careful, armor proficiency only makes you TRAINED in armor - at higher level that would suck. Try the Sentinel archetype instead.
I don't have anything specific, but you could create the yuyu hakusho shinibo. Feel sorry for the gm that has a Jin at the table.
My main worry is that this class will be broken.
I want to build a dwarf earth keneticist i think it would be cool
This is cool, but it's making me want to play Exalted.
If you think about it, with every combo of dual gate and single gate, this class has about 36 subclasses. O_O
Now consider how there are multiple points in later levels when you can add a new element and... yeah, there are way too many possibilities and I love all of them.
ooze form makes you immune to critical hits.
20:24 Hnnnnghh... Metal Gear.
So... make an Oread Earth Kineticist that picks up the Skill Junction named Dwayne.
That's a silly name for a skill junction.
This book just further demonstrated that vancian casting is outdated.
AMEN!
I don't think it's outdated, but I do think it is a poor fit for modern D&D and Pathfinder.
I have a question...
Will the Kineticist finally let me make this in Pathbuilder:
ruclips.net/video/WJTHh15yJzw/видео.html
Months of fighting with the character creation in Pathbuilder, trying to get this specific kind of playstyle has been so frustrating! (If you haven't played the game) The FFXIV Dancer is a support/ranged physical DPS job, they provide damage/crit buffs, their twin chakram weapons automatically return after every strike, and they have a minor party-wide healing spell
This new job in Pathfinder might finally give a Bard character with the Kineticist archetype the ability to conjure elemental chakrams on the fly and just remake them after the strike hits. Or, since Dancer is focused on the DPS side than support, the character in Pathfinder can be a Kineticist with the Bard archetype? I sincerely hope that's the way it works, anyway.
Aren't returning runes a thing? I'm pretty sure you could have done this all along.
@@heathenselfhealer4339 You're quite right! But no GM is going to allow a level one PC to have twin chakrams with returning runes from the outset. It's all good though, as many other character concepts have come along perfectly.
@@KaminoZanI think mine would, I came up with exactly this concept of making an Final Fantasy Dancer in my game and the GM (huge FFXIV allowed it), though it never got to the point where my previous character died or anything, so I never managed to test it. Still, Returning isn't that big of a deal, I think, it just makes Thrown builds viable.
It'd be a Battledancer Swashbuckler, and I was going to pick Catfolk reflavored as a Miqo'te, because if we're gonna go all-in on FF we gotta have the catgirls.
Hell of 1000000 Needles should be pronounced as "ten hundred thousand" 😂
I can't wait for your casters are spoiled kids video I'm very excited for that one
No real point to having more than 1 'sun' on the battlefield... you're better off having 1 going centered on you ... and you're immune to fire damage... plus you're blasting out all sorts of other spells every turn.
This video title is 100% throwing shade at NoNat for not making his video yet
For the record I'm not aware of his Kineticist coverage plans! (Been swamped by my own video to-do list)
EDIT: Oh I see this video went public literally the same minute as his vid saying his deep dive is delayed. Looks like we scheduled these videos for the same hour, and 10am/7am EST/PST is a top RUclips hour. For the record I posted this for Patrons 10 days ago, as shown by some comments! And it had this title!
(And now we're boosting each other in the algorithm! lol)
Why would the Rules Lawyer "throw shade" at NoNat? You just like to be chronically offended, don't you?
@@devcrom3 My comment was meant to be nothing more than a simple jest. You just like to be chronically offended, don't you?
@@JD-wu5pf I'm with OP; interpreting their comment as offense is a weird leap.
the reason i prefer the warlock is that you can make him work not relying on class resources and have everything cast at will.
Still feels like Paizo failed their Save vs. Power Creep, with this class. Some serious imbalances. 😢
I'm not familiar enough with the game to know about this, could you please elaborate?
My theory for a while now, since hearing the preview of the Remaster, is that they *do* want to power creep for many classes to make them feel as potent as the Fighter. We'll see.
Finally get to live my Magneto fever-dreams 🎉🦾🎇