Fun fact I originally had the criminal caller sound like my mum but my mum watches my videos and she's awesome and I didn't want her to feel bad so I changed it to my grandma cos she's dead so no worries there. Anyway *GRAB* *YOUR* *CZEPEKU* *MAPS* *HERE!!* www.patreon.com/czepeku/posts
So we did the playtest yesterday, and I agree with pretty much all your points but would add one more for the "pro" column. I had my group level up at the end so we could see how that felt. When it came to adding a new experience, all of my players without prompting added some that referenced something that had happened during the session. It made me realize that Daggerheart was subtly encouraging players to build their character based off what happened in the campaign, instead of building FOR the campaign, which i really like.
The Experiences mechanic is easily the strongest pro that Daggerheart has imo. Them being nebulous but specific, and yes, them potentially coming from what has already happened is something that I find so much more efficient and less restrictive than just D&D feats. They convey "vibes" and flavor, and I think that works great because the GM has no reason to not want to allow them if the ask in context is reasonable.
It's something the CR cast does so well in their main campaigns, it makes sense that they'd figure out a way to incorporate it into their format. It's awesome to hear everyone's stories!
I really liked how you could clearly see your path to lvl 10 on your character sheet. Also, each level felt like a gift compared to DnD where there are tons of flat levels with no gain.
This is something that RP centric groups/people do all the time of their own free will, but it's very nice to see it mechanically in a system that is in fact built for RP centric play.
So nice ro see my favourite youtubers dropping a comment for DC20 on a daggerheart video! I hope I see one of you talking about DC20 ;). Love what you do M.WorldBuilder!
You should definitely do more playtests, more videos, and don't forget to send them your feedback! This was very informative and you raised some great points. Thanks for all you do!
A note around 9:00. When talking about the enemies that resisted physical. I believe these are the final enemies of the encounter, and Resistance halves damage dealt (rounding up) before applying to thresholds. It should also be noted that example Adversaries in the Manuscript (Handbook) do show Adversaries with stress. So I believe the normal rules of damage below minor threshold would apply to adversaries as well. They would take stress until they tap out at which point they would take HP.
just seems like an enemy you wouldn't have out solo, let the party learn they are resistant so spellcasters can focus that one and the physical damage focus another.
This confirms some of what I was already thinking about Daggerheart and really paints the best picture I have seen yet on what it would be like to run! Thanks for putting all this work into this breakdown, and thanks for the props you give DC20 on being an Evolution! Definitely high praise!
I'm looking forward to DC20. I hope you can carve out a spot alongside the heavy hitters. Developing at the same time as Daggerheart and MCDM has to be wild.
Yeah, I really Hope that, by the end of this, we have at least 3 great spiritual successors of D&D with different gameloops, mechanics and styles of play
Definitely interested in it's development. Hopes and wishes it lands amazing! BONUS ROUND: I watch and would like to recommend Dave Thaumavore RPG Reviews if you haven't heard of him for inspiration to at least offer Variant rules for different types of games if not for core rules... Especially liked the clear language of his last review The Contract. Take care and bye 😃😇❤️
@everythingsalright1121 It is like a merging of DnD 5e and PF 2e. It uses a 4 action point system, stacking advantage and disadvantage, mana instead of spell slots, and stamina that martials can use for abilities. What I described is a very limited description and if you would like to know more the Dungeon Coach has a ton of videos over it and a channel called Brandon Lane has some videos going over it. Treantmonk's Temple also made a video about it and if you are interested in seeing it in action the Dungeon Coach has hosted two one-shots that are on his channel. I can't guarantee it will be for you, but I like everything I have seen about it and have supported the alpha.
@@ChandlerBaze Very interesting. I'll need to poke around those places and take a look-see. I'm new to playing D&D, and me and my friends really like it, but we do acknowledge the system has many flaws and we have to change a lot of rules and homebrew many things. So we're open to alternatives
Honestly this was everything I was hoping for for a review of this game system. No BS, covering all the pros and cons and what fixes could be applied in your opinion. Very solid! Thank you!
Given my experience with Daggerheart, I agree heavily with 2 sentiments that you touched on; there is an issue with resource overload put upon the GM, and that there are baked-in game mechanics that reward players for not engaging with the setting.
The first item you mentioned is going to kill DH in my local community. We struggle to find 1 DM who is willing to prepare for a bi-weekly session. And there are 50 players waiting for a DM.
@@kinjunranger140 100% - Daggerheart gives a lot of power and responsibilities to the GM. And if a TTRPG relies on having experienced individuals for it to function smoothly, it's doing a disservice to the TTRPG community as a whole.
Sounds exactly like MAtts (current) GM style. Take all the work off of your palyers shoulders and no matter how much they ignore your world and fuck around you still have them succeed.
One question with how much work it is on the DM is will that go away with more familiarity? Not like the DM ever gets an easy easy ride and the first time you DM anything probably feels overloading as you don't 'just know' how it works and what to do on the mechanical side of the game, or what fits within the lore of the world (if its not your world) etc. Most folks have been playing 5E and other very similar D&D like games where the rules and mechanics are similar for years, the Daggerheart system is a new twist (not sure if it really plays that well yet, but it is certainly novel).
@@TravistheGREAT03 I did get the vibe, while playtesting and reading the source material, that it caters to Mercer's (and possibly Spenser's) style of GMing and experience level.
Your videos are always wildly entertaining. Whether it's broken combos, a ranking video, or talking about a new system, you bring so much joy to the community. Thank you
About the Hope & Fear system... You should check the Conan 2d20 system which is where Daggerheart took it from. They call it Momentum & Doom, but there the DM can simply accumulate Doom in a pool if he doesn't wanna have to come up with something right away. And it can also simply be used to add extra dice to monster rolls, if there's nothing else to be done narrative-wise.
Same, was my thoughts exactly when I heard about the system in Daggerheart. But from my experience gming Conan 2d20 has more ways to spend momentum then Daggerheart seems to for hope. So much so, before the end of a scene or battle, players rarely had 1 or 2 momentum remaining after generating dozens throughout the scene. Though given it is still in beta it could very well change.
I love the cards because instead of a book and copying little notes from a book, I have a small deck of 5 or 6 cards at a moments in front of me that only take a small part of my area at the table. Super handy and I love it
I am glad you mention that it isn't a light system, because when I watched their video going over the system though I thought it has some cool mechanics I did think very quickly that this system is complicated and definitely didn't lean into some of the much simpler and lighter concepts I have been seeing in many newer systems.
So here's a weird thing - SOME of the enemies do have Stress scores, just not all of them for some reason, and there's a ton of guidelines in the combat/enemies sections about how to either create or improvise enemies (or "adversaries"). So the idea here about the enemies having Stress that they can take instead of damage is actually already possible, it's just not very well established in the premade enemies and it's not highlighted very well in the super duper dense guide book. My group is also really enjoying it so far, but there's definitely stuff we notice every time we look in the book that's like "OH weird I missed that, that changes things".
I would consider giving an enemy a stress if the PC misses with Hope, but I'm going to play it rules as written for now before making an homebrew rules like that
Kudos for your review! This was the first review from actual gameplay I've watched and I liked the way you approached it, in a honest, sensible and fair way. Funnily enough, I watched your rules review video earlier today and though "Oh well, I wish this was an actual gameplay review, but sure look, let's watch it anyway". :) Cheers!
Combat in Daggerheart sounds like a nightmare to figure out considering that the average dnd group is composed of approximately 5.5 adhd-riddled children trapped in the bodies of four nominal adults.
It almost feels as if it’d be necessary for everyone to use the online character sheet to keep track of everything, and even then there’s so much stuff happening. Plus, if you did end up using the online sheet, good luck having the players stay focused with a device in front of them. :/
@@captainapac I'd honestly probably just buy a bunch of differently colored beads or something as opposed to using the online sheet. Leaning in to that board-game feel instead of shying away from it and making all the resource management far easier to wrap your head around
We playtested it yesterday and honestly combat wasn't as bad as I thought I'd be. It took some time for our group to get in the flow, but once we did it took less time than a comparable battle in 5e, which is one of our big gripes with 5e. BUT my group is full of a lot of strong personalities (not rude, mind you, just a bunch of players who aren't afraid to speak up) so if your group has some quieter players, I can see how it can become a slog.
I kind of agree. It feels like mathfinder and 5e had a child, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. I feel that the Pathfinder and 3.5 folks will do very well with this system.
Maybe unrelated to the video topic, but I love Czepeku maps. Been using their maps for everything in my campaign and they’re gorgeous every time. Will be using their sci-fi maps for starfinder 2e when it’s out too. Great video, thank you for the synopsis, this video came out the same day I was thinking about Daggerheart too!
Its good to remind ourself that it is still in beta, so as long as there are some good concepts, that's the main thing that matters, since the balancing of the game will probably improve itself later
Yeah it feels like a lot of stuff is written vaguely, or sections are omitted entirely, with the idea that "we don't need to introduce this right now." It'll be interesting to see how things evolve as we get closer to a full release.
Great review. You have a methodical way of breaking things down and it's easy to follow. I’m excited for Daggerheart’s progression and would love to see more reviews as it gets updated.
@@witherxd2749 Its CR, I GUARANTEE that they're watching these videos anyways. They both want all the feedback they can get, and are all fans of these various creators themselves anyways, as they've said over the years
@@witherxd2749 I mean, sure, but in this specific case the entire design team probably can't really sit down to comb through hours of Dagger heart review content on RUclips. Especially since most of it will have a lot of overlap on points. I haven't dived into the test content yet, only made a character. But I'm sure the feedback forms are specifically designed with both survey questions, rating system and few open text box questions for a text dump. At least that's how these are usually done.
Hits the nail on the head with my concerns as a GM, it certainly feels like it was a game made for the show critical role. I do have concerns with my ability to run a fluid game of Daggerheart with the fear mechanic, despite feeling pretty confident to GM DND for the past 3 years. Though I do like the idea that every duality dice roll has a chance to either benefit the player or the GM's economy. Something I'm unsure on is, if combat is decided by which group has the higher HP and everyone know this, will that make encounters feel 'too simple'? idk like take that mystery from the players. Maybe I haven't done enough research on it (400 pages) and perhaps I'm off the mark. Obviously a great guideline for creating an encounter if you aren't confident with keeping players alive. As a player it sounds really fun.
"if combat is decided by which group has the higher HP..." It isn't. You misunderstood the point. What Daggerheart effectively does is merely limiting the roof of how much damage a single action can deal at a maximum. One-shotting a boss is basically impossible, so builds that try to deal unlimited damage aren't viable. Apart from that, the total hp on a side isn't any more a deciding factor than it is with D&D. And I'd hardly call it a mystery if a build focused on massive damage deals massive damage or not. That in mind, I don't see the final game having a whole ton of player options that can perform multiple attacks in one action. Probably also why a secondary weapon just boosts the main hand attack in DH. An entirely new attack might be OP, even at limited efficacy.
@@TheRawrnstuff, writes _'That in mind, I don't see the final game having a whole ton of player options that can perform multiple attacks in one action."_ If you want multiple attacks you just go again immediately -- all you have to do is justify it thematically. Taking turns is for pussies,
@@fred_derf You misunderstand what I said. You can go again immediately, but that gives the DM another action token - ie, that's two attacks for two actions. Not two attacks for one action.
I see what you are saying, thanks for explaining it. Perhaps some actual playtesting will educate me the best. I don't think I quite explained what I properly meant about the mystery thing, but that's neither here nor there.@@TheRawrnstuff
Fantastic set of videos about Daggerheart! Really well explained, really well critiqued, thank you! I downloaded all the gack for free and will start pouring over it myself soon enough. But getting your initial feelings and critiques has been good.. Seems like there are some great mechanics in the game, and even some things (like the open initiative) that could be ported into any game, really. Yes, I'd love to see more Daggerheart content here! Also, SHOUT OUT TO THE DUNGEON COACH oh yeah! :)
The thing about dagger heart, is that it genuinely feels more entertaining to watch then normal dnd, like when I finished the cr one shot, I was left wanting an entire series with these mechanics. It's just simply more entertaining hearing the dm and players explain how everything they do works. And there's just something about fear and hope that draws you into seeing how combat will go, it's not just another battle, it's a constant climatic battle that can change in a second if someone rolls a hope and gives the big bad a powerful attack. I do see flaws but it's still open beta and can easily evolve into something better.
I'll be honest, I think a LOT of that feeling is just coming from the fact that it's a new system we're all wide eyed about and it feels fresh and different. Like we're discovering what is possible in real time as we watch. It felt the same way when I first saw Critical Role and had never played D&D before. Once I knew the system well, everything became much more boring to watch because someone saying "I cast crown of madness" didn't seem like some super cool esoteric thing you can learn as an awesome spellcasting mage. Rather it was now just another ordinary spell out of hundreds of spells in a system that barely makes magic feel like magic and doesn't give casters the actual mage experience
Couple things I noticed about daggerheart: 1. DM should have some fear tokens when starting combat so they can force players to engage if they need to. It gives some agency back to the DM to balance player engagement. 2. I do agree that there's a lot of resources.
Best review of Daggerheart I've seen, and some great feedback for the Darrington Press team - I hope they're watching! Share the love on DC20 too. It just keeps getting better and better!
Yes please more Daggerheart stuff. I love having multiple eyes on this system to critique it cause I'd love for it to be the next step in the evolution of ttrpgs and the only way to do that is iron out those kinks. Thanks for being awesome.
I'll say it again. Anything that makes D&D players try new systems is a win for everyone. If they can take one step to trying something new, the next one might be easier, and so on. There are so many wonderful TTRPGs out there than some people will absolutely love, and I want that for them.
Thanks for the breakdown! My regular group haven’t been available to run the one-shot so it’s good to see what others think. Hopefully the team take the feedback onboard and make improvements. Can’t wait to dive into MCDM too.
Yes dc20!!!! I love the idea that people are highlighting this game for the system. Not cause Critical role or WOTC or MCDM. Its much lower profille but its being mentioned along side these big dogs cause of the strength of the game design alone. To me thats very punk rock
as much as it is important to always try out things for yourself to make up your own mind and feel about a game, i wanna THANK YOU SO MUCH for being so thorough in describing your experience (and with mostly facts rather than opinions) to save me the time i sadly don't have to try everything out
you’ve left me now wanting to give this a go, i do agree the cards are what makes this game feel different,id love to see you do more content on Dagger heart. love you channel man, keep on keeping on.😁🇬🇧
I get your point about pre-picked experiences, they are way to really customize your character and make it yours. But the point of pre-made characters is that you don't have to worry about filling in anything, so I think it's fine.
Great vid - any time we get a greater explanation of a new system or variances we get a greater insight of whether this is a game I could play (noting we should always try it ourselves). More on Daggerheart please
I really love the Daggerheart content! I mean, I'm a very curious Critter but don't have the Time to try this atm for personal reasons. So having this to really look into it and hear someone who's experienced und curious is lovely. I'd gladly see more!
When My friends and I first started DnD (Back when we could all meet up in person), I got spell cards for all the spells in 5e. Having those spell cards helped us so much starting out instead having to pass the handbook to double check what a spell did. Each player had the cards of the spells their characters knew for quick and easy reference or, like you said, thumb through while to figure what to do in combat when it is their turn.
Please do more dagger heart content. I’d love to hear breakdowns of the character classes. What makes them different from the dnd classes. And what ability card combos there are
Something I really like between this two videos about DH was that the cards (something i really like to use) went from an acessory to the most promesing stuff. Our dear youtuber really is able to go back on a point when he actually experiences it and that is the sort of thing that is lacking on the internet as a whole
Yeah man of course we want more daggerheart stuff! This is a really good take on the game. My table hasn't played yet, and I've kind of been dreading the "gm raise the stakes/fear" thing, but we'll see how it goes. Keep up the good work!
Thusfar Daggerheart has yet to thrill me from the content I've seen you put out so far. You've got me intrigued about this D20 evolution of 5e though... not intrigued enough to look into it myself, but definitely intrigued enough to watch any content you put out on it. Which would be a more impressive statement if I wasn't going to inevitably going to watch any content you put out about literally anything...
Would LOVE to see more Daggerheart stuff like how you do all your fun builds and breaking the game style videos. And since walloping massive amounts of damage doesn't do the same effect as it does in DnD, it would be awesome to discover how an optimized character in this system would act. Plus, with the domain system there's technically SO many ways to build a character! Thank you so much for this video. Excited to try the game myself. :)
This amazing insight to the game. Great feed back that I hope CR and Darrington Press hears. Its great we have people reviewing serious games like this to help the community out in moving forward towards other games.
Your grandma has a MAGNIFICENT beard! Good look at the system. There’s a lot of things to like, and some areas it can definitely improve, but this beta really gives me hope for the full system. I really want to play this with my group and i think it’s something that will be great for our style of play.
Love your awesome work and the time and effort you out into this video! I haven’t actually played much less dm’d daggerheart, so take this with a good pinch of salt, but: I strongly believe that all of the points you made regarding it being more work and more stress - more prep and thought and more “scrambling to find/narrate things to happen” that falls on the GM, is in good part because it’s completely new for you too. Of course you are a grandmaster DM ;) but all the things you do without thinking about it in a dnd session, comes from the countless hours you’ve spent Dm’ing. just like everything else; when starting a new skill or Job or anything, its almost impossible to imagine how all this is going to be processed by our subconscious without much strain on our “CPU” 😂 but given enough time, it becomes second nature to virtually everyone. I welcome and appreciate all the love, work, and contributions brought into the DnD community, and am and remain hopeful that Daggerheart will be a huge sucess ✨❤️ :)
My favorite system that is easier on the DM is Son of Oak's "City of Mist". The manual even says you are more than the Master of Ceremonies (MC), you are a part of the audience. This emphasizes player rp importance and we've been having a blast.
Please do more playtests! Since it's in open beta this is everyones chance to really make real changes to how the game works for the betterment of the game. I’ve been wanting to run a game of daggerheart and haven't really had the motivation yet but your video has really enlightened me a lot about what the game has to offer. Thank 🙇 you.
I personally would love to hear more about Daggerheart. Are there any changes to the classes, ideas on new cards, and what are those experiences you were talking about? Any new content that you put out I'm watching either way.
Definitely appreciating the Daggerheart feedback as I am still trying to get a play group together for testing. Would love to see something like in depth class guides or class ranking, etc.
Perfect, this is exactly the content I want, I want to know what the people in the know are saying about Daggerheart. I hope by the time Daggerheart is a finished product, your feedback will have shaped the game for the better so that a casual like me who primarily watches live plays instead of playing TTRPGs myself will want to drop money on it.
I was invited to do the character creation playtest but it ended up being too complicated for me to wrap my head around. I really enjoy your thoughts, please keep sharing them!
I'm glad to hear someone has a similar opinion about the open initiative system. Spencer said it was formulated to solve the problem of 'player takes turn, then has to sit and wait for their next turn'. But open initiative doesn't solve that. And that is a table issue, not a system issue. There are things that can happen to you when it's not your turn. And even it it doesn't, you should be paying attention and preparing for your next turn. More than that, the system is turn swingy. One player might get a turn, miss with fear, and now it's the GM's turn. Or the players might get 6 or 10 actions in a row, and then cede that many actions to the GM. But the biggest issue I had, which you touched on, is what happens if the group dynamic is unbalanced. Even in D&D and other strict order systems, loud/forceful/extroverted players can take the limelight, pushing quiet/introvert players to the background. Without malicious intent or even intending to do it. In a system where, in order to get a turn, a player has to specifically speak up and ask for it, that's bad. And depending on the people at the table saying 'Hey, it should be X's turn' could be almost as bad. With a rigid turn order, that isn't an issue.
Funnily enough I ran into similar issues while playtesting a game that I was making where player actions and decisions gave the GM resources. Unless you spend a whole lot of time during prep deciding what kinds of cool things can happen, you run out of steam coming up with things on the spot very quickly. Unfortunately, I never finished my game because I have Professor Calamitous levels of follow through, but now I don't really feel like I need to since Daggerheart does so many things I was doing. One of the big things I learned through playtesting was to turn the GM resource into a narrative tool outside of the game itself. Any leftover fear should be banked at the end of the session, and the GM should be able to use it to advance the state of the world during prep (usually in ways that make the player's story/mission more complicated or difficult). The game should also give guidance on what this look like with approximate fear costs for different types of world advancement. This change made players so much more conscious of fear gain and raised the narrative tension of the game even when I couldn't think of anything to spend the resources on during the session. Also as a GM it just makes it far less pressure in the moment to think of things to spend stuff on. You can just respond to the direct action, hold the fear, and move on. I have some other thoughts, but I'll leave it there for now 😅
I'm super interested in the new daggerheart system and this has been super helpful in preparing me for the one shot i hope to run of the same adventure. Please do keep doing daggerheart content i love to see your takes!
Fun fact I originally had the criminal caller sound like my mum but my mum watches my videos and she's awesome and I didn't want her to feel bad so I changed it to my grandma cos she's dead so no worries there. Anyway *GRAB* *YOUR* *CZEPEKU* *MAPS* *HERE!!* www.patreon.com/czepeku/posts
😭
💀💀💀 dude...
Wow ... 😂
Throwing shade at your own dead grandma because she can't fight back... 🤣
😂😂😂😂😂😂
So we did the playtest yesterday, and I agree with pretty much all your points but would add one more for the "pro" column.
I had my group level up at the end so we could see how that felt. When it came to adding a new experience, all of my players without prompting added some that referenced something that had happened during the session. It made me realize that Daggerheart was subtly encouraging players to build their character based off what happened in the campaign, instead of building FOR the campaign, which i really like.
The Experiences mechanic is easily the strongest pro that Daggerheart has imo. Them being nebulous but specific, and yes, them potentially coming from what has already happened is something that I find so much more efficient and less restrictive than just D&D feats. They convey "vibes" and flavor, and I think that works great because the GM has no reason to not want to allow them if the ask in context is reasonable.
It's something the CR cast does so well in their main campaigns, it makes sense that they'd figure out a way to incorporate it into their format. It's awesome to hear everyone's stories!
@@lonewaer This makes me really want a Daggerheart video game adaptation.
I really liked how you could clearly see your path to lvl 10 on your character sheet. Also, each level felt like a gift compared to DnD where there are tons of flat levels with no gain.
This is something that RP centric groups/people do all the time of their own free will, but it's very nice to see it mechanically in a system that is in fact built for RP centric play.
Solid review, and I love to see the shout out for DC20!
Hi Bob. I love you pal.
So nice ro see my favourite youtubers dropping a comment for DC20 on a daggerheart video! I hope I see one of you talking about DC20 ;). Love what you do M.WorldBuilder!
@@BIGBENMACDOUCEcan't wait for "crazy things you can do in DC20 part 13" videos
I also came to say Hi Bob.
You should definitely do more playtests, more videos, and don't forget to send them your feedback! This was very informative and you raised some great points. Thanks for all you do!
Very much agree! The spate of D&D-likes coming out could all benefit from this same analysis.
Agreed!
Oh I guarantee the CR team has people watching, this video IS his feedback lmao. At least some of it
I mean honestly just amazing it's open beta because it's very open to the positive as well as negative critique as to how to better the system ^^
A note around 9:00. When talking about the enemies that resisted physical. I believe these are the final enemies of the encounter, and Resistance halves damage dealt (rounding up) before applying to thresholds. It should also be noted that example Adversaries in the Manuscript (Handbook) do show Adversaries with stress. So I believe the normal rules of damage below minor threshold would apply to adversaries as well. They would take stress until they tap out at which point they would take HP.
Enemies not having stress might be an artifact from an earlier iteration
just seems like an enemy you wouldn't have out solo, let the party learn they are resistant so spellcasters can focus that one and the physical damage focus another.
This confirms some of what I was already thinking about Daggerheart and really paints the best picture I have seen yet on what it would be like to run! Thanks for putting all this work into this breakdown, and thanks for the props you give DC20 on being an Evolution! Definitely high praise!
The praise is more than well deserved. I can't wait to see where you go with it!
I'm looking forward to DC20. I hope you can carve out a spot alongside the heavy hitters. Developing at the same time as Daggerheart and MCDM has to be wild.
Yeah, I really Hope that, by the end of this, we have at least 3 great spiritual successors of D&D with different gameloops, mechanics and styles of play
More DC20 please ;)
Definitely interested in it's development. Hopes and wishes it lands amazing!
BONUS ROUND: I watch and would like to recommend Dave Thaumavore RPG Reviews if you haven't heard of him for inspiration to at least offer Variant rules for different types of games if not for core rules... Especially liked the clear language of his last review The Contract. Take care and bye 😃😇❤️
Please share this vid with Critical Roll, this was super informative. As someone thinking about trying Daggerheart and DC20, I appreciate this.
I can confirm Dungeon Coach's DC20 is very, VERY good. Professional level. -Professor DM, Dungeoncraft
Yes
What sets it apart? I've never heard of it
Hell yeah
@everythingsalright1121 It is like a merging of DnD 5e and PF 2e. It uses a 4 action point system, stacking advantage and disadvantage, mana instead of spell slots, and stamina that martials can use for abilities.
What I described is a very limited description and if you would like to know more the Dungeon Coach has a ton of videos over it and a channel called Brandon Lane has some videos going over it. Treantmonk's Temple also made a video about it and if you are interested in seeing it in action the Dungeon Coach has hosted two one-shots that are on his channel.
I can't guarantee it will be for you, but I like everything I have seen about it and have supported the alpha.
@@ChandlerBaze Very interesting. I'll need to poke around those places and take a look-see. I'm new to playing D&D, and me and my friends really like it, but we do acknowledge the system has many flaws and we have to change a lot of rules and homebrew many things. So we're open to alternatives
Honestly this was everything I was hoping for for a review of this game system. No BS, covering all the pros and cons and what fixes could be applied in your opinion. Very solid! Thank you!
Given my experience with Daggerheart, I agree heavily with 2 sentiments that you touched on; there is an issue with resource overload put upon the GM, and that there are baked-in game mechanics that reward players for not engaging with the setting.
The first item you mentioned is going to kill DH in my local community. We struggle to find 1 DM who is willing to prepare for a bi-weekly session. And there are 50 players waiting for a DM.
@@kinjunranger140 100% - Daggerheart gives a lot of power and responsibilities to the GM. And if a TTRPG relies on having experienced individuals for it to function smoothly, it's doing a disservice to the TTRPG community as a whole.
Sounds exactly like MAtts (current) GM style. Take all the work off of your palyers shoulders and no matter how much they ignore your world and fuck around you still have them succeed.
One question with how much work it is on the DM is will that go away with more familiarity? Not like the DM ever gets an easy easy ride and the first time you DM anything probably feels overloading as you don't 'just know' how it works and what to do on the mechanical side of the game, or what fits within the lore of the world (if its not your world) etc. Most folks have been playing 5E and other very similar D&D like games where the rules and mechanics are similar for years, the Daggerheart system is a new twist (not sure if it really plays that well yet, but it is certainly novel).
@@TravistheGREAT03 I did get the vibe, while playtesting and reading the source material, that it caters to Mercer's (and possibly Spenser's) style of GMing and experience level.
Great video - DC20 is coalescing into a fantastic game and I would love to see more content about it!
Your videos are always wildly entertaining. Whether it's broken combos, a ranking video, or talking about a new system, you bring so much joy to the community. Thank you
I really want to hand you a few things and hear your thoughts on it
About the Hope & Fear system... You should check the Conan 2d20 system which is where Daggerheart took it from. They call it Momentum & Doom, but there the DM can simply accumulate Doom in a pool if he doesn't wanna have to come up with something right away. And it can also simply be used to add extra dice to monster rolls, if there's nothing else to be done narrative-wise.
Same, was my thoughts exactly when I heard about the system in Daggerheart. But from my experience gming Conan 2d20 has more ways to spend momentum then Daggerheart seems to for hope. So much so, before the end of a scene or battle, players rarely had 1 or 2 momentum remaining after generating dozens throughout the scene. Though given it is still in beta it could very well change.
Fear can also be added to a pool
I love the cards because instead of a book and copying little notes from a book, I have a small deck of 5 or 6 cards at a moments in front of me that only take a small part of my area at the table. Super handy and I love it
I am glad you mention that it isn't a light system, because when I watched their video going over the system though I thought it has some cool mechanics I did think very quickly that this system is complicated and definitely didn't lean into some of the much simpler and lighter concepts I have been seeing in many newer systems.
You are the ONLY person that does not allow me to skip sponsorship segments... because they are mesmerizing. Thank you.
So here's a weird thing - SOME of the enemies do have Stress scores, just not all of them for some reason, and there's a ton of guidelines in the combat/enemies sections about how to either create or improvise enemies (or "adversaries"). So the idea here about the enemies having Stress that they can take instead of damage is actually already possible, it's just not very well established in the premade enemies and it's not highlighted very well in the super duper dense guide book.
My group is also really enjoying it so far, but there's definitely stuff we notice every time we look in the book that's like "OH weird I missed that, that changes things".
I'm going to assume it's the enemies that are meant to play more like the main guys rather than the rabble that follow the main guys?
The ones that don't have Stress scores are those that have a Minor damage threshold of 1, so if you hit them they will take at least 1 hp.
I would consider giving an enemy a stress if the PC misses with Hope, but I'm going to play it rules as written for now before making an homebrew rules like that
Kudos for your review! This was the first review from actual gameplay I've watched and I liked the way you approached it, in a honest, sensible and fair way. Funnily enough, I watched your rules review video earlier today and though "Oh well, I wish this was an actual gameplay review, but sure look, let's watch it anyway". :) Cheers!
Combat in Daggerheart sounds like a nightmare to figure out considering that the average dnd group is composed of approximately 5.5 adhd-riddled children trapped in the bodies of four nominal adults.
It almost feels as if it’d be necessary for everyone to use the online character sheet to keep track of everything, and even then there’s so much stuff happening. Plus, if you did end up using the online sheet, good luck having the players stay focused with a device in front of them. :/
@@captainapac I'd honestly probably just buy a bunch of differently colored beads or something as opposed to using the online sheet. Leaning in to that board-game feel instead of shying away from it and making all the resource management far easier to wrap your head around
We playtested it yesterday and honestly combat wasn't as bad as I thought I'd be. It took some time for our group to get in the flow, but once we did it took less time than a comparable battle in 5e, which is one of our big gripes with 5e. BUT my group is full of a lot of strong personalities (not rude, mind you, just a bunch of players who aren't afraid to speak up) so if your group has some quieter players, I can see how it can become a slog.
That’s why there’s an action tracker
I kind of agree. It feels like mathfinder and 5e had a child, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. I feel that the Pathfinder and 3.5 folks will do very well with this system.
Maybe unrelated to the video topic, but I love Czepeku maps. Been using their maps for everything in my campaign and they’re gorgeous every time. Will be using their sci-fi maps for starfinder 2e when it’s out too.
Great video, thank you for the synopsis, this video came out the same day I was thinking about Daggerheart too!
Its good to remind ourself that it is still in beta, so as long as there are some good concepts, that's the main thing that matters, since the balancing of the game will probably improve itself later
Yeah it feels like a lot of stuff is written vaguely, or sections are omitted entirely, with the idea that "we don't need to introduce this right now."
It'll be interesting to see how things evolve as we get closer to a full release.
Great review. You have a methodical way of breaking things down and it's easy to follow. I’m excited for Daggerheart’s progression and would love to see more reviews as it gets updated.
Great breakdown, cheers! Excited to see how Daggerheart evolves from now until release.
YES, very much so!
I would actually like to see you talk about DC20 since you mentioned it in the video
Agreed
Seconded
Agreed!
Yes!
Indeed! Such a good system!
More DC20 stuff!
Love the vid. This gave me much more clear understanding of DH
I really hope CR sees these videos cause any takes for an open beta are really good and I agree with alot of what you described
I mean they have an open feedback form and are encouraging everyone to give their feedback so they can work on the system more
@@TheBlueSuperDude yea I know that but it doesnt hurt to look at videos instead of forms yk?
@@witherxd2749 Its CR, I GUARANTEE that they're watching these videos anyways. They both want all the feedback they can get, and are all fans of these various creators themselves anyways, as they've said over the years
@@witherxd2749 I mean, sure, but in this specific case the entire design team probably can't really sit down to comb through hours of Dagger heart review content on RUclips. Especially since most of it will have a lot of overlap on points. I haven't dived into the test content yet, only made a character. But I'm sure the feedback forms are specifically designed with both survey questions, rating system and few open text box questions for a text dump. At least that's how these are usually done.
These videos feel like an evolution of your content, I would love to see more playtesting and more reviews (really informative content)!
Hits the nail on the head with my concerns as a GM, it certainly feels like it was a game made for the show critical role. I do have concerns with my ability to run a fluid game of Daggerheart with the fear mechanic, despite feeling pretty confident to GM DND for the past 3 years. Though I do like the idea that every duality dice roll has a chance to either benefit the player or the GM's economy.
Something I'm unsure on is, if combat is decided by which group has the higher HP and everyone know this, will that make encounters feel 'too simple'? idk like take that mystery from the players. Maybe I haven't done enough research on it (400 pages) and perhaps I'm off the mark. Obviously a great guideline for creating an encounter if you aren't confident with keeping players alive.
As a player it sounds really fun.
I mean. Its the same in all games though. As long as you hit 0 before me i dont lose.
"if combat is decided by which group has the higher HP..."
It isn't. You misunderstood the point. What Daggerheart effectively does is merely limiting the roof of how much damage a single action can deal at a maximum. One-shotting a boss is basically impossible, so builds that try to deal unlimited damage aren't viable. Apart from that, the total hp on a side isn't any more a deciding factor than it is with D&D. And I'd hardly call it a mystery if a build focused on massive damage deals massive damage or not.
That in mind, I don't see the final game having a whole ton of player options that can perform multiple attacks in one action. Probably also why a secondary weapon just boosts the main hand attack in DH. An entirely new attack might be OP, even at limited efficacy.
@@TheRawrnstuff, writes _'That in mind, I don't see the final game having a whole ton of player options that can perform multiple attacks in one action."_
If you want multiple attacks you just go again immediately -- all you have to do is justify it thematically. Taking turns is for pussies,
@@fred_derf You misunderstand what I said. You can go again immediately, but that gives the DM another action token - ie, that's two attacks for two actions. Not two attacks for one action.
I see what you are saying, thanks for explaining it. Perhaps some actual playtesting will educate me the best. I don't think I quite explained what I properly meant about the mystery thing, but that's neither here nor there.@@TheRawrnstuff
I just pre-ordered the full kit. I'd love more videos on it. Thanks!
Great video and an awesome shoutout for DC20! Also the Daggerheart stuff is cool too.
I will look forward to DC20 more than daggerheart for a better take in dnd experiences. I would love to see more of it in your channel
Big hype for DC20! I agree and glad you mentioned it here. DC20 feels like the next step in "D&D" ttrpgs!!
Dawm right!
Fantastic set of videos about Daggerheart! Really well explained, really well critiqued, thank you! I downloaded all the gack for free and will start pouring over it myself soon enough. But getting your initial feelings and critiques has been good.. Seems like there are some great mechanics in the game, and even some things (like the open initiative) that could be ported into any game, really. Yes, I'd love to see more Daggerheart content here!
Also, SHOUT OUT TO THE DUNGEON COACH oh yeah! :)
The thing about dagger heart, is that it genuinely feels more entertaining to watch then normal dnd, like when I finished the cr one shot, I was left wanting an entire series with these mechanics. It's just simply more entertaining hearing the dm and players explain how everything they do works. And there's just something about fear and hope that draws you into seeing how combat will go, it's not just another battle, it's a constant climatic battle that can change in a second if someone rolls a hope and gives the big bad a powerful attack. I do see flaws but it's still open beta and can easily evolve into something better.
I'll be honest, I think a LOT of that feeling is just coming from the fact that it's a new system we're all wide eyed about and it feels fresh and different. Like we're discovering what is possible in real time as we watch. It felt the same way when I first saw Critical Role and had never played D&D before. Once I knew the system well, everything became much more boring to watch because someone saying "I cast crown of madness" didn't seem like some super cool esoteric thing you can learn as an awesome spellcasting mage. Rather it was now just another ordinary spell out of hundreds of spells in a system that barely makes magic feel like magic and doesn't give casters the actual mage experience
Great review. I'd love to hear more real-world playtest experiences like this. Please do more daggerheart videos!
I'd love to see similar videos on DC20 and MCDM
Couple things I noticed about daggerheart:
1. DM should have some fear tokens when starting combat so they can force players to engage if they need to. It gives some agency back to the DM to balance player engagement.
2. I do agree that there's a lot of resources.
More DC20 content would b cool! Super excited for that game
Best review of Daggerheart I've seen, and some great feedback for the Darrington Press team - I hope they're watching! Share the love on DC20 too. It just keeps getting better and better!
Yes please more Daggerheart stuff. I love having multiple eyes on this system to critique it cause I'd love for it to be the next step in the evolution of ttrpgs and the only way to do that is iron out those kinks. Thanks for being awesome.
Really nice of your grandma to help with the sponsor segment. She sounds like a lovely lady.
Yes! More Daggerheart info, any crazy builds, DnD Class vs DH class, etc.
Love your videos and format, good work making the ads genuinely enjoyable!!
I’m really enjoying your Daggerheart content (I enjoy all your content but these videos are especially interesting to me). Please make more!
Enjoying playtesting DC20!
I'm loving seeing content like this on the channel!
Your style is perfect for this sort of informed opinion stuff with the emphasis on fun.
I'll say it again. Anything that makes D&D players try new systems is a win for everyone. If they can take one step to trying something new, the next one might be easier, and so on. There are so many wonderful TTRPGs out there than some people will absolutely love, and I want that for them.
Thanks for the breakdown! My regular group haven’t been available to run the one-shot so it’s good to see what others think. Hopefully the team take the feedback onboard and make improvements.
Can’t wait to dive into MCDM too.
Yes dc20!!!! I love the idea that people are highlighting this game for the system. Not cause Critical role or WOTC or MCDM. Its much lower profille but its being mentioned along side these big dogs cause of the strength of the game design alone. To me thats very punk rock
as much as it is important to always try out things for yourself to make up your own mind and feel about a game, i wanna THANK YOU SO MUCH for being so thorough in describing your experience (and with mostly facts rather than opinions) to save me the time i sadly don't have to try everything out
Great video, keep the dagger heart videos coming
Thanks for the run down, I enjoy the way you brake things down and would love to see some more Daggerheart covered!
Hella down for more Daggerheart content, and REALLY interested in DC20 content should that be on the table!
you’ve left me now wanting to give this a go, i do agree the cards are what makes this game feel different,id love to see you do more content on Dagger heart. love you channel man, keep on keeping on.😁🇬🇧
DC20 Mentioned!!!
Dagger heart is so awesome! I am excited to see the incredible people at CR take this solid advice on board and continue to inspire.
I get your point about pre-picked experiences, they are way to really customize your character and make it yours. But the point of pre-made characters is that you don't have to worry about filling in anything, so I think it's fine.
Definitely want more daggerheart videos. Really excited to see how they iterate on this.
LOL, the transition to the add was so smooth. I thought he was introducing the campaign villain at first
Thanks for the review - fun to see how you and your friends liked it.
Best commercial break ever. You outdid yourself with that one 😊
Great vid - any time we get a greater explanation of a new system or variances we get a greater insight of whether this is a game I could play (noting we should always try it ourselves). More on Daggerheart please
I really love the Daggerheart content! I mean, I'm a very curious Critter but don't have the Time to try this atm for personal reasons. So having this to really look into it and hear someone who's experienced und curious is lovely. I'd gladly see more!
Awesome review, thanks! Appreciate mentioning the time needed to set everything up and finish the initial story.
When My friends and I first started DnD (Back when we could all meet up in person), I got spell cards for all the spells in 5e. Having those spell cards helped us so much starting out instead having to pass the handbook to double check what a spell did. Each player had the cards of the spells their characters knew for quick and easy reference or, like you said, thumb through while to figure what to do in combat when it is their turn.
I just hope you sent your play test and comments in, people like you have a good chance to help fix these issues
Good review. Thank you. Yes, I would like to see your take on DH updates as significant ones come out
Yes please cover more of the community creations! I would love to hear you showcase more of Ryoko's guide, daggerheart and MCDM ❤
Please do more dagger heart content. I’d love to hear breakdowns of the character classes. What makes them different from the dnd classes. And what ability card combos there are
Something I really like between this two videos about DH was that the cards (something i really like to use) went from an acessory to the most promesing stuff. Our dear youtuber really is able to go back on a point when he actually experiences it and that is the sort of thing that is lacking on the internet as a whole
Great video! I definitely missed your wisdom and creativity on my feed!
Great synopsis. I love your balanced takes on RPGs. Keep doing what you’re doing.
Yeah man of course we want more daggerheart stuff! This is a really good take on the game. My table hasn't played yet, and I've kind of been dreading the "gm raise the stakes/fear" thing, but we'll see how it goes. Keep up the good work!
Thusfar Daggerheart has yet to thrill me from the content I've seen you put out so far. You've got me intrigued about this D20 evolution of 5e though... not intrigued enough to look into it myself, but definitely intrigued enough to watch any content you put out on it. Which would be a more impressive statement if I wasn't going to inevitably going to watch any content you put out about literally anything...
Definitely more Daggerheart content, please! I learned how to play PF2e by watching the Rules Lawyer, so this is how I primarily take in new systems.
Would LOVE to see more Daggerheart stuff like how you do all your fun builds and breaking the game style videos. And since walloping massive amounts of damage doesn't do the same effect as it does in DnD, it would be awesome to discover how an optimized character in this system would act. Plus, with the domain system there's technically SO many ways to build a character!
Thank you so much for this video. Excited to try the game myself. :)
Yes, would love to hear more reflections!
This amazing insight to the game. Great feed back that I hope CR and Darrington Press hears. Its great we have people reviewing serious games like this to help the community out in moving forward towards other games.
Your grandma has a MAGNIFICENT beard!
Good look at the system. There’s a lot of things to like, and some areas it can definitely improve, but this beta really gives me hope for the full system. I really want to play this with my group and i think it’s something that will be great for our style of play.
Loving your take on Daggerheart. Keep it coming!
We played over the weekend. I think many of my thoughts fall in line with yours.
Love your awesome work and the time and effort you out into this video! I haven’t actually played much less dm’d daggerheart, so take this with a good pinch of salt, but:
I strongly believe that all of the points you made regarding it being more work and more stress - more prep and thought and more “scrambling to find/narrate things to happen” that falls on the GM, is in good part because it’s completely new for you too.
Of course you are a grandmaster DM ;) but all the things you do without thinking about it in a dnd session, comes from the countless hours you’ve spent Dm’ing. just like everything else; when starting a new skill or Job or anything, its almost impossible to imagine how all this is going to be processed by our subconscious without much strain on our “CPU” 😂 but given enough time, it becomes second nature to virtually everyone.
I welcome and appreciate all the love, work, and contributions brought into the DnD community, and am and remain hopeful that Daggerheart will be a huge sucess ✨❤️ :)
Dude sounds like that Key & Peele master chef video. He had me going all over the place the entire time from "so, it's better" to "so, it's worse".
My favorite system that is easier on the DM is Son of Oak's "City of Mist". The manual even says you are more than the Master of Ceremonies (MC), you are a part of the audience. This emphasizes player rp importance and we've been having a blast.
Excellent review and well thought out tips. I hope they're watching.
I was very worried about the cards being too clunky at the table. I’m glad to hear that it wasn’t the case!
Please do more playtests! Since it's in open beta this is everyones chance to really make real changes to how the game works for the betterment of the game.
I’ve been wanting to run a game of daggerheart and haven't really had the motivation yet but your video has really enlightened me a lot about what the game has to offer. Thank 🙇 you.
Definitely wanna see more DHeart vids! Thanks!
I personally would love to hear more about Daggerheart. Are there any changes to the classes, ideas on new cards, and what are those experiences you were talking about? Any new content that you put out I'm watching either way.
I'd love to see more Daggerheart content! I'm gearing up to run and play some games myself, so It would be cool to hear more about your experiences!
Definitely appreciating the Daggerheart feedback as I am still trying to get a play group together for testing. Would love to see something like in depth class guides or class ranking, etc.
Perfect, this is exactly the content I want, I want to know what the people in the know are saying about Daggerheart. I hope by the time Daggerheart is a finished product, your feedback will have shaped the game for the better so that a casual like me who primarily watches live plays instead of playing TTRPGs myself will want to drop money on it.
I was invited to do the character creation playtest but it ended up being too complicated for me to wrap my head around. I really enjoy your thoughts, please keep sharing them!
i just had to pause the vid to appreciate the editing on them arms looks so clean better than some movies
I'm glad to hear someone has a similar opinion about the open initiative system.
Spencer said it was formulated to solve the problem of 'player takes turn, then has to sit and wait for their next turn'. But open initiative doesn't solve that. And that is a table issue, not a system issue. There are things that can happen to you when it's not your turn. And even it it doesn't, you should be paying attention and preparing for your next turn.
More than that, the system is turn swingy. One player might get a turn, miss with fear, and now it's the GM's turn. Or the players might get 6 or 10 actions in a row, and then cede that many actions to the GM.
But the biggest issue I had, which you touched on, is what happens if the group dynamic is unbalanced. Even in D&D and other strict order systems, loud/forceful/extroverted players can take the limelight, pushing quiet/introvert players to the background. Without malicious intent or even intending to do it. In a system where, in order to get a turn, a player has to specifically speak up and ask for it, that's bad. And depending on the people at the table saying 'Hey, it should be X's turn' could be almost as bad. With a rigid turn order, that isn't an issue.
Great review of Daggerhesrt, pros and cons. Now,during beta testing , is the tume to get those cons out there so changes can be made!
Thank you for the honest review! I want to hear more from you as developments happen in DH!
cool video, really enjoy your takes on this!!!!! would love to see more daggerheart breakdowns, concepts, etc!!! much love! :)))
This was incredibly helpful, thanks for doing what I just flat out don’t have the time for
Funnily enough I ran into similar issues while playtesting a game that I was making where player actions and decisions gave the GM resources. Unless you spend a whole lot of time during prep deciding what kinds of cool things can happen, you run out of steam coming up with things on the spot very quickly. Unfortunately, I never finished my game because I have Professor Calamitous levels of follow through, but now I don't really feel like I need to since Daggerheart does so many things I was doing.
One of the big things I learned through playtesting was to turn the GM resource into a narrative tool outside of the game itself. Any leftover fear should be banked at the end of the session, and the GM should be able to use it to advance the state of the world during prep (usually in ways that make the player's story/mission more complicated or difficult). The game should also give guidance on what this look like with approximate fear costs for different types of world advancement. This change made players so much more conscious of fear gain and raised the narrative tension of the game even when I couldn't think of anything to spend the resources on during the session. Also as a GM it just makes it far less pressure in the moment to think of things to spend stuff on. You can just respond to the direct action, hold the fear, and move on. I have some other thoughts, but I'll leave it there for now 😅
I'm super interested in the new daggerheart system and this has been super helpful in preparing me for the one shot i hope to run of the same adventure. Please do keep doing daggerheart content i love to see your takes!