Excessive pricing on certain trims is the reasons why Lightning isn't selling as much. I love my Lightning, it's a great truck. I got my XLT for 49k after tax credit, very reasonable given all the advantages of nearly zero maintenance, cheap home charging, power, quiet cabin, regen braking or one pedal driving, tons of storage and the ability to power my house. Ford should stick to making just two trims XLT and Lariat priced around 50k to high 60k. Very compelling trims. Anything above that, it becomes prohibitively expensive for regular folks. Simplify manufacturing by offering less options and making it affordable.
As a Lightning owner, I can’t imagine owning anything else. I think it’s so underrated. The only item on my wish list would be 350kW fast charging but I only use DC fast charging about twice a year so it’s not a huge need.
As a helicopter owner, I just can’t see myself without one. Never any traffic, and I can cross over any terrain and cut a 2 hour commute down to 30 minutes. I highly recommended everyone buy one.
@Cloud30000 Lame you can't fly it anywhere just plain Ole dumb, another non ev owner type comment. Yes I own 4 for my household, paid off and use the tax code to make them pay for themselves.
I just got my F150 lighting here in Canada I got the flash in Sept this year. Thanks for your videos it helped me buy the Lighting. I would say the heat pumped on the new 2024 model helps a lot I did a drive from Vancouver to Calgary and back the truck did great in the weather. What helps is the adapter to be able to charge at Tesla superchargers.
Your theories on Fords decision to halt production for 6 weeks are probably valid but the major reason is that UAW union employees request a lot of vacation time this time of year for Thanksgiving and the day after, Christmas week and New Years Eve and Day. Ford is simply making a wise business decision.
In terms of the Cybertruck, the ONLY ISSUE with it, is that the factory tires that it comes with UTTERLY SUCK! They are watered-down Goodyear Territory A/T tires which SHOULD BE CHANGED OVER to the full retail versions of the Goodyear Duratrac M/T tires at 35 inches or even better 37 inch tire sizes! Once you put MUCH BETTER TIRES on the Cybertruck, it is just as good as or even better than any Ford F150 Tremor or Chevy Silverado ZR2 or GMC Sierra AT4 series off-roader! V
I put in a reservation on the Scout pickup with range extender. Honestly, from where I sit, that's the last truck I'll ever need and will probably keep it till I die.
Why? You do realize J3400 is CCS and not tesla protocol so all Fords are already compliant and not true for any tesla made before 2022 without a hardware upgrade.
@@BarryObaminable I don’t have to use an adapter. I choose to use an adapter….that is the correct statement. I have only used a SC once so I haven’t “had to”. I know shit should better when you sensationalize if but speak the truth not your shitty propaganda.
I love my Sierra EV and couldn’t imagine wanting a hybrid after towing long distance with it. The charging is fast enough that I don’t wait for the truck, I just plug in whenever I make a stop and unplug when I leave. It adds enough range to keep going all day. Best towing truck I’ve ever had and the awesome interior keeps the family happy too.
The lightning is a electric version of the gas version which kind of made sense as that is what drivers are use to but for needs to build a aero efficient truck and it appears they are going to do that with a ford ranger ev . The lightning is the best thing i have driven .
Roman: “we are not the type of journalists who like hold back the info and not tell you the results and make you watch another video.” Also Roman:”don’t spoil it Andre, go watch the video to hear our thoughts.”
If the Silverado EV offered 6 seats, I’d have one already. I literally can’t wait for long distance EV trucks and I don’t want the complexity of range extenders or the extra weight eating at my towing capacity and payload. I can’t wait to kiss diesel emissions and clogging dpfs to the curb.
I bought the F150 Lighting and love it but yes I am not a person that tows long distance but I have been enjoying it for many months. Never going to back to gas for trucks. I leave that for my RV for long trips. Not fan of range extender
Purchased the Lightning back in March. Own 2 Tesla's. I have zero buyers remorse and I had a cyber reservation I canceled 2 weeks after first deliveries. I only paid before taxes etc $73,600. Totally pleased.
BYD has just released a range extender PHEV pickup/ute (Shark 6) in Australia and New Zealand that is between a Ranger and F150 in size, gets a claimed 100 km (60 miles) EV range (probably more like 80 km [50 miles] in reality) and 800 km (500 miles) combined range for AUD58,000 (USD38,000) plus on road costs. It has a very roomy and well appointed interior (big screen + binnacle + HUD) and 1.52 m (5') bed, dual electric motors + 1.5 L turbo petrol engine that can recharge the battery but also drives the front wheels at higher speeds and has a combined power of 321 kW (430 hp) and 650 NM (480) torque. The downsides are lower payload (790 kg [1,740 lb]) and towing capacity (2,500 kg [5,500 lb]) than its rivals. I guess it will never come to the US because of your tariffs on foreign vehicle but utes/pickups are the most popular segment here in Australia and I think they will sell like hotcakes.
Beyond tariffs, Americans won't buy cars made in China...too many safety and quality issues to even list. But let's just start with "why would you ever trust China to make something that relies on software and has your safety in its hands???!!". No way, lol.
Just imagine if Ford still had affordable cars like the Fiesta, Focus and Fusion when working-class people are struggling and might still need an affordable new car……. They might actually have something market-appropriate to sell.
F-150 is built on a frame with a battery compartment, the others are dedicated skateboard platform. Ford needs to launch an electric truck on its own platform for the broader market. The other platforms will be around for a much longer time. GM will sell well once they get their pricing right. Unfortunately right now in the US many have been priced out of the new vehicle market of any kind
I think people are overthinking the "6 week" stop for switching to model year 25'. My 23' F150 Lightning was built the month of November of 22' and they didn't produce any the week of Thanksgiving or Christmas so they are only not producing for less than one month total but everyone wants to create a story for nothing.
Thank you for mentioning this. I worked at a Pulp Mill and they ran like car manufacturing 24/7 for 11 months, then scheduled maintenance and updates for a month. I believe this is all this shutdown is nothing sinister.
? Did the Cybertruck now selling for $80,000.00 have anything to do with it? I test drove a dual motor Cybertruck, and they are HUGH. At 6'2", I could not see where the front fenders are, and the back seat area was not very large in reference to a Toyota Tundras Limited Crew cab. The turning was excellent, with lots of power.
The Cybertruck is shorter in both height and length than a midsized 2024 Toyota Tacoma double cab long bed pickup. The Cybertruck is as wide as an F150.
@ it was pretty underwhelming…..why? …… because there wasn’t much more there than driving the Lightning. Just the amount of room inside the Lightning and suspension is enough to keep me in the Lightning.
If Stellantis USA had “timing” right, they would be pulling RamCharger forward for earlier availability, and relaxing some on REV. If they came out at the same time, Stellantis would be able to sell more units per MWh of batteries. Maybe that’s why they’ve been quiet. Takes some doing to accelerate the timeline for anything with an IC motor due to all the Regulatory ‘hoops’ to jump through for a new or modified IC power train.
Makes sense to stop production and tool the line for the 25s especially if they have sufficient 24 inventory. I remember the F150 ICE did that a couple years ago as well
Demand for hybrids, whether plug-in or not, continues to remain higher than demand for BEV's. This is going to remain true for years, and fortunately we have trucks like the Ram Ramcharger to really become the new best-of-both worlds. I'm sure the GM EV trucks will ramp up and sell well, but they are definitely missing an opportunity at the right time for establishing marketshare in the hybrid space. IMO, they'll just end up being followers as usual, waiting to see how well the Ramcharger does. BTW, look at the power output, towing, and payload numbers on that truck and it really shows how getting rid of a big bulky ICE powertrain cuts weight down.
I don’t understand why people think a car that has 2 separate complicated systems neither of which is particularly good at its job is a good thing. U have more weight, more components that can go wrong. Their servicing is going to be expensive if ur planning to hold it long term. It’s the worst of both worlds. Stay ICE if BEV doesn’t fit ur lifestyle or go electric.
Except we don't have the Ramcharger. Ram is one of Stellantis' many divisions with sales problems. Ford's F-150 has been a sales leader for years, along with GM's trucks. Ram needs the Ramcharger badly, but Stellantis has the purse strings, and they're struggling right now. We might be in for a bit of a wait as they push the Hornet Hybrid to try and get volume sales and prove hybrids to the parent company.
Hybrids are the worst of both. Terrible serviceability, higher cost maintenance, infinitely more complicated to diagnose and repair as the miles add on. They’ll be avoided on the used market in years ahead.
@@aussie2uGA Sure. So all ICE or all BEV is the answer? You're correct on paper but that doesn't work in the world world. When gas is almost $4/gal is at-home electric charging comes to about $1.25/gal, it pays for the "problems". To be clear, I agree on the complication problem. Still, our governments have made energy expensive and incentives help cover the costs of the extra complication, so... what's up?
@@DeltaSierra426 well, I have a tundra and tesla. With 131k miles on the tesla, driven monthly between 4 states, the tundra sits now until it needs to tow something.
Your sales table is wrong: Rivian sold 50,000 in 2023, not 37,000. As of this video for 2024 for Rivian: It was 37,000 sold after August...add Sept(5,200) to make it 42,600 YTD after Sept. there is a production issue due to a component shortage...though they still expect more than 53,000 this year and may get to a projected 57,000.
I think GM needs to offer the 1.6TD as an onboard generator for the Silverado/Sierra EV and Hummer. It cpuld easily live in the frunk and just route the exhause to right behind the front wheel. Obvisoily a smaller battery would be needed, maybe 250 miles EV range and 250 mile RE.
@RayJohnson1980 not available, plus if I were going with a startup, I would do Edison Motors retrofit. But I really like the Silverado EV and think that small engine would do perfectly for this application.
I don’t get why gas car people hate electric cars. Ok EVs don’t work for you, so don’t get one. But they do work for some other people, so let them have if they want. Most of the time people are buying EVs because they can charge at home,fuel savings cost, safer, and more fun to drive, less maintenance. Not for environmental reasons. PS i’m against the mandates.
You have to spend money to make money. The losses at Ford, GM, etc... are due to investments in the infrastructure necessary to support EV/Hybrid development. The US won't be able to keep the Chinese out forever and unless our domestic automakers can compete with inexpensive EVs from China, their business will disappear overnight. Don't believe it? Look at what's happening to VW right now. EV sales in China have exploded and VW gas/diesel engine vehicles have completely tanked. VW gets 50% of its revenue from China and that revenue stream literally evaporated over night. VW as a company has $200 billion in debt and just lost 50% of their revenue stream. The same will happen to US automakers once China enters our market either by building their cars in the US or Mexico.
Here in western Canada, I had a chance to try my sister inlaw F150 Lighting 2021 extra range at the price tag $120 000 (more expansive in Canada) So far (3) recall, had to replace the big charger at home and the truck stop charging.......required new battery.....no truck for (2) month At -20C.....the range drop at 280km......
@@DonovanGoodwinFunny how several countries with the highest percentage of EV sales compared to ICE are cold weather places. EV batteries like to be warm. Keep them plugged in and precondition (warm up) the battery before setting out in cold weather and the range loss is minimal.
@@dvader3263 This just further proves my point. I've got to do all sorts of hoop jumping to make it viable and even still it isn't an exact recipe for no loss. I'm going to disregard your stats because they are most likely cherry picked trying to paint an image based on correlation. (Correlation does not equal causation)
It’s November so it’s not as dramatic as it sounds if the sales numbers are low. I think Ford got a great idea and it is a great plug. It just has to be improved.
I'm not sure I understand why it is that Rivian needs to change the looks of the vehicle to update it, but GM with the Hummer is okay with the same vehicle style.
F150 lightning is a great truck that's frankly underrated. However, the Silverado EV and the yet to be released Dodge RamCharger have way better range and charging capabilities. I think they are making the right move. Halt things, and take a new tack. They have to be competitive, and on paper, they aren't right now. I hope they figure things out.
Mmm. . . I don’t think this is the death of the electric truck. I love my Lightening. I live in Oklahoma. I do normal truck stuff with it: hulling, mudding and exploring. I do not use it for long distant movements. The Lightening does everything I need it to do. I don’t need to state the obvious flaws with this technology, we all know mileage and time to recharge absolutely sucks. However, within a shorter bandwidth this vehicle can out perform a traditional vehicle. It’s not a replacement for the gas or diesel trucks when it comes to high frequency use, but it could, with continued development in technology, get to be equivalent. . . Only one question who is going to pay for the R&D that is required to close that gap?
i would love a cyber trcuk but here in Canada the cheap version is 137k not everyone can afford that and the lightning pro epa 386km of range that sucks can't imagine during winter what kind if range it would make
Add native NACS and I’ll buy one. Guaranteed. With the stop in production. That should give ford enough time to change up factory to make native NACS possible
Ford Lightning plant is probably closed for more like 4 weeks. They very well likely probably already planned to be down the weeks of Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year's
Good video. I’m at 24k km on my 23 Lighting ER Lariat. Best pickup truck I have ever owned hands down. It makes no sense that they are not selling 10 Lightnings for every gas powered F150. The truck buying public is just so easily persuaded by the disinformation campaign against EVs. There are simply are no downsides other than those that only exist in the misinformed imagination of the prospective truck buyer. I think Ford, in shifting priority to PHEVs and Hybrids is a mistake. I bought a PHEV at the same time that I got my Lightning, thinking that the PHEV would be our go-to for long road trips. A month later and I regret getting the PHEV because the Lightning is just too good for road trips to not take it every time. We should have just gotten another EV, not a PHEV. 7 months in and that PHEV’s gasoline engine has run for all of 5% of the vehicle’s total use. That’s a lot of high tech gadgetry and old fashioned iron under the hood of that PHEV that is not being used. My money would have been better spent on batteries and electric motors.
When I was in my twenties I would get in a car and drive for 7 hrs straight. No thanks. Not doing that anymore. How often do you go on longer road trips, and how long are they? Give me some numbers and I’ll help you understand what makes the Lightning the best road trip vehicle I have ever owned.
@@Crab44It is only the service centres that are the trouble. Not the actual vehicle. Because I do not see been making money from you. Going to them, you are better off going to a external company for your service. And long road trips are not an issue. Especially with many different charging options, not including the most reliable. The Tesla supercharger network as charging option.
To all the haters. I tow my Yamaha AR250 all the time with this truck. No different in mileage range if I was using my 2018 Ram Power Wagon. My power Wagon goes from 12 mpg to about 8 mpg. I also use with my power washing company. Truck is excellent. It is as real of a TRUCK as any ICE vehicle. Stop trying to find something wrong with something that is continuously getting better. I’m a conservative and will probably never buy another ICE vehicle again in my life. Better ride, no maintenance besides tire rotation, windshield washer fluid, and cabin air filter. What’s not to love?
Stop lying, it's not a real truck. Also stop trying to convince people that there's no change in mileage while towing. The only thing it's good for is picking up groceries and it will be rendered useless in a few years with evolving technologies.
Clearly never said no change in mileage. Tows great. Less sag than any 1500 I’ve ever owned. Just picked up a 2000 payload of chlorine last week. I tow power washing trailer daily. You’re delusional.
@@brian5ono I said no different than the mileage loss in my Ram Power Wagon. I literally am lucky to get 8 MPG in my Power Wagon when towing. I would never tow cross country in an EV but much prefer it for the business.
Tesla is pausing builds because apparently each user they have to be certified by EPA for range and a few models are stuck waiting on them. So they paused new builds because they dont want to continue building last years. But they also have enough to continue selling.
Ford needs to focus on improving their core vehicles: F-series, Maverick, Explorer, and Expedition. The Lightning is a niche vehicle and not profitable and they have been discounting heavily just to move units. There are still new 23s out there with massive discounts.
The problem and the debate I have with range extender EV is you lose some of the cost saving by still having to do oil changes and and fuel. Is it worth needing the extended range for hauling when estimated haul range on full EV will be about 225 miles or 3 hours of driving. Also we have yet to see really what that does to the cost. With less batteries will it be cheaper because it is an engine they are already using. Or is it going to be more expensive for it because it has both. I think that will be the biggest factor. Also I know it is not here in America but I think you should have included the BYD truck.
Ford needs to advertise the E-Transit more. The new improved 2024 but no-one knows about it 89kWh battery, 180+ kW DCFC, 19.2 kW Lvl 2, heat pump, hauling plus mobile office and RV options.
In addition to flushing out dealer inventory, Ford could also be using the stoppage to implement manufacturing changes to reduce cost. This will help improve profitability.
I love my lightning. The only thing that I don't like which really doesn't matter to me is the depreciation on it. I bought it brand new, and not even a year later it depreciated by almost $40,000. If I wasn't going to keep it then I'd be upset but, everyone says to lease an electric vehicle nowadays.
It’s a phase. When I bought my tesla in 2018, I could have resold it for more than I paid around 2020/2021. Now in 2024, they’re worth far less. In my case, I’ve had so much fun with it over 130k miles, I would miss it if I let it go.
I think that would help sort it out if they got that compact maverick truck and actually made that an electric truck too. They made an electric version and if they had a midsize truck that was an electric not just the F150 lightning. I’m telling you right now because it’s pretty soon gas cars will be faced out, but I don’t think people don’t want to let you because I think people can’t afford them.
Dropped a deposit on the scout pickup for a laugh… cause I don’t mind bankrolling development costs. I want to see it come to market, and I have more faith in VW than I do stellantis right now… but I expect I’ll probably cancel the reservation when it comes due, as long as my V60 PHEV is still kickin. Hopefully there’s also more PHEV wagon choice by then, maybe a plug-in crown signia and CX-50, or a V90 successor…
I'm not sure the losses can be attributed to factory construction and R&D. Usually those are capitalized and not all the costs are absorbed up front. If this is the case, you should be able to see it in the financial documents. If long term liabilities have increased and/or cash equivalents have dropped, then you know it's even more expensive than the numbers you quoted for the EV segment.
The loss figures include "fixed costs" they specifically mention "factories, machinery and development" but don't break down those costs. Fords CFO mentioned they were close to profitability on some models this year and hope to reach profitability on those in the next year.
I’m betting that they gambled on battery costs dropping quickly, so the first couple years they don’t make a profit but after that the large batteries make the truck the most appealing and a hot seller so economics of scale allow them to get the batteries at a cheaper price.
A friend of mine thinks that will be available next year when the Escape and Escape hybrid are discontinued. Ford should definitely build one, it would be very easy to incorporate into the Bronco Sport, which is related to the Escape.
I'm willing to bet, that when Ford resumes production of the F-150 Lightning, it will have a much bigger battery. Ford was the first, (legacy) to market a full size EV pickup truck, but GM as shown them up with nearly double the battery capacity. Ford would do well, to add battery capacity to compete with GM. Trucks NEED big batteries, to be able to produce the high continuous horsepower hours, to tow large trailers for long distances. The only reason to own a truck, is to do the big jobs, carry heavy loads or tow trailers...Things you just can't do with a hatch back economy car.
Always fun to see how people making comments let their perceptions and selective reality about politics determine what they say they will or wont buy. No company passes your purity test. Get over it.
When is there going be a 2 door bench seat EV work truck with a 8’ or 6’6” box to carry fire wood, gravel, hay, lumber, sand, etc? For now I need going to keep my old pickup running for ever!
Could it be they want to stop bleeding money? That 22k trucks may have created a billion dollar loss. Almost 3% of their market cap. They really need to figure out how to make it a profitable truck all the while lowing the price so I can buy one. Edit: My math may be a little low...
Whoa hold on, those numbers are very misleading. My company supplies parts for the lightning. We weren't fully ramped into production until almost mid 2023, so numbers are higher in 2024 because they made more in 2024. Also our actual production numbers are under 25% of what we are tooled for and what we were told would be the production quantity. We also stopped our production months ago because we fulfilled their needs for the rest of the year. As a supplier to this truck, it's a disaster. They are only selling at all because they sell them at a huge loss . They lose I believe $30k per truck and there is a government incentive. Add $40k to truck ( amount needed to be profitable) and take away incentive and they wouldn't sell any. Rivian is only still in business because of Amazon vans. They lose money on every truck. Gm loses money on hummer. Why do you think ram is dragging their feet. It's a colossal mess. They should stop all ev production and concentrate on plug in hybrids
Rivian is quickly getting closer to profitability...faster than Tesla got there, and it will get exponentially faster when R2 and R3 production begins in 2025, as well as commercial Van sales will start soon, too.
@@mikelemoine4267. This is exactly why Ford shouldn’t have killed all their economical cars. The profits may have been lower but they were affordable to much more of the population and had volume. Ford killed those off- The Fiesta, Focus, Fusion, Taurus, Ecosport which was garbage anyways, and are about to kill off the Escape and Edge. The Bronco Sport is basically a higher-priced Escape, most having that 1.5 3-cylinder. Granted, in the last few years, that was a popular Escape engine, too. The Bronco Sport even now with lots of incentives starts at nearly $30k. You can get a Maverick for similar money but Ford’s vehicle prices shoot up from there. Ford ditched their affordable models thinking that a customer that could purchase an $18,000 Fusion would simply lye over and take buying a $50,000 Explorer or Mach-E. It may have looked good for quarter-to-quarter financials but was never gonna f’in happen. Now Fords chickens are coming home to roost and they deserve it! Don’t even get me started on their horrible lack of quality now.
@@brian5o I think they cancelled those smaller cars because they screwed up their reputation with the crappy dual clutch transmissions which they did everything they could to avoid standing behind. They claimed lack of interest in cars but Hyundai, Kia, Toyota and Honda's small cars were flying off the lots. I suspect the Escape and the Edge are losing out to the Asian competition as well. I'm not sure Hyundai and Kia are much, if any better at this point with their recent issues, but they have some nicely appointed models for a fairly competitive price and at least have a long warranty. Ford won't offer one because they know they didn't build it well enough to hold up. I don't get why they haven't dumped that 1.5L Ecoboost. They've been problematic from day 1, don't make that much power and don't get that great of fuel economy. It's neither Eco or Boost! A decently tuned N/A 4 cylinder would be better in all ways and reliable. I didn't buy my last new vehicle from Ford due to a horrible dealer experience so I can't comment on their current quality, but I've heard stories of leaky taillights crippling F150s, oil leaks from cheap plastic oil pans and other issues related to cheap plastic in places that should be aluminum. I like the Lightning and think it would be fine for a commuter for my purpose, and I've heard mostly good things on the forums, but the dealer experience has again turned me off Ford. Most of them are violating FTC rules about posting misleading prices but since NADA and others are suing the FTC to suppress enforcement they think they can get away with it. Maybe so from a legal standpoint, but they should realize other companies make EVs too. I still have an 03 F150 Harley Davidson Edition with a gazillion miles on it and all original drivetrain. No major issues in 21+ years and I can start it up and drive it anywhere without worrying about it, the original AC even still works. I seriously doubt most new cars made today will still be running around in 20+ years with a trip to the moon on the clock without having tens of thousands in repairs. All the EPA green initiatives focus on tailpipe emissions; maybe they should factor how new vehicles will puke their fluids all over the ground and end up in a landfill in 10-15 years as it will be too costly to keep them running.
I don’t have an EV; but when I received my registration renewal with it a green notification says, EVs will pay now extra 250 annually “Additional “ and will increase 10.00 each year for four years
All vehicles should be taxed per-mile based on the weight of the vehicle. Make those that drive the most in the heaviest vehicles that do the most damage to the road pay the most.
@@chiplangowski3298 That is why fuel taxes work so well. For gas and diesel vehicles, you pay a percentage for every gallon of fuel you purchase. The more you drive, the more you pay. Unfortunately, there isn’t a great system for taxing EVs the same way yet.
@@jamesh1641 fossil fuel-powered vehicles have to pay taxes to help fund roads whenever they fill up. There is not a system to tax EVs yet and some EVs weigh as much as commercial trucks therefore they cause more damage to the roadways. Do you feel that EV drivers shouldn’t have to pay to help maintain the roads they contribute damage to?
There’s going to be a certain kind of person who’ll beat their chest over declining EV sales. I own a lifted Bronco myself. What’s stopping me from owning an EV is pricing, not politics. Manufacturers have priced themselves out of markets by making 100k toys.
I was hoping for a more thorough investigation into the Lightning plant 2 month pause. Are they bringing in new robots to speed up production? Here in BC Canada the dealers can't get lightnings fast enough to meet demand. I called a few last week and they are saying they wont have any till April if ordered right now. They have the bloated Platinum's and Lariats nobody wants. but exeryone wants the XLT and Flash models and they are hard to come by. Ford could sell triple the lightnights if they made what people want.
The Cybertruck is the most popular EV Truck. When the PT Cruiser was introduced Chrysler sold 145,000 in its first year. What happens when everyone who wants a Cybertruck has a Cybertruck? It isn't like a Model 3 or Model Y. Those cars are relatively inexpensive and their design isn't polarizing.
@@Abebe345 -- The PT Cruiser was a $18-20K car. And they sold a lot of them. But, it styling was polarizing. After a few years, everyone who wanted one had bought one.
@@Abebe345 -- I don't like the styling and I agree with you. The only reason to buy the thing is the styling. As soon as the warranty expires, it's going to start costing the owners serious money in repairs. Complicated things are going to start breaking -- 4-wheel steering, hydraulic suspension, steering by wire, power tonneau cover. These are complex mechanical systems and Tesla is not known for robust complex mechanical systems. My advice? If you like it, buy it and keep it for a couple years. Then sell it on.
Cybertruck was still in preliminary production last winter and spring while Rivian has been ramped up for years. Also Rivian losing tens of thousands per truck to dump-into and control the market while Cybertruck is profitable from day one.
Increase sales is good, but the question is how many sales do they need to make a profit? My educated guess is all these companies are years away from that number.
The problem with the Lightning is the same problem with all new vehicles: price. EVs actually make sense for many use cases, but the high prices are a problem. ICE vehicles also face the same headwind, and if our government continues to overspend, the resulting inflation will eventually kill all new sales. Get ready to own a Chinese pickup at half the price because those days are coming.
my little 2014 f150 is chugging along with zero issues, zero payments, and zero charge time. i think ill keep it parked right next to my model y. it does things electric cannot do.
@@RayJohnson1980 because it wont tow my sailboat from my home to the launch ramp and back, wont tow my produce trailer anywhere i need it to go, and wont haul the kinds of loads that a farmer like me typically does.... plus its never, ever let me down despite the worst wishes of myriad ev goblins... and my model y is actually my FOURTH electric vehicle so im obviously sold on ev's (more so than the goblins i suspect) and well aware of what they can and cannot do. and its paid off. my eniro (kia) spent 90 days in repair because of some battery issue and because of hawaii's tough lemon laws i was able to return it and get all my money back. mercedes benz wouldnt let us keep our excellent smart car (with 70 mile range!) but it was perfect for what we needed it for. my fx zero is a motorcycle so towing... not really. fun though. saves gas.
Hybrids are not the way, just cause you have to plug them in to charge the battery and still use gas, that tech wayyy complicated to fix. As mentioned, there is not much of a bump in the gas range for trucks and suv's. Cars maybe?
How many of those are bought as part of government fleet sales? If these aren't going to everyday customers and just being sold to California who cares. Smoke and mirrors.
I know 4 people with lightnings. I also see quite a few private contractors driving them around, towing construction equipment. Its not a huge amount, but i see more and more, typically at least 1 or 2 per day and I don’t drive much.
Automakers charging a premium for EVs, pricing themselves out of any chance for success. Better support for infrastructure and stop with the cheap gimmicks and dealer markups.
Fair. TFL NEVER mentions pollution. Electric trucks only exist to minimize tailpipe emissions. The rest of the performance benefits are just to make them attractive enough.
Excessive pricing on certain trims is the reasons why Lightning isn't selling as much. I love my Lightning, it's a great truck. I got my XLT for 49k after tax credit, very reasonable given all the advantages of nearly zero maintenance, cheap home charging, power, quiet cabin, regen braking or one pedal driving, tons of storage and the ability to power my house. Ford should stick to making just two trims XLT and Lariat priced around 50k to high 60k. Very compelling trims. Anything above that, it becomes prohibitively expensive for regular folks. Simplify manufacturing by offering less options and making it affordable.
As a Lightning owner, I can’t imagine owning anything else. I think it’s so underrated. The only item on my wish list would be 350kW fast charging but I only use DC fast charging about twice a year so it’s not a huge need.
As a helicopter owner, I just can’t see myself without one. Never any traffic, and I can cross over any terrain and cut a 2 hour commute down to 30 minutes.
I highly recommended everyone buy one.
It's the best looking electric truck, it dosen't draw a ton of attention.
I'd happily trade my 19.2kW home charging for 350kW DC fast charging.
@@omgBenton I agree. I charge at 40A (9.6kW) at home and I have no issues with home charging.
@Cloud30000 Lame you can't fly it anywhere just plain Ole dumb, another non ev owner type comment. Yes I own 4 for my household, paid off and use the tax code to make them pay for themselves.
I just got my F150 lighting here in Canada I got the flash in Sept this year. Thanks for your videos it helped me buy the Lighting. I would say the heat pumped on the new 2024 model helps a lot I did a drive from Vancouver to Calgary and back the truck did great in the weather. What helps is the adapter to be able to charge at Tesla superchargers.
Today Nov 1st in my Rams on Ontario group on FB, someone posted a pic of the Ram REV out on the streets in Windsor Ontario
I want a Lightning pro with 320 miles and vinyl seats. Ford eliminated this.
I dont want to pay 80k for a lariat.
Ford worked a deal with the government so many agencies are getting lightnings now. You mean the army Corp of engineers are not getting vinyl seats?
I have that truck. I call it a unicorn because it’s white and very rare on the retail market.
get the Flash version
Your theories on Fords decision to halt production for 6 weeks are probably valid but the major reason is that UAW union employees request a lot of vacation time this time of year for Thanksgiving and the day after, Christmas week and New Years Eve and Day. Ford is simply making a wise business decision.
In terms of the Cybertruck, the ONLY ISSUE with it, is that the factory tires that it comes with UTTERLY SUCK! They are watered-down Goodyear Territory A/T tires which SHOULD BE CHANGED OVER to the full retail versions of the Goodyear Duratrac M/T tires at 35 inches or even better 37 inch tire sizes! Once you put MUCH BETTER TIRES on the Cybertruck, it is just as good as or even better than any Ford F150 Tremor or Chevy Silverado ZR2 or GMC Sierra AT4 series off-roader!
V
I put in a reservation on the Scout pickup with range extender. Honestly, from where I sit, that's the last truck I'll ever need and will probably keep it till I die.
If it ever comes. VW is having lots of problems and you’re talking about a truck that’s suppose to come out in 2-3 years.
Scout is a fraud just like lordstown and nikola truck.
They should only restart when it has a NACS port and only sell the extended range pack
Why? You do realize J3400 is CCS and not tesla protocol so all Fords are already compliant and not true for any tesla made before 2022 without a hardware upgrade.
@@kelviskelvis7140 Because people wont have to dick around with an adapter or have people unplug if for them
@@BarryObaminable I don’t have to use an adapter. I choose to use an adapter….that is the correct statement. I have only used a SC once so I haven’t “had to”. I know shit should better when you sensationalize if but speak the truth not your shitty propaganda.
and move the port to driver side rear of the truck
There are plenty of fleet buyers who have no need to pay the extra for an extended range.
I love my Sierra EV and couldn’t imagine wanting a hybrid after towing long distance with it. The charging is fast enough that I don’t wait for the truck, I just plug in whenever I make a stop and unplug when I leave. It adds enough range to keep going all day. Best towing truck I’ve ever had and the awesome interior keeps the family happy too.
Great video guys!! My choice would be the F150 Lightning ⚡️
Good choice!
The lightning is a electric version of the gas version which kind of made sense as that is what drivers are use to but for needs to build a aero efficient truck and it appears they are going to do that with a ford ranger ev . The lightning is the best thing i have driven .
Roman: “we are not the type of journalists who like hold back the info and not tell you the results and make you watch another video.”
Also Roman:”don’t spoil it Andre, go watch the video to hear our thoughts.”
😂
Lmao
I really wish the front of the lightning would look a little more exciting.
Maybe they should kinda copy the gas powered ones.
If the Silverado EV offered 6 seats, I’d have one already. I literally can’t wait for long distance EV trucks and I don’t want the complexity of range extenders or the extra weight eating at my towing capacity and payload. I can’t wait to kiss diesel emissions and clogging dpfs to the curb.
I will stick with my 1997 Chevy 1500 WT for now. In ten years or so I will see how many 2024 Lightnings are for sale and how much they will cost then.
I bought the F150 Lighting and love it but yes I am not a person that tows long distance but I have been enjoying it for many months. Never going to back to gas for trucks. I leave that for my RV for long trips. Not fan of range extender
Is there any speculation on Ford also optimizing their production? Perhaps making improvements as Rivian did with their recent “refresh”.
If you think that will make a price change, it wont
@ not worried about price change. More worried about making a better product.
Purchased the Lightning back in March. Own 2 Tesla's. I have zero buyers remorse and I had a cyber reservation I canceled 2 weeks after first deliveries. I only paid before taxes etc $73,600. Totally pleased.
yeah not changing oil is worth the extra $20,000
Waiting for a $50k ev truck to drop.
Bought mine new from dealer for $50,900
@michaelwitkiewicz7052 great for you. I'm not buying one unless I get the extended battery.
@@angelr4429 the one I bought was a new 2023 with
my friend just got her lightning for $62k canadian, thats $43,700 usd for a brand new Lightning.
@3184Patrick dealers around me are stuck at $55-60k for a flash. Just gonna keep waiting. It's definitely not a need at this point.
BYD has just released a range extender PHEV pickup/ute (Shark 6) in Australia and New Zealand that is between a Ranger and F150 in size, gets a claimed 100 km (60 miles) EV range (probably more like 80 km [50 miles] in reality) and 800 km (500 miles) combined range for AUD58,000 (USD38,000) plus on road costs. It has a very roomy and well appointed interior (big screen + binnacle + HUD) and 1.52 m (5') bed, dual electric motors + 1.5 L turbo petrol engine that can recharge the battery but also drives the front wheels at higher speeds and has a combined power of 321 kW (430 hp) and 650 NM (480) torque. The downsides are lower payload (790 kg [1,740 lb]) and towing capacity (2,500 kg [5,500 lb]) than its rivals. I guess it will never come to the US because of your tariffs on foreign vehicle but utes/pickups are the most popular segment here in Australia and I think they will sell like hotcakes.
Beyond tariffs, Americans won't buy cars made in China...too many safety and quality issues to even list. But let's just start with "why would you ever trust China to make something that relies on software and has your safety in its hands???!!". No way, lol.
Ok commie
This makes sense and I fully expected it. The new ones will have NACS.
Do u mean access to Tesla charging network?? So it needs Tesla to succeed??? 😂😂😂
I love my Lightning and will never go back to ICE
Just imagine if Ford still had affordable cars like the Fiesta, Focus and Fusion when working-class people are struggling and might still need an affordable new car……. They might actually have something market-appropriate to sell.
F-150 is built on a frame with a battery compartment, the others are dedicated skateboard platform. Ford needs to launch an electric truck on its own platform for the broader market. The other platforms will be around for a much longer time. GM will sell well once they get their pricing right. Unfortunately right now in the US many have been priced out of the new vehicle market of any kind
I take it youve never seen the lightning chassis
@8:00 oh yeah i definitely am interested in the range extended scout, i just don't do first model year vehicles
I agree with the range extender comment.
I have a reservation for the Scout SUV with range extender and a RAM charger.
I think people are overthinking the "6 week" stop for switching to model year 25'. My 23' F150 Lightning was built the month of November of 22' and they didn't produce any the week of Thanksgiving or Christmas so they are only not producing for less than one month total but everyone wants to create a story for nothing.
Thank you for mentioning this. I worked at a Pulp Mill and they ran like car manufacturing 24/7 for 11 months, then scheduled maintenance and updates for a month. I believe this is all this shutdown is nothing sinister.
Why? Did you see this month's job report. Not many have the spare money to buy or even lease one of these expensive vehicles.
Jobs report was low because of the hurricanes that hit 5 or 6 states.
@@steveb796 Still doesnt change the fact you need 60k minimum to get into the pixie truck market
@@yankeedoodle7693 no clue what the pixie truck market is.
? Did the Cybertruck now selling for $80,000.00 have anything to do with it? I test drove a dual motor Cybertruck, and they are HUGH. At 6'2", I could not see where the front fenders are, and the back seat area was not very large in reference to a Toyota Tundras Limited Crew cab. The turning was excellent, with lots of power.
Lightning is better
The Cybertruck is shorter in both height and length than a midsized 2024 Toyota Tacoma double cab long bed pickup.
The Cybertruck is as wide as an F150.
@@lrod8692How was your time driving the Cybertruck compared to your time driving the Lightning?
@ it was pretty underwhelming…..why? …… because there wasn’t much more there than driving the Lightning. Just the amount of room inside the Lightning and suspension is enough to keep me in the Lightning.
If Stellantis USA had “timing” right, they would be pulling RamCharger forward for earlier availability, and relaxing some on REV. If they came out at the same time, Stellantis would be able to sell more units per MWh of batteries. Maybe that’s why they’ve been quiet. Takes some doing to accelerate the timeline for anything with an IC motor due to all the Regulatory ‘hoops’ to jump through for a new or modified IC power train.
Makes sense to stop production and tool the line for the 25s especially if they have sufficient 24 inventory. I remember the F150 ICE did that a couple years ago as well
I think the OEM’s missed the mark on EV pickups. Should have started with small compact models going for range/efficiency/affordability.
Demand for hybrids, whether plug-in or not, continues to remain higher than demand for BEV's. This is going to remain true for years, and fortunately we have trucks like the Ram Ramcharger to really become the new best-of-both worlds. I'm sure the GM EV trucks will ramp up and sell well, but they are definitely missing an opportunity at the right time for establishing marketshare in the hybrid space. IMO, they'll just end up being followers as usual, waiting to see how well the Ramcharger does. BTW, look at the power output, towing, and payload numbers on that truck and it really shows how getting rid of a big bulky ICE powertrain cuts weight down.
I don’t understand why people think a car that has 2 separate complicated systems neither of which is particularly good at its job is a good thing. U have more weight, more components that can go wrong. Their servicing is going to be expensive if ur planning to hold it long term. It’s the worst of both worlds. Stay ICE if BEV doesn’t fit ur lifestyle or go electric.
Except we don't have the Ramcharger. Ram is one of Stellantis' many divisions with sales problems. Ford's F-150 has been a sales leader for years, along with GM's trucks. Ram needs the Ramcharger badly, but Stellantis has the purse strings, and they're struggling right now. We might be in for a bit of a wait as they push the Hornet Hybrid to try and get volume sales and prove hybrids to the parent company.
Hybrids are the worst of both. Terrible serviceability, higher cost maintenance, infinitely more complicated to diagnose and repair as the miles add on. They’ll be avoided on the used market in years ahead.
@@aussie2uGA Sure. So all ICE or all BEV is the answer?
You're correct on paper but that doesn't work in the world world. When gas is almost $4/gal is at-home electric charging comes to about $1.25/gal, it pays for the "problems".
To be clear, I agree on the complication problem. Still, our governments have made energy expensive and incentives help cover the costs of the extra complication, so... what's up?
@@DeltaSierra426 well, I have a tundra and tesla. With 131k miles on the tesla, driven monthly between 4 states, the tundra sits now until it needs to tow something.
Your sales table is wrong:
Rivian sold 50,000 in 2023, not 37,000.
As of this video for 2024 for Rivian:
It was 37,000 sold after August...add Sept(5,200) to make it 42,600 YTD after Sept. there is a production issue due to a component shortage...though they still expect more than 53,000 this year and may get to a projected 57,000.
yes, the missing component is people who want to buy the truck
I think GM needs to offer the 1.6TD as an onboard generator for the Silverado/Sierra EV and Hummer. It cpuld easily live in the frunk and just route the exhause to right behind the front wheel. Obvisoily a smaller battery would be needed, maybe 250 miles EV range and 250 mile RE.
I know a lot of people are gonna hate this comment? But if you want a range extender, suggest look at BYD and And the shark 6.
@RayJohnson1980 not available, plus if I were going with a startup, I would do Edison Motors retrofit. But I really like the Silverado EV and think that small engine would do perfectly for this application.
My 2023 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4xe , gets between 44mpge and 54mpge. The biggest factor affecting range is tires!
I don’t get why gas car people hate electric cars. Ok EVs don’t work for you, so don’t get one. But they do work for some other people, so let them have if they want. Most of the time people are buying EVs because they can charge at home,fuel savings cost, safer, and more fun to drive, less maintenance. Not for environmental reasons. PS i’m against the mandates.
Im excited about a ranger or Maverick ev. This is just more than what I need.
Sure, sell more!
They only lose 30K with each unit sold....
That will work!
You have to spend money to make money. The losses at Ford, GM, etc... are due to investments in the infrastructure necessary to support EV/Hybrid development. The US won't be able to keep the Chinese out forever and unless our domestic automakers can compete with inexpensive EVs from China, their business will disappear overnight. Don't believe it? Look at what's happening to VW right now. EV sales in China have exploded and VW gas/diesel engine vehicles have completely tanked. VW gets 50% of its revenue from China and that revenue stream literally evaporated over night. VW as a company has $200 billion in debt and just lost 50% of their revenue stream. The same will happen to US automakers once China enters our market either by building their cars in the US or Mexico.
Here in western Canada, I had a chance to try my sister inlaw F150 Lighting 2021 extra range at the price tag $120 000 (more expansive in Canada)
So far (3) recall, had to replace the big charger at home and the truck stop charging.......required new battery.....no truck for (2) month
At -20C.....the range drop at 280km......
Anywhere it's cold is a bad place for EVs. Just the reality for now.
@@DonovanGoodwinFunny how several countries with the highest percentage of EV sales compared to ICE are cold weather places.
EV batteries like to be warm. Keep them plugged in and precondition (warm up) the battery before setting out in cold weather and the range loss is minimal.
@@dvader3263 This just further proves my point. I've got to do all sorts of hoop jumping to make it viable and even still it isn't an exact recipe for no loss. I'm going to disregard your stats because they are most likely cherry picked trying to paint an image based on correlation. (Correlation does not equal causation)
It’s November so it’s not as dramatic as it sounds if the sales numbers are low. I think Ford got a great idea and it is a great plug. It just has to be improved.
I'm not sure I understand why it is that Rivian needs to change the looks of the vehicle to update it, but GM with the Hummer is okay with the same vehicle style.
Ford should go to 48V accessories. And use the shutdown to update the lightning.
F150 lightning is a great truck that's frankly underrated.
However, the Silverado EV and the yet to be released Dodge RamCharger have way better range and charging capabilities.
I think they are making the right move. Halt things, and take a new tack. They have to be competitive, and on paper, they aren't right now.
I hope they figure things out.
Mmm. . . I don’t think this is the death of the electric truck. I love my Lightening. I live in Oklahoma. I do normal truck stuff with it: hulling, mudding and exploring. I do not use it for long distant movements. The Lightening does everything I need it to do. I don’t need to state the obvious flaws with this technology, we all know mileage and time to recharge absolutely sucks. However, within a shorter bandwidth this vehicle can out perform a traditional vehicle. It’s not a replacement for the gas or diesel trucks when it comes to high frequency use, but it could, with continued development in technology, get to be equivalent. . . Only one question who is going to pay for the R&D that is required to close that gap?
i would love a cyber trcuk but here in Canada the cheap version is 137k not everyone can afford that and the lightning pro epa 386km of range that sucks can't imagine during winter what kind if range it would make
You have a better chance of seeing Big Foot and his family than a Hummer EV which is actually working.
I see plenty of Hummer EV’s.
@@Michael-pi8ps very happy for you. What state?
@@jamesh1641 Maryland
@@jamesh1641I see them pretty regularly in Utah. Not every day but most days.
Rivians are everywhere.
There are a few Silverado RST EV’s around too.
Just said GM was early with their timing, and it could be a mistake and, in the same breath, asked where Ram EV was? SMH
Add native NACS and I’ll buy one. Guaranteed. With the stop in production. That should give ford enough time to change up factory to make native NACS possible
Saw the Hummer EV at the Livonia Costco…Killer flat blue paint, but $150k sticker…🤯
Ford Lightning plant is probably closed for more like 4 weeks. They very well likely probably already planned to be down the weeks of Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year's
Are they doing retooling or upgrades at the factory?
Good video. I’m at 24k km on my 23 Lighting ER Lariat. Best pickup truck I have ever owned hands down. It makes no sense that they are not selling 10 Lightnings for every gas powered F150. The truck buying public is just so easily persuaded by the disinformation campaign against EVs. There are simply are no downsides other than those that only exist in the misinformed imagination of the prospective truck buyer.
I think Ford, in shifting priority to PHEVs and Hybrids is a mistake. I bought a PHEV at the same time that I got my Lightning, thinking that the PHEV would be our go-to for long road trips. A month later and I regret getting the PHEV because the Lightning is just too good for road trips to not take it every time. We should have just gotten another EV, not a PHEV. 7 months in and that PHEV’s gasoline engine has run for all of 5% of the vehicle’s total use. That’s a lot of high tech gadgetry and old fashioned iron under the hood of that PHEV that is not being used. My money would have been better spent on batteries and electric motors.
When I was in my twenties I would get in a car and drive for 7 hrs straight. No thanks. Not doing that anymore.
How often do you go on longer road trips, and how long are they? Give me some numbers and I’ll help you understand what makes the Lightning the best road trip vehicle I have ever owned.
AI at work, people. Move along.
@@Crab44It is only the service centres that are the trouble. Not the actual vehicle. Because I do not see been making money from you. Going to them, you are better off going to a external company for your service. And long road trips are not an issue.
Especially with many different charging options, not including the most reliable. The Tesla supercharger network
as charging option.
@@jaywhite1850Jeez, it's funny that you say AI is at work. When it is that that actually allows you to do longer to road trips.
@@RayJohnson1980 Dude, I don’t need a babysitter to drive for me. I tow a camper quite a bit so my truck use is ACTUALLY truck use.
To all the haters. I tow my Yamaha AR250 all the time with this truck. No different in mileage range if I was using my 2018 Ram Power Wagon. My power Wagon goes from 12 mpg to about 8 mpg. I also use with my power washing company. Truck is excellent. It is as real of a TRUCK as any ICE vehicle. Stop trying to find something wrong with something that is continuously getting better. I’m a conservative and will probably never buy another ICE vehicle again in my life. Better ride, no maintenance besides tire rotation, windshield washer fluid, and cabin air filter. What’s not to love?
Stop lying, it's not a real truck. Also stop trying to convince people that there's no change in mileage while towing. The only thing it's good for is picking up groceries and it will be rendered useless in a few years with evolving technologies.
Clearly never said no change in mileage. Tows great. Less sag than any 1500 I’ve ever owned. Just picked up a 2000 payload of chlorine last week. I tow power washing trailer daily. You’re delusional.
Thats not what he sais, he said his ice truck also loses range. Dont de be a nitwit@@Blanky889
@@codycouch You literally said there was no change in mileage in your original comment.
@@brian5ono I said no different than the mileage loss in my Ram Power Wagon. I literally am lucky to get 8 MPG in my Power Wagon when towing. I would never tow cross country in an EV but much prefer it for the business.
Tesla is pausing builds because apparently each user they have to be certified by EPA for range and a few models are stuck waiting on them. So they paused new builds because they dont want to continue building last years. But they also have enough to continue selling.
Have y’all heard anything about the all electric ford t3? I can’t wait to see it! I love electric cars
Ford needs to focus on improving their core vehicles: F-series, Maverick, Explorer, and Expedition. The Lightning is a niche vehicle and not profitable and they have been discounting heavily just to move units. There are still new 23s out there with massive discounts.
We’re just retooling the plant for the 25’ year model like we did last year
The problem and the debate I have with range extender EV is you lose some of the cost saving by still having to do oil changes and and fuel. Is it worth needing the extended range for hauling when estimated haul range on full EV will be about 225 miles or 3 hours of driving. Also we have yet to see really what that does to the cost. With less batteries will it be cheaper because it is an engine they are already using. Or is it going to be more expensive for it because it has both. I think that will be the biggest factor. Also I know it is not here in America but I think you should have included the BYD truck.
Ford needs to advertise the E-Transit more. The new improved 2024 but no-one knows about it
89kWh battery, 180+ kW DCFC, 19.2 kW Lvl 2, heat pump, hauling plus mobile office and RV options.
By the time you spin those hybrid up the batteries would have improved and the money tooling up wasted.
50,000 flawless miles on mine!
In addition to flushing out dealer inventory, Ford could also be using the stoppage to implement manufacturing changes to reduce cost. This will help improve profitability.
the plant is running at 20% capacity, they will never reach profitability at that rate... they need ppl to buy them
@JogBird Maybe instead read 'reduce losses'. I have read before that the common target is 80%+ capacity among auto factories for a break even point.
Production will resume in January; Also, we have a bridge we are selling that we know you will just love
I love my lightning. The only thing that I don't like which really doesn't matter to me is the depreciation on it. I bought it brand new, and not even a year later it depreciated by almost $40,000. If I wasn't going to keep it then I'd be upset but, everyone says to lease an electric vehicle nowadays.
It’s a phase. When I bought my tesla in 2018, I could have resold it for more than I paid around 2020/2021. Now in 2024, they’re worth far less. In my case, I’ve had so much fun with it over 130k miles, I would miss it if I let it go.
I think that would help sort it out if they got that compact maverick truck and actually made that an electric truck too. They made an electric version and if they had a midsize truck that was an electric not just the F150 lightning. I’m telling you right now because it’s pretty soon gas cars will be faced out, but I don’t think people don’t want to let you because I think people can’t afford them.
I love my 2004 Tacoma ( 4 cyc, 2wd)
Dropped a deposit on the scout pickup for a laugh… cause I don’t mind bankrolling development costs. I want to see it come to market, and I have more faith in VW than I do stellantis right now… but I expect I’ll probably cancel the reservation when it comes due, as long as my V60 PHEV is still kickin. Hopefully there’s also more PHEV wagon choice by then, maybe a plug-in crown signia and CX-50, or a V90 successor…
I'm not sure the losses can be attributed to factory construction and R&D. Usually those are capitalized and not all the costs are absorbed up front. If this is the case, you should be able to see it in the financial documents. If long term liabilities have increased and/or cash equivalents have dropped, then you know it's even more expensive than the numbers you quoted for the EV segment.
The loss figures include "fixed costs" they specifically mention "factories, machinery and development" but don't break down those costs. Fords CFO mentioned they were close to profitability on some models this year and hope to reach profitability on those in the next year.
It takes at least a decade to pay for a new factory, not 2 years. Factories cost billions of $$$
Problem for GM with the Silverado EV is the large battery. Basically will cost them more for every truck, it will be the hardest to turn a profit.
I’m betting that they gambled on battery costs dropping quickly, so the first couple years they don’t make a profit but after that the large batteries make the truck the most appealing and a hot seller so economics of scale allow them to get the batteries at a cheaper price.
Materials cost continue to decline.. LiFePO4 is now around $75 per kWh, which maths out to $16k for a Silverado.. They can be profitable!
GM has the lowest production costs for batteries of any domestic battery manufacturer. Lower than tesla pays.
Interest rates are high, inflation is high, truck prices are high.
I would seriously buy one but the price is just too high!
The Cyber truck is the new look ! But it’s a good electric vehicle and I liked the wrap you did , they look better wrapped ,me I’d go blue wrap !
How old is this video? Tesla now reports Cybertruck sales as a separate line item.
Would like a Bronco Sport plug in Hybred 4 wheel drive.
A friend of mine thinks that will be available next year when the Escape and Escape hybrid are discontinued. Ford should definitely build one, it would be very easy to incorporate into the Bronco Sport, which is related to the Escape.
Could this also be due to them switching from CCS1 to NACS?
I'm willing to bet, that when Ford resumes production of the F-150 Lightning, it will have a much bigger battery. Ford was the first, (legacy) to market a full size EV pickup truck, but GM as shown them up with nearly double the battery capacity. Ford would do well, to add battery capacity to compete with GM. Trucks NEED big batteries, to be able to produce the high continuous horsepower hours, to tow large trailers for long distances. The only reason to own a truck, is to do the big jobs, carry heavy loads or tow trailers...Things you just can't do with a hatch back economy car.
Always fun to see how people making comments let their perceptions and selective reality about
politics determine what they say they will or wont buy. No company passes your purity test. Get over it.
When is there going be a 2 door bench seat EV work truck with a 8’ or 6’6” box to carry fire wood, gravel, hay, lumber, sand, etc? For now I need going to keep my old pickup running for ever!
Could it be they want to stop bleeding money? That 22k trucks may have created a billion dollar loss. Almost 3% of their market cap. They really need to figure out how to make it a profitable truck all the while lowing the price so I can buy one. Edit: My math may be a little low...
Whoa hold on, those numbers are very misleading. My company supplies parts for the lightning. We weren't fully ramped into production until almost mid 2023, so numbers are higher in 2024 because they made more in 2024. Also our actual production numbers are under 25% of what we are tooled for and what we were told would be the production quantity. We also stopped our production months ago because we fulfilled their needs for the rest of the year. As a supplier to this truck, it's a disaster. They are only selling at all because they sell them at a huge loss . They lose I believe $30k per truck and there is a government incentive. Add $40k to truck ( amount needed to be profitable) and take away incentive and they wouldn't sell any. Rivian is only still in business because of Amazon vans. They lose money on every truck. Gm loses money on hummer. Why do you think ram is dragging their feet. It's a colossal mess. They should stop all ev production and concentrate on plug in hybrids
"We lose money on every sale, but we make it up in volume" Some sales guy, somewhere🙂
Rivian is quickly getting closer to profitability...faster than Tesla got there, and it will get exponentially faster when R2 and R3 production begins in 2025, as well as commercial Van sales will start soon, too.
@@mikelemoine4267. This is exactly why Ford shouldn’t have killed all their economical cars. The profits may have been lower but they were affordable to much more of the population and had volume.
Ford killed those off- The Fiesta, Focus, Fusion, Taurus, Ecosport which was garbage anyways, and are about to kill off the Escape and Edge.
The Bronco Sport is basically a higher-priced Escape, most having that 1.5 3-cylinder. Granted, in the last few years, that was a popular Escape engine, too.
The Bronco Sport even now with lots of incentives starts at nearly $30k. You can get a Maverick for similar money but Ford’s vehicle prices shoot up from there.
Ford ditched their affordable models thinking that a customer that could purchase an $18,000 Fusion would simply lye over and take buying a $50,000 Explorer or Mach-E. It may have looked good for quarter-to-quarter financials but was never gonna f’in happen.
Now Fords chickens are coming home to roost and they deserve it!
Don’t even get me started on their horrible lack of quality now.
@@brian5o I think they cancelled those smaller cars because they screwed up their reputation with the crappy dual clutch transmissions which they did everything they could to avoid standing behind. They claimed lack of interest in cars but Hyundai, Kia, Toyota and Honda's small cars were flying off the lots. I suspect the Escape and the Edge are losing out to the Asian competition as well. I'm not sure Hyundai and Kia are much, if any better at this point with their recent issues, but they have some nicely appointed models for a fairly competitive price and at least have a long warranty. Ford won't offer one because they know they didn't build it well enough to hold up.
I don't get why they haven't dumped that 1.5L Ecoboost. They've been problematic from day 1, don't make that much power and don't get that great of fuel economy. It's neither Eco or Boost! A decently tuned N/A 4 cylinder would be better in all ways and reliable. I didn't buy my last new vehicle from Ford due to a horrible dealer experience so I can't comment on their current quality, but I've heard stories of leaky taillights crippling F150s, oil leaks from cheap plastic oil pans and other issues related to cheap plastic in places that should be aluminum. I like the Lightning and think it would be fine for a commuter for my purpose, and I've heard mostly good things on the forums, but the dealer experience has again turned me off Ford. Most of them are violating FTC rules about posting misleading prices but since NADA and others are suing the FTC to suppress enforcement they think they can get away with it. Maybe so from a legal standpoint, but they should realize other companies make EVs too.
I still have an 03 F150 Harley Davidson Edition with a gazillion miles on it and all original drivetrain. No major issues in 21+ years and I can start it up and drive it anywhere without worrying about it, the original AC even still works. I seriously doubt most new cars made today will still be running around in 20+ years with a trip to the moon on the clock without having tens of thousands in repairs. All the EPA green initiatives focus on tailpipe emissions; maybe they should factor how new vehicles will puke their fluids all over the ground and end up in a landfill in 10-15 years as it will be too costly to keep them running.
I don’t have an EV; but when I received my registration renewal with it a green notification says, EVs will pay now extra 250 annually “Additional “ and will increase 10.00 each year for four years
You know why that is don't you? It is because as electric vehicles Don't use gasoline or diesel Then have to get taxes from a different way
All vehicles should be taxed per-mile based on the weight of the vehicle. Make those that drive the most in the heaviest vehicles that do the most damage to the road pay the most.
@@RayJohnson1980 governments always slap you around doing good
@@chiplangowski3298 That is why fuel taxes work so well. For gas and diesel vehicles, you pay a percentage for every gallon of fuel you purchase. The more you drive, the more you pay.
Unfortunately, there isn’t a great system for taxing EVs the same way yet.
@@jamesh1641 fossil fuel-powered vehicles have to pay taxes to help fund roads whenever they fill up.
There is not a system to tax EVs yet and some EVs weigh as much as commercial trucks therefore they cause more damage to the roadways.
Do you feel that EV drivers shouldn’t have to pay to help maintain the roads they contribute damage to?
There’s going to be a certain kind of person who’ll beat their chest over declining EV sales. I own a lifted Bronco myself. What’s stopping me from owning an EV is pricing, not politics. Manufacturers have priced themselves out of markets by making 100k toys.
100%
I was hoping for a more thorough investigation into the Lightning plant 2 month pause. Are they bringing in new robots to speed up production? Here in BC Canada the dealers can't get lightnings fast enough to meet demand. I called a few last week and they are saying they wont have any till April if ordered right now. They have the bloated Platinum's and Lariats nobody wants. but exeryone wants the XLT and Flash models and they are hard to come by. Ford could sell triple the lightnights if they made what people want.
New CATL 6C lfp packs coming on line they charge really fast are cheap and don't suffer in the cold. All the issues will slowly disappear
The Cybertruck is the most popular EV Truck. When the PT Cruiser was introduced Chrysler sold 145,000 in its first year. What happens when everyone who wants a Cybertruck has a Cybertruck? It isn't like a Model 3 or Model Y. Those cars are relatively inexpensive and their design isn't polarizing.
They are about to start $72K sales after rebate. Next year they will have $65K version. Their sales so far are for $100K FS.
@@Abebe345 -- The PT Cruiser was a $18-20K car. And they sold a lot of them. But, it styling was polarizing. After a few years, everyone who wanted one had bought one.
@@lamplighter5545 I think the only reason to get it was the styling. Otherwise not much quality.
@@Abebe345 -- I don't like the styling and I agree with you. The only reason to buy the thing is the styling. As soon as the warranty expires, it's going to start costing the owners serious money in repairs. Complicated things are going to start breaking -- 4-wheel steering, hydraulic suspension, steering by wire, power tonneau cover. These are complex mechanical systems and Tesla is not known for robust complex mechanical systems. My advice? If you like it, buy it and keep it for a couple years. Then sell it on.
@ Maybe but. But people have been offroading a lot with them because they are so good at it, but early days agree.
Andre's tshirt a hint at the new truck he'll be buying? 🤔
Wait what? Cybertruck numbers are what? 27K is less than 37K? So Rivian most sales?
Not long ago CyberTruck was out selling the other electric trucks combined. I 'think' a dataplate has been posted indicating over 40K trucks.
No that includes the suv was well for rivian
And the amazon van thing
Cybertruck was still in preliminary production last winter and spring while Rivian has been ramped up for years. Also Rivian losing tens of thousands per truck to dump-into and control the market while Cybertruck is profitable from day one.
What is going on at Blue Oval City?
Increase sales is good, but the question is how many sales do they need to make a profit? My educated guess is all these companies are years away from that number.
Ignoring CAPEX for factories they’re already profitable. And the CAPEX is temporary..
🇦🇺👀 BYD Shark PHEV seems economical.
GM is selling more e-hummers than e-silverados?
The problem with the Lightning is the same problem with all new vehicles: price. EVs actually make sense for many use cases, but the high prices are a problem. ICE vehicles also face the same headwind, and if our government continues to overspend, the resulting inflation will eventually kill all new sales. Get ready to own a Chinese pickup at half the price because those days are coming.
Maybe Ford is taking the time to re-tool prod. line to make some changes. Hopefully, longer range.
my little 2014 f150 is chugging along with zero issues, zero payments, and zero charge time. i think ill keep it parked right next to my model y. it does things electric cannot do.
Yes like break down, it's the past so go ahead and keep it just to prove how dumb an ice passenger vehicle is
@@MrJinskeNo.
Don't be like that.
Why don't you look add just a conversion?
@@RayJohnson1980 because it wont tow my sailboat from my home to the launch ramp and back, wont tow my produce trailer anywhere i need it to go, and wont haul the kinds of loads that a farmer like me typically does.... plus its never, ever let me down despite the worst wishes of myriad ev goblins... and my model y is actually my FOURTH electric vehicle so im obviously sold on ev's (more so than the goblins i suspect) and well aware of what they can and cannot do. and its paid off. my eniro (kia) spent 90 days in repair because of some battery issue and because of hawaii's tough lemon laws i was able to return it and get all my money back. mercedes benz wouldnt let us keep our excellent smart car (with 70 mile range!) but it was perfect for what we needed it for. my fx zero is a motorcycle so towing... not really. fun though. saves gas.
You just described my situation to a tee
Hybrids are not the way, just cause you have to plug them in to charge the battery and still use gas, that tech wayyy complicated to fix. As mentioned, there is not much of a bump in the gas range for trucks and suv's. Cars maybe?
How many of those are bought as part of government fleet sales? If these aren't going to everyday customers and just being sold to California who cares. Smoke and mirrors.
I don't see many lightings and most that I do see are local police departments.
Hardly any but of course got to be outraged because its different
I know 4 people with lightnings. I also see quite a few private contractors driving them around, towing construction equipment.
Its not a huge amount, but i see more and more, typically at least 1 or 2 per day and I don’t drive much.
Automakers charging a premium for EVs, pricing themselves out of any chance for success. Better support for infrastructure and stop with the cheap gimmicks and dealer markups.
Fair. TFL NEVER mentions pollution. Electric trucks only exist to minimize tailpipe emissions. The rest of the performance benefits are just to make them attractive enough.