I came into this video cold. This is an example of someone assuming people already know about the subject. So in that case, he would preaching to the choir. I am a 66 year old engineer but if I were a young kid and paid money for this training, I would stop him at each stage and make him explain each term. I did concrete form work during the summers when I was going to college, so I was not totally lost. I plan on doing an ICF house but was looking for a how-to on wood forming for parts that don't need insulation. I only made this comment as constructive criticism for the instructors so they can do better on future videos and maybe do this one over.✌️
@@scottfleming I thought that might be the case and that it was not originally intended for public consumption. If it is part of a training series, I might suggest that each video start off with a context statement like: "This is the 5th video of an 8 video series on concrete forming. It is suggested that you watch the previous videos as a prerequisite to this video." On another subject, I saw a guy building his house who couldn't get a form work crew for his porch build so he did it himself using PVC pipe and threaded rods instead of snap-ties. This causes PVC tunnels throughout the wall. He then uses a rotary hammer drill to push out the PVC tubes. He didn't need the wall to be waterproof, so he just left the holes open. What would be the best affordable way to fill those holes, assuming a waterproofing membrane would be used? I'd want to fill the whole tunnel, not just plug the openings. It seems like closed cell expanding foam would be sufficient, cheap, and easy to apply. As you can tell, I know just enough to be dangerous!🤣
@@markstipulkoski1389 , you could use closed cell foam as you mentioned. Epoxy can be used but is expensive. Parging mix is most common. Pvc tubing is common in system forms. The tubing is cut short and spreader cones are placed on the ends. When stripped, the cones are removed, tubing stays and the are parged. This video shows it pretty nicely, I think... ruclips.net/video/h72fYZ6AgO8/видео.htmlsi=Foh3kR62qBYWW-QX
I would really appreciate, as Im sure many others would, a side by side price comparison of the 3 most common types of formwork. For basements I would consider snap tie but for most residential stem walls I really think the simple wedge tie with 2x10s is so straight forward & has to compete with other panelized systems pricewise. Myself & 1 other did a form prep (8" thick) for a 46 x 48 ft foundation with 4 intermediate walls within in 2 weeks thats digging, outer wall, steel, inner wall, all bracing, j bolts & hold downs. Its quick & easy to form & break down.
ICF's are my favorite method for forming residential foundations. The cost is comparable and there is no stripping. I'm not sure where you are but in Ontario we need a continuous thermal break on the outside of the building envelope. This system gives us that plus its super light!
@@scottfleming thank you for your response. Im in NCal so we are in a climate zone of 9 snow is very rare. I have seen the ICFs & they look real nice to work with - I wonder how they fare in earthquake zone codes. The only foam wk Ove done is rigid foam placed b4 a radiant slab (down the sides of footings & about 30 % inward under the slab. I was surprised that the entire slab wasnt 1st insulated. Apparently not necessary - just the perimeter. Love doing formwork especially when it gets more involved its actually interesting to me. Been a carpenter 23 yrs so any deviation from the usual peaks my interest. Thx.
@@koogle612 I don't know how they perform in earthquake zones. I am guessing they would be fine as long as you had appropriate reinforcement. A radiant slab certainly needs rigid under the entire slab here. I love formwork too. Also kinda fascinated by all of the innovative things coming out of California (ex. California framing hammer, and most of the homes in Fine HomeBuilding seem to be from Cali). Seems like the world is a few steps behind California - we see these warning labels on so many products, "Known to the State of California to Cause...". Guess its fine for us to use elsewhere?🙃
Thanks for all the great information!! When would it be acceptable to just use waler with short end ties over a stud/strongback + waler system with long end ties?
Short ends are great for low walls where lateral pressure on the formwork is minimal. Or maybe if space is limited, like a monolithic curb and stair form. Once you start getting taller forms, the pressure compounds and walers and stongbacks make it easier to maintain consistent wall thickness and straight, plumb forms.
Good info. Thank you. I'm doing a low retaining wall so at what heights do you recommend I start using ties and walers and other things to keep it from blowing out?
Your wall formwork is very, very old school, in Bavaria we have had system formwork with metal frames for over 50 years. The anchors are mostly threaded rods with a 15mm special thread DW 15 Dywidag. This is much faster and safer.
It appears this is a training facility for apprentices. It’s good for apprentices to develop building and tool skills doing it the old school way. Also there are so many types of formwork systems they can’t teach them all. To move from the more skilful old school to easy systems is easy. Not so easy the other way. But the most important part is to have apprentices to learn skills and get a good understanding of the structural requirements in building. Once this is really understood, problem solving on site becomes much easier. A good carpenter or builder needs these skills.
@@scottschwenk9570 PERI or Doka and many other system formwork manufacturers also have systems for formwork without a crane. Anyone who educates no longer needs plywood/wooden systems, whether wall or ceiling. Today 99% of formwork work can be done with systems. The old formwork, as is currently done for walls in the USA, takes a lot of time, costs resources and is not good for the environment and climate. There are now also systems in which the frame and formwork are made entirely of plastic; it is light, stable and can be used often. This means less wood/plywood is needed, but unfortunately there is still little interest in this in the USA. During my training I also learned how formwork is only made from wood or plywood, but we no longer use it. We say “time is money” and we do most of the formwork for basements or underground car parks. A cellar measuring approximately 12m*12m made entirely of reinforced concrete (floor slab, walls and ceiling) is built in one week with 4-5 workers and a tower crane.
@@scottschwenk9570 PERI or Doka and many other system formwork manufacturers also offer systems for formwork without a crane. Those who form no longer need plywood / timber systems, whether for walls or slabs. Today, 99% of formwork work can be done with systems. The old formwork, as it is done for walls in the USA, takes a lot of time, costs resources and is not good for the environment and climate. There are now also systems where the frame and the formlining are completely made of plastic, it is light, stable and can be used often. This means that less wood / plywood is needed, but unfortunately there is still little interest in this in the USA. During my training, I also learned how formwork is made only from wood or plywood, but it is no longer used here. We say “time is money” and we make most of the formwork for basements or underground garages. A cellar of approx. 12m*12m made entirely of reinforced concrete (floor slab, walls and ceiling) is built in a week with 4-5 workers and a tower crane.
@@scottschwenk9570 P E R I or D o k a and many other system formwork manufacturers also offer systems for formwork without a crane. Those who form no longer need plywood / timber systems, whether for walls or slabs. Today, 99% of formwork work can be done with systems. The old formwork, as it is done for walls in the USA, takes a lot of time, costs resources and is not good for the environment and climate. There are now also systems where the frame and the formlining are completely made of plastic, it is light, stable and can be used often. This means that less wood / plywood is needed, but unfortunately there is still little interest in this in the USA. During my training, I also learned how formwork is made only from wood or plywood, but it is no longer used here. We say “time is money” and we make most of the formwork for basements or underground garages. A cellar of approx. 12m*12m made entirely of reinforced concrete (floor slab, walls and ceiling) is built in a week with 4-5 workers and a tower crane.
What system is better: single waler and jahn bracket or double waler and wedge...I'm building CIP lintels on a masonry building. maximum span is 8ft. (2 x4's as so expensive now)
All materials are expensive now! From what you described I think I would go with the Jahn "A" brackets. Single walers will suffice, provided your form ply is thicker than the 7/16" OSB we used in the video! Don't forget to get the short snap ties
@@scottfleming Got it...Thanks for the insight and quick reply...it's appreciated! In the 70's we could buy box cars of studs for a nickel each, now a stud is 15 bucks at HD!...don't get me started on plywood!...hahaha...Have a great day!
You don't need to have your 2x4 walers fall half on a 2x4. That's bs. You just want to stagger the break in the top and bottom waler. Also, you run your walers maybe 18" inches past the end of the bulkhead to lace it up with plywood. And letting your studs run 6 feet over the to of the form? I don't think the finishers pouring the concrete would like you very much as they will have trouble pouring and finishing the wall.
Wood forming is not cost efficient at all. The up front cost are cheaper but handsets would be the way to go. Gang forms for the bigger jobs. Saves you a ton of money in labor.
For sure! Systems like Aluma, Peri or Doka are the only way to go. But even system gang forms and fly forms need loose forming for infill, bucks and irregular shapes and sizes.
@@scottfleming Scott, graduated in 1993, with a golden hammer I might add, wood form work does have its place though. For a better finished product, less seams, better seams, smoother wall with fewer defects to be patched. Obviously, there is a place for everything, that is the beauty of UBC apprenticeship school. I will say this, there is nothing uglier in the concrete world than gang form walls.
They usually stop laughing when they find out that particular teacher has a parent on transplant meds at home, or a kid with leukemia, or whatever. You never know what's going on in other people's lives unless they tell you .. and tbh it's not your business anyway.
I'm so confused with your system those ties will be embedded in concrete that's waste of money you cannot remove it after pouring concrete you need so many for every pour your going to make.
All I can say is that for your apprenticeship was worth my time
I came into this video cold. This is an example of someone assuming people already know about the subject. So in that case, he would preaching to the choir. I am a 66 year old engineer but if I were a young kid and paid money for this training, I would stop him at each stage and make him explain each term. I did concrete form work during the summers when I was going to college, so I was not totally lost. I plan on doing an ICF house but was looking for a how-to on wood forming for parts that don't need insulation. I only made this comment as constructive criticism for the instructors so they can do better on future videos and maybe do this one over.✌️
Thanks for the feedback. This video was made to supplement in-school training for apprentices who have been in the field 2-3 years.🙂
@@scottfleming I thought that might be the case and that it was not originally intended for public consumption. If it is part of a training series, I might suggest that each video start off with a context statement like: "This is the 5th video of an 8 video series on concrete forming. It is suggested that you watch the previous videos as a prerequisite to this video." On another subject, I saw a guy building his house who couldn't get a form work crew for his porch build so he did it himself using PVC pipe and threaded rods instead of snap-ties. This causes PVC tunnels throughout the wall. He then uses a rotary hammer drill to push out the PVC tubes. He didn't need the wall to be waterproof, so he just left the holes open. What would be the best affordable way to fill those holes, assuming a waterproofing membrane would be used? I'd want to fill the whole tunnel, not just plug the openings. It seems like closed cell expanding foam would be sufficient, cheap, and easy to apply. As you can tell, I know just enough to be dangerous!🤣
@@markstipulkoski1389 , you could use closed cell foam as you mentioned. Epoxy can be used but is expensive. Parging mix is most common.
Pvc tubing is common in system forms. The tubing is cut short and spreader cones are placed on the ends. When stripped, the cones are removed, tubing stays and the are parged. This video shows it pretty nicely, I think...
ruclips.net/video/h72fYZ6AgO8/видео.htmlsi=Foh3kR62qBYWW-QX
I would really appreciate, as Im sure many others would, a side by side price comparison of the 3 most common types of formwork. For basements I would consider snap tie but for most residential stem walls I really think the simple wedge tie with 2x10s is so straight forward & has to compete with other panelized systems pricewise. Myself & 1 other did a form prep (8" thick) for a 46 x 48 ft foundation with 4 intermediate walls within in 2 weeks thats digging, outer wall, steel, inner wall, all bracing, j bolts & hold downs. Its quick & easy to form & break down.
ICF's are my favorite method for forming residential foundations. The cost is comparable and there is no stripping. I'm not sure where you are but in Ontario we need a continuous thermal break on the outside of the building envelope. This system gives us that plus its super light!
@@scottfleming thank you for your response. Im in NCal so we are in a climate zone of 9 snow is very rare. I have seen the ICFs & they look real nice to work with - I wonder how they fare in earthquake zone codes. The only foam wk Ove done is rigid foam placed b4 a radiant slab (down the sides of footings & about 30 % inward under the slab. I was surprised that the entire slab wasnt 1st insulated. Apparently not necessary - just the perimeter. Love doing formwork especially when it gets more involved its actually interesting to me. Been a carpenter 23 yrs so any deviation from the usual peaks my interest. Thx.
@@koogle612 I don't know how they perform in earthquake zones. I am guessing they would be fine as long as you had appropriate reinforcement. A radiant slab certainly needs rigid under the entire slab here. I love formwork too. Also kinda fascinated by all of the innovative things coming out of California (ex. California framing hammer, and most of the homes in Fine HomeBuilding seem to be from Cali). Seems like the world is a few steps behind California - we see these warning labels on so many products, "Known to the State of California to Cause...". Guess its fine for us to use elsewhere?🙃
What about for commercial for panels with return walls
Excellent video!
Coil rod and pvc sleeves cut to wall thickness is a great way also
Lol hey man! Didn't know you had a channel well done!
Ha! Yes, very impressive isn't it!
@@scottfleming it is! You still teaching up there for the apprentices?
@@brandonalldread241 Sure am. Hope everything is good with you.
@@scottfleming still going strong buddy haha
good job friend ☕🔔✓
Thanks for all the great information!! When would it be acceptable to just use waler with short end ties over a stud/strongback + waler system with long end ties?
Short ends are great for low walls where lateral pressure on the formwork is minimal. Or maybe if space is limited, like a monolithic curb and stair form. Once you start getting taller forms, the pressure compounds and walers and stongbacks make it easier to maintain consistent wall thickness and straight, plumb forms.
Es una excelente labor
Very helpful thanks
Good info. Thank you. I'm doing a low retaining wall so at what heights do you recommend I start using ties and walers and other things to keep it from blowing out?
I would go 1 foot up to start then 2' O.C.
Your wall formwork is very, very old school, in Bavaria we have had system formwork with metal frames for over 50 years. The anchors are mostly threaded rods with a 15mm special thread DW 15 Dywidag. This is much faster and safer.
It appears this is a training facility for apprentices. It’s good for apprentices to develop building and tool skills doing it the old school way. Also there are so many types of formwork systems they can’t teach them all. To move from the more skilful old school to easy systems is easy. Not so easy the other way. But the most important part is to have apprentices to learn skills and get a good understanding of the structural requirements in building. Once this is really understood, problem solving on site becomes much easier. A good carpenter or builder needs these skills.
We use perry and Docka? Systems for high rise buildings on the east coast smaller jobs with limited cranes that plywood system worked fine
@@scottschwenk9570 PERI or Doka and many other system formwork manufacturers also have systems for formwork without a crane. Anyone who educates no longer needs plywood/wooden systems, whether wall or ceiling. Today 99% of formwork work can be done with systems. The old formwork, as is currently done for walls in the USA, takes a lot of time, costs resources and is not good for the environment and climate. There are now also systems in which the frame and formwork are made entirely of plastic; it is light, stable and can be used often. This means less wood/plywood is needed, but unfortunately there is still little interest in this in the USA.
During my training I also learned how formwork is only made from wood or plywood, but we no longer use it. We say “time is money” and we do most of the formwork for basements or underground car parks. A cellar measuring approximately 12m*12m made entirely of reinforced concrete (floor slab, walls and ceiling) is built in one week with 4-5 workers and a tower crane.
@@scottschwenk9570 PERI or Doka and many other system formwork manufacturers also offer systems for formwork without a crane. Those who form no longer need plywood / timber systems, whether for walls or slabs. Today, 99% of formwork work can be done with systems. The old formwork, as it is done for walls in the USA, takes a lot of time, costs resources and is not good for the environment and climate. There are now also systems where the frame and the formlining are completely made of plastic, it is light, stable and can be used often. This means that less wood / plywood is needed, but unfortunately there is still little interest in this in the USA.
During my training, I also learned how formwork is made only from wood or plywood, but it is no longer used here. We say “time is money” and we make most of the formwork for basements or underground garages. A cellar of approx. 12m*12m made entirely of reinforced concrete (floor slab, walls and ceiling) is built in a week with 4-5 workers and a tower crane.
@@scottschwenk9570 P E R I or D o k a and many other system formwork manufacturers also offer systems for formwork without a crane. Those who form no longer need plywood / timber systems, whether for walls or slabs. Today, 99% of formwork work can be done with systems. The old formwork, as it is done for walls in the USA, takes a lot of time, costs resources and is not good for the environment and climate. There are now also systems where the frame and the formlining are completely made of plastic, it is light, stable and can be used often. This means that less wood / plywood is needed, but unfortunately there is still little interest in this in the USA.
During my training, I also learned how formwork is made only from wood or plywood, but it is no longer used here. We say “time is money” and we make most of the formwork for basements or underground garages. A cellar of approx. 12m*12m made entirely of reinforced concrete (floor slab, walls and ceiling) is built in a week with 4-5 workers and a tower crane.
What system is better: single waler and jahn bracket or double waler and wedge...I'm building CIP lintels on a masonry building. maximum span is 8ft. (2 x4's as so expensive now)
All materials are expensive now! From what you described I think I would go with the Jahn "A" brackets. Single walers will suffice, provided your form ply is thicker than the 7/16" OSB we used in the video! Don't forget to get the short snap ties
@@scottfleming Got it...Thanks for the insight and quick reply...it's appreciated! In the 70's we could buy box cars of studs for a nickel each, now a stud is 15 bucks at HD!...don't get me started on plywood!...hahaha...Have a great day!
You don't need to have your 2x4 walers fall half on a 2x4. That's bs. You just want to stagger the break in the top and bottom waler. Also, you run your walers maybe 18" inches past the end of the bulkhead to lace it up with plywood. And letting your studs run 6 feet over the to of the form? I don't think the finishers pouring the concrete would like you very much as they will have trouble pouring and finishing the wall.
Great video
Where can i take these classes??
Peterborough, ON
How and where do i get snap ties to buy
You can pick them up at your local concrete supply store. They usually come in a box of about 100 pcs.
Wood forming is not cost efficient at all. The up front cost are cheaper but handsets would be the way to go. Gang forms for the bigger jobs. Saves you a ton of money in labor.
For sure! Systems like Aluma, Peri or Doka are the only way to go. But even system gang forms and fly forms need loose forming for infill, bucks and irregular shapes and sizes.
@@scottfleming Scott, graduated in 1993, with a golden hammer I might add, wood form work does have its place though. For a better finished product, less seams, better seams, smoother wall with fewer defects to be patched. Obviously, there is a place for everything, that is the beauty of UBC apprenticeship school. I will say this, there is nothing uglier in the concrete world than gang form walls.
It's 2022, "WHO gave you permission!"
😆
I made this video at the height of the pandemic at a community college.
11:14 distances
the mask on didn't age well
Bro I'm so lost
Good presentation until mask guy came out at 10 mins. I hope the students are laughing
They usually stop laughing when they find out that particular teacher has a parent on transplant meds at home, or a kid with leukemia, or whatever. You never know what's going on in other people's lives unless they tell you .. and tbh it's not your business anyway.
I'm so confused with your system those ties will be embedded in concrete that's waste of money you cannot remove it after pouring concrete you need so many for every pour your going to make.