I truly believe that the sugar bowl contained exactly what it says-sugar-and every rumor spread and every iteration of it just made it seem like that sugar bowl was such an important thing in the schism. The sugar bowl was a metaphor that people fight over the most crass and simple things in life that they never really stopped and reevaluated if what they were trying to get was worth more than the harm they're causing to each other. Esme Squalor probably just thought that the sugar bowl was very "in" that's why she got infuriated when Beatrice stole it from her.
@@ClamshellPackageSpecialist Why would it have a cure? The cure is literally horseradish, which is relatively easy to get. Theres no reason for a war to be fought over that.
@@ClamshellPackageSpecialist that's just in the show, not the books. I've always seen it as a metaphor, even as a kid. Just like the unknown was a symbol for death (or fear of the unknown, as I assumed as a kid), the sugar bowl always seemed like a metaphor for small misdeads being blown out of proportion and causing all this misery
I fully agree with the first half of your comment, however, I feel differently about your take on Esmé. To me, it was always more about the betrayal associated with having your close friend steal something they know is important to you. Beatrice didn't trust Esmé to keep the sugar bowl safe and therefore ended up stealing it instead. I think that's why it suddenly became even more relevant for Esmé - she believed by finding the sugar bowl, she would somehow get revenge on Beatrice
i think the reason everyone's answer to the contents of the sugar bowl is different is to illustrate how stupid war is, nobody knows what they're truly even fighting over.
Inside you there are two wolves: one who appreciates unsolved mysteries, enjoys the speculation, and believes some things, in fact, don't need answers; and another who desperatly wants things to make sense and have fitting resolutions. ASOUE creates a schism between them and places them at war...
One clever part about putting something valuable in a sugarbowl is that the sugarbowl is ceramic and therefore very resistant to fire. Ceramics are fired and hardened at temperatures way hotter than that of a standard house fire. Perfect for VFD.
To this day, I still remember distinctly the crushing disappointment I felt when I read the last book. There was an endless paragraph about how some mysteries are better left unsolved and that's when I realised that was the author's way of justifying to me, the reader, that he never planned what was inside the sugar bowl and couldn't find an answer that would live to the hype he created. He was great at creating compelling mysteries, but he literally gave up on solving them...
Remember the Unknown ship that was left unanswered in the Grim Grotto book. Which reminds me, I didn't like that the series left out Captain Wittershins from that book..It would have been excellent to see his relationship with Fernald (Hook handed Man).
@@nowknowthis He didn't write everything no. Some choices were made by the others. He heavily implied during one of his interview that he didn't like some explanations given by the show and would have preferred some questions left unanswered.
The author did have an answer for the sugar bowl, and he said in interviews that people write to him and solve it. So it is solvable, but he never said what it is XD
It was solvable if you pay attention enough to all the clues. Specifically the hybridized apple seeds were inside and you can figure this out, by the passage the Baudelaire parents wrote in a book on the island. They claimed that the hybridized seeds were stored in a "Vessel For...." Then it cuts off because Klaus coughs. But if you guess well enough, it's a "Vessel For Disaccharides" AKA a Sugar Bowl.
As I read this when I was a child, I definitely had the feeling that the story was not about all the convoluted plot and side stories of every non-sensical character, but really about children fraternising and enduring the absurdities and sufferings of adults' world. So thank you, but I really don't care what is in the sugar bowl.
What I always noticed is the repetition of the number of 3, there's three Baudelaire children, three Quagmires, three Denoumonts, three Snickets, the adult siblings also had consecutive letters(Jaques, Kit, Lemony) It might never have ever been important but props to The author for that
Repetition is used a lot to maintain heavy elements of surrealism. 13 is another common one. It's one of the reasons the theming of the book will stand out above any other book I read as a kid. It really shines using it's quirks like that
I’m sorry but I read these books probably two decades ago and struggle to remember. “Denouement” is a French word. It’d be kind of brilliant to name characters “Denouement”. Is that what happened or is that a coincidence?
I always bought into the theory that the sugar bowl was a macguffin, meant to drive the plot. Sunny even says it at one point in the books. I think it holds up a mirror to how conflicts can have legitimate reasons for existing, such as morality, but devolve into fighting after somethibg meaningless or small happens. It’s like World War I. The easiest answer people give as to what started it, was the assassination of Arch Duke Ferdinand (mentioned in the books as well) but in reality it was much more complicated than that. I think the sugar bowl is much the same way. It was the trigger for the organization to devolve into conflict. The spark that started the fire. Fighting in relationships might start over something silly and deepen into the actual problems in the relationship
Anyone else still have questions about Olaf’s henchmen? Specifically the white-faced women, right before turning on Olaf they mentioned that they lost their parents and sister to a house fire. It could be irrelevant but it never really left my mind. I wish we knew more about them.
The last two books hammer in the idea that the world is full of tons of people, each with dense stories that we’ll never get to hear. I see this detail as an early example of that. But beyond that, we can pretty confidently say that this fire was set by somebody fighting in the VFD schism.
I see the series as a metaphor for life in general. Bad things happen and you will never truly know why they do. We will never know everything in this life, there are mysteries all around us that we can’t find answers to and in the end “it is the best for which you can hope for”
My therapist gave me similar advice recently. “Stop trying to find a ‘why’ because you’ll never fully know it, and even if you did, it won’t help you move forward.” It’s just as frustrating now as it was when I read these books as a kid lol
I read a theory online that the sugar bowl contained a audio recording device. VFD would have picnic baskets containing codes based off of the foods in the picnic(like when the Bauldalaires solved a code from the food in the fridge at the burned VFD headquarters), this also served as a means for their agents to meet to exchange information or receive orders. In these picnics a bugged sugar bowl would be placed to record their agents conversations because VFD is all about being excessively paranoid. This also explains why VFD agents always take their tea and coffee bitter, because otherwise if wanted to sweeten their drinks they’d have to use the sugar bowl and there is no sugar in the sugar bowl. Eventually something really juicy got recorded but got mixed up with the other sugar bowls and the race for that particular one started the Schism.
The theory states that sugar bowls generally were used as recording devices, but this particular sugar bowl from Esme doesn't necessarily have to be just that. "We're attempting a botanical hybrid through the tuberous canopy, which should bring safely to fruition despite its dangers to our associates in utero. Of course, in case we are banished, Beatrice is hiding a small amount in a vess--" Vessel For Disaccharides or sugar bowl. That lines up perfectly with the show. Tea being bitter works as a deterrent of picking up the sugar bowl when there is a mic in there, but the botanical hybrid is also literally bitter sugar. It works both ways. ;)
@@TCO_404 My theory (made up on the spot) is that *the* sugar bowl is the store of all recorded information. It can prove Lemony's innocence and Olaf's criminal acts. It can bring the world to its knees by exposing everyone's darkest secrets.
I’ve never hated and loved a story so much the way I hate and love a series of unfortunate events. I wish we could get new stories of the grown up orphans :(
If you ever read The Beatrice Letters, you’ll find out where the Baudelaire children go in life next. It’s actually quite nice to know that they don’t die after The End.
The series plays on biblical themes and the question of knowledge vs ignorance. On the island aka the garden of Eden there is a tree with the knowledge of good and evil. A snake presents the apple to them to partake and live. The orphans chose to seek knowledge even though it cases them great pain and ultimately they chose to leave the island/garden. Other characters (especially authority figures) chose to live in ignorance. Sometimes ignorance is bliss but it also tends to lead to death. The series deals with questions of authority and knowledge.
This book series was such a part of my childhood. I am a fan of the movie, just disappointed it didn’t do well enough to continue. I love that this series was given its proper justice on Netflix. The world was expanded, the characters and actors were great, while some of the special effects are iffy with CGI, it’s all around the adaptation that the books deserved.
The contradicting sugar bowl stuff is cool, because we can never know what actually happened, every side has a different account of what happened. Some say it held sugar, others a cure, or maybe it was never significant and it’s importance was over exaggerated by years of recounting events that may or may not have happened.
The horseradish appletree could’ve been the Baudelaires’s “Plan B”. Like they thought “well the sugarbowl was a fiasco, but we might as well develop something ELSE to fight the Mycelium and all we have here is a bigass appletree. Maybe we can add horseradish to the apples et voilá!”
I remember in the first episode when Lemony mentioned a volunteer fire department and when they started mentioning VFD my mind drifted back to the volunteer fire department as a pure joke only to find out I was right
One of violets best line's Klaus: Do you think we can trust Kit? Violet: Since we got into her taxi, she's broken at least nine traffic safety laws, driven into a hedge, and recruited us to spy for a secret organization. I like her. Klaus: Me too.
The thing about sugar bowls is that the contents can change, at any point in the time line. At the opera we see the sugar cubes have been removed from the bowl, so it seems unlikely that the bowl was, at that time, just wanted for its sugar content, hybrid or otherwise. Esme is more concerned about the sugar bowl itself, as it completes her tea set. In the opera scene we only know it contains vaguely defined 'research' - so I do wonder if there's details on a slip of paper, or in the design on the outside or inside of the bowl, of this unknown research.
The first episode made it seem that Olaf was responsible but then by the end of the series we get this great revelation but say we suspect the man with beard but no hair and woman with hair but no beard they did seem surprised as well finding out that the parents were dead
Esme, I mean it makes sense. She hates Beatrice for stealing her sugar bowl and she was apart if VFD (at least I think so) therefore we don’t know which part of the schism she was in, leaving her as a likely culprit
There is a great theory from Snicket Sleuth that the Baudelaire fire might mirror the events at Hotel Denouement. They lured Olaf to their house with the sugar bowl, and were planning to put him on trial. Then a fire starts. It may be that the Baudelaire parents, like their children, helped start that fire as a warning to other VFD agents. The books also confirm that Beatrice survives that initial fire, only to die later on. That's why the sugar bowl is in the hospital. ;)
@@TCO_404 Wait what ??? You're telling me in the books the Baudelaire mother survives almost half the series without her children even finding her ??? That's so muc more painfully and cruelly written than what the show did with the Quagmire parents my god...
I think it's one of those things to teach us that tragic things happen that have no answers. The Baudelares likely wonder why their lives were a lightning pole for tragedy and thought they could find answers by discovering the secrets of VFD and the sugar bowl, which turns up nothing. All that mattered in the end if they were together and were able to move forward together as a family and find happiness despite the trauma, abuse, and dangers they survived.
The earliest we hesr about the sugar bowl in the show is actually in episode 2 when count olaf makes a remark about missing it while drinking his coffee
Absolutely love this video! One small correction for the problems with the sugar bowl timeline. The show states that the Baudelaire parents were trying to RECREATE the botanical hybrid on the island. The sugar bowl contains the original.
As a kid I thought ASOUE was a good series of kids books and nothing more. I recently had a thought though, that we never actually learned what made the sugar bowl so important in the books and looking into that has made me realize that these books go so, so much deeper than kid me ever realized. VFD is really well done, and the realization that although it wasn't mentioned until Austere Academy and didn't really become a fully fleshed-out organization until around Hostile Hospital or Carnivorous Carnival I think, it's been influencing pretty much every aspect of the series since Bad Beginning.
But I still have one question, how are violet, klaus and sunny alive. In the first scene in the show the children question why their parents randomly told them to go to bring beach. That means that the parents might have known that something was going to happen that day. Right? Idk
You’re right. There are a few details that imply that their parents did know that their lives were in danger. But we don’t have any more information about how or why. The book doesn’t even have that line. Chapter 1 just says that the kids visit Briny Beach all the time.
@@BigBlueBackpack my theory is that one of the snickets reached out to the baudelaire parents (possibly beatrice, knowing how much she meant to lemony) to warn them that they caught wind of the plot to set a fire, and they thought they could maybe do something about it or at least save the kids. i have little to no evidence of this, but i want to believe
To me, The Great Unknown is also part of the theme of that particular book. We assume it's a terrible malevolent beast, simply because we fear the unknown, but we never actually have any proof of malice or evil, and I think it's even implied it may be in fact a benevolent force trying to help, or one that can neither be considered evil nor noble. And if it's a metaphor for death, I suppose you could also read that as a grim way of saying that death can be terrible or a relief, depending on the circumstances of ones life leading up to it.
That first "ring!" had my ears prick up so fast! Great deep dive, you've drawn similar conclusions to what I have. My best friend and I were obsessed with the books growing up, so much so I got myself an eye tattoo 😅
fun fact: the bombinating beast makes an appearance in the netflix version of the end, one of the islanders holding a tiny statue of it side note: a major flaw for me in netflix series was that the bad beginning was too long (two episodes) for the shortest book in the series, and the end was (almost?) the longest book and only got one episode, so too much content was cut
i like the Netflix cannon, but it isn’t all that faithful. The biggest difference is the fact that it far clearer who is meant to be wicked and who is supposed to be noble.
I think the VFD warm up was the disagreement of how to handle knowledge. The “good side” wanted it to just be unbridled. Whereas the “Bad Side” wanted it contained and controlled. I believe the boiling over due to the sugar bowl was bc that unspoken agreement was gone. The “Good Side” has knowledge that was dangerous (The Spores) and the “Bad Side” had something that could destroy that knowledge (The Cure and Immunization), but when the Bowl was taken… it meant one side had both. So that stalemate was now gone. So the “Bad Side” went “Alright… I guess the gloves are off”
I still remember being a kid and watching the movie at the cinema. We had no idea what to expect, and were so captivated by everything. I didn’t feel the same way about the show, but then I was also a lot older, so it makes sense. I did like the show though.
I think count olaf burt the baudalaire mansion because in the show we get a flashback from the day before of olaf telling Mr. Poe that he was the nearest relative of the baudalaire. And I remember him saying something like “If the baudalaire mansion happens to burn down and their parents die I am their nearest living relative and could inherit their fortune”
Well it may not be a fully direct prequel but the book series "The wrong Questions" talks abt Lemony's childhood, I reccomend it, its pretty good, although I only read the first one
I truly believe that the sugar bowl is a metaphor. I think nobody really knows what it contains but wants to have it, showing how people fight over nothing. The sugar bowl was a sparkle that started the fire of the Schism, but a huge problem that we dont know was already there. The Great Unknown is both a metaphor for death and a true monster, probably the sea beast of All The Wrong Questions (amazing series, you should read it)
I was deep down the Harry Potter rabbit hole when my older cousin recommended these books to my brother. I couldn't be bothered, because they're really geared towards a younger audience (my cousin was in graduate college lol), but my little brother actually latched onto them. He hated reading, and had no interest in HP (which I pre-ordered and went to the midnight book releases for), but something about the LS books just drew him in (he's 6yrs younger than me). It was so cool to see a kid who just hated reading, absolutely devouring this series. If ask him about it, and he'd always be so excited to share the latest mystery or reveal. He had something to be passionate about, like I was with HP. After I finished HP, I revisited LS, and the first thing I noticed was what you said, they don't talk down to the audience. Yeah, the first person narration is definitely more kid friendly, but they're good books at any age. I could live without the constant explanations of vocabulary, but it's something that's really helpful for those kids that hate reading.
I’m currently rewatching the Netflix series, I remember keeping up with it when it first came out and how excited I was for each new season. Never got around to reading the books, but still this series is a big part of my middle school years I love the unanswered mysteries and trying to solve them
My friend and i both read the series as kids and watched the show when it first came out, and we decided to reread them in a sort of weekly book club. We just finished #5 and im excited to get to the VFD stuff and reinvestigate it all
This is a masterpiece of a video. Everything is organized in such a meticulous way and I love how you disclose the way you will be approaching/backing up each point. I will definitely be checking out your other videos. I wish I had found this sooner.
This was my Harry Potter as a kid. I was glued to these books and watched the movie over and over. I was such a nerd I would look for the initials VFD everywhere at school
A lot of the "extra" stuff from the TV show came from the additional books, The Beatrice Letters and Lemony Snicket's Unauthorized Autobiography. The show just ties them into the story. The movie theater showing the zombie film is in the Unauthorized Autobiography, along with the poison darts at the opera, and a lot of the rest. It's been a long time since I read them but I felt like pretty much every part of the show that wasn't in the main books came from those.
Excellent video packed full of great info...BUT...you failed to mention Daniel Handler (with some help) wrote the teleplay for all 25 episode...so anything ''added'' to Netflix's ASOUE was Lemony approved 😜👍👍
Here's a bit of a stretch bc I just rewatched the whole show and really want the sugar bowl to have an answer and am happy to settle for what they told us, even if it isn't perfect or if not knowing is more poetic or fitting to the story: The objections you raise to the sugar bowl containing the cure to the fungus (I'm not even gonna try to spell it) can be solved, if you're willing to suspend a little disbelief. Yes, the schism is older than the sugar bowl, but, as you later say, its theft only worsened it, not created it (any characters who say otherwise are dramatizing what happened or have simplified it in their heads, which many sides fighting wars often do); the Baudelaires wrote down that they were figuring out how to create a cure and Beatrice would put it in the sugar bowl - well, if Beatrice stole the sugar bowl, she could've kept it and brought it with her to the island, where they had the cure, but not the means to make more of it. Eventually, they figure it out, and add to the little of it they already had, in the sugar bowl; Captain Widdershins states its contents are too dangerous for children to know, not because of its actual contents, but because he doesn't want to explain the story of the sugar bowl, its theft, and specifically how Beatrice steals and kills for it, aka, how the volunteers can do bad things in the name of good - that's what he doesn't want the children to know (btw, could this be why the Captain wasn't in the show? They wanted to avoid his not-answer to the sugar bowl?); and finally, that it can exonerate Lemony and incriminate Olaf, could be that, again, it's not about its contents, but its story - that Lemony stole it, and was an accomplice to killing Olaf's father, would prove that Olaf has it out for him and was the one to wrongly accuse him of his crimes.
I think my biggest question is Jacquelyn since she is an actual character in the show and just an actor in the books but I wonder what happened to her cause she stopped showing up around Ersatz elevator also another one is what was in Peru that they wanted Monty to find/see it always confused me why it was so important cause even Count Olaf was on the boat same with Jacquelyn, I do know that in the books there was a boat run by V.F.D members kind of like Madam Lulu with them switching turns from time to time but it was Sailors still not sure I wish those 2 were answered..
Jacquelyn only appears in the tv show. She isn’t in the books at all. There isn’t really a reason why she stopped appearing after Season 2. The writers probably just didn’t have anything for her to do. There’s one line in Season 3 about her becoming the Duchess of Winnipeg, which would make her the tv show parallel to the book character ‘R, Duchess of Winnipeg,’ a character who is frequently mentioned but never seen. There’s nothing special in Peru. Uncle Monty was trying to escape with the Baudelaires and go somewhere as far away as possible, where he and the Baudelairs could study reptiles in peace. The ship that they were going to take, the Prospero, had been owned by VFD for a long time and used for all kinds of missions. Almost every notable member of VFD served on its crew at some point.
In the books, the secret message in Zombies In The Snow doesn’t say to go to Peru. It says to come to “the town where this film takes place.” We never find out where that was - somewhere snowy, presumably. The message also mentions that there’s a ‘survivor’ there, hidden in a snowman. There’s no clear information on who that is, although there are persistent fan theories that this is the Baudelaires’ mother, who survived the fire. Uncle Monty never receives any of these messages in the books, though, and the idea to go to Peru is entirely his. In the show, it does say to go to Peru. But even so, we’re given no reason to believe that there’s anything special there, besides it being a remote location away from danger. Jacquelyn definitely does not appear in the books. I double and triple checked, and no character by that name ever appears. The detail about her acting in Zombies In The Snow appears only in the tv show.
So guys this is from my theories/what I think: In the sugar bowl is sugar, but the sugar is a cure to the fungus (forgot what it was called lol). Beatrice and Lemony Snicket wanted to use the cure to cure all the people, but Esme was just greedy. She wanted the sugar to herself to complete her tea set. Another thing I think was that when in episode 9 or 10, there was the flashback and the note said “Olaf knows”. I think this means that he knows that Beatrice threw the poison dart, not Lemony, so he killed Beatrice. That’s all I know/theorizing, what do you think? This was only from the show, I read 3 of the books
"And don't have any kids yourselves." Wait, what if the parents with kids are dying because the other members of VFD don't want whatever secrets they have to be passed onto their children? These secrets could harm the other members/give them an advantage. Also, this kind of connects to the whole past apprenticeship concept, but that's just one detail
My English isn't very good (I speak Spanish) and I only watch the series and read until the half of the 6 book (My country doesnt sell the books and I lost the PDFs). So maybe this doesn't have logic, but If there's more Schisms? Like, VFD is pretty older than Ishmael and it start with a real Volunteer Fire Departament or a talk between two brothers (In a chapter, when Lemony talks about Jacques, he says that from a talk between tho brothers can start a lot of things like a secret society or something like that) and the first Schism make the VFD in two parts. One with the Woman with Hair and No Beard and the Man with Beard and No Hair and the other with Ishmael and probably other characters like Monty and Jerome's parents (When I watch the series for fist time, something that Monty says to the Baudelaire but I don't remember pretty well make me think that his parents tell him about VFD. Also, why Jerome has the secret passage and reason because Esme married him if he isn't a VFD member?, a big question that nobody do. I think his parents was volunteers and they doesn't tell him or he doesnt want to be a VFD member). After that, in the part of the First Schism where Ishmael and the generation of VFD members like Snicket and Denouement's brothers, Beatrice, Bertrand Baudelaire, Mr. and Mrs. Quagmire and Count Olaf was, they have other Schism, the one that we know. One part want to do what the original VFD was meaning for (fight fires) and the other one start fires (with influence of the Woman with Hair and No Beard and the Man with Beard and No Hair's part of the First Schism). Again, sorry for my bad English. It isn't my first language and maybe I don't say something like I want to do it or didn't do it clear. Sorry for that
Hotel Denouement REALLY reminds me of New Pork City "it may be possible the Master Porky has gathered everyone here for one final, twisted party, before the end of the world" I just found that to be a bit similar.
you're not wrong, I think the execution is a lot more different though. all the characters coming together near the end of a story is a pretty common trope and I find that's about where it ends
the sugar bowl only containing sugar just doesnt make sense, when the show depicts the sugar bowl being gone, the blocks of sugar are right there on the dish. if the show is to be believed, then the sugar is the immunizer that is just so valuable, but beatrice took the sugar bowl without the sugar? that's like taking the case but not the jewelry. i could just be misunderstanding it, but it would make a lot more sense if the sugar bowl itself was the value instead of whatever inside, like any sugar put inside the sugar bowl would make you immune to the medusoid mycellium, but it still doesn't work
When i watched the series come to me the schism began long before olaf and lemony generation as the original hq of vfd was already on fire in the mountains and all of them were part of the same school. Every side started a armamentistic escalation that conclude with the mycelium been developed. As the mycelium become a problem. Beatrice began the investigation to find a cure, and then a way to immunization everyone, but it was to bitter-discusting it must be put on sugar cubes. The second generation fight began when Beatrice hides the cure on a very valuable sugar bowl property of Esme and any of them is aware of the true value of the sugarrbowl or the inmunization sugarcubes. This ends on olaf father's dead and made young adults olaf join the "arsonist" side of the vfd. After that the parents go on a trip and get lost for almost a year, an then create the radish-apple tree. The vfd try to prevent the arsonist to get the cure in anyway and esme was only looking to complete her collection that's why she never been reach by the arsonist at all. At the end olaf destroy the vfd and the arsonist as nothing of the schisms really matters to him.
i don't think the show was wrong about the sugar bowl. quigley was at anwhistle aquatics and could have put it in there then. but for the rest of the time it is likely it was empty and was a convenient vessel for whoever used it, mostly important for the symbolism in the story.
One question I don't think is ever answered is why VFD's logo is made to look like an eye. I know it's supposed to be the letters V F D, but in the cover art for book 13 "The End" it's quite obviously stylized to look like an eye, and it's always mistaken for an eye by almost every character who sees it, so it can't just be a coincidence. It just seems weird that an organization called Volunteer Fire Department would use an eye for symbolism.
The letters VFD are meant to be hidden within the design so that they would only be recognizable to members who knew what to look for. It’s one of VFD’s many secret coded messages. Why did they choose an eye specifically? I don’t know what the in-universe explanation is. But out of universe, it looks like an eye because it’s a creepy design that will make the reader uneasy. Even after we learn that it was supposed to be a symbol for good, it still gives off bad vibes.
Thanks for this video, that was super comprehensive! Sent it to my friend (who doesn't mind spoilers) in hope of making her want to watch or read it~ It definitely worked on me at least! Still trying to figure out the secret code!
It feels weird to watch these kinds of videos because I never read the books I’ve only seen the (2004 film) and (2017) show , the film which I absolutely adore, I’m not really sure why everyone gives it so much crap , I would however like to know if the books are worth reading,all in all great video.
i think the books are DEFINITELY worth reading. When i was little and read them they literally gave me no desire to pick up any other books and to just keep finding more about the story. However i think the show does cover a lot of the book and the details they've added fit in so well with the story, that if you've seen the show you barely need to read the book. If you love to read, definitely give it a try. One of my favorite parts of the book is when he goes into a whole page rant about icebergs in attempt to make the reader fall asleep and distract us from the horrible thing about to happen next in the story. He's incredibly talented and creative and if you want to see the mind of lemony snicket, the show and movie aren't enough
@@Jiyuu06 I found that the repetitiveness of the first 6 books was what made the departure from the formula from the 7th book onward that much more shocking and I don't think it would have had quite the same impact without that
I think people who are less keen on the film are those who enjoyed the books. The film truncates the events so much, and rounds off the first three books so that it's not easy to continue the series in later films even if they wanted to. I think also there's only so much Jim Carey some people can take before it feels like it's a Jim Carey show reel - I feel like the TV show better captures the essence of Olaf, and his characters all are recognisable as Count Olaf, whereas Jim Carey is actually a good actor, so Count Olaf and the two characters he plays are very distinct, though clearly all Carey.
This blast to the past reminded me about other mystery adventure book series i once read - Ulysses Moore and turns out the more thrilling mystery then whatever happens there is fact it and its author have literally no presence on the internet xD
Theory about the setting and schism: First of all, the dart thrown at Count Olaf's father was just a tranquilizer, and he didn't die right there. It just seemed like he was killed there, and it was easy to lie about. The series takes place in and around Viña Del Mar, Chile, and the schism was in late 1973. For context, on September 11 of that year, the military disposed of the left wing Salvador Allende in favor of Augusto Pinochet, a right-wing dictator. The firefighters supported Pinochet, while the firestarters opposed him. As a result, they were killed extrajudicially (usually thrown out of helicopters). Due to internal political disputes, VFD split, with the firefighters being supported by Pinochet. Because of this, the fire starters didn't do much until 1990, when they were emboldened by the transition to democracy, in which, Chile elected a center left government, under president Patricio Aylwin. That year, they burnt down the Quagmire home, then burned down the Beaudelaires' not long after. Viña Del Mar fits in perfectly with the series's geography and the city's history lines up with the backstory.
The problem is that people assume the theft of the sugarbowl caused the schism. That event is important but for the reason it allowed for Olaf to join the schism, and VFD to lose its leader, probably the reason the noble side couldnt easily fight back. The schism was already cooking as Beatrice was already wary about the Man no hair, Women no beard. Im sure the schism was caused by the inevitble greed developed by some members after this noble organization gained fortunes and developed offical headquarters. It also couldve easily been cause when the posions and cures were first found out about and obrained, but the theft of the sugar bowl is important for our main cast, but not why the whole organization was fighting in the first place.
Still wiping away the tears from the ending.. The world was too quiet there- so I had to look for another place to stay at that wasn't as quiet.. I watched the show thinking it's kind of A comedy but I was obviously wrong. This show will wreck ur evening ur whole life and your day..So look away
It is confirmed that the cure for the Medusoid Mycelium was in the sugar bowl because if you see the opera scene with Esme and Kit , Esme says that the sugar would be bitter and we never see Kit drink her tea. That would explain why Kit died because she never drank her tea and when she was on the island she got the Medusoid Mycelium and died. Also many people think that Olaf burned the Baudelaires house down because when Olaf and Esme see Beatrice and Lemony run away with the sugar bowl Olaf says that Beatrice will burn. Also it would make sense because that would have probably been apart of Count Olaf's plan from the beginning. I personally think that because Beatrice killed Count Olaf's father, Count Olaf took his hate and anger upon the the Baudelaire children. This would make sense we never got why Count Olaf wanted the Baudelaire's fortune.
The VFD in the eye symbol is what it looks like if you make those letters with your right hand. The F is even at an odd place to account for the rotation of your wrist bringing it lower
Subbed, awesome video, just finished the series, it was beautifully dark, and really made me feel every emotion, by the finale episode, I somehow was able to take the Offhand comments, flashbacks, snippets of notes and dialogue between characters, and by the end of it all, was proud of myself because I was able to figure out what i needed to, to understand everything, and still left with questions, yet satisfied with the ending, your video is an amazing summary, explanation and breakdown, enjoying hearing the story really dug into and explained fully, you are amazing! 😃
Also, the events 8n my opinion, likely go like this: sugarbowl is stolen while parents leave island. because a horseradish factory already exists, then the rest of the events play out. So horseradish is a common cure for meducoid mycelium, but the sugarbowl is a secluded experiment by VFD.
I really loved the movie and the show. It’s honestly such a special franchise to me. I love the way Netflix did the series and I also love the gothic concept they used in the movie.
No, the apples definitely contain horseradish. The clip you’re referring to appears at 21:32 in the video. The sugar bowl contains sugar, which was extracted from the genetically engineered horseradish/apple tree.
My headcannon is that the theft of the sugar bowl did not start THE schism. It caused the schism between Esme and Olaf, and the Snickers and Boudelairs.
I see what you did there with the bell cipher. I am too lazy to rewatch and decode it plus i do not know the cipher, but that was a pretty cagey way to get ppl to rewatch the video..excellent job great video!
ya know. i tried writing down all the words and i didn't get anything that made any sense. i thought he would have coded the word "subscribe" but i didn't get any of those letters lol
I realize there are differences between the series and the books, but I think the intention is that both are meant to be put together to form a mostly-cohesive "complete" narrative, so to speak. The series plugs holes in the books, and vice versa.
I know no one will read this but here's my opinion on the content of the Sugar bowl, the identity of the Question mark and all the other unanswered questions- We'll never know and we never were supposed to know. This is the story of the Baudelaires and how they survive the schism'd after effects and Olaf's schemes, not of V.F.D or the bowl. Lemony didn't include those details because they're not part of Violet, Klaus and Sunny's situation or story, and if Lemony revealed the information we want it would absolutely destroy the noble side of V.F.D as the information would be public knowledge.
I have proven your assumption that no one would read your comment as incorrect. Unless, of course, you meant that someone with the first name No and the last name One would read your comment, that is.
Everyone always forgets this… but the parents don’t just die in a fire. They specifically send the kids off to Briny beach and THEN they die in a mysterious fire.
In atwq lemony is supposed to meet kit snicket to steal something very important, this thing is so important that kit says it is an opportunity that she could not pass up even if she had to do it alone. I believe this thing is the sugar bowl. In the book When Did We See Her Last, on the last page, we see a sketch of kit running away from the cops holding an object wrapped in burlap, that looks suspiciously like a sugar bowl.
in the books, it was never known if Lemony and Beatrice ever meet in person. it is implied that Beautrice was looking for Lemony but, it was never revealed if they ever did meet, leaving everything to the readers imagination and adding another question left unsolved.
I truly believe that the sugar bowl contained exactly what it says-sugar-and every rumor spread and every iteration of it just made it seem like that sugar bowl was such an important thing in the schism. The sugar bowl was a metaphor that people fight over the most crass and simple things in life that they never really stopped and reevaluated if what they were trying to get was worth more than the harm they're causing to each other.
Esme Squalor probably just thought that the sugar bowl was very "in" that's why she got infuriated when Beatrice stole it from her.
The sugar has the cure for the evil fungus in it
@@ClamshellPackageSpecialist Why would it have a cure? The cure is literally horseradish, which is relatively easy to get. Theres no reason for a war to be fought over that.
@@ClamshellPackageSpecialist that's just in the show, not the books. I've always seen it as a metaphor, even as a kid. Just like the unknown was a symbol for death (or fear of the unknown, as I assumed as a kid), the sugar bowl always seemed like a metaphor for small misdeads being blown out of proportion and causing all this misery
I fully agree with the first half of your comment, however, I feel differently about your take on Esmé. To me, it was always more about the betrayal associated with having your close friend steal something they know is important to you. Beatrice didn't trust Esmé to keep the sugar bowl safe and therefore ended up stealing it instead. I think that's why it suddenly became even more relevant for Esmé - she believed by finding the sugar bowl, she would somehow get revenge on Beatrice
I think Esme even says in the show that the reason she wants the sugar bowl is because it completes her tea set.
i think the reason everyone's answer to the contents of the sugar bowl is different is to illustrate how stupid war is, nobody knows what they're truly even fighting over.
Inside you there are two wolves: one who appreciates unsolved mysteries, enjoys the speculation, and believes some things, in fact, don't need answers; and another who desperatly wants things to make sense and have fitting resolutions. ASOUE creates a schism between them and places them at war...
Yeah
Great thought 🎯
So the sugar bowl is a metaphor for social engineering and hegemony and how both backfires.
One clever part about putting something valuable in a sugarbowl is that the sugarbowl is ceramic and therefore very resistant to fire. Ceramics are fired and hardened at temperatures way hotter than that of a standard house fire. Perfect for VFD.
But they still conduct heat, so it wouldn't actually protect anything inside
To this day, I still remember distinctly the crushing disappointment I felt when I read the last book. There was an endless paragraph about how some mysteries are better left unsolved and that's when I realised that was the author's way of justifying to me, the reader, that he never planned what was inside the sugar bowl and couldn't find an answer that would live to the hype he created. He was great at creating compelling mysteries, but he literally gave up on solving them...
However the author wrote episodes of the show so he did answer the question after 13 years lol
Remember the Unknown ship that was left unanswered in the Grim Grotto book.
Which reminds me, I didn't like that the series left out Captain Wittershins from that book..It would have been excellent to see his relationship with Fernald (Hook handed Man).
@@nowknowthis He didn't write everything no. Some choices were made by the others. He heavily implied during one of his interview that he didn't like some explanations given by the show and would have preferred some questions left unanswered.
The author did have an answer for the sugar bowl, and he said in interviews that people write to him and solve it. So it is solvable, but he never said what it is XD
It was solvable if you pay attention enough to all the clues. Specifically the hybridized apple seeds were inside and you can figure this out, by the passage the Baudelaire parents wrote in a book on the island. They claimed that the hybridized seeds were stored in a "Vessel For...." Then it cuts off because Klaus coughs. But if you guess well enough, it's a "Vessel For Disaccharides" AKA a Sugar Bowl.
As I read this when I was a child, I definitely had the feeling that the story was not about all the convoluted plot and side stories of every non-sensical character, but really about children fraternising and enduring the absurdities and sufferings of adults' world. So thank you, but I really don't care what is in the sugar bowl.
What I always noticed is the repetition of the number of 3, there's three Baudelaire children, three Quagmires, three Denoumonts, three Snickets, the adult siblings also had consecutive letters(Jaques, Kit, Lemony)
It might never have ever been important but props to The author for that
Repetition is used a lot to maintain heavy elements of surrealism. 13 is another common one. It's one of the reasons the theming of the book will stand out above any other book I read as a kid. It really shines using it's quirks like that
Likewise with the hotel managers Dewey, Ernest, and Frank
@missjomferr The person whose comment you are replying to already said that, the Denoumonts.
And one of the three is always "quirky" + ends in a "y": Sunny, Quigley, Dewey, Lemony
I’m sorry but I read these books probably two decades ago and struggle to remember. “Denouement” is a French word. It’d be kind of brilliant to name characters “Denouement”. Is that what happened or is that a coincidence?
I always bought into the theory that the sugar bowl was a macguffin, meant to drive the plot. Sunny even says it at one point in the books. I think it holds up a mirror to how conflicts can have legitimate reasons for existing, such as morality, but devolve into fighting after somethibg meaningless or small happens. It’s like World War I. The easiest answer people give as to what started it, was the assassination of Arch Duke Ferdinand (mentioned in the books as well) but in reality it was much more complicated than that. I think the sugar bowl is much the same way. It was the trigger for the organization to devolve into conflict. The spark that started the fire. Fighting in relationships might start over something silly and deepen into the actual problems in the relationship
Anyone else still have questions about Olaf’s henchmen? Specifically the white-faced women, right before turning on Olaf they mentioned that they lost their parents and sister to a house fire. It could be irrelevant but it never really left my mind. I wish we knew more about them.
The last two books hammer in the idea that the world is full of tons of people, each with dense stories that we’ll never get to hear. I see this detail as an early example of that. But beyond that, we can pretty confidently say that this fire was set by somebody fighting in the VFD schism.
I see the series as a metaphor for life in general. Bad things happen and you will never truly know why they do. We will never know everything in this life, there are mysteries all around us that we can’t find answers to and in the end “it is the best for which you can hope for”
My therapist gave me similar advice recently. “Stop trying to find a ‘why’ because you’ll never fully know it, and even if you did, it won’t help you move forward.” It’s just as frustrating now as it was when I read these books as a kid lol
The Great Unknown
life is a conundrum of esoterica
I read a theory online that the sugar bowl contained a audio recording device. VFD would have picnic baskets containing codes based off of the foods in the picnic(like when the Bauldalaires solved a code from the food in the fridge at the burned VFD headquarters), this also served as a means for their agents to meet to exchange information or receive orders. In these picnics a bugged sugar bowl would be placed to record their agents conversations because VFD is all about being excessively paranoid. This also explains why VFD agents always take their tea and coffee bitter, because otherwise if wanted to sweeten their drinks they’d have to use the sugar bowl and there is no sugar in the sugar bowl. Eventually something really juicy got recorded but got mixed up with the other sugar bowls and the race for that particular one started the Schism.
The sugar bowl contained sugar that cured the fungi infection that is deadly if you get it. But if you eat the sugar you’re immune, essent
@@clay9909 that’s just for the Netflix show
@@dallaspowell6313 oh well
The theory states that sugar bowls generally were used as recording devices, but this particular sugar bowl from Esme doesn't necessarily have to be just that.
"We're attempting a botanical hybrid through the tuberous canopy, which should bring safely to fruition despite its dangers to our associates in utero. Of course, in case we are banished, Beatrice is hiding a small amount in a vess--" Vessel For Disaccharides or sugar bowl.
That lines up perfectly with the show. Tea being bitter works as a deterrent of picking up the sugar bowl when there is a mic in there, but the botanical hybrid is also literally bitter sugar.
It works both ways. ;)
@@TCO_404 My theory (made up on the spot) is that *the* sugar bowl is the store of all recorded information. It can prove Lemony's innocence and Olaf's criminal acts. It can bring the world to its knees by exposing everyone's darkest secrets.
I’ve never hated and loved a story so much the way I hate and love a series of unfortunate events. I wish we could get new stories of the grown up orphans :(
That would actually be incredibly interesting and work quite well
If you ever read The Beatrice Letters, you’ll find out where the Baudelaire children go in life next. It’s actually quite nice to know that they don’t die after The End.
@@sarareanna thank you! Ill make sure to read those!! ❤️😭
The series plays on biblical themes and the question of knowledge vs ignorance. On the island aka the garden of Eden there is a tree with the knowledge of good and evil. A snake presents the apple to them to partake and live. The orphans chose to seek knowledge even though it cases them great pain and ultimately they chose to leave the island/garden. Other characters (especially authority figures) chose to live in ignorance. Sometimes ignorance is bliss but it also tends to lead to death. The series deals with questions of authority and knowledge.
This book series was such a part of my childhood. I am a fan of the movie, just disappointed it didn’t do well enough to continue. I love that this series was given its proper justice on Netflix. The world was expanded, the characters and actors were great, while some of the special effects are iffy with CGI, it’s all around the adaptation that the books deserved.
The contradicting sugar bowl stuff is cool, because we can never know what actually happened, every side has a different account of what happened. Some say it held sugar, others a cure, or maybe it was never significant and it’s importance was over exaggerated by years of recounting events that may or may not have happened.
The horseradish appletree could’ve been the Baudelaires’s “Plan B”. Like they thought “well the sugarbowl was a fiasco, but we might as well develop something ELSE to fight the Mycelium and all we have here is a bigass appletree. Maybe we can add horseradish to the apples et voilá!”
I remember in the first episode when Lemony mentioned a volunteer fire department and when they started mentioning VFD my mind drifted back to the volunteer fire department as a pure joke only to find out I was right
One of violets best line's
Klaus: Do you think we can trust Kit?
Violet: Since we got into her taxi, she's broken at least nine traffic safety laws, driven into a hedge, and recruited us to spy for a secret organization. I like her.
Klaus: Me too.
The thing about sugar bowls is that the contents can change, at any point in the time line. At the opera we see the sugar cubes have been removed from the bowl, so it seems unlikely that the bowl was, at that time, just wanted for its sugar content, hybrid or otherwise. Esme is more concerned about the sugar bowl itself, as it completes her tea set. In the opera scene we only know it contains vaguely defined 'research' - so I do wonder if there's details on a slip of paper, or in the design on the outside or inside of the bowl, of this unknown research.
Also….at the very end Olaf literally says he didn’t start the fire that killed their parents, but the book never tells us who did! Why!?
The first episode made it seem that Olaf was responsible but then by the end of the series we get this great revelation but say we suspect the man with beard but no hair and woman with hair but no beard they did seem surprised as well finding out that the parents were dead
Esme, I mean it makes sense. She hates Beatrice for stealing her sugar bowl and she was apart if VFD (at least I think so) therefore we don’t know which part of the schism she was in, leaving her as a likely culprit
There is a great theory from Snicket Sleuth that the Baudelaire fire might mirror the events at Hotel Denouement. They lured Olaf to their house with the sugar bowl, and were planning to put him on trial. Then a fire starts. It may be that the Baudelaire parents, like their children, helped start that fire as a warning to other VFD agents. The books also confirm that Beatrice survives that initial fire, only to die later on. That's why the sugar bowl is in the hospital. ;)
it was poe's wife
@@TCO_404 Wait what ??? You're telling me in the books the Baudelaire mother survives almost half the series without her children even finding her ???
That's so muc more painfully and cruelly written than what the show did with the Quagmire parents my god...
I think it's one of those things to teach us that tragic things happen that have no answers. The Baudelares likely wonder why their lives were a lightning pole for tragedy and thought they could find answers by discovering the secrets of VFD and the sugar bowl, which turns up nothing. All that mattered in the end if they were together and were able to move forward together as a family and find happiness despite the trauma, abuse, and dangers they survived.
The earliest we hesr about the sugar bowl in the show is actually in episode 2 when count olaf makes a remark about missing it while drinking his coffee
Absolutely love this video! One small correction for the problems with the sugar bowl timeline. The show states that the Baudelaire parents were trying to RECREATE the botanical hybrid on the island. The sugar bowl contains the original.
As a kid I thought ASOUE was a good series of kids books and nothing more. I recently had a thought though, that we never actually learned what made the sugar bowl so important in the books and looking into that has made me realize that these books go so, so much deeper than kid me ever realized. VFD is really well done, and the realization that although it wasn't mentioned until Austere Academy and didn't really become a fully fleshed-out organization until around Hostile Hospital or Carnivorous Carnival I think, it's been influencing pretty much every aspect of the series since Bad Beginning.
But I still have one question, how are violet, klaus and sunny alive. In the first scene in the show the children question why their parents randomly told them to go to bring beach. That means that the parents might have known that something was going to happen that day. Right? Idk
You’re right. There are a few details that imply that their parents did know that their lives were in danger. But we don’t have any more information about how or why.
The book doesn’t even have that line. Chapter 1 just says that the kids visit Briny Beach all the time.
@@BigBlueBackpack my theory is that one of the snickets reached out to the baudelaire parents (possibly beatrice, knowing how much she meant to lemony) to warn them that they caught wind of the plot to set a fire, and they thought they could maybe do something about it or at least save the kids. i have little to no evidence of this, but i want to believe
To me, The Great Unknown is also part of the theme of that particular book.
We assume it's a terrible malevolent beast, simply because we fear the unknown, but we never actually have any proof of malice or evil, and I think it's even implied it may be in fact a benevolent force trying to help, or one that can neither be considered evil nor noble.
And if it's a metaphor for death, I suppose you could also read that as a grim way of saying that death can be terrible or a relief, depending on the circumstances of ones life leading up to it.
That first "ring!" had my ears prick up so fast!
Great deep dive, you've drawn similar conclusions to what I have.
My best friend and I were obsessed with the books growing up, so much so I got myself an eye tattoo 😅
fun fact: the bombinating beast makes an appearance in the netflix version of the end, one of the islanders holding a tiny statue of it
side note: a major flaw for me in netflix series was that the bad beginning was too long (two episodes) for the shortest book in the series, and the end was (almost?) the longest book and only got one episode, so too much content was cut
I didnt realise the Bombinating Beast statue, now I gotta go see it
i like the Netflix cannon, but it isn’t all that faithful.
The biggest difference is the fact that it far clearer who is meant to be wicked and who is supposed to be noble.
25:35 "I made a mistake" is the coded message
yeah...noticed it too.☺
What’s the message
Well if you dont mind me asking, how did you decode it?
@@ampix4669 it's every 11th word in between the ding sounds. so that there's 10 words between every word that makes up the coded message
anybody else notice he uses VFD acronyms throughout the video
like at 24:42 a Very Frustrating Dilemma
I think the VFD warm up was the disagreement of how to handle knowledge. The “good side” wanted it to just be unbridled. Whereas the “Bad Side” wanted it contained and controlled. I believe the boiling over due to the sugar bowl was bc that unspoken agreement was gone. The “Good Side” has knowledge that was dangerous (The Spores) and the “Bad Side” had something that could destroy that knowledge (The Cure and Immunization), but when the Bowl was taken… it meant one side had both. So that stalemate was now gone. So the “Bad Side” went “Alright… I guess the gloves are off”
I still remember being a kid and watching the movie at the cinema. We had no idea what to expect, and were so captivated by everything. I didn’t feel the same way about the show, but then I was also a lot older, so it makes sense. I did like the show though.
36:21 "run now" is a coded message too
I think count olaf burt the baudalaire mansion because in the show we get a flashback from the day before of olaf telling Mr. Poe that he was the nearest relative of the baudalaire. And I remember him saying something like “If the baudalaire mansion happens to burn down and their parents die I am their nearest living relative and could inherit their fortune”
One of the strong suits of the series is that the author of the books is the one who helped to expand the stories.
I have an unnecessary amount of obsession for the show. I will forever crave a prequel.
Well it may not be a fully direct prequel but the book series "The wrong Questions" talks abt Lemony's childhood, I reccomend it, its pretty good, although I only read the first one
I truly believe that the sugar bowl is a metaphor. I think nobody really knows what it contains but wants to have it, showing how people fight over nothing. The sugar bowl was a sparkle that started the fire of the Schism, but a huge problem that we dont know was already there. The Great Unknown is both a metaphor for death and a true monster, probably the sea beast of All The Wrong Questions (amazing series, you should read it)
I like how the show gives answers and happy endings to the hench people and most of the people at the hotel denouement (implied)
I was deep down the Harry Potter rabbit hole when my older cousin recommended these books to my brother. I couldn't be bothered, because they're really geared towards a younger audience (my cousin was in graduate college lol), but my little brother actually latched onto them. He hated reading, and had no interest in HP (which I pre-ordered and went to the midnight book releases for), but something about the LS books just drew him in (he's 6yrs younger than me). It was so cool to see a kid who just hated reading, absolutely devouring this series. If ask him about it, and he'd always be so excited to share the latest mystery or reveal. He had something to be passionate about, like I was with HP. After I finished HP, I revisited LS, and the first thing I noticed was what you said, they don't talk down to the audience. Yeah, the first person narration is definitely more kid friendly, but they're good books at any age. I could live without the constant explanations of vocabulary, but it's something that's really helpful for those kids that hate reading.
I’m currently rewatching the Netflix series, I remember keeping up with it when it first came out and how excited I was for each new season. Never got around to reading the books, but still this series is a big part of my middle school years I love the unanswered mysteries and trying to solve them
The whole Winnipeg thing was also like a "plot escape", quite smart tho
The "all coming together joke" was p clever. Subbed.
This series is just so well made I loved the books and its so well cast, Neil Patrick Harris is an excellent count olaf
My friend and i both read the series as kids and watched the show when it first came out, and we decided to reread them in a sort of weekly book club. We just finished #5 and im excited to get to the VFD stuff and reinvestigate it all
This is a masterpiece of a video. Everything is organized in such a meticulous way and I love how you disclose the way you will be approaching/backing up each point. I will definitely be checking out your other videos. I wish I had found this sooner.
This was the first book series that I really enjoyed as a kid that I read on my own
Your voice actually sounds like Klaus's voice. From the netflix series. That alone gave me so much comfort 🤧
This was my Harry Potter as a kid. I was glued to these books and watched the movie over and over. I was such a nerd I would look for the initials VFD everywhere at school
A lot of the "extra" stuff from the TV show came from the additional books, The Beatrice Letters and Lemony Snicket's Unauthorized Autobiography. The show just ties them into the story. The movie theater showing the zombie film is in the Unauthorized Autobiography, along with the poison darts at the opera, and a lot of the rest. It's been a long time since I read them but I felt like pretty much every part of the show that wasn't in the main books came from those.
This channel is so underrated this video deserves more views and likes
Excellent video packed full of great info...BUT...you failed to mention Daniel Handler (with some help) wrote the teleplay for all 25 episode...so anything ''added'' to Netflix's ASOUE was Lemony approved 😜👍👍
This is such a criminally underated video this gave me so much closure about the plot thank you 🙏🏼
This sounds like an amazing story! Growing up this girl in my grade was obsessed to the point of annoyance about it so that's what kept me away.
Here's a bit of a stretch bc I just rewatched the whole show and really want the sugar bowl to have an answer and am happy to settle for what they told us, even if it isn't perfect or if not knowing is more poetic or fitting to the story:
The objections you raise to the sugar bowl containing the cure to the fungus (I'm not even gonna try to spell it) can be solved, if you're willing to suspend a little disbelief. Yes, the schism is older than the sugar bowl, but, as you later say, its theft only worsened it, not created it (any characters who say otherwise are dramatizing what happened or have simplified it in their heads, which many sides fighting wars often do); the Baudelaires wrote down that they were figuring out how to create a cure and Beatrice would put it in the sugar bowl - well, if Beatrice stole the sugar bowl, she could've kept it and brought it with her to the island, where they had the cure, but not the means to make more of it. Eventually, they figure it out, and add to the little of it they already had, in the sugar bowl; Captain Widdershins states its contents are too dangerous for children to know, not because of its actual contents, but because he doesn't want to explain the story of the sugar bowl, its theft, and specifically how Beatrice steals and kills for it, aka, how the volunteers can do bad things in the name of good - that's what he doesn't want the children to know (btw, could this be why the Captain wasn't in the show? They wanted to avoid his not-answer to the sugar bowl?); and finally, that it can exonerate Lemony and incriminate Olaf, could be that, again, it's not about its contents, but its story - that Lemony stole it, and was an accomplice to killing Olaf's father, would prove that Olaf has it out for him and was the one to wrongly accuse him of his crimes.
I think my biggest question is Jacquelyn since she is an actual character in the show and just an actor in the books but I wonder what happened to her cause she stopped showing up around Ersatz elevator also another one is what was in Peru that they wanted Monty to find/see it always confused me why it was so important cause even Count Olaf was on the boat same with Jacquelyn, I do know that in the books there was a boat run by V.F.D members kind of like Madam Lulu with them switching turns from time to time but it was Sailors still not sure I wish those 2 were answered..
Jacquelyn only appears in the tv show. She isn’t in the books at all. There isn’t really a reason why she stopped appearing after Season 2. The writers probably just didn’t have anything for her to do. There’s one line in Season 3 about her becoming the Duchess of Winnipeg, which would make her the tv show parallel to the book character ‘R, Duchess of Winnipeg,’ a character who is frequently mentioned but never seen.
There’s nothing special in Peru. Uncle Monty was trying to escape with the Baudelaires and go somewhere as far away as possible, where he and the Baudelairs could study reptiles in peace. The ship that they were going to take, the Prospero, had been owned by VFD for a long time and used for all kinds of missions. Almost every notable member of VFD served on its crew at some point.
@@BigBlueBackpack she is she is just a actor in Gustavs movies
@@BigBlueBackpack in the books
@@BigBlueBackpack but if there was nothing important then why was it in a secret message he had to decode and not just in his first instinct
In the books, the secret message in Zombies In The Snow doesn’t say to go to Peru. It says to come to “the town where this film takes place.” We never find out where that was - somewhere snowy, presumably. The message also mentions that there’s a ‘survivor’ there, hidden in a snowman. There’s no clear information on who that is, although there are persistent fan theories that this is the Baudelaires’ mother, who survived the fire. Uncle Monty never receives any of these messages in the books, though, and the idea to go to Peru is entirely his.
In the show, it does say to go to Peru. But even so, we’re given no reason to believe that there’s anything special there, besides it being a remote location away from danger.
Jacquelyn definitely does not appear in the books. I double and triple checked, and no character by that name ever appears. The detail about her acting in Zombies In The Snow appears only in the tv show.
So guys this is from my theories/what I think:
In the sugar bowl is sugar, but the sugar is a cure to the fungus (forgot what it was called lol). Beatrice and Lemony Snicket wanted to use the cure to cure all the people, but Esme was just greedy. She wanted the sugar to herself to complete her tea set.
Another thing I think was that when in episode 9 or 10, there was the flashback and the note said “Olaf knows”. I think this means that he knows that Beatrice threw the poison dart, not Lemony, so he killed Beatrice.
That’s all I know/theorizing, what do you think? This was only from the show, I read 3 of the books
"And don't have any kids yourselves." Wait, what if the parents with kids are dying because the other members of VFD don't want whatever secrets they have to be passed onto their children? These secrets could harm the other members/give them an advantage. Also, this kind of connects to the whole past apprenticeship concept, but that's just one detail
My English isn't very good (I speak Spanish) and I only watch the series and read until the half of the 6 book (My country doesnt sell the books and I lost the PDFs). So maybe this doesn't have logic, but If there's more Schisms?
Like, VFD is pretty older than Ishmael and it start with a real Volunteer Fire Departament or a talk between two brothers (In a chapter, when Lemony talks about Jacques, he says that from a talk between tho brothers can start a lot of things like a secret society or something like that) and the first Schism make the VFD in two parts. One with the Woman with Hair and No Beard and the Man with Beard and No Hair and the other with Ishmael and probably other characters like Monty and Jerome's parents (When I watch the series for fist time, something that Monty says to the Baudelaire but I don't remember pretty well make me think that his parents tell him about VFD. Also, why Jerome has the secret passage and reason because Esme married him if he isn't a VFD member?, a big question that nobody do. I think his parents was volunteers and they doesn't tell him or he doesnt want to be a VFD member).
After that, in the part of the First Schism where Ishmael and the generation of VFD members like Snicket and Denouement's brothers, Beatrice, Bertrand Baudelaire, Mr. and Mrs. Quagmire and Count Olaf was, they have other Schism, the one that we know. One part want to do what the original VFD was meaning for (fight fires) and the other one start fires (with influence of the Woman with Hair and No Beard and the Man with Beard and No Hair's part of the First Schism).
Again, sorry for my bad English. It isn't my first language and maybe I don't say something like I want to do it or didn't do it clear. Sorry for that
Hotel Denouement REALLY reminds me of New Pork City
"it may be possible the Master Porky has gathered everyone here for one final, twisted party, before the end of the world"
I just found that to be a bit similar.
you're not wrong, I think the execution is a lot more different though. all the characters coming together near the end of a story is a pretty common trope and I find that's about where it ends
@@redactedinfo8557 I mean, both of their fates are left ambiguous as to wether they died or not.
the sugar bowl only containing sugar just doesnt make sense, when the show depicts the sugar bowl being gone, the blocks of sugar are right there on the dish. if the show is to be believed, then the sugar is the immunizer that is just so valuable, but beatrice took the sugar bowl without the sugar? that's like taking the case but not the jewelry. i could just be misunderstanding it, but it would make a lot more sense if the sugar bowl itself was the value instead of whatever inside, like any sugar put inside the sugar bowl would make you immune to the medusoid mycellium, but it still doesn't work
I always took that as Beatrice leaving Esme some of the cure to take for herself and not wanting her ex friend to die. I could be wrong though.
When i watched the series come to me the schism began long before olaf and lemony generation as the original hq of vfd was already on fire in the mountains and all of them were part of the same school. Every side started a armamentistic escalation that conclude with the mycelium been developed. As the mycelium become a problem. Beatrice began the investigation to find a cure, and then a way to immunization everyone, but it was to bitter-discusting it must be put on sugar cubes.
The second generation fight began when Beatrice hides the cure on a very valuable sugar bowl property of Esme and any of them is aware of the true value of the sugarrbowl or the inmunization sugarcubes.
This ends on olaf father's dead and made young adults olaf join the "arsonist" side of the vfd.
After that the parents go on a trip and get lost for almost a year, an then create the radish-apple tree.
The vfd try to prevent the arsonist to get the cure in anyway and esme was only looking to complete her collection that's why she never been reach by the arsonist at all.
At the end olaf destroy the vfd and the arsonist as nothing of the schisms really matters to him.
i don't think the show was wrong about the sugar bowl. quigley was at anwhistle aquatics and could have put it in there then. but for the rest of the time it is likely it was empty and was a convenient vessel for whoever used it, mostly important for the symbolism in the story.
One question I don't think is ever answered is why VFD's logo is made to look like an eye. I know it's supposed to be the letters V F D, but in the cover art for book 13 "The End" it's quite obviously stylized to look like an eye, and it's always mistaken for an eye by almost every character who sees it, so it can't just be a coincidence.
It just seems weird that an organization called Volunteer Fire Department would use an eye for symbolism.
The letters VFD are meant to be hidden within the design so that they would only be recognizable to members who knew what to look for. It’s one of VFD’s many secret coded messages.
Why did they choose an eye specifically? I don’t know what the in-universe explanation is. But out of universe, it looks like an eye because it’s a creepy design that will make the reader uneasy. Even after we learn that it was supposed to be a symbol for good, it still gives off bad vibes.
because eyes are cool
Thanks for this video, that was super comprehensive! Sent it to my friend (who doesn't mind spoilers) in hope of making her want to watch or read it~ It definitely worked on me at least!
Still trying to figure out the secret code!
It feels weird to watch these kinds of videos because I never read the books I’ve only seen the (2004 film) and (2017) show , the film which I absolutely adore, I’m not really sure why everyone gives it so much crap , I would however like to know if the books are worth reading,all in all great video.
I don't think they are. I find them insufferably repetitive which takes away any of the enjoyment out of them. I gave up by the 6th book.
Also everyone says the mysteries are just left unsolved so on top of being repetitive they also get frustrating by the end.
i think the books are DEFINITELY worth reading. When i was little and read them they literally gave me no desire to pick up any other books and to just keep finding more about the story. However i think the show does cover a lot of the book and the details they've added fit in so well with the story, that if you've seen the show you barely need to read the book. If you love to read, definitely give it a try. One of my favorite parts of the book is when he goes into a whole page rant about icebergs in attempt to make the reader fall asleep and distract us from the horrible thing about to happen next in the story. He's incredibly talented and creative and if you want to see the mind of lemony snicket, the show and movie aren't enough
@@Jiyuu06 I found that the repetitiveness of the first 6 books was what made the departure from the formula from the 7th book onward that much more shocking and I don't think it would have had quite the same impact without that
I think people who are less keen on the film are those who enjoyed the books. The film truncates the events so much, and rounds off the first three books so that it's not easy to continue the series in later films even if they wanted to. I think also there's only so much Jim Carey some people can take before it feels like it's a Jim Carey show reel - I feel like the TV show better captures the essence of Olaf, and his characters all are recognisable as Count Olaf, whereas Jim Carey is actually a good actor, so Count Olaf and the two characters he plays are very distinct, though clearly all Carey.
This blast to the past reminded me about other mystery adventure book series i once read - Ulysses Moore and turns out the more thrilling mystery then whatever happens there is fact it and its author have literally no presence on the internet xD
Theory about the setting and schism: First of all, the dart thrown at Count Olaf's father was just a tranquilizer, and he didn't die right there. It just seemed like he was killed there, and it was easy to lie about.
The series takes place in and around Viña Del Mar, Chile, and the schism was in late 1973. For context, on September 11 of that year, the military disposed of the left wing Salvador Allende in favor of Augusto Pinochet, a right-wing dictator. The firefighters supported Pinochet, while the firestarters opposed him. As a result, they were killed extrajudicially (usually thrown out of helicopters). Due to internal political disputes, VFD split, with the firefighters being supported by Pinochet.
Because of this, the fire starters didn't do much until 1990, when they were emboldened by the transition to democracy, in which, Chile elected a center left government, under president Patricio Aylwin. That year, they burnt down the Quagmire home, then burned down the Beaudelaires' not long after.
Viña Del Mar fits in perfectly with the series's geography and the city's history lines up with the backstory.
the SECOND i heard a bell i knew what you were doing. amazing video, all the kudos!
The problem is that people assume the theft of the sugarbowl caused the schism. That event is important but for the reason it allowed for Olaf to join the schism, and VFD to lose its leader, probably the reason the noble side couldnt easily fight back. The schism was already cooking as Beatrice was already wary about the Man no hair, Women no beard. Im sure the schism was caused by the inevitble greed developed by some members after this noble organization gained fortunes and developed offical headquarters. It also couldve easily been cause when the posions and cures were first found out about and obrained, but the theft of the sugar bowl is important for our main cast, but not why the whole organization was fighting in the first place.
Still wiping away the tears from the ending.. The world was too quiet there- so I had to look for another place to stay at that wasn't as quiet.. I watched the show thinking it's kind of A comedy but I was obviously wrong. This show will wreck ur evening ur whole life and your day..So look away
It is confirmed that the cure for the Medusoid Mycelium was in the sugar bowl because if you see the opera scene with Esme and Kit , Esme says that the sugar would be bitter and we never see Kit drink her tea. That would explain why Kit died because she never drank her tea and when she was on the island she got the Medusoid Mycelium and died. Also many people think that Olaf burned the Baudelaires house down because when Olaf and Esme see Beatrice and Lemony run away with the sugar bowl Olaf says that Beatrice will burn. Also it would make sense because that would have probably been apart of Count Olaf's plan from the beginning. I personally think that because Beatrice killed Count Olaf's father, Count Olaf took his hate and anger upon the the Baudelaire children. This would make sense we never got why Count Olaf wanted the Baudelaire's fortune.
This is a great video! Could u do one of these on The Mysterious Benedict Society?
Possibly. I haven’t read/watched it, so I’d have to do that first.
@@BigBlueBackpack You should it’s a great book series and pretty similar to ASoUE
The VFD in the eye symbol is what it looks like if you make those letters with your right hand. The F is even at an odd place to account for the rotation of your wrist bringing it lower
I only read the season 10 and it was wow.. even though it leaves the readers with some sort of mental issues
This book series taught me that I'll never figure out EVERYTHING in my life, but that doesn't mean I can't do wild things
Subbed, awesome video, just finished the series, it was beautifully dark, and really made me feel every emotion, by the finale episode, I somehow was able to take the Offhand comments, flashbacks, snippets of notes and dialogue between characters, and by the end of it all, was proud of myself because I was able to figure out what i needed to, to understand everything, and still left with questions, yet satisfied with the ending, your video is an amazing summary, explanation and breakdown, enjoying hearing the story really dug into and explained fully, you are amazing! 😃
Also, the events 8n my opinion, likely go like this: sugarbowl is stolen while parents leave island. because a horseradish factory already exists, then the rest of the events play out. So horseradish is a common cure for meducoid mycelium, but the sugarbowl is a secluded experiment by VFD.
I really loved the movie and the show. It’s honestly such a special franchise to me. I love the way Netflix did the series and I also love the gothic concept they used in the movie.
I can’t believe you’re going to make me watch the whole video again because I forgot about that one secret code… I couldn’t be happier
Worst day in my life when I remembered the code at the end of the vidoe
Very well put together video! Glad to see you also added subs since I'm italian. Bravo!
btw, the apples don't have horseradish, they actually have a recreation of the median from the sugar bowl, which was explicitly stated in the show.
No, the apples definitely contain horseradish. The clip you’re referring to appears at 21:32 in the video. The sugar bowl contains sugar, which was extracted from the genetically engineered horseradish/apple tree.
My headcannon is that the theft of the sugar bowl did not start THE schism. It caused the schism between Esme and Olaf, and the Snickers and Boudelairs.
The main reason I personally didn't like the movie was the order of events being: book 1, book 2, book 3, book 1.5
The straw that broke the camel's back
I see what you did there with the bell cipher. I am too lazy to rewatch and decode it plus i do not know the cipher, but that was a pretty cagey way to get ppl to rewatch the video..excellent job great video!
I remember thinking Kit Snicket was played by Stephanie from game theory
This was one of my top 10 favorite nextflix shows.
I wish they had more.
did no one notice the message he left for us?!?! bout to go figure this out rn- wish me luck!
You find it yet?
ya know. i tried writing down all the words and i didn't get anything that made any sense. i thought he would have coded the word "subscribe" but i didn't get any of those letters lol
I noticed the rings as well
How do u not have more subs?! This content is quality!
I realize there are differences between the series and the books, but I think the intention is that both are meant to be put together to form a mostly-cohesive "complete" narrative, so to speak.
The series plugs holes in the books, and vice versa.
I know no one will read this but here's my opinion on the content of the Sugar bowl, the identity of the Question mark and all the other unanswered questions-
We'll never know and we never were supposed to know. This is the story of the Baudelaires and how they survive the schism'd after effects and Olaf's schemes, not of V.F.D or the bowl. Lemony didn't include those details because they're not part of Violet, Klaus and Sunny's situation or story, and if Lemony revealed the information we want it would absolutely destroy the noble side of V.F.D as the information would be public knowledge.
I have proven your assumption that no one would read your comment as incorrect. Unless, of course, you meant that someone with the first name No and the last name One would read your comment, that is.
@@Ligreem Eh?
I've always liked the one with the hooks for hands, I feel like he wasn't ever actually bad.
Here comes Count Olaaaf, a biit of a show-offff
“What I like to call…” is a phrase that here means, “The proper subcategory of a genre to which everyone refers to a story as belonging.”
I remember for the islanders who left with Ishmael, inky the snake swam out with an apple after them, but i think that story ends there
Everyone always forgets this… but the parents don’t just die in a fire. They specifically send the kids off to Briny beach and THEN they die in a mysterious fire.
In atwq lemony is supposed to meet kit snicket to steal something very important, this thing is so important that kit says it is an opportunity that she could not pass up even if she had to do it alone. I believe this thing is the sugar bowl. In the book When Did We See Her Last, on the last page, we see a sketch of kit running away from the cops holding an object wrapped in burlap, that looks suspiciously like a sugar bowl.
in the books, it was never known if Lemony and Beatrice ever meet in person. it is implied that Beautrice was looking for Lemony but, it was never revealed if they ever did meet, leaving everything to the readers imagination and adding another question left unsolved.
What I think, is that the immunity was put into the sugar bowl after Beatrice stole it.
And when Jacque imprisoned Olaf why didn't he notice that officer "luciana" was esmé.
He was waiting for the officer to arrive. He didnt realize at the time that Esme was pretending to be the officer, until it happened.