I block and boot trolls. Irenic or serious comments and questions are 100% welcome. One strike rule. You troll, you magically and instantly disappear as soon as I see the comment.
Hello. The first passage you read, Jesus breaths on them and they receive the holy spirit. Next, he tells them to forgive or not to. But first they have to have the spirit. Baptized in the spirit is being born again. Given a new spirit that was made in heaven and knows Jesus personally. You still are you, but now you know the Lord and know his voice. John saw Jesus coming and said that he is the one who baptizes with the holy ghost. John just does water but it is Jesus who baptizes with the holy ghost. Men can splash or dunk you in water, but only Jesus gives the holy spirit. Men cant pass on the holy spirit. The ability to forgive or not comes only after one is born of the spirit. All i have is my testimony. After being told the good news, i believed it but that was for 1 hr on sunday morning. My thing was trying to meet girls and getting hi. About an hr and a half later i was changed. Never heard of born again so i didnt know what had happened to me. Never opened a bible, didnt care to either. When i got home and was compelled to open the bible, there was god and jesus and somehow i knew them. I know what its like to have this spirit. One cant do all the things Jesus says we can if one doesnt have the holy spirit. Thanks for your time.
@@peterzinya1 What? You can control your acidic comments? WOW! 1. Christ sets the rites of initiation. He was water baptized and the Holy Spirit descended upon Him. THAT is our model, THAT is the formula. THAT is how Christians have beeninitiated since 33 AD. 2. Baptism in the Holy Spirit is an entirely separate prayer experience, intended to release the gits you received when you were first initiated. This has been grossly distorted into asome form of entertainment. 3. The Holy Spirit, if one SUBMITS, leads always and everywhere to humility and submission. 4. Your theology is an American innovation, as it was held nowhere for the first 1800 years of Christianity. NOT as you mean it.
On reflection if I shot this video again I would differentiate between unbroken and broken 4th wall instead of 3 Walls vs. broken 4th wall but it was a pretty spontaneous video to get the big idea out while I was having it.
THIS. This explains and makes so much sense of my conversations with my family now! I thought it was the most amazing thing ever to learn that there were specific intentions behind Scripture and who it was written to, and that we must always keep those intentions in mind when reading scripture. But most Protestants I talk with are confused, uncomfortable, or downright hostile to this, and it makes sense why! Prt of my conversion to the Catholic Church was realizing I had to lay down my own world view and submit to the Church’s Authority in all things, especially as regards the Scriptures, and the most amazing part of doing that was seeing Scripture come alive and falling in love with it in ways I didn’t even know were an option!
I am a Jesuit preacher from Patna, India. I am listening your talk first time and hearing about the broken fourth wall interpretation. Now it's clear to me why the Protestants inerpret the Bible as they want. Thank you so much for your enlightening talk. Would like to listen to you more.
I think your videos are fantastic. I’m Catholic living in a predominantly Protestant community and I find them to be so brainwashed against the Catholic faith. I pray that the Lord opens their eyes to the completeness of their faith.
Great video. I started noticing something was up when debating the sacrament of reconciliation. I mentioned Apostolic succession and that passage from John 20. And the person I was talking to was very hung up on the usage of the word "you" there. It was very bizarre. I admit I initially thought this person was not the brightest bulb. This sheds a lot of light on what was actually going on. Thank you, Kenny.
Thank you Kenny. This is very helpful! I love the insight on how to understand the basis of scripture and how literally scripture can be taken vs. how it is truly intended.
I think you are on to something. I remember years ago overhearing a group of Protestants appropriate to themselves the promise Jesus made to Peter about “whatever you bind on earth…..”. I was shocked. No consideration at all of the original context. That was bypassed in favor of how that applied to them. It’s good to be aware of this “hermeneutic”. It most definitely is a place where Catholic/Protestant dialogue can lose traction.
I heard a protestant minister discussing "binding and loosening" and what that meant for his church members on RUclips the other day. My jaw hit the floor! He was explaining what they could bind and loose and I was like, "You can't do any of that. The subject implies holy orders (the Pope or Bishops) and apostolic succession! This told me that much of their understanding of the bible is way off base.
Wow! I didn’t realize I still retained some of that broken 4th wall paradigm! Convert for 10 years & was still not understanding this. Thank you for this video.🙏❤️
This I’d sooo helpful! Thank you. It helps me to understand so much. Now When I read of Jesus talking about authority to crush serpents and scorpions I now understand that if I want to be protected from Satan and his evil doctrines and attacks, I need to stay close to and submit to those who have been given that authority. The Apostles and the apostolic succession. It’s as if the apostles receive that authority, exit stage left and they come out into the audience to exercise that authority.
Hey Kenny, love your perspective, got very choked up when I heard your testimony on On the Journey with Matt Ken and Kenny. Wow! Famous hood and famous car, I won't forget it. Breaking the 4th wall! I think you nailed it! I have been debating some Reformed Baptists here in Australia and the best thing about going to their home groups for a Catholic is - you actually get to immerse yourself in Scripture without really making too much effort. It's fantastic. And the more I immerse myself, the more I realise the Bible is a Catholic book! And it has become excruciatingly clear that my Protestant interlocutors just have it wrong. Until I heard this podcast, just why they are wrong was baffling. I just put it down to them using a different lens. Now I have a name for it - breaking the 4th wall. As a sometimes Gilbert & Sullivan performer, your metaphor struck a chord with me. That's exactly what they do. Another term I'd use is 'mindless appropriation', although that might not be as charitable as your term. There is another Protestant tendency that has become very apparent to me, and was quite surprising at first, because it contradicts the commonly held belief that Protestants are "Scriptural purists", and adherents of "Sola-Scriptura". This is the tendency of Protestants to take several NT passages much less literally than Catholics, most of them from the Gospels, and most of them, the actual words of Christ. Obviously John 6:51, but then also Matthew 16:18, and the verse you mentioned at the top of this podcast, John 20:21, also and especially the words of Jesus that clearly suggest an "effort" on our part eg. John 14:15, Luke 15:11, Matthew 25:40, Matthew 18:21, Matthew 25:14. Please pardon the ramble, I will quickly summarize - Protestants will take literally (break 4th wall) and put themselves in the room where Jesus is speaking to make themselves the subject of his words, usually when those words are instituting powers, privileges, honors and graces on the apostles, but will choose to take as "figurative" the words of Our Lord when they are meant for us all, even when they are delivered in front of the apostles, as in the Bread of Life discourse, when he clearly says "if any one eats of this bread he will live forever, and...is my flesh", similarly with the parables, they are clearly meant for all believers. An interesting side note. One of the pastors at that church had a curious take on the Beatitudes. The first one, 'blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven', he said only applied to the "saved", and similarly for any beatitude that implied going to heaven, seeing God, etc. I would never have thought to see it in that way. Again, as a Catholic, I have always taken the beatitudes literally. If someone is truly poor in spirit (which only God can judge), who am I to say they cannot enter heaven. Thanks Kenny! God bless, Z
Looking to join the Catholic Church after Protestantism for 12 yrs. It has been a challenge to rewrite my brain to read the Bible in a Catholic perspective. This is a big area Protestant need help in. Keep going. Thank you.
A suggestion: “IF” you have not already, please consider going to Adoration of Christ in the Blessed Sacrament (also known as “Holy Hour”). Call your local parish and find out when they offer it. Then, just go and sit in silence in Christ’s Presence. Take your bible. Read scripture, pray, contemplate. Tell the Lord of your search for truth, of your doubts, worries, even fears. Then, be as patient with Him as He has been with you. When you receive the grace to know that HE IS THERE, you will be forever changed. Miracles occur in Christ’s presence - of that I can personally attest.
@@HAL9000-su1mzHAL9000’s advice is excellent. Try it. Another possibility is to walk into any Catholic Church and somewhere in the sanctuary usually to the left of the golden tabernacle there will be a small red candle burning signifying Christs real presence in the Eucharist is retained inside the tabernacle itself. Sit up front, as close as you can and let Jesus permeate your soul as his graces radiate out to you. Just bask in his presence, talk to Jesus, listen for his small soft whisper. Jesus is there with you. God bless you. I hope you become Catholic Christian. When you do welcome home. I will pray for your conversion.
You are 100% on it!! I was raised Protestant and although I couldn’t have explained this so succinctly as you have, this is exactly my experience learning to read the Bible through the Protestant lense vs the now Catholic lense. I NEVER understood much of the Bible growing up because it was such a pick and choose a verse sort of thing and we were actually taught that the Bible was always speaking directly to each of us and that is so overwhelming and intimidating. It wasn’t until many years after I became Catholic that I was finally able to grasp how to read the Bible in context and it opened up a whole new spiritual / theological understanding for me and my faith is so much more now! Being a Protestant is exhausting. You are your own pope, your own authority, your own scripture interpreter. It’s so amazing to come home to the Catholic Church and rest in her wisdom and tradition. Reading the NT in light of the OT was game changing for me. I highly recommend starting with Father Mike Schmidt’s Bible in a Year podcast if you have never read the whole Bible, it’s read chronologically not cover cover straight through so you get the whole thing but in an order that shows salvation history.
One very popular scripture to apply to one’s self is Jeremiah 29:11 “For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the Lord, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future.” (NIV)
NIV? A suggestion (ONLY), since the NIV is often used by the prosperity preachers. Compare with more traditional translations: Jeremiah 29:11 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition For I know the thoughts that I think towards you, saith the Lord, thoughts of PEACE, and not of affliction, to give you an end and patience. Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition For I know the plans I have for you, says the Lord, plans for WELFARE and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope. Knox Translation I have not lost sight of my plan for you, the Lord says, and it is your WELFARE I have in mind, not your undoing; for you, too, I have a destiny and a hope. As well, the NIV is missing 7 books of scripture. They are a gold mine of spiritual wealth.
As a cradle Catholic for 64 years, it seems to me from experience, that at 11:50 in this video, when non-Catholic Christians read John 20:22-23, that the meaning of the text goes straight over their heads as their brains switch off, causing amnesia. Many non-Catholic Christians abhor these verses, as they lead the reader to the hierarchical Catholic Church.
I think that an example of this is 'charismatic' fans who truly believe that St. Paul was talking to them personally when he said that some have the gift of prophecy, healing, tongues, etc. A Catholic (?) charismatic lady once told me that all I have to do is pray to the Holy Spirit and tell Him which gifts I want! I immediately saw a Holy Shopping List !
I went to Charismatic Mass for 15 years, where I learnt much from the gifted Missionaries of God’s Love (MGL). But I could no longer stand many of the nutty regular congregation, who were off with the pixies😢 Now I am unsettled and cannot find a Mass with a solid priest. Having said that, St Christopher’s, Manuka, Canberra Australia 🇦🇺 is solid. I think I will start going there more regularly.
Good Observation Kenny. I hadn't thought of it in this way. My thought was that it was downstream of their focus on memorizing bible quotes (which is in and of itself a good thing, don't get me wrong) but what essentially happens is that they cut out a "snippet" from a larger paragraph or narrative with a specific context. Once removed, this "quote" begins to take on a new life and meaning of its own, divorced from its place in its original context. In other words, they slogan it. The quote or "slogan", separated from its original context, gains new meaning and context based on how it begins to be interpreted and applied to the life of the person or persons who frequently use it. I have often found that Protestant interpretations can be refuted by merely reading the sentence or sentences directly before or after the one in which they quote. In essence, they miss the forest for the trees. On the other hand, in fairness, sometimes Catholics can do the opposite and miss the trees for the forest. So we all have something to learn from one another. I appreciate your insight (and others from the Journey with Matt, Ken, and Kenny), as it has helped me think about and engage with my separated brothers and sisters with more care and understanding that they have a completely different lens - especially when they hear two and two from a Catholic and somehow inexplicably come up with seven. We should first work on correcting their lens instead of just debating verses.
I grew up protestant, and I call it the "Jesus is my boyfriend" gospel. He is always talking to you personally. That's how we got the idea to just say this prayer and ask Jesus to be your personal Lord and Savior. Now I am a Catholic and the Bible makes way more sense to me. I learned to understand who the letter was being written to first, then go on to read the book and see it through the lens of the writer. I like it this way much better.
Yes, we learn as Catholics that the Holy Spirit gifts each of us with charisms, talents and skills to discern our own special vocation, aiding Christ’s Kingdom on Earth. Bless you!
This was before the Holy Spirit was given to any who believed and were baptized in the name of Jesus. It seems to be that beginning in Acts 2, something new was going on. It became a priesthood of believers who were spirit-filled and could minister to each other, pray for each other, and forgive each other. Now all we who are in Christ have the Holy Spirit. Each of us as members of the body have different gifts and all serve each other. I agree that often Christians will take words meant for someone else and presume to take promises as if for them, though.
This is great! I could never quite pinpoint or articulate what is going on in the protestant mind with some scripture, but this cleared it up. Thank you Kenny for this explanation!
Kenny, what you are describing is the Doctrine of Sola Scriptura, and its sub-traits; Scriptural infallibility and inerrancy. I've likewise encountered this phenomenon myself. They are using the doctrine of Sola Scriptura as a hermeneutic itself, and combining both inerrancy with infallibility. It's the philosophy that God doesn't speak to anyone directly anymore but through scripture alone, and therefore to grasp an understanding of what God is telling me, I interpret scripture in that way. Such a philosophy is extremely erroneous and dangerous, and has given rise to many cults and denominations in the Protestant sector.
Yep. In fact many independent Churches which subscribe to Sola Scriptura are, by virtue of their doctrines and practices, actually cults vs. Christian. There are simply too many to count and new ones pop up every day. It’s mayhem.
So erroneous and dangerous that many unlearned/unwise become followers of the cults that mushroomed out of this kind of personal interpretations. Even our country, the Philippines with an extreme blend of brilliant and ignorant people, is not spared from these cults.😌
I was brought out of atheism after being raised very antiCatholic Baptist by God directly speaking to me. You know like He did for Paul. I then spent many years praying, fasting, studying scripture and listening to Protestant podcasts daily. I listened to Protestants but didn’t exactly trust any of them. I trusted no one, not even myself and relied heavily on God to let me only take away that which was true and profitable. In the end, God made me Catholic without me even studying any Catholic theology. I was literally brought to a place where I understood that what I was taught to believe by the Holy Sprit didn’t fit in any Protestant tradition and I was left to either start a new denomination, which I was loath to do or look into Catholicism and Orthodoxy, which I was also loathed to do, but not quite as much as I was repulsed by the idea of starting a new denomination.
Thanks for this Kenny. This was very much my life for many years and goes to the heart of disagreements with my evangelical friends. How would you suggest approaching this though. Because I don’t see my evangelical friends seeing a problem with breaking the 4th wall. Sure, we’ve identified the reason we come to different interpretations but I don’t see that we’re any closer to resolving that.
The problem involves reading comprehension and ego. Read something closer to mortgage documents, it's not hard to at least see the Catholic view in the NT However Protestantism trains people to take a letter clearly addressed to some guy named Timothy, ignore 100% of the context, and apply 2 sentences at random to themselves. It's hard thing to get them to say "No, let's start by assuming that this a letter to Timothy." We have to start with the disappointing and humbling news that maybe Paul didn't have them personally in mind and that matters.
Hi Greg. Yeah it was my life too and now on the other side of it it is more clear to me than before. I think as a starting place we can simply point out the interpretive approach and try to get them to agree that it is different and since it is different we can make thre observations. 1. We cannot agree on the meaning of a text if we employ disparate hermeneutics. 2. The fact that such differences are possible when 2 Christians are looking at one text is a strike against Sola Scriptura. 3. Since these are true, we might look at the witness of the early Christians to see if they agree with one or the other interpreter. In the case of these texts all the early witnesses will appeal to authority vested in the apostles and their successors. You can also say in terms that may foster more contemplation and dialogue: We Catholics read the Bible in its original context. You seem to be doing something different from that. This will sound like a strike at the heart of a “Bible only” Christian who doesn’t think they do that. Simply point it out and rest on the solid witness of the Church. Leave the burden of proof on later novel interpretations.
@@atrifle8364yeah I agree. To be fair to anyone who sat under my teaching ministry (especially in the early years), I unfortunately encouraged and even modeled this flawed hermeneutic, and people sadly embraced it.
@@KennyBurchard- It's tough because that way of interacting with the Bible is built into the framework of the culture. Even Luther's original "epiphany" is more or less taking sentences out of Romans out of context. He had a lot less excuses though than people almost 500 years later. He was trained Catholic and was completely aware of passages in James, etc that contradicted his own somewhat electic theology. Most modern Protestants are trained decontextulized sentence reading approach from Day 1. Despite many self assurances on their Biblical knowledge, it's quite clear many spend their most of their time in a few select parts of Scripture. In that there is a great deal less culpability. But those practices makes the conversation much difficult, even when I have a letter from James clearly addressing a general audience as foolish for believing in faith alone. It's undoing an unquestioned process/approach.
@@KennyBurchard the ironic thing is many protestants will argume against breaking the 4th wall in other passages. For example, I've heard reformed folks say that applying Jeremiah 29:11 to ourselves and claiming that promise for ourselves is taking the verse out of context because God was specifically addressing that to Israel in exile.
Two ideas: Read scripture at Adoration. Read, gaze upon Christ, read. Repeat! Secondly, I make constant reference to the Rev. George Leo Haydock Bible Commentary (online), which is a collection of comments from the Christian greats of antiquity. It helps clear up so much of the ambiguity of the written word. Impossible to place a value on it.
People gotta start understanding that the written words of scripture came from the Apostles and their disciples who were taught by the apostles first along with the Holy Spirit,so having said that people must realize that the scriptures were not put in the hands of the members or sheep but was reserved for the hierarchy and priesthood who are the shepherd’s of the church to instruct teach and feed the flock of the one true church that started on Pentecost that will continue until the end of time.Thank you my Catholic Christian brother Kenny excellent superb video may truly increase your faith understanding and zeal to reveal many difficult things that the scriptures hold Amen 🙏 🐑🕊️✨🔥
It's funny because my first read of the whole bible I read it like a history book. There were parts that could definitely be read as talking to you specifically, but not all. I am sure not all protestants read the bible this way, but then how do they past the part when Jesus says behold your mother? To John on the cross.
The key to that verse is the subject. He’s never identified as John, but as the Beloved Disciple. Therefore we also can be beloved disciples if we do as John did there in taking Mary as his mother. As a convert this is how it was explained to me & how I believe it.
Some teach to view it as God's love letter to each soul. It is a seamless garment and John 19 cannot be separated from John's Revelation, Chapter 12. Gad is Father, Jesus is Brother, and God does not maintain a single parent household. The "woman" is the mother of all who keep the Gospel of Christ, Her Son. We must take baby steps with those unfamiliar with the ancient faith.
Thank you, I get what you're saying especially in these scriptures. I have a question as I stand on the promises of Psalm 91. Am I wrongly seeing it through the 4th wall? Thank you.
I have a question: why do you always distinguish between Protestants and Evangelicals? Why not simply say 'Protestants' when referring to non-Catholic and non-Orthodox Christians?
Because although evangelical non Catholics are separated brethren many of them reject Protestant roots and do not believe they are Protestant. If we want to talk to them we have to use the term they prefer if it is appropriate. Some want to be called “catholic with a little c,” and this we cannot do. But evangelicals tend to disconnect their historical roots from Protestants and will even tune out if you use that word with them - “oh. I’m not a Protestant so this is not for me. I’m just Christian.” When you hear that the kind of Protestant you’re talking to is an evangelical. It’s about building bridges.
I've seen exactly what you describe in my interactions with Protestants. I see it in several verses. I see it in 1 Timothy 3:15 where they see any believer as the Church and so believe they have the truth because they believe. This was the verse that converted me. I had done some studying of Catholicism around 1975ish and I never saw this verse. Another verse I use frequently is 2 Peter 1:20-21 where Peter is saying only the Holy Spirit can correctly interpret the scriptures. We can go to John and see where Jesus promised to send the Holy Spirit to the Church and would be with the Church forever. So I see it as the authority of the Church to interpret scripture. But Protestants see themselves as having the Holy Spirit, so they believe they are interpreting scripture correctly
I block and boot trolls. Irenic or serious comments and questions are 100% welcome. One strike rule. You troll, you magically and instantly disappear as soon as I see the comment.
Hello. The first passage you read, Jesus breaths on them and they receive the holy spirit. Next, he tells them to forgive or not to. But first they have to have the spirit. Baptized in the spirit is being born again. Given a new spirit that was made in heaven and knows Jesus personally. You still are you, but now you know the Lord and know his voice. John saw Jesus coming and said that he is the one who baptizes with the holy ghost. John just does water but it is Jesus who baptizes with the holy ghost. Men can splash or dunk you in water, but only Jesus gives the holy spirit. Men cant pass on the holy spirit. The ability to forgive or not comes only after one is born of the spirit.
All i have is my testimony. After being told the good news, i believed it but that was for 1 hr on sunday morning. My thing was trying to meet girls and getting hi. About an hr and a half later i was changed. Never heard of born again so i didnt know what had happened to me. Never opened a bible, didnt care to either. When i got home and was compelled to open the bible, there was god and jesus and somehow i knew them.
I know what its like to have this spirit. One cant do all the things Jesus says we can if one doesnt have the holy spirit. Thanks for your time.
@@peterzinya1
Peter, do you believe God gives each one of us different talents, gifts and abilities to take on different roles in the Church?
@@peterzinya1 What? You can control your acidic comments? WOW!
1. Christ sets the rites of initiation. He was water baptized and the Holy Spirit descended upon Him. THAT is our model, THAT is the formula. THAT is how Christians have beeninitiated since 33 AD.
2. Baptism in the Holy Spirit is an entirely separate prayer experience, intended to release the gits you received when you were first initiated. This has been grossly distorted into asome form of entertainment.
3. The Holy Spirit, if one SUBMITS, leads always and everywhere to humility and submission.
4. Your theology is an American innovation, as it was held nowhere for the first 1800 years of Christianity. NOT as you mean it.
On reflection if I shot this video again I would differentiate between unbroken and broken 4th wall instead of 3 Walls vs. broken 4th wall but it was a pretty spontaneous video to get the big idea out while I was having it.
THIS. This explains and makes so much sense of my conversations with my family now! I thought it was the most amazing thing ever to learn that there were specific intentions behind Scripture and who it was written to, and that we must always keep those intentions in mind when reading scripture. But most Protestants I talk with are confused, uncomfortable, or downright hostile to this, and it makes sense why! Prt of my conversion to the Catholic Church was realizing I had to lay down my own world view and submit to the Church’s Authority in all things, especially as regards the Scriptures, and the most amazing part of doing that was seeing Scripture come alive and falling in love with it in ways I didn’t even know were an option!
Yep. Press on. Praying for you!!! BE NOT AFRAID
I am a Jesuit preacher from Patna, India. I am listening your talk first time and hearing about the broken fourth wall interpretation. Now it's clear to me why the Protestants inerpret the Bible as they want. Thank you so much for your enlightening talk. Would like to listen to you more.
I think your videos are fantastic. I’m Catholic living in a predominantly Protestant community and I find them to be so brainwashed against the Catholic faith. I pray that the Lord opens their eyes to the completeness of their faith.
Great video. I started noticing something was up when debating the sacrament of reconciliation. I mentioned Apostolic succession and that passage from John 20. And the person I was talking to was very hung up on the usage of the word "you" there.
It was very bizarre. I admit I initially thought this person was not the brightest bulb. This sheds a lot of light on what was actually going on. Thank you, Kenny.
One of the best Catholic Channel guide. Thank you brother.
Thank you Kenny. This is very helpful! I love the insight on how to understand the basis of scripture and how literally scripture can be taken vs. how it is truly intended.
Excellent explanation. I’m so glad I found you Kenny! I am following you and look forward to all of your posts. 4 th wall is eye opening!
Prodestants definitely do this! We werent there. Things happened that we are to observe and learn from.
I think you are on to something. I remember years ago overhearing a group of Protestants appropriate to themselves the promise Jesus made to Peter about “whatever you bind on earth…..”. I was shocked. No consideration at all of the original context. That was bypassed in favor of how that applied to them. It’s good to be aware of this “hermeneutic”. It most definitely is a place where Catholic/Protestant dialogue can lose traction.
@@jeannefernando4937 yep. Happens every time Joe Protestant reads a verse. “hey look that’s about me!!”
@@KennyBurchard Yes. I realized, oh, this is how they bypass holy orders and the papacy.
I heard a protestant minister discussing "binding and loosening" and what that meant for his church members on RUclips the other day. My jaw hit the floor! He was explaining what they could bind and loose and I was like, "You can't do any of that. The subject implies holy orders (the Pope or Bishops) and apostolic succession! This told me that much of their understanding of the bible is way off base.
Wow! I didn’t realize I still retained some of that broken 4th wall paradigm! Convert for 10 years & was still not understanding this. Thank you for this video.🙏❤️
I get it
Oh, I think you have dealt with it rather well. ;-)
What a great Christian Biblical teacher with sound understanding!
The 4th wall interpretation is just wild. Wow. Bonkers.
This I’d sooo helpful! Thank you.
It helps me to understand so much.
Now When I read of Jesus talking about authority to crush serpents and scorpions I now understand that if I want to be protected from Satan and his evil doctrines and attacks, I need to stay close to and submit to those who have been given that authority. The Apostles and the apostolic succession.
It’s as if the apostles receive that authority, exit stage left and they come out into the audience to exercise that authority.
Hey Kenny, love your perspective, got very choked up when I heard your testimony on On the Journey with Matt Ken and Kenny. Wow! Famous hood and famous car, I won't forget it.
Breaking the 4th wall! I think you nailed it! I have been debating some Reformed Baptists here in Australia and the best thing about going to their home groups for a Catholic is - you actually get to immerse yourself in Scripture without really making too much effort. It's fantastic. And the more I immerse myself, the more I realise the Bible is a Catholic book! And it has become excruciatingly clear that my Protestant interlocutors just have it wrong. Until I heard this podcast, just why they are wrong was baffling. I just put it down to them using a different lens.
Now I have a name for it - breaking the 4th wall. As a sometimes Gilbert & Sullivan performer, your metaphor struck a chord with me. That's exactly what they do. Another term I'd use is 'mindless appropriation', although that might not be as charitable as your term.
There is another Protestant tendency that has become very apparent to me, and was quite surprising at first, because it contradicts the commonly held belief that Protestants are "Scriptural purists", and adherents of "Sola-Scriptura". This is the tendency of Protestants to take several NT passages much less literally than Catholics, most of them from the Gospels, and most of them, the actual words of Christ. Obviously John 6:51, but then also Matthew 16:18, and the verse you mentioned at the top of this podcast, John 20:21, also and especially the words of Jesus that clearly suggest an "effort" on our part eg. John 14:15, Luke 15:11, Matthew 25:40, Matthew 18:21, Matthew 25:14.
Please pardon the ramble, I will quickly summarize - Protestants will take literally (break 4th wall) and put themselves in the room where Jesus is speaking to make themselves the subject of his words, usually when those words are instituting powers, privileges, honors and graces on the apostles, but will choose to take as "figurative" the words of Our Lord when they are meant for us all, even when they are delivered in front of the apostles, as in the Bread of Life discourse, when he clearly says "if any one eats of this bread he will live forever, and...is my flesh", similarly with the parables, they are clearly meant for all believers.
An interesting side note. One of the pastors at that church had a curious take on the Beatitudes. The first one, 'blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven', he said only applied to the "saved", and similarly for any beatitude that implied going to heaven, seeing God, etc. I would never have thought to see it in that way. Again, as a Catholic, I have always taken the beatitudes literally. If someone is truly poor in spirit (which only God can judge), who am I to say they cannot enter heaven.
Thanks Kenny!
God bless,
Z
There's Lectio Divina and then there's narcissism. 😒
Looking to join the Catholic Church after Protestantism for 12 yrs.
It has been a challenge to rewrite my brain to read the Bible in a Catholic perspective. This is a big area Protestant need help in.
Keep going.
Thank you.
A suggestion: “IF” you have not already, please consider going to Adoration of Christ in the Blessed Sacrament (also known as “Holy Hour”). Call your local parish and find out when they offer it. Then, just go and sit in silence in Christ’s Presence. Take your bible. Read scripture, pray, contemplate. Tell the Lord of your search for truth, of your doubts, worries, even fears. Then, be as patient with Him as He has been with you. When you receive the grace to know that HE IS THERE, you will be forever changed. Miracles occur in Christ’s presence - of that I can personally attest.
@@HAL9000-su1mzHAL9000’s advice is excellent. Try it.
Another possibility is to walk into any Catholic Church and somewhere in the sanctuary usually to the left of the golden tabernacle there will be a small red candle burning signifying Christs real presence in the Eucharist is retained inside the tabernacle itself. Sit up front, as close as you can and let Jesus permeate your soul as his graces radiate out to you. Just bask in his presence, talk to Jesus, listen for his small soft whisper. Jesus is there with you.
God bless you. I hope you become Catholic Christian. When you do welcome home. I will pray for your conversion.
You are 100% on it!! I was raised Protestant and although I couldn’t have explained this so succinctly as you have, this is exactly my experience learning to read the Bible through the Protestant lense vs the now Catholic lense. I NEVER understood much of the Bible growing up because it was such a pick and choose a verse sort of thing and we were actually taught that the Bible was always speaking directly to each of us and that is so overwhelming and intimidating. It wasn’t until many years after I became Catholic that I was finally able to grasp how to read the Bible in context and it opened up a whole new spiritual / theological understanding for me and my faith is so much more now! Being a Protestant is exhausting. You are your own pope, your own authority, your own scripture interpreter. It’s so amazing to come home to the Catholic Church and rest in her wisdom and tradition. Reading the NT in light of the OT was game changing for me.
I highly recommend starting with Father Mike Schmidt’s Bible in a Year podcast if you have never read the whole Bible, it’s read chronologically not cover cover straight through so you get the whole thing but in an order that shows salvation history.
Exactly what I used to do when I was a Protestant Christian.
Me too!
One very popular scripture to apply to one’s self is Jeremiah 29:11 “For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the Lord, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future.” (NIV)
NIV? A suggestion (ONLY), since the NIV is often used by the prosperity preachers. Compare with more traditional translations:
Jeremiah 29:11
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition
For I know the thoughts that I think towards you, saith the Lord, thoughts of PEACE, and not of affliction, to give you an end and patience.
Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition
For I know the plans I have for you, says the Lord, plans for WELFARE and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope.
Knox Translation
I have not lost sight of my plan for you, the Lord says, and it is your WELFARE I have in mind, not your undoing; for you, too, I have a destiny and a hope.
As well, the NIV is missing 7 books of scripture. They are a gold mine of spiritual wealth.
This is very helpful in understanding my evangelical/ protestant friends. Thank you!
I'm so glad!
This is a great way to explain these differing approaches to reading scripture.
Thank you.
As a cradle Catholic for 64 years, it seems to me from experience, that at 11:50 in this video, when non-Catholic Christians read John 20:22-23, that the meaning of the text goes straight over their heads as their brains switch off, causing amnesia. Many non-Catholic Christians abhor these verses, as they lead the reader to the hierarchical Catholic Church.
I think that an example of this is 'charismatic' fans who truly believe that St. Paul was talking to them personally when he said that some have the gift of prophecy, healing, tongues, etc.
A Catholic (?) charismatic lady once told me that all I have to do is pray to the Holy Spirit and tell Him which gifts I want!
I immediately saw a Holy Shopping List !
🤣😅😇
I went to Charismatic Mass for 15 years, where I learnt much from the gifted Missionaries of God’s Love (MGL). But I could no longer stand many of the nutty regular congregation, who were off with the pixies😢
Now I am unsettled and cannot find a Mass with a solid priest. Having said that, St Christopher’s, Manuka, Canberra Australia 🇦🇺 is solid. I think I will start going there more regularly.
Good Observation Kenny. I hadn't thought of it in this way. My thought was that it was downstream of their focus on memorizing bible quotes (which is in and of itself a good thing, don't get me wrong) but what essentially happens is that they cut out a "snippet" from a larger paragraph or narrative with a specific context. Once removed, this "quote" begins to take on a new life and meaning of its own, divorced from its place in its original context. In other words, they slogan it. The quote or "slogan", separated from its original context, gains new meaning and context based on how it begins to be interpreted and applied to the life of the person or persons who frequently use it. I have often found that Protestant interpretations can be refuted by merely reading the sentence or sentences directly before or after the one in which they quote. In essence, they miss the forest for the trees. On the other hand, in fairness, sometimes Catholics can do the opposite and miss the trees for the forest. So we all have something to learn from one another. I appreciate your insight (and others from the Journey with Matt, Ken, and Kenny), as it has helped me think about and engage with my separated brothers and sisters with more care and understanding that they have a completely different lens - especially when they hear two and two from a Catholic and somehow inexplicably come up with seven. We should first work on correcting their lens instead of just debating verses.
Thanks!! Let’s keep working for the healing of division.
I grew up protestant, and I call it the "Jesus is my boyfriend" gospel. He is always talking to you personally. That's how we got the idea to just say this prayer and ask Jesus to be your personal Lord and Savior. Now I am a Catholic and the Bible makes way more sense to me. I learned to understand who the letter was being written to first, then go on to read the book and see it through the lens of the writer. I like it this way much better.
Yes. To whom was he writing and why. Timothy wasn't just some random man on the street. He was appointed Bishop of Ephesus.
Yes, we learn as Catholics that the Holy Spirit gifts each of us with charisms, talents and skills to discern our own special vocation, aiding Christ’s Kingdom on Earth. Bless you!
@@BensWorkshop
Good to see you again Ben🙏
That sounds like a great way to open up a conversation with my protestant friends. Thank you.
This was before the Holy Spirit was given to any who believed and were baptized in the name of Jesus. It seems to be that beginning in Acts 2, something new was going on. It became a priesthood of believers who were spirit-filled and could minister to each other, pray for each other, and forgive each other. Now all we who are in Christ have the Holy Spirit. Each of us as members of the body have different gifts and all serve each other.
I agree that often Christians will take words meant for someone else and presume to take promises as if for them, though.
This is so eye opening and helpful!
I'm so glad!
Wow, i never saw it like that. Great video and great work
Loved this! ❤️💙
This is great! I could never quite pinpoint or articulate what is going on in the protestant mind with some scripture, but this cleared it up. Thank you Kenny for this explanation!
Kenny, what you are describing is the Doctrine of Sola Scriptura, and its sub-traits; Scriptural infallibility and inerrancy. I've likewise encountered this phenomenon myself. They are using the doctrine of Sola Scriptura as a hermeneutic itself, and combining both inerrancy with infallibility. It's the philosophy that God doesn't speak to anyone directly anymore but through scripture alone, and therefore to grasp an understanding of what God is telling me, I interpret scripture in that way. Such a philosophy is extremely erroneous and dangerous, and has given rise to many cults and denominations in the Protestant sector.
Yep. In fact many independent Churches which subscribe to Sola Scriptura are, by virtue of their doctrines and practices, actually cults vs. Christian. There are simply too many to count and new ones pop up every day. It’s mayhem.
So erroneous and dangerous that many unlearned/unwise become followers of the cults that mushroomed out of this kind of personal interpretations.
Even our country, the Philippines with an extreme blend of brilliant and ignorant people, is not spared from these cults.😌
@@alelilaceda3539
I’m married to a Filipina, whose Catholic faith is unshakable, very strong but simple, ie she finds it hard to articulate her faith.
I was brought out of atheism after being raised very antiCatholic Baptist by God directly speaking to me. You know like He did for Paul.
I then spent many years praying, fasting, studying scripture and listening to Protestant podcasts daily. I listened to Protestants but didn’t exactly trust any of them. I trusted no one, not even myself and relied heavily on God to let me only take away that which was true and profitable.
In the end, God made me Catholic without me even studying any Catholic theology. I was literally brought to a place where I understood that what I was taught to believe by the Holy Sprit didn’t fit in any Protestant tradition and I was left to either start a new denomination, which I was loath to do or look into Catholicism and Orthodoxy, which I was also loathed to do, but not quite as much as I was repulsed by the idea of starting a new denomination.
Jesus started a Church. ONE HOLY CATHOLIC AND APOSTOLIC CHURCH. Those are FOUR marks that no protestant denomination can say they have.
When you have ruled out the impossible, what remains however improbable must be the answer.
@@BensWorkshop
Occam's razor 👍
Makes sense to me.
Me too!
Excellent! Thank you for this... so true
Great video, it has helped me understand more on how my evangelical Freind’s interpret the Bible
Thanks for this Kenny. This was very much my life for many years and goes to the heart of disagreements with my evangelical friends.
How would you suggest approaching this though. Because I don’t see my evangelical friends seeing a problem with breaking the 4th wall. Sure, we’ve identified the reason we come to different interpretations but I don’t see that we’re any closer to resolving that.
The problem involves reading comprehension and ego. Read something closer to mortgage documents, it's not hard to at least see the Catholic view in the NT
However Protestantism trains people to take a letter clearly addressed to some guy named Timothy, ignore 100% of the context, and apply 2 sentences at random to themselves. It's hard thing to get them to say "No, let's start by assuming that this a letter to Timothy." We have to start with the disappointing and humbling news that maybe Paul didn't have them personally in mind and that matters.
Hi Greg. Yeah it was my life too and now on the other side of it it is more clear to me than before. I think as a starting place we can simply point out the interpretive approach and try to get them to agree that it is different and since it is different we can make thre observations. 1. We cannot agree on the meaning of a text if we employ disparate hermeneutics. 2. The fact that such differences are possible when 2 Christians are looking at one text is a strike against Sola Scriptura. 3. Since these are true, we might look at the witness of the early Christians to see if they agree with one or the other interpreter. In the case of these texts all the early witnesses will appeal to authority vested in the apostles and their successors.
You can also say in terms that may foster more contemplation and dialogue: We Catholics read the Bible in its original context. You seem to be doing something different from that. This will sound like a strike at the heart of a “Bible only” Christian who doesn’t think they do that. Simply point it out and rest on the solid witness of the Church. Leave the burden of proof on later novel interpretations.
@@atrifle8364yeah I agree. To be fair to anyone who sat under my teaching ministry (especially in the early years), I unfortunately encouraged and even modeled this flawed hermeneutic, and people sadly embraced it.
@@KennyBurchard- It's tough because that way of interacting with the Bible is built into the framework of the culture. Even Luther's original "epiphany" is more or less taking sentences out of Romans out of context. He had a lot less excuses though than people almost 500 years later. He was trained Catholic and was completely aware of passages in James, etc that contradicted his own somewhat electic theology.
Most modern Protestants are trained decontextulized sentence reading approach from Day 1. Despite many self assurances on their Biblical knowledge, it's quite clear many spend their most of their time in a few select parts of Scripture. In that there is a great deal less culpability. But those practices makes the conversation much difficult, even when I have a letter from James clearly addressing a general audience as foolish for believing in faith alone. It's undoing an unquestioned process/approach.
@@KennyBurchard the ironic thing is many protestants will argume against breaking the 4th wall in other passages. For example, I've heard reformed folks say that applying Jeremiah 29:11 to ourselves and claiming that promise for ourselves is taking the verse out of context because God was specifically addressing that to Israel in exile.
Two ideas: Read scripture at Adoration. Read, gaze upon Christ, read. Repeat!
Secondly, I make constant reference to the Rev. George Leo Haydock Bible Commentary (online), which is a collection of comments from the Christian greats of antiquity. It helps clear up so much of the ambiguity of the written word. Impossible to place a value on it.
Claro de aqua, best explanation ans easy to understand
Brilliant!
Thanks!
Yes! This makes 100% sense.
People gotta start understanding that the written words of scripture came from the Apostles and their disciples who were taught by the apostles first along with the Holy Spirit,so having said that people must realize that the scriptures were not put in the hands of the members or sheep but was reserved for the hierarchy and priesthood who are the shepherd’s of the church to instruct teach and feed the flock of the one true church that started on Pentecost that will continue until the end of time.Thank you my Catholic Christian brother Kenny excellent superb video may truly increase your faith understanding and zeal to reveal many difficult things that the scriptures hold Amen 🙏 🐑🕊️✨🔥
Absolutely correct 👍
It's funny because my first read of the whole bible I read it like a history book. There were parts that could definitely be read as talking to you specifically, but not all. I am sure not all protestants read the bible this way, but then how do they past the part when Jesus says behold your mother? To John on the cross.
Oh, for them, that's where Jesus is speaking to only John, not them.🙄
The key to that verse is the subject. He’s never identified as John, but as the Beloved Disciple. Therefore we also can be beloved disciples if we do as John did there in taking Mary as his mother. As a convert this is how it was explained to me & how I believe it.
Some teach to view it as God's love letter to each soul. It is a seamless garment and John 19 cannot be separated from John's Revelation, Chapter 12. Gad is Father, Jesus is Brother, and God does not maintain a single parent household. The "woman" is the mother of all who keep the Gospel of Christ, Her Son. We must take baby steps with those unfamiliar with the ancient faith.
Thanks Kenny!
Joe Catholic versus Joe PROTESTANT - 27:00
I know - I was speaking too quickly. Good catch, and I agree.
Joe Catholic verses Bill Protestant 👍 There are lots of Joe’s out there, especially the sleepy type😂
Wow. This helps me a lot. Thank you
Great!
Thank you, I get what you're saying especially in these scriptures. I have a question as I stand on the promises of Psalm 91. Am I wrongly seeing it through the 4th wall? Thank you.
2 Peter 1-20
Know this first of all that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation
Yep!!
I have a question: why do you always distinguish between Protestants and Evangelicals? Why not simply say 'Protestants' when referring to non-Catholic and non-Orthodox Christians?
Because although evangelical non Catholics are separated brethren many of them reject Protestant roots and do not believe they are Protestant. If we want to talk to them we have to use the term they prefer if it is appropriate. Some want to be called “catholic with a little c,” and this we cannot do. But evangelicals tend to disconnect their historical roots from Protestants and will even tune out if you use that word with them - “oh. I’m not a Protestant so this is not for me. I’m just Christian.” When you hear that the kind of Protestant you’re talking to is an evangelical. It’s about building bridges.
I've seen exactly what you describe in my interactions with Protestants. I see it in several verses. I see it in 1 Timothy 3:15 where they see any believer as the Church and so believe they have the truth because they believe. This was the verse that converted me. I had done some studying of Catholicism around 1975ish and I never saw this verse.
Another verse I use frequently is 2 Peter 1:20-21 where Peter is saying only the Holy Spirit can correctly interpret the scriptures. We can go to John and see where Jesus promised to send the Holy Spirit to the Church and would be with the Church forever. So I see it as the authority of the Church to interpret scripture. But Protestants see themselves as having the Holy Spirit, so they believe they are interpreting scripture correctly