Van's Aircraft Business Announcement from Dick VanGrunsven
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- Опубликовано: 26 авг 2024
- We need to share some difficult information about the status of Van’s Aircraft, and we invite you to watch this brief video from Dick VanGrunsven, founder of Van’s Aircraft. All of us at Van’s truly value the loyalty and confidence you have shown us over these many years. We will be in touch soon to update you on our progress. For more information, please visit: www.vansaircra...
First class businessman, upfront, honest, and totally transparent. You don’t see that ever nowadays.
I think they got to the point where they were completely out of cash and had no choice but to come clean.
Certainly not from tRump.
I’m genuinely sad to hear that the (arguably) most prolific and successful EAB kit aircraft manufacturer is Not (currently) profitable. The individual companies behind many exciting airframe designs have come and gone over time and that’s always a concern. We are a niche community and simple economics indicate we have to pay the expenses of the companies that provide the materials and components we need to pursue our aviation activities. I appreciate Van’s candor and humility by delivering this message personally.
If the factors affecting Vans are not only specific (inventory and repercussions of laser cut parts), it can be extrapolated to General Aviation as a whole, where the experimental sector gave enthusiasts the opportunity to fly their dream plane.
Agree, its G.A in general being squeezed. 6 years ago we sold our 172 to free up cash and we were only using it a few times a year due to our work loads, with the thinking we'd buy back in a few years later when we retire. Now we can't afford it due to price escalations on everything from fuel to hangar fees.
My financial advice to Vans are: 1) increase the price immediately by 30% now, then increase their price by 10% every month gradually until the lead time will not become 1-2 weeks. Ask for minim 75% downpayment.
@@pwffstubePlease volunteer your time to help fix the company. They need your help.
what happened with the laser cut parts? Can anyone please expand on that for me? Thank you.
@@daszieher
Wow! Thanks for the straight talk Van!
Looks like a developing story to cover. Given the company's footprint within the community, this is a bit of a surprise.
This is probably the only positive thing I've ever seen you post about a fellow aviator....
@@evansargent1 learn much Evan, or just trolling?
@@blancolirio You still begging for money?
Big Big fan Brownie!!
Total class act. This only increases my confidence in the company.
@@pwffstubePlease volunteer your time to help fix the company. They need your help.
Mr. VanGrunsven: thank you for your leadership.
I was unaware of the personal financial sacrifices you and your wife made to ensure the continued success of Van's Aircraft.
I am extremely grateful for the investments you made, which directly help both the company, and the thousands of us building or flying an RV.
Thank you for your communication, perspective, and positive attitude.
As a business owner I feel this pain. Best of luck, what an icon.
Please consider a crowd fund... I and most others in GA would love the opportunity to support VANs in such circumstance and will be an instant form of cash flow!
Good call! It would be a tragedy if Vans went under. I’m sure many would rally to the cause, I will.
First class idea. Make sure the appeal is advertised World wide and the outcome should should be as we'd like it.
@@watchfordpilot Exactly! $20.00 to ha e your name put on the 15 Prototype for example... so many options for them to explore.
@@ThinkfliteGreat idea! Why don’t you send an email with this to Vans? As an elderly guy these type of new media possibilities is maybe not in his mind.
@@timmholzhauer3342 I would think most at Vans aren't Dicks age but I will do, just on case it does help 🙂
I met “Van” at Oshkosh, truly one of the nicest gentlemen you will ever meet. Owned an RV7 for 5 years and throughly enjoyed every moment of flying it!
Everyone! Keep in mind that being profitable is very different than being cash flow positive. Honestly I've been a little worried about their cash flow in light of how rapidly they've expanded in the last couple years. They have invested heavily in tooling and staff, carry significant inventory, and have a decent delay between receipt of customer order and receipt of payment. The time in between those two is inventory they need to pay for but haven't received payment for. Even very successful businesses can have cash flow crunches. Frankly I'm shocked and impressed that Van would be so candid about this. Bravo.
I was thinking this too, expanded too fast.
Having inventory is money spent on manufacturing product that’s sitting on a shelf. That’s why parts are expensive.
@@glendavis1266And non-business owners don’t realize that inventory is post-tax money.
25 years ago the Willamette Valley Soaring club, just across the hiway from Van's (he started in North Plains, OR) was going under due to bad leadership. Van, also a great glider pilot and member of the club, jumped in and set the course with his business sense. It worked. Van has a fantastic old world sense of hard work, money and how to make things work. He can do it again. HIs values are so important. Van's will come out better if possible. An honest guy doing hard work. The easy thing would be to sell to the CCP. Our government should come in with a defense contract. Van is a great American.
Thank you very much for sharing this. Video updates like these give perspective to the overall issues and remind us that we are all human. It’s clear that you genuinely care for your builders, staff, and the products you deliver. I hope Van’s can get through this relatively unscathed, and we can all look back on it years from now as a hiccup in our build journeys.
@@pwffstubePlease volunteer your time to help fix the company. They need your help.
Very few business men will come out and talk like this honest and ,concerned gentleman to customers, that's old school business ethics something few have anymore
Agree.
Good luck Vans. I hope you can overcome these hurdles and carry on for another 50 years.
Ben
Thank you for your candor Mr. VanGrunsven. Having met you in person once, and listened to you speak on several occasions I was struck by your humility and your passion. Your honesty in making this information public is refreshing and I believe gives your past, current and future customer base confidence that Vans Aircraft will be around for many years to come!
I recall stopping into to Van's many years ago while on a business related trip to Oregon. I went to the parts counter to pick up some small bits and pieces of hardware. Van himself came out and just chatted with me for many, many minutes...like I was an old friend and we had never even met before. He is a one-in-a-million guy and truly one of the greatest designers in aviation history.
@@pwffstubePlease volunteer your time to help fix the company. They need your help.
I was finallly gonna order my RC-8A kit this month but suddenly you are not taking orders now. BUT this message makes me feel even more confident about the company and keep my project alive and you can be sure that I’ll be placing my order as soon as you accept and process orders again. You are a great company. I had the pleasure to fry from Colombia ONLY to visit you. Your company kindly gave me a FREE flight on your gorgeous RV-14A and also enjoyed the factory tour. Vans Aircraft is a great example about how a company MUST treat its customer.
I’m sure Vans will continue operations stronger than before and we will see your airplanes flying for many more generations. I can’t wait to build my RV. As company’s owner in my country I know how hard being alive in this changing and challenging business world is. YOU ROCK!!!!! God Bless Van’s Aircraft. You had the wisdom to be here and done all you have done until today. Of course you will have that wisdom to defeat this crisis. My sincere support from Colombia.
This video should be required annual review material for executives at those big brand corporations on how to properly address your issues with complete candor and clarity….directly and openly to your market. Bravo.
As someone who has a RV7 in the family and who wants to build my own kit in the future, praying for a speedy and successful resolution of the issues. I cannot thank you enough for your timely and candid communication. It’s just another reason I value your company so much.
I'm sorry to hear of your issues. Those of us that have flown your planes know that you make a great product. I expect you will sort this out, and keep going.
As a dreamer who want's to build one of your lovely aircraft one day, and a huge fan of Mr VanGrunsven himself, this is difficult news. I can't offer any practical support from the other side of the world, but I'm rooting for your company to sort the issues quickly. All the best in this difficult time
Honest and to the point. Just don’t sell to the Chinese.
Thanks for your candid coms, we all wish you a speedy resolution to the problems, and as a customer I thank you for underwriting the business and keeping it going. Your firm makes great kits so folks have there can have great aeroplanes, and it quite a shock that the business is having tough times. Good luck sir.
Dick, you've always been kind to me while chatting and--while I have a vested interest here--I'm very hopeful you get this sorted out and your company can continue to provide great kits and service to the wonderful GA community.
Takes a lot of courage and leadership to establish and maintain such a position in a specialized market. Well and briefly shared. Wish you great and increased success.
Sir, thank you for your frankness and honesty, it is a true rarity these days.
I wish you all the best.
Thank you Van for the open and honest communication!
I wish you all the best. You all are a national treasure to the GA community.
At least Van's is upfront about the issues. I hope they can revise the business and continue on. RotorX left people hanging without any communication.
When?
@@SquawkCodeI think they filed for bankruptcy a few days ago or so. Heard it on the aero news network i believe.
We will always be there to support you as a customer. Consider asking help from your customers in difficult times. I am sure many of us are able and willing to help. Every growth comes with pains, Van''s Aircraft is on their way to brighter days for sure.
Thanks for the honesty Van. It seems that some processes introduced have caused some real headaches for the business. I'd gladly settle for an old style kit again, or just zero laser cut parts! You have a loyal Vans Air Force behind you, we'll stick with you through this rocky period.
As the owner of two businesses I can completely relate to the difficulties of cash flow against very profitable businesses. The delay between invoicing and payment, capital equipment purchases, build out of personnel for anticipated demand etc are all very difficult to manage against cash flow.
Good luck Vans ! I love your product and wish you the best.
What a great video. Your candor is very refereshing! I wish you the best in getting things on tract.
As a builder I certainly appreciate the forthright communiation - thank you! Certainly hoping you find the resoultion that we are all hoping for and we see Van's heading into another 50 years as the top EAB kit manufacturer!
I have never flown a Van's kit plane but have seen one up close and was very impressed. I pray that they survive this situation and hope they stay in business and stay profitable.
I’ve owned 3. They are as much fun as a Carbon Cub and get you twice as far between bathroom breaks!
If i may ask, what is theprice @backcountyrpilot
I was in the process of building an RV4 in the late 80s. Unfortunately, I was unable to complete my dream aircraft. Vans Aircraft designs are the best in the industry. I am way beyond flying at this point. I fully hope that Vans can come out of this difficult time fully intact. Best wishes!
Raw material shortages and 50% increases in raw material parts is a huge issue for any company. Couple that with lower sales due to inflation is a bad combo for any "non-essential" business. Hard to make a stable business in an unstable environment. I hope VAN's can weather this. Huge blow to our hobby and the people who have invested in it if they can't.
Glasair ?
As a long time admirer of Dicks designs and simple (original) business model this isn’t news I wanted to hear. I wasn’t surprised though as Van stepped back and the company become more “structured “. Kit aircraft is a very niche business that requires VERY tight controls and that usually means the owner being present, this isn’t a business that can survive with a typical corporate structure.
The lack of communication and direction after the laser cut parts issue spoke volumes about leadership, you see who stepped in?
I’m an RV6 owner but even if I didn’t own an aircraft requiring parts I would still have an interest in this company surviving as they are a positive force in the GA space. Survival as I see it will requiring stepping back to something close to the original business model.
Best of luck to the Vans employees!
Too many models requiring massive parts inventories, money spent sitting on the shelf for future needs.
All the best in your reorganization and profit measures!!!
Dick, don’t be afraid to ask for volunteers. There are lots of Engineers and Business experts out there that can and want to help you. Many are ready, right here in Oregon.
@@pwffstubeYeah a bunch of college freshmen working on airplane designs. What could go wrong. Great idea Einstein.
@@pwffstubePlease volunteer your time to help fix the company. They need your help.
So what have been the problems that have happened exactly?
@@pwffstube
Please establish a crowd funding site to allow your adoring public the honor of giving back to a person who has given so much and now, Too much! If we all give what we can, skip a dinner out and donate to Dick! Let's make this on of the most positive events Van's Co. ever dealt with. God bless you sir! I'll put up the first C note.
Why would people donate money to a company that apparently has made some horrible business decisions?
No way should this be allowed to happen. It would just let them off for business decisions that they have made. They have to sort this out. If it does happen RV’s will go to the bottom of the list for me.
Anyone can blame bad business decisions but that may not be the issue(s).
Now, there's a man with integrity. I hope they're able to fix the cash flow problem.
I believe in you guys and I believe in your products! I'm a happy -7a builder and will always be a huge fan! We're all rooting for you!!
Thanks for being forthright. I am sad to hear the news but I am confident in the people who have created the finest kit aircraft on the market. I am still enjoying my 9 and am directing a group of students on a 12. My confidence in Vans aircraft remains steadfast. Best wishes.
I plan on building a vans aircraft in the future. I wish Vans the best of luck!
I'm still backing Van's Aircraft to survive. Planning to build a RV-15 as soon it become available. The customer's support is far wider and deeper than you image for your product.
I knew when they hadn’t changed anything on the 15 at Osh from last year there were problems.
I suspect that they are also getting some Osborne effect. People are waiting for the RV-15, so they are not selling the current models, but that will prevent them from bringing the RV-15 to the market.
@@Finder245 Osh 22 it looked like it was almost done with testing. That was their influx of cash right there. Sonex if you notice did the exact same thing. Promised their high wing and didn’t deliver. We all knew they were in trouble before that though. I really hope Vans pulls thru this. One thing for sure is that if they don’t come up with some way to make the laser folks happy, they’re doomed.
@@Pilotpaulie Did Van's take orders for the RV-15? If not, I don't see how this would result in an influx of cash.
@@Finder245 Nope. They were going to at Oshkosh this July. People waving checkbooks at them. Weren’t taking orders.
It is sad to learn about the difficulties your company is going through. I wish you, your company, and your employees all the success your company deserves. Best wishes.
May the force be with you! Honest genuine gentleman. I wish you the time and resources to make sure your business continues. Your planes are without doubt the best on the market.
Definitely do a crowd fund. As a proud RV-7A owner, I would support.
Thank You for your candor. All of aviation is by your side. 🛩
The toughest thing for a small family owned business to do is
1. To look inside itself honestly
2. State the real & needed changes that must be accomplished and
3. Implement those changes.
The reason is because family businesses are built around family members individual strengths & weaknesses and this journey Van's Aircraft is taking may come to the conclusion that certain family members must be replaced or their positions diminished in order for the company to survive.
I wish Mr. VanGrunsven and his family good luck in the difficult process ahead.
Really sorry to hear this and I hope you can financially pull this off. Your reputation is so good and general aviation needs you. All businesses need a positive cash flow and that may require significant price increases. Best of luck.
Cirrus could learn a lot about communication and transparency from this fine gentleman. I hope Van's comes out strong.
Good luck to you in fixing the issues. you have great products, so I expect you will come through it.
This makes sense, because they let my brother go after working for them for 23 years. He left on good terms and has a wonderful relationship with them. Praise God he got another job soon after and is enjoying himself in his new adventure.
Sorry to hear of the difficulties.
Wish you the best of luck in figuring out how to move forward in your endeavors.
Tried to talk to Dick years ago when the 6A first came out at a fly in, in Kerrville, TX because I wanted to build one. He didn't say a word to me, turned and walked away. Never understood this so I took my money elsewhere. Despite this he's done extremely well up to this point with a great product! Hate to see this and I hope everything works out.
Depends on something you said?
I am not a plane owner but just listening to Mr. Vans speak it is obvious that the current situation is cutting into his soul to have to make this address. I think Vans will be okay and will come out stabilizing and stronger for the future!
A great man, full of integrity. An asset to the EA world. Perhaps one of the experimental aviation worlds most important people and definitely one the most important companies. I wonder if the EAA will put it's charitable machine to it's best use and help him out in his time of need? At this time I think it would help the largest sector of EAA's constituency.
I wish Van’s the very best. I finished a RV6-A in 2003, but I had to sell in less than 3 years later due to health issues. Van’s was a great company to work with and the 6-A was a fabulous airplane. I still miss flying, but all things have to end sometime.
Hope they get thing sorted out. I was looking at starting a build in a few years and the Van's aircraft are always at the top of the list.
This level of candor only makes me want a RV something even more.
As the previous owner of an RV-7A, a RV-7, and currently an RV-8 (all purchased from the builders) I am pulling for you Van!
I’d like to add, that I’d gladly pay $350,000 for a finished RV15 with a GTN750, G3X, G5, 500AP, AOA and nice 2-color paint.
There are RV10’s with less panel listing for $450,000 recently. Well-equipped RV14’s seem to be bringing $300,000.
I think your guys are on the phone with builders that send you maybe $70,000 including the engine.
I sold Nikasil plating for motorcycle cylinders and big-bore and stroke kits for dirt bikes in the 90’s and 2000’s.
The phone, and R&D, racing and other fun stuff is a killer.
One solution might be to establish 3 or 4 or 5 independent build centers around the country and deal less
directly with customers. The changing FAA rules might help or hurt this plan. Boomers are timing out.
I expect this to kill Harley and 57 Chevy’s. Until I was 40 there is no way I could have afforded aviation.
Getting the FAA to allow training in non-customer-owned Experimental’s might help young people.
You might also look at whatever Cub Crafter’s is doing. I’m not sure they are making a bunch of money, but
they seem to be on the move.
The book, THE E-MYTH by Robert Gerber might help you set up systems and focus on working ON the business
rather than working IN the business.
A friend of a friend built a stunning RV10 (with my dream panel) in Portugal. Maybe expand on that?
The first thing you need to do is to fire the big shots.
Dick..
Your pass success is the best reason why you need to change the way to operate, you have being on the number 1 position for so long that that you lower your guard, remember you have to be permanently dissatisfied in order to get better and better and keep ahead of the competition.
You can’t solve a problem unless you can accurately define the problem, take your time, you will come back stronger that never, we are counting on you.
Thank you for sharing this video it's unbelievable on what cost is for aluminum and any other parts and Machinery to make these planes I wish . Lycoming and all the other engines would lower their prices on their engines you could buy a house in 1972 for the price of their brand new engine it's unreal how much they charge for a aircool Lycoming aircraft engine just because it's an aircraft engine it's just ridiculous
You should probably thank the millionaire liability lawyers for the price increases.
@@snotnosewilly99 yeah I forgot about thanking them
@@snotnosewilly99 As much as I wish the prices were due to potential litigation, the real reason they increase prices to absurd levels is because people will pay it. Both Lycoming and Continental have captive customers; who else realistically are they going to get an engine from?
Best of luck. Tough times require tough decisions. Glad you are making them.
Vans is a class act! I appreciate the continued updates and look forward to seeing you come out the other side stronger than you've ever been! Keep up the hard work! (Would have posted this in today's video but comments are off 🙂)
Very nice aircraft. Filled an amazing variety of aviation solutions. Made a lot of people happy.
Just remember it's a business, not just a hobby. Wish the source of your issues, now have a fully backed business focus.
Looks like you may be also ready for retirement. Hope you pass on the reins to someone with the same passion as you. Fingers 🤞
Wishing you great success in your reorganization 🙂
Best if Luck Vans!!! Wish you the very best!
Not worried. The problem is being addressed. Just my 4th notice of delay on my finish kit. Making the best of it and enjoying other things away from the build for a bit. Is what it is.
Wonderful attitude.
Praying for you folks.
This honesty clarity, and honorable business practice is EXACTLY why the Vans is my number one choice over composites, and a plethora of other aircraft, as something I want to build for my first homebuilt. At 56, having grown up with aviation and detoured to a career in IT, and racing, your actions and stability long term is why I want to build one of your aircraft. Along with the stable and proven design that has evolved nicely with the times and advances in knowledge with experience. Thank you for taking the time and I hope things smooth properly for the firm.
Keep up the good work Vans Team... I know things will turn around for you. PS We love your planes :)
❤ your prouducts and you and your team to make it through. Bless you...
Integrity, that's what it is. I sincerely hope your company pulls through.
Totally fair, Dick. I always thought Van's kits were a bit less expensive than others so it doesn't hurt to get in line with the industry(just maybe not TSI Sling pricing please).
Wow. A lot of fair weather friends and business geniuses in here. Maybe they can get together and provide a buyout and show the world how easy it is to run a successful company. I wish Vans the best of luck.
G'Day Dick
I wish you all the best now and ongoing
Cheers Rory
As I read all the comments, it seems like there have been problems with Vans management and the bottom line for a while…and many builders seem to know about it. Others like me don’t know what’s going on. I’ve been thinking about a RV 12 kit for a while. Should I rethink this? Was Vans video just a way of saying prices will be going up…way up?
Consider creating a program where your friends in the community can loan Van's money at extremely favorable rates. If many of us make you small loans, it may be enough to get you where you need to be. Make it a club of some sort. Count me in!
Man this is hard to hear. What happens to GA if Vans goes under? I'm building a 14 because Vans is the last real bastion of affordable aircraft. Affordable being very, very relative.
A most honourable and honest presentation. Good luck with what appears to be a most unlovely situation.
I would like to build a RV-15 as soon it become available even if its just the tail section to start with and I can wait long periods until other sections are ready. I watched this video and read the linked article so I'm hopeful that vans can work through their current challenges.
There are companies in all sorts of hobby industries that are dealing with the same problem. Pretty much every hobby that could be done at home exploded during the pandemic. Companies invested heavily in order to meet those demands and then everybody went back to work. It's a tough situation.
About time they came out with some truths! They’ve been pissing off numerous customers with their messed up effort to try and cut costs (more profits)! You’ve done damage to your own brand, was it worth it?
You may have to bring things down to 2 or 3 models. Best of luck, and i hope to see you in the future!
I work at a skydiving place it’s going under , and a local beer company is having same problems. 2023 has been one of the worst years for most of us especially the smaller businesses.
Thank you sir! These inflationary times are hurting everyone. I pray that you make the right decisions for the future of your company as I may be a customer in about ten years.
It has nothing to do with inflation. They had a small issue with skins cracking and then today's crybabies and internet trollsmade much ado about nothing over the internet. The next thing you know, everyone is trying to get something for nothing and Vans goes belly up.
Aviation is a hard go, Wishing you all the best in moving fwd.
As a new Aviation business owner... THIS is the sort of ethics and transparency I try to operate in. I'm very sorry to hear this news, our American Aviation sector is getting tight for sure. Godspeed Gentlemen... I will keep you in my prayers! 🇺🇸🤝🏻
The second highest cause of business failure is too rapid growth.
Perhaps with a good plan, some could purchase minority equity to raise capital?
I really want Van's Aircraft to succeed!
You said it. This talk reminds me of working for Mirage Resorts when Bellagio was under construction. Steve Wynn bought primetime NBC airtime to address all of us local employees and assure us we'd be fine...MGM bought us a few months later and everything went to crap. Stories that start out with, "We've run the company into the ground, but we're working on a plan..." don't typically end up well.
@@branchandfoundry560 But I hope it does this time.
Won't ship and won't refund? I had been looking forward to building an RV-10. I will be looking for alternatives.
Yeah? ill give the POS kit that have with faulty parts at half the cost.
Hope all goes well. Gotta get that RV-15 kit released and the cash will start flowing in! That plane looks great!
I work in a similar business (not the same industry). I could see a similar message being pushed out by other very successful 'garage industries'. It takes guts to deliver this message. I bet it will also bring in investors who love the industry to help.
Thanks for the update. Praying for your continued success.
They should issue an IPO. I’d buy some shares for sure.
Surprised about the amount of positive reactions. My thoughts go to all them builders that put their money in and might never see parts at all. And / or have build part of the plane and now face the option of not even bothering to take it all apart anymore for replacement parts due to the laser trouble.
Sad to hear that even at the substantially higher prices of modern aviation these great companies can't stay profitable.
I don't blame them at all. They have to charge what they need to stay in business. But as someone who's not insanely wealthy and has a passion for aviation it seems more and more like it's something I'll never be able to achieve.
Building my fuselage right now. Very Very Nervous. This is enormous if Vans doesn't pull out. To the experimental world, this is like Chevy declaring a shutdown to reorganize.
Do they give you actual plans that have enough information for you to scratch-build the rest of your airplane if necessary?
@@kurtayres9689 The Zenith plans provide dimensions. Only the parts that you scratch build do they provide that much information on the Vans. I don't think I am going to try this. I think it would be easier to go to the community college and get an A&P and buy a used certified aircraft. Scratch builds take a decade. Pretty sure I don't want to put it that level of effort. If your doing that, typically you build the forms from hardwood and pound each rib into shape. It can be done but so much extra time time goes into fabricating each part.
If they don't pull out, I will finish off what I have and probably sell the components. Helping someone with damaged or missing parts. I am hopeful that someone may come in a buy Vans if it gets to that.
@@omorin34 Yep, at a point you have to answer the question, "Do I want to build or do I want to fly?" I've been in hangars where guys just like working on a project plane with a lot of camaraderie, and it was a fun atmosphere. But those guys all either had other planes they flew regularly or didn't have much interest in flying anymore. Guessing that's not your situation.
@@branchandfoundry560 Yup, seen that 100 times. Dead giveaway is, Do they have a TV and furniture in the hanger? If they is a fridge with beer, with the other items above, this is a place to get out of the house, not a place to keep a plane.
@@omorin34 Agreed. I do metal and woodwork. Lots of guys ask if there's beer in the fridge (nope, just my lunch). Always puzzles me. This is a place of business--work to be done, with tools that can kill you. Not a hangout spot.
“Although our testing proved that laser-cut parts are functionally equivalent to punched parts”. Is this true for the recommended replacement parts? If so, the communication on that has been far from clear. Is it true for parts with cracks?
I'd be willing to bet they could start a gofundme and get a bunch of support.