The "Father of BPD" Describes BPD Relationships | JOHN GUNDERSON
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- Опубликовано: 18 апр 2017
- Get the full, minimally edited interview (and see the documentary we made about BPD called BORDERLINE) here: watch.borderlinethefilm.com/p...
According to Gunderson, a person with BPD thinks the perfect (ideal) relationship will solve their problems. This causes a painful, cyclical high-low relationship drama which plays out again and again throughout the person's life.
John Gunderson, a major force in the BPD world and the person who originally defined the diagnosis, discusses Borderline Personality Disorder from the viewpoint of a researcher and clinician.
The complete Gunderson interview playlist: • Prevalence in the Gene...
For more information about the BORDERLINE film, please visit our website at borderlinethefilm.com
Our archive of videos on BPD and NPD is expanding - be sure to subscribe to our channel here: / @borderlinernotes
This analysis of BPD is so accurate it drove me to tears. Suffering with BPD is not only hell for the person who has it, but also for the people that love us.
Yes we love and we love and we love and we are never enough....
Thank you so much for this comment. Gunderson wrote the diagnostic criteria; his understanding of this disorder was unmatched. Unfortunately there won't be any more interviews with him. RIP. -P
It’s even worse when they leave because of it
@@lillliiillliilll sometimes it is the only right thing to do
It may be accurate but it's also very limited.
A bullseye may be glorified but it doesn't take into account every other point across the board and this has consequences.
It's why the medical model doesn't work.
I avoid getting close to people because I don't trust myself, I don't know if my feelings will change.
If someone withdraws without explanation it doesn’t make you BPD wtf lol
The hardest part is when they leave you for other people, the disconnection is like you never existed, and then they come back.
Why do they come back and not stick with the newer romance ?
Because the new supply won’t get them the relief they are searching for and they will re-cycle all potential partners over and over again . But no one will safe them ! They will never be satisfied until they start to work on them selfs . Sad thing is that their behaviour makes them feel more guilty and each cycle is more painful for the person without bpd.
@@pavlacechakova Thanks! Once boundaries are set in place the cycles do less damage, but if kids are involved, they are weapons of control.
@@pavlacechakova The cycles got extremely painful and life-threatening, then I started learning about boundaries, and now I am the one dishing out the pain to her, so she can be kinder and learn to treat people better.
In my case boundaries were in place , explanations how certain behaviour is impacting me in polite and understanding way however it was never enough. My patients with him almost destroyed me .
I’m really glad that your person has enough of self reflection and trying to be better. I believe anyone can reach remission but they need to truly want first .
Best of luck to both of you 🍀
This just doesnt end. It doesn't ever end. Id do anything to feel normal
It can be managed though. Your feelings are valid, I hope it gets better. ❤️❤️
Facing the fact it doesn’t end is the hardest part - but those good moment, manic or otherwise are real and it is possible to try and maximise those. I managed that once and my life was unspeakably better than it has gone back to now. I hope we can both get there
I hope it gets better for you and all of us who live this way ❤️🩹
❤❤❤❤
for the non BPD partner, it is SO hard to deal with ...
An underststement.
The non BPD partner often feels trapped and enmeshed. It is a very hard thing to get out of. I watched a good friend become a ghost of the man he was because he was not over his BPD ex. My ex also has BPD. I escaped the moment he called me a c*** on my birthday without any provocation whatsoever.
Run away when you can.
Kikyo-sama it’s so hard. I feel so horrible for cutting him off. He’s hot and cold
We are so sorry 😐
😭😭😭😭
“Has it ever struck you that life is all memory, except for the one present moment that goes by you so quick you hardly catch it going?”― Tennessee Williams..
This is an obnoxiously obvious statement framed as something poetic due to how verbose it is
@@Lhwbakao Not as obvious as you think, it's easy to take it at surface level.
Beyond however they meant for that quote to pertain to this video, there is a profound realization of what the present moment really is, and just how wispy the passing moments are. Like, yeah, we're always in the present moment by default, but understanding that conceptually is _way_ different than actually allowing yourself to live in the present moment instead of being hung up on memories or anxieties about the future.
It’s quite uncomfortable hearing a stranger so casually sum up my entire life like that.
… "and it starts all over again" … That´s it in a nutshell - well done, John.
It's a nice day to start again!
I'm an autistic lady, my boyfriend of 3 going on 4 years is also autistic and has BPD. He's an angel and a gem truly, I did a lot of research and would read the information he would send me on BPD so I could understand him better and such, before moving in. He's for real a sweet hearted person, all he ever wants is to be held and hugged 😌🖤 there's never a dull moment, he's the funniest person I know, my best friend and just my person in every meaning of the word, I know the dating scene was uncaring and cruel to him as it was to me for years. It's crazy the shit he's been through with exes and how people seemed to just dip, I refuse to ever give up on him cuz I know he refuses to give up on me 💟
Wow, what a lovely story of true love❤
Prior to my treatment for BPD, alone I was like a blind, deaf person moving around in life. A partner became my eyes and ears; my way of safely moving around the world. That is a lot to require of a person. DBT helped me gain my self and self dependence. DBT freed me.
I always wanted DBT for someone I love but haven't found with whom to recur
@@astralandreid with whom to recur? What does this mean?
@@onwardsandupwards7397 lol wtf was that? I mean I don't know where to go. I think psychiatrists or therapists here don't do that
@@astralandreid Look for a DBT clinic in an outpatient psychiatric part of a hospital. It's called DBT Therapy. It involves a lot of processes that actually change your brain functioning. If your loved one won't seek treatment, learn about this treatment for yourself to help you deal with this person better. But please take care of your own emotional health and emotional balance and seek peaceful relationships in your own life. You can't make this other person seek these things but you can be a happy, balanced, peaceful person in your relationships for yourself.
@@astralandreid Andrei, since DBT is based on modular skill learning, it is one of the treatments that seems to work very well when done online. (Evidence-based efficacy of online delivered DBT programs). You can search into that. If your loved one speaks English, finding an online program should not be a problem. If done properly - with a therapist or in a group and with crisis interventions - then it is pretty costly. However, there are also online courses that are less guided, mainly focused on the skills themselves, and are much cheaper. I cannot recommend one in particular but it should work.
No words can explain the emotional damage they inflict on their spouses. Some of us are damaged forever.
I couldn’t imagine !
Agree. My ending the relationship due to him hacking me and forcing sex (he was a high earning programmer who used his money and us (family) as a source of worth). When that ended, he would go through the house screaming “I want to kill myself kids! Did you know that?!” to our 9 year old twins.
How naive I was. I stayed thinking I could fix it (BA in psych here). No tools in the belt with fix it. My daughter & were diagnosed with CPTSD and my son was turned against his twin and me, his mom. Yeah, destroyed all our lives for a period. Rebuilding, getting strong. 🥰
THEY are not all the same, victim
@@heathernikki5734 the majority are.
Starting to think that forever, maybe my fate as well :/
i'm reading these comments about bpd in relationships, and i have to weigh in-- i had an ex who i am 99% sure had bpd, and it was genuinely very emotionally difficult. however, I dont think that means that no one with bpd can ever be in a successful relationship. If someone is working on their mental health and putting in effort to resist certain reactions, they can absolutely have a great relationship. It is when people are not working against those reactions where there is an issue in terms of staying in a relationship
Love this. Thank you for saying it. There's degrees to everything, so maybe there are cases that remain very difficult even though the person is trying. It also depends very much on the partner's willingness. But I know this: without trying, the chances are much slimmer. -P
what you is true, but i think that is important to point that "resist certain reaction" doesn't mean to repress them, that makes things way worse and many times is what concludes in those well known big outbursts.
so, to resist may be simply, to acknowledge them but not acting according to them.
Thank you!!!! Any person with any disorder won’t get any better when they don’t want to, however if a person is willing there is nothing that they cannot achieve! Thank you for posting your lovely comment..it helps people like us who are genuinely trying to get better (not only for ourselves but for loved ones too) more hope and motivation among all the stigma and demoralisation.
It’s not about “feeling” that their needs were met, they actually didn’t get those needs met.
Please say that louder for the people in the back.
Rosangela are you a psychiatrist? Or have BPD?
That is correct
Seriously
@@thesorrow88 Makes us pretty knowledgeable yep
I stopped even trying. Watching someone drown to save me is terrifying and painful.
My ex had BPD and I was living in hell on a near day to day basis. It was incredibly abusive and I don’t wish this upon my worst enemy.
Feel ya
Ive been in some BAD relationships before this, where I felt disrespected or infantilized or emasculated...but this relationship with a girl who fits all the signs of BPD is the first relationship in my life where I would describe it as a "living hell".
same here. very sad bro.
Same here. I had to breakup after 5 years of trying to make her happy whilst trying to make clear that I would walk if the burst of emotional abuse didn't stop.
Cry me a river baby girl!
My ex with BPD cheated on me after I made her my world. That’s how I ended up here
How are you now my guy? I am in the same situation rn.
I’m sorry that you’ve experienced that. I’m bpd but I would never cheat on my partner. I’ve been in a loyal partnership for 4 years now despite of any problems which include even long distance. You seriously didnt deserve that at all..or better yet she didn’t deserve a gem like you. Pls be assured that there are some of us with Bpd who would never do that, what she did with you was wrong. I’m wishing you lot of love and healing..
Same exact thing. But she was never diagnosed but meets all criteria. Once I recognized this it made me feel better knowing I dodged a bullet and this is her issue. Not mine
Like a surgeon who encounters complications in the operating room, the very act of trying to remove a person's suffering can sometimes exacerbate it.
You are so correct. This disorder is hard enough to live with. We don't need more negativity. We already carry the guilt of the world on our shoulders.
I knew I was part of the problem in my divorce...but this humbling to release just how much of the problem I was. My current husband is a saint for putting up with me.
generally if a woman recognizes she was "part of the problem" she was 100% of the problem.
I have BPD and it's taking a toll on me. My mentality is wack. I feel not loved by anyone I know to love be back. So I just sleep my life away in this pain that drives me insane.
❤
How are you today?
Spot on! Angry devaluation. I faced prolonged fear before building the courage to leave my now ex, (especially with our shared child). The fear stemmed from grappling with past suicide attempts and self-harm. Distinguishing authentic love from a codependent trauma bond was a very hard task.
After enduring bouts of violence and meltdowns, I finally ended the relationship. Within a week, my ex started a new relationship and sought to involve our child in her new 'family,' portraying a facade of stability while blaming me for her emotional turmoil over six years. My worst fears about my daughter's well-being were triggered. I tried suggesting waiting to bring children into the equation which my ex felt was a "attempt to control her".
Now, three months later, I'm gradually finding calm amidst this confusing and devastating journey. Coping through writing many songs and going to therapy, I've been exploring codependency and my role in allowing a destructive dynamic to persist. To those facing similar challenges, may healing and inner calm prevail. Prioritize self-love above all. 🌱🙏
It is a good partial description. I agree it is mainly founded on neglect. Caregiver(s) who dont validate you and may harmfully invalidate you. But in surplus to what the good doctor says, that I agree with, you form disconcerted connections in your brain regarding communication. We all communicate in several ways, not just words. But for us with BPD, we misinterpret those signals. As children we were constantly given mixed signals. You feed me, you cloth me, you keep me from dying, which says you care, but you only interact with me in ways that make me feel bad. You may even abuse me. You nelgect my needs as a human being who needs care and attention. So later in life the signals others send us are often misinterpretted. Someone says something critical and you hear they care. Someone says something caring and you hear criticism. I had to teach myself to listen to others, translate what they are saying in the context Im hearing it, try to see what they maybe saying and craft a response as to how they would like hear me. It is very far from in the moment and fluid with life, but it helped to keep me from exploding when I heard that you hate me because of my interpretation of what you said by recent behavior and your words.
I also have the morphic form of BPD. When you involuntarily copy other peoples identities. I believe that is co-pathology with DID.
Great video. I just wish it expressed more of the symptoms of BPD. People watching it may discount their symptoms as not of BPD when they are and devaluate themselves. After all validation is key to this illness.
🚨Read this if you’re a MAN dealing with a BPD breakup:
I know what it’s like. I’ve been there just like you. You feel like you’re alone on this planet and no one will ever understand the pain you’re in. It’s no normal break up and it feels hopeless. It’s hell.
My life felt pointless for a very long time, feeling like everything was lost.
HOWEVER, how hopeless it may seem, it is NOT.
It’s been 3.5 years ago for me, and looking back this is the best thing that ever happened to me. You have to take back control of your own mind. Fight through the pain. Use the pain as fuel to go to the gym, work hard and become a better man. All this while feeling at your worst.
I was a mess. Life had no more meaning and everything felt lost. But I overcame it all by working harder than I knew was possible. Find your purpose, find your goals and crush them. Your life will slowly start to be meaningful again.
Once you overcome this. You will feel unbeatable.
How hopeless it may seem; trust me, I’ve been there. Once you have left the dark side, looking back at it will become something amazing. Pressure creates diamonds.
It breaks you, or it makes you.
It’s up to you king.
Good luck.
Thanks for this. I devalue and discard and then obsess over them and live in the past. I didn't notice the cycle until now..
thank you
Thank you 🥹 i shed some tears while reading your text!
I miss her so much but I cannot go through this push n pull cycle that she has......I cannot anymore I wont let her play with my feelings
Exactly right. I was worried this would take years or possibly even destroy me altogether but after 6 months i feel amazing.
Shes finally out of the house. The chaos and controlling is becoming a thing of the past.
Finally some peace and a chance to work on myself and get back to being me and doing what i enjoy and what gives me confidence.
Looking forward to the future
I've been married to her for 26 years, it is hell to feel so hopeless trying to save someone you love so much.
Heartbreakingly difficult. For both. Painful but necessary decision to choose my own peace.
My BPD wife of 27 years left in a year ago July. This is what it was like for me.
Her love was the promised land and I was eager to prove my devotion. Together we wandering in the desert for many years, looking for the lush green forest at the edge of a lake, where surrounded by snow-capped mountains she could find peace and purpose. I brought plenty of food and water which never seemed to quench her thirst or satisfy a hunger she could not describe.
Occasionally we came upon an oasis where I was content and happy. In time the spring would go dry and once again we would resume the search. I am now very tired, our water supply a burden I no longer wish to carry. I tap into the last reserves of inner strength to stumble onward in this barren landscape, gripped by a fear of what is beyond the next, ever shifting sand dune. The blazing sun is high over-head, so I'm no longer certain of our direction, but once again, there on the horizon a patch of green. Her enchanting song once again draws me to Bristol Cove on the lake in the mountains.
We lay down together in the cool green grass, but I soon realize, once again it's an illusion. Like a mirage, in a blink of an eye, it all vanishes and this time she too is gone. I realize I've lost the faith, I must give up the quest and turn back, no longer sure of the way home.
The sun has set and in the darkness I cannot resist the urge to look back over my shoulder with ever step. It has become second nature to worried about her, I will always feel her pain and hunger, her loneliness in the void. I am overwhelmed with an alien concept and try to accept I no longer have the power to save her, even worse, I realize I never did.
At the same time I try to erase the image that she may have found the forest without me and is swimming in the cool clear water. I think "how weak of me to have given up" and in the knowledge that I will never see her again what am I to do with all the love I still have for her. It pours out onto the dry sand and evaporates without purpose.
The witness of my existence now gone, my heart is tormented by waves of sorrow, like the breakers of some ancient sea crashing on a rocky shore. The primeval granite is reduced to particles of sand, now long forgotten, so too will our story be relegated to a footnote, then fade on the parchment of time with each passing generation.
I pry upon the wind, hoping to hear her sweet voice one last time, the words of the promised land as she whispers, "I now know he truly love me". I imagine her weeping with the thought "how could I not have known all those years, we should have found paradise together". It was a leap of faith she was unable to take, inflected with an invisible wound, suffered alone in her cradle so many years ago, long before her happiness become the purpose of my life. When she or I, the last of what was once “us” departs this terrestrial existence, no one will say “they were in love and are together again”.
This is so beautifully written and described, about a very dark & painful disorder-on both sides. I'm sorry for the impossible battle you've endured and hope you find peace.
@@leopardsnlions thank you.
Beautifully written. However, it's not weak to give up, it's strong.
It's weak to throw your life away and integrity for a problem that you cannot solve.
@@jamesbalthes6353 is it?!
@Russell on the last part you made me cry, thank you for sharing your words, i understand you, even if for me is just a year, it feels like a lifetime, that i may will never have again cause i lost her, just like you. i hug you, and i wish you to heal from your pain, one day or another.
Man this is so painfully validating to hear. Having it laid out like this really helps see the cycle more holistically which helps see ahead. Otherwise, when you’re in it you’re on the ride till it stops
I literally have been struggling with this for so long that i burst into tears because good f*** I’m finally fINALLY understood, and i can put a name on it. This is exactly what my relationship looks like right now and it’s so extremely painful. Now i can go get help for it
I've been on the rough end of being in a relationship with a woman with bpd and it ruined 12 years of my life but one good thing that came out of it is I'm getting counselling for codepepency and without the 12 years of suffering I'm now taking steps forward in my life to become a better and stronger person but unfortunately for my bpd ex of 12 years she has a life time of suffering.
It's honestly enraging how i feel like I'm living life my own way independent from other people's lives but ACTUALLY I'm fitting it to the pattern of what my life looks like with BPD and I hate it
How exactly does one learn to love themselves if they don’t already? This seems like a puzzle with no solution.
To love someone is to accept them as they are in the moment. That doesn't mean that a particular behavior is "good", we are simply accepting ourselves and others as we are. We can offer compassion to ourselves, observe when our thoughts are negative and destructive and ask why we would treat ourself in that way. Love comes from a place of calm acceptance. We don't have to approve, just accept and let be.
Psychoanalysis. Self Compassion. Life experience. And positive risk taking.
I’ll never be able to love myself. My entire life is just a “try not to kill yourself challenge”.
@@AeonGreyh same! Self love is bs!
@@AeonGreyh exactly the same for me
may he RIP thank god for your wisdom you left behind
This was perfect
I could watch this over and over again and not grow tired of it. Such a spot on description of BPD
My Mother took care of my physical needs expertly, but I never felt loved. I constantly chased her approval and affection. I'm now married to someone I truly love, but who is very distant and oftentimes extremely critical.
:-(
It was only after my mum's death did I realized that she never once, in the 20 years that we had together did she hug, kiss or say that she loved me.
*But* I now acknowledge that she had her own problems that caused this and her issues are not mine to carry the rest of my life and it was a relief to finally be able to put them down thanks to DBT.
Me too…my mom always said she loved me, but I never really felt it. I used to either hate or love her sporadically. I never believe anyone who says they say they love me.
I can relate. I had clean cloths and food on the table, but I was invisible in a spititual sense.
Thank you for this amazing content
Plenty of people without BPD experience this same pattern. Very insightful video.
yes, they're called narcissists.
Great discription of the smothering in relationships.
It was like dealing with emotional whiplash with my ex with bpd. Never met anyone so damaged, so changeable and so cold at times. He would just end the relationship and go quiet for weeks/months and then come back like nothing happened. It was always doomed and I had to work hard to maintain my own emotional stability. I have a lot of compassion for him but pleased its in my rear view window.
My fiancé has BPD, and at the moment, he is not interested in getting professional help. He falls into the lower class below the poverty level. He has so many reasons why he can’t participate with professional service, and it breaks my heart that he’s going through all of these contrasts and chaos, and he only has me for support. I feel so powerless and useless sometimes. To the people with BDP, what inspired you to take a step toward getting the professional help you deserve?
Tried hanging myself after my ex broke up with me because I ran back to attention from my previous ex, he had noticed and told me I couldn’t follow boundaries or my word, I had lied about suicide attempts, medications, and my PTSD cause, and I told him out of guilt, impulsive decision, he told me he hoped I never dated anyone again, and it drove me to a point where I said “he is right, I’m unlovable, all I do is chaotic, my mind is a mess, it should become mush”, so I went to my closet and did it, couple minutes later I woke up, with a big scar on my neck, I passed out but my mom who had been going to the bathroom and wanted to check on me found me, as of now, the scar has healed, but my mom doesn’t trust me, i am to a point I live to live, walk to walk, but life feels so plain without attention; had to delete social média, and now with a therapist to see if I can get medication, because my quality of life has been dependent on relationships
Damn, I came here to feel better about myself, but sadly there are only people who had bad experiences with us in the comments. Wish they could understand it’s a disorder and we’re not monsters…
Not monsters at all my friend but the way you choose to play with others feelings is so sad and hard to accept 🫤
@@pitbullash you…DO realize that not every each of us play with other people’s feelings…?? Literally, the only most manipulative things I ever do is trying to get attention…
It’s a disorder that in some people with BPD can mean that they’re so self-involved that they ask an awful lot of other people around them. Which is ok as long as there is mutual respect and understanding, but in some cases it goes horribly wrong. The love hate cycle can be something the SO adapts to dealing with, because you know where it comes from, but it is very toxic and unhealthy to be in a relationship where things are shifting from black to white. It’s hell for the person with BPD but also extremely taxing on the partner. Especially if the person with BPD is also prone to looking into other people/ chasing that first high of falling in love. Then the cycle continues not within one relationship but with new people over and over again, leaving a lot of people in their wake damaged. Not saying every person with BPD is like this at all, but enough of them are that exes come to youtube to figure out wtf just happened.
For a person with BPD, it's a prolonged progress coping with NON inflicting pain on oneself.
I just did this and devalued other and wouldn't back down, disgusting toxic. I just took lorazapam to calm down.
My has bf been really good to me but there were many times when he would do or say something that I would the perceive to be unsafe ( I’m reality it wasn’t unsafe) but my mind can’t determine what’s a real threat and what isn’t. I always f up the best relationships because of this . My partners probably think the worst of me because of these problems I have but I just am literally unable to feel safe when being vulnerable or giving my heart out so I push everyone away. I wish I wasn’t like this . These people don’t deserve to be pushed away the way I’ve pushed them away and hurt them . I know all I’ve ever wanted since I was a young child was to feel loved and to give love and that just isn’t in the stars for me ig lol .
wow i watched this by chance and what he's describing is exactly what I've been doing for years and years
I have BPD. Coming from a very unstable home with an abusive narcissistic Mother. Despite years of therapy, I still find the pain can be excruciating. I really tried with DBT but it triggered me badly. If you happen to read this, can you suggest / recommend any other treatment modality? And, I had to self diagnose. Finally found a psychotherapist who diagnosed me with CPTSD. I will do whatever it takes to go into remission 🤷🏻♀️Oh and my happiest, least painful years were when I was an active parent to my now adult Sons. How fascinating
I've been in a long-term relationship with someone with BPD and have witness to cycle myself a couple times and this is a massively oversimplified version of the cycle process and the relationship. He doesn't mention the fact that when someone that doesn't have BPD is first entering the relationship they don't all feel swallowed up they feel love and sincerity and are immediately addicted to that person it gets to the devalued part of the cycle. Depending on the person this could just serve to make them and their own issues with self-esteem and self-worth person. That's what happened with me the first time I was in the cycle of being a favorite person from a BPD suffer. I had no clue what was going on and saw that it was all my fault until the cycle started over and then began again
As a borderline myself, he is completely right.
it all makes sense now
Sums it up.
Well, this explaind more than 100 things i watched and read about bordeline relationships
Ah, what he described was the classic _Favorite Person._ And oh, how everything hurts again.
all other youtube videos apart .. this man explained it all in 2:55 mins.. people who love them will forever have a story of an unrequited love .. moreso a story that they will never cld put a specific ending to.
thank you
Currently living with an abusive partner that has bpd.
He started therapy.
If it works then I'll be happy.
If nothing changes between us then I'll leave.
Made that decision last week, almost killed me in rage driving
Still love him, but that's not healthy and I hope I will fill this emptiness one day
This is so accurate. It is hell when you love someone, but they get into stages where they push you away - and not because of anything you've done. Just because of how they feel.
Part of my healing from a relationship with someone with bpd was recognizing what it was in myself that drew me to that kind of person in the first place. It's very easy to throw these labels around as a way of demonizing and avoiding responsibility for our half of the relationship. The honest reason I stayed was because I have an addiction to fantastically intense displays of love that made sitting through the chaos and pain worth it. And bpd people love so damn hard- at least while the love lasts. There was a hole in me that drew me to the hole inside them.
Spot on!
I lived with this for 4.5 years...
diagnosed with bpd: Great description John.
Fact 2 partners in a row. Second time around I was in so much denial that it could be happening twice. I kept thinking my new partner didn’t yell and scream at me so maybe it will pass and be all normal again soon. How wrong I was. No loud or physical abuse this time around it was just the manipulation and gaslighting that was so apparent. It wears you down over time trying to help them asking to both go see someone together but to no avail so in the end when I had no more energy left, holding onto my self worth I had to make the hard decision and from our last argument I / we chose no contact. I do miss and love her but now for my own happiness and maybe even hers I have to love her as a memory.
How long was the relationship?
@@abolisher 2.5 years
@@Paulroach6 wow that’s a long time man I hope your feeling much better now though unfortunately these individuals can only get better with medicine therapy and acceptance.
@@abolisher yeah it’s a tough road. It’s like I’m detoxing from my relationship. It will take time to filter this trauma bond but as they sine time heals all wounds.
@@Paulroach6 I feel your pain I was pursuing someone who had this when she first told me about it on our first date I didn’t really think much about it but as time went by I realized it was something I should have looked up that very first night. We were only 3 months in so not a long time but it definitely felt like it.
"You are drowning and I am here to save you but you have to stop panicking and thrashing about cause I am not drowning with you". Jordan Peterson
Thank you!
This is a poignant and eloquent film series. So true. I have CPTSD which is very similar in symptoms. How sad we can send people to the moon and back but fail at bringing up children normally.
Im in current relationship and I had an argument with my loved one and it was exactly how it was described here. But how to break that behaviour pattern? I don't want to lose my loved ones
im truly sorry if i open an old wound, but what did you and your partner learn 1 year later? Did it work out and if so how?
I simply have to ask because i currently love someone very precious to me and i so desperently want to change.
@@darthgandalf9485 I'm in a similar boat. I likely have undiagnosed BPD and my hysterical behavior has been the root of many of my arguments with my bf. It's usually very intense and I cool down faster then he does I guess because I'm used to it and because he often needs space and has trouble understanding what I think is helplessness and anger related to the situation. By the time I've reflected, it usually is already too late. It IS unfair to him. And it's weird how one small thing causes such trouble. It was particularly bad this one time. And I was ready to accept letting him go because I have been really unfair and it could be what's best for him and for me. On occasions when I'm not manic, I do my best to take care of him and things go well. But this one fight made me realize how much I've let BPD control many aspects of my life. So I asked him for another chance. Where I actively deal with BPD in tangible ways. No longer just philosophically but in proven ways. With DBT. With mindfulness. With therapy. People have overcome BPD and I'm determined to join that party.
My boyfriend gave me that chance. And it baffled me that anyone would be so kind and understanding. I love him a lot and I am determined to fix this.
I've realized my BPD has a lot of roots from the past but I'm choosing to separate that now and fully own up to my actions and my BPD. It's mine now and that's okay. It's mine now so I can and will fix it.
It's only been a few days since. But what's been helpful so far is going through Reddit r/BPD and r/dbtselfhelp (This post has many resources: www.reddit.com/r/dbtselfhelp/comments/6ujifl/self_help_workbooks_megapost/). It has helped to know what it's like for my boyfriend and family to experience my BPD which this video sheds light on: (ruclips.net/video/WoO4VMWjIuo/видео.html). It has been helpful to meditate (I've been using headspace). It has been helpful to use a journal. It has been useful to read of others who have succeeded. One of those that have succeeded on Reddit recommended a DBT workbook (www.amazon.com/Dialectical-Behavior-Therapy-Skills-Workbook/dp/1572245131) which I'm about to crack open soon myself. I also found a podcast on DBT on Spotify called "DBT weekly" that teaches skills that help.
I think it's important to let your loved one know what you are dealing with and to be self-aware enough to let them know what they might have to deal with as you navigate change.
Another important thing I've realized only recently is that it's not just about solving BPD in terms of your relationship but also in terms of how else it affects other aspects of your life. How you deal with family. How you accept change. How you need to find a sense of identity independent of your partner. It is many things. And the first step, as my boyfriend says, is to realize these things.
You have to remember that love is there between you and your loved ones. Even if you fail to perceive it. You have to trust that fully. And you have to remind yourself of that and of the pain you do not wish upon them.
I hope this long comment helps even in the slightest. I wish you all the best and I believe if we can just be disciplined and consistent enough and do this for us and those we love, we CAN overcome it.
@@danasy-ching5205 thank you so, so much for your comment
your kindness didnt go unnoticed and i will try the things you said
espacially the part where you said "not just thinking about it philosophically" hit home
i wish you the best
@@danasy-ching5205 You are such an Amazing and beautiful soul I just wanted to let you know your comment is so valuable specially as it is coming from a place of pure genuine love may you be infinitely blessed💜🌈
@@danasy-ching5205 I want to be where you are with my BPD.
Alexithymia, identity diffusion and engulfment /abandonment anxiety.
With a good consistant therapist this will be reduced (favorite person). Needing validation. Dbt and various rx can help. Naloxone can stop the pleasurable feeling after cutting or other self harm activities.
My gf has it , it’s sometimes a struggle like rn , she’s being quiet cold and distant with me , I’m a overthinker , have anxiety and depression . I feel rejected she’s given me reassurance but I don’t really believe it , I love her alot but sometimes I feel like it’s gonna end
It's a vicious cycle isn't it. My husband's ex-wife has suffered from BPD all her adult life and except for the cutting/self-harm stuff this explains her to a tee. After years of harassing us she seems to have calmed down and I hope she's found a good therapist like you who can help her understand why she ruined her marriage and get her onto the path to recovery and healthy self-esteem.
Did he divorce her?
@@qaissamkari5302 He did, but she was the one who initiated the separation, very suddenly and without warning, on New Year's Day. She'd seen a lawyer secretly to put the paperwork together so needless to say it came as a BIG shock. After a couple of years of her harassing him to reconcile he'd had enough and initiated the divorce.
@@valeriemcknight5608 many borderliners are irrational with their behaviour in different ways. I personally was married to one. I (initiated) divorced her, she dated a guy two months after the start of the divorce process. And a month later after her being with the new guy, she called me telling me that she doesn't know what to say but she doesn't think she will ever forget me or stop thinking about me. but she doesn't want to come back right now. I really do not get it? Do they always first value and end up with devaluing everyone? and will she ever come back to me?
@@qaissamkari5302 Sounds like she's weighing her options. If the new guy doesn't work out she wants to keep a foot in the door with you because Borderlines will always "hoover", i.e. after treating you horribly (devaluing and discarding) they'll do everything they can to suck you back into a relationship. My advice is don't fall for it otherwise you'll be back into the old cycle of idealize, devalue and discard.
@@valeriemcknight5608 Thank you for answering my question! I just want to ask you this last one: So if your saying borderlines always hoover you does that mean they always discard any person after they idealize them even if they were good towards them? like will they always discard the person they will start their relationship with even if they are really nice?
So....everything i dealt with was a lie?
I think some people should take a moment to distinguish between whether their ex partner was just a crappy person instead of saying "My ex with BPD used to chest on me". Them cheating isn't bc they have BPD, it's because they are crappy people.
With that being said, nobody's bad experience should be invalidated and I am sorry for what people have experienced. I just think it's NB to not put us under the same umbrella when the actions of someone was not due to them having BPD, it was just because they were shitty people in general.
What would be the situation where the person does NOT want the self harm to be discovered because it works to dissociate still, but everything else fits?
My goal is to understand BPD to be able to help my girlfriend and to be able to cope with the things that come with it
I would say one thing run!!! It’s not worth it man just watch eventually she’ll lose feelings randomly ghost you say she only wants to be friends.
@@abolisherThis erases any type of individuality. Just because you probably went through that with a past partner does not mean this person will. The second you realize people with mental disorders aren’t a monolith is the moment you gain some empathy for those actually struggling with their disorder their own damn selves.
@@taevionsmelanin8345 Mental health is VERY important in any relationship I can’t stress this enough.
It is a constant cicle of like to being born, and than to die again. The pain is there, always, happines rarely.
The way I wish I knew about this. I ended up hurting my ex fiancée by reacting to sumn she can not control. Although undiagnosed, I’ve been doing my research. My soul hurts for that girl and many alike.
I'm starting to talk to a girl that has BPD and TBH it's hard to see her mad/sad and all I want for her is to be ok then she gets mad at me trying to look out for her and I've done so much for her in such a short amount of time. It truly makes me think about how do I work around this and with her. But she doesn't make me feel better when I am getting yelled at or given attitude.
I know that she's very likely to be one of the most beautiful interesting people you met... But she'll end up destroy you.
No matter what you give her will never be enough., she'll be a bottomless pit where you throw all the love, care, sacrifices selflessness you can until you fall in it and this is the moment when she'll just tell you that she doesn't give a fuck and will try to date the guy she's been cheating on you with....
@@anatole2478 exactly man 💯% facts
@@jeffersondelira2706 just words from a guy who's now broken, in the pit, and rotting along with the skeletons of all her exes around me, hoping that at some point the pestilence will be so great that whoever approches her will know that she's just the place where gullible innocents are lured, fall and die...
So, your first post comment was 4 months ago., you got some update?
@@anatole2478damn bro, i dont know you but i want you to know. I've been there myself and i feel you man. We gotta be strong, its a fucked up world out there and some woman are totally insane. We men must support one another where we can. All the best to you man and keep your head up, your time will come and the right person is waiting for you its just a matter of time
@@Gekke_Gerrit94your comment lifted me up man...thanks mate....btw this world is fucked up indeed
I have bpd and I know my toxic symptoms well, I have self sabotaged mny relationships because I know how toxic I can be, I can be selfish but I know no other being should suffer my toxicity, sometimes the partner stays in the relationship hoping I would be better, I start trusting them and I do work on myself of course but its hard to manage all the time, I start believing that this partner understands me but after a year or so it gets too much for them and they leave, reinforcing the idea that I can't be loved, anyways now I just self sabotage before it gets serious so that neither me or them are hurt.
I am 42, I used to be needy but now I want to be alone. I dont even want to talk to family and friends. Is this how BPD goes? I can see myself being a loner in old age
how is it different than the relationship between 2 people with anxious and avoidant attachment styles? because in that relationship its the same dance/cycle which keeps on going. After an argument one partner moves away (avoids) and the other partner wants to get closer (anxious). Pulling one's hair also falls under self harm?
Can we get better? Often I feel I'm fighting a war in my mind.
not often from what i've read, find people who love you unconditionally and try to accept their love. Stay away from boyfriends too.
@@inspectasexy1264 I love my ex unconditionally but she’s pushed me away. I don’t know what else to do but stay gone.
Yes, completely ignore those saying otherwise. It’s garbage. Listen to Dr. Fox and find a healthcare provider who will treat you fully. It is a medical diagnosis and there are many routes to remission. You deserve a life full of loving people.
@@HeatherFaraMS exactly. Dr. Fox is the 🐐 for BPD.
After being in a relationship with someone long-term not only am I mentally damaged I feel totally used. I used to be very empathetic and social.
Now I could care less about anyone or anything. This shit is contagious.
Learn the signs! Save your life! Get out ASAP!
im 17 dealing with this.
i was mute from ages 8-11 and I would only talk if it was to lash out at a close family member. My teachers at school took note of this and sent me to the school counselor. She tried to help me, but my parents basically threatened her job if she kept helping me.
My sister thinks im bipolar and anytimes shes home from college she begs my religious non therapy believing parents to take me to therapy. of course they always say no.
I can’t tell if she’s has good intentions, or if she’s trying to treat me like an outcast. I know shes my sister but My brain choose the latter, as it usually does with most people. I lash out at her, my parents berate me and so i hide in my room.
I’m just so tired of constantly making friends and then becoming paranoid and backing away from friendships, and lashing out because of my suspicions and then feeling like a monster, and then trying to apologize and then the person doesn’t look at me the same, and I’m back to square one.
How can i just be a better friend and daughter and sister overall?
Find a way to go into therapy,without your parents knowing. Have your sister back you up if the parents fond out.. She is trying to break the generational curse, because your parents, at least for now, can not parent you right. The hope remains, but untill it comes true, find someone more competent. Nobody's perfect, parents are just humans after all, but working on oneself is a must.
I always scartche myself until it bleeds...
My God man, i just found out I have this. Reading these comments makes me feel like utter shit in my heart. I'm sorry I'm like this. I'm sorry for having this.
If you're not prepared it's a hand grenade to the psyche.
So true! I was with someone who I believe had BPD. He ended up leaving the planet about seven months later. I did not know what was wrong with him and he would not tell me what he was diagnosed with. So terribly sad because we in the beginning had a really good love!
I @@Bozpeep I believe it. Sorry for your loss.
I’ve never received a diagnosis for Borderline Personality Disorder, but it fits me to a T.
I need to talk to my psych about this.
Lest I fuck up again.
I have BPD and it's horrible diagnosed 8 years ago never had treatment I start march 3 over phone 📱. I attract the narcs
I have very bad trust issues and been very lonely in my teens and I tend to reject people before they reject me bcz in very sensitive so Idk if I have BPD but im similar in a lot of ways
I decided 20 years ago to just stay single and alone. Since then, I have grown so much because I have time and space to look deeper n deeper into myself. I do pai-dah to drive out the trapped emotions, then allow them to be, and then release them with love no matter what it is.
Taking the pain that cannot be described and turning it into something physical......that hit it perfectly, the moment my abandonment issues from my father took hold. It was highschool, my 2nd and least productive year at school. My girlfriend of two weeks broke up with me. It hit hard cause it was only my 2nd ever girlfriend and I tried like fucking hell too win her heart .....it was when I felt leperous, I didn't know how to describe what I am today then, all I knew was the pain inside had reached a point and I could not take it out on anyone else but myself because I knew, somewhere something had to be wrong with me to be this rejected already in my life. 40 years later and the behavior still shows itself on occasion. I don't hide it anymore, just wrap it up and go on.
After being in a relationship with someone with BPD, I relate to so many of the things he said the person with BPD feels. Is that normal?
thks
just run
This is so accurate. I was on the partner side of this. I still question my ability to love someone... Thankfully, she dumped my ass. Otherwise I would've been swallowed completely.
My ex cheated 3 times blamed bpd i get it but innocent people get really destroyed
Yes, this happens all the time. It's good to understand their problems, however, it seems like it destroys the non- BDP's life.
Often the BPD patient will develop an NPD defence structure to help them cope - thus all the lying and cheating that goes with NPD. BPD/NPD really is an awful combination.
Usually there is no intent to harm someone, even if it does happen. Just remember this is an illness, a broad one at that, and not everyone is the way you perceive your ex.
True... Its too much of pain.. And they jumps into toxic abusers and users too and that part is very difficult to handlle... Very painful...
If someone with PBD is starting to become dependent to your attention how can you properly handle the situation with out hurting them?
borderline always sound to me like several different conditions
I’m curious about everyone’s opinion about borderline as a diagnosis? Is it actually a personality disorder, or more of a trauma response? Are we just pathologizing the victim?
Personality disorder, as they lack any sort of self. They dont know who they are. Its much more of a mess than just rauma response. Its simply that the trauma happened so early, that it totally stunted the emotional growth. They are stuck at age of 1-2. Go check out "still face experiment", it borderline in a nutshell. Thats what they are doing their whole life, trying to get that connection to their mother. And raging if its cut.
@@Nobody-Nowhere You've just acknowledged that it is in fact a trauma response but that happened so early in life that affected the person's construction as whole.
For a BPD diagnosis 5 out of 9 "symptoms" need to register. Why 5 out of 9? or why 9 and not any other number? Well cause people in charge of DSM voted like that.
Identity disturbance is one of the traits and it doesn't happen with all diagnosed BPD.
I think both and mine includes abandonment issues as well.
Yeah, l flipped back and forth a bit on this initially. You have to love someone suffering to understand how it is absolutely genetic. Their amygdala dominance leads to other brain centers not functioning or developing. There are physical difference in structure. While everyone’s brain works the same way, theirs is misfiring to the point of fight flight collapse. It’s similar to addiction in presentation…they are almost hooked like a junky to the emotional rollercoaster. If things are quiet their brain codes danger! With medication they can get out of fight flight exhaustion and retrain the brain over a couple years, but they are wired so well in that region that they will always be more affected by slight sleep irregularities, trauma, and drama. You don’t need to have a traumatic backstory for diagnosis, but as you can imagine, they will tend to have one because their brain codes slight eye twitching as danger, so parents feel the brunt…to the sufferer it can feel like living with a dagger twisting in your heart…BPD needs comprehensive medical intervention because the bullshit “talk to a counselor” and focus on events coded as trauma compounds issues and makes them feel at fault..suicide is too often the way out of sheer constant physical pain.
Bpd in relationships is really hard - my relationship is going very well but only because I am very self aware of it and my partner is incredible - I’ve had relationships before that were nothing like this.
But the narrative of bpd forming from a cycle of over investment in relationships doesn’t chime with me. I was exceptionally good at masking and no one even knew I had depression until I told them, although a couple suspected. I always struggled with knowing my life was exceptionally privileged and yet I felt so profoundly in pain - my parents were supportive in everything, they were progressive, I never experience trauma and they dedicated a lot of their lives to me.
I would be very interested if there’s any causal evidence to this narrative or if it’s just a conjectural rationalisation of the consequences of so called “bpd”; as it seems entirely possible that this occurs at a more subtle level and people in this bracket manifest themselves through relationships like this.
There’s also an interesting question about whether it is “our fault” or not for our mood swings. On one level, of course it isn’t, we don’t control it. Yet no one controls their mood swings. I think philosophically that we ARE our so called “bpd” and we have to accept that, it’s not something external to us and treating it so relies on an impossible idea of the “normal human”.
That doesn’t mean we’re dicks right; the bar for effective social interaction in the long term is perhaps higher for us than others, but that’s a systematic issue of neurotypical heuristics in culture, and so the burden is, at this current moment, on us and our loved ones to form a new type of relationship where our divergent sense of self and mood swings are accommodated to maximise the love we’re capable of.
Whether that is an imperative for collective action on social advocacy I’ll let you decide, but the fact is is that bpd people clearly struggle with conventionally defined relationships, and going more fundamental and asking what each of us want from a relationship, while often immensely difficult, has at least worked for me. But then I’m with an aro autistic girl so straight culture isn’t so much an issue xo
Good luck is all I’m going to say
I am dying taking care of my mother that clearly has borderline personality disorder it is a nightmare and it's her way or no way it's her way or you don't love me you don't want to take care of me because I said stop calling me 94 times in 2 hours because I didn't pick up the phone that means to her that I'm abandoning her how the hell am I supposed to deal with this
How do i fix myself?
Fancy way of saying those with BPD are simply emotional immature perpetual toddlers. I don't like any body who deals with this. Only love and respect to survivors of those who have had to deal with the nightmare that are these people.
We with BPD and other similar disorders are so beautiful and misunderstood and artistic and emotionally caring. Sad people don’t educate themselves on it.