The answer is both. Some are objectively snake oil, some are objectively helpful tools. Then there are the ones that may be snake oil for some, but essential for others, making it a matter of taste. I’d also argue beyond that, there are the “cool but unnecessary” plugins. Stuff that’s more of a “nice to have” rather than a “need to have”. Not inherently hurtful, nor inherently helpful.
Theres some obvious "you dont need this" plugins but many are exactly what you said, time savers. Imagine telling a painter they're wasting money on purple when they could just mix Blue and Red every time they need a dab🤣
@@ryanyates8090 its all about output at the end of the day. I dont really care what a person does if they make great work... spend hours using analyzers, use hardware, use plugins doesnt matter. Buying plugins constantly isnt the answer but if you have a stack that save you time and you like them, power to you. The same with art supplies/paint if you want to go there... couldnt care less how a painter got there in the end.
So does that thought processing apply to hardware also? Because that is a completely limited sound which costs way more than plugins… is that talentless to rely upon a piece of gear to give you an instant color/vibe? Everyone has to figure what works for them in the end!
@@spinlightstudios in the same context absolutely. If a painter can’t turn two primary colors into a secondary or doesn’t think that knowledge is valuable or worth their time, owning all the purples in the world won’t make you a better painter. Now just switch out paint for processing. I’m not saying plug ins and hardware are useless or unnecessary at all. I guess the easiest way to explain what I’m trying to say is I love watching live mixing videos and the people who I watch consistently and learn the most from tend to use pretty basic processing and creative thinking. I’d say at least 50% of the channels I discover and try watching I shut off within the first few minutes because their mix is littered with plug ins and I already know from watching the people producing hits that whatever is going on here is steering me in the wrong direction.
It's not the plugins what AP mastering called a scam, it's the marketing behind it. I think it's also important that he is critical about this whole thing, it's good to understand what a plugin does, and how it works, so you don't have to buy a specific EQ to get that airy shelf sound for example. Technically they are a scam, since they all work the same way with different GUI's and/or added saturation, but the companies who are selling them act like if every single plugin would be a miracle from God. So if they work the same more or less, the companies aren't angels who can provide us these magic boxes, they are just algorithms, codes, ones and zeros. Just don't get him wrong (AP). Yeah, 100 bucks is not a lot, for americans, and for people who has money, but not everyone can just buy a plugin like that. His message was: don't buy unnecessary plugins, or don't buy anything unnecessary in that matter, you can work with what you have, your focus should be on knowledge and experience and understanding. Which is a very important message. What he is selling is online courses, which is probably more useful than buying 160 plugins from XY companies.
Oh yeah, look I’m not bashing him! He put a ton of effort and research into and I also said I agree that by matching those parameters you will achieve a similar/same sound. I’m also not advocating that your should buy every plugin under the sun - but I don’t think owning a handful of third party plugins means you’ve been scammed - perhaps if you’re buying plugins all the time you may have a problem 😬 but some plugins just sound good and make things FAST. That’s got some value in it too
Here’s my beef with AP , I’ve listened to countless professionals talk about difference in sound between plugins and NOT for marketing to the plugins they are using. Michael brauer a and b the bx ssl 9000 to his real console and said it was exactly the same and that’s just one example , these guys have ears and minds far superior than ours with the decades of experience to back it. But to his point I agree with the message. Get good at the tools. If these were a scam it would’ve been discovered a decade ago from the professionals that moved from analog.
I bought tons of plugins at first…. And now I use maybe 10 at a push (chiefly a Waves SSL channel strip). Today I felt a need to mess with my master bus chain. Was using very little EQ on there, deliberately. Ended up trying all my pultec emulations out (yes, I have about four 🫣) - before settling on the Logic stock linear phase EQ to recreate the basic pultec effect, and it was better. That surprised me a bit, but the results are ace!
Gidday Rhys. Wonderfully said mate and I agree with you 110 percent. What nobody has spoken about yet in this debate is that the best plugin EQs and compressors are actually convolution-based. Yepp I'm one of those Acustica fan boys and for good reason. You won't find better sounding EQs all round, and over the last few years they have nailed their compressors as well. El Rey 2 (their RCA BA-6) is wonderful and FAST to operate. Amber 4 Ultra's EQ is sublime and within 5 seconds I have an acoustic guitar tonal adjustment nailed. The Amber 4 Ultra comp is top notch as well. Jam, one of their saturators I couldn't live without. Again, a 5 second fiddle for a world-class sound. 99 percent of Acustica's plugins are convolution-based, which I know from experience take a mammoth amount of work to create a useable plugin. To put companies like AA in this "pot" of scamming plugin companies actually makes me angry. We have enough broad generalisations in the world, and for someone to say that ALL plugin companies are a scam is total nonsense. If there is logic in this debate, why do we all drive different cars, eat different foods, wear different shoes etc. Like yourself I work beyond full time in this industry. I am so busy I don't have time to piss fart around de-bunking bullshit theories, I'm too busy earning heaps doing what I love, and making hundreds of people happy as I do it.
Love it mate, appreciate your input. The biggest thing is does it get the job done? Does it make it quick? Does it make it enjoyable? Does it sound good? Really doesn’t matter if you can do it with other plugins - the fact is you may not get the same sound or creative edge that a particular sounding plugin will deliver.
You've made some excellent points, Rhys. People also tend to ignore the fact that a lot of these plugins react differently over time and/or depending on the frequency
Good topic! People really need to make use of the trials/demo of plugins before spending. I do agree, when working fast having less options but good options will help speed things up.
Basically, the algorithmic emulation of hardware components is pioneering work from 20 years ago, and the source code is mostly open-source. I heard that most plugin companies use this code, develop a special GUI, and sell it for high prices. It's more about innovations, like Soothe or something special that offers value, but normal EQ or compression plugins are mostly the same by design. Hardware makes the real difference for me. Plugins are important, but I just need one of a kind for each case.
There’s no denying you can get roped into having too many plugins. You don’t need 5 different types of 1176 plugins… but I’m pretty sure I do 😂 but that’s me problem not a plugin company problem 😂 I agree it has to be something special at this point to draw me in - as I have everything I need! A mix of hardware and plugins is what works for me!
There are plenty of amazing free plugins out there that really are amazing and do the job. That's where I've learned and spent my time. Plugins4free has amazing stuff gave the chance to learn using different types of plugins and what I liked/needed before spending money. I have proq3 but I also use Tokyo dawns nova eq and it's been amazing.
Good video, love your point. I've seen that topic on a different chanel, where author tries to tell us that plugins are scam because he made free tool which you can tweak and achieve desire sound. I found your explanation close to my. To be owner of different plugins can save you time and when you need specific sound you just go for plugin which can give you quick what you are looking for. It is so simple to grab 1175 when you know that you looking that type of sound rather than know right threshold, input release times and so on. Specially to non experienced people, who are learning yet. And to be fair it is so obvious that if you have digital, flexible eq you can recreate every type of eq gear. All what is mathemeticialy measurable can be recreated that way.
Exactly! It’s not so much about the fact that with some time and the right tools you can recreate any plugin - cause who has time to do that - it’s about knowing your tools and being able to select them as required, thus saving time and keeping the creative flow going!
@@spinlightstudiosthat's the point! I think the problem is not with plugin scam but in ability to try them all. Because it's so more or less affordable many people are willing to pay for them. Then they have a tone of plugins, they never tried and never used. The same guilt is in guitar players, they buy different amps, different guitars, when the tone is mostly in their playing style. It's is not about the last 5% guitar tone or overall mix tone. It's more about to realize that to achieve good sounding guitar tone, you need to be good in playing guitar. The same as a mix engineer, you need to know your craft, know how to find problems in the source material, and how to managed with the tools you have to solve this problem. Many experienced engineers uses a limited range of plugins because they know it well. For them there is no need to look for another eq plugin, when they tweak the knobs in ssl chanel strip plugin for few years and the plugins is reliable. There is more sense for me to look for the smart kind of plugins, which can address particular task quicker and be in time with news but no with another eq :) Anyway I found myself that buying a bunch of plugins was for me a part of learning process. I was curious why one plugin behaves one way and another plugin behaves differently. For me it was so much fun in learning that and I don't care how much money I have spend to achieve that knowledge. But can't imagine where could be fun if the only compressor I would have from the beginning of learning process must be only stock compressor. From where takes the inspiration, knowledge, when all what need is to dial milliseconds? Do you find something interesting in numbers? No specially but you find so much fun know that bust and cut in pultec behaves certain way. There is no common sense to add and adjust in the same frequency in reqular eq plugin, but knowing that you can do it in pultec is pure knowledge and fun. The fun is what is all about when it comes to music. Have a great day!
Wish there was a way I could sell my plugins for 50% off. The problem with companies is that they shut down soon & the plugins exist only for a few years.
My issue is that we live in an industry that teaches tips and tricks and not enough on fundamentals and using reference songs properly. I'm currently teaching someone these things, but once they see a "tips and tricks " video they are asking questions about these method's and ideas like (a pultec example) "why is attenuating and gaining around the same frequency giving xyz results?" And giving the answer is awesome for them, but they are always left with more questions once they see another video maybe doing the 'opposite'. People should have a solid understanding that transients = excitement, managing dynamics = competitive loudness, automation = depth, distortions and other fx = mood changers. Without a clear foundation or a lot of resources on this topics, and more plugins keep coming out makes the whole industry come off as a scam because people don't know what they don't know.
Stock plug ins are usually good enough. However there are several out there that are special. For example I do shoot outs on similar style plugs. Townhouse buss comp vs ssl bus comp vs shadow hills. They set at similar setting, sound drastically different. Also some work better on certain mixes. I went down the rabbit hole as did with preamps. After a while once you learn how to use ears those other 100 plug ins just sit there and I forget I have em. Everyone has the top 5-10 plugs they use. Familiarity is hard to break.
I think the point of the video in question is that with his limited programming ability he was able to create an all in one utility that’s capable of the same characteristics of thousands of dollars worth of plug ins. A single plug in with every 1176 revision would be more efficient but wouldn’t be extracting as much money from you as 5 separate plug ins. Understanding and learning the inner workings of utilities and the differences between them is time consuming but it will only make for a better engineer.
My theory is theyre always some new plugin but its not different than any other time in music with any other gear. Ive got a few plugins to cover my bases that I know and use and dont need 10 different versions of the same thing. Get 1 or 2 great conpressors, channel strips etc whatever you know, enough to do your job well and youll be perfectly fine and happy.
One of the problems is that when I do trials I have no idea what sounds good to me. Even if my ear is somewhat developed and ready, my past self has run out of trials... I have found some of the right tools through your channel, I knew the BX 4000E is a classic, but I have realized the value. Thank you.
They just add their own sound when you run a signal through them. And some plugins have more control over side chain and wet signal options. Which I like.
Well said bro. That youtuber that did a recent video about plugin scam was offering another plugin he developed. I watched for a while and it was like... yawn, another click bait video of a guy trying to get smoke by dissing other companies and aimed to people that, maybe, really don't understand much about plugins and hardware yet. I too also need a couple of different 1176 for different scenarios. Same with tape, saturation, etc. Keep up the good work mate.
Imagine that you are going to work and there is a fallen tree in the middle of the road, probably broken by the strong wind. What do you do, do you return home and stop going to work or are you looking for another way, an alternative? It is the same with these algorithmic emulations from these famous algorithms that were lucky in the past to be used by creative producers and becoming popular today in this way. It is a psychological prison not to conceive that you can create something beautiful without going out of patterns, Cubase and Logic have better quality eqs than most on the market for example, these 2 daws have plugins that do not require out of the box.
Me and my 1189 plugins feel attacked!🤣 I had to make a favorites folder to eliminate getting lost. It will be interesting to see where the future ai takes sounding like diodes and transformers.
I agree with you 100%. I thought the same when I seen those videos. I don't care if you can recreate plugins. I'm a sound engineer and I need to move fast. I have alot of hardware and plugins. If I grab a plugin and it gives the sound I'm looking for, that's all I care about. Just because you can copy a plugin doesn't mean a thing. The plugin companies do the work to give us an alternative to buying the hardware. And there's other things to consider alot of plugin companies make advanced version of the gear doing things the hardware cannot do. Like Eli's Arouser plugin does way more than the Distressor hardware. And Arturia's plugins have an extra panel on each plugin with features that are not on the hardware. Plugin are not a scam. They give us tools alot of times with extra features that make our job easier and faster. Most plugins are worth the money, just like my hardware is worth the money. Anything that does what you need to do and improves your workflow is worth the money. Real mix engineers don't care how a plugin is made as long as it does what it's suppose to do we don't care about anything else. Some people have to much time on their hands, that's obvious. But I don't, time is money.. Great video, you said exactly what I said when I first seen those videos. I'm glad you made this video, you represent most of us with your view of this.. Great Vid. 🙂🙂🙂👍👍👍
I think the whole point is to really ask yourself if you need another EQ or compressor. I have tons of them, but I only really use the same 3 of each most of the time. Marketing is really strong in making you believe that this new thing will change the whole game (see oeksound's bloom), but we need to remember that a good mix isn't new at all, what we have can achieve that. Also, kinda crazy take, but I really tried to enjoy Kirchhoff EQ and the Cenozoix compressor, but they really don't click with me. I'd rather pull my Pulsar 1178 than the FET algo in Cenozoix. Same for EQ, if I want the SSL, I get better results with the SSL. Those two plugins are very open-ended, and open-endedness more often than not results in bad mixing. Working on the constraints of the hardware will hardly suck. I see a lot of people using Pro-Q and Pro-C as their first plugins, and it's no wonder when they quit because they can't make anything sound good.
Yeah man! Plugins like proQ3 can be dangerous because it’s so easier to over EQ and chase frequencies etc whereas a good ssl channels strip makes you listen more and think less and just be more Musical with the choices you make.
If people spent as much time leaning to write a good song and powerful lyrics as they did acquiring gear, it would be a more effective use of their time. That being said, I'm a total sucker for gear and I've spent thousands on plugins, guitars and pedals. So I'm like a televangelist that was just caught with hookers and drugs in a cheap motel room: a total hypocrite.
😂😂😂 whatever inspires you! I’ve bought instruments that I’ve used a handful of times but wrote a sick song on it.. new sounds help inspire us! Even if sometimes it costs us 😂
@@spinlightstudios Yeah mate, I hear that. It's part of the fun if I'm being honest. But there DOES come a point where the law of diminishing returns slaps us across the face for sure. I have stopped buying plugins but I spent about 3k before I learned that lesson.
I better buy plugin than using the same one over and over just to try and match what I want to get. For example, if I want the "maag air band like" sound, I'll grab the maag eq, not the pro Q 3 and try to match using plugin doctor to go back to the session and recreate that curve, best way to waste time is to do that. Yes I could learn all types of curves, do preset etc etc… but as professionnal, some clients want to see the plugin, they do have that psychology things that it's the maag sound (staying with that first example). Same for anything else. Obviously some plugin are "meh", can be good one time, then fall in the abyss of unused plugin (I don't want to tell how much are in there). The big problem is not buying plugins, we do what we want with our money. The problem is company marketing a new plugin as the new banger we all need everytime cause it has something new, while it does not and is just a new gui from an older plugin (hello PA just to name one…). This is snake oil, or marketing an other compressor, now with 32x oversampling, while all others only have 16. this is some serious bs to me.
tools help you make stuff more quickly. Sometimes the journey is the destination and we get stuck cork sniffing and in a loop testing the 100’s of pirated plugins we have 😂😂😂
I have seen the videos in question and a lot of the answer videos. I think it’s a workflow thing as well. The same thing can be said about visual art. Sure, I can mix 3 colors to get the right shade of blue I need. Or I could just… have that shade ready to go? Ultimately although a lot of plugs are just marketing BS the bare essentials will give you what you need in a timely manner. Can I just download Tokyo Labs EQ and be done with it? Sure! But sometimes I just need a certain sound and I don’t want to spend 35 minutes to get it. Time is money afterall.
Yes, this is the point I was hoping to convey - it’s just about quick workflow and getting results quickly - but also giving some inspiration to the process. Totally think everyone should unsubscribe from plugin companies 😂 if they message you every week about a sale - remove the temptation 😂
Agreed, sure you can match curves and dial in a similar sound, it's NOT easy and intuitive. Most of this stuff is about workflow for me, as it seems like it's for you. I earn my living with these tools and keep a full calendar. I need to move quickly and part of that is knowing which tools are best for which job. This is all very subjective!
Agreed, it’s very much about what works for you - but I do agree you don’t need to buy every EQ and Compressor plugin! A few choice options is all you need :)
Some are snake-oil - but some are decent but clunky. Early on I bought a bunch of Waves plugins. I never use them. If I could sell the plugins I rarely use, 2/3 of my plugins would be gone. Plugins I use all the time: *FabFilter* ProQ 3, Pro MB, Pro R2 *Neural* Plini *UAD* 1176, LA-2A, Bus Comp *Kiive* Distinct Pro, NFuse *Toontrack* Superior Drummer 3. I'd buy all of these again if I lost them in a crash. I think it comes down to workflow. With something like an 1176, you know exactly what you're going to get and you don't have to think about it. ProQ 3 and Kiive NFuse are the same. I get results immediately.
I don't think most plugins are "snake oil" but the part I regret in my purchases is the duplication. That's not the manufacturer's fault but it's mine. You get caught up in the slight variations of an eq or compressor and you see all of the videos of engineers showing off the latest and greatest, so you think that gives you a leg up on the competition. I only needed one good 1176, LA-2A, Pultec EQ, Neve channel strip, etc.
Very true mate! The other thing is plugins can definitely inspire you to achieve a sound you may not have come to on your own - using an eq with certain curves or a compressor that reacts a certain way may be just what you’re looking for. I know everyone is like “you can just recreate these sounds with basic plugins” but that disregards the instant sound/effect you may achieve from using a certain plugin and you go “oh yeah that’s awesome”. But yes - it’s best to try and avoid getting duplicates of plugins - easier said than done sometimes though.
@@spinlightstudios Yeah I’ve tried to use one of each “flavor” of an item like EQ, compressors, etc and then stick to it. My Logic plugin manager is ridiculous.
I've spent at least 5-6k on plugins and over time as I slowly get better at mixing, I only use a selected hand full of those plugins lol while the rest are now collecting dust! Yes I've also been sucked into the GUI pit of "wow it looks good, then so will my mix lol" train your ears not your eyes 👍
Definitely train those ears up. Truth be told you only need a select few good plugins to get it all going - but some plugins do inspire you to mix differently - which in itself can be a valuable tool when needed.
Analog gear does sound better, a lot of the time. Not always, but I would say most of the time. It lets one work quickly (after you go through the royal pain in the ass of getting it all set up and configured, with converters and a patchbay). Once thats all done though, its usually a big sweet spot in terms of settings, and tends to be more flattering and musical than an emulation. As far as the end listener not noticing the difference- I would disagree. Sure, one analog compressor on one single track in a mix isnt going to be a gamechanger; but thats not the best place to start anyway. A solid mix bus chain WILL often sound better and more natural than a corresponding plugin one. Then, after that slowly adding great quality processors can often contribute to incremental sound benefit… assuming you even like the flavor of analog gear. I would also say- as far as ROI - there are worse things to buy. If you buy a used CL1B for example, and wait to get a little bit of a deal on one (they can definitely be found if you can be just a bit patient), then - if you decide to part ways with it at some point - you can almost be sure not to lose any money, at all. In fact there is a good chance you could stand to make a buck or two. So its a better investment financially speaking than lets say, clothes…or even a new car.
For sure I get that - my mix bus chain makes a world of difference - but with a few choice plugins I’ve been able to recreate it pretty closely too! But I still prefer my hardware :) the biggest difference is using some Hardware while tracking - good performance/mics/pres/ maybe a touch of EQ and compression and you have a way better starting point with some flavour already added. That’s a different topic and a WAY bigger investment that a handful of plugins though :)
To be fair, the only things that will make a song popular and make money is 1. If it's a good or great song. 2. If there is effective marketing 3 Cultural association or relevance. Most releases have a good enough mix. A great or even superb mix has no real impact on sales of music. Saying this is definitely going to annoy a lot of people, but it's without doubt, true. A bad mix has never hurt a great song in terms of sales, ask the 1980's. AI is coming around the bend and you can already get free OK'ish mastering done, it won't be long until it's in a state that AI can mix to a commercial level for free and then all this plugin stuff will be moot. Another controversial comment I would say is that it's great for musicians, artists and composers/ writers. they don't have to dump their entire financial future into production, studio time and mastering then into a lottery of whether anyone will buy it in numbers great enough to pay for all that stuff. Whether you like it or not, time's been called on this industry. Here's hoping for the death of Spotify as well. Spotify fu**ing hates musicians, but loves the money they screw them out of, just like those labels do (although Spotify is largely owned by the labels).
I own both hardware and plugin and I’m also a duped customer 😂 I see the value in both - all just tools that help make creating music fun and inspiring
But in your DAW you have almost all the compressor and eq you need. Logic have all the classic Compressor and Eq. And Bitwig have great plug ins , they are really good. so why buy so many plug ins.
I think the truth, like with most things, lies somewhere in the middle. Having tools to make your job quicker and easier is not a scam. Charging $250 for an eq or compressor is in many cases.
I just go for the free ones lol or stock plugin, just work with what I got… or check out the trails for the short time. It’s a home studio atm. PS this a touchy subject mate, don’t go trump on us and let’s make analog great again!
Hahaha I love analog 🥰 but also know that having a few good EQ and compressor plugins is not an issue - you definitely don’t need every EQ and comp plug that gets released though 😂
Why do you say the hardware will absolutely sound better? Better in what way? Why would that be? I know you can definitely get much more consistent QC from unit to unit in software of course, and any parameter you are going for you could more accurately get in software, so it seems to be a weird claim. Its a lot like these amps vs modeller claims
This is more a hardware vs plugin discussion - where I am absolutely advocating for plugins here vs the price point of hardware. And plugins can do more - load a stereo version of it - have unlimited instances etc loads of pros. But no denying in my opinion that some hardware just sounds awesome. Doesn’t mean I won’t use a plugin version. A lot of the time it seems to just be a personal preference - but take my Audioscape Opto for example - it sounds so much better than any of my LA2A plugins and I can push it harder while tracking and it still sounds great - I don’t feel the same about the plugin versions when I start to push them harder - particularly on a vocal it’s not the same. But will I still use the plugins? Of course, they are still good - but I work hybrid so I’m always implementing some level of outboard gear into my mixes because I love what it does. I also love amps and amp sims - I use both cause they are both awesome tools - sometimes an amp sim works better, other times a real amp is what is needed. I don’t really have any bias - I just care about getting a good result.
So glad to see this one on here. So many right answers, so many wrong answers, but hopefully people will realize its important to know what they're getting
God you guys are deluded, the guy who made the scam videos is 100% correct. You are wasting money you instead could invest in hardware or taking real face to face mixing courses with professionals in your town.
I think it’s a bit of a reach to think that a couple hundred $ spent on compressor and EQ plugins equates to racks of hardware. A handful of useful plugins is not going to break the bank. I totally agree you shouldn’t buy every plugin with a flashy GUI. But the amount I’ve spent on EQ/comp plugs over the years I’ve been doing this wouldn’t even buy me a warm audio compressor 😂 if you wait you can pretty much get any plugin on sale too.
@@JoeyFTL hey man - we are talking about compressors and EQs! Of course all of my plugins are worth way more than that - But they all have a purpose - like melodyne etc fab filter prol2 is a great limiter not part of this discussion. All of my plugin purchase for all types of plugins - EQ, comp, saturation , limiters, tuning, reverb etc sure I could own a few more pieces of gear - but not that many - maybe one cl1b and I’d have no good method to tune vocals 😂 But the point here is EQ and compressors - not all plugins. I think I have never paid more than $15 for a plugin alliance plugin lol they used to do loyalty vouchers and cheap deals and you get their plugs dirt cheap before they went subscription. Same for pretty much any plugin I own - waited for good sale.
Are plugin companies selling you snake-oil or useful tools?
Good question
I believe I have purchased plugins for the wrong reasons in the past when I didn’t know what I was looking for. Now I have exactly what I need
Selling 365 parameters compressor for 19€. Some people think it is stupid, other are saying it change their life.
The answer is both.
Some are objectively snake oil, some are objectively helpful tools. Then there are the ones that may be snake oil for some, but essential for others, making it a matter of taste.
I’d also argue beyond that, there are the “cool but unnecessary” plugins. Stuff that’s more of a “nice to have” rather than a “need to have”. Not inherently hurtful, nor inherently helpful.
useful tools
Theres some obvious "you dont need this" plugins but many are exactly what you said, time savers. Imagine telling a painter they're wasting money on purple when they could just mix Blue and Red every time they need a dab🤣
Perfect analogy 😂 just recreate it every time you want to use 😩
Which is the more talented painter? The one that can make his own shades of purple when needed or the one that needs to buy them?
@@ryanyates8090 its all about output at the end of the day. I dont really care what a person does if they make great work... spend hours using analyzers, use hardware, use plugins doesnt matter.
Buying plugins constantly isnt the answer but if you have a stack that save you time and you like them, power to you. The same with art supplies/paint if you want to go there... couldnt care less how a painter got there in the end.
So does that thought processing apply to hardware also? Because that is a completely limited sound which costs way more than plugins… is that talentless to rely upon a piece of gear to give you an instant color/vibe?
Everyone has to figure what works for them in the end!
@@spinlightstudios in the same context absolutely. If a painter can’t turn two primary colors into a secondary or doesn’t think that knowledge is valuable or worth their time, owning all the purples in the world won’t make you a better painter. Now just switch out paint for processing.
I’m not saying plug ins and hardware are useless or unnecessary at all. I guess the easiest way to explain what I’m trying to say is I love watching live mixing videos and the people who I watch consistently and learn the most from tend to use pretty basic processing and creative thinking. I’d say at least 50% of the channels I discover and try watching I shut off within the first few minutes because their mix is littered with plug ins and I already know from watching the people producing hits that whatever is going on here is steering me in the wrong direction.
It's not the plugins what AP mastering called a scam, it's the marketing behind it. I think it's also important that he is critical about this whole thing, it's good to understand what a plugin does, and how it works, so you don't have to buy a specific EQ to get that airy shelf sound for example. Technically they are a scam, since they all work the same way with different GUI's and/or added saturation, but the companies who are selling them act like if every single plugin would be a miracle from God. So if they work the same more or less, the companies aren't angels who can provide us these magic boxes, they are just algorithms, codes, ones and zeros. Just don't get him wrong (AP).
Yeah, 100 bucks is not a lot, for americans, and for people who has money, but not everyone can just buy a plugin like that.
His message was: don't buy unnecessary plugins, or don't buy anything unnecessary in that matter, you can work with what you have, your focus should be on knowledge and experience and understanding. Which is a very important message. What he is selling is online courses, which is probably more useful than buying 160 plugins from XY companies.
Oh yeah, look I’m not bashing him! He put a ton of effort and research into and I also said I agree that by matching those parameters you will achieve a similar/same sound. I’m also not advocating that your should buy every plugin under the sun - but I don’t think owning a handful of third party plugins means you’ve been scammed - perhaps if you’re buying plugins all the time you may have a problem 😬 but some plugins just sound good and make things FAST. That’s got some value in it too
Here’s my beef with AP , I’ve listened to countless professionals talk about difference in sound between plugins and NOT for marketing to the plugins they are using. Michael brauer a and b the bx ssl 9000 to his real console and said it was exactly the same and that’s just one example , these guys have ears and minds far superior than ours with the decades of experience to back it. But to his point I agree with the message. Get good at the tools. If these were a scam it would’ve been discovered a decade ago from the professionals that moved from analog.
I bought tons of plugins at first…. And now I use maybe 10 at a push (chiefly a Waves SSL channel strip). Today I felt a need to mess with my master bus chain. Was using very little EQ on there, deliberately. Ended up trying all my pultec emulations out (yes, I have about four 🫣) - before settling on the Logic stock linear phase EQ to recreate the basic pultec effect, and it was better. That surprised me a bit, but the results are ace!
Been loving your channel brother. You are right on on this one! Diggin' your perspective all around.
Thanks man! It’s good to be objective on these subjects!
Gidday Rhys. Wonderfully said mate and I agree with you 110 percent. What nobody has spoken about yet in this debate is that the best plugin EQs and compressors are actually convolution-based. Yepp I'm one of those Acustica fan boys and for good reason. You won't find better sounding EQs all round, and over the last few years they have nailed their compressors as well. El Rey 2 (their RCA BA-6) is wonderful and FAST to operate. Amber 4 Ultra's EQ is sublime and within 5 seconds I have an acoustic guitar tonal adjustment nailed. The Amber 4 Ultra comp is top notch as well. Jam, one of their saturators I couldn't live without. Again, a 5 second fiddle for a world-class sound. 99 percent of Acustica's plugins are convolution-based, which I know from experience take a mammoth amount of work to create a useable plugin. To put companies like AA in this "pot" of scamming plugin companies actually makes me angry. We have enough broad generalisations in the world, and for someone to say that ALL plugin companies are a scam is total nonsense. If there is logic in this debate, why do we all drive different cars, eat different foods, wear different shoes etc. Like yourself I work beyond full time in this industry. I am so busy I don't have time to piss fart around de-bunking bullshit theories, I'm too busy earning heaps doing what I love, and making hundreds of people happy as I do it.
Love it mate, appreciate your input. The biggest thing is does it get the job done? Does it make it quick? Does it make it enjoyable? Does it sound good? Really doesn’t matter if you can do it with other plugins - the fact is you may not get the same sound or creative edge that a particular sounding plugin will deliver.
You've made some excellent points, Rhys. People also tend to ignore the fact that a lot of these plugins react differently over time and/or depending on the frequency
Thanks mate! Indeed!
People sleep on McDSP. Still good all these years later. Metric Halo channel strip still good too.
Bought Sound Radix Auto Align 2 recently and I can't be happier!
Makes drum alignment a lot easy for me 😀
Absolutely worth it man
Good topic!
People really need to make use of the trials/demo of plugins before spending. I do agree, when working fast having less options but good options will help speed things up.
100% agree mate!
Was very surprised by the number of insta buyer paying without having downloaded the product !
@@Comprendre.vst3 cough gear lust forums cough
Basically, the algorithmic emulation of hardware components is pioneering work from 20 years ago, and the source code is mostly open-source. I heard that most plugin companies use this code, develop a special GUI, and sell it for high prices. It's more about innovations, like Soothe or something special that offers value, but normal EQ or compression plugins are mostly the same by design. Hardware makes the real difference for me. Plugins are important, but I just need one of a kind for each case.
There’s no denying you can get roped into having too many plugins. You don’t need 5 different types of 1176 plugins… but I’m pretty sure I do 😂 but that’s me problem not a plugin company problem 😂 I agree it has to be something special at this point to draw me in - as I have everything I need! A mix of hardware and plugins is what works for me!
When you buy plugins before you've even learned how to use the ones you have! Guilty as charged!🤩
Hahaha we’ve all been there 😂
We all did it lol
There are plenty of amazing free plugins out there that really are amazing and do the job. That's where I've learned and spent my time. Plugins4free has amazing stuff gave the chance to learn using different types of plugins and what I liked/needed before spending money. I have proq3 but I also use Tokyo dawns nova eq and it's been amazing.
Second that
Good video, love your point. I've seen that topic on a different chanel, where author tries to tell us that plugins are scam because he made free tool which you can tweak and achieve desire sound.
I found your explanation close to my. To be owner of different plugins can save you time and when you need specific sound you just go for plugin which can give you quick what you are looking for.
It is so simple to grab 1175 when you know that you looking that type of sound rather than know right threshold, input release times and so on.
Specially to non experienced people, who are learning yet.
And to be fair it is so obvious that if you have digital, flexible eq you can recreate every type of eq gear. All what is mathemeticialy measurable can be recreated that way.
Exactly! It’s not so much about the fact that with some time and the right tools you can recreate any plugin - cause who has time to do that - it’s about knowing your tools and being able to select them as required, thus saving time and keeping the creative flow going!
@@spinlightstudiosthat's the point! I think the problem is not with plugin scam but in ability to try them all. Because it's so more or less affordable many people are willing to pay for them. Then they have a tone of plugins, they never tried and never used.
The same guilt is in guitar players, they buy different amps, different guitars, when the tone is mostly in their playing style.
It's is not about the last 5% guitar tone or overall mix tone. It's more about to realize that to achieve good sounding guitar tone, you need to be good in playing guitar.
The same as a mix engineer, you need to know your craft, know how to find problems in the source material, and how to managed with the tools you have to solve this problem.
Many experienced engineers uses a limited range of plugins because they know it well. For them there is no need to look for another eq plugin, when they tweak the knobs in ssl chanel strip plugin for few years and the plugins is reliable. There is more sense for me to look for the smart kind of plugins, which can address particular task quicker and be in time with news but no with another eq :)
Anyway I found myself that buying a bunch of plugins was for me a part of learning process. I was curious why one plugin behaves one way and another plugin behaves differently. For me it was so much fun in learning that and I don't care how much money I have spend to achieve that knowledge. But can't imagine where could be fun if the only compressor I would have from the beginning of learning process must be only stock compressor. From where takes the inspiration, knowledge, when all what need is to dial milliseconds? Do you find something interesting in numbers? No specially but you find so much fun know that bust and cut in pultec behaves certain way. There is no common sense to add and adjust in the same frequency in reqular eq plugin, but knowing that you can do it in pultec is pure knowledge and fun. The fun is what is all about when it comes to music.
Have a great day!
Wish there was a way I could sell my plugins for 50% off. The problem with companies is that they shut down soon & the plugins exist only for a few years.
Thanks I've been waiting for a pro to say this cause I didn't want to get into a debate in my replies! I work hybrid & plugins save me alot of time 😁
Hardware needs cables and emits heat. My apartment in Tokyo doesn’t have the space for the cables!!!
Plugins it is!
My issue is that we live in an industry that teaches tips and tricks and not enough on fundamentals and using reference songs properly. I'm currently teaching someone these things, but once they see a "tips and tricks " video they are asking questions about these method's and ideas like (a pultec example) "why is attenuating and gaining around the same frequency giving xyz results?" And giving the answer is awesome for them, but they are always left with more questions once they see another video maybe doing the 'opposite'. People should have a solid understanding that transients = excitement, managing dynamics = competitive loudness, automation = depth, distortions and other fx = mood changers. Without a clear foundation or a lot of resources on this topics, and more plugins keep coming out makes the whole industry come off as a scam because people don't know what they don't know.
I do like your video btw even though it has a "playing the devil's advocate" vibe to it. hope all is well.
Stock plug ins are usually good enough. However there are several out there that are special. For example I do shoot outs on similar style plugs. Townhouse buss comp vs ssl bus comp vs shadow hills. They set at similar setting, sound drastically different. Also some work better on certain mixes. I went down the rabbit hole as did with preamps. After a while once you learn how to use ears those other 100 plug ins just sit there and I forget I have em. Everyone has the top 5-10 plugs they use. Familiarity is hard to break.
I think the point of the video in question is that with his limited programming ability he was able to create an all in one utility that’s capable of the same characteristics of thousands of dollars worth of plug ins. A single plug in with every 1176 revision would be more efficient but wouldn’t be extracting as much money from you as 5 separate plug ins.
Understanding and learning the inner workings of utilities and the differences between them is time consuming but it will only make for a better engineer.
My theory is theyre always some new plugin but its not different than any other time in music with any other gear. Ive got a few plugins to cover my bases that I know and use and dont need 10 different versions of the same thing. Get 1 or 2 great conpressors, channel strips etc whatever you know, enough to do your job well and youll be perfectly fine and happy.
Stock plugins work great, never needed to buy a plugin. Looking at your setup, why would you ever want to buy a plugin?
Just came to say hi thx u for ur content as always
Hey mate! No worries :) thanks for tuning in!
One of the problems is that when I do trials I have no idea what sounds good to me.
Even if my ear is somewhat developed and ready, my past self has run out of trials...
I have found some of the right tools through your channel, I knew the BX 4000E is a classic, but I have realized the value. Thank you.
It can be hard - I’d say if you’re not sure at the end of the trial maybe you don’t need it.
Bx4000e is always a good choice!
They just add their own sound when you run a signal through them. And some plugins have more control over side chain and wet signal options. Which I like.
Well said bro. That youtuber that did a recent video about plugin scam was offering another plugin he developed. I watched for a while and it was like... yawn, another click bait video of a guy trying to get smoke by dissing other companies and aimed to people that, maybe, really don't understand much about plugins and hardware yet. I too also need a couple of different 1176 for different scenarios. Same with tape, saturation, etc.
Keep up the good work mate.
Thanks mate! Im just offfering the opposite side of the topic and why there’s value in them - as you and I understand for our work flows!
Imagine that you are going to work and there is a fallen tree in the middle of the road, probably broken by the strong wind. What do you do, do you return home and stop going to work or are you looking for another way, an alternative? It is the same with these algorithmic emulations from these famous algorithms that were lucky in the past to be used by creative producers and becoming popular today in this way. It is a psychological prison not to conceive that you can create something beautiful without going out of patterns, Cubase and Logic have better quality eqs than most on the market for example, these 2 daws have plugins that do not require out of the box.
Me and my 1189 plugins feel attacked!🤣 I had to make a favorites folder to eliminate getting lost. It will be interesting to see where the future ai takes sounding like diodes and transformers.
I agree with you 100%. I thought the same when I seen those videos. I don't care if you can recreate plugins. I'm a sound engineer and I need to move fast. I have alot of hardware and plugins. If I grab a plugin and it gives the sound I'm looking for, that's all I care about. Just because you can copy a plugin doesn't mean a thing. The plugin companies do the work to give us an alternative to buying the hardware. And there's other things to consider alot of plugin companies make advanced version of the gear doing things the hardware cannot do. Like Eli's Arouser plugin does way more than the Distressor hardware. And Arturia's plugins have an extra panel on each plugin with features that are not on the hardware. Plugin are not a scam. They give us tools alot of times with extra features that make our job easier and faster. Most plugins are worth the money, just like my hardware is worth the money. Anything that does what you need to do and improves your workflow is worth the money. Real mix engineers don't care how a plugin is made as long as it does what it's suppose to do we don't care about anything else. Some people have to much time on their hands, that's obvious. But I don't, time is money.. Great video, you said exactly what I said when I first seen those videos. I'm glad you made this video, you represent most of us with your view of this.. Great Vid. 🙂🙂🙂👍👍👍
Appreciate this mate! We are like minded on this subject 🙏🏼
I think the whole point is to really ask yourself if you need another EQ or compressor. I have tons of them, but I only really use the same 3 of each most of the time. Marketing is really strong in making you believe that this new thing will change the whole game (see oeksound's bloom), but we need to remember that a good mix isn't new at all, what we have can achieve that.
Also, kinda crazy take, but I really tried to enjoy Kirchhoff EQ and the Cenozoix compressor, but they really don't click with me. I'd rather pull my Pulsar 1178 than the FET algo in Cenozoix. Same for EQ, if I want the SSL, I get better results with the SSL. Those two plugins are very open-ended, and open-endedness more often than not results in bad mixing. Working on the constraints of the hardware will hardly suck. I see a lot of people using Pro-Q and Pro-C as their first plugins, and it's no wonder when they quit because they can't make anything sound good.
Yeah man! Plugins like proQ3 can be dangerous because it’s so easier to over EQ and chase frequencies etc whereas a good ssl channels strip makes you listen more and think less and just be more
Musical with the choices you make.
If people spent as much time leaning to write a good song and powerful lyrics as they did acquiring gear, it would be a more effective use of their time. That being said, I'm a total sucker for gear and I've spent thousands on plugins, guitars and pedals. So I'm like a televangelist that was just caught with hookers and drugs in a cheap motel room: a total hypocrite.
😂😂😂 whatever inspires you! I’ve bought instruments that I’ve used a handful of times but wrote a sick song on it.. new sounds help inspire us! Even if sometimes it costs us 😂
@@spinlightstudios Yeah mate, I hear that. It's part of the fun if I'm being honest. But there DOES come a point where the law of diminishing returns slaps us across the face for sure. I have stopped buying plugins but I spent about 3k before I learned that lesson.
I have gas myself. Tried everything. I just live with it.
I better buy plugin than using the same one over and over just to try and match what I want to get.
For example, if I want the "maag air band like" sound, I'll grab the maag eq, not the pro Q 3 and try to match using plugin doctor to go back to the session and recreate that curve, best way to waste time is to do that. Yes I could learn all types of curves, do preset etc etc… but as professionnal, some clients want to see the plugin, they do have that psychology things that it's the maag sound (staying with that first example). Same for anything else.
Obviously some plugin are "meh", can be good one time, then fall in the abyss of unused plugin (I don't want to tell how much are in there).
The big problem is not buying plugins, we do what we want with our money. The problem is company marketing a new plugin as the new banger we all need everytime cause it has something new, while it does not and is just a new gui from an older plugin (hello PA just to name one…). This is snake oil, or marketing an other compressor, now with 32x oversampling, while all others only have 16. this is some serious bs to me.
tools help you make stuff more quickly. Sometimes the journey is the destination and we get stuck cork sniffing and in a loop testing the 100’s of pirated plugins we have 😂😂😂
😂😂😂 🏴☠️
I have seen the videos in question and a lot of the answer videos. I think it’s a workflow thing as well. The same thing can be said about visual art. Sure, I can mix 3 colors to get the right shade of blue I need. Or I could just… have that shade ready to go? Ultimately although a lot of plugs are just marketing BS the bare essentials will give you what you need in a timely manner.
Can I just download Tokyo Labs EQ and be done with it? Sure! But sometimes I just need a certain sound and I don’t want to spend 35 minutes to get it. Time is money afterall.
Yes, this is the point I was hoping to convey - it’s just about quick workflow and getting results quickly - but also giving some inspiration to the process. Totally think everyone should unsubscribe from plugin companies 😂 if they message you every week about a sale - remove the temptation 😂
Great video! I thought you might touch on plug-ins that do very little and just boost gain to make you believe they did something 😅
Yes that’s a little sneaky isn’t it! Not a fan of that - definitely a sketchy practice if the plugin automatically adds volume!
Agreed, sure you can match curves and dial in a similar sound, it's NOT easy and intuitive. Most of this stuff is about workflow for me, as it seems like it's for you. I earn my living with these tools and keep a full calendar. I need to move quickly and part of that is knowing which tools are best for which job. This is all very subjective!
Agreed, it’s very much about what works for you - but I do agree you don’t need to buy every EQ and Compressor plugin! A few choice options is all you need :)
Some are snake-oil - but some are decent but clunky. Early on I bought a bunch of Waves plugins. I never use them. If I could sell the plugins I rarely use, 2/3 of my plugins would be gone.
Plugins I use all the time: *FabFilter* ProQ 3, Pro MB, Pro R2 *Neural* Plini *UAD* 1176, LA-2A, Bus Comp *Kiive* Distinct Pro, NFuse *Toontrack* Superior Drummer 3. I'd buy all of these again if I lost them in a crash.
I think it comes down to workflow. With something like an 1176, you know exactly what you're going to get and you don't have to think about it. ProQ 3 and Kiive NFuse are the same. I get results immediately.
Very well put mate!
I don't think most plugins are "snake oil" but the part I regret in my purchases is the duplication. That's not the manufacturer's fault but it's mine. You get caught up in the slight variations of an eq or compressor and you see all of the videos of engineers showing off the latest and greatest, so you think that gives you a leg up on the competition. I only needed one good 1176, LA-2A, Pultec EQ, Neve channel strip, etc.
Very true mate! The other thing is plugins can definitely inspire you to achieve a sound you may not have come to on your own - using an eq with certain curves or a compressor that reacts a certain way may be just what you’re looking for. I know everyone is like “you can just recreate these sounds with basic plugins” but that disregards the instant sound/effect you may achieve from using a certain plugin and you go “oh yeah that’s awesome”. But yes - it’s best to try and avoid getting duplicates of plugins - easier said than done sometimes though.
@@spinlightstudios Yeah I’ve tried to use one of each “flavor” of an item like EQ, compressors, etc and then stick to it. My Logic plugin manager is ridiculous.
All well said.
I've spent at least 5-6k on plugins and over time as I slowly get better at mixing, I only use a selected hand full of those plugins lol while the rest are now collecting dust! Yes I've also been sucked into the GUI pit of "wow it looks good, then so will my mix lol" train your ears not your eyes 👍
Definitely train those ears up. Truth be told you only need a select few good plugins to get it all going - but some plugins do inspire you to mix differently - which in itself can be a valuable tool when needed.
Analog gear does sound better, a lot of the time. Not always, but I would say most of the time. It lets one work quickly (after you go through the royal pain in the ass of getting it all set up and configured, with converters and a patchbay). Once thats all done though, its usually a big sweet spot in terms of settings, and tends to be more flattering and musical than an emulation. As far as the end listener not noticing the difference- I would disagree. Sure, one analog compressor on one single track in a mix isnt going to be a gamechanger; but thats not the best place to start anyway. A solid mix bus chain WILL often sound better and more natural than a corresponding plugin one. Then, after that slowly adding great quality processors can often contribute to incremental sound benefit… assuming you even like the flavor of analog gear.
I would also say- as far as ROI - there are worse things to buy. If you buy a used CL1B for example, and wait to get a little bit of a deal on one (they can definitely be found if you can be just a bit patient), then - if you decide to part ways with it at some point - you can almost be sure not to lose any money, at all. In fact there is a good chance you could stand to make a buck or two. So its a better investment financially speaking than lets say, clothes…or even a new car.
For sure I get that - my mix bus chain makes a world of difference - but with a few choice plugins I’ve been able to recreate it pretty closely too! But I still prefer my hardware :) the biggest difference is using some Hardware while tracking - good performance/mics/pres/ maybe a touch of EQ and compression and you have a way better starting point with some flavour already added. That’s a different topic and a WAY bigger investment that a handful of plugins though :)
Totally agree 👍🏼
Thanks legend!
To be fair, the only things that will make a song popular and make money is 1. If it's a good or great song. 2. If there is effective marketing 3 Cultural association or relevance. Most releases have a good enough mix. A great or even superb mix has no real impact on sales of music. Saying this is definitely going to annoy a lot of people, but it's without doubt, true. A bad mix has never hurt a great song in terms of sales, ask the 1980's. AI is coming around the bend and you can already get free OK'ish mastering done, it won't be long until it's in a state that AI can mix to a commercial level for free and then all this plugin stuff will be moot. Another controversial comment I would say is that it's great for musicians, artists and composers/ writers. they don't have to dump their entire financial future into production, studio time and mastering then into a lottery of whether anyone will buy it in numbers great enough to pay for all that stuff. Whether you like it or not, time's been called on this industry. Here's hoping for the death of Spotify as well. Spotify fu**ing hates musicians, but loves the money they screw them out of, just like those labels do (although Spotify is largely owned by the labels).
I say it often - a great song can save a bad mix, a great mix can’t save a bad song! It’s all about the song!
Oh yeah, I ignore the "scam" videos. They will ignore us "duped" consumers when we say "we literally buy these recreations for workflow purposes."
I own both hardware and plugin and I’m also a duped customer 😂 I see the value in both - all just tools that help make creating music fun and inspiring
But in your DAW you have almost all the compressor and eq you need. Logic have all the classic Compressor and Eq. And Bitwig have great plug ins , they are really good. so why buy so many plug ins.
I think the truth, like with most things, lies somewhere in the middle. Having tools to make your job quicker and easier is not a scam. Charging $250 for an eq or compressor is in many cases.
I don’t have a problem with companies charging what they want - people will vote with their wallets! (I sure would not pay $250 for an EQ or comp)
On the other hand, buying all the emulations of a certain piece of gear is also a form of GAS. xD At that point, it's better to buy the hardware!
Haha PAS? Plug-in Addiction Syndrome. I’m all for hardware, just depends if the wallet agrees!
@@spinlightstudios PAS-ing GAS? :P
Hahahaha nice one 😂
@@aleksamrkela831yoooo...
Is the plugin version of hardware like wearing Chinese knock-offs?!
😂
Good points.
Thanks!
I just go for the free ones lol or stock plugin, just work with what I got… or check out the trails for the short time. It’s a home studio atm. PS this a touchy subject mate, don’t go trump on us and let’s make analog great again!
Hahaha I love analog 🥰 but also know that having a few good EQ and compressor plugins is not an issue - you definitely don’t need every EQ and comp plug that gets released though 😂
Why do you say the hardware will absolutely sound better? Better in what way? Why would that be? I know you can definitely get much more consistent QC from unit to unit in software of course, and any parameter you are going for you could more accurately get in software, so it seems to be a weird claim. Its a lot like these amps vs modeller claims
This is more a hardware vs plugin discussion - where I am absolutely advocating for plugins here vs the price point of hardware. And plugins can do more - load a stereo version of it - have unlimited instances etc loads of pros. But no denying in my opinion that some hardware just sounds awesome. Doesn’t mean I won’t use a plugin version. A lot of the time it seems to just be a personal preference - but take my Audioscape Opto for example - it sounds so much better than any of my LA2A plugins and I can push it harder while tracking and it still sounds great - I don’t feel the same about the plugin versions when I start to push them harder - particularly on a vocal it’s not the same. But will I still use the plugins? Of course, they are still good - but I work hybrid so I’m always implementing some level of outboard gear into my mixes because I love what it does. I also love amps and amp sims - I use both cause they are both awesome tools - sometimes an amp sim works better, other times a real amp is what is needed. I don’t really have any bias - I just care about getting a good result.
YES!!!!!
So glad to see this one on here. So many right answers, so many wrong answers, but hopefully people will realize its important to know what they're getting
There is definitely two sides to the story and both make good points - I think meeting in the middle is ok!
GUI Team ===> 🤣🤩🤩🤩
Haha get that flashy flashy GUI 😂
Facts
Agree
💯
100%
I agree, there's a guy in the net right now calling all these plugins scams. I told him I don't agree and that I'm willing to pay for their work.
If plugins inspire you to create awesome mixes and make the process enjoyable for you - no harm done!
7 grand plus the converters and patch cables when the componants proably cost 500 bucks max.. its crazy the $100 plug in is considered the scam
Nailed it 🔨
Absolutely sounds better, but know will be able to tell the difference. 😂
God you guys are deluded, the guy who made the scam videos is 100% correct.
You are wasting money you instead could invest in hardware or taking real face to face mixing courses with professionals in your town.
I think it’s a bit of a reach to think that a couple hundred $ spent on compressor and EQ plugins equates to racks of hardware. A handful of useful plugins is not going to break the bank. I totally agree you shouldn’t buy every plugin with a flashy GUI. But the amount I’ve spent on EQ/comp plugs over the years I’ve been doing this wouldn’t even buy me a warm audio compressor 😂 if you wait you can pretty much get any plugin on sale too.
@@spinlightstudios Forgive for having my doubts, the FF Total Bundle alone costs more than a Warm Audio compressor 😅
@@JoeyFTL hey man - we are talking about compressors and EQs! Of course all of my plugins are worth way more than that -
But they all have a purpose - like melodyne etc fab filter prol2 is a great limiter not part of this discussion.
All of my plugin purchase for all types of plugins - EQ, comp, saturation , limiters, tuning, reverb etc sure I could own a few more pieces of gear - but not that many - maybe one cl1b and I’d have no good method to tune vocals 😂
But the point here is EQ and compressors - not all plugins.
I think I have never paid more than $15 for a plugin alliance plugin lol they used to do loyalty vouchers and cheap deals and you get their plugs dirt cheap before they went subscription. Same for pretty much any plugin I own - waited for good sale.
On a side note I don’t own all FF plugs - just the ones I use regularly :)