Ranking the Best COH2 Allied Infantry | 2022 Tier List Redux
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- Опубликовано: 17 окт 2024
- Greyshot117 and Greyshot151 continue to rank the best and worst CoH2 frontline infantry, but this time they cover the allies. They did forget to rank the USF major (I would rank it low A for it's great support options), I'm sure that will be the only issue people take away from the video. Anyway, enjoy!
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Comissar is definitely S tier simply due to his fanfic distribution call-in. Breaking any infantry offense or softening MG defence for 45 ammo is just ridicolous. It's by far the most OP unit ability in the game. Yeah, it was already pointed out, but i feel that it wasn't enough.
My favorite tactic is NKVD. Commissar + AT overwatch + KV8 = 🎉
I love that you called it fanfic distribution
Penal Squad i think should be ranked higher. in shootouts, it outperforms a lot of other infantry squads (especially conscripts who like to shoot at anything else other than the enemies), have deadly satchel charge to deal with bunkers and tanks. with their large squad size, they can easily defeat grenadiers and then steal their MG42, becoming even deadlier.
As a british main, here is my essay on why Raid Sections are absolutely great. Not as good as Infantry Sections, but still damn good. Low A tier, maybe high B.
Section 1: Purpose
Within your discussion of the sections, you mentioned that they did not have a defined role, but they do. They exist as your solution for tech rushing, something that can be extremely effective as a brit.
Raid sections fulfill every major role of an early-to-mid game offensive force, while also ensuring your army can follow safely. Their base stats make them similar to Riflemen, allowing you unparralleled aggression, they have tech-less grenades in the form of molotovs, unlike Assault Sections [which IIRC meta, so I would also bump them the hell up] which allow them to replace WASP Universal Carriers, to an extent. They have a sprint which allows them to get in the close range they excel at, much like Rifle Company Riflemen. Their mines allow them to ensure that what is UKF's greatest weakness, namely light vehicles, do not even have a chance to encroach on your lines.
What you see as a weakness I see as their greatest strength, they're good enough at everything, while also being dirt cheap in terms of upgrades compared to Infantry Sections and starting as 5 man squads. You save 60 fuel and from 130 to 540 munitions for each and every raid section compared to regular infantry.
Section 2: Commander
If the raid section was in any other commander, I would agree with your assessment, but by God the synergy Tactical Support has with them:
Designate Command Vehicle: Get this on an AEC or your Croc and you'll be able to get them to kill any AT guns while your vehicles roll over the infantry.
Air Resupply Operation: The first way in which this commanders allows you to bypass sections. You get medical supplies, alongside a MOBILE MORTAR and an AT gun, thus one drop of this sets you up for the whole pre-armour phase. Get another AT gun if you need. If you need more medical supplies get a medic or drop them with FOP
Forward Observation Post: Oh, the Creme de la creme. Enemy fortifications/MGs/AT guns in front of you? Do you not have the fuel to get armour against it? Is it too risky to send in your infantry? Well, Tactical Support has you covered, with much, MUCH longer range than infantry section, you get a strafe loiter [which has much longer range than you would guess], Better Artillery, Smoke and Medical, in any building you want, at any time. Oh and also reinforces your units. Literally a straight upgrade over SOV and OST ones. If you get it on your Assembly you also get regular artillery as well.
Churchill Crocodie: It's a fucking crocodile: give it Command Vehicle, point it at the general direction of enemy infantry and commit warcrimes with immortal infantry to protect it.
Section 3: Comparison against infantry sections
At a glance, one would guess that Raids lose in the late-game compared to Infantry. And that is correct...except for the fact that you can get them to nearly the same level if you just get weapon racks. I'm not gonna comment on double vickers, since they're bugged. Brens they're literally better than on Infantry Sections, because unlike them, they have no out of cover penalty for reloading, or firing. Making them much better at offensive operations. Any other disadvantages, their commander covers. Raids also get better vet.
Section 4: Conclusion
In short, the Raid Sections are riflemen with a mix between Urban Assault and Rifle Company abilities. They exist to cover you until you get your armour rolling out and then, they exist for murdering anything and everything you may fear may endanger your vehicles, through Forward Observation Posts they can initiate attacks, their better veterancy can keep you gong for longer and their lack of an out of cover penalty renders said attacks more effective.
The problem I found with Raids is that their received accuracy is is pretty high so they die pretty quick and bleed manpower. By comparison, regular infantry sections, even with 4 models seem to last a bit longer and cost the same 28mp per model to replace. You can save more manpower too by skipping medics and getting on field healing. It's fairly easy to to get the cover bonus for infantry sections as only one model needs to be in cover and it doesn't matter the direction of the cover. This effects the whole squad and makes them very powerful with Brens. Even out of cover, with Bren's at long range, their DPS is close to raid sections due to the remaining models with Lee Enfield's having better long range accuracy.
The biggest benefit you get from raid sections is being able to skip bolster and grenades which is good in the short term to get an earlier vehicle. But in the long term Bolstered infantry sections with on-field healing are much more resilient and save a ton of manpower. I always skip grenades anyway because the officer and commandos have light gammon bomb. If you tech hammer you get heavy gammon bombs on infantry sections which raids miss out on.
As for the airdrop, it can't be dropped in base which means you have to waste time dragging the weapons into the base before reinforcing. The mortar you get is also complete garbage, and its only real use is for smoke and a counter to infantry in buildings so is arguably a waste of popcap/upkeep. It's better on commanders with the 0cp call in because Brits have no other counter for machinegun's in building's in the early game, and no smoke. Once you get either the pyrotechnics upgrade, officer or mortar pit there is less need for it.
@@thundergod6115 As I said, IS are still better. Raids are meant as a singular 'good enough' solution for early game problems. Sprint for flanking MGs, molotovs for buildings and mines for vehicles
@@alek7998 Fair enough, just based on my own experience I think B tier feels about right for them.
Been using Raid section with brens and i honestly prefer them over inf section, since they don't need the cover bonus and are much easier to use in early game. Of course the inf section will always be superior in heavy arty games thanks to half the map becoming yellow cover but I really wish the Vicker K worked as intended becuse that doctrine is very fun with the observation building
I think if the Vickers K was better, I would have fought for Raid IS and the assault officer more.
I will have to disagree about the pathfinders, even tho yes they might be lacking compared to other units but you cannot deny them for recon purpose. Just like jeager you can send them front with hold fire and see where enemy team weapons or tanks stay at which gives you a good first strike against them. Since we are talking about 4v4 as well there will be a lot mortar or arty shots in the mid that will generate yellow spots for them to hide as well.
5 stars jaeger beat any1 in cover
In my opinion you guys should have played more and reaserched for these units
They put jager light inf from overwatch to c tier not A or B. It C
@@butter_nation fr bruh they litreally did the same mistakes from the 2019 tier list
I think it's because they are talking about 4v4 and 3v3, no 1v1 or 2v2
@@jr4450Not that JLI are bad in team games. They are easily S tier if used properly (aka as 2nd line support damage dealers and/or ambushers).
@@TovKafur well yes, they are better than Volks, and I think also than panzerfusilier. And also the come in overwatch commander who is good, so yes they are good.
Never merge conscripts into shock troops, you lose the armor and the squad becomes way less effective.
I think you've got most of these spot on. My only argument is that I think Assault sections should be solid A tier. Once they get Thompsons they are very powerful and can beat Sturmpioneers and even Panzergrenadiers when vetted. They are not as good as Shocks, Paras or Rangers, but for a 280mp unit with a 0cp requirement they are pretty damn good and can give you an early game advantage. They can also building sandbags and get access to the grenades and heavy gammon bombs which gives them the choice of up to 4 types of grenades. Smoke grenades are always handy and the WP grenades are borderline OP as they don't have shared cooldowns with the other grenades.
I want to offer my piece as well regarding the UK Assault Officer. In my opinion he is S tier and just about a "must have" in 90% of the matches.
First of all it is an amazing combat unit compared to other "officer variants" and can hold their own not just with their Stens, but with the light gammon bomb as well. As far as the Vickers K upgrade, the thing is that the gun is good, the patch making it good is there, however it is actually...em... *bugged*. The values in the patch, are not the values in game.
Second, the ally buff ability is great especially due to the speed buff, in micro managing it helps with units flanking, helping AT units or Engineers to get a snare off, as well as help with finishing retreating units with the accuracy buff.
Third, Vet 1 gives you recon, something the Brits lack and well, information is valuable.
And lastly, howitzer smoke and cover smoke. The thing that makes this OP, is the fact that the officer is the only one that does NOT need an animation for the Red smoke. It is instant and being pinned does not lower the range of the ability.
All in all in the hands of a good player, a UK officer will have more value compared to its counterparts. Thank you for coming to my Ted talk.
Soviet Combat Engineers are poor but necessary unit. The problem with them, plus conscripts, is weakness against OKW rushes.
man did assault and raid sections dirty
The infantry section is weak in comparrison to Cons.
Infantry section has
>No snares
>No mobility
>Reliant on many upgrades
>countered completely by smoke
In contrast cons while being stupid cheap they can
>reinforce multiple elite squads and team weapons
>Snare+Sprint
>cheap molotov for disruption
>can build the best sandbags in game
Seven man at 3 vet allows the cons to bully Volks and beat grens at medium-close and they even get the cover bonus. Cons are the ultimate bulwark unit.
>can build the best sandbags in game
Uh not really
you cant really set it up so that enemy can't use it without wires so not that great i prefer normal sandbags
@@aaa26700 and? Wire takes a second to build for a sandbag wall you can squeeze a million Soveits into
Typical allied fanboy doesn't know what he's talking about
I'm gonna start by just saying that all the mainline allied infantry are superior to their axis counterparts for different reasons. For sections however, they are THE best mainline infantry. Here's why
-they are the brits starting unit which is completely imbalanced as they fight other factions engineers
-they have the best rifles out of any infantry squad and certainly better than the trash k98s that the grens get
-they don't have any damage fall off at range like every other squad
-they do MORE damage the longer the range
-they get accuracy bonuses in any type of cover
-they get brens which are better than grens mg42s
-they get artillery and extra sight
-they get to bolster their squads unlike every other squad
Plus snares don't matter because for some reason only the allies get super early light vehicles that actually do damage (usf jeep, UC,). By the time the axis gets a 222 or panzer 2/puma out you should have an AT gun. If you don't then you're doing it wrong
S tier is for things that can be used in nearly any game
Even on open maps i make shock troops and keep them in hidden spots to make surprise attacks, always backing them up with some armor or HW
i've used this unit in nearly every single game i've ever played as soviets, they're so useful
S tier for sure, imho
Agree. If anything shock troops are still relevant of not more relevant in open maps because that's where artillery shine and shock troops'beefy health is what keeps them surviving the barrage to capture the points instead of getting squad wiped. Using any other infantry to hold a point which is being subjected to artillery is very risky especially for elite troops but with shock troops I'm confident that they'll survive long enough to capture a flag and retreat.
I can't believe pathfinders with bars not a topic !!
just try them with one bar because drop rate is High if they die from nade or rocket and they can steal bars from you
BUT they are OP you out range every thing in the game and shred them
Fun fact: Conscripts model is an engi model so reinforcing engi with cons is a good Idea
Take that 151
wait the reinforcement ability maintains the Conscripts health and stuff?
@@gerfand all units have the same health (80 hp) with the exception of the sniper for balance reasons (82 hp). What's more important for this specific discussion is a stat called "Target Size", which is basically how large the object is for accuracy calculation purposes. If every unit was 100% accurate, then against an enemy with a target size of 1 a squad would have a 100% chance to hit it, and a target size of .5 would give a 50% chance to hit it.
The conscript squad has a base "Target Size" of 1.09, so they're easier to hit than normal. Combat engineers have a "Target Size" of 1. So while they don't have the exact same stats, the difference is pretty much negligible.
There are other changes to the stats based on veterancy but this is pretty much all you need to know.
EDIT: And yes, I didn't say it but the conscript models keep their base stats. This is why reinforcing shocks with conscripts is a bad idea, because they still have crappy con "Target Size" and will drop like flies.
@@snaek2594 ah that makes sense, thank you,
The 10 man flamer team
While rating units you absolutely need to consider at what point in game they are first available. The fact the penals are just above rear ech is disgusting, penals are solid infantry probably will win most 1v1 engagements against early axis unit. And in my opinion the order for starting units should have been Brit inf section>conscripts> raid section> penals> riflemen. And commandos are arguably the best allied infantry they have everything quite literally
I don't know in what paralel universe the riflemen are not the best starting squad
I agree. Penal Battalion is my staple when playing Soviet. Conscript is just too fragile. With "Torched" intel bulletin, Penal is even better with increase in accuracy, SVT-40 & large squad size is just deadly, while PTRS-41 can pierce even Panther tank, and Anti-Vehicle Satchel is very useful at disabling tank & damaging it (1/4 of its health)
@@Spaghetter813 Ridiculous indeed. Riflemen is the main staple of USF strategy. With Bazooka Increase Penetration and Quick Reinforcement Intel Bulletin it is still useful until mid-late game.
AT Sections without being upgraded to PIATs actually are on par with Bolstered Inf Sections without weapon upgrades in terms of their Anti-infantry power.
Did some tests and they often are about the same in both survivability and damage fighting against Gren and Volk squads. The biggest noteworthy thing though is that they can break the cover of what they are shooting at so that can really effect the course of the engagement.
I did the tests with unbreakable cover to make it more consistent to compare with Inf Sections and in those tests they are about equal in time to wipe the enemy squad and how many models/health they have remaining after the engagement. These were done with no veterancy and with 3 veterancy to see the difference and it was consistent all around. Also yes AT Sections have the same winrate with Inf Sections _against Grens and Volks._
AT Sections are a straight side-grade to the Inf Sections.
With the commander specifically, what I like to do is use the Halftrack to give the Sappers Vickers, and even doubling down with Heavy sappers for 3 Vickers total. The Vickers doesn't perform well when firing on the move compared to alternatives but with it being on Sappers, it's better than their Stens for CQC and the Heavy engineer upgrade increasing their survivability. I also use it in conjunction with the Halftrack to drop them into the front or harass while on the move. The AT Sections I don't even need to upgrade to PIATs for the most part and if I need better AT capabilities I just get the heavy hitters like Fireflies or the AT gun and/or get 1 AT squad to be upgraded to PIATs while others stay with the Boys AT.
Also if you wonder how many AT Sections it takes to take down a StuG with the AT Rifle, it takes 2 Volleys from 5 up front; 2 Volleys from 4 behind. Vet 2 increases the chance of doing Criticals on vehicles.
I think 151 is completely insane thinking rifles are S tier. Most expensive frontline with 280mp and 28 reinforce and an insulting 120 muni for full weapon upgrades, non doctrinally have probably the worst utility of any frontline (no mines, sandbags, medic ability, sight, grenade requires tech).
Rifles in terms of combat ability are about on par with volks for the cost, which in a bubble is fine, but volks get their power spiker earlier with free weapon rack unlock and they are far better at holding ground with non doctrinal bags. What this is ignoring however, is that OKW with just volks kinda sucks, getting JLI or Obers pretty much happens every single game. USF does not have non doctrinal elite infantry nor does it have non doctrinal long range specialists. It doesn't help that pretty much every single engagement rifles have to close the distance to be in optimal performance.
What ends up happening with rifles in most games in my experience (top 100 2v2) is that rifles end up bleeding you super hard, especially against WM. When you are winning you are still likely to have a negative K/D even though grens only cost 2 more to reinforce than rifles. Honestly, its not uncommon to have a soviet using cons to have a better K/D than a USF player using rifles, which should speak wonders about something being wrong.
Rifles are a solid B tier unit only because m1919s and bags can do some saving to rifles with doctrines. Without using bags or m1919s, rifles in their current state are borderline unusable and painful to play. In 1v1 this might be different, but in every other gamemode they need a serious change.
the problem with Jaegers is that you talking to someone you probably forget who is who.
Really interested to see the video they're talking about with the cavalry rifle in a vehicle lel
thing is I will disagree on the cavalry riflemen, they allow you to out right skip riflemen saving you a whole bunch on resource cost, as you can just go jeep and stall for command point 1 and call in 2 of these suckers, plus they get satchels which are very great against enemy tanks, considering the fact you can put them in a jeep with lets say bazookas and have them being a driving AT squad, plus they are very good at supporting other infantry such as captain by using fire supremacy which makes the target easier to hit and slowed so you could take 2 cavs and 2 obers, and use the fire supremacy ability on one ober, fire at the ober that doesn't have fire supremacy on them, then once they run away it should be fairly easy to knock down the other ober, and because of the fact they get smoke it makes them one of my favorite short range squads in the game, while they dont have grenades yes, they dont really need them as their fire power is already strong enough at mid close range to handle just about any squad. The only problem with them is the fact at vet 0 they have the same dodge as regular riflemen, making them kinda hard to use early game, but this can be avoided by simply putting them in a jeep and getting up close to team weapons such as, behind a raketen, flanking an hmg, rushing a mortar, and even running in to quickly take down a pak 43 if given the chance to do so. the one thing that makes these suckers really really good is the fact their smoke grenade and the other smoke grenades for usf can make a vehicle slowed and have its main gun locked, making this squad good for stopping tank pushes with smoke grenade and satchels, making them very potent at short range, having a good support ability when things get tough for your men, and the fact they're so mobile with the jeep it is insane.
AT section is stronger than base Section without upgrade
Chav rifleman has the higher dps in the game the only issues with them is that they are squishy even at vet3, and if you do not rush them out and hunt vet for them then they will wipe in miliseconds.
Maybe it's just me but I use the Captain just for support my industry. I send them to the Frontline and try to retreat them when their down to 2 or 1 man. From there, I don't reinforce them and have them stay at base switching them between buildings to get new Units Faster.
That's just me though anyone else does this?
Just you…. Decent unit and can be upgraded with BAR, vet 3 get insane speed bonus for capping points
people sleep on the Captain's ability to speed up production and focus more on it's fighting capability. You can use it for _any_ production and I think also affects techs so you can get them out very quickly. (400% increase in speed)
Need a TD out to respond to an enemy panzer immediately? Use the Captain and you get one in less than 10 seconds.
Comandoes die in second when they fail. Its hit or miss
If you're putting units that scales best + are solid front line units in the S tier, then the conscriptions should be up there as well
can't Sov Airbone fire their MG on the move btw?
Not as good as Obersoldaten, but I'm pretty sure they can.
they can but that doesnt change the fact that they are bad, they need buffs asap , their dps is too low for an elite unit and more so for such an expensive one
@@lazaroskordas4397 i think the idea today is use them as am Ambush unit but I dont disagree
@@gerfand what makes me sad is that my favourite Sov commanders are Terror and Airbourne , they re bad camo unit, they would do better if they could keep stealth while moving in cover , also while playing airbourne i used ppsh penals and they deal so much more dmg than guards, its such a same that guards dont get at least the same accuracy modifiers,their ppsh ability is useless on a ppsh unit they should pass that ability to dp and give stealth while moving in cover,vet1 ability is trash,and vet 3 gives 20% cooldown on abilities where it should be like 50% cause all abilities have too long cooldowns, i would also consider grenade range on vet 3, right now they get so many perks like camo , an ability for ppsh upgrade ,3 weapon slots for lmgs but it all feels like its there just to make it an elite unit on name only cause everything they get is useless
Wait why are regular pathfinders above I/R?
the I/R meta melts everything.
Because IR have only one scoped rifle rather than two, thus being worse against most targets. While they have the best call-in in the game (fake one, not joking btw), they are also in much worse doctrine (i like Recon, but it's just very poorly designed compared to fantastic Airborne).
Who needs the allies. I just want my MG42
Not if we "Strategically Take Equipment Away Logically" aka "STEAL" it
I will say borrowing enemy tanks will never get old
My G
Commando's should definitely be S tier.
two sharp looking bois! good video!
Riflemen, Assault Engineers, and Rear Echelons are ranked way too high. Riflemen are B-tier at best. Assault Engineers are solid C-tier, and Rear Echelons are definitely D-teir if not F-tier. Rear Echelons are the worst starting unit in the game, and frankly, incredibly overpriced.
@@tinman3586 worst starting unit? They are something medium between soviet and ostheer engineers.
What about the major? Definitely S tier😉
I mentioned that in the description but the file didn't upload when I made the tier list so it was left out. Completely forgot about it.
Rear Echelons higher than Sov Engineer? Meh
Infantry sections don't have snare? Who cares? Just stay put behind green cover if necessary and wait for the best AT unit in this game which is the vanilla royal engineer. They are cheap, have both snare and AT weapon, and really hard to hit when level up. The designer of this game must be British because it has tons of things which other factions must obtain through doctrine. They even have a special M3 which can distribute weapons at frontline to make sure Brits never have to run back to base like those stupid yankees.
No comment here
airborne guards S tier, penals S tier, cons D tier, and ptrs guards C tier. there fixed
You can tell these guys play nothing but 4s or 3's. This video should be tittle the A AND B list instead of tier .
We say that at the beginning. That's not hidden information.
@Greyshot Productions Fair enough but at least throw that in the description or at least the title.
You're going to have gullible players run in there spamming with pathys and get reckt by literally anyone competitive
2 - 3 penals and then 2 - 3 shock troops. The only counter to my shock troops I've had that are only infantry are the obers.