I have a system of auctioning my pottery. That way the price is set by the customers. They have two days to bid and the highest bidder gets a bill for the item plus the shipping price. I have zero inventory. Sometimes I would have underpriced and sometimes over-priced.
I think your small pots look cozy in a way. Since we tend to life in smaller and smaller flats, our room for a decorative piece to comfort the wandering eye also shrinks. Yet the angles give it your pots a mighty character as the angles don't change compared to the larger ones. The effect of your work is maybe intensified or condensed.
Half way through the video I had to stop and look at my finger to realize how small these pieces are compared to your normal work. Concerning the pricing issue, years ago, watchmakers had to charge more for smaller watches, but that was ok because people wanted smaller watches. Now, people want big showy watches so they charge more for easier to make watches. This is the outlier example of what is normal, as in we normally have to charge a premium for miniaturization. You truly should charge for your time across the board of sizes and then sell what people want to pay for. It may feel "wrong" to charge the same for a small product but it is the honest way to price thing. If you are always honest in pricing then people will respect the prices. Selling, as in the active process of convincing someone to buy the piece, is far easier when you are honest about the costs of production. Good Luck
I think we have to see this pricing issue from a macro perspective. Selling smaller pots at a lower price because people expect them to be cheaper. You can compare this pricing approach to the iPhone Mini, which doesn't necessarily cost less.
This is a long post, but I think it's possible to create a personal mathematical formula that will work best for you! It will be complex at first, but once you create it, it will be easy to fill in for future projects. Consider ALL costs in making the piece PLUS whatever you feel comfortable charging for your time/labor/creativity: All physical material costs per piece - i.e. clay, glaze, packaging materials (consider the amount used and charge as a percentage of the total cost to purchase the supply) All utilities used (i.e. electricity cost to run the kiln as a percentage - considering how much space the piece takes up) A fraction of your total monthly studio and overhead costs (down to the hour so it can be applied to this formula) i.e. rent, heat, water, marketing, etc. These numbers may be small, but will add up. Now you know approximately how much it costs YOU (out of your pocket) to have all you need physically to create, promote and ship the piece. Next, consider your artistic rate per hour and how much time, effort and originality you are truly dedicating towards each piece. Your uniqueness is valuable and should be rewarded in a way that feels good to you! Ideally, those numbers added together should be the minimum price for the piece. This is often adjusted, however, based on your limited supply (as you are one person and can only make so many pieces) and the demand for your work. You may find that once you create and apply this formula, the price for your pieces make the most sense to you. This technique is not for everyone, as I am sure many will find it to be an unnecessary over-complication. Either way, it is an option ❤
A commun formula is (at least for small sellers and that i've seen it many times) : 2*(hour wage * time spent + material price + energy) (basicly 2 times everything it cost to make) The 2 factor is for everything else, such as rent, water bill, time spent on communication etc... And is a margin to grow the company
thinking about pricing which is an art in itself. I would go for a reduction of perhaps one third only off the standard size price, materials are maybe a small part but labour is just as huge a part in the making , perhaps timewise the same amount of time! Bonne chance, lovely work.
I don't know why but there's something quite cute about these small pots. I'm really curious how they'll look finished. As far as pricing goes, I'm no potter but from my own business experience you could always try shifting the margin - charging more for your usual work and take a loss on more unique projects. This way you can maintain the appearance of balanced pricing - since many buyers won't know about the difficulty and time needed to make pots like these. This approach also works for one-offs that are very labor intensive if you don't want to make them seem prohibitively expensive. Great work as always.
As a baker I often fall into this same conundrum. Miniatures are presumed to be more expensive than large pieces. But miniatures are clearly harder to make and require much more repetition often requiring more of the most expensive materials, e.g. chocolate, fruit glazes, or other icings. Some industry standards include selling only as sets. That way you receive multiples of your marginal profit. Simply charge more per piece. Often times the equivalent number of servings cost 3 to 5 times more if they are sold in miniature. Finally, make sure to calculate the exact cost of making a piece in hours worked and materials consumed. As you will be receiving marginal profits it's best to know that you are receiving some profit. Finally, although it's less creative small crafts require the exact same piece be made several times, some times dozen or hundreds of times, That way much greater speed is achieved reducing the total cost in labor time. Also some concessions for ease of creation may be necessary throwing more oblique angles, not throwing lids. Perhaps creating a template out of acrylic to automatize some production.
I think with pricing you just have to set an amount that you are happy to let the work go for . If people understand and appreciate the labor they are YOUR customers ,if they dont get it they are another poters . I think people who purchase hand crafted items enjoy the fact that they own something very different from a mass produced product .You buy into the one off uniqueness which I think is wonderful .
Trust your instincts. Perhaps, you can treat these like their larger-counterparts and apply a "discount?" If a full vessel, like this, is $400-what feels right to you? 50% off? 25%? Pricing is difficult; but, I will be among the first to try and get my hands on one. My mother just recently passed; I would love to use one of these as an urn for her remains
i’m thinking of opening an etsy to try and make some money for college definitely something i’ll have to think about soon I also loved your book,seeing old pictures of you tho is kinda weird you hair was sooooo blond!!! i really loved the section about your younger years
Great video. Pricing of small pottery has always been a difficult conundrum for me, as I can throw a large 15-20# vase and sell it for a couple hundred in the same time it takes to throw/handle a mug/small cup. Additionally I enjoy refining things as you do and the time investment just does not pan out for smaller potters. So i either have to make less "refined" mugs or small objects that take less time and sell the same at the cost of my preferred aesthetics. Or just suck it up.
I wonder if a happy compromise might be to sell them in sets. Perhaps each pot in the set with a different glaze? That way the customer feels they're getting good value for their money and you have a better chance of recouping the time and effort that you put into them as you can price it higher than a single pot.
On price determination / discrimination: The artist is also the producer. So, there is a portion of price that is art, and a portion of production. Also, there is a perception of the consumer that cheaper priced items are of less quality, which the artist surely attests is not the case. Resist lowering prices. For the example of the smaller pots, my opinion would expect it to be a little cheaper than a larger pot and more than a small cup. However, because it is an art piece, I would not expect that a price would be structured upon a simple factor such as size. I feel artists should ask what the market will bear, and especially focus on not short selling items. I also feel it prudent for an artist to consider production time on items that they will be fairly compensated for, even if part of that compensation is in the joy of making. Willingness to purchase is the consumer's appreciation of the artist. I feel many artists are humble about pricing.
This is the age old question for potters: How much should I charge? I have thrown pottery on the wheel for 10 years. The sales that I participate in is at a major arts and education center in Denver, Colorado where students sell along side of instructors. I try to take into account the demographic of the customer base, my personal experience etc. I am an unknown hobbyist so my goal is to sell pottery to help pay for my classes and materials. You have potters who just want to clean out their garage of accumulated work and others who are trying to make a living through teaching and selling their work. It's hard to convince the potters who just want to get rid of pots, to put high enough prices on their work. Very low prices from some potters will devalue other's work in a sale like this. For the last sale I used this formula and felt more confident in my prices and did quite well with sales. I probably will tweak it a little for the Christmas sale as I have become more extensive with my carving on items. - Set a base price for each type of item looking at size, shape, difficulty etc. of just the piece without adornments. For instance Large bowl - $40, Medium bowl - $30, Small bowl - $20. (for me, throwing and triming is the easy and less time consuming part) - Then add a certain amount for each time you've worked on the piece after it's thrown. For me it was $5 more for each thing I did to the pot. Simple carving, foot ring, trimming to thin or shape the pot, glaze dip, more than one color of glaze, brush work etc., etc. - So a large bowl, trimmed to thin and shape, foot ring, carved decoration, glazed a single color would be $40 for the pot + $20 for extra handling = $60 price tag. Small bowl with same work would be $20+$20 for extras = $40 price tag. Or on the flip side a medium bowl with no trimming, no foot ring, only glaze for decoration would be $35. The thing is with this formula you can adjust it to your liking, if you do intricate sgraffito work charge more for that particular design. This formula could also be as complex as you want to make it if you need to account for your time and material cost for example.
I think there is no good solution to this. Most people don't see the work that's put into making them. Maybe you could make small batches with limited numbers. That would automatically push the value up.
Good idea! A range that's considerably more rare deserves a higher price - but I could also show them this video to demonstrate how annoying they are to trim!
If you were a neophyte potter, the pricing question might be something you would think about. But you are an artist with a known demand for your work. Consider what you yourself need, and price accordingly. We are not talking about a pile of beans to be sold by the pound. And you owe no one an explanation.
So, let’s say you’re a very experienced potter, it may not take you as long to throw and trim. But the time you spent learning to be faster needs to be taken into account. Otherwise your things will get cheaper and cheaper the better you get. Not a good way to price. Also, I think there is something about the artistic expression that is hard to value. I can look at your work and KNOW it’s your work, and would pay more, because of the artistry. I just don’t see how pottery can really be a money maker. And my thoughts are if you’re creating art, like you are, then you can command higher prices. However, most of what I see in markets lack originality. My goal is to create things that lean more towards art. I think you’ve nailed one of the better combinations of art and functionality.
I think this may be the route I take! A little trio would work well, each in a slightly different tone of crackle glaze, from white grey to dark green.
I'm not a potter, or a craftsman per se for that matter, but I am in a line of work which requires a lot of training and where skills with your hands matter a lot. When pricing your work, you absolutely have to dare to charge enough for you to to be happy with the profit. Thousands of hours of training and experience have value if it's reflected in the quality of the work. Break even plus just a little is NOT enoguh.
I have a system of auctioning my pottery. That way the price is set by the customers. They have two days to bid and the highest bidder gets a bill for the item plus the shipping price. I have zero inventory. Sometimes I would have underpriced and sometimes over-priced.
That makes a lot of sense
For reference. Is it possible to give us an idea of the scale of your pottery production/output?
I like this idea, thank you.
I think your small pots look cozy in a way. Since we tend to life in smaller and smaller flats, our room for a decorative piece to comfort the wandering eye also shrinks. Yet the angles give it your pots a mighty character as the angles don't change compared to the larger ones. The effect of your work is maybe intensified or condensed.
Half way through the video I had to stop and look at my finger to realize how small these pieces are compared to your normal work. Concerning the pricing issue, years ago, watchmakers had to charge more for smaller watches, but that was ok because people wanted smaller watches. Now, people want big showy watches so they charge more for easier to make watches. This is the outlier example of what is normal, as in we normally have to charge a premium for miniaturization. You truly should charge for your time across the board of sizes and then sell what people want to pay for. It may feel "wrong" to charge the same for a small product but it is the honest way to price thing. If you are always honest in pricing then people will respect the prices. Selling, as in the active process of convincing someone to buy the piece, is far easier when you are honest about the costs of production. Good Luck
I think we have to see this pricing issue from a macro perspective. Selling smaller pots at a lower price because people expect them to be cheaper. You can compare this pricing approach to the iPhone Mini, which doesn't necessarily cost less.
This is a long post, but I think it's possible to create a personal mathematical formula that will work best for you! It will be complex at first, but once you create it, it will be easy to fill in for future projects.
Consider ALL costs in making the piece PLUS whatever you feel comfortable charging for your time/labor/creativity:
All physical material costs per piece - i.e. clay, glaze, packaging materials (consider the amount used and charge as a percentage of the total cost to purchase the supply)
All utilities used (i.e. electricity cost to run the kiln as a percentage - considering how much space the piece takes up)
A fraction of your total monthly studio and overhead costs (down to the hour so it can be applied to this formula) i.e. rent, heat, water, marketing, etc.
These numbers may be small, but will add up. Now you know approximately how much it costs YOU (out of your pocket) to have all you need physically to create, promote and ship the piece.
Next, consider your artistic rate per hour and how much time, effort and originality you are truly dedicating towards each piece. Your uniqueness is valuable and should be rewarded in a way that feels good to you!
Ideally, those numbers added together should be the minimum price for the piece. This is often adjusted, however, based on your limited supply (as you are one person and can only make so many pieces) and the demand for your work.
You may find that once you create and apply this formula, the price for your pieces make the most sense to you. This technique is not for everyone, as I am sure many will find it to be an unnecessary over-complication. Either way, it is an option ❤
A commun formula is (at least for small sellers and that i've seen it many times) : 2*(hour wage * time spent + material price + energy) (basicly 2 times everything it cost to make)
The 2 factor is for everything else, such as rent, water bill, time spent on communication etc... And is a margin to grow the company
These piece are gorgeous, I love the size geometry. Personally I love the “unfinished” look of raw clay
thinking about pricing which is an art in itself. I would go for a reduction of perhaps one third only off the standard size price, materials are maybe a small part but labour is just as huge a part in the making , perhaps timewise the same amount of time! Bonne chance, lovely work.
I don't know why but there's something quite cute about these small pots. I'm really curious how they'll look finished. As far as pricing goes, I'm no potter but from my own business experience you could always try shifting the margin - charging more for your usual work and take a loss on more unique projects. This way you can maintain the appearance of balanced pricing - since many buyers won't know about the difficulty and time needed to make pots like these. This approach also works for one-offs that are very labor intensive if you don't want to make them seem prohibitively expensive.
Great work as always.
Exactly what I was thinking.
Miniatures! I love making miniatures. Yesterday was my 64th mini YT short! Your work is exceptional!
As a baker I often fall into this same conundrum. Miniatures are presumed to be more expensive than large pieces. But miniatures are clearly harder to make and require much more repetition often requiring more of the most expensive materials, e.g. chocolate, fruit glazes, or other icings.
Some industry standards include selling only as sets. That way you receive multiples of your marginal profit. Simply charge more per piece. Often times the equivalent number of servings cost 3 to 5 times more if they are sold in miniature.
Finally, make sure to calculate the exact cost of making a piece in hours worked and materials consumed. As you will be receiving marginal profits it's best to know that you are receiving some profit.
Finally, although it's less creative small crafts require the exact same piece be made several times, some times dozen or hundreds of times, That way much greater speed is achieved reducing the total cost in labor time. Also some concessions for ease of creation may be necessary throwing more oblique angles, not throwing lids. Perhaps creating a template out of acrylic to automatize some production.
I think with pricing you just have to set an amount that you are happy to let the work go for .
If people understand and appreciate the labor they are YOUR customers ,if they dont get it they are another poters .
I think people who purchase hand crafted items enjoy the fact that they own something very different from a mass produced product .You buy into the one off uniqueness which I think is wonderful .
Trust your instincts. Perhaps, you can treat these like their larger-counterparts and apply a "discount?" If a full vessel, like this, is $400-what feels right to you? 50% off? 25%? Pricing is difficult; but, I will be among the first to try and get my hands on one. My mother just recently passed; I would love to use one of these as an urn for her remains
i’m thinking of opening an etsy to try and make some money for college definitely something i’ll have to think about soon I also loved your book,seeing old pictures of you tho is kinda weird you hair was sooooo blond!!! i really loved the section about your younger years
Great video. Pricing of small pottery has always been a difficult conundrum for me, as I can throw a large 15-20# vase and sell it for a couple hundred in the same time it takes to throw/handle a mug/small cup. Additionally I enjoy refining things as you do and the time investment just does not pan out for smaller potters.
So i either have to make less "refined" mugs or small objects that take less time and sell the same at the cost of my preferred aesthetics. Or just suck it up.
I wonder if a happy compromise might be to sell them in sets. Perhaps each pot in the set with a different glaze? That way the customer feels they're getting good value for their money and you have a better chance of recouping the time and effort that you put into them as you can price it higher than a single pot.
That's a great idea - I was thinking of selling the smaller vessel with a matching, larger piece too. Big and little, one sets off the other.
Your work is great, keep it up 💗
On price determination / discrimination: The artist is also the producer. So, there is a portion of price that is art, and a portion of production.
Also, there is a perception of the consumer that cheaper priced items are of less quality, which the artist surely attests is not the case. Resist lowering prices.
For the example of the smaller pots, my opinion would expect it to be a little cheaper than a larger pot and more than a small cup. However, because it is an art piece, I would not expect that a price would be structured upon a simple factor such as size. I feel artists should ask what the market will bear, and especially focus on not short selling items. I also feel it prudent for an artist to consider production time on items that they will be fairly compensated for, even if part of that compensation is in the joy of making. Willingness to purchase is the consumer's appreciation of the artist. I feel many artists are humble about pricing.
Amazing
I wish i could could gk tk the Yorkshire sculptor park but i have school and were kinda broke right now
Ayyy I've been waiting for this one
Apologies for a beginner question.. why don’t you throw the lid as part of the pot and cut it on the wheel. Wouldn’t that be quicker? ❤
Did you have to send a copy of your book to the British Library? I hear that's a legal requirement in the UK.
Have you been watching Tom Scott? Good question! I hope so. I imagine my publisher has sent a copy.
@@floriangadsby LOL yes, I have. You called it. Thanks for the reply! I guess that makes sense that they'd handle that sort of thing.
This is the age old question for potters: How much should I charge? I have thrown pottery on the wheel for 10 years. The sales that I participate in is at a major arts and education center in Denver, Colorado where students sell along side of instructors. I try to take into account the demographic of the customer base, my personal experience etc. I am an unknown hobbyist so my goal is to sell pottery to help pay for my classes and materials. You have potters who just want to clean out their garage of accumulated work and others who are trying to make a living through teaching and selling their work. It's hard to convince the potters who just want to get rid of pots, to put high enough prices on their work. Very low prices from some potters will devalue other's work in a sale like this.
For the last sale I used this formula and felt more confident in my prices and did quite well with sales. I probably will tweak it a little for the Christmas sale as I have become more extensive with my carving on items.
- Set a base price for each type of item looking at size, shape, difficulty etc. of just the piece without adornments. For instance Large bowl - $40, Medium bowl - $30, Small bowl - $20. (for me, throwing and triming is the easy and less time consuming part)
- Then add a certain amount for each time you've worked on the piece after it's thrown. For me it was $5 more for each thing I did to the pot. Simple carving, foot ring, trimming to thin or shape the pot, glaze dip, more than one color of glaze, brush work etc., etc.
- So a large bowl, trimmed to thin and shape, foot ring, carved decoration, glazed a single color would be $40 for the pot + $20 for extra handling = $60 price tag. Small bowl with same work would be $20+$20 for extras = $40 price tag. Or on the flip side a medium bowl with no trimming, no foot ring, only glaze for decoration would be $35.
The thing is with this formula you can adjust it to your liking, if you do intricate sgraffito work charge more for that particular design. This formula could also be as complex as you want to make it if you need to account for your time and material cost for example.
I think there is no good solution to this. Most people don't see the work that's put into making them. Maybe you could make small batches with limited numbers. That would automatically push the value up.
Good idea! A range that's considerably more rare deserves a higher price - but I could also show them this video to demonstrate how annoying they are to trim!
Inspiring
Do you make anything unglazed? I'd love to buy a small unglazed (inside & out) teapot off of you.
If you were a neophyte potter, the pricing question might be something you would think about.
But you are an artist with a known demand for your work. Consider what you yourself need, and price accordingly. We are not talking about a pile of beans to be sold by the pound. And you owe no one an explanation.
So, let’s say you’re a very experienced potter, it may not take you as long to throw and trim. But the time you spent learning to be faster needs to be taken into account. Otherwise your things will get cheaper and cheaper the better you get. Not a good way to price. Also, I think there is something about the artistic expression that is hard to value. I can look at your work and KNOW it’s your work, and would pay more, because of the artistry. I just don’t see how pottery can really be a money maker. And my thoughts are if you’re creating art, like you are, then you can command higher prices. However, most of what I see in markets lack originality. My goal is to create things that lean more towards art. I think you’ve nailed one of the better combinations of art and functionality.
Maybe selling in batches would work better? people might be more apt to spend a lot more if they are getting a matching set.
I think this may be the route I take! A little trio would work well, each in a slightly different tone of crackle glaze, from white grey to dark green.
@@floriangadsby Different tones/colours is a wonderful idea, would really add to the value of the set for little extra work.
I'm not a potter, or a craftsman per se for that matter, but I am in a line of work which requires a lot of training and where skills with your hands matter a lot. When pricing your work, you absolutely have to dare to charge enough for you to to be happy with the profit. Thousands of hours of training and experience have value if it's reflected in the quality of the work. Break even plus just a little is NOT enoguh.