Great point, I'm going to pin this comment to the top so others can discuss it with . I agree that return to zero is the probably the most important. Two of these guns aren't mine, they were tuned by professionals, spring weight should be matched to the users skill and grip pressure. I didn't have footage of the owner shooting them. I used to tune mine to shoot the softest, but lately I'm changing that. Now that you point that out, I didn't do enough talking about return to zero on these in a video, thanks for pointing that out. The only time I alluded to it was when I was saying how fast the XC begs you to run it. They both had an SRO and the same Cheely grip, I feel that's a great level playing field. the XC was easier to keep and get back on target, not by much but noticeably. I'll have to go back and look at all the footage for the dip. Might have been my skill slacking off or grip pressure loosening. I've seen the dip on some of my other guns, but couldn't go lower on the spring. I do have a tuned and external comped X Macro with perfect return to zero.
Ive had a couple atlas and return to zero is not marketing. Xc isn’t far behind the atlas. Ive had one of them too. I think return is more important than tracking the dot. How did the dwx return?
That DWX is definitely keeping up with the crowd! Great video brother! I just ordered the XC but the DWX is in my “must haves” for sure! Thanks and great job!
Chris, new to the channel, great review on these 3 guns! The Apache just looks so dam good as well the DWX!! I am like you, there is something about the recoil feel on the Stacatto XC that I can't quite explain - I love the way that gun shoots, hate the price....IMO it is one of the best shooting and most enjoyable guns on the market, no question. You probably have shot the Sig Sauer P226 X5 Legion - while not a 2011 platform, I was blown away by the low recoil of that gun. While it has that Sig flip it returns to zero or target very well, for less than half the price of the Stacatto XC that gun is the real deal for sure. I shot it alongside the Stacatto XC & P at the range putting about 150 rounds through each. The Sig X5 has less recoil and is a softer shooting gun that the Stacatto P.....hands down, no question!!!! I wound up buying the Sig X5 Legion over the XC because like you said, I could have it plus buy a Bul Armory Tac Pro for about $300 more than the XC!! Question if I may and hopefully get some of your thoughts on this gun build. I saw your comments over on Skips Guns channel on the Sig Sauer P365 XL or macro build out that he did. What is your opinion on building a Sig P365 XL or Macro with the Icharus lower, DPM barrel & comp, after market slide.......do you really notice a difference in recoil and performance, if so by how much. Really interested in the build because I want a carry gun that is fun to shoot with less recoil.....The Radian ramjet afterburner P365 videos got me excited from Nightwood Guns and 9 to 5 tactical on how good that reduction was in there opinion. I shot the new Sig Fuse the other day along with the Stacatto CS & C2......none of those guns excite me with the way they shoot and their recoil is harsh. I want a FUN to shoot soft recoil carry gun......looks like the Sig build is the ticket....Sorry for the long comment. Would really appreciate your thoughts!! Keep up the good work....Subscribed now.
First, have not shot the Sig 226 X5, I would really like to though. My first gun was a p226 when I was young. I've got some good information for you on the 365. I have a p365 macro with the Icarus polymer grip, a 4.3-in threaded true Precision barrel and a Herrington comp. I went with the polymer because I didn't want to spend $400 on the metal grip, when I put them both in my hand the metal one to me just wasn't that special and I really like the polymer at 130 bucks. As for the Harrington comp and the true Precision barrel, it really does change the gun accuracy wise and recoil wise, and you can get a spring kit to make it either shoot softer or get a better return to zero, whatever your flavor is. It's worth it to me. It's better than the standard built-in slide comp the macro has. I carry it often even though it's long as fuck it's still pretty thin and it's easy for me to carry, the length doesn't bother me. I too was blown away by all the p365 ramjet afterburners reviews, so I went and bought a p365x and last night I installed the ramjet on it, I'm going out to the range tomorrow to test it. What's great about it is it's still so small, it's about the length of a macro but that X grip is so tiny but you can fit a full hand on it, or these I can. I really feel like it's going to be a great build, although expensive. I'll be putting a video out on it and I'll share some information with everybody tomorrow, I doubt the video will be ready tomorrow okay but I'll get back to you.
Thanks man! I got a lot of great footage in the pipeline, been teaching myself a lot about tuning and working on them. Just built a custom 2011. It came out fantastic. Just have to find time to do the videos lol
I have talked to you on Reddit. I have the ported DWX by Impact Machine. The felt recoil is noticeably less than the XC,, we shoot them side-by-side, the Dan Wesson has brass grips and zero recoil. It's a clear winner all the way around the board with the ports, that said, I seem to have a slight accuracy issue since the porting. My friend has the unported dwx., the felt recoil is pretty harsh. Not much different than the Shadow 2. I went ahead and bought the staccato XL over the XC and I could not be happier. The XCs do occasionally have issues. The one we have at work stove pipes about every 600 rounds, my past experience with it led me to the XL. ✌️
Hey man! Glad to talk to you over here. That is some good info. That XL is a hefty beast. I never considered that one because I wanted to carry it sometimes. I've been on the fence about the ports for my DWX. It's great to hear that it makes it better than the XC, in thought it would. Sucks to hear about the accuracy part, can you give me more info!? I would agree it's similar to Shadow 2 with no ports.
@@MoneyShot_CM I have had my dwx since December 2022, so I've tried just about every combination of things on them including the trigger if you do have any other questions just let me know ✌️
staccato did a 10,000 round test on their P model shooting all wolf steel cased ammo with no cleanings. Those guns don't mess around. after I saw that and just loved the way they look i went and bought a staccato p and put a holosun 508t on it and everyone loves it. couple thousand rounds later and i also have not had any issues
Lol that's an insane test! I love it. Stuff like that is why I went that. Just ordered a 509t for this thing. Almost went 508t, I like that one too. I'm going to carry it so I didn't want something to fragile like the sro, didn't want to chance it
Great video! I was curious about the Apache compared to the xc. Im still waiting for my Apache to be shipped as it's said awaiting shipping for about a month and a half now. I'm not sure what the hold up is. I have the limited p and xc right now, and both are fantastic! Limited p definitely performs on xc lvl, but the xc takes it by a little bit. Keep up the grind, and congrats on the P.
@MoneyShot_CM holding my breath, I haven't got it yet. They've already tried canceling my order, saying it wasn't leagal in my state. "Washington" had to have my ffl sot set them straight 2x now. 🤣 Just need to get it before any more unconstitutional laws come in.
@@marcusd3212 Dude I was going to order an Apache but they told it was not legal in Wa because it was threaded 🤷🏻♂️ that was a month ago how did you order it?? Did you get it??
@bboystream3 still haven't got it as watchtower hasn't shipped it. But my ffl Is a sot and gunsmith. He called them said send me his gun it's my responsibility to make sure it's washington leagal.
@@MoneyShot_CM Absolutely amazing. I was hoping it would be as good as my cajunized p01…… turns out it’s better, right out of the box. Can’t explain the magic they’ve done to this gun, but it’s simply outstanding.
@@MoneyShot_CM So I called Cajun gun works, and they were all in on me getting a S2 compact instead of the DWX-C for a few reasons. I’m so glad I didn’t listen to them. I think it would have been somewhat redundant, given that I have the cajunized p01. The DWX-c (as you know) is just a different animal. Combining the ergos of the CZ75 with the 1911 somehow just works and makes for a flatter shooting, more accurate out of the box pistol than the p01. It makes no sense based on physics and bore axis, but yet it’s true- contrary to what the guys at Cajun gun works said. From most people who either own or have shot both- they seem to agree the DWX-C is the better shooting gun than the S2C
@SigAXG320 I think you made the absolute correct decision. I don't regret my s2c, it's great. I didn't buy the DWX compact at first because of no rail and optic plate. I'm not shy to have something milled for an optic, I got one of the first dwx's. But I really wanted a rail.
Probably need to take out a couple links LOL, I'm such a procrastinator. Since I got the watch I lost a shitload of weight and I just never got it resized. It's on my list but I don't go by the jewelry store much and I don't have a punch to fit it and I might have to use a needle like I did when I was younger, a sewing needle
I've been running CGW S2 SAO for a good while . I favor S2 Frame / Grip over 2011 . DWX is definitely a pistol I'm snagging . I'll more than likely go the Ghingis Komp route and use that in Open Division for 2Gun Matches . Even if I paid 2k for the DWX I'd still be under 3.2k with all mods I would want . Optic , Trigger Job , Comp and LOK Veloce Palm Swell grips is the mods I want .
I favor this easy ergos over 2011 as well. I think that's why I like my DWX so much. Don't give me wrong my Cheely grips are great, but I like my palm swells.. It sounds like a hell of a plan for the DWX. I just shot a ported one today and it was pretty nice. Not sure if I'll get mine ported though. I am thinking about the grandmaster Genghis comp for my staccato P .
@@MoneyShot_CM Man those Bul Armory are freaking tits for sure . I shot the Pro Tac 4.25 or whatever the Comp'd commander length is and it was outstanding. I'm a typical gun dude so my mind changes every 34.2 seconds . I'll probably end up getting whatever I'm thinking about for that 34 second time period lol
I’m fortunate enough to have a DWX and a XC. I really enjoy both of them but I must say I always end up putting a few more rounds through the XC when I have both at the range. There’s just a touch more enjoyment from that really soft feel. Oddly enough, I also have a prodigy and I prefer the prodigy grip to the XC. I may be the only person around with a prodigy grip on my XC soon. 😂
I can totally understand wanting to shoot the XC more than a dwx. It's fun to shoot. I'm looking forward making my DWX more comparable with some extra work. That's strange about The prodigy grip, are you talking about the stock prodigy grip? I don't think it's bad, but I think I like the Tac grip from Staccato better, My official choice would be something metal like the hero or from cheely
@@MoneyShot_CM the stock prodigy grip is a better shape for my hand. Its edges are contoured a bit. The stacatto is very blocky….kind of like a glock grip, which I despise.
@@jagpilotohio I thought the same thing when I picked up a C2 staccato, made me not want to buy it. I recently bought the staccato P and the tac grip Is completely different. My favorite non-metal lip is the MJD villain grip made from Kevlar carbon fiber and nylon, I love it.
@@jagpilotohio I paid $318 for mine, Worth every penny. There are discount codes out there. Still not as cheap as The prodigy grip, if you like that that's the way to go. That's an awesome price . Don't look up the price for the Phoenix Trinity hero or the Cheely, those metal grips are crazy expensive.
I'm pretty happy with it, and I haven't even got all the work done to it that I need. I did an ignition kit and a new grip and threw an optic on it, changed out the springs and it gets better every time I shoot it, oh I changed out the trigger too LOL.
@Aviation_Professional I think they were about equally flat, the XC was definitely softer and faster for me. My buddy leans to the watchtower like you.
Yeah that XC is great. The dwx was my most accurate, got a Wilson Combat that's just as good, but my crown Jewel is a 5.4 in 2011 that I built, I was able to control the barrel fit and lock up and that thing is crazy. No video on it yet though. I did build a commander model that's just about as accurate too.
Those two guns were not worked on by me, the owner paid someone to do them. I have heard the XC and all Staccato's fit Cheely grips easily. Don't know about the Apache. I do know on my last custom build, I use my old staccato p grip on a Cheely frame so I wouldn't scar up the real grip, or my hands lol. Both the Cheely grip and the staccato p grip for the same frame. That's all the first hand info I can give you.
1:30 sec in i can already sum the video up and tell you since the dwx trigger work an OR, dwx wins based on performance for price. Every video I watched on apache unless sponsored hard all say it's not worth price tag and QC sucks. Ive owned the dwx and a phenomenal pistol.
Agree, I would take it over these two any day. This video is kind of old but I'm sitting here thinking it's definitely still one of my favorites, I'm trying to think if it is still my favorite? I think my love comes from the uniqueness of it being a 2011 and having CZ ergonomics. I think the only gun I have that I like better is the custom 5.4 in comp build I did. It cost more to make than I bought the DWX4 though LOL.
@MoneyShot_CM ive been doing alot of research last month on apache and I'm so glad I didn't waste 4k. I'm sad I sold my dwx but I got a great price trade for it and my upgraded springfield prodigy has been amazing. For me if I'm opening over 2k it's hard to pass up masterpiece arms. Also you may want to check out the kimber 2k11 and alpha foxtrot romulus. Great video
They both had Cheely E2 grips, that made the comparison extra cool in my book, they were both set up nearly identical. I have shot both of these before with the stock grips and the Cheely was a big upgrade..
Yeah I agree. I got a buddy that has one, there's a short video on my channel showing it in slow motion, but I'll be putting out a longer more in depth one when I get a chance, he'll let me borrow it. It was going to be on my list to get next, but honestly I built a 5.4 -inch comp gun that shoots softer than anything I've ever shot so I don't really need to spend the money on it right now, maybe someday. Don't get me wrong I'm not a master gun builder or something it's just sheer physics the length and the weight of it makes it awesome. I do love that bull attack Pro. I would likely get the four and a quarter so I can carry it
Every You Tube review i have seen on the Bul Armory Tac 5 Pro, the reviewers just rave about that gun. I am like Chris, there is something about that Stacatto XC on the feel of the recoil that I just can't explain......it just feels like the softest shooting gun!! Wish the Bul Armory were available to test shoot. Next year they are coming out with that 6 ported barrel along with a comp on the end!!! That should be something even though I bet the current Tac Pro 5" shoots just as flat.
@kevinmcqueen9068 since I made this video, I had a chance to spend some time with the bul tac pro 5-in, I would take it over the XC. It's just too good and that's a hell of a lot cheaper. I haven't got the chance to shoot them back to back though and I would like to do that. I got a buddy that owns it so that won't be a problem.
Watchtower has seemingly way more technical issues with past guns compared to the XC. The XC is a beast. It truly is. Yey, it’s a Polymer frame, but who cares, what its gonna break? Lol no. It was done on purpose. Staccato XC is built to last. One guy on youtube did a 16,000 round review of his with only like 3 malfunctions in all of those. That says alot. Ive not seen one video on a watchtower gun with that round count. U chose wise with the staccato P.
Yeah that XC is magic Man. I heard about the watchtower Apache early issues, I think they got it fixed. The gun I was shooting belongs to my friend and it had early issues, he had to send it off to get it tuned. No way I would choose that over the XC. I don't even care about the polymer frame, even though I do prefer metal and I put that on most of my guns, my only issue is the plastic trigger LOL why? That's easy enough to swap out though. The staccato P is my first one. I figure there's no way I could go wrong with one of those, I've seen. Just too much good stuff about them. I'm only a couple hundred rounds in and I already know I love it. The xc was clearly the better of all three. I just wish it wasn't so expensive. Not that I can't afford it, but I'd rather stretch that money into multiple guns. it was really fun shooting both of them for the day, despite the early issues. That Apache really is a good gun, now that it's running, right lol. They were both already modded too, new cheely grips
Yey man the plastic curved trigger in the Staccato is definitely questionable. But like u said, it’s an easy fix. I think an Atlas trigger would be perfect for the XC. Yes, it is very pricy. But I think it pays for itself in the long run and that island comp. The P is beautiful and work horse like the XC. I think thats what I love about Staccatos so much. Yes they 2011’s but they also have that tactical combat aspect to them that most 1912 double stacks just dont have. Have you seen the kovert apache that is coming out? It looks pretty sick But I still cant see grabbing it over an XC. It is priced at 4500. 2011s are insanely priced. And the dwx is just s complete YES all way around. Cant find one for nothing though lol.
@a.d.c7941 I love flat triggers, when I saw that curved plastic one I wasn't excited. Now I just hate that it's plastic, the curve is not bad to me any more. I love the Atlas trigger, I put one in my Bul Armory 3.25 UL, it's fantastic. That Kovert version does look really good. I love that company, they are always chatting it up in the REDDIT Subs. The full size DWX is scarce now, I think maybe a change is coming, my evening I talk to is looking for it. People are trying to sell it for way above MSRP now, I hate that. Maybe the optic version is getting ready to hit the market. Had mine direct milled.
I was wondering if they were making an Optic version and that is why it is not being seen anymore. Hopefully that is what is going on. Yes Kovert seems to be a really cool company. That kovert apache is tempting. They are only making 500 of them so to have one of 500 would be awesome. But, I dont trust watchtower. So idk man.
Fastest and flattest is only one factor of many. I trust Staccato as a company more than any other. Staccato has proven to be more dependable than most, including Atlas. Aesthetics are personal preference. DW is UGLY IMO. Everyone knows at this point the Apache needs more work to be considered. Way too many negative reports.
Nah I bought two guns for the price of the XC. The P and a Wilson Combat Experior commander. And then built a custom 5.4 comp gun for half the price of the XC. No video on it yet. The XC is great, I love it, it just wasn't worth the price to me. Maybe I'll pick up one used some day. I wouldn't trade any of those three. Unfinished pic below photos.app.goo.gl/EcCh9WaqEDJvbw289
Maybe it's just me, but does the Apache Watchtower looks like the gun in John Wick 4? I know that it's different but I would like to know if I'm not the only one who's thinks this.
@@tonyhamilton6948 I don't think so, but I would have to go back and rewatch and look specifically.. you never know. It's a good looking gun I'll tell you that. If I had to choose on looks alone I would take it over the XC.
The amount of people that try to justify the DWX when compared to the XC and other mid/high tier 2011’s is crazy. Yes the DWX is a nice pistol. Its not XC or Apache nice
Not sure you fully listened to the video, I fully admitted that it was a third place pistol when compared to the other two and the XC was the top one. Maybe you skipped that part? What I said was for me, and for the money I'll take it over both of those any day. The extra performance isn't enough for double the price. I said that I can get two quality pistols for the price of One XC, in fact I did just that. At the end of the video I show the staccato p I got and then after that I got a Wilson Combat X9 Experior, both together cost 300 more than the XC. I like both of those individually better than the XC. The performance increase of the XC can almost be matched with a good Port or comp job on a DWX.
@@MoneyShot_CMnot sure where you got the idea that I was talking to you specifically regarding the DWX justification? Whole bunch of people all over RUclips making such claims that understand f$&k all about quality let alone shoot/train much. Some even try to compare the cheaper MAC 9 DS to a staccato which is laughable at best. How does someone’s opinion carry any weight if they have to pay someone else to do all their matching and fitting for them? Doesn’t make sense to me. I have the Apache. I have had mine since early February. The 3D printed grip is a flat out pos! I think it is completely unsafe to fire the pistol with the grip and have said this since the day I got mine. My grip screws were loose, thumb safeties fit like crap, trigger drug in the grip, magwell and main spring housing pin didn’t line up.. The first Apache I picked up was actually busted out in the main spring housing. #0114 and #0117. I did watch all of your video. I can appreciate your opinion but don’t have to agree with it.
@@PnP-td1mt well I assume since you were replying to my video that you were insinuating that I was trying to justify it. That's my bad I apologize. The Apache in this video has a Cheely grip on it now, but I felt the stock grip on it and it wasn't good. This one had problems as well and had to be sent out to be tuned. From when I hear I think they got that cleared up now and they're actually using mjd grips which are great. I have a Mach 9 and it's great, for what it is and how much it cost. Mine has been flawless but it isn't my staccato. I know what you mean about having to send your guns out to be fitted, I don't do that, I also only value people's opinion to a certain extent if they don't do their own work. I just built a custom 2011 from the ground up and I'll be putting up some videos here shortly because it turned out stellar. Again I read this early in the morning and just assume you were talking about the video and me, not in general. I apologize.
I think people are missing the “return to zero”. Recoil doesn’t matter if the gun snaps back on target.
The XC looked like it was “dipping” more.
I own an Apache with the stainless aggressive cheely E2 grip.
It’s an amazing gun. I just hate digging lead out of the comp lol
Great point, I'm going to pin this comment to the top so others can discuss it with .
I agree that return to zero is the probably the most important. Two of these guns aren't mine, they were tuned by professionals, spring weight should be matched to the users skill and grip pressure. I didn't have footage of the owner shooting them. I used to tune mine to shoot the softest, but lately I'm changing that. Now that you point that out, I didn't do enough talking about return to zero on these in a video, thanks for pointing that out. The only time I alluded to it was when I was saying how fast the XC begs you to run it.
They both had an SRO and the same Cheely grip, I feel that's a great level playing field. the XC was easier to keep and get back on target, not by much but noticeably. I'll have to go back and look at all the footage for the dip. Might have been my skill slacking off or grip pressure loosening. I've seen the dip on some of my other guns, but couldn't go lower on the spring. I do have a tuned and external comped X Macro with perfect return to zero.
Ive had a couple atlas and return to zero is not marketing. Xc isn’t far behind the atlas. Ive had one of them too. I think return is more important than tracking the dot. How did the dwx return?
Right away, I love the slide on the DWX
Thanks! Primary machine does excellent work, I think their camo jobs are the best. They have quite a few colors. Very subtle I think
That DWX is definitely keeping up with the crowd! Great video brother! I just ordered the XC but the DWX is in my “must haves” for sure! Thanks and great job!
Thanks and congrats on your purchase! XC is great, one of the best I think.
@@MoneyShot_CM great to hear! Keep up the good work!
Magwell for DWX is the pain on my ass
@@cui01984 oh really?
@@cui01984 have you tried the loc grips and mag well?
Chris, new to the channel, great review on these 3 guns! The Apache just looks so dam good as well the DWX!! I am like you, there is something about the recoil feel on the Stacatto XC that I can't quite explain - I love the way that gun shoots, hate the price....IMO it is one of the best shooting and most enjoyable guns on the market, no question. You probably have shot the Sig Sauer P226 X5 Legion - while not a 2011 platform, I was blown away by the low recoil of that gun. While it has that Sig flip it returns to zero or target very well, for less than half the price of the Stacatto XC that gun is the real deal for sure. I shot it alongside the Stacatto XC & P at the range putting about 150 rounds through each. The Sig X5 has less recoil and is a softer shooting gun that the Stacatto P.....hands down, no question!!!! I wound up buying the Sig X5 Legion over the XC because like you said, I could have it plus buy a Bul Armory Tac Pro for about $300 more than the XC!!
Question if I may and hopefully get some of your thoughts on this gun build. I saw your comments over on Skips Guns channel on the Sig Sauer P365 XL or macro build out that he did. What is your opinion on building a Sig P365 XL or Macro with the Icharus lower, DPM barrel & comp, after market slide.......do you really notice a difference in recoil and performance, if so by how much. Really interested in the build because I want a carry gun that is fun to shoot with less recoil.....The Radian ramjet afterburner P365 videos got me excited from Nightwood Guns and 9 to 5 tactical on how good that reduction was in there opinion. I shot the new Sig Fuse the other day along with the Stacatto CS & C2......none of those guns excite me with the way they shoot and their recoil is harsh. I want a FUN to shoot soft recoil carry gun......looks like the Sig build is the ticket....Sorry for the long comment.
Would really appreciate your thoughts!! Keep up the good work....Subscribed now.
First, have not shot the Sig 226 X5, I would really like to though. My first gun was a p226 when I was young.
I've got some good information for you on the 365. I have a p365 macro with the Icarus polymer grip, a 4.3-in threaded true Precision barrel and a Herrington comp. I went with the polymer because I didn't want to spend $400 on the metal grip, when I put them both in my hand the metal one to me just wasn't that special and I really like the polymer at 130 bucks. As for the Harrington comp and the true Precision barrel, it really does change the gun accuracy wise and recoil wise, and you can get a spring kit to make it either shoot softer or get a better return to zero, whatever your flavor is. It's worth it to me. It's better than the standard built-in slide comp the macro has.
I carry it often even though it's long as fuck it's still pretty thin and it's easy for me to carry, the length doesn't bother me. I too was blown away by all the p365 ramjet afterburners reviews, so I went and bought a p365x and last night I installed the ramjet on it, I'm going out to the range tomorrow to test it. What's great about it is it's still so small, it's about the length of a macro but that X grip is so tiny but you can fit a full hand on it, or these I can. I really feel like it's going to be a great build, although expensive. I'll be putting a video out on it and I'll share some information with everybody tomorrow, I doubt the video will be ready tomorrow okay but I'll get back to you.
Great video...I own both the dwx and xc love them both..they are both amazing guns in their categories..be safe out there brother
Thanks, appreciate that! Will do
Thanks for the video. I’d guess adding ports to the DWX would make some difference. All of the guns looked good 👍
It's on the list to do, I just haven't got the nuts to do it yet LOL
Brilliant analysis 👍
Thanks man! I got a lot of great footage in the pipeline, been teaching myself a lot about tuning and working on them. Just built a custom 2011. It came out fantastic. Just have to find time to do the videos lol
I have talked to you on Reddit. I have the ported DWX by Impact Machine. The felt recoil is noticeably less than the XC,, we shoot them side-by-side, the Dan Wesson has brass grips and zero recoil. It's a clear winner all the way around the board with the ports, that said, I seem to have a slight accuracy issue since the porting. My friend has the unported dwx., the felt recoil is pretty harsh. Not much different than the Shadow 2. I went ahead and bought the staccato XL over the XC and I could not be happier. The XCs do occasionally have issues. The one we have at work stove pipes about every 600 rounds, my past experience with it led me to the XL. ✌️
At what distance do you start to notice thr accuracy issues and how much deviation from your friends non ported DWX?
Hey man! Glad to talk to you over here. That is some good info. That XL is a hefty beast. I never considered that one because I wanted to carry it sometimes. I've been on the fence about the ports for my DWX. It's great to hear that it makes it better than the XC, in thought it would. Sucks to hear about the accuracy part, can you give me more info!?
I would agree it's similar to Shadow 2 with no ports.
@@awokeone7997about 10 yards
@@MoneyShot_CM I have had my dwx since December 2022, so I've tried just about every combination of things on them including the trigger if you do have any other questions just let me know ✌️
staccato did a 10,000 round test on their P model shooting all wolf steel cased ammo with no cleanings. Those guns don't mess around. after I saw that and just loved the way they look i went and bought a staccato p and put a holosun 508t on it and everyone loves it. couple thousand rounds later and i also have not had any issues
Lol that's an insane test! I love it. Stuff like that is why I went that. Just ordered a 509t for this thing. Almost went 508t, I like that one too. I'm going to carry it so I didn't want something to fragile like the sro, didn't want to chance it
Is there a source to this?
Go to the Staccato 2011 youtube page and search for the video titled "Stress Testing The Staccato P"
Will definitely check it out
Ok I checked it out, great video. I like the inspection at the end just to back it up
Great video, and beautiful gun man
Thank you very much!
Great video! I was curious about the Apache compared to the xc. Im still waiting for my Apache to be shipped as it's said awaiting shipping for about a month and a half now. I'm not sure what the hold up is. I have the limited p and xc right now, and both are fantastic! Limited p definitely performs on xc lvl, but the xc takes it by a little bit. Keep up the grind, and congrats on the P.
Thanks man! Congrats on your Apache, great gun!
@MoneyShot_CM holding my breath, I haven't got it yet. They've already tried canceling my order, saying it wasn't leagal in my state. "Washington" had to have my ffl sot set them straight 2x now. 🤣 Just need to get it before any more unconstitutional laws come in.
@@marcusd3212 that is crazy! Couldn't imagine those restrictions.
@@marcusd3212 Dude I was going to order an Apache but they told it was not legal in Wa because it was threaded 🤷🏻♂️ that was a month ago how did you order it?? Did you get it??
@bboystream3 still haven't got it as watchtower hasn't shipped it. But my ffl Is a sot and gunsmith. He called them said send me his gun it's my responsibility to make sure it's washington leagal.
Just picked a DWX compact with the rail and RDO slide. Can’t wait to shoot it. I also plan on getting the XC later this year.
I've been eyeballing the compact, I love the full size. How is it so far?
@@MoneyShot_CM
Absolutely amazing. I was hoping it would be as good as my cajunized p01…… turns out it’s better, right out of the box. Can’t explain the magic they’ve done to this gun, but it’s simply outstanding.
@SigAXG320 I definitely need one. I love my shadow compact but I think that DWX compact will be better for me. Love CZ egos
@@MoneyShot_CM
So I called Cajun gun works, and they were all in on me getting a S2 compact instead of the DWX-C for a few reasons. I’m so glad I didn’t listen to them. I think it would have been somewhat redundant, given that I have the cajunized p01. The DWX-c (as you know) is just a different animal. Combining the ergos of the CZ75 with the 1911 somehow just works and makes for a flatter shooting, more accurate out of the box pistol than the p01. It makes no sense based on physics and bore axis, but yet it’s true- contrary to what the guys at Cajun gun works said. From most people who either own or have shot both- they seem to agree the DWX-C is the better shooting gun than the S2C
@SigAXG320 I think you made the absolute correct decision. I don't regret my s2c, it's great. I didn't buy the DWX compact at first because of no rail and optic plate. I'm not shy to have something milled for an optic, I got one of the first dwx's. But I really wanted a rail.
Take an extra link out that Movado watch. Looking a little loose.
Probably need to take out a couple links LOL, I'm such a procrastinator. Since I got the watch I lost a shitload of weight and I just never got it resized. It's on my list but I don't go by the jewelry store much and I don't have a punch to fit it and I might have to use a needle like I did when I was younger, a sewing needle
Good video brother
Thanks man!
I've been running CGW S2 SAO for a good while . I favor S2 Frame / Grip over 2011 . DWX is definitely a pistol I'm snagging . I'll more than likely go the Ghingis Komp route and use that in Open Division for 2Gun Matches .
Even if I paid 2k for the DWX I'd still be under 3.2k with all mods I would want . Optic , Trigger Job , Comp and LOK Veloce Palm Swell grips is the mods I want .
I favor this easy ergos over 2011 as well. I think that's why I like my DWX so much. Don't give me wrong my Cheely grips are great, but I like my palm swells.. It sounds like a hell of a plan for the DWX. I just shot a ported one today and it was pretty nice. Not sure if I'll get mine ported though. I am thinking about the grandmaster Genghis comp for my staccato P .
Oh I forgot to mention I shot the 5-in Bull tack Pro today and it is the best shit man. I liked it way better than the XC and the Apache
@@MoneyShot_CM Man those Bul Armory are freaking tits for sure . I shot the Pro Tac 4.25 or whatever the Comp'd commander length is and it was outstanding.
I'm a typical gun dude so my mind changes every 34.2 seconds . I'll probably end up getting whatever I'm thinking about for that 34 second time period lol
I’m fortunate enough to have a DWX and a XC. I really enjoy both of them but I must say I always end up putting a few more rounds through the XC when I have both at the range. There’s just a touch more enjoyment from that really soft feel. Oddly enough, I also have a prodigy and I prefer the prodigy grip to the XC. I may be the only person around with a prodigy grip on my XC soon. 😂
I can totally understand wanting to shoot the XC more than a dwx. It's fun to shoot. I'm looking forward making my DWX more comparable with some extra work. That's strange about The prodigy grip, are you talking about the stock prodigy grip? I don't think it's bad, but I think I like the Tac grip from Staccato better, My official choice would be something metal like the hero or from cheely
@@MoneyShot_CM the stock prodigy grip is a better shape for my hand. Its edges are contoured a bit. The stacatto is very blocky….kind of like a glock grip, which I despise.
@@jagpilotohio I thought the same thing when I picked up a C2 staccato, made me not want to buy it. I recently bought the staccato P and the tac grip Is completely different. My favorite non-metal lip is the MJD villain grip made from Kevlar carbon fiber and nylon, I love it.
@@MoneyShot_CM $379? Ouch. No thanks. I can buy a prodigy grip for $40. 😁
@@jagpilotohio I paid $318 for mine, Worth every penny. There are discount codes out there. Still not as cheap as The prodigy grip, if you like that that's the way to go. That's an awesome price . Don't look up the price for the Phoenix Trinity hero or the Cheely, those metal grips are crazy expensive.
One reason the XC felt recoil is softer is due to the plastic grip vs the watchtower’s steel or aluminum grip
Not sure if you could see it in the video and I don't remember if I discussed it or not, but both of these have the Cheely E2 grips on them.
smart buy on the P. the best bang for the buck in the market, gmgk and you're at 90% of XC, at sub $3.
I'm pretty happy with it, and I haven't even got all the work done to it that I need. I did an ignition kit and a new grip and threw an optic on it, changed out the springs and it gets better every time I shoot it, oh I changed out the trigger too LOL.
No the real winner is the DWX. Not ported and shoots flat as hell. For less money and much cheaper and more reliable mags. Port it!
I've been thinking about it, my buddy got his ported and it's pretty nice.
Watchtower seems flattest, but I get the price point issue and the comps
@Aviation_Professional I think they were about equally flat, the XC was definitely softer and faster for me. My buddy leans to the watchtower like you.
I have all three and before I got the XC I thought the Dex was the most accurate pistol I ever shot.
Yeah that XC is great. The dwx was my most accurate, got a Wilson Combat that's just as good, but my crown Jewel is a 5.4 in 2011 that I built, I was able to control the barrel fit and lock up and that thing is crazy. No video on it yet though. I did build a commander model that's just about as accurate too.
Alien has joined the chat... Your time is over ... :D
Not even. Although the new Remus Alien is cool.
Hi, did you have any fitment issues putting the E2 on either the Watchtower or Xc or did they fit as is?
Those two guns were not worked on by me, the owner paid someone to do them. I have heard the XC and all Staccato's fit Cheely grips easily. Don't know about the Apache. I do know on my last custom build, I use my old staccato p grip on a Cheely frame so I wouldn't scar up the real grip, or my hands lol. Both the Cheely grip and the staccato p grip for the same frame. That's all the first hand info I can give you.
1:30 sec in i can already sum the video up and tell you since the dwx trigger work an OR, dwx wins based on performance for price. Every video I watched on apache unless sponsored hard all say it's not worth price tag and QC sucks. Ive owned the dwx and a phenomenal pistol.
Agree, I would take it over these two any day. This video is kind of old but I'm sitting here thinking it's definitely still one of my favorites, I'm trying to think if it is still my favorite? I think my love comes from the uniqueness of it being a 2011 and having CZ ergonomics. I think the only gun I have that I like better is the custom 5.4 in comp build I did. It cost more to make than I bought the DWX4 though LOL.
@MoneyShot_CM ive been doing alot of research last month on apache and I'm so glad I didn't waste 4k. I'm sad I sold my dwx but I got a great price trade for it and my upgraded springfield prodigy has been amazing. For me if I'm opening over 2k it's hard to pass up masterpiece arms. Also you may want to check out the kimber 2k11 and alpha foxtrot romulus. Great video
Thanks for the vid. Did you say the Staccato had a Cheely on it as well or did it have the stock polymer grip?
They both had Cheely E2 grips, that made the comparison extra cool in my book, they were both set up nearly identical. I have shot both of these before with the stock grips and the Cheely was a big upgrade..
Sorry if I missed it, was the XC a steel frame?
Yes the XC has a steel frame. No aluminum frame XC or there that I'm aware of.
Get a Bul Armory Tac Pro 5inch shoots just as flat if not flatter then XC for 2400 and has better trigger
Yeah I agree. I got a buddy that has one, there's a short video on my channel showing it in slow motion, but I'll be putting out a longer more in depth one when I get a chance, he'll let me borrow it. It was going to be on my list to get next, but honestly I built a 5.4 -inch comp gun that shoots softer than anything I've ever shot so I don't really need to spend the money on it right now, maybe someday. Don't get me wrong I'm not a master gun builder or something it's just sheer physics the length and the weight of it makes it awesome. I do love that bull attack Pro. I would likely get the four and a quarter so I can carry it
@@MoneyShot_CM yea I have the 4.25 Tac couldn’t get the Pro was sold out but just got it ported as soon as I got it. It’s awesome pistol.
Every You Tube review i have seen on the Bul Armory Tac 5 Pro, the reviewers just rave about that gun. I am like Chris, there is something about that Stacatto XC on the feel of the recoil that I just can't explain......it just feels like the softest shooting gun!! Wish the Bul Armory were available to test shoot. Next year they are coming out with that 6 ported barrel along with a comp on the end!!! That should be something even though I bet the current Tac Pro 5" shoots just as flat.
@kevinmcqueen9068 since I made this video, I had a chance to spend some time with the bul tac pro 5-in, I would take it over the XC. It's just too good and that's a hell of a lot cheaper. I haven't got the chance to shoot them back to back though and I would like to do that. I got a buddy that owns it so that won't be a problem.
Just port the DWX and it should be right there. Hard to ask a non compd gun to do comp things
Maybe someday, it's on the list
Watchtower has seemingly way more technical issues with past guns compared to the XC. The XC is a beast. It truly is. Yey, it’s a Polymer frame, but who cares, what its gonna break? Lol no. It was done on purpose. Staccato XC is built to last. One guy on youtube did a 16,000 round review of his with only like 3 malfunctions in all of those. That says alot. Ive not seen one video on a watchtower gun with that round count. U chose wise with the staccato P.
Yeah that XC is magic Man. I heard about the watchtower Apache early issues, I think they got it fixed. The gun I was shooting belongs to my friend and it had early issues, he had to send it off to get it tuned. No way I would choose that over the XC. I don't even care about the polymer frame, even though I do prefer metal and I put that on most of my guns, my only issue is the plastic trigger LOL why? That's easy enough to swap out though. The staccato P is my first one. I figure there's no way I could go wrong with one of those, I've seen. Just too much good stuff about them. I'm only a couple hundred rounds in and I already know I love it. The xc was clearly the better of all three. I just wish it wasn't so expensive. Not that I can't afford it, but I'd rather stretch that money into multiple guns. it was really fun shooting both of them for the day, despite the early issues. That Apache really is a good gun, now that it's running, right lol. They were both already modded too, new cheely grips
Yey man the plastic curved trigger in the Staccato is definitely questionable. But like u said, it’s an easy fix. I think an Atlas trigger would be perfect for the XC. Yes, it is very pricy. But I think it pays for itself in the long run and that island comp. The P is beautiful and work horse like the XC. I think thats what I love about Staccatos so much. Yes they 2011’s but they also have that tactical combat aspect to them that most 1912 double stacks just dont have. Have you seen the kovert apache that is coming out? It looks pretty sick But I still cant see grabbing it over an XC. It is priced at 4500. 2011s are insanely priced. And the dwx is just s complete YES all way around. Cant find one for nothing though lol.
@a.d.c7941 I love flat triggers, when I saw that curved plastic one I wasn't excited. Now I just hate that it's plastic, the curve is not bad to me any more. I love the Atlas trigger, I put one in my Bul Armory 3.25 UL, it's fantastic. That Kovert version does look really good. I love that company, they are always chatting it up in the REDDIT Subs. The full size DWX is scarce now, I think maybe a change is coming, my evening I talk to is looking for it. People are trying to sell it for way above MSRP now, I hate that. Maybe the optic version is getting ready to hit the market. Had mine direct milled.
I was wondering if they were making an Optic version and that is why it is not being seen anymore. Hopefully that is what is going on. Yes Kovert seems to be a really cool company. That kovert apache is tempting. They are only making 500 of them so to have one of 500 would be awesome. But, I dont trust watchtower. So idk man.
Fastest and flattest is only one factor of many. I trust Staccato as a company more than any other. Staccato has proven to be more dependable than most, including Atlas. Aesthetics are personal preference. DW is UGLY IMO. Everyone knows at this point the Apache needs more work to be considered. Way too many negative reports.
Should have just gotten an XC oh well fire arms hold value and you can make a trade.
Nah I bought two guns for the price of the XC. The P and a Wilson Combat Experior commander. And then built a custom 5.4 comp gun for half the price of the XC. No video on it yet. The XC is great, I love it, it just wasn't worth the price to me. Maybe I'll pick up one used some day. I wouldn't trade any of those three. Unfinished pic below
photos.app.goo.gl/EcCh9WaqEDJvbw289
Your not waering your watch correctly. It should be tighter and behind the wrist bone.
Lost a bunch of weight, this is old footage, it has been corrected, thanks 👍
I hate to admin it but my friends xc feels better to shoot that my atlas athena
I can believe that, the Athena isn't comped. XC shoots soft
White Sarah Thompson William Moore Brian
I like the Apache Watchtower but ALL of these should be in the Next GTA 6 game.
It's a nice gun, That would be extra special if they showed up there.
Maybe it's just me, but does the Apache Watchtower looks like the gun in John Wick 4? I know that it's different but I would like to know if I'm not the only one who's thinks this.
@@tonyhamilton6948 I don't think so, but I would have to go back and rewatch and look specifically.. you never know. It's a good looking gun I'll tell you that. If I had to choose on looks alone I would take it over the XC.
Jesus christ dude, get that watch fitted.
Old video, didn't get it fitted until I was done losing weight. Don't let it run your night
The amount of people that try to justify the DWX when compared to the XC and other mid/high tier 2011’s is crazy.
Yes the DWX is a nice pistol. Its not XC or Apache nice
Not sure you fully listened to the video, I fully admitted that it was a third place pistol when compared to the other two and the XC was the top one. Maybe you skipped that part? What I said was for me, and for the money I'll take it over both of those any day. The extra performance isn't enough for double the price.
I said that I can get two quality pistols for the price of One XC, in fact I did just that. At the end of the video I show the staccato p I got and then after that I got a Wilson Combat X9 Experior, both together cost 300 more than the XC. I like both of those individually better than the XC. The performance increase of the XC can almost be matched with a good Port or comp job on a DWX.
@@MoneyShot_CMnot sure where you got the idea that I was talking to you specifically regarding the DWX justification?
Whole bunch of people all over RUclips making such claims that understand f$&k all about quality let alone shoot/train much.
Some even try to compare the cheaper MAC 9 DS to a staccato which is laughable at best.
How does someone’s opinion carry any weight if they have to pay someone else to do all their matching and fitting for them? Doesn’t make sense to me.
I have the Apache. I have had mine since early February.
The 3D printed grip is a flat out pos! I think it is completely unsafe to fire the pistol with the grip and have said this since the day I got mine.
My grip screws were loose, thumb safeties fit like crap, trigger drug in the grip, magwell and main spring housing pin didn’t line up..
The first Apache I picked up was actually busted out in the main spring housing. #0114 and #0117.
I did watch all of your video. I can appreciate your opinion but don’t have to agree with it.
@@PnP-td1mt well I assume since you were replying to my video that you were insinuating that I was trying to justify it. That's my bad I apologize. The Apache in this video has a Cheely grip on it now, but I felt the stock grip on it and it wasn't good. This one had problems as well and had to be sent out to be tuned. From when I hear I think they got that cleared up now and they're actually using mjd grips which are great. I have a Mach 9 and it's great, for what it is and how much it cost. Mine has been flawless but it isn't my staccato. I know what you mean about having to send your guns out to be fitted, I don't do that, I also only value people's opinion to a certain extent if they don't do their own work. I just built a custom 2011 from the ground up and I'll be putting up some videos here shortly because it turned out stellar. Again I read this early in the morning and just assume you were talking about the video and me, not in general. I apologize.
ugh, watch guys.. guido drip/