Can you please do a video where 3 bike fitters all do a fit for one rider, then they have to discuss with each other how none of their fits are identical and explain their reasoning. I’d find that fascinating
This is why you can do your own bike fit, you know your body and what feels good for you, and there is enough information on the internet to figure any part of it out.
Had a bike fit with Luke last month after 30 years of riding racing. Luke has changed several things a small amount, and my ride quality, comfort, connection to the bike has changed so much for the better it's incredible, thoroughly recommended.
Good overview, however one thing i'd point out is that tilting the saddle slightly down can have some benefits too, as in creating some important space to allow you to "roll your pelvis" (anteriorly). This can substantially reduce pressure in your lower back and smoothen your spine curvature and allow better upper back rounding + proper ribcage/diaphragm + scapular engagement, with the latter, as a result, also helping in freeing up your neck. Kind of important for lower back pain in people that naturally have a posterior pelvic tilt or that struggle with glutes and hamstrings stretch/recruitment and especially helpful to preserve comfort when in need of switching into drop position for a prolonged amount of time (ie strong headwinds). Yes the downside is that you will shift your center of mass slightly forward, have more pressure on hands and give your triceps some workout depending on your reach and stack measurements. How slippery the saddle is also limits you in this regard and makes this adjustment less worthy. Something for something.
I solved a few problem of mine by keeping the saddle slightly tilted for some time. As I have slight anterior pelvis tilt it was natural for me to tilt it. Also weak knees from iregular riding and problems with 2nd vertebra made me lift my saddle a bit higher, therapeutically kept it for a year and slowly adjusting it to more stable position as I grew stronger over the months
Had a fit with Luke back in January and had a recent follow up fit where we made some further smaller adjustments. We made some pretty substantial changes to all contact points and as expected it’s taken a while to adjust. Comfort levels have gone up massively and my pedal stroke feels much more planted. I’ve been riding bikes for a long time and it’s reassuring to have support from fitters like Luke who are able to take into account each person’s particular injury history/nuances. Highly recommended!
This is helpful. I'm a mid aged rider in my 60's and have made a bunch of adjustments even with a newer bike. But seeing this, I will revisit all these areas for increasing comfort, etc. My last century ride could have been much more comfortable.
#4 Saddle Angle - I've seen a LOT of bikes with the saddle angled down in front which I thought was "wrong" but didn't know why. Thanks for the good explanation that this typically is the sign of a fit issue.
I ride in a more aggressive fit than what my bike fitter prescribed but that means I have to stretch more and do some not-so-sexy S&C work every other day. I actually enjoy the process! ❤
I fell into the Q factor issue. I ran it so long and rode so much my inner quad muscle wilted away because I was flaring my knees. I pushed my cleats in on my shoes and added spacers and my Vastus medialis is coming back.
I wish bike geometry was better. All the websites say I should be a 54 medium (I'm 5'9"). I went to a bike shop to try a Specialized Allez and the 52 small (5'4" to 5'7") fit me perfectly. Without checking I would never have thought a bike "meant" for someone 5" shorter than me would fit. For reference I also tried a Trek and a Giant and I found the small fitted me best as well.
Completely agree. On some I fit right in the middle of a large frame (I'm 185cm / 6'1") on others I sit at the extremity of a large and the beginning of an XL. There's no standard size which is partly why these fit services seem to be promoted more and more.
#2 Shoe Fit - YES! I'm rather annoyed with the cycling shoe industry in that cycling shoes are made to look cool, not to fit a foot. Even Lake shoes (my favorite) are too pointy in the toe area with the exception of their very limited selection of shoes built on the "comfort plus" last.
I had a guy at a shop I used all the time talk me into going a little shorter on my cranks in 1991. I have since moved up to 175 because that is what comes on bike in my size. I guess he was ahead of his time. I've also always use 44cm bars. Just recently a fitter told me I would be better with a 42. I put 42 on my new bike and I have to say I do like it better.
I bought my bike from a popular shop in Miami. My bike fit took literally 5 minutes and the guy said it was fine. I have at least 3 issues brought up by this video (numbness in my hands, constantly adjusting in the saddle, feeling like I’m dropping forward from the saddle). Should I assume my saddle is too high?
Regarding the hand position. Imho it really depends what kind of effort you doing. If I go slowly up a hill, I could easily do with 10-20mm less stem length. If I do threshold effort on the flats, I feel like stem length could be 10-20mm longer.
Everything in bike fitting (and life?) is a compromise. There is no single option that works "best" for everything, so considering your individual needs, preferences and things like times in each of those related use case are variables for use to make a decision on setup and component selection.
Great video, unlike some other channels (C@de), the bike fitter isn't some shouty zealot! I checked my road bike, found it was 1 cm higher than my other bikes 😮
How do you calculate the width your feet where they need to be as it is often glossed over. I often see cranks worn on used bikes like the shoes have been rubbing on the cranks. Could there be a calculation of hip width minus foot width to calculate your pedal centreline. Another thing with sitting to one side of a bike or the other this could be because often a bike has a longer Axel on the drive side to compensate for chainrings on that side. So adding spacers to get the right width might need to be done on the non drive side a couple of mm. Just a thought?
The variation between manufacturers in their frame sizes is an annoyance. I'm 185cm / 6'1" tall. For some I fit right in the middle of a large frame, e.g. Ridley, yet for say Ribble I sit at the top end of a large and the beginning of an XL. Some manufacturers have distinct frame ranges, while others have overlaps between frame sizes. Then we have the differences between bike fitters. One may recommend a bike be set up a certain way, but another may suggest a different set up. What's the solution?
Hi there, you want to aim for more consistent power throughout the pedal stroke to share the load across more muscle groups For example, 1-5 o'clock would be an improvement on 2-4
first thing to be comfy on the bike is to buy endurance oriented bike :) today everyone has racing bike, it is like every car on the road was superstiff sports car, and then we would want to be comfy inside :)
IDK, my inseam dictates a 52 cm frame and my height dictates a 56 cm frame. So I compromised and got a 54 cm frame. However, my arms are apparently shorter than normal for my height. Therefore, it seems that to reach the hoods causes me to slip towards the nose of the saddle while riding. So maybe I need a 52 cm frame. Or I need to install a shorter stem or I need to install a stem that is angled up. I really do not know what to do. Please advise?
Shorter stem, maybe shorter reach bars, move brake levers up the bars a bit, perhaps turn the levers slightly inward. Also, experiment with the amount of saddle set back. You may need shorter cranks to get the seat up to a better height. Yes, I have the same issue. In my case, shorter cranks (172.5 to 165), shorter stem and less seat post setback solved the issues.
To get the right size frame, you have to pick the one that perfectly balances (with the appropriate set back on the seatpost) your weight when pedaling under moderate or typical effort. This means that your hands will float on the top of the bars with very little pressure, when you pedal. Your the position of your hips relative to the BB is what allows your upper body to be cantilevered over the hoods and achieve such a balance. See where your hands fall naturally, when you are in a riding position and pedaling. Choose the frame that best accommodates: 1) fore/aft balance and 2) hand position by the choice of top tube and stem length. Try to pick a frame that gives you a stem length of 80-120mm, inverting and adding spacers if necessary. A bike fitter can figure all of this out using a fitting device that allows for the saddle and bars to be moved. Many people can be fitted correctly on two different frame sizes (with different choices of seat post and stem), but I find that the smaller frame handles better with a longer stem, than the opposite. In your case, I think an endurance style frame (e.g. Trek Domane, Giant Defy) will fit best because of its high stack and short reach. You can also fit it with a shorter crank (165mm) for more comfort.
@@bengt_axle Thank you for the reply. My bike is a Domane. I got to ride it yesterday. The problem is that my torso is so long and my reach so short that my arms are almost at 80 degrees. And I cannot set upright at all because my torso has to be bent over to reach the bars. And thus the weight of my torso has to be held up by my arms and hands. And that causes me to slide forward on the saddle because the saddle is not carrying my weight. A shorter bike would cause my arms to be straight down and a longer bike would make me have to bend over even further. So the only solution I see is to raise the handlebars by about 4 inches.
@@michaelsherwin4449 You need to slide the saddle back as far as possible. Racing seatposts have a setback of 32mm, so as to allow the racers to use a smaller frame and balance their weight and take the load off the hands, just like you are currently experiencing. Additionally, you may find that a saddle like SMP Dynamic which is very curved, will allow you to raise the nose, shift the balance to the back and relieve hand pressure, all without increasing pressure on your anterior perineal area. But the first approach should be to slide the saddle back. To try an experiment, go to a spin bike studio and then try different positions of saddle setback and see how they affect your hands. Take measurements of the most comfortable positions and then try to reproduce on your Domane. You also must learn to sit on a road bike with your core engaged (i.e. pull in belly button a bit and lift pelvic floor slightly). A strong core will help support your torso. Look up a picture of Johan Vansummaren, when he was riding for Garmin or Agr2. He looks like a giant on a tiny bike. It is possible to get a functional fit, even for an odd morphology.
How do you know what crank length is the right one? I'm 1.76m and I use schimano 172.5mm Often I feel the stroke is very long and takes forever to do a revolution. I haven't tried shorter but I wouldn't want to purchase one and realise is not the right one... os there a recommendation in this respect?
I am 176.5 and I have 172.5mm crank and they feel perfect for me. I do have a slightly longer leg than body so have no issues. I do have other bikes with 170mm cranks and they feel fine as well. The number one thing is not to concentrate on your height as you could have large head or long body or neck and short legs. Work around your legs not your height and a 170mm crank sounds like a good move.
The belief it makes them more aero, understandable for pros and high grade racers but not average cyclists. That aside virtually all bike filters advise against too narrow bars for most cyclists. @@Chader9
You know, I see that comment a lot, but if you think about it, pretty much everyone copies the pros. Isnt it true that everyone goes out and makes sure that they have sram red or shimano dura ace on their bikes, and dont they make sure the bikes that they get are "Specialized" or "Trek", or "Bianchi" or something like that? How come nobody just goes to wal-mart and buys a bike that pedals just like those bikes, or rides their daddies bike from the 1950s? EVERYONE tries to do what the pros do.
For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Romans 6:23) Therefore also now, saith the LORD, turn ye even to me with all your heart, and with fasting, and with weeping, and with mourning: And rend your heart, and not your garments, and turn unto the LORD your God: for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and repenteth him of the evil. (Joel 2:12-13) I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish. (Luke 13:5)
I like ti save the power of my calf muscles for hill climbing when my legs quads and hamstrings are exaughsted or I just dont want to use them as much at that time, ia this when you think that they sould be used? When do you uae them? When do you think that they should be used and how often?
![ARGENTINA vs. PERÚ [1-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 12](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/xtI25ENDDSY/mqdefault.jpg)
Can you please do a video where 3 bike fitters all do a fit for one rider, then they have to discuss with each other how none of their fits are identical and explain their reasoning. I’d find that fascinating
100%. You can have multiple fitters "fit" you and each fit will be different.
That's a good point. A couple other guys that comes to mind are Scott Maclean of Bulletproof Cycling and Neil Standbury of Road Cycling Academy.
This is why you can do your own bike fit, you know your body and what feels good for you, and there is enough information on the internet to figure any part of it out.
@@DryhumorGuy-1 Lots of videos here on YT which provide a wealth of info.
That would be a great video. It’s one of the reasons i haven’t done one yet
Had a bike fit with Luke last month after 30 years of riding racing. Luke has changed several things a small amount, and my ride quality, comfort, connection to the bike has changed so much for the better it's incredible, thoroughly recommended.
That was an excellent vid on bike fitting......Really like the way this guy delivers the information👍🏻👍🏻
the best video on bike fitting theory on youtube. Give the man a drink on me
Good overview, however one thing i'd point out is that tilting the saddle slightly down can have some benefits too, as in creating some important space to allow you to "roll your pelvis" (anteriorly). This can substantially reduce pressure in your lower back and smoothen your spine curvature and allow better upper back rounding + proper ribcage/diaphragm + scapular engagement, with the latter, as a result, also helping in freeing up your neck.
Kind of important for lower back pain in people that naturally have a posterior pelvic tilt or that struggle with glutes and hamstrings stretch/recruitment and especially helpful to preserve comfort when in need of switching into drop position for a prolonged amount of time (ie strong headwinds).
Yes the downside is that you will shift your center of mass slightly forward, have more pressure on hands and give your triceps some workout depending on your reach and stack measurements. How slippery the saddle is also limits you in this regard and makes this adjustment less worthy. Something for something.
I solved a few problem of mine by keeping the saddle slightly tilted for some time. As I have slight anterior pelvis tilt it was natural for me to tilt it.
Also weak knees from iregular riding and problems with 2nd vertebra made me lift my saddle a bit higher, therapeutically kept it for a year and slowly adjusting it to more stable position as I grew stronger over the months
Had a fit with Luke back in January and had a recent follow up fit where we made some further smaller adjustments. We made some pretty substantial changes to all contact points and as expected it’s taken a while to adjust. Comfort levels have gone up massively and my pedal stroke feels much more planted. I’ve been riding bikes for a long time and it’s reassuring to have support from fitters like Luke who are able to take into account each person’s particular injury history/nuances. Highly recommended!
Great video. I loved hearing a fit specialist talk about shoe width. Super overlooked and very fixable source of problems!
This is helpful. I'm a mid aged rider in my 60's and have made a bunch of adjustments even with a newer bike. But seeing this, I will revisit all these areas for increasing comfort, etc. My last century ride could have been much more comfortable.
#4 Saddle Angle - I've seen a LOT of bikes with the saddle angled down in front which I thought was "wrong" but didn't know why. Thanks for the good explanation that this typically is the sign of a fit issue.
I ride in a more aggressive fit than what my bike fitter prescribed but that means I have to stretch more and do some not-so-sexy S&C work every other day. I actually enjoy the process! ❤
I fell into the Q factor issue. I ran it so long and rode so much my inner quad muscle wilted away because I was flaring my knees. I pushed my cleats in on my shoes and added spacers and my Vastus medialis is coming back.
Very clear video, and explanation. Thanks for posting it.
I wish bike geometry was better. All the websites say I should be a 54 medium (I'm 5'9"). I went to a bike shop to try a Specialized Allez and the 52 small (5'4" to 5'7") fit me perfectly. Without checking I would never have thought a bike "meant" for someone 5" shorter than me would fit. For reference I also tried a Trek and a Giant and I found the small fitted me best as well.
Completely agree. On some I fit right in the middle of a large frame (I'm 185cm / 6'1") on others I sit at the extremity of a large and the beginning of an XL. There's no standard size which is partly why these fit services seem to be promoted more and more.
#2 Shoe Fit - YES! I'm rather annoyed with the cycling shoe industry in that cycling shoes are made to look cool, not to fit a foot. Even Lake shoes (my favorite) are too pointy in the toe area with the exception of their very limited selection of shoes built on the "comfort plus" last.
Did you try the Lake 242 wide fit shoe?
I had a guy at a shop I used all the time talk me into going a little shorter on my cranks in 1991. I have since moved up to 175 because that is what comes on bike in my size. I guess he was ahead of his time. I've also always use 44cm bars. Just recently a fitter told me I would be better with a 42. I put 42 on my new bike and I have to say I do like it better.
Great detail, loved the explanations for each of the issues
I bought my bike from a popular shop in Miami. My bike fit took literally 5 minutes and the guy said it was fine. I have at least 3 issues brought up by this video (numbness in my hands, constantly adjusting in the saddle, feeling like I’m dropping forward from the saddle). Should I assume my saddle is too high?
Regarding the hand position. Imho it really depends what kind of effort you doing. If I go slowly up a hill, I could easily do with 10-20mm less stem length. If I do threshold effort on the flats, I feel like stem length could be 10-20mm longer.
Everything in bike fitting (and life?) is a compromise. There is no single option that works "best" for everything, so considering your individual needs, preferences and things like times in each of those related use case are variables for use to make a decision on setup and component selection.
At Last ! someone talking commonsense 👍
Excellent vid! Thanks!
Great video. Thanks for making it!
Great video, unlike some other channels (C@de), the bike fitter isn't some shouty zealot! I checked my road bike, found it was 1 cm higher than my other bikes 😮
I clearly hurt your feelings, my heart bleeds
Very good content
Very informative. Thanks.
great content thanks
Very interesting. I know I need a new bike fit but I don't know where to find shoes that fit wide and high arch feet for women.
Get.
A.
Bike.
Fit.
Great video! 👌🏽
Glad you liked it!
How do you calculate the width your feet where they need to be as it is often glossed over. I often see cranks worn on used bikes like the shoes have been rubbing on the cranks. Could there be a calculation of hip width minus foot width to calculate your pedal centreline.
Another thing with sitting to one side of a bike or the other this could be because often a bike has a longer Axel on the drive side to compensate for chainrings on that side. So adding spacers to get the right width might need to be done on the non drive side a couple of mm. Just a thought?
super good vid:)
Finally, the 100th video about what we're all doing wrong.
Thank you!
Excellent info
The variation between manufacturers in their frame sizes is an annoyance. I'm 185cm / 6'1" tall. For some I fit right in the middle of a large frame, e.g. Ridley, yet for say Ribble I sit at the top end of a large and the beginning of an XL. Some manufacturers have distinct frame ranges, while others have overlaps between frame sizes. Then we have the differences between bike fitters. One may recommend a bike be set up a certain way, but another may suggest a different set up.
What's the solution?
There's a snake oil element to the bike-fit boom of the last 8 years
Which shoe is that next to the lake?
At 1:20 you mention that pedal power stroke from two-to four o'clock is not ideal. Can you please inform me where the power stroke is most efficient?
Hi there, you want to aim for more consistent power throughout the pedal stroke to share the load across more muscle groups For example, 1-5 o'clock would be an improvement on 2-4
@@roadccisnt that just a wider spectrum?
first thing to be comfy on the bike is to buy endurance oriented bike :) today everyone has racing bike, it is like every car on the road was superstiff sports car, and then we would want to be comfy inside :)
Always install a saddle on the seatpost.
😂
I'm yet to find cycling shoes with a wide toe box. If anyone has tips, I'm taking it.
Investigate Lake shoes
Lake 242 wide
My young grandson laughed his head off when I complained about an uncomfortable bike saddle.I said "It messes up your apples and pears."
IDK, my inseam dictates a 52 cm frame and my height dictates a 56 cm frame. So I compromised and got a 54 cm frame. However, my arms are apparently shorter than normal for my height. Therefore, it seems that to reach the hoods causes me to slip towards the nose of the saddle while riding. So maybe I need a 52 cm frame. Or I need to install a shorter stem or I need to install a stem that is angled up. I really do not know what to do. Please advise?
Установи короткие шатуны 160 мм
Shorter stem, maybe shorter reach bars, move brake levers up the bars a bit, perhaps turn the levers slightly inward. Also, experiment with the amount of saddle set back. You may need shorter cranks to get the seat up to a better height. Yes, I have the same issue. In my case, shorter cranks (172.5 to 165), shorter stem and less seat post setback solved the issues.
To get the right size frame, you have to pick the one that perfectly balances (with the appropriate set back on the seatpost) your weight when pedaling under moderate or typical effort. This means that your hands will float on the top of the bars with very little pressure, when you pedal. Your the position of your hips relative to the BB is what allows your upper body to be cantilevered over the hoods and achieve such a balance. See where your hands fall naturally, when you are in a riding position and pedaling. Choose the frame that best accommodates: 1) fore/aft balance and 2) hand position by the choice of top tube and stem length. Try to pick a frame that gives you a stem length of 80-120mm, inverting and adding spacers if necessary. A bike fitter can figure all of this out using a fitting device that allows for the saddle and bars to be moved. Many people can be fitted correctly on two different frame sizes (with different choices of seat post and stem), but I find that the smaller frame handles better with a longer stem, than the opposite. In your case, I think an endurance style frame (e.g. Trek Domane, Giant Defy) will fit best because of its high stack and short reach. You can also fit it with a shorter crank (165mm) for more comfort.
@@bengt_axle Thank you for the reply. My bike is a Domane. I got to ride it yesterday. The problem is that my torso is so long and my reach so short that my arms are almost at 80 degrees. And I cannot set upright at all because my torso has to be bent over to reach the bars. And thus the weight of my torso has to be held up by my arms and hands. And that causes me to slide forward on the saddle because the saddle is not carrying my weight. A shorter bike would cause my arms to be straight down and a longer bike would make me have to bend over even further. So the only solution I see is to raise the handlebars by about 4 inches.
@@michaelsherwin4449 You need to slide the saddle back as far as possible. Racing seatposts have a setback of 32mm, so as to allow the racers to use a smaller frame and balance their weight and take the load off the hands, just like you are currently experiencing. Additionally, you may find that a saddle like SMP Dynamic which is very curved, will allow you to raise the nose, shift the balance to the back and relieve hand pressure, all without increasing pressure on your anterior perineal area. But the first approach should be to slide the saddle back. To try an experiment, go to a spin bike studio and then try different positions of saddle setback and see how they affect your hands. Take measurements of the most comfortable positions and then try to reproduce on your Domane. You also must learn to sit on a road bike with your core engaged (i.e. pull in belly button a bit and lift pelvic floor slightly). A strong core will help support your torso. Look up a picture of Johan Vansummaren, when he was riding for Garmin or Agr2. He looks like a giant on a tiny bike. It is possible to get a functional fit, even for an odd morphology.
How do you know what crank length is the right one? I'm 1.76m and I use schimano 172.5mm
Often I feel the stroke is very long and takes forever to do a revolution. I haven't tried shorter but I wouldn't want to purchase one and realise is not the right one... os there a recommendation in this respect?
You could get a second hand 170 crankset for peanuts. It would be a very cheap experiment.
I'm 1.78 and I'm on 165mm after a bike fit.. go get one it's amazing I pedal smoother
I am 176.5 and I have 172.5mm crank and they feel perfect for me. I do have a slightly longer leg than body so have no issues. I do have other bikes with 170mm cranks and they feel fine as well. The number one thing is not to concentrate on your height as you could have large head or long body or neck and short legs.
Work around your legs not your height and a 170mm crank sounds like a good move.
Not many shoe manufacturers make proper shoes.
Just look at either Lake or Bont and you’ll probably find something that actually fits.
Incorrect. Lots make great shoes, if they suit your feet
@@matthewlewis2072 most are way too narrow.
That top tube is a full 2-3" too short
Surely it's far more common to see people, particularly men, with their bars too narrow?
Based on what requirement specifically?
The belief it makes them more aero, understandable for pros and high grade racers but not average cyclists. That aside virtually all bike filters advise against too narrow bars for most cyclists. @@Chader9
👍
Recreational cyclists here, mistake , Buy first fit after😂😂😂.
Too many people see what the pros do, and copy it; not what is best for them......Absolute mugs......
You know, I see that comment a lot, but if you think about it, pretty much everyone copies the pros. Isnt it true that everyone goes out and makes sure that they have sram red or shimano dura ace on their bikes, and dont they make sure the bikes that they get are "Specialized" or "Trek", or "Bianchi" or something like that? How come nobody just goes to wal-mart and buys a bike that pedals just like those bikes, or rides their daddies bike from the 1950s? EVERYONE tries to do what the pros do.
For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Romans 6:23)
Therefore also now, saith the LORD, turn ye even to me with all your heart, and with fasting, and with weeping, and with mourning: And rend your heart, and not your garments, and turn unto the LORD your God: for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and repenteth him of the evil. (Joel 2:12-13)
I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish. (Luke 13:5)
I think cyclists use their calf muscles far too little! 🤔
I like ti save the power of my calf muscles for hill climbing when my legs quads and hamstrings are exaughsted or I just dont want to use them as much at that time, ia this when you think that they sould be used? When do you uae them? When do you think that they should be used and how often?
'Bike fit mistakes' .. a bike bike fit
Great video. Thanks.