Are Beefy Subs Louder? | Myth Busted?
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- Опубликовано: 29 авг 2024
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It’s absolutely crazy that I’ve been torn choosing between these 2 10”s , and a video just so happened to be made to help me out 😂
You should check out Toby Speakers HITMAN - DUAL 10" its a band-pass I have had mine over 20 years nothing has come close to the sound quality, im running 500wRMS and blow away everything…
@@dillwack funny you said Tobey.i haven't heard of those since 1994 when I was in Washington state.i didn't know they were still around
@@jermainephillips5179
Good possibility that he has them from that year one never knows
Get Resilient Sounds 10" gold. I got the Resilient sounds platinum 18s and absolutely love it. I'm never upgrading my subwoofer.
@@RyanBassForLife those were another possibility , my brother had 8 of their 12”s in his Demo Truck . Thanks man !
I think your initial point is valid, the test imo was better for the strato because it used the available box size better. You need to redo this test with an enclosure made to specs for each woofer.
The box was closer to spec for the tropo
Best to keep just one variable when comparison testing.
I have to 12” tropos and I absolutely love them, clean clear bass!
I love that you make a quality check on random subs in in the middle of a huge eight 15 build just to make a point.
Those Black CT Sounds amplifiers surprised me on the amp dyno I saw recently. Definitely a good value and it put out like 1000 watts over rated @1 ohm. I've always liked their subs too. The Meso and Strato subs have solid performance. If you can afford a pair of Strato or Meso 15's and a good amplifier from CT, or a JP23v2, or a Taramps Smart 5k, you can have a great system. Just make sure you have a good enclosure and solid power, and CT Sounds won't disappoint you.
Yeah I was surprised as well!
I'd like to see this video with Dayton audio, their cheapest 12in vs their most expensive. I know their stuff seems to outperform what they say on the box.
Although not the usual set up, I am running 2 jbl stadium subs in a fox box in my ram 1500. Powering them is a 2002 Rockford Fosgate Punch 800.2 S. Amplifier at 4 ohm stereo. It is ear splitting loud and clean at the same time. The sound quality is amazing. Also running jbl gto series 6.9 speakers front and back in the doors with a Fosgate t-600 x 4 amp. I am very happy with this set up. Great video and very informative. Thru trial and error I have found the results the same as you. The better the quality sub you buy the more the output.
Rockford Fosgate a reliable company that's been making great equipment since the day they went into business people tend to forget about these brands and go with this new stuff thinking it's better because it's less expensive sometimes it is most of the time it's not
Had that skar box for yrs, it's gets down for a prefab. Excellent video parker
Great test and I was also surprised by the results.
I always believed beefier subs would only benefit when you played them at high power (near their RMS)
Your test showed they were louder with less power in many instances.
That CT Sounds amp is pretty powerful. I am running the 1500 watt mono block on 1 Kicker L7R 15 and it shakes the neighbors windows! I hope CT Sounds keep these amps at the same pricepoint, a super value.
Kicker does not play when it comes to sound, wattage, durability, quality, people are getting lost with these new brands forgetting how great kicker really is. they will never disappoint.
@@Mr.Robert1 only the square ones and the top of the line circle ones are good. Rest of kickers suck
@@ssjdavid Noooo. I have a kicker compR 12 on a 500.1 kenwood and it slams. I've had JL W6s to Punch power series back in the day and this one 12 hits so hard. People can't believe it's 1-12". Keep in mind thats MY experience. Others may not have been so lucky with these
The coils were getting hot is why there were losses at more power over time. Great test, i just think there should have been cool off times. Love your videos Parker... but Derrick at sundown unofficial was seeing the same issue testing the SA v2 15 prototype, same exact issue.
yes i was about to say that it depends on the coils how many there are so on and so forth i'm no audio car expert but yes i agree
That wasn't a big enough difference in db to be able to hear it. So no reason to get the more expensive subs. I've got 2 $60 Audio Legion 10s that are underpowered and they are doing 142db at 35hz. Using the exact same db meter.
Beefy subs are better for horn loaded enclosures (the driver pushes on the narrow end of a gradually expanding tunnel of air), and very small enclosures. But as a direct radiator, the air is thin and doesn't need huge magnets and heavy cones. You will need a larger enclosure for the less beefy sub, but it won't drink as much amplifier power for the same SPL.
ct sounds have amazing subs. i switched from skar to them and no complaints at all they sound good on 1500 watts. im satisfied. cool that you are spreading there name.
Ive always liked the way Ct sounds look. Nice comparison 😉👍🏼
I run a 10" Strato on the CT 1500.1D in a Truspec ported box @ 1ohm. It sounds Great for my daily driver. The Truspec box is only 0.1cu ft bigger than what the sub calls for and is tuned to 35hz... Parker, love your videos man
A well executed experiment, CT sounds I think have very affordable equipment, unlike some other companies who dramatically increase their prices, they have remained a true budget brand for the average guy. If I were just starting in car audio I'd definitely recommend them. Solid equipment for a decent price.
when i got my strato v2s on pre order i would have went with the 18s but they had the v1 baskets posted and they said they would offer recones and never did... only the mesos 8s had recones also the ts changed a few times on the same subs a couple times mainly rms.. my pair of strato v2 where good for a rf prime 1200.1 at 1 ohm but couldnt handle a rp 4500.1 at 4 ohm
Very interesting experiment. I would've thought the tropo would've been louder with less power since the sensitivity was higher
Great video. Every video I've seen like this and personal experience suggest efficiency doesn't mean much. I would guess the higher impedance rise (lower power) on the stratos may have to do with them wanting more air space plus having a larger displacement means it's making the box effectively smaller with higher tuning especially because it seems like there's more difference at higher frequency
All about enclosure design and vehicle acoustics. For example- I had two fifteens (~$150 double stacked 3 inch vc) on 2k in my Jeep and it sounded fantastic on the low notes very defined in a box 6.4 tuned to 32hz. Now I am rocking a single 15 on 2500 ($600 triple stacked 4 inch vc, it's massive) in a 4.2 box tuned to 32 in my 2003 mustang. So a huge difference in air volume and acoustics. In the mustang, a 32 hz bass not does not have the length to fully unload and it gets bottled up and sounds muddy. Plus the fact that the box has so much airspace, it peaks super low and exasperates the problem. When I roll down the windows, the issue mostly goes away and I gain noticeable spl.
Just my experience
Edit: I should say that the difference in air volume is per sub not the total volume. So the box that I had for my 2 15s after sub displacement was probably around 6 cubes which is actually slightly smaller than the recommended size for their combined cone size. 2 15s > 1 18 and a good ported enclosure for an 18 is ~5.75-6 cubes
Check out both builds on my channel
I running two CT Tropo 8s in a custom box, definitely getting strato's after this video!!!
Awesome comparison my dude! I'm running 2 tropo 12's on a JP8. Makes me want to upgrade my subs and amp!
Well the tropos are awesome! Ive liked them so far
Great video the tropo I’ve never heard of love that you do stuff with not just name brand stuff and almost to 80k so so close man Gratz
never too early for this
Thank you!!
Nice comparison of those 2 subs. Beefy subs for the win! Thanks Parker!
I have two CT sounds Stratos 18’s on a audiopipe apcle 3000 and my box is tuned to 28.86 the box was made by Deca out of Tupelo Mississippi I had to get bigger subs for my two nvx 8ks but I always find myself going back to this setup for daily use
Thanx for the content my friend, lookin forward to seeing the next build vid 👍
Thank you man!! It will be out Thursday
2 , 10" are good for punchy bass! 2, 12" For good deep base! Getting 4 subwoofers and you have both best World ! Nice job keep it up !!
Great vid, Parker! Super cool test and your comments on your hands was hilarious. lol
I think it comes down to efficiency at a given power level. The beefier sub will need more power to play to it's potential.
More power needed = more money to spend on electrical upgrades.
Yeah but the test showed the beefier sub actually got louder with less power in a lot of cases.
wrong yet again lmao watch the video
Do a video of the same box , either facing forward or backwards and up to hear which way is better 🔈🔉🔊
Great idea!!
Brother. Love your videos you've actually helped me pick between speakers a couple of times before. I just wanted to maybe make a suggestion. You know how your doing the tests. Changing the frequency and then running though the different volume responses.. I think the tests might be a little more beneficial if you changed the frequency with every volume test. I know it's a little more work but I personally feel like it would be easier to tell the difference between the effects of different frequencies. Opposed to the affects of different volumes. It might seem like a little bit of a hassle but it would emphasize the affect more
Thanks for doing this. Was thinking same as you when I seen my first punisher 8 get here . Now I am more confident in getting the other one 😅.
that was a serious meaningful test. conclusion (oddly enough): given identical wattage Strato plays louder than Tropo - despite Strato being a LESS EFFICIENT transducer than Tropo. This I can't explain...
I like my subs like my women, beefy. 👍😆
you love the big food bill huh?! 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
You mean stacked
But which are louder, the smaller women or the beefy women?
@parker you just committed a mortal sin running CT subs in a Skar box!!! JK LMFAO 😂 great video brotha keep up the good work
Great test👍 most tests are not even equal at all. I noticed the tropos hadle much morevthan claimed! CT is a great product. Great video👍👏👏
CT Sounds may be part of my next upgrade, never ran them before but they always look good on here. Also, I really appreciate you some of the Ts specs. Would love to see a more completed list and, when comparing 2 subs, would be handy to have it on screen for a few seconds.
i have the meso 15s they hit the lows pretty good but to me you can find better sound quality if you really don't care about that I'd go with em
Running two ozone 12 ct sounds they’re good good for the price
@@Furybeatsgme I like to go with a less common sub but would be lying if I said sq isn't an important factor. Price is important as well and they seem to be one of the more affordable ones on my radar. I have been leaning towards a pair of 15s tuned to the mid 20s but may just do a single 18 build with the low to mid 20s tuning.
Thanks for the info. What sort of enclosure size/tuning/style and what kind of power, if you happen to know?
@@murrayshekelberg9754 I'm using a box 3 cubes per 15 tuned to 30hz, on a 3k I'm at half ohm, not turned up really i only have a brand x 250 amp and a auto zone platinum agm.
@@murrayshekelberg9754 but i wont lie they're loud and have some punch, but just a little inaccurate. an spl orientated sub for aure
Really enjoy these comparison videos
Heck yeah great vidja as always Parker keep up the good work
Great comparison! It seems the bigger/better built sub is more efficient with the power.
I almost went with CT sounds.
I can't say I'm overly impressed tbh after seeing this.
The FS is waay too high.
Im glad I went the way I did, B2 Riots V2. Supposed to be 750 rms each but are easily double that and weren't too expensive!
You can't B2 loud!
This video made me confident in my purchase!
You should review some B2 Parker, they're great!
I'm surprised by these results. There are a lot of variables at play. It's easy to assume it's about cone surface area and cone excursion and typically that's the volume recipe. However, when it comes to the mechanics of it, a stronger motor, will more accurately reproduce sound. Anytime an applied force(magnetic in this case) has to accelerate a mass(the cone), a stronger motor structure will be more capable of accelerating the cone more in sync with the music's intent. Basically, a signal is sent to the coil to move the cone. But there's always a tiny lag before the magnetic field can defeat the mass of the cone. I think after watching this, the more powerful motor lessens that lag, when compared to a less powerful motor. Essentially, the more powerful motor is more efficient with the given input power. However, I suspect that would change if the frequency was set to the cheaper subs resonant frequency.
However, I could very well be wrong. The results so fat has surprised me.
The reason for the difference in power is bc of impedance rise. Subs with bigger motors and more motor force typically have more rise. So those stratos actually could have used a bigger amp than what they sent you if they wasn't able to get to their power limit before the amp clips.
I've been contemplating my self on changing my 3 13w7s for a mid level set of subs and amps avatar tsunami's probably wish shyt was like it used to be going in audio shops and seeing how shyt sounds.
I'm running a single 13w7AE off a JL HD1200/1 amplifier. It sounds decent but not as amazing as I thought it would be. I'm tempted to sell the w7 and go for 2 or 3 x 12" more efficient subwoofers.
Better test would be to put them in boxes made to spec for each sub
Very interesting and good test but tbh, I mean if bigger, beefier subs didn't get louder, why would people upgrade to them and why would they make them? You should post up the sensitivity (aka know as efficiency) of each sub as well because that's how "loud" they should be at 1w (apparently). Bigger/more beefy subs are USUALLY more efficient and do better on the same sized amp(but NOT always!) Iv seen a few out there that are "weaker" subs that have better fs and are more efficient as well. Still a cool video 👌 always enjoy your stuff
Edit: also the t/s should tell you port size, box volume, and lots of stuff to help decide between one or another sub(as I'm positive you already know this lol) one could just go the Fi audio route and have a sub specd whatever t/s parameters you want lol but, that's big $$$
00:15 Jesus...scared the sh#t outta me
Like both of them they sound good another great video thank you
Thank you!
I see that hoodie👀 somone told me to visit that site once. Love the videos Parker see you in the next one!!
I've had a tropo 10 for a couple of years now with a alpine 800 rms pushing it in a 2.25 box with no issues in the same type of of truck as Parker
CT SOUNDS NEEDS TO BUILD THE EXO 18S. THERE CRAZY FOR JUST MAKING A SMALL 12" SUB AS THERE COMPITION SERIES.
I see it differently tho.. the cheaper ones impedance wasn’t rising like crazy..the bigger ones need a more custom box for better results but I get what your saying as well
that basket design is very inefficient ive noticed, strato, evl both use that and around 85-86db spl
The box size is everything. Tuning is everything. Power is everything. The Sub's power handling is nothing without proper electrical.
Nice for early morning I need to try this out. I have some soundqubed hds2.1 ,HDs.3.2 and about to get some hdx3 12 subs. That would be a awesome test... I can test all 3 in the same car....
Heck yeah man!! That would make for a great test
I'd love to try out some hdx3s. The hdc3s are monsters and even with a 41 fs love the lows
Coil diameters !!
surprised no audio speaker engineer hasn't figured that out yet,
how to incorporate a larger diameter coil former&winding while maintaining a smaller spider and cone hole opening, utilizing a differential diameter former !
Or maybe it's just more practical to go with a larger diameter basket to incorporate a larger diameter spider for the required x-maxx.. .
My scars say the stratos were night and day better. They were way deeper and punchier.. so all things considered it’s well worth the upgrade no matter the power or xmax cause they are just much more musical
After this test.
The numbers show a very small difference. Wondering about the actual sound it's self? That's the most important bottom line for me.
Was not able to tell on the smartphone bluetooth system I was using to listen.
No replacement for horsepower, curious what the BL curves look like for the two subs
I really miss old school high efficiency subs. Plus they sounded better. You could get louder on ¼ the power
I forgot where I saw and heard this, but i believe the industry will be going back to this...for the most part. There are some excellent subs out there that aren't 90 lbs. with huge motors and tall as hell, that can be very competitive subs. All in all, wether it's true, I agree with you.
Maybe a shallow mount sub vs regular? I accidentally bought a shallow mount and have it in a regular fab box and it sounds good, but always wonder and am too cheap to if I put a regular 12, would it get more performance in the same setup
I had 2 Stratos 18s. Did a 53....blew one...upgraded to a zvx. Did a 55 on the same power.
I've got a CT Sounds Stratos in my Tacoma. The vox I have it in is too small for it though.
But for someone that doesn't compete, they can't go wrong with either sub. They wouldn't be able to tell the difference in sound.
Funny enough I have 2 10 tropos in my supercab F150 and 2 10 stratos in the wife’s Yukon Denali, both have their pros and cons but enjoy them both
lets go bit coin we all know where his heart was
I Love DJ Dirty Bass Edits!
What is the name of the first song that was used in the tests? The one with that killer bass hit on the 3rd note? I am still rocking a single Sundown X8 V3 with a Sundown SFB-1000D. I have fooled many people into thinking it was a single 12. Keep up the hard work Parker.
hey parker id turn off the mic Limiter/distortion so we can hear the pure sound of bass so it aint quieting down any sort of bass sound
I like CT Sounds products. They make some pretty decent stuff for the price. Certainly one of the brands to consider when wanting to upgrade your crappy OEM car stereo. lol
Well it's kinda like comparing a $100 12 to a $300 12. More flexible surround, magnet, power rating might vary for hitting lows, but they all seem to do good
I like CT sound but I had the 2K monoblock also and it went up in smoke so I got a skar rp2k it does better
Get yourself an AT series amp they rock!!!
I think the efficiency of the sub comes into play Here aswell
Absolutely. The Tropo is more efficient. Also, the Tropo is geared more towards sound quality. But both are good drivers.
@@Chuck_Sanders On paper, the specs showed that the tropo was 2.5 db louder, but those are @ 1watt=totally useless for comparing subwoofers max spl. If you would have seen parkers results, in this video, you would know that the beefier subwoofer performed better on less power. And the gap would become greater with even more power.
@@evilinside5984 this isn't a "test" at all. The Tropo is more efficient, regardless. Higher efficiency drivers perform better in larger enclosures, where as less efficient drivers are suited for smaller enclosures. Using software like DATS and Woofer Tester to pull actual TSP'S woukd help him greatly. I have said in numerous videos, he shoukd purchase DATS or an equivalent program. And modeling the driver in enclosure software to see what the driver needs for enclosure volume, and tuning helps tremendously. Thus providing where the driver will reach full xmax, and or exceeding the xmax at 70-80% of the max power it sees. Youll also be able to adjust tuning, to get the port velocity(speed) correct, for the enclosure. Throwing two different drivers, in the same enclosure, isn't a test. Also, this is comparing apples to oranges. More efficient drivers, need less power to meet there performance goals. The fact that the Tropo held its own, against a "beefier" driver, shows that. Put them in the proper air volume, and tune them accordingly, to show a true test. There is more to a driver, than just being "beefier" and he gave a lot of incorrect info right off the bat, and the Fs is a useless parameter basically, and the spider isn't the only limiting factor, when it comes to xmax at all. Good video though, for watching subs play. 👍
@@Chuck_Sanders Even though this test is not optimal, it is very useful for the average person, who may not have access to a local custom shop, or be able to afford a custom enclosure. Knowing they can buy an affordable prefab enclosure, that mates well with a subwoofer, that they can get shipped to their door is awesome. Although it would be great to have 3 custom enclosures tested, the smallest, the exact middle, and the largest that the company recommends. Then test each model in all 3 enclosures. Awesome video, though. Thank you Parker!
Off point I know but I'd love to see you test some Powerus amps!
I remember the day when "lower power" didn't mean 2,000 watts! I used to run 2 twelves on a 75X2 amp! Not even bridged! And I was happy with it!
Ok boomer. Theres better now
@@Luminous.Dynamics that must mean they make shyte speakers now if you need that much power!
@@thecman26
Lol. You wouldnt understand.
I wish I would have bought Sundown SA instead of the X series. I feel like I would have saved money on all the extra amps wire alt, ect , I think it would have bumped just as good for me.
There so many different things that make a " loud " driver. If you were to go simply from a amount of db the the amount of power they can flow would be the only important parameter . A lot of what we call " loud " is more about the pressure a driver can produce. Here a beefy motor is important. To move the diaphragm of the driver fast enough and far enough while resisting physics requires a good amount of electo-mechanical force. But we also care about sound quality and reproduction. This tends to favor a more efficient driver. A stiff yet light cone, good spiders, a very reactive coil. Imagine what it takes to nail all of this in one driver . Imagine the materials required to achieve excellent sound quality and responsiveness, yet be strong enough to allow a giant , super efficient motor structure man handle the diaphragm parts without destroying them but keep it affordable...seems like a big job to me.
Yes but it's interesting to see the beefier sub got louder with less power in many of the results.
Higher power subs generally have very stiff spiders. I always thought you would benefit only if you played them at RMS power.
Already know the answers. It's no! The Resilient Sounds Platinum is not as beefy as a Sundown ZV6 but there about equal. Well maybe but there almost identical to a X v3.
I'm willing to bet if you let them properly break in you'll notice a big change in those numbers
Thanks fam!!!
Just curious. Are we sure that the peak output was at the peak db?
Great comparison subwoofer facts test indeed
I like the painful hurting bass. Not so much loud. Which one was better for that?
@parker how do you like that Atoto head unit? Thinking about getting one. Switching from a pioneer cheap Apple CarPlay unit that freezes a lot. Wondering if it’s worth it? Maybe you could do a review on it? Forgive me if you already have reviewed it.
Too many variables when it comes to sound. Number one what kind of sound are you looking for? Do you like your base tight? Are you trying to get SPL? how much room do you have or are willing to give up for your box? How much money can you afford or are willing to spend on your sound system?
I have always based my systems on bang for the buck. Always wanted a very good sounding system, never wanted to spend A fortune. Had other things that were more important in life. Like my family, my home, my cars, my children's education. Going on vacation and more.
Bang for the buck is true in many aspects of life.
Grab a Skar EVL. Very soft, very efficient with low power, but can still handle high power in the proper enclosure... this sub gets very loud in lower wattage setups, of done correctly.
Whats soft? Not the suspension. 0.06mm/N is not a soft spider.
I'm trying to choose my next pair of 10s. I'm trying to decide from a bunch of different subs; Memphis Mojo, CT Sounds Ozone, Alpine Type R, Kicker CompQ, American Bass Titan, NVX VCW104v3, MB Quart RW1-254, DS-18 ZXI10, or Sundown SA. My amp is a new Skar RP1500 and the box has two separate chambers with the volume of 2.1 cf. I'm pretty sure it's tuned to 36 h.
Xr or xfl would be my choice , add a second rp1500 down the line and be good to go
Hey Parker if I was to use this amp to power an AB HD18 what electrical would I need in an Explorer that comes stock with a 130A alternator? I got Big 3 and 0 gauge power. Love the vids man!
This content for me is even more fun and even more relevant than the big build the builds are fun this is relevant and necessary in my world
Love my meso 8s in my f150 on a ct1500.1
💪🏼💪🏼
I wish you could do a review on the Memphis mojo pros preferably the 12” it would be greatly appreciated
After all my years I've come to the conclusion that the only things that really matter are the largest, lightest, and stiffest cone you can fit, with as much motor bl as you can get.
I have a 2004 Tahoe that’s my daily driver that I drive to work and just to tow my boat and stuff. I’m wanting to get me a nice setup in there for some pretty serious bass. I am wanting to see what your best options are for me to get as loud as possible but not have to add batteries and other power upgrades. Probably wanting one 12 or one 15. Maybe two if it’s going to be a whole lot better. I was looking at the Skar EVL 12. But I don’t know what the best options are. I was thinking about 2000 watt rms amplifier from skar and one EVL 12/15 .. what’s your opinion??
Excellent as always sir but l wonder why it seems as though a single 12 always seems to do better than 2 10s, some easily hitting 140+. With 2 10s you have more cone area and twice the motor force. Or am I imagining things?
. Im thinking that the 10's need more power than the 12 for an accurate test. So yes, 750 watts to 1-12 will sound better than 2-10's with that under powered set up.
What is that ATOTO head unit you're using? Would you recommend it, and how loud can it go before it distorts?
I’ve been looking at the Stratos but thinking about the Mesos, do you think you would ever compare them like this?
Pls how is those China big surround sub woofers... Have you lay hand to test any?
Try to 10" Resilient Sound RS series and then the Lesser series that they've upgraded to a 2.0 Resilient Sounds is way ahead of the game with their medium stiff spiders
In order for this to be correct the subs would have to have same tsp and one would have to handle more. Of course my beefy would destroy the trapo. But if the subs are damn near the same just 1 handles more then this would be a myth buster but its two completely different types. Different boxs different positions everything effects the outcome.