Tarnished: "Hah! See that, Varre? I've got a maiden now!" Varre: "Really? Where is she?" Tarnished: "She's not here right now. She only shows up occasionally after I rest at these lights that apparently only I can see to tell me I'm doing a good job or whatever." Varre: "..."
If Melina is the gloam eyed queen, then I think the tattoo covering her eye represents Maliketh’s hand in which Destined Death was sealed. Upon defeating him, and restoring the Death Rune to the Elden Ring (making Death indiscriminate), the Gloam Eye of Melina is opened…
@@ijustmakeinflammatorycomme9839 at 9:35 in the new vid? Seems very similar to me 🤷♂️. I suppose I would not have mentioned it had he labelled it as “a theory”, or “one theory” etc
Then this would support the idea that Melina is simply trying to repair things of her volition. I still think Marika and Radagon both ended up serving the Greater Will. As the Erdtree grows more powerful so does the influence of the Greater Will. What if a deathless age of constant struggle was what the greater will intends?
@@ForticusKrorkenstein I think Melina is Marika's daughter (of a sort) born likely before the Golden order was fully established and before the Nox/Numen were banished to the Eternal Cities underground as she shares the same moveset as the Night Maidens and Black Knife Assassins (who were Numen Women with ties to Marika and scions of the Eternal cities) At some point the Greater will through the two fingers selected Melina as an Empyrean to wield and deliver destined death in the name of the greater will and as an Empyrean had the potential to replace Marika. At which point I suspect Marika who was aware of if not had taken part in the Downfall of the preceding Dragon order and Greater Will abandoning it and its God and one time vessel of the Elden ring whom she and her order were in the process of replacing got paranoid that one day the Greater will may well seek to abandon her and have her own daughter Melina replace her resolved to remove the death rune to avoid a similar fate which I suspect incensed Melina as she had come to accept and believe that delivering destined death was her calling and declared open war with Marika becoming the Gloam eyed Queen and leading her Godskin apostasy but was ultimately defeated by Maliketh. however Marika in part out regret and foreseeing a future where she may want to end her rule and order, only had Melina killed in body alone similar to Rani (whichmay have inspired that part of Rani's later scheme) leaving Melina burned, bodiless, near powerless, and without a clear purpose with the death rune fully sealed. But Marika did have a contingency plan that involved Melina, Hewg, and the Tarnished should she decide to end her order and rule a plan she initiated when the death her favorite child despite all her efforts came to pass.
Its pretty chilling to hear Melina, this being who has pretty consistantly been around to help and guide us be very plain in telling us "If you become lord of Chaos, _I will kill you_ ". Like, she knows exactly what shes talking about right there. *_She's here to kill Chaos._*
Chaos…? It’s not as simple as Chaos. It’s about annihilation of everything in order to relieve pain and suffering. If you listen to the three fingers “maiden”, it’s clear. It’s the culmination of an older school of philosophy that suggests life and individuality is suffering, and the only cure is to become a singular chaotic void of nothingness. And yes, that’s a real thing. Melina makes it clear when she speaks to you outside the three fingers. Someone who would abandon individuality has no right to be a Lord, a Lord wouldn’t abandon their peoples very being. Melina hunts you down not because you’re chaos in that ending. It’s because you’re Seymour from Final Fantasy 10. And we should all hunt down and kill Seymour’s from Final Fantasy 10. 👍🏻
@@ZhongliArchonofSwag I think that OverTheStone was making a reference to the game Stranger of Paradise. It's sort of a meme; ruclips.net/video/no-MCGxZcsQ/видео.html
The voice direction given to Melina's actress clearly shows her intentions are not ill-intended and she truly believes what she is doing is for the greater good. That "Thank you" she gives when burning herself is the most heart-warming line in all of Elden Ring.
What about Hewg calling you lord. He was a true friend. And roderika staying with Hewg implying she is part of the loop Hewg is in, as he recalls someone like her when she first goes to the roundtable
Melina: the erdtree burns, my purpose is fulfilled, goodbye you who walks alongside the flame Me shortly after: hello there 3 fingers Melina form the grave: am I a joke to you?
I actually accidentally did this on my first playthrough. I saw a giant ass door on my way to get the stone tablet, couldn't figure out how to open the door. Killed the fire giant, was like "hey I wonder if there is a way through that door. It's probably a gank or something". I then went back to that door, saw someone put a sign that said "no armor", and proceeded to get mad that I was forced into that ending. Not at the game mind you, at myself.
One thing tho, I don't think the greater will wants the death rune back in the elden ring. Enia says that it's much too late to put it back and it would cause problems
@@deztacular If it's really her purpose, she might not be able to see that, or beyond it. She comes off as somewhat "programmed," even for all her emotion. Like how all lifeforms are programmed to struggle blindly towards death, unconcerned with any grander point.
Here's my take: 1- Melina was the last attempt of Radagon to repair the ring, he tried but he couldn't mend the Elden Ring, he needed a tarnished to do so. 2- Tarnished, before being exiled and fallen from grace (literally) depended on maidens for guidance of the Greater Will, once marika banished Godfrey and the Tarnished, she set out to eliminate all maidens. 3- A flock of tarnished started returning to the lands between to fulfill the prophecy of "a tarnished becoming elden lord" this is literally said by the finger reader at the entrance of Leyndell. 4- The tarnished returning posed a serious problem for any of them to become elden lords as for what we know THE only maiden searching the land is Hyetta, we see a couple more but both were killed, and Therolina becomes one of Seluvis puppets. without maidens NO tranished would never reach Leyndell as they can't even channel runes into power, let alone interpret the will of the Greater Will. 5- Seeing this Radagon/Marika creates Melina to be the last Maiden. 6- we know that prior to our tarnished arrival there were 2 suitable candidates for Elden Lord: Vyke and Bernahl. 7- Vyke couldn't become a Lord because he pledged to the Frenzied flame, which would've prompted Melina to ditch him. 8- Melina in one of her first dialogues tells you she doesn't remember much, other than she was burned, if you read Bernahl's armor set you'll notice it says he could've become "Lord" but his maiden burned away... that's very strange, as Bernahl is later connected to Rykard being eaten by the snake, and to the night of the Black Knights (by the items he drops in Farum Azula) 9- My thoughts is that Bernahl managed along with Melina to go into Leyndell and tried to set the tree ablaze, as it's shown in one of the sides of the Erd Tree which is clearly mated and possibly burnt. The Finger reader at the foot of Rold's Lift tells you that burning the tree is a cardinal sin, however unless that sin was attempted before, it would seem that just the idea of it was unthinkable for anyone living in The Lands Between 10- after that attempt Melina was called back inside the Erd Tree, and later sent to you, but without her memories of the previous "coup" attempts.
@@rightousnesspursuer6523 not even Melina has a clear idea who she was prior of meeting you, but the fact that she can channel the power as a maiden sure points to her having a connection to grace that is one of a maiden (or former maiden) or similar.
@@rodrigomanzo777 yeah vayke Madien died it's why he even went with the three fingers. and for behall he had another maiden as well. notice that malenia is called the kindling Madien that is something that should explain the lore but I just don't know what yet
@@lawlessloki9320 read the items from Bernahl...he literally burnt his maiden, and the erd tree has a huge scar right where the thorns are as if charred
Melina seems to be a "solaire is the lost son of gwyn" character currently. We don't have a lot of answers so we force this character to fill the gaps.
I still think the Gloam Eyed Queen is a character we haven’t met yet. I think Melina’s purpose is to free Marika from the Erdtree, which is why she’s willing to commit a cardinal sin. She has no love for the golden order, only her mother, and wants to see Marika, the Ring, and The Lands Between, all repaired.
I mean > Her eye is Gloam colored > She's obsessed with destined death > She has the same animations as the Black Knife Assassins > She uses a weapon that is directly related to the Black Knife, and has almost exactly the same flavor text > Ranni took the death rune, and somehow it got into the hands of the Gloam Eyed Queen - implying they worked together > Ranni and Melina are half sisters, and are the only two who refer to Torrent by name > Ranni says she knows the previous owner of Torrent > Gloam Eyed Queen was also obsessed with destined death, and had the death rune > Melina claims her body was burned, and Maliketh uses fire
@@Wakish0069 the dialogue from Ranni regarding Torrent makes sense now... Ranni pretty much said that she knows the previous owner of Torrent. It might be Melina.
@@nathanieldelacruz7198 Ranni and Melina 100% know each other and are half sisters, and all evidence points to them being allies I didn't mention it in my above comment, but it seems Melina's face is that spectral face you see next to Ranni's - and the tattoo on their opposite eyes match
@@Wakish0069 I believe the face you see next to Ranni is Ranni. The "Ranni" that you interact with is a doll, because she sacrificed her body. And the ghostly thing is her soul. I don't think it's Melina.
@@Notsogoodguitarguy The ghost face thing we really don't know, but have you seen people overlap Melina's face on top of it? The tattoo and opposite closed eyes match up perfectly Not really sure what this entails, but both of these sisters lost their original bodies and may have some connection
Was actually pretty sad when she died... Then I finished the chaos ending AFTER burning the tree, not realizing she was against it... sooo I guess no one is coming to kill me. accidental win?
Lol I did this too. I decided that my character was just so heartbroken after her loss that he just decided to burn it all down and start again. This video makes my personal "lore" playthrough of Elden Ring oh so much more poignant
@@troybird7604 I did a similar thing, but with a religious zealot style character (nothing more fitting than a religious nut bringing about the end of the world) following Millicent's quest. Made sure to kill Malenia right before Godfrey for extra style points. Melina still being alive at the end was a bonus since I don't like the idea of the Lord of Frenzy getting to live especially since it definitely kills the Tarnished at the end and just takes over the body like Yura with Shabriri.
I got the distinct impression from the first couple conversations you have with Melina after defeating Morgott, that Melina becoming the kindling maiden was her own decision, that she redirected her purpose from it's original. Very possibly an act of defiance against her original based on her angry tone. I have a hard time believing she cares for the greater will given she doesn't care a if you pledge yourself to Ranni, meaning that possibly the Elden ring does not get restored at all (that is unclear). It is also important to note, that Melina was not born of a mother, despite being heavily implied (not counting datamining confirming this) she is the daughter of Marika. She tells us this herself, when discussing Boc wanting his mother and to be called beautiful. This means she was likely created in some other manner, and her being a piece of the rune of death is quite poetic.
The way I see it Melina and Ranni are both part of the Gloam eyed Queen. Ranni is dusk and Melina is dawn which is why they share that ghostly face overlay as both parts of the “gloam” which can mean both dusk and dawn depending on context. Also the mark on Melina’s eye is a crows foot which obviously is a sign of death tying her to destined death and Ranni.
Ranni is not the Gloam-eyed Queen. She is the daughter of Radagon and Rennala. She only has a connection to the Rune of death because she stole it, but that happened years later, after Maliketh defeated the Gloam-eyed Queen
Don't think they are all gloam eye, but think Miquella, Ranni, and Melina are walking the same path. The three lone wolfs who have forsaken the greater will and want to end the order of things. Both Ranni and Melina have a deep tie to Torrent, who has chosen us and I think we'll find out miqeulla has a tie to Torrent in the dlc.
"the one who walks alongside flame, shall one day meet the road of destined death" I feel this is atleast connects Melina to the gloam eyed queen in some capacity. Originally, the gloam eyed queen held control over destined death, in the form of the black fire used by the godskins in combat. Until, maliketh beat her and took it for himself and used it as a weapon out in the open which frightened all the demigods. Eventually, ranni steals a piece of it in the night of black knives and when maliketh gets it back, he seals it away in the amulet until our fight with him in game. This would makes sense about the tattoo over Melina's eye being a beasts claw cause it symbolizes maliketh, being a shadowbound beast, whom beat her. As such, her powers are sealed away until the rune is freed into the world and her eye opens, being able to use the power of destined death once agian.
Super crazy theory dump ahead!!!!! So basically every offspring of Marika or Radagon comes in 3 and usually the names start or sound the same (ex. Ranni, Radhan, Rykard) but if you think about it. The ones who break this rule are the offspring of Marika and Radagon Mikela and Malenia. If you try a third name that rimes. Melina fits perfectly. Further more. Malenia has the red mane of her father and Mikela has the golden hair of his mother and when you see the transition from Marika to Radagon in the final fight between the golden hair and the red mane it looks pink!!!! My guess. Melina is a secret daughter of the gods. Who they sent to destroy the golden order. The reason why Rani was able to steal death from Maliketh which if you think about you would need an insider to do something like that. The connection between Ranni and Melina is no that obvious but we all know is there. Her purpose is to restore the balance by shattering it.
Where does it say the Erdtree feeds on struggle? I read Marika sending away Godfrey and the Tarnished as her plan to overthrow the Elden Beast by making the Tarnished die and die again so they could become stronger. "Grow strong in the face of Death."
It definitely does not say that. Souls appear to return to the Erdtree, so it may feed on souls in some capacity, but we're given no reason to believe it feeds on struggle. Even if it did, it would make no sense to send people to struggle outside the Erdtree's territory to struggle to feed it: they're outside its territory.
@@Eladelia Right, I was referring to this video, where he said that the tree fed on struggle and I don't recall finding anything that pointed towards that conclusion.
AgtJake has mentioned that the erdtree feeds on struggle in at least 2 of his videos that I’ve seen, and both times he hasn’t really explained why he thinks so. He’s the only content creator who has this theory that I’ve seen
Melina being the gloam eyed queen makes sense she has a twilight colored eye.but her being the dusk eyed queen is also sensible. She has a dusk eye after the Lord of chaos. And the whole as surely as night follows day line confirms it
I think that Melina's relation to the gloam eyed queen could be like Millicent is to Malenia. Heavily implied to be born of the shattering (blooming) of Malenia. Similarly, Melina might be born of the Gloam eyed queen's defeat (at the foot of the Erdtree). She regains her complete self in FF ending. So when Ranni gives you the bell and talks about Torrent's previous owner, she must be referring to the gloam eyed queen (the steed is spectral as are the spirit ashes, both post death) Kinda like V and Vergil I guess. It might be that Marika was the only person who knew of Melina's existence and was part of her plan to return Godfrey and grant him audience.
Theres a few counters to this claim that come to mind. Why is melina in an incomplete state? She says she lost her purpose long ago and was burned and bodyless? Only to get a new one from marika. This born from death would make a lot of sense but the fact she apparently had a former body and purpose takes a lot of the wind from the sails for that idea. I do think melina was born from death as being born from the roots points to where they bury their dead so they can reach the tree sooner to be reborn and where Godwyn is(perhaps godwyns body has something to do with it.) Almost like a reverse of how life normaly is recycled for her to be born where the dead are. But I'm starting to lean to the idea melina being born is only pertaining to her current state, not what ever she was before being burned and bodyless but i dont have any proof just the only logical one that lets melina be who she is now and be associated with the gloam eyed queen cause there is so much that points to it but if she was "born bu marika at the roots of the tree" as the gloam eyed queen its impossible because gloam eyed queen most likely exsisted before the erdtree. I get thar info from the deathbrids serving the gloam eyed queen and they exsisting litterly before the erdtree. Still need some more context before saying what exactly is what unfortunately. Also another reason melina couldn't have experienced a similar thing to millicent is that she calls melania her mother, either by blood or association im not sure the motivation but technically she did create millicent from the bloom so it checks out. For melina she is calling marika her mother as well as data mining calling her "daughterofmarika" so exsisting from gloam eyed queen the way millicent does from melania just doesnt work in thay context.
@@petercottantail7850 Actually, none of what you said takes the 'wind out of its sails'. Millicent has marks on her face as well. Millicent NEVER calls Malenia her mother. Melina NEVER calls Marika her mother. As for the datamine name, Nepheli Loux is daughter of Gideon. Having a former body and purpose takes NOTHING away from the idea, actually. It could be the result of someone thwarting the 'cardinal sin' planned by Marika. No offence and all, but nothing of what you typed is of any consequence. That too such a LONG wall of text...
When Melina says "Death Indiscriminate", she means that gods and demigods must die too. And i think Marika was on the same page. She sacrificed her son and tried to kill herself (she was the Elden Ring she tried to shatter). The Numen assassins were her people and Ranni simply took advantage of the situation, by working with Marika at first and then setting in motion her own plans. Marika sent Godfrey and his soldiers away to grow strong in the face of actual death and come back stronger, to help her That was her plan B, if she failed. Which is the reason the tarnished have returned. She stole the rune of Death and gave it to her to shadow to guard it. She wanted to use it for her own purposes, not thoseof the Greater Will. At some point she became obsessed with the idea that living forever was the root of all evil. It made people corrupt and weak. She even told her children that either they will be strong or they will become a sacrifice. The Greater Will tried to take advantage of this "Plan B", in order to take out all the demigods that rejected it. But it doesn't want Marika dead, which is why you find the entrance to the Erdtree closed. Even the Two Fingers are surprised by that, which is why they try to communicate with it to find out why, after you kill the Omen King. They are not in the know. Melina tries to fulfill her mother's plan. She is not afraid of death, because for her, immortality is the real cause of everything that went wrong. She literally tries to help you kill her mother and the Elden Beast, just like Marika tried to do and failed. That is her purpose, "given to her in the Erdtree": to complete Marika's plan and deliver Indiscriminate Death Edit" By the way, her name, "Melina", also describes the color of her eyes: "honey".
I'm pretty Marika didn't want to kill Godwyn. After all, her grief over his death caused her to shatter the Elden Ring. I think she may have had doubts about sealing the Rune of Death, and wanted to release it.
I wonder if Melina's appearance is so similar to Ranni's because they're both dead in the flesh, but not in the soul. We know that Ranni dies in the flesh, but sacrifices Godwyn's soul so she can survive. If Melina is the soul of the Gloam Eyed Queen, whose body has been destroyed, this means that another demigod lost his soul. But who?
Melina's big line is "the one who walks alongside flame will one day meet the road of destined death." And her title that we know is the kindling maiden. So I certainly believe she was purposed to burn the erdtree, but I'm also curious as to what meeting destined means, and when she first became associated with the rune of death.
I think she refers to the fact that in order to really burn the Erdtree and access to it, we also need to fight Maliketh who protects the destined death rune.
What I find odd is that Melina seems to be following you at the end of the Lord of Chaos ending. I've been thinking that if you take the flame, burn the tree but then use the needle she should come back and say "Oh, I see what you did there. Smart.".
Hey dude, just want to say you put out fantastic content, you're one of my favorite Elden Ring.... Lorists? I urge you to not pay any heed to the jackwagons that have been claiming copyright bs. Keep doing you and let the haters stew in their negativity. I look forward to all of your lore videos, keep it up 🤟
I believe Melina is the Snow Witch. Her face is near identical to Ranni, one eye closed, and they even sound nearly identical. We know Ranni's new doll body was based on the looks of her Witch teacher. They even have the same eye color (revealed in the frenzied flame ending).
I didn't know you could summon Melina for the Morgott fight! That's so cool. Love your videos my dude and still so upset that some jerk copyrighted your video that you worked so hard on! I really hope youtube approved your appeal. Keep doing you my dude!
I think Melina, Marika and the gloam eyed queen are all the same person. Mainly because we never see Marika alive, we only see her other half, Radagon. Melina is also bodyless like Ranni. I think there is something to be said about the fact that Melina is bodyless and Marika appears to be soulless (or at least her soul is not in her body when we see her before and after the Radagon/Elden Beast fight). Also Marika seems to share goals with the godskins, mainly the death of the gods (evidenced by master Hewg making a god slaying weapon for the tarnished on Marika's orders). Marika and Melina also share the goal of getting the tarnished on the throne/ killing the elden beast which is the vassel of the golden order in the lands between. It's likely not correct but idk I just find this theory fun.
I subscribed because I used your videos to explain lore to none Elden Ring fans. Keep doing you bro, this situation your dealing with might ended up benefiting you in the end. Also I wanted your dog to get treats!
if miquella's needle eliminates/suppresses the influence of the outer gods and melina is the gloam/dusk-eyed queen i.e. an outer god, then even if she did wanted to speak with us once again, maybe she can't because of miquella's needle.
Probably because she is Renna in disguise, and Ranni borrowed her name at the start to confuse the PC and since she wasn't using it at that moment. So many names and so few characters LOL
Melina was once alive and already fulfilled her purpose as a kindling maiden, but died and is subjugated to repeating the process as a phantom guiding new tarnished that venture into the land between. This may be why we find her blade of calling in Leyndell.
Elden Chads: Lord Godfrey the first elden Chad Hoarah Loux, Chad Chad Margott the last of all Chads Margit the fell Chad General Chadahn Godwyn the Chad Iron Chad Alexander Maliketh the black Chad(nothing racist) Radagon of the golden Chads Varre Chad Morgott last of all Chads: “None may claim the title of Elden Chad with Maidens”
in the cavern of the wise at altus there are the killers of the birds of death, and the one on melina is the mark of the claw of the birds of death. melina presumably is the twilight-eyed queen
You know how Marika’s and Radagon’s kids either have red or white/blond hair? Melina has pink hair. Pink is just red and white mixed together. Melina says her mother gave her purpose IN the Erdtree. Is Melina a child Radagon and Marika somehow created while Marika was imprisoned? Regardless, hair color is really significant in this game and never seems to be just a random aesthetic choice. FromSoft is amazing at visual storytelling and so much is conveyed through character appearances. Melina’s mother being Marika and Melina having pink hair rather than red or blond is significant. It’s saying something. I haven’t heard anyone mention this yet, and I truly think it’s very significant. Maybe I haven’t watched enough lore videos though and it’s already been discussed. If Melina’s pink hair is significant, then her hair color change when she becomes the Gloam Eye’d Queen must also be extremely significant and might give a clue as to what the hell is going on with her.
Melina makes many references to her “mother” and makes clear that her mother is in the ErdTree. But she also makes many references to “Marika,” and seems to refer to her as discrete entity who is not her mother. This to me seems like a deliberate choice, which suggests that Marika is not her mother. But if that’s right, who is her mother then? The elden ring itself? Some other essence within the erdtree?
Godwyn was killed before the shattering. Ranni stole a fragment of the Rune of Death and the night of the black knives happened shortly after where Godwyn was killed, which was the catalyst of the Shattering, whether Ranni ordered the Night of the Black Knives or not is up to debate, but her fragment was certainly the one used to kill Godwyn. Godwyn’s death caused Marika to cause the shattering, then Radagon desperately tried to fix it. Marika was against the Erdtree and the Greater Will, that’s kinda why you literally kill the Elden Beast, which is a messenger of the Greater Will of some sort that is the very incarnation of Order.
This game, this lore man its like a gift from the Gods to play this game. Timeless legend, game of the year forever. I am 250 hours in lvl 410 and I keep replaying over and over, I just cant get enough of its mysterious universe. I cant wait for the DLC!! I hope they take it to a cosmic horror level, outer beast, like those black shades in the game that I only seen 3 of them so far, they hide in shadows scary looking, or like the elden beast. I also love your videos brother they are amazing!
Everyone thinks she's the gloam eyed queen because she has a weird eye, even though Ranni has a closed eye and a burned body.... The real question is who Torrent's former master is, and Miquella or Marika seems to be the best bet, either could be the 'girl' with the three wolves in Farum Azula if it were a sort of prophecy. Melina is likely a child of Marika born to burn the erdtree when she was imprisoned, and considering Millicent is somehow a daughter of Malenia, I think it's a safe bet. As for her eye, same as Ranni, i think its just because her spirit is split from her body, i think Melina is a daughter in the sense that shes a clone of Marika, an empty vessel she made from her essence to be kept secret from Radagon for this one purpose, the child was killed by Maliketh's hand in body, while perhaps Marika was killed in soul out of a desire to end Godwyn's shameful half-death. I think Gloam Eyed Queen is just a Numen the two fingers wanted to replace with a puppet, and Marika didn't like her strings when she noticed them.
Actually, Marika plucked the rune of death out of the elden ring and gave it to maliketh BEFORE shatering the elden ring, years before. Ranni stole a fragment of death from maliketh, and used to kill Marika’s firstborn and ONLY healthy child. She was furious with maliketh incompetence and cursed him. Maliketh sealed death within his body so no one would ever steal it from him again, and spent the rest of his life trying to take back all the death he let escape, by “eating” death that we players give him and returning the stolen fragments back to the rune of death trapped inside his body. He does this to try to fix his mistake and please marika again, as we all know empyrean shadows are very loyal to their empyrean and would do anything for them “rip blaidd”. We can see him, as beast clergyman, lamenting and calling for marika, asking when this curse would end, hoping to be forgiven. And he always refer to the death loose at the world as his “sin” blaming himself for been robbed or deceived by ranni, and saying it was his duty to fix it. AFTER waging hundreds of war in the name of the Greater Will, having her children cursed and killed because of this never ending conflict of imposing the Greater Will desire upon other people and other gods, marika was tired of all the “bullshit” and shattered the elden ring (the elden beast/Greater Will agent wrote the elden ring). After she shattered it, she was “killed” by the elden beast as punishiment and her body imprisoned inside the tree (form me it seens she is not dead just kinda absorved? Like all other souls that the erdtree absorves). Radagon tried to fix it but he was punished as well. Now who is melina? I dont know, I think she was Bernahl maid (beast champion set) who threw herself into the fire. She tells us she died burned and is bodyless. And her dagger, the Blade of Calling, belonged to the “kindling maiden”, and “someone set on a journey to fulfill her duty”. Now who is melina mother? Why the first time she burned herself didnt count? She said she was born inside the great three só what does that mean? Who is the gloam eyed queen? I think we will only discover this things in the dlc
This. Marika only became known as "The eternal" after she took the rune of death away from the ring and gave it to Maliketh for safe-keeping, so that she and her offspring could live eternal lives and destroy all their enemies in the Lands Between, to consolidate the golden order. Where i have a different theory is regarding the shattering. I believe Marika shattered the ring as a big "Screw U, everybody go to hell" once Ranni managed to steal a fragment of the rune of death to kill herself and Godwyn. I do not believe Marika has a grand scheme of redemption and plans of freedom from the control of greater will, i think she just threw a tantrum out of rage and grief from losing her firstborn, thus shattering the ring. She is a manipulative and controlling person who wanted to punish everyone and everything, even if it meant being punished herself. She is just another Cersei Lannister, and probably FS tried to made her less obvious by making her share the same body with Radagon (Jaime Lannister), without hinting to a very obvious case of incest.
The Greater Will uses the Erdtree to feed on the souls of the dead (lore of the various catacombs). When Marika found out (Ofnir alludes to this) she removed death from the Elden Ring (the manifestation of the laws of nature designed by the Greater Will). This messes things up. Melina wants to restore order by restoring death and to free her mother Marika from The Greater Will. Melina only wants to burn the Erdtree after you reach it the first time and sees Radagon sealed it. It was not her original plan. She has no qualms about burring it though, because destroying it is a major blow against The Greater Will.
Well of course the Erdtree feeds form struggle it literally grow from the corpses of the catacombs, they say they go back to the Erdtree as they die so naturally The Greater Will/Fingers/Golden Order wants people to not die naturally but to become nourishment for the tree instead. Maybe Marika didn't want that anymore that's why she did everything and maybe she IS Melina too or at least created her.
Your first clue about Shabriri should have been the "all that divides and distinguishes" line. It's literally straight out of End of Evangelion, except with fire instead of orange tang.
It feels as though Melina looks like Ranni because that is indeed Ranni's body, infused with another spirit (melina) or a fragment of the spirit of the rune of death. EDIT: At the time of writing this comment, I wasn't aware that Ranni's body can be found in the game, but it would've been a fun theory ! XD
Are we sure Melina didn't kill our intended Finger Maiden when we enter the Lands Between? You know, the very first corpse we find in the starting area. If she did, that would give her the perfect excuse to approach us and offer to serve as a Maiden for us.
I think Melina is the glaom eyed queen, who was probably an emperyean that represents death. The reason she wants any change but the flames of frenzy ending is because by bringing everything into one, death ceases to exist. That's also why she's fine with every other ending, because every age is either coming to a close, or introducing death back into a world where the system was built with its removal in mind.
I have a theory on Melina and Ranni being twins. When Radagon and Rennala had Ranni, what if the Marika side of Radagon also got pregnant with Melina. Ranni got the R name because she is Radagons child, but Melina got the M name because she is Melinas child. Twins are also knowen to be very close to each other, some people say twins are connected spiritually. Rannis other side could be her twin connection to Melina.
On a related tangent - the game makes it sound like a big deal that our Tarnished is maidenless. But as far as I can tell, every other Tanished we encounter also lacks a maiden. It feels like a huge oversight in the game to either not show these maidens, or not explain what happened to them.
I dislike that people think that saving her is whats best for her. The lady has lived far far far longer than you and has experienced many things before meeting you. Is it so far fetched to accept that she chose this fate out of her own free will? She even says that this fate of hers was her own choosing ...she wanted it to happen. Why should one take that away from her >
Melina says, “The one who walks alongside the flame shall one day meet the road of destined death.” I think this means she plans to become the next Gloam-eyed Queen. Something that Melina herself didn’t think possible when first following the path Marika set for her. She says “My purpose was given to me by my mother, but now I act of my own volition… this world is in dire need of repair, and death indiscriminate.” Meaning not only is burning the Erdtree what Marika wants, but it is also what the first Gloam-eyed Queen did in order to become an Empyrean and discovered the Rune of Death by doing so. Once we separate the rune from Maliketh, and Melina has burned away her flesh she finds the rune and claims destined death as the New Gloam-eyed Queen. The dead eye is something I haven’t fully come to understand, this is either because she is still a part of Marika and Radagon, and that part has since died, or it is a sign that Melina has ascended to the level of an Empyrean. Perhaps the first Gloam-eyed Queen had one dead eye and one gloamy one too.
Unrelated but I really hope if we fight Miquella he references himself as a the ‘Shield of Malenia’ and continues ‘and I have never seen true battle’ or something like his sister lol
I feel like Melina is a manifestation created by Miquella, as an homage to malenia, to finish the job of replacing the Erdtree with the Haligtree. But that's just conjecture.
I'm confused. I thought the rune of Death was removed so that the age of the Golden Order would begin. Isn't that why Marika is called the Eternal because she got rid of death from the lands between? Why is AgtJake asserting that the rune of death was removed after the Shattering?
You right. It's a common mistake to think that, my friend thought the same thing and i had to go over a couple item discriptions to get him to believe me. And to be fair it is hard to imagine someone 'taking' death out of the ring, when theres a shattering it would make sense if thats whem it happened so i understand the confusion. Unfortunately i dont think ive found a single lore video that doesn't get something completely wrong and some how soirals out of control by coming to a conclusion that was based on incorrect information. But I still watch them to see if i missed anything cause i want to know what happened and its a community after all, cant do it all on my own 😫 but it would be nice if lore/theory videos tried to be accurate for once, but truth doesnt make money content does 🧐
I'm watching this after the DLC and some things still make sense, but others don't. We are now pretty sure that Melina is Miquella's younger sister, which denies the theory that she was born from Ranni's actions, but it doesn't deny the fact that she may be the vessel of Destined Death in the same way that all of Marika's children have their own "curses." This makes me think that Marika and Maliketh fought with the Gloam-Eyed Queen for the title of God for the Greater Will. In the DLC trailer, we see Marika gathering something from what might be a dead body at the Divine Gate and becoming a God. It suggests that Melina was actually born at the foot of the Shadow Tree not the Erdtree, and possibly being a vessel or a reborn version of the Gloam-Eyed Queen, with the purpose of restoring Death to its "normal" state in the Lands Between.
why does vare know we are maidenless? my guess is that he killed her in the tower of anticipation to 'push' us towards his beloved blood god.. just like a sneaky thing he would do
This video, specifically at 5:32, just made me realize the 2 fingers and 3 fingers are literally identical in shape to the Elden Beast's hand. I'll have to go look at Ranni's 2 fingers, that one is strangely massive compared to the others.
theory dump ranni and melina is different person..ranni doll body take after his mentor/teacher look..ranni real body probably dont even look like the doll..ranni mentor hold rune of death got defeat by maliket..she probably gloom eye queen..and teach ranni how to kill her body and all that..so melina is the gloom eye queen or her daughter
One thing that confuses me is how the player ends up in farum azula. Whether you burn Melina or not you just randomly wake up there without explanation. If Melina has some kind of connection to the rune of death then it could maybe explain why she would send you to it, but I don't know why she would do that after you take in the flame of frenzy. The other explanation is that Melina had nothing to do with it but then who could be responsible? It's kind of infuriating how ambiguous it is.
Or how our character is transported from the Chapel of anticipation to the stranded graveyard, who took us there?. Also, aren't we the travellers from across the fog? When did we crossed it? Even Demons Souls had a better explatation for how we got into Boletaria.
5:39 I've always tought her brand was a crow talon, and linked her to the Deathbirds and the Gloam Eyed Queen. Also, why no one ever mention that there is ANOTHER ERDTREE in the land of the dead?
I think it is likely she killed our maiden. She does this to use us to get her to the ears tree. Her ability to help us grow stronger is a great offer that we would not accept if we had a maiden. She also has more of an ability to get to the starting area where our maiden was waiting with her ghost powers than other characters.
Ive been thinking about why our maiden is dead too. And yet we still get to be guided by grace? But I don't think its melina since the intro cutscene makes it like she "stumbled" onto us and we were lucky. This to me says she found us because we can be guided by grace. Torrent sees it right away but melina waits a bit as it takes a couple graces for her to visit you. But who kills our maiden is probably related to marika's motives. I say this because marika shatters the ring, by shattering it no one can become lord right away, the Lord Rune discription says that once the ring was shattered, the would-be lords lost their way. Maybe that's why marika shattered the ring. To stop anyone from replacing Godwyn as lord. Maybe to stall until she finds someone that would have her motives inmind perhaps. If(i stess if here but most likely is the case but im still having trouble with it) we go further with this line of thought and say that she was with the black knives as they are all numan. The numan coming from the eternal city who are nox. They worship the night, wnd are waiting fornits return. Coincidentally enough ranni's fate is to being back the night. We confirm this by not just her association with the moon but rennala pleads after we beat her that ranni bring back the night amd sella says that radahn holding the stars is keeping rannis fate from continuing. This would mean that if marika is also part of this plot she is stalling till someone will come along and help ranni or at the very least defeat radahn (as well as radagon to become lord? Something just doesn't add up unless we go with split personalities here) melina is the key to letting her chosen tarnished inside the tree by burning it down as noone else could enter before and fix what she started. The main issue with this thoery for me is that there is no guarantee you find ranni and do her quest, and if you do her quest ranni kills marika in her ending just feels odd (unless that needed to be done to completely severe the order from the lands between) but she does introduce herself to you saying she is doing so because she was entrusted to give you the bell cause of torrents former master. Like she sees you have grace, so that means you are being helped by marika(maybe) then she says learn the land well and alludes to not following the fingers for long, like she is trying to instigate that you find her where she is hiding away and second guess the fingers direction.
I think you shouldve mentioned that she is also the Kindling Maiden wich is stated in the description of the blade of calling wich is the weapon melina used against morgott and its stated that this weapon belonged to the Kindling Maiden alongside a Citation: "The one who walks alongside Flame shall one day meet the road of destined Death." This Citation is written in the description of blade of calling and this where also Melinas last words. So she is the Kindling Maiden and my theory is that she is Marikas daughter cause Melina tells us that her Mother gave her a purpose IN THE ERDTREE and this was prob. Part of Marikas perfect Plan to test the greater Will and so Marika wanted to see if another person could become Elden Lord.
Yeah she offered herself , she offered herself so hard that she set her ass on fire just to progress my quest. She is literally a Lord orbiter. I guess that is why I always go with the fecal feaster's or rannis ending
I also like how the dead maiden in the chapel of anticipation is most likely our original maiden since it implies so much potential story and lore. Her blood is still fresh enough to soak the cloth Varre gives us. The only maiden who's death was recent enough and blood still wet is the one right next to us when we wake up at the start. This is also probably why varre is openly critical of us because we do not appear to be a possible candidate at first, and only show promise after proving ourselves and meeting him in liurnia. I can see a possible alternative route in this questline being Hyetta. Since she wants to become a finger maiden, we could've helped her do that after encountering the 3 fingers in the sewers with her. In that moment we would embrace the 3 fingers, Melina would cast us aside and leave, Hyetta would be granted the powers of a finger maiden, and we would be branded with the flame of frenzy. However her career as a finger maiden would be cut short because we'd have to kill her and soak the cloth for Varre's questline. This could also open the road for an extended branch of Varre's questline or Hyetta's questline depending on who you side with. Either a Frenzy-tainted white mask item/item set if you side with Varre and use Hyetta's frenzy blood or a true frenzy flame item/item set from the 3 fingers if you continue with Hyetta. either way i wish we could get more extended storylines like we got with the jars in an early patch as some stories just seem to stop with not much development after a certain point. Edit: after doing some research apparently you can use 2 other maiden's bloods to progress varre's quest a dead maiden in liurnia where you fight frenzy vyke(probably his maiden who he just killed or saw get killed) and if you kill irina or find her dead you can use hers(irina is most likely hyetta so maybe killing hyetta will also work but her body probably disappears like other npc's do after death)
The biggest problem with Melina being the Gloam-Eyed Queen is the timeline. We all assume she is the third child of Marika and Radagon, and it seems she is indeed their child. But what if she was the first? Basically, my idea is that Melina was born in secrecy, before Godfrey was Elden Lord, and was raised by Marika as a "failsafe", an impartial judge that would deliver death to the gods should they stray from their path. To acomplish this, Marika plucked the rune of Death from the Elden Ring and gave it to Melina, who raised children of her own in the form of the Godskins and their black flame. But Melina, now the Gloam-Eyed Queen, grew bold. Under her orders, the Godskins butchered and worn the gods, and so Marika unleashed the failsafe's failsafe, Maliketh, to put a stop to the Godskins, their queen and their flame, and seal away destined death. And this, her shadow achieved. Melina was, at some point, left burnt and bodyless, stripped of her power and her Godslayer Greatsword, and most likely imprisoned in some way. But Marika is not above forgiveness, especially to her children. And so, before sealing herself and Radagon within the Erdtree to shatter the Ring, Marika gave Melina a purpose, a calling, and a Blade. To serve as kindling for the flame of ruin, to help burn the Erdtree and, once again, to act as a final failsafe, should the Chosen Tarnished embrace the Three Fingers. And to this end, one of her eyes was closed shut, and in that darkness, her eye would become gloam once more. I know the timeline still isn't perfect, but we're here to discuss as a collective anyway, so if you have something of your own to add, go ahead! (That goes for you too, Jake.)
Even if she appears so sporadically, Melina is such a magnificent character, she is the chosen Tarnished biggest aid in dire need, she guides the chosen Tarnished through the Lands between, and i loved listening to her beautiful soothing Voice at a safehaven that is a side of Grace, seeing her engulfed by the flames of the Giants on the Edge of the Forge on the Mountaintop, it hurt my soul to lose her to be honest, no perfect Order, no frenzied Chaos, no reemerging death, eternal night or cursed kin, in hope of seeing her again, i chose the neutral ending, but she was gone, faded away as ash in the wind, the Erdtree ablaze and my Tarnished sitting on the Throne, ascended to be the Eldenlord, the new Ruler of the Lands between in the upcoming Age of Fracture, but maidenless in the end...
I thought the shattering happened after the The Rune of Death was already taken from Melina since Maliketh was robbed of the Rune of Death on the Night of Black Knives which took place after he had already defeated The Gloam Eyed Queen and before the shattering
Based on the item description of the blade of calling Melina is likely the fire maiden, who’s entire purpose was for told in an omen/vision to guide the tarnished burn the erd tree and help restore order to the lands between. This is supported by the fact that she literally says the same thing that’s written below the item description when she dies..
My comment on your Placidusax video makes even MORE sense now. I love your lore hunting. It was accidental, but thanks to you showing the Elden beast’s FIVE fingers shaped exactly like the two fingers and the three fingers, the theory I proposed is summed up below: 1. Placidusax was Eldenlord in the prior order of the Greater Will, had five heads, and the Lands Between operated much like our real world. 2. This led to too much chaos and free will (I.e war, petty fighting, hate, discrimination, etc.), so…. 3. Greater Will severed Placidusax’s three heads and the five finger envoys three fingers, separated them and locked away chaos in the form of the three fingers. 4. Placidusax fell out of grace and Marika was chosen as the consort for a new order, the Golden Order, where chaos was taken away. 5. This led to Farum Azula and the dragon rebellion. Gransax died but destroyed Lyndell. Placidusax sealed himself in time awaiting their opportunity to be given the grace they deserve again from the Greater Will (similar to Godfrey coming back to claim what was taken from him). Fortissax fought Godwyn but lost, however the two gained respect after the battles and became friends.
And this would eventually lead to Marika ruling peacefully for a while until she becomes disillusioned with the Golden Order and the Shattering ensued.
Finally, on the other video I mentioned two other interesting things: Two fingers = Peace ✌️ Three fingers = 3 = odd number only divisible by itself and another odd number, 1. Also close to pi, 3.14 the craziest fucking number. Maybe there are 0.14 fingers we are missing? Zoom in Jake!!! Zoooooommmmmmmm
Tarnished: "Hah! See that, Varre? I've got a maiden now!"
Varre: "Really? Where is she?"
Tarnished: "She's not here right now. She only shows up occasionally after I rest at these lights that apparently only I can see to tell me I'm doing a good job or whatever."
Varre: "..."
It’s like similar to like divorce almost no? She says goodbye to the kids rather than you, or to the car.
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That's cause she doesnt care about the player, just who ever torrent likes
She actually does say goodbye to you though. She says "Goodbye, my companion"
I remember that because it was particularly sad
She lives in Canada
Melina: "l can play the role of gf."
Ranni: "Come, my husband."
burn baby burn
See the difference?
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Confirmed ranni and Melina are waifu
ranni supremacy confirmed
If Melina is the gloam eyed queen, then I think the tattoo covering her eye represents Maliketh’s hand in which Destined Death was sealed. Upon defeating him, and restoring the Death Rune to the Elden Ring (making Death indiscriminate), the Gloam Eye of Melina is opened…
Interesting. It could explain why the tattoo is faded in the Frenzied Flame ending.
Just seen the comment on the new video... Not even a like lol
Either way more eyes on the theory
@@ijustmakeinflammatorycomme9839 at 9:35 in the new vid? Seems very similar to me 🤷♂️. I suppose I would not have mentioned it had he labelled it as “a theory”, or “one theory” etc
Then this would support the idea that Melina is simply trying to repair things of her volition. I still think Marika and Radagon both ended up serving the Greater Will. As the Erdtree grows more powerful so does the influence of the Greater Will. What if a deathless age of constant struggle was what the greater will intends?
@@ForticusKrorkenstein I think Melina is Marika's daughter (of a sort) born likely before the Golden order was fully established and before the Nox/Numen were banished to the Eternal Cities underground as she shares the same moveset as the Night Maidens and Black Knife Assassins (who were Numen Women with ties to Marika and scions of the Eternal cities)
At some point the Greater will through the two fingers selected Melina as an Empyrean to wield and deliver destined death in the name of the greater will and as an Empyrean had the potential to replace Marika. At which point I suspect Marika who was aware of if not had taken part in the Downfall of the preceding Dragon order and Greater Will abandoning it and its God and one time vessel of the Elden ring whom she and her order were in the process of replacing got paranoid that one day the Greater will may well seek to abandon her and have her own daughter Melina replace her resolved to remove the death rune to avoid a similar fate which I suspect incensed Melina as she had come to accept and believe that delivering destined death was her calling and declared open war with Marika becoming the Gloam eyed Queen and leading her Godskin apostasy but was ultimately defeated by Maliketh. however Marika in part out regret and foreseeing a future where she may want to end her rule and order, only had Melina killed in body alone similar to Rani (whichmay have inspired that part of Rani's later scheme) leaving Melina burned, bodiless, near powerless, and without a clear purpose with the death rune fully sealed. But Marika did have a contingency plan that involved Melina, Hewg, and the Tarnished should she decide to end her order and rule a plan she initiated when the death her favorite child despite all her efforts came to pass.
Its pretty chilling to hear Melina, this being who has pretty consistantly been around to help and guide us be very plain in telling us "If you become lord of Chaos, _I will kill you_ ". Like, she knows exactly what shes talking about right there.
*_She's here to kill Chaos._*
UH…uh…UH
Chaos…?
It’s not as simple as Chaos.
It’s about annihilation of everything in order to relieve pain and suffering. If you listen to the three fingers “maiden”, it’s clear. It’s the culmination of an older school of philosophy that suggests life and individuality is suffering, and the only cure is to become a singular chaotic void of nothingness. And yes, that’s a real thing.
Melina makes it clear when she speaks to you outside the three fingers. Someone who would abandon individuality has no right to be a Lord, a Lord wouldn’t abandon their peoples very being.
Melina hunts you down not because you’re chaos in that ending. It’s because you’re Seymour from Final Fantasy 10.
And we should all hunt down and kill Seymour’s from Final Fantasy 10. 👍🏻
She HATES chaos. Chaos killed her wife and fucked her dog and recorded it. Chaos. She has the MP4 on her MacBook.
@@ZhongliArchonofSwag I think that OverTheStone was making a reference to the game Stranger of Paradise. It's sort of a meme; ruclips.net/video/no-MCGxZcsQ/видео.html
She aint gonna kill shit.
The voice direction given to Melina's actress clearly shows her intentions are not ill-intended and she truly believes what she is doing is for the greater good. That "Thank you" she gives when burning herself is the most heart-warming line in all of Elden Ring.
What about Hewg calling you lord. He was a true friend. And roderika staying with Hewg implying she is part of the loop Hewg is in, as he recalls someone like her when she first goes to the roundtable
Melina: the erdtree burns, my purpose is fulfilled, goodbye you who walks alongside the flame
Me shortly after: hello there 3 fingers
Melina form the grave: am I a joke to you?
I'm seriously bout to do this
@@thabignickdigga2603 maidenless behavior
Melina from the grave: I can imagine that, Melina doing the same meme of that guy from the stadium looking at something soooo disappointing to.
😅🤣😅🤣
I did the same on this playthrough. But Melina never reappeared for me. 😂
I actually accidentally did this on my first playthrough. I saw a giant ass door on my way to get the stone tablet, couldn't figure out how to open the door. Killed the fire giant, was like "hey I wonder if there is a way through that door. It's probably a gank or something". I then went back to that door, saw someone put a sign that said "no armor", and proceeded to get mad that I was forced into that ending. Not at the game mind you, at myself.
Melina's purpose was to sell me a car. She offered me an Accord...... but instead, she gave me a horse. Truth be told, I would've preferred the car.
I feel like the car would have a hard time in the lands between..
When Melina said "as surely as night follows day" I got big dusk vibes from her
One thing tho, I don't think the greater will wants the death rune back in the elden ring. Enia says that it's much too late to put it back and it would cause problems
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The lines, you'll surely find them at George RR Martin's Game of thrones novel. Could be some classic words of him.
@@deztacular If it's really her purpose, she might not be able to see that, or beyond it. She comes off as somewhat "programmed," even for all her emotion. Like how all lifeforms are programmed to struggle blindly towards death, unconcerned with any grander point.
Here's my take:
1- Melina was the last attempt of Radagon to repair the ring, he tried but he couldn't mend the Elden Ring, he needed a tarnished to do so.
2- Tarnished, before being exiled and fallen from grace (literally) depended on maidens for guidance of the Greater Will, once marika banished Godfrey and the Tarnished, she set out to eliminate all maidens.
3- A flock of tarnished started returning to the lands between to fulfill the prophecy of "a tarnished becoming elden lord" this is literally said by the finger reader at the entrance of Leyndell.
4- The tarnished returning posed a serious problem for any of them to become elden lords as for what we know THE only maiden searching the land is Hyetta, we see a couple more but both were killed, and Therolina becomes one of Seluvis puppets. without maidens NO tranished would never reach Leyndell as they can't even channel runes into power, let alone interpret the will of the Greater Will.
5- Seeing this Radagon/Marika creates Melina to be the last Maiden.
6- we know that prior to our tarnished arrival there were 2 suitable candidates for Elden Lord: Vyke and Bernahl.
7- Vyke couldn't become a Lord because he pledged to the Frenzied flame, which would've prompted Melina to ditch him.
8- Melina in one of her first dialogues tells you she doesn't remember much, other than she was burned, if you read Bernahl's armor set you'll notice it says he could've become "Lord" but his maiden burned away... that's very strange, as Bernahl is later connected to Rykard being eaten by the snake, and to the night of the Black Knights (by the items he drops in Farum Azula)
9- My thoughts is that Bernahl managed along with Melina to go into Leyndell and tried to set the tree ablaze, as it's shown in one of the sides of the Erd Tree which is clearly mated and possibly burnt. The Finger reader at the foot of Rold's Lift tells you that burning the tree is a cardinal sin, however unless that sin was attempted before, it would seem that just the idea of it was unthinkable for anyone living in The Lands Between
10- after that attempt Melina was called back inside the Erd Tree, and later sent to you, but without her memories of the previous "coup" attempts.
Vykes maiden wasn't Melina. Melina only plays the role of maiden.
@@rightousnesspursuer6523 not even Melina has a clear idea who she was prior of meeting you, but the fact that she can channel the power as a maiden sure points to her having a connection to grace that is one of a maiden (or former maiden) or similar.
@@rodrigomanzo777 Perhaps. I'm just saying because we meet vykes maiden who is dead.
@@rodrigomanzo777 yeah vayke Madien died it's why he even went with the three fingers. and for behall he had another maiden as well. notice that malenia is called the kindling Madien that is something that should explain the lore but I just don't know what yet
@@lawlessloki9320 read the items from Bernahl...he literally burnt his maiden, and the erd tree has a huge scar right where the thorns are as if charred
Melina seems to be a "solaire is the lost son of gwyn" character currently. We don't have a lot of answers so we force this character to fill the gaps.
That was a joke theory Tbf. I feel like this theory makes more sense. Plenty of arguments you could make for this one.
You mean we get told off by Miyazaki 2 games later "no lol", like with the Nameless King?
I still think the Gloam Eyed Queen is a character we haven’t met yet. I think Melina’s purpose is to free Marika from the Erdtree, which is why she’s willing to commit a cardinal sin. She has no love for the golden order, only her mother, and wants to see Marika, the Ring, and The Lands Between, all repaired.
I mean
> Her eye is Gloam colored
> She's obsessed with destined death
> She has the same animations as the Black Knife Assassins
> She uses a weapon that is directly related to the Black Knife, and has almost exactly the same flavor text
> Ranni took the death rune, and somehow it got into the hands of the Gloam Eyed Queen - implying they worked together
> Ranni and Melina are half sisters, and are the only two who refer to Torrent by name
> Ranni says she knows the previous owner of Torrent
> Gloam Eyed Queen was also obsessed with destined death, and had the death rune
> Melina claims her body was burned, and Maliketh uses fire
@@Wakish0069 the dialogue from Ranni regarding Torrent makes sense now... Ranni pretty much said that she knows the previous owner of Torrent. It might be Melina.
@@nathanieldelacruz7198 Ranni and Melina 100% know each other and are half sisters, and all evidence points to them being allies
I didn't mention it in my above comment, but it seems Melina's face is that spectral face you see next to Ranni's - and the tattoo on their opposite eyes match
@@Wakish0069 I believe the face you see next to Ranni is Ranni. The "Ranni" that you interact with is a doll, because she sacrificed her body. And the ghostly thing is her soul. I don't think it's Melina.
@@Notsogoodguitarguy The ghost face thing we really don't know, but have you seen people overlap Melina's face on top of it? The tattoo and opposite closed eyes match up perfectly
Not really sure what this entails, but both of these sisters lost their original bodies and may have some connection
Melina takes the phrase “I’ll be with you in spirit” to a whole other level.
where did she say that?
@@breathair66 it’s a turn of phrase people use. The joke is that’s she’s an actual spirit.
Was actually pretty sad when she died...
Then I finished the chaos ending AFTER burning the tree, not realizing she was against it... sooo I guess no one is coming to kill me. accidental win?
Thats more like a double loss. You let her die AND became frenzied lord?
@@newt2120 or a double win however you want to look at it lol
Lol I did this too. I decided that my character was just so heartbroken after her loss that he just decided to burn it all down and start again. This video makes my personal "lore" playthrough of Elden Ring oh so much more poignant
@@troybird7604 I did a similar thing, but with a religious zealot style character (nothing more fitting than a religious nut bringing about the end of the world) following Millicent's quest. Made sure to kill Malenia right before Godfrey for extra style points. Melina still being alive at the end was a bonus since I don't like the idea of the Lord of Frenzy getting to live especially since it definitely kills the Tarnished at the end and just takes over the body like Yura with Shabriri.
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I got the distinct impression from the first couple conversations you have with Melina after defeating Morgott, that Melina becoming the kindling maiden was her own decision, that she redirected her purpose from it's original. Very possibly an act of defiance against her original based on her angry tone. I have a hard time believing she cares for the greater will given she doesn't care a if you pledge yourself to Ranni, meaning that possibly the Elden ring does not get restored at all (that is unclear).
It is also important to note, that Melina was not born of a mother, despite being heavily implied (not counting datamining confirming this) she is the daughter of Marika. She tells us this herself, when discussing Boc wanting his mother and to be called beautiful. This means she was likely created in some other manner, and her being a piece of the rune of death is quite poetic.
The way I see it Melina and Ranni are both part of the Gloam eyed Queen. Ranni is dusk and Melina is dawn which is why they share that ghostly face overlay as both parts of the “gloam” which can mean both dusk and dawn depending on context. Also the mark on Melina’s eye is a crows foot which obviously is a sign of death tying her to destined death and Ranni.
Ranni is not the Gloam-eyed Queen. She is the daughter of Radagon and Rennala. She only has a connection to the Rune of death because she stole it, but that happened years later, after Maliketh defeated the Gloam-eyed Queen
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Gloam is being used as an adjective, which means shady or gloomy. Melina's one eye has become shady in that ending.
Don't think they are all gloam eye, but think Miquella, Ranni, and Melina are walking the same path. The three lone wolfs who have forsaken the greater will and want to end the order of things.
Both Ranni and Melina have a deep tie to Torrent, who has chosen us and I think we'll find out miqeulla has a tie to Torrent in the dlc.
"the one who walks alongside flame, shall one day meet the road of destined death"
I feel this is atleast connects Melina to the gloam eyed queen in some capacity. Originally, the gloam eyed queen held control over destined death, in the form of the black fire used by the godskins in combat. Until, maliketh beat her and took it for himself and used it as a weapon out in the open which frightened all the demigods. Eventually, ranni steals a piece of it in the night of black knives and when maliketh gets it back, he seals it away in the amulet until our fight with him in game.
This would makes sense about the tattoo over Melina's eye being a beasts claw cause it symbolizes maliketh, being a shadowbound beast, whom beat her. As such, her powers are sealed away until the rune is freed into the world and her eye opens, being able to use the power of destined death once agian.
Super crazy theory dump ahead!!!!!
So basically every offspring of Marika or Radagon comes in 3 and usually the names start or sound the same (ex. Ranni, Radhan, Rykard) but if you think about it. The ones who break this rule are the offspring of Marika and Radagon Mikela and Malenia. If you try a third name that rimes. Melina fits perfectly. Further more. Malenia has the red mane of her father and Mikela has the golden hair of his mother and when you see the transition from Marika to Radagon in the final fight between the golden hair and the red mane it looks pink!!!! My guess. Melina is a secret daughter of the gods. Who they sent to destroy the golden order. The reason why Rani was able to steal death from Maliketh which if you think about you would need an insider to do something like that. The connection between Ranni and Melina is no that obvious but we all know is there. Her purpose is to restore the balance by shattering it.
she could of dropped a mixtape and it would be so fire the urdtree would burn
Noice
True we could've even featured in it
Where does it say the Erdtree feeds on struggle? I read Marika sending away Godfrey and the Tarnished as her plan to overthrow the Elden Beast by making the Tarnished die and die again so they could become stronger.
"Grow strong in the face of Death."
It definitely does not say that. Souls appear to return to the Erdtree, so it may feed on souls in some capacity, but we're given no reason to believe it feeds on struggle. Even if it did, it would make no sense to send people to struggle outside the Erdtree's territory to struggle to feed it: they're outside its territory.
@@Eladelia Right, I was referring to this video, where he said that the tree fed on struggle and I don't recall finding anything that pointed towards that conclusion.
@@2402Stevo Sorry, I wasn't clear enough. I was meaning to reinforce your point, not disagree with you
@@Eladelia No problem. I hope the creator of the video can share his two cents on where he got his conclusion.
AgtJake has mentioned that the erdtree feeds on struggle in at least 2 of his videos that I’ve seen, and both times he hasn’t really explained why he thinks so. He’s the only content creator who has this theory that I’ve seen
Melina being the gloam eyed queen makes sense she has a twilight colored eye.but her being the dusk eyed queen is also sensible. She has a dusk eye after the Lord of chaos. And the whole as surely as night follows day line confirms it
gloam is a literal synonim or however you spell it of dusk
I think that Melina's relation to the gloam eyed queen could be like Millicent is to Malenia. Heavily implied to be born of the shattering (blooming) of Malenia.
Similarly, Melina might be born of the Gloam eyed queen's defeat (at the foot of the Erdtree). She regains her complete self in FF ending. So when Ranni gives you the bell and talks about Torrent's previous owner, she must be referring to the gloam eyed queen (the steed is spectral as are the spirit ashes, both post death)
Kinda like V and Vergil I guess. It might be that Marika was the only person who knew of Melina's existence and was part of her plan to return Godfrey and grant him audience.
this makes sense as they are both empyrean, splitting themselves into Aspects seems to be what they do.
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Theres a few counters to this claim that come to mind.
Why is melina in an incomplete state? She says she lost her purpose long ago and was burned and bodyless? Only to get a new one from marika.
This born from death would make a lot of sense but the fact she apparently had a former body and purpose takes a lot of the wind from the sails for that idea. I do think melina was born from death as being born from the roots points to where they bury their dead so they can reach the tree sooner to be reborn and where Godwyn is(perhaps godwyns body has something to do with it.) Almost like a reverse of how life normaly is recycled for her to be born where the dead are. But I'm starting to lean to the idea melina being born is only pertaining to her current state, not what ever she was before being burned and bodyless but i dont have any proof just the only logical one that lets melina be who she is now and be associated with the gloam eyed queen cause there is so much that points to it but if she was "born bu marika at the roots of the tree" as the gloam eyed queen its impossible because gloam eyed queen most likely exsisted before the erdtree. I get thar info from the deathbrids serving the gloam eyed queen and they exsisting litterly before the erdtree. Still need some more context before saying what exactly is what unfortunately.
Also another reason melina couldn't have experienced a similar thing to millicent is that she calls melania her mother, either by blood or association im not sure the motivation but technically she did create millicent from the bloom so it checks out. For melina she is calling marika her mother as well as data mining calling her "daughterofmarika" so exsisting from gloam eyed queen the way millicent does from melania just doesnt work in thay context.
@@petercottantail7850 Actually, none of what you said takes the 'wind out of its sails'. Millicent has marks on her face as well. Millicent NEVER calls Malenia her mother. Melina NEVER calls Marika her mother. As for the datamine name, Nepheli Loux is daughter of Gideon.
Having a former body and purpose takes NOTHING away from the idea, actually. It could be the result of someone thwarting the 'cardinal sin' planned by Marika.
No offence and all, but nothing of what you typed is of any consequence. That too such a LONG wall of text...
I think milicent is malenia's dignity basically and she lost that when she allow the scarlet rot to bloom
When Melina says "Death Indiscriminate", she means that gods and demigods must die too. And i think Marika was on the same page. She sacrificed her son and tried to kill herself (she was the Elden Ring she tried to shatter). The Numen assassins were her people and Ranni simply took advantage of the situation, by working with Marika at first and then setting in motion her own plans.
Marika sent Godfrey and his soldiers away to grow strong in the face of actual death and come back stronger, to help her That was her plan B, if she failed. Which is the reason the tarnished have returned. She stole the rune of Death and gave it to her to shadow to guard it. She wanted to use it for her own purposes, not thoseof the Greater Will. At some point she became obsessed with the idea that living forever was the root of all evil. It made people corrupt and weak. She even told her children that either they will be strong or they will become a sacrifice.
The Greater Will tried to take advantage of this "Plan B", in order to take out all the demigods that rejected it. But it doesn't want Marika dead, which is why you find the entrance to the Erdtree closed. Even the Two Fingers are surprised by that, which is why they try to communicate with it to find out why, after you kill the Omen King. They are not in the know.
Melina tries to fulfill her mother's plan. She is not afraid of death, because for her, immortality is the real cause of everything that went wrong. She literally tries to help you kill her mother and the Elden Beast, just like Marika tried to do and failed. That is her purpose, "given to her in the Erdtree": to complete Marika's plan and deliver Indiscriminate Death
Edit" By the way, her name, "Melina", also describes the color of her eyes: "honey".
she says that she is acting of her own accord and doesn't care what her perpose given to her is though
I'm pretty Marika didn't want to kill Godwyn. After all, her grief over his death caused her to shatter the Elden Ring. I think she may have had doubts about sealing the Rune of Death, and wanted to release it.
@@Ty-cx3gv Yes, i have changed my mind on this since then.
I wonder if Melina's appearance is so similar to Ranni's because they're both dead in the flesh, but not in the soul. We know that Ranni dies in the flesh, but sacrifices Godwyn's soul so she can survive. If Melina is the soul of the Gloam Eyed Queen, whose body has been destroyed, this means that another demigod lost his soul. But who?
Maybe she just took upon the body of the first person who died
Melina's big line is "the one who walks alongside flame will one day meet the road of destined death." And her title that we know is the kindling maiden. So I certainly believe she was purposed to burn the erdtree, but I'm also curious as to what meeting destined means, and when she first became associated with the rune of death.
I think she refers to the fact that in order to really burn the Erdtree and access to it, we also need to fight Maliketh who protects the destined death rune.
I was wondering why the use of Dark Souls OSTs, but then you mentioned about Melina's "kindling" sacrifice.
Such a subtle detail.
Thank you for noticing that 💕
What I find odd is that Melina seems to be following you at the end of the Lord of Chaos ending. I've been thinking that if you take the flame, burn the tree but then use the needle she should come back and say "Oh, I see what you did there. Smart.".
Hey dude, just want to say you put out fantastic content, you're one of my favorite Elden Ring.... Lorists? I urge you to not pay any heed to the jackwagons that have been claiming copyright bs. Keep doing you and let the haters stew in their negativity. I look forward to all of your lore videos, keep it up 🤟
I approve this message
@@TheSebastianSykes I approve it as well.
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Wait, people have been copyright claiming lore videos? Quantum TV must have a sith academy training these bastards somewhere. Lol
I believe Melina is the Snow Witch. Her face is near identical to Ranni, one eye closed, and they even sound nearly identical. We know Ranni's new doll body was based on the looks of her Witch teacher. They even have the same eye color (revealed in the frenzied flame ending).
I didn't know you could summon Melina for the Morgott fight! That's so cool. Love your videos my dude and still so upset that some jerk copyrighted your video that you worked so hard on! I really hope youtube approved your appeal. Keep doing you my dude!
I think Melina, Marika and the gloam eyed queen are all the same person. Mainly because we never see Marika alive, we only see her other half, Radagon. Melina is also bodyless like Ranni. I think there is something to be said about the fact that Melina is bodyless and Marika appears to be soulless (or at least her soul is not in her body when we see her before and after the Radagon/Elden Beast fight). Also Marika seems to share goals with the godskins, mainly the death of the gods (evidenced by master Hewg making a god slaying weapon for the tarnished on Marika's orders). Marika and Melina also share the goal of getting the tarnished on the throne/ killing the elden beast which is the vassel of the golden order in the lands between. It's likely not correct but idk I just find this theory fun.
I subscribed because I used your videos to explain lore to none Elden Ring fans. Keep doing you bro, this situation your dealing with might ended up benefiting you in the end. Also I wanted your dog to get treats!
The Elden Beast hand has 3 fingers very separated from the other 2 in that cutscene, dont know if it was on purpose or not but still, HMMMMMM
this whole time i thought Melina is Malenia
Bro did NOT play elden ring before this comment 😭
if miquella's needle eliminates/suppresses the influence of the outer gods and melina is the gloam/dusk-eyed queen i.e. an outer god, then even if she did wanted to speak with us once again, maybe she can't because of miquella's needle.
It is never implied that the Gloam eyed queen is an outer god
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Haha, excellent!
Typically the phrase "Driven to the brink" means that they're on the edge of something, whether its madness or otherwise.
Probably because she is Renna in disguise, and Ranni borrowed her name at the start to confuse the PC and since she wasn't using it at that moment. So many names and so few characters LOL
Maybe a dumb question, but who are the three sisters? If Ranni is one of them, and Renna is another, then this could make sense
She gives us the (Honda) Accord
Melina was once alive and already fulfilled her purpose as a kindling maiden, but died and is subjugated to repeating the process as a phantom guiding new tarnished that venture into the land between. This may be why we find her blade of calling in Leyndell.
I think Melina is a confessor fighting for the will of the two fingers that’s why she tries to kill you if you choose flame of frenzy
Elden Chads:
Lord Godfrey the first elden Chad
Hoarah Loux, Chad
Chad Margott the last of all Chads
Margit the fell Chad
General Chadahn
Godwyn the Chad
Iron Chad Alexander
Maliketh the black Chad(nothing racist)
Radagon of the golden Chads
Varre
Chad Morgott last of all Chads: “None may claim the title of Elden Chad with Maidens”
in the cavern of the wise at altus there are the killers of the birds of death, and the one on melina is the mark of the claw of the birds of death. melina presumably is the twilight-eyed queen
You know how Marika’s and Radagon’s kids either have red or white/blond hair? Melina has pink hair. Pink is just red and white mixed together.
Melina says her mother gave her purpose IN the Erdtree. Is Melina a child Radagon and Marika somehow created while Marika was imprisoned?
Regardless, hair color is really significant in this game and never seems to be just a random aesthetic choice. FromSoft is amazing at visual storytelling and so much is conveyed through character appearances. Melina’s mother being Marika and Melina having pink hair rather than red or blond is significant. It’s saying something.
I haven’t heard anyone mention this yet, and I truly think it’s very significant. Maybe I haven’t watched enough lore videos though and it’s already been discussed.
If Melina’s pink hair is significant, then her hair color change when she becomes the Gloam Eye’d Queen must also be extremely significant and might give a clue as to what the hell is going on with her.
Melina makes many references to her “mother” and makes clear that her mother is in the ErdTree. But she also makes many references to “Marika,” and seems to refer to her as discrete entity who is not her mother. This to me seems like a deliberate choice, which suggests that Marika is not her mother. But if that’s right, who is her mother then? The elden ring itself? Some other essence within the erdtree?
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First time I got this dialogue “For my purpose given to me by my mother inside the erdtree long ago”
Godwyn was killed before the shattering. Ranni stole a fragment of the Rune of Death and the night of the black knives happened shortly after where Godwyn was killed, which was the catalyst of the Shattering, whether Ranni ordered the Night of the Black Knives or not is up to debate, but her fragment was certainly the one used to kill Godwyn. Godwyn’s death caused Marika to cause the shattering, then Radagon desperately tried to fix it. Marika was against the Erdtree and the Greater Will, that’s kinda why you literally kill the Elden Beast, which is a messenger of the Greater Will of some sort that is the very incarnation of Order.
This game, this lore man its like a gift from the Gods to play this game. Timeless legend, game of the year forever. I am 250 hours in lvl 410 and I keep replaying over and over, I just cant get enough of its mysterious universe. I cant wait for the DLC!! I hope they take it to a cosmic horror level, outer beast, like those black shades in the game that I only seen 3 of them so far, they hide in shadows scary looking, or like the elden beast. I also love your videos brother they are amazing!
Everyone thinks she's the gloam eyed queen because she has a weird eye, even though Ranni has a closed eye and a burned body.... The real question is who Torrent's former master is, and Miquella or Marika seems to be the best bet, either could be the 'girl' with the three wolves in Farum Azula if it were a sort of prophecy. Melina is likely a child of Marika born to burn the erdtree when she was imprisoned, and considering Millicent is somehow a daughter of Malenia, I think it's a safe bet. As for her eye, same as Ranni, i think its just because her spirit is split from her body, i think Melina is a daughter in the sense that shes a clone of Marika, an empty vessel she made from her essence to be kept secret from Radagon for this one purpose, the child was killed by Maliketh's hand in body, while perhaps Marika was killed in soul out of a desire to end Godwyn's shameful half-death. I think Gloam Eyed Queen is just a Numen the two fingers wanted to replace with a puppet, and Marika didn't like her strings when she noticed them.
the night of black knives happened before the shattering, though. maliketh already had the rune of death before marika shattered the elden ring
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Cmon bro don't just kneel there give her a hug goodbye. It's just a little fire
You know what would send me absolutely insane with joy? DLC which varies what you do in it, depending on how you completed the game.
Now I ain't sayin' she a gold dagger
But she ain't hanging with no broke fingers.
Actually, Marika plucked the rune of death out of the elden ring and gave it to maliketh BEFORE shatering the elden ring, years before.
Ranni stole a fragment of death from maliketh, and used to kill Marika’s firstborn and ONLY healthy child. She was furious with maliketh incompetence and cursed him. Maliketh sealed death within his body so no one would ever steal it from him again, and spent the rest of his life trying to take back all the death he let escape, by “eating” death that we players give him and returning the stolen fragments back to the rune of death trapped inside his body. He does this to try to fix his mistake and please marika again, as we all know empyrean shadows are very loyal to their empyrean and would do anything for them “rip blaidd”.
We can see him, as beast clergyman, lamenting and calling for marika, asking when this curse would end, hoping to be forgiven. And he always refer to the death loose at the world as his “sin” blaming himself for been robbed or deceived by ranni, and saying it was his duty to fix it.
AFTER waging hundreds of war in the name of the Greater Will, having her children cursed and killed because of this never ending conflict of imposing the Greater Will desire upon other people and other gods, marika was tired of all the “bullshit” and shattered the elden ring (the elden beast/Greater Will agent wrote the elden ring). After she shattered it, she was “killed” by the elden beast as punishiment and her body imprisoned inside the tree (form me it seens she is not dead just kinda absorved? Like all other souls that the erdtree absorves). Radagon tried to fix it but he was punished as well.
Now who is melina? I dont know, I think she was Bernahl maid (beast champion set) who threw herself into the fire. She tells us she died burned and is bodyless. And her dagger, the Blade of Calling, belonged to the “kindling maiden”, and “someone set on a journey to fulfill her duty”.
Now who is melina mother? Why the first time she burned herself didnt count? She said she was born inside the great three só what does that mean? Who is the gloam eyed queen? I think we will only discover this things in the dlc
This. Marika only became known as "The eternal" after she took the rune of death away from the ring and gave it to Maliketh for safe-keeping, so that she and her offspring could live eternal lives and destroy all their enemies in the Lands Between, to consolidate the golden order. Where i have a different theory is regarding the shattering. I believe Marika shattered the ring as a big "Screw U, everybody go to hell" once Ranni managed to steal a fragment of the rune of death to kill herself and Godwyn. I do not believe Marika has a grand scheme of redemption and plans of freedom from the control of greater will, i think she just threw a tantrum out of rage and grief from losing her firstborn, thus shattering the ring. She is a manipulative and controlling person who wanted to punish everyone and everything, even if it meant being punished herself. She is just another Cersei Lannister, and probably FS tried to made her less obvious by making her share the same body with Radagon (Jaime Lannister), without hinting to a very obvious case of incest.
The Greater Will uses the Erdtree to feed on the souls of the dead (lore of the various catacombs). When Marika found out (Ofnir alludes to this) she removed death from the Elden Ring (the manifestation of the laws of nature designed by the Greater Will). This messes things up. Melina wants to restore order by restoring death and to free her mother Marika from The Greater Will. Melina only wants to burn the Erdtree after you reach it the first time and sees Radagon sealed it. It was not her original plan. She has no qualms about burring it though, because destroying it is a major blow against The Greater Will.
Well of course the Erdtree feeds form struggle it literally grow from the corpses of the catacombs, they say they go back to the Erdtree as they die so naturally The Greater Will/Fingers/Golden Order wants people to not die naturally but to become nourishment for the tree instead.
Maybe Marika didn't want that anymore that's why she did everything and maybe she IS Melina too or at least created her.
Your first clue about Shabriri should have been the "all that divides and distinguishes" line. It's literally straight out of End of Evangelion, except with fire instead of orange tang.
It feels as though Melina looks like Ranni because that is indeed Ranni's body, infused with another spirit (melina) or a fragment of the spirit of the rune of death. EDIT: At the time of writing this comment, I wasn't aware that Ranni's body can be found in the game, but it would've been a fun theory ! XD
Are we sure Melina didn't kill our intended Finger Maiden when we enter the Lands Between? You know, the very first corpse we find in the starting area. If she did, that would give her the perfect excuse to approach us and offer to serve as a Maiden for us.
I think Melina is the glaom eyed queen, who was probably an emperyean that represents death. The reason she wants any change but the flames of frenzy ending is because by bringing everything into one, death ceases to exist. That's also why she's fine with every other ending, because every age is either coming to a close, or introducing death back into a world where the system was built with its removal in mind.
I have a theory on Melina and Ranni being twins.
When Radagon and Rennala had Ranni, what if the Marika side of Radagon also got pregnant with Melina. Ranni got the R name because she is Radagons child, but Melina got the M name because she is Melinas child.
Twins are also knowen to be very close to each other, some people say twins are connected spiritually. Rannis other side could be her twin connection to Melina.
yes
May chaos take the world.
tbh i didn't see the elden beasts hands on melina's eyelid at all. looks like a roosters paw to me :P
I'm pretty sure when you first meet Melina in the Church of Ellah, she tells you that she was given her purpose by her mother in the Erdtree.
On a related tangent - the game makes it sound like a big deal that our Tarnished is maidenless. But as far as I can tell, every other Tanished we encounter also lacks a maiden. It feels like a huge oversight in the game to either not show these maidens, or not explain what happened to them.
I dislike that people think that saving her is whats best for her. The lady has lived far far far longer than you and has experienced many things before meeting you. Is it so far fetched to accept that she chose this fate out of her own free will? She even says that this fate of hers was her own choosing ...she wanted it to happen. Why should one take that away from her >
Melina says, “The one who walks alongside the flame shall one day meet the road of destined death.” I think this means she plans to become the next Gloam-eyed Queen. Something that Melina herself didn’t think possible when first following the path Marika set for her. She says “My purpose was given to me by my mother, but now I act of my own volition… this world is in dire need of repair, and death indiscriminate.” Meaning not only is burning the Erdtree what Marika wants, but it is also what the first Gloam-eyed Queen did in order to become an Empyrean and discovered the Rune of Death by doing so. Once we separate the rune from Maliketh, and Melina has burned away her flesh she finds the rune and claims destined death as the New Gloam-eyed Queen. The dead eye is something I haven’t fully come to understand, this is either because she is still a part of Marika and Radagon, and that part has since died, or it is a sign that Melina has ascended to the level of an Empyrean. Perhaps the first Gloam-eyed Queen had one dead eye and one gloamy one too.
she gave me her speach at the door to the flame of frenzy
i burnt her at the forge of the giants
i opend the door and became lord of chaos
Unrelated but I really hope if we fight Miquella he references himself as a the ‘Shield of Malenia’ and continues ‘and I have never seen true battle’ or something like his sister lol
Lmao
I feel like Melina is a manifestation created by Miquella, as an homage to malenia, to finish the job of replacing the Erdtree with the Haligtree.
But that's just conjecture.
I'm confused. I thought the rune of Death was removed so that the age of the Golden Order would begin. Isn't that why Marika is called the Eternal because she got rid of death from the lands between? Why is AgtJake asserting that the rune of death was removed after the Shattering?
You right.
It's a common mistake to think that, my friend thought the same thing and i had to go over a couple item discriptions to get him to believe me. And to be fair it is hard to imagine someone 'taking' death out of the ring, when theres a shattering it would make sense if thats whem it happened so i understand the confusion.
Unfortunately i dont think ive found a single lore video that doesn't get something completely wrong and some how soirals out of control by coming to a conclusion that was based on incorrect information. But I still watch them to see if i missed anything cause i want to know what happened and its a community after all, cant do it all on my own 😫 but it would be nice if lore/theory videos tried to be accurate for once, but truth doesnt make money content does 🧐
This is a very clear thing the game tells you and somehow people still get it very wrong
Give that doggo one more tummy rub from me =D
Marika was driven to the brink by Godwin, her most beloved son, being killed by the black knives
I'm watching this after the DLC and some things still make sense, but others don't. We are now pretty sure that Melina is Miquella's younger sister, which denies the theory that she was born from Ranni's actions, but it doesn't deny the fact that she may be the vessel of Destined Death in the same way that all of Marika's children have their own "curses." This makes me think that Marika and Maliketh fought with the Gloam-Eyed Queen for the title of God for the Greater Will. In the DLC trailer, we see Marika gathering something from what might be a dead body at the Divine Gate and becoming a God. It suggests that Melina was actually born at the foot of the Shadow Tree not the Erdtree, and possibly being a vessel or a reborn version of the Gloam-Eyed Queen, with the purpose of restoring Death to its "normal" state in the Lands Between.
why does vare know we are maidenless? my guess is that he killed her in the tower of anticipation to 'push' us towards his beloved blood god.. just like a sneaky thing he would do
"may chaos take the world"!!! 😂😭 bro I was keeping h alive despite the nagakiba lol but once I heard that he ruined everything
If Melina didn’t want me to be the lord of frenzied flame then why did she sound so cute when saying she was going to kill me? 🥰
This video, specifically at 5:32, just made me realize the 2 fingers and 3 fingers are literally identical in shape to the Elden Beast's hand. I'll have to go look at Ranni's 2 fingers, that one is strangely massive compared to the others.
Wow. Good eye.
@ProTheGrammer those aren't even fingers. More like talons or claws. Similar to some art in the bestial sanctum or deathrite birds.
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Wait... you can summon Melina?!
theory dump
ranni and melina is different person..ranni doll body take after his mentor/teacher look..ranni real body probably dont even look like the doll..ranni mentor hold rune of death got defeat by maliket..she probably gloom eye queen..and teach ranni how to kill her body and all that..so melina is the gloom eye queen or her daughter
If Melina is the Gloam eyed Queen, then it is she that Placidusax was waiting for. Destined death is red, as is the lightning of Ancient dragons
One thing that confuses me is how the player ends up in farum azula. Whether you burn Melina or not you just randomly wake up there without explanation. If Melina has some kind of connection to the rune of death then it could maybe explain why she would send you to it, but I don't know why she would do that after you take in the flame of frenzy. The other explanation is that Melina had nothing to do with it but then who could be responsible? It's kind of infuriating how ambiguous it is.
Or how our character is transported from the Chapel of anticipation to the stranded graveyard, who took us there?. Also, aren't we the travellers from across the fog? When did we crossed it? Even Demons Souls had a better explatation for how we got into Boletaria.
5:39 I've always tought her brand was a crow talon, and linked her to the Deathbirds and the Gloam Eyed Queen.
Also, why no one ever mention that there is ANOTHER ERDTREE in the land of the dead?
I think it is likely she killed our maiden. She does this to use us to get her to the ears tree. Her ability to help us grow stronger is a great offer that we would not accept if we had a maiden. She also has more of an ability to get to the starting area where our maiden was waiting with her ghost powers than other characters.
Ive been thinking about why our maiden is dead too. And yet we still get to be guided by grace?
But I don't think its melina since the intro cutscene makes it like she "stumbled" onto us and we were lucky.
This to me says she found us because we can be guided by grace. Torrent sees it right away but melina waits a bit as it takes a couple graces for her to visit you.
But who kills our maiden is probably related to marika's motives.
I say this because marika shatters the ring, by shattering it no one can become lord right away, the Lord Rune discription says that once the ring was shattered, the would-be lords lost their way.
Maybe that's why marika shattered the ring. To stop anyone from replacing Godwyn as lord. Maybe to stall until she finds someone that would have her motives inmind perhaps.
If(i stess if here but most likely is the case but im still having trouble with it) we go further with this line of thought and say that she was with the black knives as they are all numan. The numan coming from the eternal city who are nox. They worship the night, wnd are waiting fornits return. Coincidentally enough ranni's fate is to being back the night. We confirm this by not just her association with the moon but rennala pleads after we beat her that ranni bring back the night amd sella says that radahn holding the stars is keeping rannis fate from continuing.
This would mean that if marika is also part of this plot she is stalling till someone will come along and help ranni or at the very least defeat radahn (as well as radagon to become lord? Something just doesn't add up unless we go with split personalities here) melina is the key to letting her chosen tarnished inside the tree by burning it down as noone else could enter before and fix what she started.
The main issue with this thoery for me is that there is no guarantee you find ranni and do her quest, and if you do her quest ranni kills marika in her ending just feels odd (unless that needed to be done to completely severe the order from the lands between) but she does introduce herself to you saying she is doing so because she was entrusted to give you the bell cause of torrents former master. Like she sees you have grace, so that means you are being helped by marika(maybe) then she says learn the land well and alludes to not following the fingers for long, like she is trying to instigate that you find her where she is hiding away and second guess the fingers direction.
I think you shouldve mentioned that she is also the Kindling Maiden wich is stated in the description of the blade of calling wich is the weapon melina used against morgott and its stated that this weapon belonged to the Kindling Maiden alongside a Citation: "The one who walks alongside Flame shall one day meet the road of destined Death." This Citation is written in the description of blade of calling and this where also Melinas last words. So she is the Kindling Maiden and my theory is that she is Marikas daughter cause Melina tells us that her Mother gave her a purpose IN THE ERDTREE and this was prob. Part of Marikas perfect Plan to test the greater Will and so Marika wanted to see if another person could become Elden Lord.
Yeah she offered herself , she offered herself so hard that she set her ass on fire just to progress my quest. She is literally a Lord orbiter. I guess that is why I always go with the fecal feaster's or rannis ending
I also like how the dead maiden in the chapel of anticipation is most likely our original maiden since it implies so much potential story and lore. Her blood is still fresh enough to soak the cloth Varre gives us.
The only maiden who's death was recent enough and blood still wet is the one right next to us when we wake up at the start.
This is also probably why varre is openly critical of us because we do not appear to be a possible candidate at first, and only show promise after proving ourselves and meeting him in liurnia.
I can see a possible alternative route in this questline being Hyetta.
Since she wants to become a finger maiden, we could've helped her do that after encountering the 3 fingers in the sewers with her. In that moment we would embrace the 3 fingers, Melina would cast us aside and leave, Hyetta would be granted the powers of a finger maiden, and we would be branded with the flame of frenzy. However her career as a finger maiden would be cut short because we'd have to kill her and soak the cloth for Varre's questline.
This could also open the road for an extended branch of Varre's questline or Hyetta's questline depending on who you side with.
Either a Frenzy-tainted white mask item/item set if you side with Varre and use Hyetta's frenzy blood
or a true frenzy flame item/item set from the 3 fingers if you continue with Hyetta.
either way i wish we could get more extended storylines like we got with the jars in an early patch as some stories just seem to stop with not much development after a certain point.
Edit: after doing some research apparently you can use 2 other maiden's bloods to progress varre's quest
a dead maiden in liurnia where you fight frenzy vyke(probably his maiden who he just killed or saw get killed)
and if you kill irina or find her dead you can use hers(irina is most likely hyetta so maybe killing hyetta will also work but her body probably disappears like other npc's do after death)
Keep pushing for those subscribers dude! Your videos are great. Also your thumnails are wallpaper material lol
The biggest problem with Melina being the Gloam-Eyed Queen is the timeline. We all assume she is the third child of Marika and Radagon, and it seems she is indeed their child.
But what if she was the first?
Basically, my idea is that Melina was born in secrecy, before Godfrey was Elden Lord, and was raised by Marika as a "failsafe", an impartial judge that would deliver death to the gods should they stray from their path. To acomplish this, Marika plucked the rune of Death from the Elden Ring and gave it to Melina, who raised children of her own in the form of the Godskins and their black flame.
But Melina, now the Gloam-Eyed Queen, grew bold. Under her orders, the Godskins butchered and worn the gods, and so Marika unleashed the failsafe's failsafe, Maliketh, to put a stop to the Godskins, their queen and their flame, and seal away destined death.
And this, her shadow achieved. Melina was, at some point, left burnt and bodyless, stripped of her power and her Godslayer Greatsword, and most likely imprisoned in some way. But Marika is not above forgiveness, especially to her children. And so, before sealing herself and Radagon within the Erdtree to shatter the Ring, Marika gave Melina a purpose, a calling, and a Blade.
To serve as kindling for the flame of ruin, to help burn the Erdtree and, once again, to act as a final failsafe, should the Chosen Tarnished embrace the Three Fingers. And to this end, one of her eyes was closed shut, and in that darkness, her eye would become gloam once more.
I know the timeline still isn't perfect, but we're here to discuss as a collective anyway, so if you have something of your own to add, go ahead! (That goes for you too, Jake.)
5:27 looks like the 3 and 2 fingers combined
The “laugh in his face” part was a cool little addition Hahahaha
Even if she appears so sporadically, Melina is such a magnificent character,
she is the chosen Tarnished biggest aid in dire need,
she guides the chosen Tarnished through the Lands between,
and i loved listening to her beautiful soothing Voice at a safehaven that is a side of Grace,
seeing her engulfed by the flames of the Giants on the Edge of the Forge on the Mountaintop,
it hurt my soul to lose her to be honest,
no perfect Order, no frenzied Chaos,
no reemerging death, eternal night or cursed kin,
in hope of seeing her again, i chose the neutral ending,
but she was gone, faded away as ash in the wind,
the Erdtree ablaze and my Tarnished sitting on the Throne,
ascended to be the Eldenlord, the new Ruler of the Lands between in the upcoming Age of Fracture,
but maidenless in the end...
Step 1: obtain maiden step 2: journey with maiden and chat and have fun step 3: burn maiden and cry step 4: seek new comfort maiden
She'll show up again for boc on his quest line
All praise our cyclopian bride
I thought the shattering happened after the The Rune of Death was already taken from Melina since Maliketh was robbed of the Rune of Death on the Night of Black Knives which took place after he had already defeated The Gloam Eyed Queen and before the shattering
Hey there, it's a real Melina
Based on the item description of the blade of calling Melina is likely the fire maiden, who’s entire purpose was for told in an omen/vision to guide the tarnished burn the erd tree and help restore order to the lands between. This is supported by the fact that she literally says the same thing that’s written below the item description when she dies..
I think Melina is either a child of Marika or an extension of her will
My comment on your Placidusax video makes even MORE sense now. I love your lore hunting.
It was accidental, but thanks to you showing the Elden beast’s FIVE fingers shaped exactly like the two fingers and the three fingers, the theory I proposed is summed up below:
1. Placidusax was Eldenlord in the prior order of the Greater Will, had five heads, and the Lands Between operated much like our real world.
2. This led to too much chaos and free will (I.e war, petty fighting, hate, discrimination, etc.), so….
3. Greater Will severed Placidusax’s three heads and the five finger envoys three fingers, separated them and locked away chaos in the form of the three fingers.
4. Placidusax fell out of grace and Marika was chosen as the consort for a new order, the Golden Order, where chaos was taken away.
5. This led to Farum Azula and the dragon rebellion. Gransax died but destroyed Lyndell. Placidusax sealed himself in time awaiting their opportunity to be given the grace they deserve again from the Greater Will (similar to Godfrey coming back to claim what was taken from him). Fortissax fought Godwyn but lost, however the two gained respect after the battles and became friends.
And this would eventually lead to Marika ruling peacefully for a while until she becomes disillusioned with the Golden Order and the Shattering ensued.
Finally, on the other video I mentioned two other interesting things:
Two fingers = Peace ✌️
Three fingers = 3 = odd number only divisible by itself and another odd number, 1. Also close to pi, 3.14 the craziest fucking number.
Maybe there are 0.14 fingers we are missing? Zoom in Jake!!! Zoooooommmmmmmm
I know it's pretty late but if you combine the 2 & 3 fingers it resembles the hand of the elden beast.
I swear I got the spectral steed whistle from Ranni