Going to be bad to the bone for what they are. I've been thinking after I finish my gt40p heads I'm going to start on my e7s that I'm taking off.... for the experience! Nice video Charles
👍👍👍👍👍 excellent video Charlie. Fortunately I don't think that we ever saw that upper manifold here in Australia. The lower however is familiar up to 2000. From 2000 to 2002 we got the better staggered runner lower manifold with the larger ports. Bigdogs Porting showed some stuff on one and it appears that he was getting pretty good numbers out of the modified standard manifolds. Might be worth your mate considering chasing up one of those manifold combinations. Regards Greg
That manifold is a cast version resembling the tubular GT40. It has the round port staggered runners and fits the lower of the tubular... but has that intake sweep which is suppose to be better flow than the sharper 90* turn into the other. It also gives more shock tower clearance. The 93-4 cars have a shorter height upper for hood clearance. The Explorer is tall and uses a sharp turn elbow into the intake, with the TB on the front of it. Check Explorer pictures. JMO but BigDogs makes excellent manifolds per $.
That intake is a 93-95 TBird and 94-5 Mustang. Lowers are suppose to be the same as all the HOs. Rumors are that the Explorer manifold with the staggered port lower flows about 40 better.
The truck lower intake with a sheet metal upper would probably flow twice what the original 5.0 intake would..the motor is basically sucking air through a straw on the original. On another note my dads 5.0 had over 500000 miles on it and it had less than .002 ring wear, I honed it and new file fit moly rings and bearings,ported the heads with 3 angle valves and put it in my Ranger ,looking for another quarter of a million miles out of it or more and its at least 325hp or better now with 530 lift 220duration at 50
I really like seeing stock casting outdoing themselves 🤘🏻 and I’m one of those who turn their nose at stock windsor heads hehe 😜 Can you shape that flat spot behind the exhaust valve like David.v does to see the difference?? Opposite side to plug Love to see some Cleveland stuff on this channel
I've got a set of e7 heads that were on a crate engine and only ran once for testing never installed in a vehicle they are stock but I'd love to port them out rather then run gt40 heads or aftermarket heads it's gonna be in a street truck I've got headers and a procomp ignition system for it and I'm going to build it with better pistons rollers and possibly low rpm torque focused cam and Alil bigger injectors and I'll have to port the rest of the intake system obviously and tune the ecm I might get a 70mm throttle body to put on aswell I'll just have to do some testing and see how much it makes I don't wanna make to much power it's gonna have a stock aod and an 8.8 rear end with an Eaton locker I'll eventually build the transmission to hold up better but for now I'm not trying to make more then 300hp
A set of TFS Twisted wedge heads out of the box is what I would like to see how Flow Data between them and the E7 HEADS that You are working on . Great content Thank You. 🇺🇲🇵🇷🦊👍
@@servediocylinderheads why because they make too much power? I had a set of ported E7s with 1.94x1.6 that was a blast to drive then swapped them out for TW and wow! Gains everywhere and wish I didn’t waste my time with E7TEs, unless bracket racing if you want to make power you need to toss them in favor of good flowing aftermarket aluminum head.
@@servediocylinderheads weird i had no valve train issues with them first on my 306ci then 331ci motor, no ptv clearance either with pistons not for TW heads and healthy cams
My dad had a 90 or 91 i think it was f150 extended cab long bed with the 5.0 and a 4 speed auto i think...and i thought back then it seemed pretty lively when you got on it. It would have smoked from his prior 89 regular cab long bed f150 with a 300-6 3 spreed auto it was pathetically slow.
🔔😎 Cam lift. JMO Run all you possibly can. If the head flow flattens out at say .500 then run .600 lift. Consider how long of the duration the head is flowing it's maximum. Not just 2 degrees, but maybe 20. Also let's not forget that proper scavenging can make at head pull way more than the tested 28 inches.... Proper scavenging has sucked at more than twice that. JMO 😎
Have you ever gotten your hands or grinder on earlier heads? There were many different chambers and of course ports depending on core shift. I’m running a set that I ported using very crude shop vac port testing. Installed 351W valves which had polished backsides and polished chambers. Runs really well. I would be curious how I did in comparison. All this work was done back in 1987 to my 66 mustang running a 1976 302 that I rebuilt.
Don, I do not posses the same skill as Charlie, but have worked a 69 302 head with a shop vac bench and had them tested. They were 164 at .3 and 180 at .6. They sat around awhile, and I did some more work on them to get them better on the home made bench, and would guess they are upper 180s now. I think a better valve job or bigger valves might be the next step....but would love to get them on a motor at some point.
I'm probably not telling you anything that you don't already know but there were 3 different castings of the same lower intake manifold. Some were pretty thin and some had a lot more meat you could remove to straighten the really bad ports. I can't remember exactly how to tell them apart. One was cast by Alcan that was pretty good if I remember correctly. I think the info can be found by searching T-Moss porting. If nothing else this comment was good for another post count. Andrew
I read a very in-depth write-up of the three different lower intake castings with casting #’s and all. All I can remember was that the Alcan cast lowers were more consistent, thicker and marginally better for serious porting. I’d probably get an Explorer intake long before I spend a bunch of time hunting for the perfect HO lower…. but to each their own.
The desirable lower intake has noticeably more material on the outside of the runners. The other lower intakes you have to add material by welding the outside of the runners. The desirable lower has enough extra that no welding is needed.
I have tfs twisted wedge 170cc heads on my mustang I believe they advertise 250ish cfm flow. Have you ever ported a set? If so how much more can they flow?
Hey Charles we did the 50 degree seat and saw no difference but that's on a time slip not a flow bench my theory is the bowls are to shallow in the e7 but that's just a hunch i have no proof
Glad to get your input. That will be tested! Remember the steeper seat flows less at low lifts but not nessesarily more at high lift so. What it does is reduce overlap flow. It mellows a big cam. So, go a step up in cam!
So I was going through all my millenium falcon worthy smog pump air injection pipes etc etc.. I planned to just run my EGR and original equipment but realized a couple of things.. Do you think now that my bumps are shaved down it could throw any insufficient air for EGR? Or is it kind of assumed if someone carves up E7s they are just going to delete all smog stuff. I wanted to still run cats (at least high flow ) and I read somewhere that without the smog pump or any of that stuff cats could clog ( esp given its flat tappet and needs zinc ) Guess I should have thought of that but I wasnt sure how much it needed that hump to catch exhaust into the thermactor / egr system
I am on a budget i found a set for 50 bucks i am porting them to much gt40p heads . Doing for a project new to working in Automotive using a harbor frieght drimmal using the same carbed intake how do you like it it
Yeah I was wondering about stock valve numbers it seems rare to see. I did see one guy run a 203 cfm but lost some lower lift values. He was an amateur but all of his cut decisions are logged.. I think DIYporting E7 is what to search if youre curious... I learned this from DV ( of course on a different head ) but He says removing the pinch only like 50% biased toward the roof side of the major pushrod bulge. That makes sense because I've also heard the short turn radius opened up is where majority of air flow gains come. If you open that bulge toward the roof it creates a nice straight shot . I only have valve lapping ability so i cant do fancy valve jobs so I'm wondering if that move in the port alone could push it toward 200 cfm? I know you told me it wouldnt hurt to flatten that bulge out but wasnt sure if youve ever tested that specifically.. although im still raking the channel lol
@@servediocylinderheads well yeah, i was just curious as where the 1.780 have gone.. as far as stock GT40 flows or exceeding them a little. I know your intent was larger valves anyway so i wasnt comparing was just curious if that pinch gets it to that point mostly
@@servediocylinderheads Gotcha, so youre saying the 50% bias is not advantageous .. have you and DV ever gotten into heated debates? that would be a fun broadcast ha
I got an f350 with the 5.8 I'm looking to stroke to 408. Curious if ported e7s are up to the task or if I should be looking for something different. How about intakes? I want to stay efi
I would mod the E7's and the stock fuel injection manifold. I did a Speedtalk thread about 9 years ago, Build a lightning Bronco? Where I bought a junk lightning 5.8l and rebuilt it for Big Mike's Bronco. Detailed thread, Not a super high hp design. It has an overdrive tranny, 5.38 gears and 40" tires. So it was a torque/streetable build. He says it runs fantastic and pulls the big tires with ease.
@@servediocylinderheadsanything to consider or keep in mind working these heads for a truck application? The intake ports actually don't look too bad, the exhaust ports are just tiny! How about on the actual intake? What are the best bang for your buck areas to hit?
Hi Charlie. Thank you so much for doing the E7's step by step. I hope to learn lots of new stuff. Waiting for the next video. Andrew
I am watching this with much anticipation! Hope you get a week of cooler weather to mine all the great moves with flow testing. Thank-you!!!!
Hot here already..ugh
I was just interested in getting the flow data comparison between the two .Thank You for sharing the information
🇺🇸🇵🇷👍
I really apreciate your methodical , diciplined hard work.
Thanks!
Going to be bad to the bone for what they are. I've been thinking after I finish my gt40p heads I'm going to start on my e7s that I'm taking off.... for the experience! Nice video Charles
Nice stuff!
Awesome vid, 👍💪
School is in session.
I've seen some decent gains from the efi 5.0 intake after exstrude porting with the paste and abressive material pushed throw it
Expensive. But it is a cool process.
BigDogs Porting fuelie intakes etc is amazing.
Controversial ...
But the name of the game is RESULTS👍👍
Awesome results.
He cuts those manifolds apart as well. Problem is you still can't get to the 90.
👍👍👍👍👍 excellent video Charlie. Fortunately I don't think that we ever saw that upper manifold here in Australia. The lower however is familiar up to 2000. From 2000 to 2002 we got the better staggered runner lower manifold with the larger ports. Bigdogs Porting showed some stuff on one and it appears that he was getting pretty good numbers out of the modified standard manifolds. Might be worth your mate considering chasing up one of those manifold combinations. Regards Greg
That manifold is a cast version resembling the tubular GT40. It has the round port staggered runners and fits the lower of the tubular... but has that intake sweep which is suppose to be better flow than the sharper 90* turn into the other. It also gives more shock tower clearance.
The 93-4 cars have a shorter height upper for hood clearance.
The Explorer is tall and uses a sharp turn elbow into the intake, with the TB on the front of it.
Check Explorer pictures.
JMO but BigDogs makes excellent manifolds per $.
These heads will be mated to a fully worked single plane or tunnel ram. The 95 gt manifold has no chance of feeding it.
@@servediocylinderheads i can't wait to see the numbers that you get
That intake is a 93-95 TBird and 94-5 Mustang. Lowers are suppose to be the same as all the HOs.
Rumors are that the Explorer manifold with the staggered port lower flows about 40 better.
The truck lower intake with a sheet metal upper would probably flow twice what the original 5.0 intake would..the motor is basically sucking air through a straw on the original. On another note my dads 5.0 had over 500000 miles on it and it had less than .002 ring wear, I honed it and new file fit moly rings and bearings,ported the heads with 3 angle valves and put it in my Ranger ,looking for another quarter of a million miles out of it or more and its at least 325hp or better now with 530 lift 220duration at 50
I believe it. The good fuel injection does not wash the cylinders down like the carb engines I grew up on so the cylinders stay in great shape.
I really like seeing stock casting outdoing themselves 🤘🏻 and I’m one of those who turn their nose at stock windsor heads hehe 😜
Can you shape that flat spot behind the exhaust valve like David.v does to see the difference?? Opposite side to plug
Love to see some Cleveland stuff on this channel
I am not sure that mod makes much of a difference on the bench. D.V. has done the dyno testing on it.
You're just up the road from me , I live in PSL ...
My Mom has a house there. You are about an hour and fifteen minutes away. Thanks
I've got a set of e7 heads that were on a crate engine and only ran once for testing never installed in a vehicle they are stock but I'd love to port them out rather then run gt40 heads or aftermarket heads it's gonna be in a street truck I've got headers and a procomp ignition system for it and I'm going to build it with better pistons rollers and possibly low rpm torque focused cam and Alil bigger injectors and I'll have to port the rest of the intake system obviously and tune the ecm I might get a 70mm throttle body to put on aswell I'll just have to do some testing and see how much it makes I don't wanna make to much power it's gonna have a stock aod and an 8.8 rear end with an Eaton locker I'll eventually build the transmission to hold up better but for now I'm not trying to make more then 300hp
300 is easy.
A set of TFS Twisted wedge heads out of the box is what I would like to see how Flow Data between them and the E7 HEADS that You are working on . Great content Thank You. 🇺🇲🇵🇷🦊👍
Not from me. Not a fan of twisted wedge.
@@servediocylinderheads why because they make too much power? I had a set of ported E7s with 1.94x1.6 that was a blast to drive then swapped them out for TW and wow! Gains everywhere and wish I didn’t waste my time with E7TEs, unless bracket racing if you want to make power you need to toss them in favor of good flowing aftermarket aluminum head.
@@msk3905 I am not a fan due to valve train geometry.
@@servediocylinderheads weird i had no valve train issues with them first on my 306ci then 331ci motor, no ptv clearance either with pistons not for TW heads and healthy cams
My dad had a 90 or 91 i think it was f150 extended cab long bed with the 5.0 and a 4 speed auto i think...and i thought back then it seemed pretty lively when you got on it. It would have smoked from his prior 89 regular cab long bed f150 with a 300-6 3 spreed auto it was pathetically slow.
@@95Sn95 No doubt! Thanks
🔔😎
Cam lift. JMO
Run all you possibly can.
If the head flow flattens out at say .500 then run .600 lift.
Consider how long of the duration the head is flowing it's maximum.
Not just 2 degrees, but maybe 20.
Also let's not forget that proper scavenging can make at head pull way more than the tested 28 inches.... Proper scavenging has sucked at more than twice that.
JMO 😎
You are right. That is what will really help the 50 degree seats...a bigger cam.
Scavenging depression: THAT is the reason many of us say, "We are NOT racing flow benches."
Have you ever gotten your hands or grinder on earlier heads? There were many different chambers and of course ports depending on core shift. I’m running a set that I ported using very crude shop vac port testing. Installed 351W valves which had polished backsides and polished chambers. Runs really well. I would be curious how I did in comparison. All this work was done back in 1987 to my 66 mustang running a 1976 302 that I rebuilt.
Don, I do not posses the same skill as Charlie, but have worked a 69 302 head with a shop vac bench and had them tested. They were 164 at .3 and 180 at .6. They sat around awhile, and I did some more work on them to get them better on the home made bench, and would guess they are upper 180s now. I think a better valve job or bigger valves might be the next step....but would love to get them on a motor at some point.
Did two sets of 289 heads for D.V. I have not seen the dyno results yet. 244cfm.
I'm probably not telling you anything that you don't already know but there were 3 different castings of the same lower intake manifold. Some were pretty thin and some had a lot more meat you could remove to straighten the really bad ports. I can't remember exactly how to tell them apart. One was cast by Alcan that was pretty good if I remember correctly. I think the info can be found by searching T-Moss porting. If nothing else this comment was good for another post count. Andrew
T moss doesn't have a website that I can find. He used to have alot of good info on there.
I didn't know there were different castings.
I read a very in-depth write-up of the three different lower intake castings with casting #’s and all. All I can remember was that the Alcan cast lowers were more consistent, thicker and marginally better for serious porting. I’d probably get an Explorer intake long before I spend a bunch of time hunting for the perfect HO lower…. but to each their own.
The desirable lower intake has noticeably more material on the outside of the runners. The other lower intakes you have to add material by welding the outside of the runners. The desirable lower has enough extra that no welding is needed.
I have tfs twisted wedge 170cc heads on my mustang I believe they advertise 250ish cfm flow. Have you ever ported a set? If so how much more can they flow?
Never did a set.
Hey Charles we did the 50 degree seat and saw no difference but that's on a time slip not a flow bench my theory is the bowls are to shallow in the e7 but that's just a hunch i have no proof
Glad to get your input. That will be tested! Remember the steeper seat flows less at low lifts but not nessesarily more at high lift so. What it does is reduce overlap flow. It mellows a big cam. So, go a step up in cam!
@@servediocylinderheads You mean the flatter 50 seat reduces overlap flow?
@@hotrodray6802 Yes, so you can jam in a snottier cam.
If he is doing EFI why not to the sploder intake? They litter the planet. Or get the truck lower and edelbrock upper?
@@JH-oh1in It is his choice. Thanks
So I was going through all my millenium falcon worthy smog pump air injection pipes etc etc.. I planned to just run my EGR and original equipment but realized a couple of things.. Do you think now that my bumps are shaved down it could throw any insufficient air for EGR? Or is it kind of assumed if someone carves up E7s they are just going to delete all smog stuff. I wanted to still run cats (at least high flow ) and I read somewhere that without the smog pump or any of that stuff cats could clog ( esp given its flat tappet and needs zinc ) Guess I should have thought of that but I wasnt sure how much it needed that hump to catch exhaust into the thermactor / egr system
Full emissions should be fine with ground exhausts.
@@servediocylinderheads oh okay cool. trying to avoid copd lol
I am on a budget i found a set for 50 bucks i am porting them to much gt40p heads . Doing for a project new to working in Automotive using a harbor frieght drimmal using the same carbed intake how do you like it it
They run quite well after some work.
Yeah I was wondering about stock valve numbers it seems rare to see. I did see one guy run a 203 cfm but lost some lower lift values. He was an amateur but all of his cut decisions are logged.. I think DIYporting E7 is what to search if youre curious... I learned this from DV ( of course on a different head ) but He says removing the pinch only like 50% biased toward the roof side of the major pushrod bulge. That makes sense because I've also heard the short turn radius opened up is where majority of air flow gains come. If you open that bulge toward the roof it creates a nice straight shot . I only have valve lapping ability so i cant do fancy valve jobs so I'm wondering if that move in the port alone could push it toward 200 cfm? I know you told me it wouldnt hurt to flatten that bulge out but wasnt sure if youve ever tested that specifically.. although im still raking the channel lol
I have seen DIY. 203 cfm is nothing great.
@@servediocylinderheads well yeah, i was just curious as where the 1.780 have gone.. as far as stock GT40 flows or exceeding them a little. I know your intent was larger valves anyway so i wasnt comparing was just curious if that pinch gets it to that point mostly
@@tonypepperoni229 The more flow you get through the port the more important the pinch becomes. I do not see an advantage to a super fast pinch.
@@servediocylinderheads Gotcha, so youre saying the 50% bias is not advantageous .. have you and DV ever gotten into heated debates? that would be a fun broadcast ha
@@tonypepperoni229 We have. Not for broadcast. Always good discussions.
I got an f350 with the 5.8 I'm looking to stroke to 408. Curious if ported e7s are up to the task or if I should be looking for something different. How about intakes? I want to stay efi
I would mod the E7's and the stock fuel injection manifold. I did a Speedtalk thread about 9 years ago, Build a lightning Bronco? Where I bought a junk lightning 5.8l and rebuilt it for Big Mike's Bronco. Detailed thread, Not a super high hp design. It has an overdrive tranny, 5.38 gears and 40" tires. So it was a torque/streetable build. He says it runs fantastic and pulls the big tires with ease.
@@servediocylinderheadsanything to consider or keep in mind working these heads for a truck application? The intake ports actually don't look too bad, the exhaust ports are just tiny! How about on the actual intake? What are the best bang for your buck areas to hit?
*note I have DV's porting book but lost it. I have a fresh copy on order😅
@@JakeMakesProductions The exhaust port is actually the right size. Shaped correctly flows 185 cfm!
@JakeMakesProductions The whole intake could use work. Do not hog out. Give extra radius on turns. Done.
Not Everyone has afr money
That is why I started porting heads!