My Mom Discloses Secret Mormon Temple Rituals
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- Опубликовано: 16 июн 2024
- The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (LDS or Mormon Church), has long been known for their secret temple rituals that only the worthy saints can participate in. Shelise grew up in this mainstream Mormon Church, learning that going to the temple was the ultimate goal, that if she could only be worthy enough, she might even get to see Jesus himself walking the halls. The picture that is painted to it’s members (because NOTHING is disclosed ahead of time) is vastly different than what actually happens when you finally get to go. Shelise’s mom Lisa, describes the ultra secret temple rituals that happen inside the tall, castle-like walls.
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Chapter Markers
00:00:00 Intro
00:02:44 Quick explanation of the Mormon temple
00:05:49 The LDS church didn't approve of Lisa's partner choice
00:09:45 How Lisa felt being denied a temple marriage
00:11:15 Worthiness requirements to go to the temple
00:12:06 A flip flopping bishop on Lisa's worthiness
00:18:09 You're given a new name
00:19:58 What actually goes on in the temple?
00:23:34 Signs, symbols and tokens
00:25:19 What happened when Lisa's friend forgot the new name
00:28:22 Role playing getting let into heaven through the veil with code
00:33:00 Doing work for the dead
00:34:44 Shelise talks about doing baptisms for the dead
00:38:31 Shelise's awkward first kiss story
00:40:00 They say Jesus literally walks the halls
00:42:24 Lisa wouldn't have gone if she knew what went on in there
00:49:09 TOP SECRET Mormon ritual- The Second Anointing
00:51:44 Naked poncho touching/anointing
00:56:11 Shelise learns something shocking about Lisa's intent!
01:00:36 Linda, Listen
Theme Song Produced and Composed by Christian Guevara
*Disclaimer: Thanks for joining us at Cults to Consciousness. This storytelling podcast is meant to be for entertainment purposes only and does not substitute for medical advice. We may discuss triggering topics and we ask that you make your personal mental health a priority. Lastly, the opinions of our guests do not necessarily reflect the opinions of the host.*
Having your mom be open to healthy change, ready to communicate with you, and reflective like this is such a huge blessing as a new mother. My mom is part of the village working to make my children’s world a better place. It’s so good to see other families working to break generational and religious cycles together too!
Finally someone addressed what I wanted to know...how did people believe in this and I get it now or better for sure!! you guys are amazing!!
tysm for sharing your stories!! I am absolutely fascinated!!
@@butterfliii73So much for countless American soldiers shedding their blood to protect religious freedom to worship without public ridicule that hurts millions of LDS families and their freedom to worship in a free country without enduring public persecution. Especially the desecration of a sacred temple by open mockery online. Destroying in the name of getting publicity by a one sided opinion. Shame on them.
@@butterfliii73I’ve been asking to be in this podcast for months now and they just ignore me
Good for you and you are lucky to have that
Just a religious attack on millions of good Americans to get publicity and vent your own prejudice by casting the LDS in the worst light possible. The same thing they do to all Trump supporters by January 6th which is a big lie.
That precious dog with his head on the desk just warms my heart.
Me too. Dogs are the best! I lost my 14 year old chihuahua Luka 2 months ago. I'm so heartbroken and miss her so much. She was the sweetest little thing in the world!
The love with our animals is so precious!
@@KidRocker44 I'm sorry for your loss. We lost our little Boston/Pug mix that we got from a rescue. It was 4 years ago and it still hurts. I still can't get another dog.
@jillcarter5221 Thank you. Sorry for your loss too. I know what you mean. I don't think I'll get another dog for a long long time.
@@KidRocker44I'm so sorry. No matter then animal, it is a bad loss. I lost my snake. She was gentle and gorgeous, got severe arthritis so didn't eat. She was put to sleep due to pain. Wish they'd do that to me. Hahaha. But I miss her so much. Our pets are our family. If not more so if you are in your own. ❤
it is refreshing to see family members coming together outside of a religion instead of being torn apart by it.
The Church never wants or expects families to be torn apart.
@@lorielizabethwade7505 by their fruits ye shall know them. The church's fruits and doctrines absolutely separate families, my own, and so many others that I have seen. I have hardly seen a LDS family that hasn't been torn apart by this religion.
Amen!❤🎉
@@slvrsrfr92 Yes and Amen! I'm learning all of this because a dear friend... has broken relationships with her siblings who are current Mormons along with many of their children.😥
I converted from a Protestant to the Church in 1980 when I was 19 yrs old. 44 yrs I've gone to Church in multiple places I've lived. I've known lots of friends, families and taught the Young Women, Relief Society and in the Primary. I've known a few couples that got divorced, including me after a Temple marriage. After 4 decades, I tell you no one is torn by the Church. It is the opposite of that. I was loved after 1 time of disfellowship AND in my 30s, an excommunication. I was baptized after 2 yrs of soul-searching, prayer and Scripture study. I knew and know plenty of Church families all of them unique. Not one person goes without their family's love and support, unless the family member is a danger or causing other serious harm. The families lI know struggled but thru faith accept and love their gay children. We love our families so much because family is a sacred bond and "Families are forever". I'm so sorry you've experienced something(s), but members are ppl too. Maybe you've been around those who were not faithful and didn't practice their faith. Yes, it's true about a Church; ye shall know them by their fruits. Go to church and experience the faithful, kind Saints. Speak with a Bishop or Branch Pres with your stories, concerns or questions. Say a little prayer before you go, ok? ❤
My home temple was the Seattle Temple. Once you walked back to change clothes, the first thing you saw was cash registers and the first thing I did back then was pay money to rent temple clothes! It always bothered me because I remembered how Jesus had been appalled by the money changers in the temple of his day. Cash registers in the temple?! It just felt so wrong.
It WAS wrong!
Thanks again for the conversation. It’s helping me to process this stuff. 💜
Such a great point!! He flipped the table
In the Supreme Court’s Hernandez vs IRS Commissioner (1989), Justice Thurgood Marshall wrote: “Traditionally, the IRS had distinguished between gifts that were made without expectation of reward and quid pro quo exchanges in which donors received something in exchange.” Clearly being forced to rent clothing in order to participate is not a donation, there is a quid pro standard involved. I would go further and apply that to tithing because it is required to gain entrance to the Temple AND to the Celestial Kingdom. Oddly, the decision made donations NOT tax deductible for Scientology services and the IRS does not enforce this ruling which has the weight of law.
I wonder what they'd do if you said you didn't have any money. Jesus surely wouldn't send you tohell because you couldn't pay for "proper" clothing for a ritual.
I remember being surprised at the cash registers too. I brought this up to my dad who was with me and he explained that the church didn’t make any money from these transactions, but rather it was just to cover the costs of material and labor. At the time I felt like that was a reasonable explanation. Now, having left the church and knowing the astonishing hordes of money the church has amassed, it really is irksome.
Absolutely. I'm formerly Christian and Jesus would've definitely flipped those tables and chased them out of the temple
Our son converted to LDS church in his senior year of high school though we insisted he wait 3 years and study more. He disobeyed. His Mormon girlfriend became his wife 2 years later. We were not allowed to see our son's wedding. We had asked her parents if they could have a civil ceremony we could be present for, me, his father and his two brothers. The bride 's parents refused. We had to wait in the rose garden outside the Temple. We have had to move on from that. But it was quite unkind towards us.
Even now almost 22 years later, I cannot laugh about it.
Thank you for sharing.
This is highly offensive! Temple Ceremonies aren’t SECRET! They are SACRED! I’m sorry you had an awful experience when you went to buy your garments. I had a few bad experiences in the temple years ago, which kept me away, but I love the temple. The fact that you are mocking the ceremony, is hurtful and wrong.
How is your son’s life and marriage?
@@Luluisraging.86the fact that you and your lot are mocking the sacred God of an entire religion is even more wrong and hurtful.
@@achanneledname I assure you the temple ceremony isnt satanic.
I support your right to dislike or criticize any faith but your suspicions are unfounded and unsupported by evidence or reality.
@@BlueSwampyCraft how is God being mocked?
Your mama is so sweet. I’m happy you’re both living your best lives.
Thank you so much!
My grandfather told me that people, especially people who convert, have a need for everyone else to believe the same because what if they didn’t choose right? He said that God is everywhere and to know truth one must look within one’s heart for God is always there.
exactly! I listen to hundreds of NDEs we are souls zipped up into a flesh suit, experiencing contrasts. we come from pur light and Love. Our goals are to learn to choose Love over Fear.
I often thought there is a group of people that have a need to feel superior to the rest of the world. They believe they will go to heaven but the rest of us will not be welcomed in heaven.
@@linminnesota2036 they’re so wrong. Granted a certain dictator might still be writing lines in the corner…
What is an NDE?
@@jodiwitt-bailey1791 near death experience
It always creeped me out that my dad and others did temple work for the dead. How arrogant to assume those souls want to be bound to this church.
It is very creepy. Talk about spiritual overstepping! Leave dead people alone. They worshiped as they chose in their life.
Yeah- for SO MANY reasons. They did HITLER'S Temple work! WUT?
good thing it's just all pretend.
It seems to be a control mechanism. Tithing keeps it going on
I attended some social events as a non member with a friend as a teenager and I remember them talking about all the baptisms for the dead and what a great job they had done on such an such a day and said the number (it was a lot) and it felt so wrong to me.
My daughter's friend is Mormon. It breaks my heart, because she is incredibly bright & just a joy to be around. But she has been so used by this church. She's 27 now, not married, & they keep her so busy... all for them. She hides it well, but i can see how much guilt & anxiety she is constantly in. I feel for her. Thank you for your videos. They're very informative. I just hope one day that my daughter's friend gets out & is able to live a life for herself.
Please bless your daughter and her friend every day 🙏 ... God's ways are incomprehensible and wonderful ... 😉
I hope so too!
She can actually say NO. There are people who are also learning their parts and they do not always realize they are overworking someone. In the leadership handbook, it essentially says to not do that, though some things are busy by nature. Like planning a camp. She can also ask for help as people are more than willing. She obviously wants to stay in the church. So instead of feeling sad for her,go tell her it's okay to say when it's too much (which can look different for everyone), and to say she needs her time, or wants to go out and do things, or whatever. Some people literally think they can't say no, but they truly can. I am honestly helping here. Tell her she needs a break, and it's okay. Nobody goes to hell for this. It takes a lot to earn a spot in hell. Tell her to say no if she needs personal time.❤
It's because everyone who talks badly about the church, is not truthful about what goes on in the Temple! I'm there every week as a Temple worker!
I have no idea why anyone would find God's love 💞 offensive for his son's and daughters ❣️ The Temple is a holy place dedicated to the Lord ❗ We make promises to the Lord through the covenants we choose to make!
The Temple is the only place I feel the spirit of God,after going there l feel God's peace 🕊️ in my life. Having gone to so many other churches, that felt so empty. I'm forever grateful I joined the church 37 years ago! It changed my life forever in a positive way. Our church does so much good in the world 🌍, we donate our time and talents to make the world a better place! We provide funds to humanitarian work,we keep other people's churches soup 🍲 kitchens open, we donate food to battered woman's shelters and the homeless all year long, we bring clean water to poor people in need. I have been apart of this world wide effort . If you love your daughters friend then trust her judgement in which church she has chosen to be apart of. Listen to the prophet and apostles on RUclips, go to the source of the church, not someone who wants views for their channel. You get what you put out in the church as with anything in life. My Dad just passed away Jan 6th 2024 and hearing the beautiful marriage/ sealing brings my heart such comfort knowing we are an eternal family! The word's are healing and have given me great comfort and peace 🕊️🙏🏻💜. Watch David Alexander on RUclips he's got a different perspective on the church and his views on the church are amazing 😍. If you want truth about the church go and walk the grounds of the Temple and feel the peace 🕊️ . The gospel brings hope and happiness to our world 🌎.
@@stardustgirl2904 I never came across anything unusual there. It's always weird when people "reveal secrets" when millions attend a temple somewhere at any given time. I was never told to keep it a secret. We are told that it is sacred. As you know,people being told something and understanding it can be two different things. I shared something spiritual with a well-meaning person. They didn't mean to trash on the experience, but their response did indeed demean it. It was like accidental gaslighting or making it seem less than it was. It was then that I realized that spiritual or sacred things are kept close to me for a reason. And not just the temple either. People simply may not understand and it will weird them out. I get it. I just keep thinking people are capable of going for understanding rather than judging. But people as a whole don't really change. They will judge before they understand. Anyway, the 'casting pearls before swine' is very real. People don't know they sometimes accidently play the part of the swine and put someone else down. So we try to keep things sacred. I understand your issue :-)
I find it funny though,I'd respect Hindu and Buddhist temples too, and they are not of my faith. I can't understand the lack of respect some people have.
You're mom is such a likeable woman. And I love that you speak openly and freely with each other. Very good conversation, thanks for sharing with us.
It’s so interesting that the Mormon church changes, their specifications and “beliefs” because Hebrews 13 eight says that Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and to the ages to come. God never changes.
The ideas that they believe that God villes revelations at different times. I mean, even the Bible has been changed around multiple times over the course of centuries. God isn’t even consistent within the older New Testament.
The core beliefs have not changed.
So please tell me any church or religion that has not changed something over the span of time.
@darkemberandviolet
Name specific examples of what you're saying
this is the reason many people have left the church about being lied to about Jospeh. That and always changing rules and wording of THEIR bibles. ANY church that has their own bible is a cult not a religion. Pathetic
Break the silence. Break the cycle.
Yes. Reclaim your free will
Your Mum is amazing. Would love to hear more detail about her leaving the Church, why and how x
ExMo here. I was 26, no mission, single I guess I was old 🤷🏼♀️ lol. I remember thinking the outfits were weird lol. I really liked this guy too, and he and I went together a few times. I left the church right after he married somebody else. I didn’t leave because of him, because it started to not align with what I truly believed. 20 years later, I’m still good friends with that guy, and his wife❤
I have no connection to the church, or anyone in it, but even so I absolutely love watching your videos and learning about it and your experience of it. That's a testament to your skill, intelligence, humor, and compassion! Great show! Your mother is GORGEOUS inside and out!
Same! I’m just hear learning more about the religion (honestly due to the Vallow/Daybell case).
I adore Lisa's hair! Thank you so much for sharing her story.
I love her hair as well she's so stunningly beautiful
She's beautiful. Also a beautiful person.
She was finally able to do what the heck she wants with her hair and clothes 🎉 Everything about that church is peculiar ,to say the least . Weird . This type of worship is not what Jesus taught . They will probably actually wonder in genuine puzzlement at Christ's Passion , why they are rejected and left behind .
I have only heard the opening clip and I am already identifying with Lisa’s experience. I joined the church at age nineteen and two years later I was in the Salt Lake Temple for the first time on my wedding day! Everything happened in one day, initiatory, endowment, sealing, far from home and with no family attending. I think I dissociated. It was all so very weird. It was 1976 and all the penalties were included.
Thanks for this discussion! 💜
That's the year I went through. By myself. I was in a total daze. The word "cult" kept popping into my head.
@@MikeMitchellishere , by yourself? That would be so hard! I can’t even imagine. We were 1200 miles from home, but we did have our bishop and his wife and one other ward member who travelled down with us, thank goodness.
I am glad that you survived! 😊
@@donnellallan I was in a daze for at least a week. It was almost like some sort of nightmare.
@@MikeMitchellishere , I hear that. We visited a couple more temples on our honeymoon until things finally felt a little less bizarre. Not that they were not still weird, but I got used to the weirdness. It’s interesting what our brains will do to help us survive, isn’t it?
I live here in Utah and these videos are eye opening having grown up LDS. I turn 56 Feb and I am STILL on the fence. I go to “church” in my own home as medically I am not able to attend. I feel “church is on your heart and what YOU choose to do. I may be wrong but this is my opinion…respectfully
One thing that stands out to me is that it's one thing to go through the temple as a young adult with your parents and other older adults you trust, but it's another to then later on lull your own children into these rituals. I went through because I trusted my parents, but eventually left the church for many reasons, but now realize if I'd stayed I would have been faced with encouraging my own kids to go through this stuff. I honestly don't think I would have been comfortable with that, especially without their full informed consent. I often wonder how do parents feel comfortable doing this to their kids and expect them to go along with it? If it were me I'd feel embarrassed and be constantly checking with my kid to see whether they were wierded out, and that's a huge red flag!
It takes a lot of awareness to feel that way, for sure!
I get what you're saying....I felt like unsure about raising children in LDS... Now, 30 years later, I'm glad I didn't have that guilt..see my earlier comment..
I mean, it’s kind of like anything. When you grow up with it in your culture, it’s normal. Part of what made me leave the church permanently was how many mothers were completely fine brainwashing their children into Mormonism. At this point, I don’t think kids should be Threatened or forced into any religion, and they should be able to choose for themselves without someone influencing them all the time. Even though my sister hasn’t been an active member in the church for decades, her kids are members because they spend a lot of time with my parents, And my parents made it normal for them I guess. Kind of makes me sad that the cycle of religious manipulation keeps going.
I was a member of the church for 13 years. I served a stake and a full time mission! then I left, and I learned to be truly happy. As your mom said in the interview, the most difficult thing I did was to removed my garments. I felt guilty, and even a little afraid of my decision. But I developed into an understanding, more sympathetic, happier human being that I was ever when inside the church.
Thanks for sharing ❤️❤️❤️
Under a minute in, your mother’s hair in the intro is phenomenal!! Seriously!
It’s given me ideas, and instant courage to finally go shorter. It’s classy, flattering, stylish, and unique looking. Just wow. (This is the first I’ve ever commented on someone’s hair on RUclips in my life).
Can’t wait for the interview!
Amazing!! You can do it too! 😁
I was thinking the same thing. I love her hair!
She's just ridiculous Beautiful all around!
Yes
Beautiful and attractive women you both are!! God bless❤
This was such a humble episode in my opinion. I have been following you for maybe a year and will go back to watch the first time your mom came on but I really enjoyed her perspective as well as watching your connection with one another. Blessings to your family and pregnancy -Jen
It’s so cool to see how supportive your Mom is of you and your work. Your Mom seems like such a cool person. ❤
There is such a terrible opioid issue in Mormon country because of these hypocrisies. Glad you made it out.
Sounds similar to the 1950s housewives these people like to claim was the best truest family. A lot of women doped up to make one of the worst mental health crises we've ever seen bearable. To be clear, you want to be a housewife and mother, I fully support it, many of these women didn't
I had no idea 💔
Family minded doesn't really apply when you're forcing teens back into abusive fundie cu
???where can i find more about that?
@@nickywalyes, the 1950’s housewives were prescribed speed to keep up with all that perfection that was expected of them. Speed.
Now the Mormons are slowed down with opioids. They’ve slowed us all down to accept the craziness they want from us.
I saw a tiktok that was showing how all modern religious rituals are just pagan rituals slightly altered. I hadn't realized but it's true!
That’s true, or things were just shifted around to make it seem like the pagans were observing or celebrating Christian traditions.
Find that interesting and it makes sense.
I was surprised when I found out too! And all of the holidays happen on days significant to the Pagan religion too!
Which Christian rituals are allegedly pagan in origin?
@vaska1999 The slaughter of animals for religious feasts, the tinkling of bells to ward off evil during holy rites, the custom of dancing in religious services-these and many other pagan practices persisted in the Christian church for hundreds of years after Constantine proclaimed Christianity the one official religion of Rome.
Although it is modern custom to relate lit trees, mistletoe, holly and caroling with Christmas, these, among other symbols, do not stem from Christianity. Most of these symbols have pagan roots and were borrowed by Christians, who later altered them to fit the new faith. In fact, most religious holidays can be tied back to paganism. Oh, I almost forgot anointing oils and incense. Those were pagan rituals tools long before Catholic tools.
I always love the videos where your mom is involved, it's clear where you got your awesomeness from. I was just yesterday telling a person in my life who just got back from job corps in Utah about some of the things I've learned from y'all about the Mormon church, and today you drop this video, wonderful coincidence.
Aww thank you! Love that coincidence! Yes, mama is awesome!
The jumpsuits were so see through, they did not let me wear a bra (this was for my first time at 12) AND I was so scared everyone watching would see my nipples and my dark pubic hair. Utterly humiliating. I was also so nervous I wasn't worthy (even though I was 12 and innocent) that I actually threw up in the temple parking lot before we went in.
Oh my goodness I experienced this too 😢
Ouch.
It is wrong on SO many levels! It makes me sad for all of you who experienced these awful things!
This is sexual child abuse you’re talking about. It’s perverted.! a very sex positive human being. Nobody should have to do 😢
I wore my underwear when we did baptisms for the dead
One of my last experiences in the temple was during an endowment session. I was giving all the signs and tokens at the veil to the old man on the other side. It was the first time I was saying the long paragraph for the first time, memorized all by myself, for the second token of the Melkizedek priesthood. Just as I was saying the last sentence, the old man passed out and grabbed onto me to keep from falling. The fabric for the veil ripped down the middle and then he let go and fell backwards and hit his head on the wall behind him. He just laid there grey, eyes and mouth wide open, unconscious. I felt so bad for him, but I was also so shocked.
Once things calmed down, the lady asked me if I finished the token, and I hadn’t. So she had me do it all over again with another man. I don’t know how I did it! Strangely this experience was the beginning of the end of my temple experiences.
Woah!! That must’ve been scary to witness.
I am so glad my relationship with God, my faith is not tied up with all these rituals. Churches have a way of screwing things up. That faith, etc. Is base on rules, doctrines, rituals. It's an individual relationship not based on fear and or I got to meet all these church rules.
We are on earth, with corruptible body. I am not deterred to disbelieve d Church because of dysfunction. I see how God prolongs my life because of my temple attendance. Many temple workers in the Philippines were in 80 0r 90 years of age, and yes some had died already. One sister, Dolly, was stage 4 cancer and told by doctor that her life will be up to two years only. She served and seen happy, accepting 2years will end. Yet we see, she stayed until 5 years. I too suffered complications of sickness and experience dying. ( I am sorry, I will not tell what sickness coz I want to be treated normally.) At my supposed deathbed, I can hear conversations but did not see of people telling me to help them be proxied. i conversed with them and promise I will, however I asked them who they were and showed to me. Somebody answered they were my ancestors I could not see yet coz I will still live. So, I survived five major surgeries and still live. I know d Church is true through the Holy Ghost. I am a witness of d Savior's work in our day. In Jesus Christ's name. Amen.
Watching this video brought me to tears!! To think that this Mom would have done anything to be able to be at her daughter’s wedding shows how much love there is between you both!! I had three, beautiful daughters myself and lost my eldest to cancer five years ago, which was the hardest thing I have ever had to go through!! I am 82 years old have enjoyed several of your Cults to Consciousness videos, particularly this one, as we were very friendly with a Mormon family years ago while living in South America, so this has cleared up some of the questions and mystique I have always had about this “ religion”. I am also a huge animal lover and was so enamored by the dog in your lap during the first half of the video!! My congratulations on becoming a new mom and stay as sweet as you are!! I think you are a beautiful lady, physically and in your heart!! Your videos are done with such respect, compassion and openness!! God Bless you and your Mom as you embark ion starting your own little family!! I hope your husband appreciates you and is aware of what an outstanding person his wife is!! I wish you all much happiness, good health, and most of all I wish you love!!
I think you would enjoy watching the My Not So Mormon Wedding episode. It's been a while since I watched it, but if I remember right, little Oscar the Weiner Dog is their best man or something like that. He's part of the wedding. It was an adorable video. I'm so sorry for the loss of your daughter.
Thank you for all your kind words! I’m sorry about your daughter. I can’t imagine how hard that must’ve been. I feel very lucky to have such an amazing mom and husband. ❤️
I'm sorry, but the admonition to "stay sweet" is in itself a culty warning! Mormons, even ex Mormons, are too sweet, in my opinion. Stay feisty! Stay rebellious! Stay curious! Question authority! Stay true to yourself! Let go of shame and guilt over leaving all this silly sexist crap behind.
This was a delightful interview watching the two of you! Loved Shelise's first kiss story! Lol! 😂 Embarrassing but so cute!
Lisa, you are a gem! I love your heart to always do the right thing. Hearing you share about walking down the temple hallway to see the painting of Christ was so moving to me. I can imagine feeling similarly. ❤ Have a very blessed time as you prepare to welcome your grand baby bear! 🐻 I know you and Shelise are super excited! 🥰
Glad you enjoyed it!🥰
Yay for mama and her bravery! I’m all here for it! Strong women like you raise strong children! Thank you Shelise for sharing the spotlight on a mother’s story! All perspectives are necessary!💜
I hadn't seen your interviews with your mom but I'm going back and listening because you're both so awesome to listen to. I raised my kids in a culty fundamentalist Christian church, not Mormon but the themes are similar. I'm doing what I can to help support my kids who have deconstructed. Listening to your conversation just makes me feel hopeful and good. Thank you.
Btw, I *love* your mom's hair! You're both so beautiful inside and out.
Thank you so much! Taking accountability and being a support to your kids is HUGE and an amazing step. Thanks for sharing ❤️
She came such a long way. I don't mean that to sound condescending: Questioning the life you were indoctrinated in is hard and shows true character strength, it's VERY HARD!
I love that you both have a good relationship. ❤ bless you both. And I hope your baby shower is/was great.
You guys are so effortlessly stunning!!! Beautiful souls always add to outward beauty, but you guys are top notch❤️ I hope baby is going easy on you, and I hope your baby shower was a time of peace and joy❤️
You’re so kind! Thank you! Ankles are enormous and heart burn maaay be the death of me, but we are so close! Lol
May you be blessed in your journey. My babies are nearly 34 and 30@@CultstoConsciousness
Your mom is so much fun! Definitely keep having her on!
Thank you! Will do!
Listening to you speak to each other with so much love and support 💗 makes my ❤ ache for my momma. She's passed 😢18 yrs ago. Thank you for sharing both your journey and family bond❤. Congratulations 🎊
Your mother is lovely! What a big heart. Full of wisdom too. This open dialogue was so very enlightening for all those reasons and more--have another like it again real soon!
At no time in the past, nor now or at anytime in the future is the consensual activity of a married couple in their bedroom any of a churches business. Why anyone would ever think it was is beyond me.
And that's why they call cults like this "high control."
Your mom's amazing! I wish everyone could have such a fun and supportive mother!
Thank you for what you do. Your videos have been a lot of help. Cult-like situations can also happen in family dynamics, and my husband was just cut off from his family because he decided to protect me from their emotional violence. Your videos have helped me to understand my husband's situation better and not feel guilt over not having contact with those people anymore.
Great episode, full of love and supportiveness and amazing detail.
On a side note, enjoy all Costa Rica has to offer! I have lived here for the last 2 years and it still enthralls me and surprises me everyday, with even everyday activities such as grocery shopping with mountains in the background.
The prurient interest of the elders in the married sex lives of the brethren is nuts!!! Not to mention everything else!😅
I was a Jehovah's Witness in the 70s and the leader at that time Mr. Knorr decided to band oral sex too. (Also a Mason) even though I was in my early 20s I thought that odd and non of their business. Plus being single and you can't fornicate, you're so afraid of sinning against God. Then you have to be worried sinning in marriage?
You know none of them follow those rules.
The founders of LDS were truly diabolically gifted. Good for you for "waking up" and running away and not looking back! Very interesting and insightful. Any religion that imposes heavy financial requirements topped up with heavy psychological requirements is a HUGE 🚩
I think it’s great that your mom is so open about what she went thru and that she was also open to questioning things in a way that helped you along the way as well. You two make a great podcast team! 😊
Every time I hear the temple stuff, it is just as freaky as the first time. It is totally spooky. Cult!
Who do you hear temple stuff from? Your opinion depends on who you listen to. Former disgruntled members or others who are hostile to the Church are not the only sources of information. Have you ever talked to someone with a positive view of the temple? Many people form opinions with too little information and have no desire to try to understand how the other side perceives things.
@@ttbo12 I listen to myself. I once had a positive view of the temple, that has changed.
So fascinating! I grew up near the LDS Temple in Hamilton, New Zealand, and knew quite a few LDS members. They were all wonderful, kind and loving people but I never felt that I *knew* them. I'm sure that was because of the secrecy that kept such important matters from outsiders (I certainly knew nothing of the Temple rituals!). You and your mother are delightful and have a lovely bond. I'm so happy for you that you can now live freely and with choice.
mama came out slaying the game! spilling secrets and setting the record straight. Come through mom!
My name is Linda so the “Linda listen” speaks directly to me !
Your mom is a rockstar ! I love your relationship and that the both of you had a journey through this type of experience of leaving something that had such a stronghold on both of you. Your channel is so important! Thank you for your dedication 🤍
SO GLAD TO SEE YOU ON AGAIN *MAMA LISA!!* 🖤🖤
I find myself rewatching the interviews between you two sometimes because the vibes are just immaculate ✨
But seriously, the brightness between you two gives me SO much hope that others will have similar support through their transition out of a cult.
MUCH much love and support as always 🖤
Aww thank you, Joel!!
There’s a lot of shame and anxiety in the Morman world. I’m so glad the two have you have survived. You are lovely women with marvelous spirits.
❤️❤️
Shame and anxiety is not supposed to be part of the "Mormon world". Members who experience that don't understand the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and their shame and anxiety are self-imposed. I have heard countless talks by Church leaders which are encouraging and recognize the progressive nature of spiritual growth. Any church member or leader who imposes shame or anxiety on others, is not following the example of Christ nor the policies of the Church.
Great video, and, so awesome that your mom is so supportive. Mine is very supportive of my choice to leave as well even though she's still a member. She's even begun drinking caffeinated tea, whic was pleasantly surprising.
My friends daughter just joined the LDS because her boyfriend is. I’m mortified the mom is just happy to have her go to church
That's the wrong reason for joining the Church. The only good reason is because you have a testimony that it is the restored Church of Jesus Christ. I wonder, though, if anyone is qualified to judge that the only reason she joined is because of her boyfriend. I would also say that being "mortified" by this is an overreaction based on biased information.
I’m a Convert…..Grew Up Catholic but got baptized in Mormon Church when I was 24 yrs old…..I eventually ended up leaving after 5 years…..I just thought it was Strange that they don’t believe Jesus is born on December 25 but, they just gonna Celebrate Christmas with everyone else because, it’s a Holiday?!?! That was always Weird to me…..and also a Mormon Girl who I was friends with ….didn’t allow me to play Music in My Car?!?! She said we can’t play Music nor Shop on Sundays because it’s the Sabbath?!?! lol!! And too many restrictions when it came to hanging out with Outsiders?!?! I never understood these rules?!?! Thank you so Much for sharing your Experiences…..this stuff is interesting!! Love watching your Channel!! God Bless you Both!! 🙏🏻✝️💕👍🏻
I can see myself having a full anxiety attack at that temple. Then, I’d run out as a mad person. PTSD would surely follow.
WOW! Just the first minute has me relating to your mom! I am the 2 x's exmo and it was during my second tour that I went to through the temple endowments around 2008'ish and I was about 40. I thought the exact same thing, "What the heck did I get my self into, is this a cult?" was my constant thought. I would have walked out, if I wasn't "escorted" by RS members (per the Bishops request) and if I knew where the exit was. Every wall was covered, so there didn't seem to be an escape. There was one way in and only one way out... In the Celestial room, I was so numb and crying because I hated it and fel so betrayed and let down, but my RS escorts took my tears as me "feeling the spirit". I couldn't say anything.
Thank you for sharing ❤️
This is my FIRST listen and I just LOVED it! Thank you ladies for opening your hearts and speaking so candidly. Subscribed!
You ladies are so awesome. Thank you so much for sharing this story with us. I have family in the Mormon church and I always have wondered about so many things this was very interesting and God bless you both❤
Love your mom! Love hearing her experiences as well
I love momma Bear. Her hair is amazing and she's willing to do for you what i did for my daughter in a different situation. Bring your mom back again soon.
Her hair is definitely cute!
Thanks Lisa and Shelise for your discussion of religion and the rituals. It brings most religions into perspective. We are all at different places in our belief process. What is important is our relationship with God and others. Be that example of love and faith.❤
Really interesting. I'm so glad you both got out and are shining a light on it ❤
Hello Lisa nice seeing you and your daughter getting along so well....and Thank you for sharing your stories
Shalise I wish your mom was closer to me bc I would ask her if she wanted to date me
Your little puppy sleeping on the table is too cute 😂😍
It’s amazing what we can get our moms to do with the promise of a grand baby!
This is really exciting and interesting. Been waiting for this one. ❤
Your mom seem like such a beautiful soul. Also, I love her hair 😍
After watching this video, the notion of a multi-level marketing scheme popped into my mind.
MLMs are very cult like!!! You're pretty spot on I think
There’s actually an extremely high-level of multilevel marketing, and not just Mormon, but Christians correlating with each other. I’ve seen videos on this exact topic. This stuff tends to spread easily in religious communities, because people are more likely to trust each other because of their religious status. you can even find zoom calls People have gotten access to of MLM groups praying before a meeting. Not to mention that in these type of communities, families tend to be traditional, and these scams advertise as work at home opportunities.
Yes and a lot of MLM companies are from Utah 😂
MLM's are VERY prominent with the Mormon religion.
Thank you both for sharing your experiences.
Love listening to both of you! Thank you for sharing.
I was raised Catholic, and that was creepy enough. The abuse that was unearthed shocked a lot of people, but I wasn't 100% surprised, even though nothing happened to me. I watched videos on Mormonism, and that cult struck me as downright bizarre! Catholicism is tame compared with Mormonism. By the by, the dog is adorable! ^_^
feel the same!!
I agree I was just thinking the same thing! No religion saves us no person place or thing… Just the relationship with Jesus Christ and being baptized in the Holy Spirit. Amen.
Also raised Catholic here in Utah. As a kid, I thought A LOT of what went on in church was a bit strange to me, and the part of confession and having to go to a priest and saying hail Mary's and other BS to be forgiven just made NO SENSE WHATSOEVER TO ME EVEN AS A KID!! I remember thinking to myself, WHY CAN'T I DIRECTLY ASK GOD FOR FORGIVENESS?? Just didn't seem right!
On my 16th birthday, which fell on a Sunday 😂, I flat out REFUSED to go to church anymore. My dad was NOT happy about it at all! My mom wasn't bothered by it. She was Church of England and very seldom ever went to church.
Thank God for my mom!
I am not Mormon but did enjoy the rapport between the two of you as you discussed with dignity the experiences you had at the Temple. I can imagine the complexity one must feel having left a faith tradition that one is raised in and yet still making sense or understanding the practices one once followed and believed in prior to leaving. What your discussion shows me is that you both have a deep understanding of the Divine and how you continue to authentically cultivate that understanding outside of the confines of religious rules and practices.
I have family members who are Mormon. I respect them. They walk their faith serving those in need better than most fundamentalist Christians in my family. I am a child from my mother's second marriage and while my mother and father were married longer than my mother and her first husband, now that she's passed it worries me that they have taken it upon themselves to seal my mother to her first husband who is also passed.
I admire the dialogue you two can have as daughter and mother and the honesty you can share. Great episode. Thanks for sharing.
Thank you for such a thoughtful comment ❤️
Thank you for continuing to shine the light on the damage that can be done in the name of god by his church who would force conformity and enslavement of those who desire to be good and help each other. You are helping to bring kindness together!
This is awesome! Your mom is fantastic! Mother /'daughter goals right there
❤ The 2 of u r adorable together! ❤ I’ve not even looked, but have u linked all of your Mom’s episodes? As a type A myself, I enjoy that u both keep things moving!😊 As a 63 yo Baptist PK, I thought OUR rules were exhausting! They were tame compared to LDS!
I'm just into the first 8 minutes, your laugh just made me so happy, it was so contagious
😁
I love it when your mom is on here! I appreciate her talking about this on here! She's great! Oscar's so comfy and cozy! I love how he's got to be near you! He's your first baby!
Amazing! Yes he really is lol
I get my answers from nature and my own connection to God and Jesus. No middle man or special buildings. God gave me a temple, it's called my body. I'm now learning to take care of myself better. Blessings to all those who are here and thank you for your time making this video. Helps heal old wounds...
I saw a documentary that said the original Mormons came from the Church of Christ and the Presbyterian Church. I don’t know how accurate that was, but I was raised Church of Christ and this stuff has always been so familiar to me. The rules, the shame, even being shunned for questioning. It took me 12 years to extricate myself just to the point of not attending. Another 20 to feel totally free, and then something will trigger me and I’m right back there, being quiet, submissive, unworthy. Vulnerable. Wish I’d had programs like this when I was trying to deprogram myself. Thank you for the work you do.
There's not much of Presbyterian in it, from attending a youth group they ran. Even the branch started here in Ireland by a man with two personality traits homophobia and Catholics bad, aren't this extreme. It's more about fairly austere lives and good work ethic, very Scottish. No weird Masonic gestures either
@@nickywal no we weren’t this extreme either. It’s like they took our craziness and built on it.
@@GrannyLinnThat's what happens when a church develops in near isolation led by slave traffickers apparently
I went to first Presbyterian Church for nearly 20 years. Mormonism is nothing like Presbyterianism. None of these rituals, none of the ridiculousness with purity culture as far as the way you dress and what you can do.
I am not sure if that’s true either. Maybe early converts joined the Mormon church and left their Presbyterian congregation? Mormons cannot be called Christians because they don’t believe in the Trinity, nor that Jesus and God the Father are one. Plus all of the other nonsense.
Sounds alot like Freemasonry
It is Freemasonry. Thats why Joseph Smith got killed. He didn't keep the Rituals secret.
You're amazing on your shows Shalise. You're a great presenter, very intelligent and open. I Love the shows with your mom ! Glad to have watched this, and happy for you and your husband about your baby !
Thank you so much! That means a lot!
Thank you for such an enlightening video on the temple. My LDS friends will not discuss it with me.
However, I found your videos when searching Lori Vallow stuff. Your discussion sheds light on Lori’s desire to be in the temple so much. Your video just helps me further understand Mormonism a little better.
Glad it was helpful!
Liked, shared and commented! Up the algorithm!
May I share just one experience? I was a Temple worker in Orlando. Every time I attended for myself or was working there, I would be so stressed out trying to remember it all. I finally gave up trying to memorize the words (exactly). I was to tell sisters the ordinance she was going in, the words of instruction. Since I failed in that area I was sent to the Baptismal area. Here, I gave the youth and patrons a garment and clothing to wear. I also messed this up. I gave several young men the women's garment!!! Well, I offered to go to the laundry. I did laundry daily at home. I think my reputation was getting out. They didn't want me, next I was honored to be in the Celestial room. I fluffed many pillows, and I could fill a spot.
Unfortunately, I went home with a migraine Every time. It is stressful!
This was so interesting to listen to. I appreciate what you shared. It made me think about my Catholic upbringing. Which was waaaaaaaay less stressful, but bares some similarities as far as being afraid of disapproval by others and god
As someone outside of a cult, i appreciate this immensely. Ive had friends who ignored me after whatever sin parted us. NOTHING a cult does has anything at all to do with holiness or God.
One should be careful about using the word "cult." As a very famous anti Mormon who compiled a list of what makes something a cult, under his own definition, Jesus, His teachings, the apostles etc. were one. As did the Romans and the Jews. Before you take this out of context, please understand I believe in Him, His divinity, His Gospel, Atonement, Sacrifice and Resurrection, the Bible, etc. His list started with a cult has a charismatic leader, which Jesus was, that a cult had new scriptures, which is what the New Testament is. The list goes on. One can say anything they disagree with, hate, etc. but that does not make it a cult. Sad that far too many who say they believe in the Bible, His teachings and Him are so biased, narrow minded, etc. Everyone has their right to believe in Him as they are capable of doing, but to disparage, tear down, insult and demean others and their faith when actually ignorant of what they believe is wrong.
The creator of the BITE Model for identifying cults is a Jewish man. Thus church fits almost every point for cult questionnaires.
A friend of mine told me a NDE guy saw the demons who gave new Revelation to Smith, the beginning of his teaching/recruitment and a child asking him "why did you lie to me, dad?" in hell. Don't let a false prophet cost you your soul.
it's wonderful you and your mom feel comfortable sharing this. i know it takes courage. ... on a funny thought though: What happens in Vegas, Stays in Vegas lol
Omg your beautiful puppy sleeping on your lap 😍🤗 that is pure joy
I’ve only checked out some of the videos so far, and it’s definitely compelling. I also grew up in the church, and the most I ever did was baptisms for the dead and confirmations. I never went on a mission or got married in the temple either. my step sister and her ex-husband, however did, and told me some about the temple ceremonies when they left the church. It feels so good, knowing that people are getting out of this church. When I look at my family, and how my parents got my nieces and nephews to join, even though my other sister isn’t a member. It’s pretty discouraging. The vast majority of my family, except for a couple siblings are still very strong members of the church, and there are times I wish my biological mother had been able to get out before she passed away. Anyway, hope the baby shower goes well. Thanks for posting. Always so brave when people speak out.
Consider this. Is the LDS church the worst thing that could happen? Or do you just not agree with it. Nobody is trapped. They can leave as they wish. So why do some stay? Well, why does anyone go to any church at all? Your "coming to Jesus" moment is very personal. Your path is personal. My conversion in Christ was loud, clear, and personal. Whatever path I'm trying to be on is the right one for me. Not perfect. But right. I stay in the church. However, though I can back up its truth with several biblical verses and soon with archeological proof, I can say not everyone will join it. That's okay! I have seen and heard beautiful conversion in Christ stories from people of other religions (because again conversion is personal). God doesn't come down and say, "I know you believe in me, but you have to join the Mormons now." He leaves it up to us to make a choice of where we learn. If this path is helping your family be close to God, it's okay. Is anything really bad coming from it other than you don't like it?
@@Nopety-Nope they are hoarding millions, they enable misogyny, they’re super pushy on other people, so yeah. It’s more than just I don’t like it. Some people try for their whole lives to talk to God and don’t hear anything and that’s just as valid as an experience as yours. And no one’s any less worthy because of it either. That’s the thing a lot of you Mormons, and really zealous Christians act like people that don’t believe the same as you are better than other people. And no one is morally superior over others just because of their beliefs or lack there of. And consider this, is there really such a thing as adjusted God that would send good people to hell just for never hearing him and not believing? It doesn’t mean that they have hard hearts. But they might have different experiences that give them different beliefs. They’re still good people, but God would send them to hell just for thinking differently. That’s not a just God, and that’s a God who only loves with conditions. I’ve read the Bible book of mormon and there are sure a lot of them. Not to mention a ton of inconsistencies if you do your research. Believe it if you want, but it’s true. Not to mention that a lot of it conflicts with provable science.
@@Nopety-Nope also, minimizing peoples experiences with religious trauma is extremely rude when Mormon and Christian churches push guilt and shame on their parishioners. If you want to believe that lie, that’s on you. But the rest of us don’t have to. Just because you deny reality doesn’t mean that reality doesn’t exist.
@@Nopety-Nope archaeolog proof that’s a riot! It’s probably only things the church has said, because there’s actually a mountain of inconsistencies between the book of Mormon, and what actually is under the ground in the Americas. Not to mention that the Americas didn’t even have horses, but the book of Mormon clearly talks about horses. the church is also guilty for hoarding, massive amount of money, and pushing guilt shame on its parishioners to keep them terrified to leave. y
@@Darkemberandviolet You took my comment as rude? Do you think perhaps you seek for bad things on purpose? I literally told you I was helping your friend. I asked if it's the worst thing that's out there. While there are those individuals who push guilt, a lot of guilt is self brought. I have never had someone make me feel guilty for not doing church things. I have felt guilt before on my own, but realized it's because I saw things the wrong way. I brought guilt because of my perception. But then I learned something about life and I learned the rules. Your friend can choose to not feel guilty, and that was the point of my comment. Read it again objectively. Not with the desire to seek dirt and anger.
I think you two ladies would love The Stacie's Mom Podcast . They are from the deconversion community and have a fantastic story to mother and daughter deconstruction and deconversion.
I’m not Mormon, but a mom who has a daughter and you two are so special. Thank you for your podcast! And much love to your BABY!!!❤️
WoW. Thanks for sharing this eye-opening conversation. 😊
If the spirit of discernment were a REAL thing, shouldn't the people at the temple be able to just tell if you're "worthy" to be in the Temple eliminating the need to have your recommend to get in? One would think.... No?
Lori and Chad Daybell went inside the temple after unaliving several people
The name of the game is to keep the parishioner guilty feeling. At least that’s what I’m assuming. I don’t know if this is in Christian doctrine, or only Mormon doctrine, but there’s literally a verse that paraphrases too. If you’re not with God, you’re against God. That’s pretty intense. A 12-year-old should never have to wonder if they’re worthy just because they might swear.
@@anitah2404 those two killers were mentally deranged. criminals lie cheat manipulate anyone. Every profession has killers rapists and pedophiles even politicians, judges, drs, police officers,
You can’t blame. Judas gave Jesus to be tortured and hung on a cross then Judas committed suicide
Not even God or Jesus prevented Judas from this.
Boy, the “Mormon church” is weird. Had missionaries show up at my door in the past, always polite to them while telling I’m not interested because of my antipathy to religion. Your podcast and others have taught me so much. Thanks
Appreciate you are polite to the missionaries! Yes, this podcast is so enlightening with great invites! I also recommend Mormon Stories Podcast!
It is very interesting that THIS religion is the only one the government and media leave alone. ANY OTHER religion would be pounded in to the ground every day. All monies lead to Utah it seems.
I wish we had more West Africans who had antipathy to religion. Colonialism has done a number on us. The LDS church is unfortunately spreading like rapidfire in West Africa, esp. Ghana and Nigeria. I’m Akan and Yoruba but born in America :)
This is an incredibly interesting interview with these two and so much insight into the craziness of that Mormon church
What a well done interview. Very informative
Love you and your Mom's relationship. So gosh darn cute.
I think the mystery aspect is so effective because it creates the illusion of a puzzle that everyone's trying to figure out.. like mama bear says you find yourself hanging on every word, trying to make sense of it. Then you start reading things into it that weren't even intended, because you start assigning meaning, which then reinforces the idea that it's really divine. I remember my mission companions would often see signs in the little things around us, believing they were messages for us, but they were really meaningless. For example she'd see numbers in a street sign and that would mean something.. honestly I don't remember now what she thought she saw. That's got to be why the church uses so much mystery and symbolism.. the people start to see what they want to see or think they should see and the church can just sit back while the members keep the story going.
Makes a lot of sense!! Confirmation bias and using “testimony” to fill in the huge gaps
That was eye-opening,! Thank you so much for sharing. I’ve been deconstructed from Mormonism for a while now, but I don’t really think about that idea much. It makes sense why some people would see signs where they’re really isn’t anything because you’re always told to look out for any little spiritual thing in the church. So many Sacrament meeting talks found symbolism all over the place, and applied random bible concepts to every day situations.
I truly admire your channel and your willingness to bring awareness of the mind and heart to ppl. I'm a Christian, and it completely amazes me to hear ppl who were former Mormons, talk about their experiences. The one thing that continues to stick out to me is how Mormons keep referring to the church, and I think I rarely have heard anyone (former Mormons) mention their actual relationship with God directly. Idk, but it sounds like Mormonism is very closely related (ideology wise) to the Pharisees and how they place the focus on the "church" or "temple" rather than the teachings of Jesus. I, myself, have struggled with my faith bc of my religious upbringing, but once I placed my focus on wanting and desiring peace in my life, God/Jesus began to open my mind even more to the magnitude of who God is. Thanks for sharing your stories and teaching others to open their minds and hearts and going deeper within to find who they are, and their peace...❤❤❤
Thank you both!
Seeing Jesus in the temple, like sneaking downstairs to see Santa. 😂💝
😂
Unscramble Santa & it's SATAN Dec 24th to Dec 25 is Hindu Brahms red heiffer sacrifice / Certainly not YHWH GOD or The Glorious Emmanuel Covt Govt in isa7:14 verse 18 is the Ross Rvr Moskitoes curse worldwide 🎉 GoodLuckTarot from Egypt is dream catchers with all 3 Tarot n Menstruous Blood- despicable sods effect San Francisco is abt to fall into San Andreas Fault Tiff Shuttlesworth Oumuamua Asteroid gona hookup with dark 🔥 sp Pele lei garlands / Starsky n Hutch hooch Psychosis Boulevard is disappearing with Michigan Farmers sick with Parkinsons from Paraquat herbicides in potatoes