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Many of these companies download the roms, hacks, "pirated" versions and sell them back to you because they've lost the original source code. It's only because software preservation exists that we can still play these games.
Emulation is awesome. I prefer to play on real hardware but a lot of these systems are getting older and failing. Also I have no problem emulating Switch games. I own a Switch and a Switch Lite, I buy all my games for the switch that I want to play but sometimes emulating them offers a better experience. I get a more stable frame rate emulating ToTK on my PC than I do playing it on a Switch. There is also Xenobalde 3 that I preordered from Nintendo and ended up beating it on an emulator since Nintendo didn't even ship it until a week after the game released.
I 110% Agree WELL PUT. I couldnt had said it better myself. I wouldn't know the amazing RPGS that were Japan only if it wasnt for emulation and fan translations to English. These games should be world wide for all and not just file and forget which is the major SIN of most companies these days. Give gamers a chance to play these games and let them be the judge of how great they are. Japan will be shocked on how popular RPGS are in the west and we are capable of playing them as equal to the Japanese gamers and THATS FACT
What I say is, yes, I can see an issue of games that just come out. But a 20 or a 30 year old game especially when you can’t get them at reasonable prices, and especially when old cartridges or discs go bad, that is where the gaming industry has to learn.
Moon Channel did a video covering this from a lawyer's point of view that is familiar with Intellectual Property law. In short, the owner of the IP (game) can do whatever they want with it (they can emulate their own games, but can also legally go after anyone else doing it); While i'm not a fan of this, there are titles that disappeared when the 3DS and WiiU ehops went offline and I'm pretty sure we might never see them again outside of emulation.
There are thousands of games throughout history for all consoles, platforms, systems that are not available today on current generation technology, no matter what somebody is willing to pay.
@@eye-of-omega 'Fair use' is a phrase that gets misused/misunderstood even more often than the 'emulation is piracy' argument brought up in this video. And any time a supposedly 'fair use' video gets struck off RUclips by an IP holder, there's another example of that lack of understanding. There's a lot more that goes into it than just 'don't make money from it'.
If Emulation is Piracy, that it would be all these results: Games have to be rebuilt from the ground up. Nintendo, Microsoft, and Sony would be breaking the law for emulating their own games, wouldn't matter if they were the creators or publishers. Games that are no longer sold would vanish into obscurity ROMs you dont own is piracy, but if the ROM is no longer possible to obtain by legit means, then emulation is the only way to play. Don't forget, there is also Gabe Newell's quote: Piracy is a service problem, best way to combat piracy is to offer services better than the pirates. Which most companies won't do unfortunately.
I often ask people that say emulation is piracy how I can legally purchase the content. Then they say Ebay or FB Marketplace etc. And I say no that doesn't support the creators or publishers of the games. How can I legally obtain this by purchase that supports the actual team members that made it? Even with say Nintendo if I pay for Nintendo online subscription and get NES games do those original game devs get residual income for those games? I highly doubt it.
That's a bit of a weird question at the end there. If the developers were employed by Nintendo, they certainly got compensated for their time while working on a game. Profits will go to the company itself, to put towards (among other things) paying those developers' salary/wages and to fund more projects.
@@qactustick If you work on movies or tv or music you get paid when there are re-runs or people listen to a song on spotify etc. To my knowledge no such system exists in video games. Thus my comment.
The fact that emulation is not piracy was legally established back in like 2000 with the bleem! lawsuits that Sony lost. But the U.S. legal system favors big companies in that they are allowed to file lawsuits and issue takedowns and C&D's at will against small time independent hobbyist devs without any burden of proof and those devs have to pay their own astronomical legal fees if they want to try to defend their rights and their work. This basically gives the Nintendo's and the Sony's of the world free reign to target just about anybody doing something they don't like knowing they won't be able to afford the legal battle. It's a shame the legal system tolerates this kind of corporate bullying.
One caveat with emulating current games I'll say is that sometimes you can get the game to run better with significant improvements or mods through emulation vs original hardware. This is the case with most Nintendo games lol. Breath of the Wild looks incredible running in 4K60 with some graphics mods on an emulator. But if you're gonna do that you should still buy a legal copy of the game, I'd say.
The most hilarious part is people who don't realize that buying used does not even give a single penny to Nintendo, Sony, etc. Not even if you pay $80,000 dollars.
@@wordsovsean8905 I've read some comments that said that piracy is bad because it "steals" from the creators, then suggested to buy used for old games.
Three pillars of any successful good/service. 1: Can I access it? Doesn't matter how awesome it is. If I can't actually buy it then I can't buy it. 2: Is it affordable? If you price it so that it is out of my ability to purchase it then I can't purchase it. 3: Is it an experience? Why should I bother if it's the same as watching paint dry or grass grow. Doesn't mean that it has to be excellent, but it needs to stand out from a sea of choice. Congratulations, you have just gotten 2 years of advanced business classes in a few sentences.
If Emulation is piracy Nintendo stole from themselves when they released the NES mini and SNES mini. Even Sony and Sega stole from themselves with the PlayStation 1 mini. Sega with the Sega Genesis 1 and 2 minis. Which doesn't make sense at all. Sony even went as far used a emulation software they didn't create to run on the PlayStation 1 mini to play the games.
The "Emulation is piracy" argument is just a convenient tool for videogame companies to keep implementing their dirtiest business practices and generate more revenue at the cost of screwing their customers. That's why I have no qualms about anyone emulating any game they want, especially if it's something retro. Happy New Year, everyone!
On the flipside, there's also the 'emulation is preservation' argument which is just as flawed, coming from the consumer side. As MLP frequently notes when he talks about this stuff, almost everyone who emulates doesn't give half a crap about preservation. They just feel entitled to access to every game they want to play, and for some people that includes for no cost as well.
@@ornerycuss5804 You'd do the same thing if you had collections like that. Anyone would. Also, you're not 100% correct. They use flashcarts, emulators, and aren't afraid to talk about it.
I would just invite the naysayers to try it. It’s amazing. You can grab your PS2 gathering dust in your house somewhere, get its console bios to your PC, grab your PS2 games and play them on your PC from the disc. Yes PCXS2 just works with PS2 game discs. Literally using a USB DVD drive hooked up to your PC you can play your PS2 games in 4k. It’s not that straightforward with every emulator, but yeah in 2023 playing an actual PS2 on native res is rough, these emulators on PC are the best way to play these old games … the people who slave away building and polishing these emulators are an absolute god send and gift to me and all gamers. Just try it!
I just commented regarding this. The argument being made in this video misses the point. The argument he should be making is whether piracy can be legitimised in some circumstances.
If it weren't for emulation, there would just be so many amazing games I would have never got a chance to play. Actraiser, Soul Blazer, Alisa Dragoon, Ogre Battle 64, River City Ransom, Langrisser.. I mean, all games I went back and bought in some form or another.
I agree that emulation and piracy are two totally different things. I've always believed in being able to play your whole library of purchased games no mater what the era. I remember the first time I ran emulators it was a NES, SNES, AND Genisis emulator on my Sega dreamcast. I thought to my self wow I have the ability to play all my games on one platform this is great. As the years passed emulation just got stronger and better. As those years passed I baught the newest systems and totes full of games. I am so thankful for where emulation is today so I can still play all of my old Backus instead of having to dust off my old consoles and games and fill a whole room with old tvs or adapters to play them although some times i do for nostalgia. Emulation is an all in one solution to play your whole purchased library over the years on one small convenient platform.
Funny part is without emulation, the nintendo classic wouldn't be made. It was obvious that rom and emulation set up was based on piracy before. I still buy the games even thoughi have an original version.
If something is available for me to buy, then i dont emulate it. I feel its their property so they deserve to make money on it, no matter how old. But if i have no way to buy it, im going to emulate it
If you pay $300 for an original of Chrono Trigger off eBay, does the eBay seller turn around and cut a check for a portion of the sales to the developers? Lol no And in turn in some cases the developer company doesn't even exist anymore or the original hardware is too complex and old to repair and be readily available. In which case emulation may be the only way the software or games can be preserved.
If its not being sold and their is no monetary gain or loss accredited to is not piracy. Saying that emulation is piracy only makes people want to emulate even harder.
Emulation never was piracy but even companies like Nintendo love to say so to scare off the untold. Plus these days at least on PC it is rather easy to buy at least some ROMs legally, like SEGA MegaDrive/Genesis games on Steam or NeoGeo games on GOG which are actually the same files you would load into FinalBurnAlpha too. I just dump the games I want to play on another hardware from my own physical collection and call it a day.
You couldn't be more wrong. I was there in the early days of emulation and you know what everyone did with emulators? Download games illegally and play them.
I didn’t hear a word you said as I was focusing on the gameplay, showing of some of your finest skills on Mario hidden levels. Well thanks for explaining and it makes sense, keep on gaming 👍🏾
This can’t be reiterated enough. Ignorance and stupidity are destructive. Keep fighting the good fight good sir. edit* I wonder how many of these online ‘emulation is piracy’ trolls are irl retro video game dealers
If someone downloads a copy of Breath Of the Wild , it's piracy, if you get a copy of Ocarina of Time , you are celebrating the game. I feel that I emulate a LOT just before I go and buy old games. I feel that same effect may warrant actually having PHYSICAL medias. If no Physical releases exist , then I ask, What good are digital copies of games vs backups?
0:49 I get that you're probably emulating that SNES rom on Switch or PC, but that video background struck me as funny, cause that was an example of when Nintendo did sort of reprogram the NES games to run on the SNES. The original code is there, from what I understand anyhow, but it's been reworked and upgraded, not emulated. In that way it was one of the first remasters, since they're basically the same games just with a graphical overhaul.
I love emulation. I emulate a lot games. But I also buy re-released retro games(collections, aca neogeo, aca arcade archives, and even original physical games.) I hate how companies attack others when they won't re-release their older games.
i had no idea even with having a physical copy you do not have ownership. what an eye opener. This means every corporation is guilty of fraud. We have been played like a fiddle! No court in this land should therefore uphold piracy claims because they are supposed to work for the people!
Piracy is a bit of the appeal to me; I love the idea of “sticking it to the mab,” getting to play all these games “for free.” *However I am not a lifelong gamer, never owned a home console, played PC games 25 years ago. I am completely aghast at the landscape of pay-to-play, micro transactions, high costs of games and hard ware. Cannot justify spending $1,000 on a PlayStation or Xbox, additional controller, some games, online access, etc. Currently playing GBA games on a $75 Powkiddy and my mind is blown.
Well said. When it comes to this issue I pretty well say the same things you did. I use Nintendo and the NES for my argument as well. For example, in ‘94 Nintendo discontinued support of the NES. They wouldn’t discontinue it if it was of worth to Nintendo. So, if it’s discontinued, I can’t buy a new cartridge for the NES, and they think those old games are of no worth, then why are they so protective of a media they themselves treat as worthless?
i have never had an issue with Piracy some of the first games I ever played were pirated games on the commodore 64. I also believe writers, developers and companies deserve to get paid and they do. But look what Sony did to LIK-SANG was this right? Im with the hackers on 99% of the issues. its my opinion that the property owners are only going to get a certain % of the total game value and they should call the rest free advertising.
These companies never give you anything, they sell you the same games over and over again, usually worse or via buggy emulation. Download the ROMs and play emulators made by people who give a passion for retro gaming, unlike the corporations that don't care about how bad their games emulate. They only care about making money and that’s it. Own the originals, and at least you feel that you own a copy.
I remember emulating NES games on my Packard bell computer when nesticle was brand new. I did this to play games I never saw anywhere and games that came out really late like kirbys adventure, DuckTales 2 and rescue rangers 2. My friends and cousins were blown away at that.
Emulation is NOT piracy... I for one do my best to rip my libraries so they outsurvive the hardware. HOWEVER, I will also argue if the game is not available anymore, Im not against piracy either (far more against the "collector tax"). And on a similar note, Nintendo's answer of "We wont sell you the old games. At best you can rent them from us for a monthly fee" is absolute trash. Sell the roms... even if exclusive to yoru machine...
I emulate because i don't want to play games on tiny screens i want to play them on a pc monitor or tv. There's no way to do that officially with a ds , psp or 3ds or game gear.
If its not buyable it is not piracy that is my motto and if it's to expensive to be available for the masses it is not piracy but pirating nintendo games is always morally right
Capcom ported games to PS1 and PS2 (YES: Rockman/Megaman collections are ported there). Now it varies. Megaman Legacy Collection 1 - emulation, 2 - ports as I understand.
if emulation is piracy then game collecting is criminal for hiking the prices. most of us cant afford the physical copies, how can we relive the nostalgia. emulation really help alot
If you emulate Twisted Metal for example and like it....when you can buy the newer one on console...you are likely to buy it. Piracy helps too. People want the original Pokemon game and not a rom. I think the pirates equal out sales lost. They will buy future games. Most are kids who can't buy, but when they get older and richer they do buy. I agree, buy and also "pirate"
Emulation is Piracy, if the software or hardware you are emulating is available for purchase through an official licenced retailer. Stealing software it's still stealing, you are not paying for getting access to someone elses work (time and effort). I am a game dev myself, and I agree with game preservation, because i love gaming, so having a way to preserve software i think shouldn't be discussed, that needs to happen, as games and software are part of our history. That being said, I will never condone people not paying for software that is readily available for purchase or access. On the other hand, i think that any game that is no longer available for purchase should be given out for free as it no longer can give any revenue to the company and people that put work in it. There is an argument to be made, that sometimes, having access to old software can damage the new software sell metrics, but thats it what it is, i think if you, as the company, don't want to give access to software that you released 15 years ago, then people should be entitled to have access to it, if its available and has been preserved on the internet or other mediums. Now DRM is a whole different discussion as well, its a complicated topic, and i am not going to write everything of what i think, but i least i can give a small glimpse of my perspective and someone can agree or disagree :)
I love physical media, i collect for the systems i have the only time i emulate it is if its my only last resort. Such as US copy and imported copies being crazy expensive. Or worst case scenario, it was never released in Japan... And i refuse to pay $500+ for a game... So thats when i emulate it...
I totaly agree Ron Emulation only becomes Piracy when its sold for profit OR its ripping off current software but if its for games 30 or more years old on dead consoles OR the game are translations of Japan Only games translated to English or another Language giving people world wide right to play the games for THE 1ST TIME and it is kept as a private collection much like Banned DVDS are then. People DO NOT pay for old nes and snes games anymore unless they collect them in cart form and I own a LOT of nes and SNES Japan only games in English and enjoy playing them a lot. Even Sega Genesis-Mega Drive games had Japan Only games and for myself that is Sega's true library of games. Japan underestimates the West way too much. We are as skilled as they are in games esp. Americans AND THAT IS FACT.
@@videostash413 Tell THAT to Japan. They don't think we have the ability to play their games and that is total BULLSH*T. These games are NOT ROCKET SCIENCE. Anyone regardless of race can pick up and learn. Hell Man I HAVE AUTISM For christ's sake yet I learned the games. It is as plain as the nose on your face they never want the world to know these games exist
emulation is only piracy if the game cannot be reasonably obtained. If you want to play commodore 64s go to town, but if you are emulating a ps5 to play games without paying, its theft.
In the grand scheme, no, it isn't. In my case, it definitely was piracy lol But I was a kid and couldn't get all the games I wanted to play. Plus the untranslated SNES games I got to play because of the community
If you can't purchase it, you can't pirate it. I see no issue at all with emulating older games that aren't available. If there's a way to purchase a game that I want to play, then I'll do it. Nintendo could easily make a bunch of money by making their older games available, but they're dead set on barely ever releasing older games.
I bought every nintendo switch game for my nephew except the Wario and mario party. Even bought 3 odyssey. If I want to play them I feel it's a legal backup.
I heard that when R-type 1 and 2 came out on PS1 they actually did reprogram the game from scratch to run on a PS1. But yeah 99% of the time emulation is used
Emulation is what makes gaming interesting and much more fun! Especially when all company’s are starting to go to an all digital future which sucks. Emulation is saving gaming from the community that really appreciate it!
Emulation is just another way to say "Virtual Machine" IMO. When you run VirtualBox on Linux to virtualise Win98 to play your old games; you're using software to replicate a hardware environment to run software not intended for the hosting system. Gee... that sounds identical to how emulators are software that replicates a hardware environment to run software not intended for the system running the emulator...
If it was pirating a modern or recently released game, yeah that'd be wrong to do, and it's especially scummy if someone is pirating from a new and upcoming indie developer, but if it's from ancient hardware from the NES, SNES, Genesis, Atari 2600, I don't see what's the big issue of having access to stuff that long since been abandoned and inaccessible for decades. There's also an asshat in the Steam forums of Sonic Origins who adamantly believes that buying _legitimate second-hand retail games_ "is illegal"... There are some people on Steam forums and social media with the most stupidest takes with not only emulations, but just legally obtaining a _used_ game. I still find it really hypocritical and two-faced Nintendo is with emulating, they'll sue or forcibly take down a ROM site for hosting games from their systems yet they use glorified rental systems with the Switch Online games that are based on emulation. Hell, they worked with the emulation gurus M2 back then for the Virtual Console emulation for certain platforms on the Wii U. Sadly not all emulation devs are being honest about preserving access to older games, like the RPCS3 developers; from my personal experience, they have been incredibly passive-aggressive towards me for wanting to try out the PlayStation 3 version of the Doom: Classic Complete collection out of curiosity since John Carmack worked on this particular collection and I legally own all of the classic Doom games on PC and Switch, but the RPCS3 would not help me with problems I was having with their emulator and then locked down a thread I made on Github to pass when I called them out on it while another user gloating that they had no issue about their overrated emulator. Maybe it's a good thing I'm poor since I don't end up supporting shitty and hypocritical developers like them if they're this adamant against piracy yet their software is emulating games that not many people have legal access to since it has been discontinued and may not even care if they are pirating a game or not as long as the games they want to play is accessible without original hardware.
Emulation is awesome! Not everyone has access to buy games physically! Just play video games and enjoy!!! It’s businesses lookout what is right or what is not! Not general public! We are just consumers!
Piracy is fine after a certain time. God gave them the skill and they got paid well for it, usually. I downloaded Switch games I don't own, I didn't play them more than a few minutes. I just wanted too see if it's worth buying. I collect physical for my Switch. My largest collect is on my Switch. I have about 5-10 games I want to buy for my collection, already at 30 or so. I'm gonna have to buy twice for some digital games I bought since Nintendo doesn't keep servers up. Maybe I pirated movies or songs before, but if I did...I was broke and had no intention on buying it. I remember copying music on cassette from the radio. Quit being greedy, eventually I turned into a customer. FYI I'm speaking as a character who agrees with some piracy and a collector. It's for a book I'm thinking about writing.
😆 whatever floats yer gaming boat right? I love using original consoles with flashcarts. No right or wrong answers when it comes to how we play retro games.
@@Madlittlepixel 100% agree. That was more tongue in cheek. I have zero problem with emulation or how anyone plays games. As Gamestop said originally (lol), "Power to the players!"
I have 1 reason why I emulate. That is because some of these days my N64 is going to stop working. Permanently. How am I going to play with my games if my N64 stops working?
We offer the company money to re release certain games so we can still play them.... They refuse... So that's why pirates are now all in and I'm in for it 😁👍
I’m glad emulation exist to play retro classic (the original systems and games are getting more expensive and who no’s how long it works!)Besides that there are a lot of games that never came to console only to be in arcades or didn’t released in some country’s.In my opinion is piracy a thing if you’re talking about recent games (Nintendo switch,PS5,Xbox One and series S and X including pc.
The day Nintendo Sony ect stop shutting down their online stores that’s the day I’ll stop emulating getting tired of buying games and can’t download them anymore after they shut the store down. Physical only for me now or emulation.
I meet a lot of people at work. It isn't surprising that most of them are gamers. Games have become even more popular than movies with most people. What I've come to discover in my conversations is most people don't understand what emulation actually is or how to do it. They're ignorant in all the ways you can get, make, and access a ROM. Some even choose to remain ignorant after you try to explain that you converted your legit Gameboy carts into roms using a cart flasher like a Krikzz, Smartboy, JRodrigo, BennVenn, the list goes on. There are so many ways to rip your LEGIT games for emulation without download, that it has slowly become laughable to me how people choose not to understand, and in some cases just jump on their fanboy horse and say "If Nintendo doesn't like it, I don't like it." I think in the back of their heads though, they don't want to have to figure out how to emulate so they get jealous, ("If I CaN't hAvE It thEn THey shOuLDN't EITHER").
I've been using emulator since on my old computer and then current 2014 of my computer (10 or almost 10 years for now on, with SSD added just for OS system drive, but my harddrive still retain to use for data and other hard drive for a game). And yes for emulator, played NES for example like i did on another, like Famiclone. Chinese NES (Famicom) bootleg. I remember play the Famiclone, and that because back then when was a kid i didn't get into a PlayStation until there was someone playing it and have myself enjoy and play as well with move on from a Famiclone.
I think the important thing to think though is that a lot of people that emulate DO pirate. so much so people correlate the two together which most of the time they aren't wrong. when it comes to certain things like the Switch with DRM and User agreement Nintendo has with it. Any kind of Switch emulation is pirating. Due to the only way of aqcuiring a ROM for the Switch is to break their terms you agree to when buying the Switch. Same can be said for DS and 3DS. Another important note that is that even when you buy a physical copy, YOU DO NOT OWN THE GAME. YOU PURCHASED A LICENSE TO PLAY THE GAME. The ruling that allowed emulation in the US by the way, was made in an era that wasn't as digital as it is now. If the topic would go to court today I believe that emulation would actually become illegal or make it harder to emulate legally. With Nintendo Switch Online and PS+ adding classics to their subscription. It absolutely does mean that they are losing out on potential money when it comes to people emulating classics.
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Long live emulation, keeping gaming history alive...
And showing the west theres 2 sides to gaming with East and West bridging the gap with Language
I think emulation is great, can you imagine all the arcade games that would be lost forever without it
facts
Well said.
I completely agree I got into retro gaming because of emulation
I agree but also applies to niche Japan only games as well genre various on all but I go for JRPGS
also all the games that have been delisted over time and hidden gems you would discover with emulation
Many of these companies download the roms, hacks, "pirated" versions and sell them back to you because they've lost the original source code. It's only because software preservation exists that we can still play these games.
Yeah :)
True but for Japanese only games hacks to English are the only way you can play them
Can you imagine not having emulation with the way gaming is these days.i feel like emulation will be the only way we'll own anything eventually.
You dont even own it anyway the elites own everything lol wake up
Title: Emulation IS NOT PIRACY!
Thumbnail: EMULATION IS PIRACY!
Emulation is keeping all those old games alive. Without it, then it would be impossible to play them again without resorting to expensive hardware.
or spending half your life learning a complex Language
Emulation is awesome. I prefer to play on real hardware but a lot of these systems are getting older and failing. Also I have no problem emulating Switch games. I own a Switch and a Switch Lite, I buy all my games for the switch that I want to play but sometimes emulating them offers a better experience. I get a more stable frame rate emulating ToTK on my PC than I do playing it on a Switch. There is also Xenobalde 3 that I preordered from Nintendo and ended up beating it on an emulator since Nintendo didn't even ship it until a week after the game released.
I 110% Agree WELL PUT. I couldnt had said it better myself. I wouldn't know the amazing RPGS that were Japan only if it wasnt for emulation and fan translations to English. These games should be world wide for all and not just file and forget which is the major SIN of most companies these days. Give gamers a chance to play these games and let them be the judge of how great they are. Japan will be shocked on how popular RPGS are in the west and we are capable of playing them as equal to the Japanese gamers and THATS FACT
Emulation is a tool.... And just like a knife it can be used as a weapon or as a tool depends on the person
Like a knife it's intent of what the person's mindset is. If its just private ownage its a tool it its used as profit its a weapon
What I say is, yes, I can see an issue of games that just come out. But a 20 or a 30 year old game especially when you can’t get them at reasonable prices, and especially when old cartridges or discs go bad, that is where the gaming industry has to learn.
Moon Channel did a video covering this from a lawyer's point of view that is familiar with Intellectual Property law. In short, the owner of the IP (game) can do whatever they want with it (they can emulate their own games, but can also legally go after anyone else doing it); While i'm not a fan of this, there are titles that disappeared when the 3DS and WiiU ehops went offline and I'm pretty sure we might never see them again outside of emulation.
There are thousands of games throughout history for all consoles, platforms, systems that are not available today on current generation technology, no matter what somebody is willing to pay.
@@eye-of-omega 'Fair use' is a phrase that gets misused/misunderstood even more often than the 'emulation is piracy' argument brought up in this video. And any time a supposedly 'fair use' video gets struck off RUclips by an IP holder, there's another example of that lack of understanding. There's a lot more that goes into it than just 'don't make money from it'.
If Emulation is Piracy, that it would be all these results:
Games have to be rebuilt from the ground up.
Nintendo, Microsoft, and Sony would be breaking the law for emulating their own games, wouldn't matter if they were the creators or publishers.
Games that are no longer sold would vanish into obscurity
ROMs you dont own is piracy, but if the ROM is no longer possible to obtain by legit means, then emulation is the only way to play.
Don't forget, there is also Gabe Newell's quote: Piracy is a service problem, best way to combat piracy is to offer services better than the pirates. Which most companies won't do unfortunately.
I often ask people that say emulation is piracy how I can legally purchase the content. Then they say Ebay or FB Marketplace etc. And I say no that doesn't support the creators or publishers of the games. How can I legally obtain this by purchase that supports the actual team members that made it? Even with say Nintendo if I pay for Nintendo online subscription and get NES games do those original game devs get residual income for those games? I highly doubt it.
That's a bit of a weird question at the end there. If the developers were employed by Nintendo, they certainly got compensated for their time while working on a game. Profits will go to the company itself, to put towards (among other things) paying those developers' salary/wages and to fund more projects.
@@qactustick If you work on movies or tv or music you get paid when there are re-runs or people listen to a song on spotify etc. To my knowledge no such system exists in video games. Thus my comment.
It's not piracy if they aren't selling the game anymore.
Developers over Publishers!
The fact that emulation is not piracy was legally established back in like 2000 with the bleem! lawsuits that Sony lost. But the U.S. legal system favors big companies in that they are allowed to file lawsuits and issue takedowns and C&D's at will against small time independent hobbyist devs without any burden of proof and those devs have to pay their own astronomical legal fees if they want to try to defend their rights and their work. This basically gives the Nintendo's and the Sony's of the world free reign to target just about anybody doing something they don't like knowing they won't be able to afford the legal battle. It's a shame the legal system tolerates this kind of corporate bullying.
If you cant own your games, then piracy is not wrong
IMHO emulation is no different than preserving art in a museum.
Emulation is preservation
And sometimes absolutely necessary to keep businesses running.
Depends what you are emulating
The genie is out of the bottle, they'll never stop emulation, EVER🤣 Great video👍🏼
Emulation was WELL out of the bottle 20 years ago when you could emulate SNES and older on your OG XBOX
One caveat with emulating current games I'll say is that sometimes you can get the game to run better with significant improvements or mods through emulation vs original hardware. This is the case with most Nintendo games lol. Breath of the Wild looks incredible running in 4K60 with some graphics mods on an emulator. But if you're gonna do that you should still buy a legal copy of the game, I'd say.
The most hilarious part is people who don't realize that buying used does not even give a single penny to Nintendo, Sony, etc. Not even if you pay $80,000 dollars.
Has anyone ever said it does?
@@wordsovsean8905 I've read some comments that said that piracy is bad because it "steals" from the creators, then suggested to buy used for old games.
I was banned from Reddit for saying this, even though it's literally true.
I'm pretty sure the Zelda collection on GC was done through emulation, so its not new for OEMs to do this
Three pillars of any successful good/service.
1: Can I access it? Doesn't matter how awesome it is. If I can't actually buy it then I can't buy it.
2: Is it affordable? If you price it so that it is out of my ability to purchase it then I can't purchase it.
3: Is it an experience? Why should I bother if it's the same as watching paint dry or grass grow. Doesn't mean that it has to be excellent, but it needs to stand out from a sea of choice.
Congratulations, you have just gotten 2 years of advanced business classes in a few sentences.
but i didn't pay for that info from a class! your post is piracy! LOL
If Emulation is piracy Nintendo stole from themselves when they released the NES mini and SNES mini. Even Sony and Sega stole from themselves with the PlayStation 1 mini. Sega with the Sega Genesis 1 and 2 minis. Which doesn't make sense at all. Sony even went as far used a emulation software they didn't create to run on the PlayStation 1 mini to play the games.
The "Emulation is piracy" argument is just a convenient tool for videogame companies to keep implementing their dirtiest business practices and generate more revenue at the cost of screwing their customers. That's why I have no qualms about anyone emulating any game they want, especially if it's something retro. Happy New Year, everyone!
and also saying they give us the best when the best they only release in Japan. Its not just screwing us over its plain FKING CRUEL
Let's not forget the retro gatekeepers like Pat and Ian who argue against it to justify their collecting and raise the value of their own games.
On the flipside, there's also the 'emulation is preservation' argument which is just as flawed, coming from the consumer side. As MLP frequently notes when he talks about this stuff, almost everyone who emulates doesn't give half a crap about preservation. They just feel entitled to access to every game they want to play, and for some people that includes for no cost as well.
@@ornerycuss5804 You'd do the same thing if you had collections like that. Anyone would.
Also, you're not 100% correct. They use flashcarts, emulators, and aren't afraid to talk about it.
@user-cz5fr5yk7k Interesting. They've changed their stance apparently. Times change I suppose.
I would just invite the naysayers to try it. It’s amazing. You can grab your PS2 gathering dust in your house somewhere, get its console bios to your PC, grab your PS2 games and play them on your PC from the disc. Yes PCXS2 just works with PS2 game discs. Literally using a USB DVD drive hooked up to your PC you can play your PS2 games in 4k. It’s not that straightforward with every emulator, but yeah in 2023 playing an actual PS2 on native res is rough, these emulators on PC are the best way to play these old games … the people who slave away building and polishing these emulators are an absolute god send and gift to me and all gamers. Just try it!
man.. when I saw the title I thought there is a new law out there that's going to wreck my hobby
😂😂😂 I thought the opposite.. I thought they were going to make it legal 😂
Do people really think emulation is piracy? I just assumed they meant obtaining free roms is piracy.
I just commented regarding this. The argument being made in this video misses the point. The argument he should be making is whether piracy can be legitimised in some circumstances.
Of peaple can sell weed peaple can buy a hdd with all the roms and sell the roms or even the emulators with it
If it weren't for emulation, there would just be so many amazing games I would have never got a chance to play. Actraiser, Soul Blazer, Alisa Dragoon, Ogre Battle 64, River City Ransom, Langrisser.. I mean, all games I went back and bought in some form or another.
Emulation is preservation.
Emulation does what Nintendont.
I agree that emulation and piracy are two totally different things. I've always believed in being able to play your whole library of purchased games no mater what the era. I remember the first time I ran emulators it was a NES, SNES, AND Genisis emulator on my Sega dreamcast. I thought to my self wow I have the ability to play all my games on one platform this is great. As the years passed emulation just got stronger and better. As those years passed I baught the newest systems and totes full of games. I am so thankful for where emulation is today so I can still play all of my old Backus instead of having to dust off my old consoles and games and fill a whole room with old tvs or adapters to play them although some times i do for nostalgia. Emulation is an all in one solution to play your whole purchased library over the years on one small convenient platform.
Yeah this debate is outdated. If you think it is, then don’t use it. People that use it don’t care. End of the discussion.
There's always someone new to the topic who will say something about it.
Yeah because without emulators we wouldn't be able to enjoy the games we wanna play!
Emulation is not piracy but are you gonna ignore the fact that a lot of pirates are hiding behind that term?
Funny part is without emulation, the nintendo classic wouldn't be made. It was obvious that rom and emulation set up was based on piracy before.
I still buy the games even thoughi have an original version.
If something is available for me to buy, then i dont emulate it. I feel its their property so they deserve to make money on it, no matter how old. But if i have no way to buy it, im going to emulate it
If you pay $300 for an original of Chrono Trigger off eBay, does the eBay seller turn around and cut a check for a portion of the sales to the developers? Lol no
And in turn in some cases the developer company doesn't even exist anymore or the original hardware is too complex and old to repair and be readily available. In which case emulation may be the only way the software or games can be preserved.
If its not being sold and their is no monetary gain or loss accredited to is not piracy. Saying that emulation is piracy only makes people want to emulate even harder.
Thank you for making this. Now I can just copy and paste the link to this video in those arguments on Twitter. Lol
Emulation never was piracy but even companies like Nintendo love to say so to scare off the untold.
Plus these days at least on PC it is rather easy to buy at least some ROMs legally, like SEGA MegaDrive/Genesis games on Steam or NeoGeo games on GOG which are actually the same files you would load into FinalBurnAlpha too.
I just dump the games I want to play on another hardware from my own physical collection and call it a day.
You couldn't be more wrong. I was there in the early days of emulation and you know what everyone did with emulators? Download games illegally and play them.
I didn’t hear a word you said as I was focusing on the gameplay, showing of some of your finest skills on Mario hidden levels. Well thanks for explaining and it makes sense, keep on gaming 👍🏾
This can’t be reiterated enough. Ignorance and stupidity are destructive. Keep fighting the good fight good sir.
edit* I wonder how many of these online ‘emulation is piracy’ trolls are irl retro video game dealers
Love it because you are right. Emulations and Piracy are two different things that warrant two different conversations! :)
If someone downloads a copy of Breath Of the Wild , it's piracy, if you get a copy of Ocarina of Time , you are celebrating the game. I feel that I emulate a LOT just before I go and buy old games. I feel that same effect may warrant actually having PHYSICAL medias. If no Physical releases exist , then I ask, What good are digital copies of games vs backups?
And it'll never be, we need to teach a lesson to these old men about that.
0:49 I get that you're probably emulating that SNES rom on Switch or PC, but that video background struck me as funny, cause that was an example of when Nintendo did sort of reprogram the NES games to run on the SNES. The original code is there, from what I understand anyhow, but it's been reworked and upgraded, not emulated. In that way it was one of the first remasters, since they're basically the same games just with a graphical overhaul.
That's possible with that game because the two consoles were similar enough that "a few" modifications to the code was enough to get it working.
The Trolls that say stuff like that come from a large family where they didn't get any attention as a child and are looking it for online.
I love emulation. I emulate a lot games. But I also buy re-released retro games(collections, aca neogeo, aca arcade archives, and even original physical games.) I hate how companies attack others when they won't re-release their older games.
i had no idea even with having a physical copy you do not have ownership. what an eye opener. This means every corporation
is guilty of fraud. We have been played like a fiddle! No court in this land should therefore uphold piracy claims because they are supposed to work for the people!
I wish everyone a Happy New Year,may the best wishes for all in the new year,..Happy 2024!! 🙏
Piracy is a bit of the appeal to me; I love the idea of “sticking it to the mab,” getting to play all these games “for free.”
*However I am not a lifelong gamer, never owned a home console, played PC games 25 years ago. I am completely aghast at the landscape of pay-to-play, micro transactions, high costs of games and hard ware. Cannot justify spending $1,000 on a PlayStation or Xbox, additional controller, some games, online access, etc. Currently playing GBA games on a $75 Powkiddy and my mind is blown.
Can’t believe this is still an argument in 2024…
And it will be until the end of times, thanks to corporate greed.
Well said. When it comes to this issue I pretty well say the same things you did. I use Nintendo and the NES for my argument as well. For example, in ‘94 Nintendo discontinued support of the NES. They wouldn’t discontinue it if it was of worth to Nintendo. So, if it’s discontinued, I can’t buy a new cartridge for the NES, and they think those old games are of no worth, then why are they so protective of a media they themselves treat as worthless?
I feel like any systems older than PS3 are ok to emulate. The companies arent marketing those systems any longer
I agree with your stance on emulation and as far a piracy (copies) goes for profit think of video game rentals.
i have never had an issue with Piracy some of the first games I ever played were pirated games on the commodore 64. I also believe writers, developers and companies deserve to get paid and they do. But look what Sony did to LIK-SANG was this right? Im with the hackers on 99% of the issues. its my opinion that the property owners are only going to get a certain % of the total game value and they should call the rest free advertising.
These companies never give you anything, they sell you the same games over and over again, usually worse or via buggy emulation. Download the ROMs and play emulators made by people who give a passion for retro gaming, unlike the corporations that don't care about how bad their games emulate. They only care about making money and that’s it. Own the originals, and at least you feel that you own a copy.
Yeah and then official new emulations lose licensed content and make changes you don't want
I remember emulating NES games on my Packard bell computer when nesticle was brand new.
I did this to play games I never saw anywhere and games that came out really late like kirbys adventure, DuckTales 2 and rescue rangers 2.
My friends and cousins were blown away at that.
@@marccaselle8108wow, I remember that emulator and also ZSnes, I had a mate asking me how I plugged SNES cartridges into my PC back in the day. 😂
I do it all and dont apologise.
If Emulation is piracy. Then that means Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft are pirates!
Emulation is NOT piracy... I for one do my best to rip my libraries so they outsurvive the hardware.
HOWEVER, I will also argue if the game is not available anymore, Im not against piracy either (far more against the "collector tax").
And on a similar note, Nintendo's answer of "We wont sell you the old games. At best you can rent them from us for a monthly fee" is absolute trash. Sell the roms... even if exclusive to yoru machine...
I emulate because i don't want to play games on tiny screens i want to play them on a pc monitor or tv. There's no way to do that officially with a ds , psp or 3ds or game gear.
If its not buyable it is not piracy that is my motto and if it's to expensive to be available for the masses it is not piracy but pirating nintendo games is always morally right
That’s not the way it works.
Capcom ported games to PS1 and PS2 (YES: Rockman/Megaman collections are ported there). Now it varies. Megaman Legacy Collection 1 - emulation, 2 - ports as I understand.
i am not much indie games to even download them
if emulation is piracy then game collecting is criminal for hiking the prices. most of us cant afford the physical copies, how can we relive the nostalgia. emulation really help alot
I do both so I don't care one way or the other.
If you emulate Twisted Metal for example and like it....when you can buy the newer one on console...you are likely to buy it. Piracy helps too. People want the original Pokemon game and not a rom. I think the pirates equal out sales lost. They will buy future games. Most are kids who can't buy, but when they get older and richer they do buy. I agree, buy and also "pirate"
Emulation is Piracy, if the software or hardware you are emulating is available for purchase through an official licenced retailer. Stealing software it's still stealing, you are not paying for getting access to someone elses work (time and effort).
I am a game dev myself, and I agree with game preservation, because i love gaming, so having a way to preserve software i think shouldn't be discussed, that needs to happen, as games and software are part of our history.
That being said, I will never condone people not paying for software that is readily available for purchase or access.
On the other hand, i think that any game that is no longer available for purchase should be given out for free as it no longer can give any revenue to the company and people that put work in it.
There is an argument to be made, that sometimes, having access to old software can damage the new software sell metrics, but thats it what it is, i think if you, as the company, don't want to give access to software that you released 15 years ago, then people should be entitled to have access to it, if its available and has been preserved on the internet or other mediums.
Now DRM is a whole different discussion as well, its a complicated topic, and i am not going to write everything of what i think, but i least i can give a small glimpse of my perspective and someone can agree or disagree :)
The only problem I have with emulation is the input lag compared to playing on original hardware.
I love physical media, i collect for the systems i have the only time i emulate it is if its my only last resort. Such as US copy and imported copies being crazy expensive. Or worst case scenario, it was never released in Japan... And i refuse to pay $500+ for a game... So thats when i emulate it...
🎄⛄🎁🎅 All the best for New year 2024! Billions of views and subscribers!
I totaly agree Ron Emulation only becomes Piracy when its sold for profit OR its ripping off current software but if its for games 30 or more years old on dead consoles OR the game are translations of Japan Only games translated to English or another Language giving people world wide right to play the games for THE 1ST TIME and it is kept as a private collection much like Banned DVDS are then. People DO NOT pay for old nes and snes games anymore unless they collect them in cart form and I own a LOT of nes and SNES Japan only games in English and enjoy playing them a lot. Even Sega Genesis-Mega Drive games had Japan Only games and for myself that is Sega's true library of games. Japan underestimates the West way too much. We are as skilled as they are in games esp. Americans AND THAT IS FACT.
Skill comes from training and experience, not from country of origin.
@@videostash413 Tell THAT to Japan. They don't think we have the ability to play their games and that is total BULLSH*T. These games are NOT ROCKET SCIENCE. Anyone regardless of race can pick up and learn. Hell Man I HAVE AUTISM For christ's sake yet I learned the games. It is as plain as the nose on your face they never want the world to know these games exist
@@videostash413 You dont get the skill or experience if the games are not available in your country
emulation is only piracy if the game cannot be reasonably obtained. If you want to play commodore 64s go to town, but if you are emulating a ps5 to play games without paying, its theft.
In the grand scheme, no, it isn't. In my case, it definitely was piracy lol But I was a kid and couldn't get all the games I wanted to play. Plus the untranslated SNES games I got to play because of the community
If you can't purchase it, you can't pirate it. I see no issue at all with emulating older games that aren't available. If there's a way to purchase a game that I want to play, then I'll do it. Nintendo could easily make a bunch of money by making their older games available, but they're dead set on barely ever releasing older games.
I bought every nintendo switch game for my nephew except the Wario and mario party. Even bought 3 odyssey. If I want to play them I feel it's a legal backup.
I heard that when R-type 1 and 2 came out on PS1 they actually did reprogram the game from scratch to run on a PS1. But yeah 99% of the time emulation is used
Emulation is what makes gaming interesting and much more fun! Especially when all company’s are starting to go to an all digital future which sucks. Emulation is saving gaming from the community that really appreciate it!
Retro: It's Historical curation! The future proofing 🧾 of childhood memories! So bit me ! 🤔🧐🤨🤪🤪🤪🤪🤪
Emulation is just another way to say "Virtual Machine" IMO. When you run VirtualBox on Linux to virtualise Win98 to play your old games; you're using software to replicate a hardware environment to run software not intended for the hosting system.
Gee... that sounds identical to how emulators are software that replicates a hardware environment to run software not intended for the system running the emulator...
Only the plastic box cult thinks that. Not to be confused with console gamers. They're separate breeds.
If it was pirating a modern or recently released game, yeah that'd be wrong to do, and it's especially scummy if someone is pirating from a new and upcoming indie developer, but if it's from ancient hardware from the NES, SNES, Genesis, Atari 2600, I don't see what's the big issue of having access to stuff that long since been abandoned and inaccessible for decades. There's also an asshat in the Steam forums of Sonic Origins who adamantly believes that buying _legitimate second-hand retail games_ "is illegal"... There are some people on Steam forums and social media with the most stupidest takes with not only emulations, but just legally obtaining a _used_ game. I still find it really hypocritical and two-faced Nintendo is with emulating, they'll sue or forcibly take down a ROM site for hosting games from their systems yet they use glorified rental systems with the Switch Online games that are based on emulation. Hell, they worked with the emulation gurus M2 back then for the Virtual Console emulation for certain platforms on the Wii U.
Sadly not all emulation devs are being honest about preserving access to older games, like the RPCS3 developers; from my personal experience, they have been incredibly passive-aggressive towards me for wanting to try out the PlayStation 3 version of the Doom: Classic Complete collection out of curiosity since John Carmack worked on this particular collection and I legally own all of the classic Doom games on PC and Switch, but the RPCS3 would not help me with problems I was having with their emulator and then locked down a thread I made on Github to pass when I called them out on it while another user gloating that they had no issue about their overrated emulator. Maybe it's a good thing I'm poor since I don't end up supporting shitty and hypocritical developers like them if they're this adamant against piracy yet their software is emulating games that not many people have legal access to since it has been discontinued and may not even care if they are pirating a game or not as long as the games they want to play is accessible without original hardware.
Emulation is awesome! Not everyone has access to buy games physically! Just play video games and enjoy!!! It’s businesses lookout what is right or what is not! Not general public! We are just consumers!
I don't care if it is or isn't I don't feel guilty. I think they will be alright with me not paying for 30 year old games.
Piracy is fine after a certain time. God gave them the skill and they got paid well for it, usually. I downloaded Switch games I don't own, I didn't play them more than a few minutes. I just wanted too see if it's worth buying. I collect physical for my Switch. My largest collect is on my Switch. I have about 5-10 games I want to buy for my collection, already at 30 or so. I'm gonna have to buy twice for some digital games I bought since Nintendo doesn't keep servers up. Maybe I pirated movies or songs before, but if I did...I was broke and had no intention on buying it. I remember copying music on cassette from the radio. Quit being greedy, eventually I turned into a customer.
FYI I'm speaking as a character who agrees with some piracy and a collector. It's for a book I'm thinking about writing.
lol why any Karen would possibly care is beyond me
I refuse to emulate games. Which is why I own a bunch of roms and Everdrives 😂
😆 whatever floats yer gaming boat right? I love using original consoles with flashcarts. No right or wrong answers when it comes to how we play retro games.
@@Madlittlepixel 100% agree. That was more tongue in cheek. I have zero problem with emulation or how anyone plays games. As Gamestop said originally (lol), "Power to the players!"
I have 1 reason why I emulate. That is because some of these days my N64 is going to stop working. Permanently. How am I going to play with my games if my N64 stops working?
Happy New Year to you and your loved ones.
i cannot connect my console on my 4k monitor. no emulation. no ability to play the games i bought and own!
We offer the company money to re release certain games so we can still play them.... They refuse... So that's why pirates are now all in and I'm in for it 😁👍
I’m glad emulation exist to play retro classic (the original systems and games are getting more expensive and who no’s how long it works!)Besides that there are a lot of games that never came to console only to be in arcades or didn’t released in some country’s.In my opinion is piracy a thing if you’re talking about recent games (Nintendo switch,PS5,Xbox One and series S and X including pc.
The day Nintendo Sony ect stop shutting down their online stores that’s the day I’ll stop emulating getting tired of buying games and can’t download them anymore after they shut the store down. Physical only for me now or emulation.
Emulation on a smartphone is dope. I dont care what anybody says.
I meet a lot of people at work. It isn't surprising that most of them are gamers. Games have become even more popular than movies with most people. What I've come to discover in my conversations is most people don't understand what emulation actually is or how to do it. They're ignorant in all the ways you can get, make, and access a ROM. Some even choose to remain ignorant after you try to explain that you converted your legit Gameboy carts into roms using a cart flasher like a Krikzz, Smartboy, JRodrigo, BennVenn, the list goes on. There are so many ways to rip your LEGIT games for emulation without download, that it has slowly become laughable to me how people choose not to understand, and in some cases just jump on their fanboy horse and say "If Nintendo doesn't like it, I don't like it." I think in the back of their heads though, they don't want to have to figure out how to emulate so they get jealous, ("If I CaN't hAvE It thEn THey shOuLDN't EITHER").
I've been using emulator since on my old computer and then current 2014 of my computer (10 or almost 10 years for now on, with SSD added just for OS system drive, but my harddrive still retain to use for data and other hard drive for a game). And yes for emulator, played NES for example like i did on another, like Famiclone. Chinese NES (Famicom) bootleg. I remember play the Famiclone, and that because back then when was a kid i didn't get into a PlayStation until there was someone playing it and have myself enjoy and play as well with move on from a Famiclone.
you are so right man...
I think the important thing to think though is that a lot of people that emulate DO pirate. so much so people correlate the two together which most of the time they aren't wrong. when it comes to certain things like the Switch with DRM and User agreement Nintendo has with it. Any kind of Switch emulation is pirating. Due to the only way of aqcuiring a ROM for the Switch is to break their terms you agree to when buying the Switch. Same can be said for DS and 3DS. Another important note that is that even when you buy a physical copy, YOU DO NOT OWN THE GAME. YOU PURCHASED A LICENSE TO PLAY THE GAME. The ruling that allowed emulation in the US by the way, was made in an era that wasn't as digital as it is now. If the topic would go to court today I believe that emulation would actually become illegal or make it harder to emulate legally. With Nintendo Switch Online and PS+ adding classics to their subscription. It absolutely does mean that they are losing out on potential money when it comes to people emulating classics.
Nesticle for the win. The emulator that got me access to overseas NES games back in the days.
Me too. In the mid 90s, I used nesticle, a2600, genecyst, colem, freeintv, and others to enjoy systems i and games I never had
I forgot zsnes, and callus, and neorage x too. 🙂