Vintage Story explicitly credits TFC as its basis for inspiration, the devs are all very aware of this and everyone is on perfectly good terms. This is a non issue.
@@topminator2991 Especially since there's actually a Minecraft mod Vintagecraft that was done by VS devs before they've decided to make their own engine. And didn't see anyone complaining about Vintagecraft being stolen back when it was developed (and I've followed MC drama channels at that time). Not sure whether TFC or VC came first, but I don't think that matters much since devs of both decided to just shake hands and not to be a-holes about it.
The parallels are too strong to say otherwise. I played through TFC and TFC-TNG and now dipped my toes into VS. The only way the creative concepts can coexist is my recognising the existence of their predaseors. I'm glad that they all exist, and that their creators remain kind and civil about their overlaps.
You cant steal a mod by making something similar. Thats not how shit works. They shouldnt even have to credit TFC whatsoever considering they did NOTHING to create VS
TFC still feels like it's just a revamped Minecraft, while Vintage Story has managed to establish its own identity and completely immerse me in its world. One of Minecraft's weakest aspects, to me, is its lack of direction and consistency; it really just feels like a hodgepodge of random features at this point.
And Minecraft's lack of direction has only gotten worse over the past couple years. Meanwhile, VS is an indie team committed to the vision. Its really outgrown its beginnings to become something truly breathtaking and promising.
@@StuffandThings_ THIS. Everyone debating and asking why old Minecraft was better is not because the actual game is "better", but the old devs had a VISION for their game, the game had a purpose. Now it's just random additions and with every new update the game feels like a kitchensink modpack.
@@Exis247 The problem is lore, MC is meant to be a sandbox, that is what it thrived at. Now they are trying to build an RPG exploration game out of a sandbox game and failing at both.
To be honest, this is a problem in the survival game genre as a whole. Other games that add these features don't do progression to such an interactive degree like TFC or Vintage Story do. TFC was truly the first survival "game" that managed to make stone knapping, leatherworking, farming, and metalworking more interactive than simply selecting a recipe and waiting for the result to be crafted. Other games like 7 Days to Die or SCUM simply have crafting menus that all look the same no matter the workstation used, and they all use the same style of crafting via clicking what you want crafted and waiting for the timer to count down. TFC made what other games couldn't get right possible. By making most of the crafting systems interactive in such a way as they did, it made progression actually feel nice. However, this was all still through Minecraft, meaning that with each MC update, the mod would have to change and adapt, either leaving behind old features or completely changing current ones. Plus, most of the crafting is still done through UIs and menus, not because of stylistic choice or simplicity, but because of it being a Minecraft mod still. Vintage Story saw what TFC did, figured out what it could do to further improve and add upon, and did it all in their own engine. They even have the game's source code publicly available for modders and bug fixers to use when making new mods or when making new updates. In this sense, there's no plagiarism or wrongdoing from TFC or from Vintage Story at all. It's simply a progression in how video games are made. Vintage Story isn't even the first to do this. Garry's Mod, DayZ, PUBG, and more all started off as mods for other games before branching off and becoming their own games later on. People never got mad or defensive when those games took off. It's really just a problem with the Minecraft community being overly critical and argumentative when they don't even have all the facts and examples laid out to do so. People really need to just let this go tbh.
This very well put! I haven't played the minecraft mod in question but Vintage Story finally recaptured that spark Minecraft started before letting fade. I've tried various mods and just standard up to date Minecraft but I've always bounced off within a few hours, however Vintage Story has already given me a good 100-120 hours of enjoyment. No matter how close it may be to what came before or other mods, having something so well put together that gives me enjoyment with minimal jank is all I ask for. Also, sorry 😅 I started rambling and this isn't very connected to your comment. At the end of the day, people should just play what they enjoy without going after others for doing the same ^,w,^
The fact that both games are good, the cost pretty much the same and both can be cracked(but it’s better to buy to support devs) Minecraft is good for multiplayer experience(single player sometimes really boring, unless u found a new mod pack or started creating Paris tower from diamond blocks in hardcore.) Vintage story is made for modding directly, installing mods is just a few clicks and no need for 5min reload each time u want to remove a mod. The mods for it have lots of enchanting options and even mechanic overhaul, the are even some very good mods that add more content connected with “Temporality”. Take a look at rustbound magic or primitive survival, which adds endgame content with “Temporality”. VS is much better optimized, but Minecraft can also be played with normal fps even on weak PCs, so we shouldn’t quarrel about what more enjoyable, but just enjoy best of both worlds.
@@alexanderrahl7034 7 days has the issue of the horde quickly going from threat to annoyance. I think if they uppled the complexity just a tad for some stuff, especially making structures require a stricter support system to invalidate the old build above a pit of spinning blades atrategy, would honestly do it some justice.
If I recall correctly, he DID get permission from Terrafirmacraft to use the textures in vintagecraft. Which was more of a similar mod to Terrafirmacraft. Much like how the Create mod is similar to Ugocraft. People don't realize this fact... Create was the EXACT same situation here.
Its not the "EXACT same situation". Create didnt branch off and become its very own, separate game. But with that being said, I do understand what you are referring to. VC is just a better, more well and cohesively developed game in my opinion.
There is a difference between copying and taking inspiration from something... Vintage Story is _clearly_ inspired by Minecraft, but that doesn't make it Minecraft. The same is true for TFC. You can take ideas from other things and expand upon them, but that doesn't make it a blatant ripoff.
Having played Vintage Story for a long time, it really is its own thing, so far removed with its own identity. It is it's own thing. There is a difference between a mod for an existing game and a fully fledged standalone game with their own unique design.
I genuinely do not understand why some gamers instead of being happy that a new game came out and it's similar to a game they love, choose to be angry and personally offended. "How dare you STEAL from my favorite game?!?" is their go-to attitude and it confuses me. The whole "copying" "stealing" "___ game is a ___ ripoff" doesn't make sense to me. If some developer "copies" Terraria and makes another content rich and highly replayable pixel crafting exploration game you won't see me complaining. I wouldn't give a fuck if it was a near 1:1 game as long as they add enough content to the game to make it feel fresh and new. Give me MORE games that I like, not less is my motto.
I was playing a homo sapiens waterworld game on VS yesterday, while i overheard my father listening to something about neanderthals and what our ancestors had to suffer through because of them. Made me realize the Homo sapiens mode would massively benefit from the addition of other human tribes, and a reskin of Drifters into neanderthals that hunt and kill other humans.
It's very silly to excuse one game from stealing another while both just simulate irl mechanics?? Those are not the only games that do those things as well. It's like saying Fortnite stole from minecraft cuz fortnite has sky...
@@TheGeekFactor No, more like that Fortnite "plagiarised" PUBG since both games have similar gameplay, and by the same logic Vintage Story "plagiarised" TFC since both games also have similar gameplay.
@@TheGeekFactor Sidenote, I know this is off topic, but I recommend you check out bugmancx's minecraft Journey series. His videos are very well made and fun to watch.
It genuinely boils down to: Vintage Story did copy TFC's basic concepts, but refined them and built upon them in a way no minecraft mod ever could, especially in this refined a fashion. Continued below for further thoughts It's team is also much more friendly than vanilla minecraft and clearly cares deeply about their game and its community. It also just simply looks and runs better because it has its own engine. Honestly, Minecraft and TFC could learn from Vintage Story's approach, and I can't actually think of much that minecraft has that vintage story doesn't or doesn't plan to have, apart from Redstone; At least when it comes to things that would fit in both games. Additionally, Vintage Story's modding community is only just getting off the ground but already has some amazing and unique mods, some of which are far more unique than almost any minecraft mod I've seen; And again, it's only just starting for comparatively.
A while back when I saw a TFC+ Video here on youtube I read a lil bit on it since was confused. TFC 2 was planned by Bioxx to update TFC past 1.8 seperate from TFC:TNG, but he quit modding and the Vintage Story Team was supposedly planning on taking over, before pivoting to just make it their own game. From what I recall, generally old TFC had quite a lotta performance issues so its entirely possible that was their reasoning for not using it as a base to develop their idea. Clearly took inspiration and to begin with had some involvement in developing TFC, but yk they're doing their own thing and they started doing that in a time where TFC was undergoing a change in Dev Teams and forking into slightly different alterations.
Never understood this aversion to copying, if you can do something better, then do it better. I love TFC, I spent many hours playing it. However it's patch worked into an existing game which caused very obvious performance issues and bugs. Where as VS has been developed from the ground up to work the way it's intended to work. It's not like the devs of TFC are losing out as they are not making money from their mod and even if they were that's just how the world works, if you offer something better people will prefer you over the worse alternative.
Vintage Story isn't also just a Game, they build a whole unique Engine around it and the "Game" Vintage Story is just a Mod in this Engine. Like if TFC would not only be a Mod in Minecraft, but the Mod team would have build Minecraft to play TFC.
("This is just Terrafirma Craft, But Uglier." - random Vintage Story Hater comment) I played TerrafirmaCraft, and i watched videos about Vintage Story, and honestly, that guy is trash-talking. quality-wise in terms of visual, Vintage is better, and in gameplay too and the monsters in Vintage makes sense at least and has a reason (when i played TerrafirmaCraft, i assumed that TerraFirma is supposed to be IRL Minecraft, but i dunno which version (modpack) that i played that suddenly spawned armored zombies and weird stuff in the middle of the night, breaking the realistic vibe of Terrafirma...)
TFC in recent version like 1.18 didn't spawn vanilla mod above ground, instead they keep adding passive hostile animals like lion/bear/dog/wolf/etc for the same function.
@@CrickBrittI mean it seems okay, though I’ve always stuck with Minecraft more due to both me liking the game, and because of mods, vintage story just seems alright but not something I’d defiantly play over Minecraft.
Vintage Story holds it's own and has it's own unique identity. It's like when artists use reference - it isn't copying or plagiarism, it's just inspiration used to make a unique work. Both also take heavy inspiration from real life processes, which isn't something that can exactly be "stolen" in any way. Nobody 'invented' the idea to knap stones into tools, 'invented' metallurgy, or 'invented' the ages of human progression. Also, Vintage Story's lore and story is completely unique. Really, the two are completely separate and unique.
Plagiarism is much focus today. Why not just stop making thesis and battle for authenticity. They made it to gate keep and overthrow to social media so the people think they are the only reliable.
vintage story runs on it's own engine, which let's the team do a lot with it. it also allows mod devs to make some cool stuff. i know the plan is to eventually have an end game as far as a long term goal to shoot for as well as more lore to explain what has happened. you can already find out a lot about the world.
the idea that a Mod or a standalone game owns the concept of a very common idea is absurd. VS as well as TFC are both evolutions of the core MC experience and should be treated as equals rather than competitors. If the Devs of VS decided to trademark "their" mechanics, then I'd have a problem but as it stands there is nothing wrong with both existing.
my guy... primitive survival, stone knapping, charcoal burning, prospecting, metalurgy, pottery, and all the mechanics in the game were not invented by any game. these things were used by the man kind since we stared eating cooked meat and our brains got bigger. so nobody can claim these as their own unique mechanic even if its the first game to implement such mechanic.
I don't think it needs as much of a revamp as people seem to think it does... Minecraft is _Minecraft,_ its not just a survival game. Building, creativity, adventuring, and exploration is more of a focus than its survival aspects, and that's not a bad thing.
@@NephelangeloI completely agree! I'd been playing Minecraft since beta 1.2 is January of 2011. Throwing out Minecraft was incredibly easy when I discovered vintage story!
both did it great imo, they both take inspiration from each other and i think that's amazing though who did it better is personal preference, i actually haven't played TFC yet, i should try it some time soon.
primitive survival, stone knapping, charcoal burning, prospecting, metalurgy, pottery, and all the mechanics in the game were not invented by any game. these things were used by the man kind since we stared eating cooked meat and our brains got bigger. so nobody can claim these as their own unique mechanic even if its the first game to implement such mechanic.
@@TheGeekFactor sorry i copied over my comment and forgot to remove the "my guy..." The target of my comment are pepole who pause the video after the first 30 seconds and go wage war in the comment section I did watch your video and i liked it very much.
I modded minecraft on my own and ended achieving a similar result to TFC and VS mechanics, minus the stone knapping. I guess it's simply logical to have these mechanics because, lo and behold, we've did that irl to get were we are atm.
Anything involving survival and voxels could easily be called a "minecraft ripoff". Vintage story isn't stolen off anything, it's based off minecraft, and may or may not have some similar features some other mod has. But nothing is stolen.
I mean Minecraft could just as easily be called a "ripoff". Notch did NOT invent voxels and minecraft was not the first voxel game nor was it the first survival game. Minecraft only popularized the voxel system
If we gonna use the logic that Vintage Story stole ideas from TFC instead of being inspired by it, then we could also say that Minecraft stole the core features of Infiniminer which is placing and breaking cubic blocks and some other stuff.
Hey, imitation is the most sincere form of flattery, is it not? I see no issue here with TFC and any "beef" between the two projects, but I have to agree with the common sentiment: I, too, said "This is Terrafirma Craft, but nicer!" when I saw this for the first time. What I will say, though, is that TFC has a different "feel" to VT, mostly because you can TELL it is a "mod" for Minecraft, while VT delivers the same experience in a...say, "bespoke" fashion: The entire engine is created for that singular vision, while TFC heavily modifies the framework of an existing game. That's also where I want to note, that while TFC is free, Minecraft is not. Therefore you technically have to "pay" for both experiences in the end. That said, one last thing I HAVE to mention is mod integration: Minecraft mods already struggle with this old Java-Brick, but VT has been not only smooth sailing with mods, but has its own dedicated modbase AND in-game installation of mods! You can really tell the developer knows well where he came from, if he made modding and adding mods such a priority this "early" in development.
Notch had planned a proper modding api for Minecraft before Microsoft forced bedrock edition to be the "main" version, which is now about to lose all mod support making Java edition all the more superior. Such a shame Microsoft has done so little with Minecraft other than make spin offs and rather bland updates surpassed by mods.
@@CommanderRedEXE Microsoft is a corporation, down to being its own conglomerate almost. By its very nature control is what they crave and modding would take away that control. "Bedrock" is their "Main" version, what they commercially try to bank on for the future. Java is relegated as offshoot, hence modding is less of an issue there, from the standpoint of what's in their business interests. Spinoffs are new revenue streams and what is done with MC Bedrock is calculated via business prognosises and market evaluations. "Gameplay" and being "pro-player" are nothing which interest beyond the barest minimum, buzzwords and surface-level considerations.
Minecraft runs much better in 1.20 onwards, several improvements were made to the game engine and the lightning engine. And the most recent versions run on the jvm 21, and the boost is quite noticeable. Just to clarify. Yes, 1.7.10 was awfully laggy.
Vintage story engine is just miles ahead of Minecraft though. And the way your able to mod and and create models is seriously so easy on VS. Minecraft has an insanely large dev team and financial backing but lacks any type of drive. Leading to a terribly boring game now a days
For my PC, Minecraft runs like butter until 1.12.2. Then the FPS gets SHIT even with Optifine until 1.20, were both the Vanilla and the new mods like Sodium make it run better... but still worse than 1.12 optifined
I guessed both, as I know both(I know VS better than TFC, but I still know TFC). didn't know TFC was older, but I could've checked myself if I cared for the "he stole my ideas" debate on things that are already heavily inspired by something else(same attitude I had with the Palworld vs Pokemon debate). most of those mechanics were taken as part of historical research into real human progression through the stone, copper, bronze and iron ages and can be used in real life if you want to. there are a few differences like how crucibles require something more specialized than a simple campfire to be used, even for copper, but all in all they are very close to authentic early human technology.
I tried TFC before and hated it. Didnt even play 20 minutes. Ive played VS for a hundred hours already probably. There must be a very meaningful difference otherwise I would not have diametrically opposed reactions to either game.
Things like pottery and metalwork are just part of a natural progression. How can you steal history? Would it be a better game if it called clay wibblewobble and copper shiny rock?
Makes game with in-game systems that mirror real-world techniques and technologies "YOU'RE STEALING IDEAS FROM A MINECRAFT MOD!", also the mod isn't even in the hands of the original mod developers anymore, so I highly doubt they even care about the similarities.
I was planing to play TFC when i first saw an video about it, but after watching your review i needed to try and i can't stop playing, im a big fan of gacha games like hsr and i haven't played for a week straight bc of Vintage Story, all the progress feels so much rewarding and meaningful like i never felt in any other game. Terraria had a similar feeling but after a while i just played in full auto mode
This reminds me when Terraria came out. Some people said it was a Minecraft rip-off. I can still remember when Mojang was based and added "Try Terraria" in the menu messages.
At the end of the day, it doesnt actually matter. If 75% of the ideas in VS were taken from TFC, that doesnt matter a lick. Because of one important thing. VS, is a standalone game, and TFC is a mod. Those who make the "with a new coat of paint" argument, are simply ignorant to game design. Not a bad thing, its not essential knowledge. But theyre clearly ignorant of the immense time and work that goes in to building a standalone game over a mod. The mod gets to work with minecraft as a base game. The standalone, has to build everything from the ground up. The mod has to code its new features. The standalone has to code _everything_ In this way, TFC took a marker to the Mona Lisa, added a hat, gave her bags under her eyes, painted her nails and drew a ship in the backround. VS on the otherhand, bought a canvas, paint supplies, and recreated the Mona Lisa, while also including those things and a bit more. TFC posted it to their deviant art page for free VS sold it as an original work. Saying VS "stole from" TFC is to say TFC "stole from" Minecraft. But folks wont say that. Because both are ignorant and ridiculous statements. The VS devs put way more time and effort into their product. Anyone can come up with ideas. Fewer can make them a reality on an already existing work. And fewer still can make the reality from scratch. It doesnt matter to me, because the VS devs made a game, not a mod, and it has its own identity
I think vintage story has much nicer and immersive natural world generation, plus as someone who loves geology i love all the different rock types and and ores and how they generate in a realistic manner
The features of the game in the mod reflects mechanics from real life that makes sense in our fun and so you’re going to have over lab there it’s like saying oh smash Bros Tekken and streetfighter are all the same because they’re all fighting games with fighting game mechanics
I mean yeah that was basically my first thought when I first saw vintage story. It looks very similar to TFC. Though when I started playing vintage story myself I realised how different it is from Minecraft. It's dark atmosphere, lore and mysterious creatures make up for an entire new gaming experience which makes vintage story a truly unique game. Yes, I get the argument around TFC and vintage story...but I also totally agree with you.
The fact that you buy it you own it. Should have everyone buying it. Guess who is going to be gaming when the internet blacks out? People who play Vintage Story.
Hey. Have you heard of TFC+? It's basically TFC but taken to an even more realistic level. It's a bit niche but I fundamentally believe that it is the best version of the mod that exists out there, and actually more than anything, vintage story reminds me of TFC+ moreso.
Just for you know. At the start of VS they tried to contact the authors of TFC, which had been abandoned for some time (at that time). And as far as I know, they never got an answer. In any case, although some mechanics are similar, but not in all respects, and the further you go along the progression - the more differences you will see. For example, blacksmithing or steelmaking is seriously different from TFC. But yes, the game was inspired by TFC (TFC Plus) and does not hide it
The people who made VS did contact the TFC people… and they did get a response. I show the reddit post where the TFC devs confirm they talked to the VS devs
7:49 I was not looking at the screen so I can’t be influenced by that. I have never played TFC and that did not entirely sound like what I thought it was, but I will still guess the correct answer is “both” for everything you said there.
Another thing about vintage story is that I believe the devs have stated they want to minimize UI based crafting and have even more in world crafting than the current knapping, clay forming and smiting
TFC is honestly the closest thing I have to Vintage Story right now, and I enjoy watching both because they both are so directly interactive with HOW you craft things.
Thats impossible considering technically blizzard owns the rights to all mods made from/for its games. How can someone sue blizzard for taking stuff from a mod on their own game lol
While on the surface VS and TFC are very similar, I would say VS is a far more cohesive and fluent experience. It feels like it has much more of a focus, and respect towards deeper immersion. Tyron has said VS is only about 10% complete, and has stated that he would like to be able remove the crafting grid entirely someday, in favor of more immersive in world crafting, which is already a huge difference from other similar games. TFC and VS are similar, but extremely different once you look a bit deeper.
usually i just click the dont recommend this channel on youtube when i see some salacious headline or thumbnail (I dont really care for the videos on average when someone is making a wild claim). I'm glad i gave this video a shot. as far as whether the game's idea was stolen i guess doesnt really matter since the devs on both sides dont care (which if there were to be some kind of take down or DMCA, would 100% require)
I’ve thought about the price of Vintage Story now… It’s as expensive as an average McDonald’s meal… except it’s 10000x more worth it, and a life-time investment.
TL;DR The various settings and world customization screen when you create a world is a huge deal and probably the best part of Vintage Story. And free mods is always a bonus! I love the versatility of Vintage Story and can play it non-stop for days--no, months! One hundred people might use the same world seed, but get totally different worlds unless they select the exact same settings. Sure, there might be a ruined village to the south and a large deposit of surface copper to the north, but it's not always guaranteed, and they're almost never at the exact same coordinates. And the ruined village might change to one of several variations. I suck at fighting mobs, but do pretty good at everything else. I can lower the mob HP and how hard the mobs hit. Mobs can be aggressive/attack when you come within their detection range, passive/they will only attack you if you attack them, or docile/they will never attack the player no matter what the player does. Young kids can start with the easiest settings and, as they get older and more experienced, they can adjust the settings to be more challenging with every new world they create. Getting into using mods is super easy--pretty much plug in and play, but I do recommend playing without mods in the beginning to find out what you feel the game lacks or to make the game more accessible for people with issues that might make it hard for them to play video games. For example, I find the vanilla world to be empty of places to explore. It has lots of caves and several ruins, but not much loot that you want as you progress through the metal ages. And, except for the various traders, it lacks civilization. I want a much "busier" world. So, I add the Better Ruins mod, The Dungeon mod, and the Underground Mines mod to give me more ruins and places to explore (and fight). More loot, too! I also use the VS Villager mod with its two sub mods to spawn working villages that I can visit, take over as my own, or I can create an item that will allow me to create a village of my own. I have to build the buildings my villagers live in. This gives me opportunities to show off the loot I've collected and place them in these buildings, giving them a more post-apocalyptic touch. I added the Still Useful Stuff mod mainly for it's Welcome Mat which will spawn one of the vanilla traders for a day every few days as if they are visiting your base, or you can set up a place for them to spawn in your village. The Welcome Mat is great if you don't have any nearby vanilla game traders, or you haven't found certain traders you need items from. This way, you don't have to travel for literal game days to find or get to them. You never know which type of trader is going to show up, what they have to offer, or what they will buy from you. It's like a fun roulette. You never know until they show up! And you can have more than one welcome mat. Currently, I plan to have an inn in my village with rooms that have welcome mats in them to make it appear to be a functioning inn. As the traders show up, I "shop" their wares, and then they leave after a meal and provide currency to pay for their stay. As long as you fill the necessary requirements for the welcome mat traders, you can slowly build up currency if you don't buy anything from them. There is a huge amount of items you can find in ruins or trade with the traders ranging from food products, clothes and jewelry, weapons and tools, rare building materials, hard to find resources, and more. There are also mods for people who have accessibility issues like low manual dexterity, epilepsy, sound or motion issues, or other special issues that might make it harder to play video games or use a computer keyboard or mouse doing repetitive tasks aka repetitive strain injuries. I've seen people who have carpal tunnel playing VS using these accessibility mods. They couldn't stream on Twitch, but they would record themselves playing for as little as five minutes at a time. Then upload these unedited, short twenty-minute videos. It kept their subscribers happy to see some content from a favorite RUclipsr and brought in some income even while they were recovering from their injury.
Glad you did this follow up. And VS is really a great game-it’s not fast, there’s no instant gratification, you have to be ready to spend time and go through multiple processes to create something (leather backpacks, I’m looking at you!) but when you finally finish making something it’s a lot more rewarding. And the mods are great, so imaginative and fun and useful and, well, you just have to try it first yourself.
The idea that one game could "steal" the idea of survival from another, whichever degree of realism, is a young (immature, but i cant blame them) thought to me. Notch himself said his goal was to try and do a 3D dwarf fortress, much like what TFC claims to attempt. In this case its a matter of depth, TFC and Vintage Story both have a similar level of depth to their survival aspects, and carry the boons and drawbacks of a 3D First Person video game. Theres more to this, of course, so much more than whats presented, while DF has adventure mode, its not so easy to immerse yourself, and its deep survival aspects truly come out in fortress mode if you look closely, for a more focused, single player-character survival game, Cataclysm Dark Days Ahead (CDDA) and its branches has you in a very realistic post apocalyptic survival setting (especially innawoods) which lets you advance at least to vehicles and firearms from nothing. Theres certainly deeper, more intricate and obscure projects out there but thats a rabbit hole I elected to not dive down. My point is there is no ownership over the survival setting, any survival setting, all a survival setting does is add another layer of similarity to the life you live daily, or could be living in a different time period or fictional work.
Here's my thoughts on Vintage Story as someone who has purely seem gameplay of it. ...I think it's genuinely interesting. I think it's genuinely a really cool game. I'd love to get into it but I don't have the money, nor do I have the PC, for it. While I'm not the BEST at Survival games... I genuinely do think I'd get into Vintage Story. Not because of the gameplay but I guess... how it FEELS. I think my problem with some games is that I just don't feel it sometimes. Minecraft is a game that I've played and... I'm ambivalent on as a game I'd like to play. As a game I like to watch? Oh it's fun, pretty damn fun to watch. Vintage Story might be one of those games where when I sit down and play it. I automatically feel it, I feel how great it is. And when I get down to it... I'll probably end up doing a lot in that game. But that's my general assumption... in the end; Vintage Story feels so distinct. That I can't reasonably compare that much to minecraft. I can even partially get into why it feels so distinct from Minecraft. It feels less... disconnected in a sense with some gameplay. Minecraft has a lot of content, oceans of items... but it's about as deep as a puddle with some of them. Sure Redstone Engineering is pretty big, sure you can do a lot with automation but... it feels like some stuff is also just lacking in that department. Yeah you can build a lot but... you can only build SO MUCH before you start to kinda wanna crave something else. At least in my opinion. Vintage Story feels way more connected. What it probably lacks in content, I'm not sure do not quote me on that, it has in depth. You can really see how much the resources you are given matter to heavily. Clay will carry you HEAVILY into so many parts of the game. Same with storage, same with many of the blocks you use, same with armor. You can do so. Much. In the end; Vintage Story is its own distinct masterpiece. It works because even IF it isn't like Minecraft in so many aspects... that's not a bad thing. That's a great thing in my opinion... anyway yeah you're free to ignore my thoughts because I have not played this game.
I'm really glad that someone finally had the will to make s video about this topic. I've seen and have wondered myself plenty of time if these games had the same developers or something like that. I still haven't played Vintage Story, but I'm eager to give it a try.
The only possibly valid reason to criticise Vintage Story having copied mechanics would be that it's paid instead of free, not that they copied game mechanics in and of itself. There is nothing wrong with copying game mechanics, that's how innovation and better games are made.
I've played both and I actually prefer Vintage Story a lot more, I really enjoyed how interactive the knapping was for clay and stone tools and thats an important part of the early/mid game. Terrafirmacraft had some great ideas, but was limited by the minecraft engine with it's execution which left it a little lacking to me. Currently 80+ hours deep in my Vintage Story world.
Before i get further into the video and see your claims and reasoning, i want to say my piece. TFC is the "free" tutorial to Vintage Story. (I say free because most people own mc by now and at least own java) Vintage Story utilizes mechanics that just arent possible in mc, such as in-world knapping/smithing, as well as, i hope crafting, down the line. TFC is definitely similar, but its more a mod based off of it rather than Vintage Story copying it.
saying Vintage Story copied TFC is like saying Cyberpunk copied GTA, they are all unique and enjoyable experiences in their own right, survival mechanics are semi based off real survival mechanics but in a gamified form, there isn't an infinite number of different ways to make survival mechanics that are fun and enjoyable and still faithful
My guess is that you were talking about both games, with the only thing to throw me off being the detail of watering cans, as I don't remember there being any in TFC.
Vintage Story reminding me of TFC is one of the main reasons I got so easily and heavily into VS. TFC is a great mod and I have spent hours upon hours in it, but as mentioned in the video - modding minecraft can kind of be a pain and the game itself runs kinda meh. VS offers an even better experience in similar vein and runs better to boot.
Heard of Better Than Wolves? (A MC modpack, that tried to atempt what TFC did. Also known as the hardest mod available on Java.) Atleast you actually have to get binding for your tools. Not to mention TFC has a thirst system. Pretty big difference. I imagine there would be thirst mods for Vintage Story as well... But not by default so :P... And there's TFC HardRock which you'll have to look at yourself.
1:14 “steal ideas from TFC” is a bit of a stretch,you can’t really steal ideas unless you implement it 1:1,Vintage story draws heavily inspiration from and are not limited to TFC.Yea I believe vintage Strory is a clone of TFC but that doesn’t negate fact that it’s a good game! I just prefer the TFC modded experience .
I think Vintage Story is far beyond a clone of TFC. It does a lot different and frankly... is a lot better in some ways. Not being tied to Minecraft is a huge bonus to Vintage Story
I wouldn't call it a 'clone', both games do a lot to stand apart from each other, with neither being a clone of the other. 'Clone' implies that they are extremely similar, which they are not. While the general basic ideas of survival and progression through the ages of humanity are the same, these are general concepts that cannot be 'cloned' as they have a basis in the real world.
After reading 2 coments and watching 1 minute of the video I'm somewhat convinced that at most, tfc made the creator feel like me. That it wasn't quite as mutch of a strugle to do stuff as it should be, that it was still too simplistic in it's mecanics and way too many complex or simple things can be just crafted in a 3x3 grid.
The devs of Vintage Story were Minecraft modders at one point plus they even stated they took inspiration from Terrafirmacraft. This isn’t a bad thing. I played MC for years and found TFC pretty much right after I started playing MC. It made the whole game soooo much better. I refused to play MC without TFC. Then the dev for TFC dropped updating the mod and that’s when Vintage Story came on the scene. Now it truly is its own game and I love it even more than the newer versions of TFC developed by TFC fans. I still love TFC but to be honest, it’s built on MC code which sucks. VS gives me everything I want with a better engine ❤
This feel like how Nintendon't wants to claim little monsters and balls as there trademark property. just cause your game has blocks or balls doesn't make it a clone or give ppl the right to be butthurt over it. You can't call all horror movies Scream or all scifi Trek.
Saying Vintage Story is a clone or anything like that of Minecraft or a mod of Minecraft is like comparing Unturned to Apocalypse Rising on Roblox. They're similar sure but as time went on the games grew apart to be very different, and nowadays it's a tough argument to say they're the same type of zombie block dude game. Vintage Story is on a similar path, especially nowadays. The mechanics compared to Minecraft or any one mod are pretty different, there's a ton of lore that's shared in ways that Minecraft either won't or can't with most mod developers focusing on gameplay stuff rather than lore based mods. I'd personally argue that Minecraft and Vintage Story can't really be compared in that regard anymore, they've still got a lot in common but both games have a different feel and are meant for different people nowadays. I think a lot of people who bash Vintage Story are just afraid of change, like they risk actually enjoying something different. It's funny because I have a handful of friends who think Minecraft's progression is too fast, easy, and somewhat mindless; Vintage Story is the complete opposite yet they refuse to try it just on the basis that it's different or it's a clone, and then my brain hurts.
People accusing games of stealing from each other are both right and ridiculous. It's called being inspired. And yes, even if the result looks very similar. We have *always* done that. We take the ideas from games that inspire us, make a game out of it that suits our own preferences (or what we think players want/need), then sell that. The next generation of games does just that. It has alwas been the same. Yet people always accuse games of "stealing ideas" - like that was something bad? Minecraft too "stole" the entire concept from earlier games. Are you really saying the most popular game of all times should not exist because it didnt come up with its core concepts first? And as it is the most popular game of all times, there is bound to be a plethora of games inspired by it. It's as easy as that, and that's really all there is to it. A mere "copy" of a game does not sell. If it sells, it does something better than whatever it copied, or has other advantages. For example, Vintage Story has a direction and meaning to the things you do, while a lot of players complain that Minecraft Survival feels like just some random set of features thrown together. That alone can be a selling point. Furthermore, the devs in this case even credit FCS as one of their primary inspirations. Noone takes issue with that. Or rather i meant to say.. noone that matters. The FCS devs are totally fine with it, any why wouldnt they be. Honestly, and this is just my opinion, we need more people copying from good games. Not the 0815 AAA trash we get served all day, but the gems, like KSP, Hades, and so on and so forth. Taking what works and improving on it is how a genre improves and becomes greater than any one game could possibly make it.
Now I'm happy that I withheld my comment, and watched to the end first. Still... Don't mind me while I go about having 200+ mods in my 1.20.1 TFC pack, including my homebrew compat mod that I'm gradually meshing TFC aspects into the various other mods in the pack through... Meanwhile sitting at a nifty, stable 60fps at embeddium enhanced graphic settings. I just wish that I could get shader packs to work and not brick visually with TFC.
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
Let me know what you guys think of this more “investigative” type video! ❤️
Remembered that cs is a mod. And valorant is a riff off and haters have offensive points but never do good.
I would love if there dawncraft like vintage craft.
It was crap tbh.
it was the first video of yours that ive watched. pretty good work
.... you know that the vintage story dev's are the OG TFC mod dev's right ?
Vintage Story explicitly credits TFC as its basis for inspiration, the devs are all very aware of this and everyone is on perfectly good terms. This is a non issue.
literally this. Came here just to comment this.
and even if that wasn't the case for how good tfc is it doesn't own "believeable survival" so it can't be "stolen"
@@topminator2991 Especially since there's actually a Minecraft mod Vintagecraft that was done by VS devs before they've decided to make their own engine. And didn't see anyone complaining about Vintagecraft being stolen back when it was developed (and I've followed MC drama channels at that time). Not sure whether TFC or VC came first, but I don't think that matters much since devs of both decided to just shake hands and not to be a-holes about it.
The parallels are too strong to say otherwise. I played through TFC and TFC-TNG and now dipped my toes into VS. The only way the creative concepts can coexist is my recognising the existence of their predaseors. I'm glad that they all exist, and that their creators remain kind and civil about their overlaps.
You cant steal a mod by making something similar. Thats not how shit works. They shouldnt even have to credit TFC whatsoever considering they did NOTHING to create VS
TFC still feels like it's just a revamped Minecraft, while Vintage Story has managed to establish its own identity and completely immerse me in its world. One of Minecraft's weakest aspects, to me, is its lack of direction and consistency; it really just feels like a hodgepodge of random features at this point.
And Minecraft's lack of direction has only gotten worse over the past couple years. Meanwhile, VS is an indie team committed to the vision. Its really outgrown its beginnings to become something truly breathtaking and promising.
@@StuffandThings_ THIS. Everyone debating and asking why old Minecraft was better is not because the actual game is "better", but the old devs had a VISION for their game, the game had a purpose. Now it's just random additions and with every new update the game feels like a kitchensink modpack.
well thats because it kinda...is.
its just a mishmash
Part of that may be Mojang's refusal to add any concrete lore.
@@Exis247 The problem is lore, MC is meant to be a sandbox, that is what it thrived at. Now they are trying to build an RPG exploration game out of a sandbox game and failing at both.
The people saying Vintage Story stole from TFC are the types of people that say every FPS game is CoD rip off.
The FPS genre used to be called "DOOM-clones"
And every game with an open world, combat and enterable vehicles is a gta clone
Frrrr
That's one nice pfp, Worshipper of the one that shouldn't be named
To be honest, this is a problem in the survival game genre as a whole. Other games that add these features don't do progression to such an interactive degree like TFC or Vintage Story do. TFC was truly the first survival "game" that managed to make stone knapping, leatherworking, farming, and metalworking more interactive than simply selecting a recipe and waiting for the result to be crafted.
Other games like 7 Days to Die or SCUM simply have crafting menus that all look the same no matter the workstation used, and they all use the same style of crafting via clicking what you want crafted and waiting for the timer to count down.
TFC made what other games couldn't get right possible. By making most of the crafting systems interactive in such a way as they did, it made progression actually feel nice. However, this was all still through Minecraft, meaning that with each MC update, the mod would have to change and adapt, either leaving behind old features or completely changing current ones. Plus, most of the crafting is still done through UIs and menus, not because of stylistic choice or simplicity, but because of it being a Minecraft mod still.
Vintage Story saw what TFC did, figured out what it could do to further improve and add upon, and did it all in their own engine. They even have the game's source code publicly available for modders and bug fixers to use when making new mods or when making new updates. In this sense, there's no plagiarism or wrongdoing from TFC or from Vintage Story at all. It's simply a progression in how video games are made.
Vintage Story isn't even the first to do this. Garry's Mod, DayZ, PUBG, and more all started off as mods for other games before branching off and becoming their own games later on. People never got mad or defensive when those games took off. It's really just a problem with the Minecraft community being overly critical and argumentative when they don't even have all the facts and examples laid out to do so. People really need to just let this go tbh.
This very well put! I haven't played the minecraft mod in question but Vintage Story finally recaptured that spark Minecraft started before letting fade.
I've tried various mods and just standard up to date Minecraft but I've always bounced off within a few hours, however Vintage Story has already given me a good 100-120 hours of enjoyment. No matter how close it may be to what came before or other mods, having something so well put together that gives me enjoyment with minimal jank is all I ask for.
Also, sorry 😅 I started rambling and this isn't very connected to your comment. At the end of the day, people should just play what they enjoy without going after others for doing the same ^,w,^
Gigachad right here 🗿🗿
The fact that both games are good, the cost pretty much the same and both can be cracked(but it’s better to buy to support devs) Minecraft is good for multiplayer experience(single player sometimes really boring, unless u found a new mod pack or started creating Paris tower from diamond blocks in hardcore.) Vintage story is made for modding directly, installing mods is just a few clicks and no need for 5min reload each time u want to remove a mod. The mods for it have lots of enchanting options and even mechanic overhaul, the are even some very good mods that add more content connected with “Temporality”. Take a look at rustbound magic or primitive survival, which adds endgame content with “Temporality”. VS is much better optimized, but Minecraft can also be played with normal fps even on weak PCs, so we shouldn’t quarrel about what more enjoyable, but just enjoy best of both worlds.
@@Elfeen most pirate if they could would buy the game at least it like that were I live
@@alexanderrahl7034 7 days has the issue of the horde quickly going from threat to annoyance. I think if they uppled the complexity just a tad for some stuff, especially making structures require a stricter support system to invalidate the old build above a pit of spinning blades atrategy, would honestly do it some justice.
Whether it's copying or not, it's clear that TFC and VC are on good terms. Starting drama is fighting a battle with no victors.
Both games are equally good, each with their own flaws and quirks that make it fun to play.
Vintage Chronicle
If I recall correctly, he DID get permission from Terrafirmacraft to use the textures in vintagecraft.
Which was more of a similar mod to Terrafirmacraft.
Much like how the Create mod is similar to Ugocraft.
People don't realize this fact... Create was the EXACT same situation here.
Dint Create basically outright surpass and replace Ugocraft though? At least VS doesn't replace TFC.
Its not the "EXACT same situation". Create didnt branch off and become its very own, separate game. But with that being said, I do understand what you are referring to. VC is just a better, more well and cohesively developed game in my opinion.
There is a difference between copying and taking inspiration from something... Vintage Story is _clearly_ inspired by Minecraft, but that doesn't make it Minecraft. The same is true for TFC. You can take ideas from other things and expand upon them, but that doesn't make it a blatant ripoff.
we also have dont starve voice acting hehe
@@somedesertdude1308 trumpet trumpet
Having played Vintage Story for a long time, it really is its own thing, so far removed with its own identity. It is it's own thing. There is a difference between a mod for an existing game and a fully fledged standalone game with their own unique design.
I genuinely do not understand why some gamers instead of being happy that a new game came out and it's similar to a game they love, choose to be angry and personally offended. "How dare you STEAL from my favorite game?!?" is their go-to attitude and it confuses me. The whole "copying" "stealing" "___ game is a ___ ripoff" doesn't make sense to me. If some developer "copies" Terraria and makes another content rich and highly replayable pixel crafting exploration game you won't see me complaining. I wouldn't give a fuck if it was a near 1:1 game as long as they add enough content to the game to make it feel fresh and new. Give me MORE games that I like, not less is my motto.
Tribalism is my guess
If you can steal "concepts" and "ideas" then everything is stolen.
The FPS genre used to be called "doom-clones".
I was playing a homo sapiens waterworld game on VS yesterday, while i overheard my father listening to something about neanderthals and what our ancestors had to suffer through because of them.
Made me realize the Homo sapiens mode would massively benefit from the addition of other human tribes, and a reskin of Drifters into neanderthals that hunt and kill other humans.
No, Patrick, Vintage Story is not a rip-off of TFC
It's very silly to excuse one game from stealing another while both just simulate irl mechanics??
Those are not the only games that do those things as well.
It's like saying Fortnite stole from minecraft cuz fortnite has sky...
Wait Fortnite didnt invent the sky?
More like Fortnite stole from PUBG because both games are FPS battle royale games.
Wait woah so pubg invented the sky? Now I’m hella confused
@@TheGeekFactor
No, more like that Fortnite "plagiarised" PUBG since both games have similar gameplay, and by the same logic Vintage Story "plagiarised" TFC since both games also have similar gameplay.
@@TheGeekFactor
Sidenote, I know this is off topic, but I recommend you check out bugmancx's minecraft Journey series. His videos are very well made and fun to watch.
It genuinely boils down to:
Vintage Story did copy TFC's basic concepts, but refined them and built upon them in a way no minecraft mod ever could, especially in this refined a fashion.
Continued below for further thoughts
It's team is also much more friendly than vanilla minecraft and clearly cares deeply about their game and its community. It also just simply looks and runs better because it has its own engine. Honestly, Minecraft and TFC could learn from Vintage Story's approach, and I can't actually think of much that minecraft has that vintage story doesn't or doesn't plan to have, apart from Redstone; At least when it comes to things that would fit in both games.
Additionally, Vintage Story's modding community is only just getting off the ground but already has some amazing and unique mods, some of which are far more unique than almost any minecraft mod I've seen; And again, it's only just starting for comparatively.
A while back when I saw a TFC+ Video here on youtube I read a lil bit on it since was confused. TFC 2 was planned by Bioxx to update TFC past 1.8 seperate from TFC:TNG, but he quit modding and the Vintage Story Team was supposedly planning on taking over, before pivoting to just make it their own game.
From what I recall, generally old TFC had quite a lotta performance issues so its entirely possible that was their reasoning for not using it as a base to develop their idea. Clearly took inspiration and to begin with had some involvement in developing TFC, but yk they're doing their own thing and they started doing that in a time where TFC was undergoing a change in Dev Teams and forking into slightly different alterations.
Never understood this aversion to copying, if you can do something better, then do it better. I love TFC, I spent many hours playing it. However it's patch worked into an existing game which caused very obvious performance issues and bugs. Where as VS has been developed from the ground up to work the way it's intended to work.
It's not like the devs of TFC are losing out as they are not making money from their mod and even if they were that's just how the world works, if you offer something better people will prefer you over the worse alternative.
Vintage Story isn't also just a Game, they build a whole unique Engine around it and the "Game" Vintage Story is just a Mod in this Engine. Like if TFC would not only be a Mod in Minecraft, but the Mod team would have build Minecraft to play TFC.
("This is just Terrafirma Craft, But Uglier." - random Vintage Story Hater comment)
I played TerrafirmaCraft, and i watched videos about Vintage Story, and honestly, that guy is trash-talking.
quality-wise in terms of visual, Vintage is better, and in gameplay too
and the monsters in Vintage makes sense at least and has a reason
(when i played TerrafirmaCraft, i assumed that TerraFirma is supposed to be IRL Minecraft, but i dunno which version (modpack) that i played that suddenly spawned armored zombies and weird stuff in the middle of the night, breaking the realistic vibe of Terrafirma...)
TFC in recent version like 1.18 didn't spawn vanilla mod above ground, instead they keep adding passive hostile animals like lion/bear/dog/wolf/etc for the same function.
TFC built a great Minecraft mod. Vintage Story threw Minecraft out entirely and programmed a completely new game from the ground up.
And then some us threw Minecraft out entirely because Vintage story just can't be beat!
Best comment here@@CrickBritt
@@CrickBrittI mean it seems okay, though I’ve always stuck with Minecraft more due to both me liking the game, and because of mods, vintage story just seems alright but not something I’d defiantly play over Minecraft.
Vintage Story holds it's own and has it's own unique identity. It's like when artists use reference - it isn't copying or plagiarism, it's just inspiration used to make a unique work. Both also take heavy inspiration from real life processes, which isn't something that can exactly be "stolen" in any way. Nobody 'invented' the idea to knap stones into tools, 'invented' metallurgy, or 'invented' the ages of human progression.
Also, Vintage Story's lore and story is completely unique.
Really, the two are completely separate and unique.
Totally agree!
Plagiarism is much focus today. Why not just stop making thesis and battle for authenticity. They made it to gate keep and overthrow to social media so the people think they are the only reliable.
@@TheGeekFactorthe fact that there is already 😂 games picking pebbles and sticks survival games and not even a Minecraft.
vintage story runs on it's own engine, which let's the team do a lot with it. it also allows mod devs to make some cool stuff. i know the plan is to eventually have an end game as far as a long term goal to shoot for as well as more lore to explain what has happened. you can already find out a lot about the world.
I always was under the impression that the same guys who made Terrafirma went off to make VS
I swear i though the same at first lmao
the idea that a Mod or a standalone game owns the concept of a very common idea is absurd. VS as well as TFC are both evolutions of the core MC experience and should be treated as equals rather than competitors. If the Devs of VS decided to trademark "their" mechanics, then I'd have a problem but as it stands there is nothing wrong with both existing.
my guy... primitive survival, stone knapping, charcoal burning, prospecting, metalurgy, pottery, and all the mechanics in the game were not invented by any game. these things were used by the man kind since we stared eating cooked meat and our brains got bigger.
so nobody can claim these as their own unique mechanic even if its the first game to implement such mechanic.
@@bartomolev6682 What was the point of this reply??? What you replied was the OPs literal point
@@carlcarlson5553 take a closer look at the comment, it was edited
Vintage story is simply more beautiful, this is why it is appealing to me at least
Lets be honest, minecraft needs a big revamp; there is so much potential for the game.
I don't think it needs as much of a revamp as people seem to think it does... Minecraft is _Minecraft,_ its not just a survival game. Building, creativity, adventuring, and exploration is more of a focus than its survival aspects, and that's not a bad thing.
Vintage Story basically is that revamp you’re looking my for.
@@NephelangeloI completely agree! I'd been playing Minecraft since beta 1.2 is January of 2011. Throwing out Minecraft was incredibly easy when I discovered vintage story!
People always complain about who did it first, but the real question is who did it better
both did it great imo, they both take inspiration from each other and i think that's amazing
though who did it better is personal preference, i actually haven't played TFC yet, i should try it some time soon.
the real question is which dev can give me a better cake recipe
primitive survival, stone knapping, charcoal burning, prospecting, metalurgy, pottery, and all the mechanics in the game were not invented by any game. these things were used by the man kind since we stared eating cooked meat and our brains got bigger.
so nobody can claim these as their own unique mechanic even if its the first game to implement such mechanic.
I don’t think you watched the video lmao
@@TheGeekFactor sorry i copied over my comment and forgot to remove the "my guy..."
The target of my comment are pepole who pause the video after the first 30 seconds and go wage war in the comment section
I did watch your video and i liked it very much.
When I was a kid my dumb ass thought that TerraFirmaCraft was a mod based on Terraria, like genuinely
In *that* segment you were talking about Vintage Story, since you mention a watering can and Terrafirmacraft has no watering can.
I modded minecraft on my own and ended achieving a similar result to TFC and VS mechanics, minus the stone knapping. I guess it's simply logical to have these mechanics because, lo and behold, we've did that irl to get were we are atm.
Anything involving survival and voxels could easily be called a "minecraft ripoff".
Vintage story isn't stolen off anything, it's based off minecraft, and may or may not have some similar features some other mod has.
But nothing is stolen.
I mean Minecraft could just as easily be called a "ripoff". Notch did NOT invent voxels and minecraft was not the first voxel game nor was it the first survival game. Minecraft only popularized the voxel system
If we gonna use the logic that Vintage Story stole ideas from TFC instead of being inspired by it, then we could also say that Minecraft stole the core features of Infiniminer which is placing and breaking cubic blocks and some other stuff.
Not to mention Dwarven fortress where notch got his world generation from
Hey, imitation is the most sincere form of flattery, is it not? I see no issue here with TFC and any "beef" between the two projects, but I have to agree with the common sentiment: I, too, said "This is Terrafirma Craft, but nicer!" when I saw this for the first time. What I will say, though, is that TFC has a different "feel" to VT, mostly because you can TELL it is a "mod" for Minecraft, while VT delivers the same experience in a...say, "bespoke" fashion: The entire engine is created for that singular vision, while TFC heavily modifies the framework of an existing game.
That's also where I want to note, that while TFC is free, Minecraft is not. Therefore you technically have to "pay" for both experiences in the end. That said, one last thing I HAVE to mention is mod integration: Minecraft mods already struggle with this old Java-Brick, but VT has been not only smooth sailing with mods, but has its own dedicated modbase AND in-game installation of mods! You can really tell the developer knows well where he came from, if he made modding and adding mods such a priority this "early" in development.
Notch had planned a proper modding api for Minecraft before Microsoft forced bedrock edition to be the "main" version, which is now about to lose all mod support making Java edition all the more superior.
Such a shame Microsoft has done so little with Minecraft other than make spin offs and rather bland updates surpassed by mods.
@@CommanderRedEXE Microsoft is a corporation, down to being its own conglomerate almost. By its very nature control is what they crave and modding would take away that control. "Bedrock" is their "Main" version, what they commercially try to bank on for the future. Java is relegated as offshoot, hence modding is less of an issue there, from the standpoint of what's in their business interests. Spinoffs are new revenue streams and what is done with MC Bedrock is calculated via business prognosises and market evaluations.
"Gameplay" and being "pro-player" are nothing which interest beyond the barest minimum, buzzwords and surface-level considerations.
@mastermage23 The issue is bedrock is stagnating fast, and most servers for it are modded.
Minecraft runs much better in 1.20 onwards, several improvements were made to the game engine and the lightning engine. And the most recent versions run on the jvm 21, and the boost is quite noticeable. Just to clarify.
Yes, 1.7.10 was awfully laggy.
Vintage story engine is just miles ahead of Minecraft though. And the way your able to mod and and create models is seriously so easy on VS. Minecraft has an insanely large dev team and financial backing but lacks any type of drive. Leading to a terribly boring game now a days
For my PC, Minecraft runs like butter until 1.12.2. Then the FPS gets SHIT even with Optifine until 1.20, were both the Vanilla and the new mods like Sodium make it run better... but still worse than 1.12 optifined
I guessed both, as I know both(I know VS better than TFC, but I still know TFC).
didn't know TFC was older, but I could've checked myself if I cared for the "he stole my ideas" debate on things that are already heavily inspired by something else(same attitude I had with the Palworld vs Pokemon debate).
most of those mechanics were taken as part of historical research into real human progression through the stone, copper, bronze and iron ages and can be used in real life if you want to.
there are a few differences like how crucibles require something more specialized than a simple campfire to be used, even for copper, but all in all they are very close to authentic early human technology.
I tried TFC before and hated it. Didnt even play 20 minutes. Ive played VS for a hundred hours already probably. There must be a very meaningful difference otherwise I would not have diametrically opposed reactions to either game.
Things like pottery and metalwork are just part of a natural progression. How can you steal history? Would it be a better game if it called clay wibblewobble and copper shiny rock?
people just wanna stir drama its different enough to be inspired but its own thing
Makes game with in-game systems that mirror real-world techniques and technologies "YOU'RE STEALING IDEAS FROM A MINECRAFT MOD!", also the mod isn't even in the hands of the original mod developers anymore, so I highly doubt they even care about the similarities.
The funny thing is, that if that were a valid argument then so would saying "Minecraft stole its ideas from dwarven fortress and Infiniminer"
Heres the thing, even if vintage story "copied" TFC there isn't anything wrong with that.
8:00 It's Vintage Story because tfc by default doesn't have watering cans and the fire pits need sticks, not just straw and logs.
I was planing to play TFC when i first saw an video about it, but after watching your review i needed to try and i can't stop playing, im a big fan of gacha games like hsr and i haven't played for a week straight bc of Vintage Story, all the progress feels so much rewarding and meaningful like i never felt in any other game.
Terraria had a similar feeling but after a while i just played in full auto mode
This reminds me when Terraria came out. Some people said it was a Minecraft rip-off. I can still remember when Mojang was based and added "Try Terraria" in the menu messages.
The funny thing is, that if that were a valid argument then so would saying "Minecraft is a ripoff of dwarven fortress and Infiniminer"
there’s plenty of differences in systems and mechanics either game has but the other doesn’t
At the end of the day, it doesnt actually matter.
If 75% of the ideas in VS were taken from TFC, that doesnt matter a lick. Because of one important thing.
VS, is a standalone game, and TFC is a mod.
Those who make the "with a new coat of paint" argument, are simply ignorant to game design. Not a bad thing, its not essential knowledge.
But theyre clearly ignorant of the immense time and work that goes in to building a standalone game over a mod.
The mod gets to work with minecraft as a base game.
The standalone, has to build everything from the ground up.
The mod has to code its new features.
The standalone has to code
_everything_
In this way, TFC took a marker to the Mona Lisa, added a hat, gave her bags under her eyes, painted her nails and drew a ship in the backround.
VS on the otherhand, bought a canvas, paint supplies, and recreated the Mona Lisa, while also including those things and a bit more.
TFC posted it to their deviant art page for free
VS sold it as an original work.
Saying VS "stole from" TFC is to say TFC "stole from" Minecraft.
But folks wont say that. Because both are ignorant and ridiculous statements.
The VS devs put way more time and effort into their product. Anyone can come up with ideas. Fewer can make them a reality on an already existing work. And fewer still can make the reality from scratch.
It doesnt matter to me, because the VS devs made a game, not a mod, and it has its own identity
I think vintage story has much nicer and immersive natural world generation, plus as someone who loves geology i love all the different rock types and and ores and how they generate in a realistic manner
The features of the game in the mod reflects mechanics from real life that makes sense in our fun and so you’re going to have over lab there it’s like saying oh smash Bros Tekken and streetfighter are all the same because they’re all fighting games with fighting game mechanics
I mean yeah that was basically my first thought when I first saw vintage story. It looks very similar to TFC. Though when I started playing vintage story myself I realised how different it is from Minecraft. It's dark atmosphere, lore and mysterious creatures make up for an entire new gaming experience which makes vintage story a truly unique game.
Yes, I get the argument around TFC and vintage story...but I also totally agree with you.
Bro, TFC has 3 different forks right now. TFC is ripping off TFC at this point. XD
Got vintage story today, wow it’s fun. Don’t be a cynic guys give it a shot the modding community is already nuts
The fact that you buy it you own it. Should have everyone buying it. Guess who is going to be gaming when the internet blacks out? People who play Vintage Story.
Also, In Vintage Story you can chisel entire block into whatever shape you want voxel by voxel. Which I really love it
Hey. Have you heard of TFC+? It's basically TFC but taken to an even more realistic level. It's a bit niche but I fundamentally believe that it is the best version of the mod that exists out there, and actually more than anything, vintage story reminds me of TFC+ moreso.
Just for you know. At the start of VS they tried to contact the authors of TFC, which had been abandoned for some time (at that time). And as far as I know, they never got an answer. In any case, although some mechanics are similar, but not in all respects, and the further you go along the progression - the more differences you will see. For example, blacksmithing or steelmaking is seriously different from TFC. But yes, the game was inspired by TFC (TFC Plus) and does not hide it
Fun fact, you’re incorrect. You’d know this if you watched the video
@@TheGeekFactorHm. In what exactly?
The people who made VS did contact the TFC people… and they did get a response. I show the reddit post where the TFC devs confirm they talked to the VS devs
@@TheGeekFactorMaybe later? I'm not sure about that. But the game has been released in 2016, not 2020
The theme for both is realistic survival. They're going to overlap because of a centralized origin that is clearly defined.
terrafirmacraft but uglier is a wild statement
Vintage Store!
Edit: Bruh come on man don't do that to me.
11:34 As a TFC player, I can confirm that this statement is true. Smithing in TFC is done in a menu.
7:49 I was not looking at the screen so I can’t be influenced by that. I have never played TFC and that did not entirely sound like what I thought it was, but I will still guess the correct answer is “both” for everything you said there.
Another thing about vintage story is that I believe the devs have stated they want to minimize UI based crafting and have even more in world crafting than the current knapping, clay forming and smiting
do some vintage story lets plays and i will watch you.
I might do it on my second channel. Lets plays kinda don’t… hit
@@TheGeekFactor well just more vintage stuff in general i guess. not need a lets play.
Mayhaps.
TFC is honestly the closest thing I have to Vintage Story right now, and I enjoy watching both because they both are so directly interactive with HOW you craft things.
LOL go sue Blizzard for making DOTA2 from warcraft mod. You cant steal from ultra realism game because its based on reality.
Thats impossible considering technically blizzard owns the rights to all mods made from/for its games. How can someone sue blizzard for taking stuff from a mod on their own game lol
Unfortunately I can't play that game yet, since I don't have a pc at the moment, but I'll definitely give it a try when I get a pc.
While on the surface VS and TFC are very similar, I would say VS is a far more cohesive and fluent experience. It feels like it has much more of a focus, and respect towards deeper immersion. Tyron has said VS is only about 10% complete, and has stated that he would like to be able remove the crafting grid entirely someday, in favor of more immersive in world crafting, which is already a huge difference from other similar games. TFC and VS are similar, but extremely different once you look a bit deeper.
usually i just click the dont recommend this channel on youtube when i see some salacious headline or thumbnail (I dont really care for the videos on average when someone is making a wild claim). I'm glad i gave this video a shot.
as far as whether the game's idea was stolen i guess doesnt really matter since the devs on both sides dont care (which if there were to be some kind of take down or DMCA, would 100% require)
I’ve thought about the price of Vintage Story now…
It’s as expensive as an average McDonald’s meal… except it’s 10000x more worth it, and a life-time investment.
Do you know infection mods like the scape and run mod?
TL;DR The various settings and world customization screen when you create a world is a huge deal and probably the best part of Vintage Story. And free mods is always a bonus!
I love the versatility of Vintage Story and can play it non-stop for days--no, months! One hundred people might use the same world seed, but get totally different worlds unless they select the exact same settings. Sure, there might be a ruined village to the south and a large deposit of surface copper to the north, but it's not always guaranteed, and they're almost never at the exact same coordinates. And the ruined village might change to one of several variations. I suck at fighting mobs, but do pretty good at everything else. I can lower the mob HP and how hard the mobs hit. Mobs can be aggressive/attack when you come within their detection range, passive/they will only attack you if you attack them, or docile/they will never attack the player no matter what the player does. Young kids can start with the easiest settings and, as they get older and more experienced, they can adjust the settings to be more challenging with every new world they create. Getting into using mods is super easy--pretty much plug in and play, but I do recommend playing without mods in the beginning to find out what you feel the game lacks or to make the game more accessible for people with issues that might make it hard for them to play video games. For example, I find the vanilla world to be empty of places to explore. It has lots of caves and several ruins, but not much loot that you want as you progress through the metal ages. And, except for the various traders, it lacks civilization. I want a much "busier" world. So, I add the Better Ruins mod, The Dungeon mod, and the Underground Mines mod to give me more ruins and places to explore (and fight). More loot, too! I also use the VS Villager mod with its two sub mods to spawn working villages that I can visit, take over as my own, or I can create an item that will allow me to create a village of my own. I have to build the buildings my villagers live in. This gives me opportunities to show off the loot I've collected and place them in these buildings, giving them a more post-apocalyptic touch. I added the Still Useful Stuff mod mainly for it's Welcome Mat which will spawn one of the vanilla traders for a day every few days as if they are visiting your base, or you can set up a place for them to spawn in your village. The Welcome Mat is great if you don't have any nearby vanilla game traders, or you haven't found certain traders you need items from. This way, you don't have to travel for literal game days to find or get to them. You never know which type of trader is going to show up, what they have to offer, or what they will buy from you. It's like a fun roulette. You never know until they show up! And you can have more than one welcome mat. Currently, I plan to have an inn in my village with rooms that have welcome mats in them to make it appear to be a functioning inn. As the traders show up, I "shop" their wares, and then they leave after a meal and provide currency to pay for their stay. As long as you fill the necessary requirements for the welcome mat traders, you can slowly build up currency if you don't buy anything from them. There is a huge amount of items you can find in ruins or trade with the traders ranging from food products, clothes and jewelry, weapons and tools, rare building materials, hard to find resources, and more. There are also mods for people who have accessibility issues like low manual dexterity, epilepsy, sound or motion issues, or other special issues that might make it harder to play video games or use a computer keyboard or mouse doing repetitive tasks aka repetitive strain injuries. I've seen people who have carpal tunnel playing VS using these accessibility mods. They couldn't stream on Twitch, but they would record themselves playing for as little as five minutes at a time. Then upload these unedited, short twenty-minute videos. It kept their subscribers happy to see some content from a favorite RUclipsr and brought in some income even while they were recovering from their injury.
Glad you did this follow up. And VS is really a great game-it’s not fast, there’s no instant gratification, you have to be ready to spend time and go through multiple processes to create something (leather backpacks, I’m looking at you!) but when you finally finish making something it’s a lot more rewarding. And the mods are great, so imaginative and fun and useful and, well, you just have to try it first yourself.
I think the in world crafting of vintage story really helps separate it from minecraft. While TFC still feels like minecraft, just overhauled.
Those comments were so stupid it makes me puke lol. Source of code was stolen? lmao vintage is written completely in different language
The idea that one game could "steal" the idea of survival from another, whichever degree of realism, is a young (immature, but i cant blame them) thought to me. Notch himself said his goal was to try and do a 3D dwarf fortress, much like what TFC claims to attempt. In this case its a matter of depth, TFC and Vintage Story both have a similar level of depth to their survival aspects, and carry the boons and drawbacks of a 3D First Person video game.
Theres more to this, of course, so much more than whats presented, while DF has adventure mode, its not so easy to immerse yourself, and its deep survival aspects truly come out in fortress mode if you look closely, for a more focused, single player-character survival game, Cataclysm Dark Days Ahead (CDDA) and its branches has you in a very realistic post apocalyptic survival setting (especially innawoods) which lets you advance at least to vehicles and firearms from nothing. Theres certainly deeper, more intricate and obscure projects out there but thats a rabbit hole I elected to not dive down.
My point is there is no ownership over the survival setting, any survival setting, all a survival setting does is add another layer of similarity to the life you live daily, or could be living in a different time period or fictional work.
Here's my thoughts on Vintage Story as someone who has purely seem gameplay of it.
...I think it's genuinely interesting. I think it's genuinely a really cool game. I'd love to get into it but I don't have the money, nor do I have the PC, for it. While I'm not the BEST at Survival games... I genuinely do think I'd get into Vintage Story.
Not because of the gameplay but I guess... how it FEELS. I think my problem with some games is that I just don't feel it sometimes. Minecraft is a game that I've played and... I'm ambivalent on as a game I'd like to play. As a game I like to watch? Oh it's fun, pretty damn fun to watch.
Vintage Story might be one of those games where when I sit down and play it. I automatically feel it, I feel how great it is. And when I get down to it... I'll probably end up doing a lot in that game.
But that's my general assumption... in the end; Vintage Story feels so distinct. That I can't reasonably compare that much to minecraft. I can even partially get into why it feels so distinct from Minecraft.
It feels less... disconnected in a sense with some gameplay. Minecraft has a lot of content, oceans of items... but it's about as deep as a puddle with some of them. Sure Redstone Engineering is pretty big, sure you can do a lot with automation but... it feels like some stuff is also just lacking in that department. Yeah you can build a lot but... you can only build SO MUCH before you start to kinda wanna crave something else. At least in my opinion.
Vintage Story feels way more connected. What it probably lacks in content, I'm not sure do not quote me on that, it has in depth. You can really see how much the resources you are given matter to heavily. Clay will carry you HEAVILY into so many parts of the game. Same with storage, same with many of the blocks you use, same with armor. You can do so. Much.
In the end; Vintage Story is its own distinct masterpiece. It works because even IF it isn't like Minecraft in so many aspects... that's not a bad thing. That's a great thing in my opinion... anyway yeah you're free to ignore my thoughts because I have not played this game.
if vintage story would just release on steam already it would be more popular
I'm really glad that someone finally had the will to make s video about this topic. I've seen and have wondered myself plenty of time if these games had the same developers or something like that.
I still haven't played Vintage Story, but I'm eager to give it a try.
The only possibly valid reason to criticise Vintage Story having copied mechanics would be that it's paid instead of free, not that they copied game mechanics in and of itself. There is nothing wrong with copying game mechanics, that's how innovation and better games are made.
I've played both and I actually prefer Vintage Story a lot more, I really enjoyed how interactive the knapping was for clay and stone tools and thats an important part of the early/mid game.
Terrafirmacraft had some great ideas, but was limited by the minecraft engine with it's execution which left it a little lacking to me.
Currently 80+ hours deep in my Vintage Story world.
Before i get further into the video and see your claims and reasoning, i want to say my piece. TFC is the "free" tutorial to Vintage Story. (I say free because most people own mc by now and at least own java) Vintage Story utilizes mechanics that just arent possible in mc, such as in-world knapping/smithing, as well as, i hope crafting, down the line. TFC is definitely similar, but its more a mod based off of it rather than Vintage Story copying it.
you forgot that in vintage story you can chissel most blocks to make just about anu block / decoration you can think of :)
saying Vintage Story copied TFC is like saying Cyberpunk copied GTA, they are all unique and enjoyable experiences in their own right, survival mechanics are semi based off real survival mechanics but in a gamified form, there isn't an infinite number of different ways to make survival mechanics that are fun and enjoyable and still faithful
When I was watching you play it I was thinking "Wow this looks so much cooler then TFC"
Didn’t the developers of vintage story originally crated the mod then they decided to make there own game
It's same on conceptual level but experience is vary vary different. Both want to deliver realistic survival experience.
My guess is that you were talking about both games, with the only thing to throw me off being the detail of watering cans, as I don't remember there being any in TFC.
Now hear me out. VS has some great bgm, but imagine if C418 made new ones.
I know, completely unrelated. You can carry on your day now 😁
20% of those that accused vintage story will even notice this video.
Vintage Story reminding me of TFC is one of the main reasons I got so easily and heavily into VS. TFC is a great mod and I have spent hours upon hours in it, but as mentioned in the video - modding minecraft can kind of be a pain and the game itself runs kinda meh. VS offers an even better experience in similar vein and runs better to boot.
Heard of Better Than Wolves? (A MC modpack, that tried to atempt what TFC did. Also known as the hardest mod available on Java.) Atleast you actually have to get binding for your tools. Not to mention TFC has a thirst system. Pretty big difference. I imagine there would be thirst mods for Vintage Story as well... But not by default so :P... And there's TFC HardRock which you'll have to look at yourself.
What’s the name of the game at the end of the video? Anyone?
I show the name of the game on screen. It’s animal well.
@@TheGeekFactor Oh my bad. Didn't notice it😅 Thank you!
1:14 “steal ideas from TFC” is a bit of a stretch,you can’t really steal ideas unless you implement it 1:1,Vintage story draws heavily inspiration from and are not limited to TFC.Yea I believe vintage Strory is a clone of TFC but that doesn’t negate fact that it’s a good game! I just prefer the TFC modded experience .
I think Vintage Story is far beyond a clone of TFC. It does a lot different and frankly... is a lot better in some ways. Not being tied to Minecraft is a huge bonus to Vintage Story
I wouldn't call it a 'clone', both games do a lot to stand apart from each other, with neither being a clone of the other. 'Clone' implies that they are extremely similar, which they are not. While the general basic ideas of survival and progression through the ages of humanity are the same, these are general concepts that cannot be 'cloned' as they have a basis in the real world.
After reading 2 coments and watching 1 minute of the video I'm somewhat convinced that at most, tfc made the creator feel like me.
That it wasn't quite as mutch of a strugle to do stuff as it should be, that it was still too simplistic in it's mecanics and way too many complex or simple things can be just crafted in a 3x3 grid.
The devs of Vintage Story were Minecraft modders at one point plus they even stated they took inspiration from Terrafirmacraft. This isn’t a bad thing. I played MC for years and found TFC pretty much right after I started playing MC. It made the whole game soooo much better. I refused to play MC without TFC. Then the dev for TFC dropped updating the mod and that’s when Vintage Story came on the scene. Now it truly is its own game and I love it even more than the newer versions of TFC developed by TFC fans. I still love TFC but to be honest, it’s built on MC code which sucks. VS gives me everything I want with a better engine ❤
This feel like how Nintendon't wants to claim little monsters and balls as there trademark property. just cause your game has blocks or balls doesn't make it a clone or give ppl the right to be butthurt over it. You can't call all horror movies Scream or all scifi Trek.
Saying Vintage Story is a clone or anything like that of Minecraft or a mod of Minecraft is like comparing Unturned to Apocalypse Rising on Roblox. They're similar sure but as time went on the games grew apart to be very different, and nowadays it's a tough argument to say they're the same type of zombie block dude game.
Vintage Story is on a similar path, especially nowadays. The mechanics compared to Minecraft or any one mod are pretty different, there's a ton of lore that's shared in ways that Minecraft either won't or can't with most mod developers focusing on gameplay stuff rather than lore based mods. I'd personally argue that Minecraft and Vintage Story can't really be compared in that regard anymore, they've still got a lot in common but both games have a different feel and are meant for different people nowadays.
I think a lot of people who bash Vintage Story are just afraid of change, like they risk actually enjoying something different. It's funny because I have a handful of friends who think Minecraft's progression is too fast, easy, and somewhat mindless; Vintage Story is the complete opposite yet they refuse to try it just on the basis that it's different or it's a clone, and then my brain hurts.
unturned was originally a roblox game anyway lol
People accusing games of stealing from each other are both right and ridiculous. It's called being inspired. And yes, even if the result looks very similar. We have *always* done that. We take the ideas from games that inspire us, make a game out of it that suits our own preferences (or what we think players want/need), then sell that. The next generation of games does just that. It has alwas been the same. Yet people always accuse games of "stealing ideas" - like that was something bad? Minecraft too "stole" the entire concept from earlier games. Are you really saying the most popular game of all times should not exist because it didnt come up with its core concepts first? And as it is the most popular game of all times, there is bound to be a plethora of games inspired by it. It's as easy as that, and that's really all there is to it. A mere "copy" of a game does not sell. If it sells, it does something better than whatever it copied, or has other advantages.
For example, Vintage Story has a direction and meaning to the things you do, while a lot of players complain that Minecraft Survival feels like just some random set of features thrown together. That alone can be a selling point. Furthermore, the devs in this case even credit FCS as one of their primary inspirations. Noone takes issue with that. Or rather i meant to say.. noone that matters. The FCS devs are totally fine with it, any why wouldnt they be. Honestly, and this is just my opinion, we need more people copying from good games. Not the 0815 AAA trash we get served all day, but the gems, like KSP, Hades, and so on and so forth. Taking what works and improving on it is how a genre improves and becomes greater than any one game could possibly make it.
Now I'm happy that I withheld my comment, and watched to the end first.
Still... Don't mind me while I go about having 200+ mods in my 1.20.1 TFC pack, including my homebrew compat mod that I'm gradually meshing TFC aspects into the various other mods in the pack through... Meanwhile sitting at a nifty, stable 60fps at embeddium enhanced graphic settings. I just wish that I could get shader packs to work and not brick visually with TFC.
me not think it stolen
Wasn't TFC made by the same guy that made VS?
Do a 100 days vintage story video! It’ll probably take a year to do… but would be fun to watch ❤
Nope. I have no interest in making that kind of content! There are some good 100 days videos out there already! ❤️