Lord Celeborn the Wise - Epic Character History
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 7 ноя 2020
- Celeborn the Wise was the husband of Galadriel and the lord of many Elves throughout his years in Middle-earth, and his history is an interesting one in the annals of Tolkien’s works. Thank you all so much for watching, let me know your thoughts about Celeborn and his history in the comments below! As always, a great thanks to the online artists whose visual works made this video possible! If you are one of the artists, please let me know and I will post your name and a link to your work in this description!
#LordoftheRings
#Tolkien
#Lore
Consider donating to our Patreon for the Westernesse Podcast and Discord Server:
/ menofthewest
Check out our Merch:
www.spreadshirt.com/user/Yoys...
Check out our music channel:
/ @musicmotw
Join us on Facebook at:
/ yoystan
Join us on Twitter at:
/ yoystan
Related articles:
tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Celeborn
lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Celeborn
www.glyphweb.com/arda/c/celebo...
Lady Galadriel - Epic Character History:
• Galadriel, Lady of Lig...
The Ruin of Doriath - Timeline of Arda:
• The Ruin of Doriath - ...
Celebrían, Wife of Elrond - Epic Character History:
• Lady Celebrían, Wife o...
The War of the Elves and Sauron - Wars of the Legendarium:
• The War of the Elves a...
The Tragic Love Story of Amroth and Nimrodel:
• The Tragic Love Story ...
The History of Lothlórien - Region Spotlight:
• The History of Lothlór...
Thank you for your patronage!
Adrian De la Torre
Peter Sheppard
Chris Ortner
Blair Scouten
Samuel McBee
Jonathan Putnam
Mark Kralick
Tobias Göldner
Diego Perez
Berni McCoy
Daniel Orlandi
John Crowley
Susan Henry
Atlas
Jennifer Wood
Maz Gibs
Ryan Warren
Renato Filipe
Imiel Elenen
Chiara Siasat
Tyler Lund
Hydro Knight
Joshua W
Ádám Kis
Memory Troll
Dale Starbuck
Dan Mazzei
April Green
The new Men of the West logo was created by Raffe - Twitter: RaffetheRandom
The final image “Bag End” was created by Wayne Glassbrook at designly.net
The first song was developed and produced by my associate Galafee.
The second and last songs used in this video are from:
library.techsmith.com/
Many related and/or used art come from these artists and sources:
Ted Nasmith:
www.tednasmith.com/
Jenny Dolfen:
goldseven.wordpress.com/
Alan Lee:
www.iamag.co/the-art-of-alan-...
John Howe:
www.john-howe.com/portfolio/g...
Hildebrant brothers:
www.brothershildebrandt.com/Br...
DonatoArts:
www.deviantart.com/donatoarts
Magali Villeneuve
www.magali-villeneuve.com/
Wolfanita:
www.deviantart.com/wolfanita
Gerwell:
/ gerwell
Mirach Ravaia:
www.deviantart.com/mirachrava...
Kaprriss:
www.deviantart.com/kaprriss/g...
EKukanova:
www.deviantart.com/ekukanova/...
steamy:
www.deviantart.com/steamey
Laurelinartistry:
/ laurelinartistry
SaMo-art:
www.deviantart.com/samo-art/g...
kimberly80:
www.deviantart.com/kimberly80...
Anke Eissmann:
anke.edoras-art.de/anke_illust...
Drazenka Kimpel:
eldamaranquendi.tumblr.com/po...
alystraea:
www.deviantart.com/alystraea/...
moumou:
www.deviantart.com/moumou38/a...
www.deviantart.com/moumou38/a...
hollano:
www.deviantart.com/hollano/ar...
Firat Solhan:
www.artstation.com/artwork/Brgnm
ralphdamiani:
www.deviantart.com/ralphdamia...
Jugi Val:
jugival.artstation.com/projec...
MotherofDragons64:
www.deviantart.com/motherofdr...
Wojtek Fikus:
www.artstation.com/artwork/XB...
Nicholas Barbas:
www.artstation.com/artwork/Bm...
I like how elves could be like "Babe, I'm going to go on a elf business trip for a few centuries. I'll see you later. Maybe we can grab elf lunch some decade soon."
Absence makes the heart grow fonder.
Elrond to his daughter:Dear ,I know Aragorn is a human but 60 years aren't that long,it take me 1850 years to tell your mother I love her.
Glorfindel: Mostly , because your grandparent looks about to kill a half-elf over their only daughter.
i realize I'm quite off topic but does anyone know a good place to watch new tv shows online ?
@Iker Asher Flixportal :)
@Julio Devin thanks, signed up and it seems to work :D I appreciate it !
If Galadriel says Celeborn is the wisest Elf in Middle Earth, I'm going to take her word for it.
She might be biased towards him since he is her husband.
But for Gandalf, it's Elrond the wisest since the 'Hobbit' and 'LOTR'. They were close too.
I've always liked Celeborn. Badass when needed, wise when needed, laid back when needed, not above flaws, lucky and devoted family man. Unbent by defeat, victorious in the end, he left Middle Earth on his own terms after making sure his lineage would live on and prosper. I wish I was like him. Long live Celeborn!
beautiful post
Yes!! He never gets enough credit!
Muy interesante tu mensaje
I think Tolkein should have REALLY reconsidered the name "Teleporno".
Thought the same thing.
🤣👍
Tolkien was too pure for this world...and at the time he was writing this, the word “pornography” and its abbreviation were not as commonly used in society as they unfortunately are now.
It didn't mean the same thing when he was originally writing, decades before the slang term "porno," or the widespread use of the prefix "tele-" for anything related to television
@@TheSaneHatter Reminds me of the way Tolkien frequently uses the word "queer" in its original meaning of "odd" or "strange."
Celeborn the Wise!
Also Celeborn:
"Where's Gandalf??"
Galadriel: 😒
Celeborn's other name is premium cable subscription adult entertainment channel.
@@genghisgalahad8465 i laughted to my death when i read his other 'name'
@@genghisgalahad8465 Celebornhub
Genghis Galahad That is only in the movies.
He is wise to listen to his wife, not many elf did
Tell me, where is Gandalf? For I much desire to speak with him.
A Balrog of Morgoth.
@@yourstruly4817 what did you say?
THEYRE TAKING THE HOBBITS TO ISENGARD
@@lucasfinrod3428 Stupid fat hobbit!
The hobbits the hobbits the hobbits the hobbits
To Isengard to Isengard
Me: Watching Sunday Night Football
Men of The West: Uploads new video.
Me: Clicks instantly
It seems Celeborn caught the football
He’s a really underrated character, thanks for bringing him to light
Celeborn is definitely wise enough to always listen to his much wiser wife 😆. I'm not even married & I can see the great wisdom in that 😉.
Nah. He just knows what his wife is going to say and does not care enough to interrupt her. Imagine having a wife that is both beautiful and smart. But she also wears one of those greater rings and can defend your whole domain by her own. But you are pretty cool guy yourself. And you are just fine. The only thing you want is to know where is Gandalf. Because Gandalf is bro. And you much desire to speak with him.
@@Stellarheim Thigol was the tallest Elf and had Melian as wife but paid little heed to her counsel. One could say Celeborn learnt from Thingol's mistakes.
I would love some stories about the twins and Celeborn just hanging out in Imladris together.
*"Hello There! This was very well done and most interesting!"*
GENERAL KENOBI, you are a bold one! Thank you very much!
*"You are very welcome Men of the West always."*
I love it here
@@skzanarchist same lmao
@@caedes4367 not often do we see our mighty lore master and the great general kenobi conversing with each other!
Celeborn had already a somewhat minor role in the FotR books, but in the films he will ever be know as no more than Galadriel’s husband😢
He gave some good council in the extended cut
@@huntergiron2388 I agree. Galadriel seemed to give lofty words and mind fucked people, but Celeborn was like “this is what you need to do.”
I didn't realise he was on the very last ship with Cirdan,
... kinda choked me up for a sec.
In the book, he wasn't on that ship. He took rulership of Southern Mirkwood for a while, then went to live with his grandsons in Imladris for a while. When, or even if he went to Aman is unknown, to though it is presumed in the Red Book off Westmarch that he did.
Celeborn Was the wisest in Middle Earth!!!!
Elves were generally very wise, but very abstract. Do not go to Elves for answers, for they will answer both ay and nay. That is very important to understand. Even Galadriel or Elrond did not understand life as Celeborn did. Celeborn gave realistic and much needed aid. Not abstract look in mirror advice. He understood Aragorn needed time to process his options, so he gave them boats. He knew the fellowship will be in danger, he gave them knives.
When Celeborn admonished the fellowship, he did not single out Gimli in particular. Although he apologized to Gimli only. Celeborn would have admonished Gandalf also for awakening the Balrog and putting Lorien in danger. Celeborn grew up in the court of Melian for far longer than Galadriel. He had wisdom that could not be rivaled by any one. He was wise and used his wisdom. Galadriel was powerful, but did totally nothing to undo the ring. Instead she caused the breaking of the fellowship by putting visions of the ring in the mind of Boromir. If Celeborn had known that, he would have told Aragorn to be more careful. Also despite being a powerful ruler and the wisest of them all, he never once coveted the One Ring. Unlike his wife, who got her power from the elven ring.
Facts 🔥🔥🔥👏👏
👍
I think the reason Galadriel called Celeborn wise...Is she loves him!!! I Bet!!!
Thanks, Mellon for this Video, on an elf that needs more love...Until Taking 2 of the Easterlings, Marion Baggins Out!!!
"Calas Galathon, home of of the Lord Celeborn and of Galadriel, lady of light"
May seem like a minor character but his history crosses multiple ages of middle earth, impressive and respectable for any elf
Does make me wonder why he didnt leave with Galadriel tho🤔
When the sea calls u home u always answer 😊
I agree! I wondered that myself, and perhaps it's because all he's ever known was Middle-earth, and did not want to leave the lands of the east until he had to go to Valinor? I'm unsure, it's a very great question!
@@MenoftheWest He stayed for the sake of Middle Earth. She comes back to Middle earth when Belgians rises again she states to Fangorn known as tree beard so he can show him fimbrethil
@@Makkaru112 huh ? When what rises ? Is this from the time after the wars of the ring ?
@@Makkaru112 belgians, beleriand?
@@Makkaru112 “Ah shit the Belgians are back”
I hate that they left out Celeborn in The Hobbit films. Instead we got that weird romance between Galadriel and Gandalf. Bleh!
I was so looking forward to seeing him but nope.
Celeborn is interesting character. I think one of the reasons Galadriel speaks of him as wisest is because to her he is just that.
Mutch like Nerdinel the wise was able to calm and reason with Feanor until they crew apart. Celeborn had calming effect on his wife. It is worth of note, because for all her virtues Galadriel was still prideful princess of Noldor
Indeed, Galadriel was more prideful in her youth, although never so much as the sons of Feanor. And she was horrified and ashamed of the Kinslaying, learning wisdom and temperance from Melian, the Maia, wife of Thingol.
@@timonsolus i would rather say, that thanks to Melian and Celeborn Galadriel's pride did not take a form as terrible as it did with her uncle and cousins. It came with its own price through.
@Saima Fatima Ali Between two potentially terrible things which is worse anger born from fear or ambitious pride? Or are they perhaps equal?
Celeborn was angry in his fear, when the fellowship came to Lorien. News about the presence of Balrog in Moria where understandably a. shock. He apologized for those hasty words immediately afterwards as is befitting.
Then again despite the warning given by Mandos it is her pride and ambitious goals, that led Galadriel to joun her uncle’s host and cross the grinding ice into Beleriand. Melian and Celeborn where both in their own right replaceable aid to Galadriel in her quest.
Celeborn and Galadriel complemented each other and indeed were better because of it.
@Saima Fatima Ali Thank you You are correct in that the effect Celeborn had on his wife is not quite the same as the one Nerdinel had on Feanor. It is similar though especially in the beginning. One pair eventually crew part whereas the other became closer.
Similarities faded over time, but they are still there.
Probably also because he is thousands of years older than her
I would feel so useless if Galadriel was my wife
but if you can clap her shiny cheeks all night, does it matter?
What would Thingol say?
Galadriel was taller than me?!
lol manlet rekt
Wise you say? Hmm...The wisest of all I’ve seen has been Yoystan, such an insightful young man, such a stunning form, full of beauty and light, joy and peace. We all put you far above him, but will listen to this with all the intent to learn, if only from you
Celeborn was named the Wise for many reasons. Having lady Galadriel as a wife was indeed one of them. But also he was practically the builder of the whole Lothlorien as an elvish kingdom. The guy basically created wood elves. Now, that was wise.
Thorin: "I have no right to ask this of any of you. But will you follow me one last time?"
Interesting seeing a elf that didn’t play much of a role in Middle Earth. He seemed more like a bystander. Which in a way can make people relate to him, for we sometimes miss out and aren’t able to change important things in life.
I feel like maybe that’s why he stayed in Middle Earth for a little while longer. To ensure that everything was alright. Eventually, the West called him home to the most important thing. Family
Well done, my friend!
Has anybody ever told you that you should do an audio book? You have the right voice for it. Especially anything Tolkien related!
Just wanted to say after watching basically all your vids you have a great voice for this. Well done. Keep em coming.
These videos always gives me such a warm, fuzzy feeling and leaves me with lingering thoughts of magic and wonder. Great job!
Thank you again for your videos may we stand against this darkness and lose no bonds of fellowship but let us stand MEN Of THE WEST
He was good in battle strategy throughout the ages. Imagine him playing virtual war games, he would win all the boss fights. And Galadriel would be like:" Chill down my lord!"😁
Fascinating - thank you for another wonderful telling! Always a joy to listen to you
This was masterfully done.
Great video as always Yoystan!
Celeborn was definitely one interesting elf from his family history to what he and Galadriel did during their time in Middle Earth. The movies really didn’t do his character any justice it seemed a lot more like he was “Mr. Galadriel” so to speak. Thanks for this video Yoysten!
Mate , you're videos are just sensational. Brilliant music, perfect images and a rich narration. Heck yeah buddy 👍 thanks for bringing Tolkien's works to life. Hope U read this comment
It's a shame the movies didn't establish how incredible this man was
the movies are garbage really, if you know anything about all the books.
I don't hear a whole lot about Lord Celeborn so this video was a real treat.
A very extremely great video as always Men of the West.
Instant like! I love falling asleep to your videos.
Love your content my friend!
Nice video. Thank you.
Great commentary , my favorite Tolkien site . Was curious if you ever heard of the books, “Finding God in The Lord of the Rings “ and “Finding God in the Hobbit” by Jim Ware & Kurt Bruner? Take care, many blessings.
Wonderful video. I love all your videos, actually. Your voice monologues are excellent, but perhaps a bit too much of an echo? Or reverb maybe. The voiceovers on these would be better served with a more sound proofed, echo resistant room. But that's just a minor quip and does not take away from the quality of your material, at all. Brilliant job nonetheless!
Thanks for the video👍
Excellent. Thank you
Oh thanks for doing this one man.
Unfinished-Tales has some fascinating material for the History of Celeborn and Galadriel.
“If our folk had been exiled long and far from Lothlorien, who of the Galathrim, even Celeborn the Wise would pass nigh and not wish to look upon our ancient home. Even if it had become an abode of dragons “ Galadriel to Celeborn
Really great! Keep it up!!
Awesome thanks waiting for a celeborn backstory
I mean, Celeborn also led the assault on Dol Guldur, so that has to count for something. Its also likely he was also a gifted sailor and warrior considering his non-canon origins that never made it in..
a wonderful video he truely was a awesome Elf Lord and one of Noble linage thank you again for bringing him to life
In the books, it was said that Celeborn didn't leave with his wife to the Undying Lands. But in the movie, he looked eager to get off the shores of Middle Earth!
I always found that contradictory..🤔🤔🤔
Celeborn was a Sindar, a Sylvan Elf, while Galadriel was not, being of the Noldorin. So Celeborn would have been more emotionally attached to the forests of Middle Earth than Galadriel was, and unsurprisingly, he found it harder to leave them behind for ever.
Did you ever hear the tragedy of Celeborn the Wise
Hooray glory to the Valar
I am early!!!!!
And to a video of one of my favorite characters awesome!!!!
great story loved it .nice telling of the celeborn story. love South Africa
So glad Celeborn got this amazing character history!
You should definitely do one for Fingolfin, but still great to see!
Regardless of how great any of the elves’s histories are awesome, they somehow always end either sad or nostalgic, by death or a passage to the immortal lands after them being weary of Middle Earth 🥺
An amazing video from men of the west as always 😃
If possible, can you please make a video on all of Tolkien's books (written both before and after his passing). Thank-you.
No one:
Absolutely and categorically not a soul:
Tolkien: ... know what fam? TELEPORNO
EVERYONE: 👁👄👁
I was always fascinated by the elves, including their origin, and the mythos about the creation of Middle Earth and whatnot, and I was also interested in the Green Elves or as they were once known as the Laiquendi (Wood/Wild elves) I think(?) Do you happen to have a video on them? I think they're supposed to be a mix of Green elves and then the Silvan elves, or there were two different groups that joined into one, but I might be mixed up. If you don't already have a video on them would you consider doing one please?
What's that music that plays in the end called (roughly 11 minutes in)? It's very beautiful. And great video as always!
Stumbled across your channel and got hooked, when it comes to fantasy settings, especially ones so extensive, I'm like a moth drawn to a lamp. How many books are there aside from tlotr and the Hobbit?
Gimli: “Legolas! Two already.”
Legolas: “I’m on seventeen.”
Gimli: “Stop the count!”
Please do a video on the war of the great jewels
Loved this! He'd my favorite character other than Galadriel. I really hope they do him justice in the new show. Assuming he's in it?
Love this channel... it's like a nice ten minute vacation to one of my favorite fictional settings
Keep em comin
Beautiful !!! ❤️🌹
What do you think of the "song of Durin?" It was made by the same group that gave us the song, "far over the misty mountains cold." I think it is great, with the style similar to other songs of the dwarves and that the dwarves probably would have sang it. What do you think of it?
So good so good bravo freind bravo....thnx
Their heights are told in the unfinished tales: "In the chapter "The Mirror of Galadriel", the heights of Galadriel and Celeborn are described: "Very tall they were, and the Lady no less tall than the Lord". Galadriel's height of 6'4" comes from "Appendix: Númenórean Linear Measures" to "The Disaster of the Gladden Fields" in Unfinished Tales." this wouldn't really be canon considering the fact that in unfinished tales he also has the telerin origin rather than the sindarin origin. Good video nonetheless.
1969 account for Eldar height is also 7 feet tall lol
@@kauetadaieski3131 This plus he is the tallest Telerin after Thingol so no way Thranduil is is taller than him.
So wise was Celeborn the Elf, that even men of the 6th age are often searching for teleric wisdom named after him.
Rofl
Some very wise ancient person once said that a truly wise man knows how much he still has to learn. I think that is why Galadriel says he is the wisest elf. He's a good listener and observer, always willing to learn and grow from experience. He isn't just smart, he's also humble.
I'm not sure you know what the word "arrogant" really means Yoystan. You seem to think it refers to all types of pride. Celeborn had every right to be proud of his lineage and his deeds, and that is the good kind of pride. But arrogance is believing yourself or your group to be above all others. While he held a grievance against dwarves, I find little to suggest he thought they were lesser than elves. No one would be more aware than Celeborn of how cruel elves can be to each other, so thinking the dwarves cruel would not be the same as thinking they were lesser than elves. It is also clear that he did not think humans unworthy to be allies and even partners with elves, given how he welcomed King Elessar into his family so readily. And of course, while his great-uncle Thingol kicked the Noldor out of Doriath: Celeborn was willing to marry one of them. Albeit the one who actually did the right thing during the Kinslaying. But that's just my point. He didn't tar Galadriel with the same brush even though the Valar did ("I have passed the test, I will diminish": this line is referencing the Curse of the Noldor, showing that she is subject to it despite being innocent). That shows an appreciation for nuance that can only come from humility.
nice video
The real reason Celeborn was a bit arrogant was just because he was salty for not getting an elven ring
One of the things I've always puzzled about is the assertion that no one knew that Durin's Bane was a Balrog until the account of Aragorn and the Fall of Gandalf. I thought that it was common knowledge among the Wise that a Balrog dwelt in Moria. Perhaps it's because I haven't read all the accounts yet. I only have the Book of Lost Tales and The Fall of Gondolin among my collection of the "backstory"
Pretty darn cool.
I am watching this during a French class.
Also that is a really good ending.
I wonder if Celeborn was jealous of Galadriel for being given one of the three Elven rings?
If it was me I wouldn't be jealous. I would be concerned that as her power and everything exceeded mine what would she need me for?
I doubt it. Galadriel was the more powerful and lore-wise of the two, and also more attuned to the Ring, being one of the Noldorin, like Celebrimbor the craftor of the Three Elven Rings, while Celeborn was of the Sindarin.
@@richardthomas5362 : Galadriel was a woman, and love counted for more than power with her, or she would never have married Celeborn, a Sindar, in the first place, but one of her own Noldorin race.
Honestly I think he was more worried for her than anything
Celeborn probably was like: "Hey Celebrimbor, I need a gift for Galadriel. Next month is our 3,000th anniversary. Could you make something?"
and Celebrimbor was like "I might have just the right thing for her!"
Relationship goal: Galadriel and Celeborn
Well 6'4" figure is speculation on Christopher Tolkien’s part. Considering that full-grown elfmen were no less than six and a half feet and Galadriel, ‘the tallest of all the women of the Eldar of whom tales tell,’ was said to be man-high, she was no less than six and a half feet (198+ cm).
We need a vid on Cirdan the shipwright.
Yes!
eh, I think Galadriel called him the wisest of the elves because he listens to her.
It's always seemed ridiculous that Galadriel refers to him as the wisest...and then less than a minute later rebuked him for his statement about Mithrandir and his passage of Moria.
Cheers to that💪
I've actually given a lot of thought to the subject of when and how Celeborn left Middle-Earth. And while detailing my theories at length would take more time and patience than anyone has here, I have to say that I'm not *completely* convinced that Celeborn and Cirdan left on the same, final ship. There are a few contradictions in that course of events such as......
1) The issue of whether, and how, Samwise Gamgee left Middle-Earth from the Havens, and who would have been there to meet him and sail with him (as he could not have built a White Ship by himself, much less in his old age).
2) The fact that Legolas technically seems to have said the last ship out of Middle Earth, from out of Edhollond or its environs.
3) Tolkien was continually revising his work anyway, especially the small details, and inadvertent mistakes thusly crept in, more than once.
For those reasons, I don't think it's wise to take statements like, "with [Celeborn] went the last living memory of the Elder Days in Middle Earth," and Cirdan's "I will dwell by the grey shores until the last ship sails" too literally, especially together.
I think that Celeborn, to cut a long story short, might have left a little bit before Cirdan, who had to pack up the last of the Grey Havens and the Elves' affairs in MIddle Earth before going. And as I said, I have an idea or two as to how that happened.....
5:00.
What happened to the city ruled by Celebrimbor? Did Sauron destroy it or is it just abandoned in the 3rd Age or does it still stand?
Sauron conquered the city, slaughtered and/or enslaved the survivors, and razed it to the ground, I believe.
Awesome info as I voted for Celeborn!! If you are in to the miniatures game check out SW Miniatures channel and learn how to play with a very pleasant group of guys!! DC Hobbit League teaches you the finer points of the game if you like the game too!! This channel is my nightly watch and I love it!!
How about an epic history of the sons of elrond. Did they leave middle earth with celeborn or legolas.
I read ...lord celebrimbor the wise...and i was like what??? When was celembrimbor wise...
Hey cool! Been awhile. Hope you are well after the fires. Mae Govannen.
Amazon's writers did not watch this informative video.
I want to see Galadriel destroy the fortress and purify the forest.
Who else was on the last ship with Cirdan and Celebron? Glorfindel? Thranduil? Sons of Elrond?
Yaayy!!
I'm going to have to argue that Celeborn's grievance with the dwarves was not "petty".
Absolutely, however, it should be against the Dwarves that were responsible. The Longbeards were not the ones to slay Thingol, so applying this to them is incorrect I think.
@@MenoftheWest They are still Dwarves; this isn't a matter of earth races where the primary differences are merely phenotype. And we aren't talking about some live and let live misdemeanor. We are talking about the destruction of the fairest and oldest kingdom of Elves by guests; a place that was Celeborn's home for centuries.
@@Dadecorban ok, so if one tribe harms you it's okay to hold a grudge against all members of a species? The dwarves of Moria were an entirely different culture from those who destroyed Doriath. That should count for something. It certainly did with Thranduil, who was also present for the destruction of Doriath. Furthermore, it was Thingol's own greed that really led to the Kingdom's downfall: not the dwarves, who were only coming to exact payment for their services. Finally, holding grudges is just never really a good idea even if you have a legitimate reason for being angry. You're liable to lose sight of what's truly important.
@@sophiejones7727 All Dwarves have the nature of Dwarves. Period. If you are an immortal having lived for thousands of years to watch Dwarves destroy your civilization, yes you are afforded some latitude to strongly dislike them. Furthermore, you seem to have failed to read the Silmarillion all the way through; the Dwarves upon completing the work for Thingol, decided to demand that work itself as payment and they refused, they slew him, not some reasonable confusion over the price. Additionally, Thranduil hated Dwarves as well. Not sure how you think bringing another good example into this was in your favor. What are you some kind of Dwarven apologist trying to revisionist justify the Dwarves killing Thingol? What poppycock.
@@Dadecorban unless your Tolkien himself, there is no Period.