I'm a little late to the party with this comment, but I just listened to the Guildhall String Ensemble's recording on MHS (originally on RCA) and their performance is fantastic. In my judgement, they perfectly balance the warmth/expressiveness of traditional string playing with the transparency/sprightly rhythms of period practice. They also recorded Corelli's Op. 6 with similarly outstanding results. I'm sure both recordings are out of print, but you never know when they might pop up...
These are wonderful pieces -one musicologist declared that if all subsequent concertos were lost it would still be all-right if we had Handel’s Op 6. Perhaps an over statement ! I love Trevor Pinnock with The English Concert with the Orpheus Chamber Orchestra in reserve - agree they are well overdue for a box set (could begin with their Haydn)
Other sets that are great, and, so far as I know, hard to find: Hermann Scherchen with and English ensemble Alexander Schneider and his chamber orchestra Horst-Tanu Margraff with the Handel Festival Orchestra of Halle All served, as one musicologist has it, piping hot!
Of the baker's dozen recordings I have, the Marriner remains my fave, for both its unmatched, infectious joyfulness--I find myself tapping my toes to that one more than any other--and for the remarkably inventive, if also overdone, continue by Thurston Dart (being an amateur harpsichordist, I don't mind a slightly more pronounced continuo). I think a more problematic balance error in some recordings is when the concertino is miked so closely, it's as loud as the ripieno. There should be a difference of volume as well as texture, but some engineers are so used to spotlighting soloists that the distinction gets lost. Also, for a real guilty pleasure, I enjoy wallowing in the Montovani-like lushness of the Karajan account.
If you want a Concerti Grossi with a soft harpsichord continuo and don't mind old mono, the Boyd Neel String Orchestra on the Decca Mono box does a pretty solid job. Thurston Dart on harpsichord, but hardly there that you'd notice him. Even the Orpheus Chamber Orchestra's continuo is more prominent (which is not that much).
Thanks. Many fine other versions. Interesting and very strong in character: Hermann Scherchen in London for Westminster (1954) (available on DGG). Also, N. Harnoncourt & Concentus Musicus Wien (1984), C. Hogwood & Boston's Handel and Haydn Society (1991) ...
I was converted to Handel by a 1970s CD set by Prague Chamber Soloists conducted by Eduard Fischer (another Fischer, btw). I believe it was never published on CDs but is now available as download. No "period style' interpretation... but naturally felt music and relaxed playing, most of the time...
My favourite recordings would have to be TWO: 1. I Musici with Federico Agostini (Philips Classics). This set is really amazing because in my opinion, you can never go wrong with I Musici. The tempi are fantastic, and the use of unromanticized modern instruments gives the works a shimmering effect. My second choice is the Academy of St. Martin in the Fields, but instead under the direction of Iona Brown. Brown was the lead violinist and concertmaster of the AoSMitF for many years, and also conducted the orchestra on several occasions. She recorded both sets Op. 3 and 6. Op. 3 was recorded in 1995, and released on Haenssler Classics. Op. 6 in 1994, on the same label. Both recordings were later popularised when they were released, on Hanssler's behalf, on the original Brilliant Classics label. These reached international acclaim, and it's definitely obvious why. I think that they even surpass Marriner's recording on Decca. If you haven't already Dave, I really recommend listening to them. Regards: The Classic Classics
Hello, what do you recommend for Handel Concerto Grosso Opus 3? I have been struggling to find Opus 3 recordings by the people you recommended for Opus 6. There is a film with Oliver Reed called Blue Blood and the final scene uses Opus 3, Number 2 I think. I can't find this version I like anywhere. It seems to have more energy than the others. Maybe they sped it up.
@@Joe-os3vp Well, Iona Brown recorded the Opus 3 with the Academy as well as Opus 6. Marriner also recorded it along with Op. 6 on Decca, but the former is paced faster. I'll look into what version they used in the film 😊. Oh and also I Musici never recorded Opus 3 on any label, it was just Opus 6.
@@RequiemAeternam01 Thanks, I just compared Iona Brown and Mariner and Brown comes close to the film version. I found a cheap 5 CD "Brilliant Classics" with Op 3, 6, Water Music and Royal Fireworks, but it says Iona Brown *and* Marriner, so hopefully it's Iona that got the job of OP.3. While I'm at it, could you also give me some basic advice on what devices to listen to classical music on? Every time I attempt to find out about speakers, amps, etc there are just too many variables and too much choice. Added to which all the formats to buy music on (CD, mp3 etc) leaves me hopelessly confused. I don't play loud music anyway so would I be best off with headphones good for classical, e.g. Sennheiser, and plug them into the TV/laptop/stereo?
@@Joe-os3vp 1. Marriner played the first violin in the Academy for the Water Music/Fireworks Music/Concerti grossi, whereas Brown actually conducts *whilst* playing the violin. Yes, that Brilliant Classics 5 CD set is probably your best choice, because the 4 CD box set released by Haenssler is quite expensive. The Water Music and Fireworks Music recordings are quite good, but I recommend Marriner's 1978 recording for Philips, as it's more consistent all the way through. 2. I'm really not a techy kinda person, so I don't really have any suggestions for things to play on. I personally have both a portable stereo, and an amp/speaker/Panasonic multi-disc player set-up, which works fine. With the headphones, I wouldn't say that you needed any specific brand for listening to classical music, so it really depends on your preferences and how much you're willing to spend. I hope I helped! And to be frank any amp/speaker system will work, you don't need any fancy super-expensive setup to get the best out of your CDs/LPs.
Some of Handel's best work, and I wore out my version of the I Musici de Montreal version. As a Torontonian, I must also give a shout out to Tafelmusik, who give their usual solid performance
I agree, being a fellow Canadian, Tafelmusik are fantastic! However, I don't think that they ever got around to recording the Op. 6 concertos, though they did do Op.3.
Luckily I picked up the Orpheus cd set at a thrift store today for $2, sealed. It can still be had quite inexpensively. I agree, it's a wonderful recording.
I remember coming across Handel Op.6 and Geminiani Concerti Grossi after Corelli Violin Sonata Op.5 by I Musici di Roma many years ago. It were so beautiful, elegant and humble, not too raw, not too stylish, overall very light-hearted and somewhat otherworldly. Afterward I find it impossible to enjoy these twos, especially the latter, on period instruments.
My favorite: Karl Richter and the Munich Bach Orchestra. Just delightful and stirring. (It's on DG/Arkiv Produktion). I'm not sure if it's still in print or not, but if you can find them, get them!
For me Handel has to be lush, heavy strings and "romanticized" with GRANDEUR. Karl Richter on dgg, Karajan, and Hermann Scherchen seem to really understand the grandeur of the music. The music is very capable of being stately and grand---not interlude music at all. The three I mentioned have an approach that is very different from all the recordings mentioned in the talk. This approach extends to other performances of baroque by the three. I used to like Marriner and leppard, and they are wonderful. But they present a lighter approach. I obviously dont like most HIP performances because they sound undernourisheded and lean. The melodic lines are never elaborated. Although I do find Pinnock quite satisfying. I would like to see the performance practice swing away from HIP. Klemperer, Furtwangler did baroque performances that are interesting, but the sound is not that good. The Busch recordings of bach and handel are too hard to listen to, but they understood the grandeur of baroque music. By the way, try Scherchen, Richter and Karajan on BACH. Scherchen orchestrated both the musical offering and art of fugue and they are very fine. (Marriner performance of Musical offering is very good) For other transcriptions: karl Munchinger is great. And of course, Stokowski and ormandy. I used to be a purist, however, Stokowski and ormandy transcriptions really convey the spirit of the music sometimes better than the original intended instrumentation, because they can differentiate texture better with a full orchestra. When will someone do VIVALDI with the weight it deserves??? Opus 3 with I Musici is great, but there is more in the music.
Oh dear, you're not going to make many friends in HIP circles! Love the contrarian viewpoint, though. You may want to have a look at my Music Chat on Handel's Ombra mai fu...
@@DavesClassicalGuide I am always amazed by the HIP movement. On the one hand they all agree, as schnabel said, great music is greater than any one performance can ever be.....and they know Bach, Mozart and other composers were eager to hear new instruments which offered something BETTER. Yet, they insist on compressing this great music onto instruments that simply are constrained and offer that very poor sound the great composers did NOT find adequate. By the way. Has anyone heard the Handel organ concertos transferred to the PIANO. They are wonderful. There are several recordings where a HARP is used or a pedal harpsichord. All wonderful, not what was written, but what is the intention......Bach transcribed Vivaldi for organ and harpsichord...etc. so what is the harm.
When Handel self- published Op. 6 he titled it “Twelve Grand Concertos. “ ‘Grand’ is defined as ‘ magnificent, and imposing in size or style; large and ambitious in scope and scale; denoting the largest or most important item of its kind.’ I don’t think the meaning of the word has changed substantially since Handel’s time.
I'm a little late to the party with this comment, but I just listened to the Guildhall String Ensemble's recording on MHS (originally on RCA) and their performance is fantastic. In my judgement, they perfectly balance the warmth/expressiveness of traditional string playing with the transparency/sprightly rhythms of period practice. They also recorded Corelli's Op. 6 with similarly outstanding results.
I'm sure both recordings are out of print, but you never know when they might pop up...
These are wonderful pieces -one musicologist declared that if all subsequent concertos were lost it would still be all-right if we had Handel’s Op 6. Perhaps an over statement ! I love Trevor Pinnock with The English Concert with the Orpheus Chamber Orchestra in reserve - agree they are well overdue for a box set (could begin with their Haydn)
Other sets that are great, and, so far as I know, hard to find:
Hermann Scherchen with and English ensemble
Alexander Schneider and his chamber orchestra
Horst-Tanu Margraff with the Handel Festival Orchestra of Halle
All served, as one musicologist has it, piping hot!
Of the baker's dozen recordings I have, the Marriner remains my fave, for both its unmatched, infectious joyfulness--I find myself tapping my toes to that one more than any other--and for the remarkably inventive, if also overdone, continue by Thurston Dart (being an amateur harpsichordist, I don't mind a slightly more pronounced continuo). I think a more problematic balance error in some recordings is when the concertino is miked so closely, it's as loud as the ripieno. There should be a difference of volume as well as texture, but some engineers are so used to spotlighting soloists that the distinction gets lost. Also, for a real guilty pleasure, I enjoy wallowing in the Montovani-like lushness of the Karajan account.
If you want a Concerti Grossi with a soft harpsichord continuo and don't mind old mono, the Boyd Neel String Orchestra on the Decca Mono box does a pretty solid job. Thurston Dart on harpsichord, but hardly there that you'd notice him. Even the Orpheus Chamber Orchestra's continuo is more prominent (which is not that much).
Thanks. Many fine other versions. Interesting and very strong in character: Hermann Scherchen in London for Westminster (1954) (available on DGG). Also, N. Harnoncourt & Concentus Musicus Wien (1984), C. Hogwood & Boston's Handel and Haydn Society (1991) ...
I have to say that I've never really been a fan of Christopher Hogwood's recording. I'd take Pinnock anytime!
I also adore the set by Hermann Scherchen! Absolutely beautiful from beginning to end!
I was converted to Handel by a 1970s CD set by Prague Chamber Soloists conducted by Eduard Fischer (another Fischer, btw). I believe it was never published on CDs but is now available as download. No "period style' interpretation... but naturally felt music and relaxed playing, most of the time...
You may sample them here... I hope it is not inappropriate to give a link... www.supraphonline.cz/album/323673-handel-concerti-grossi-op-6/
Les musiciens du Louvre playing Händels concerti grossi opus 3 under Marc Minkowski, are equivalent to pure daylight, so uplifting.
My favourite recordings would have to be TWO: 1. I Musici with Federico Agostini (Philips Classics). This set is really amazing because in my opinion, you can never go wrong with I Musici. The tempi are fantastic, and the use of unromanticized modern instruments gives the works a shimmering effect. My second choice is the Academy of St. Martin in the Fields, but instead under the direction of Iona Brown. Brown was the lead violinist and concertmaster of the AoSMitF for many years, and also conducted the orchestra on several occasions. She recorded both sets Op. 3 and 6. Op. 3 was recorded in 1995, and released on Haenssler Classics. Op. 6 in 1994, on the same label. Both recordings were later popularised when they were released, on Hanssler's behalf, on the original Brilliant Classics label. These reached international acclaim, and it's definitely obvious why. I think that they even surpass Marriner's recording on Decca. If you haven't already Dave, I really recommend listening to them.
Regards: The Classic Classics
Sure, I have them. As you say, they are excellent.
Hello, what do you recommend for Handel Concerto Grosso Opus 3? I have been struggling to find Opus 3 recordings by the people you recommended for Opus 6. There is a film with Oliver Reed called Blue Blood and the final scene uses Opus 3, Number 2 I think. I can't find this version I like anywhere. It seems to have more energy than the others. Maybe they sped it up.
@@Joe-os3vp Well, Iona Brown recorded the Opus 3 with the Academy as well as Opus 6. Marriner also recorded it along with Op. 6 on Decca, but the former is paced faster. I'll look into what version they used in the film 😊. Oh and also I Musici never recorded Opus 3 on any label, it was just Opus 6.
@@RequiemAeternam01 Thanks, I just compared Iona Brown and Mariner and Brown comes close to the film version. I found a cheap 5 CD "Brilliant Classics" with Op 3, 6, Water Music and Royal Fireworks, but it says Iona Brown *and* Marriner, so hopefully it's Iona that got the job of OP.3.
While I'm at it, could you also give me some basic advice on what devices to listen to classical music on? Every time I attempt to find out about speakers, amps, etc there are just too many variables and too much choice. Added to which all the formats to buy music on
(CD, mp3 etc) leaves me hopelessly confused. I don't play loud music anyway so would I be best off with headphones good for classical, e.g. Sennheiser, and plug them into the TV/laptop/stereo?
@@Joe-os3vp 1. Marriner played the first violin in the Academy for the Water Music/Fireworks Music/Concerti grossi, whereas Brown actually conducts *whilst* playing the violin. Yes, that Brilliant Classics 5 CD set is probably your best choice, because the 4 CD box set released by Haenssler is quite expensive. The Water Music and Fireworks Music recordings are quite good, but I recommend Marriner's 1978 recording for Philips, as it's more consistent all the way through.
2. I'm really not a techy kinda person, so I don't really have any suggestions for things to play on. I personally have both a portable stereo, and an amp/speaker/Panasonic multi-disc player set-up, which works fine. With the headphones, I wouldn't say that you needed any specific brand for listening to classical music, so it really depends on your preferences and how much you're willing to spend.
I hope I helped! And to be frank any amp/speaker system will work, you don't need any fancy super-expensive setup to get the best out of your CDs/LPs.
Secret dirty pleasure: Karajan. Hard to find on cd, but I have the lps. I also like the Leppard, and performances on Bis as my HIP choice.
I listened to these in the 60s box. I was pleasantly surprised - they were far less turgid than his Bach and quite enjoyable.
Some of Handel's best work, and I wore out my version of the I Musici de Montreal version. As a Torontonian, I must also give a shout out to Tafelmusik, who give their usual solid performance
I agree, being a fellow Canadian, Tafelmusik are fantastic! However, I don't think that they ever got around to recording the Op. 6 concertos, though they did do Op.3.
@@wapolo1974 You're right - I was thinking of op. 3 ...
I'm surprised that Tafelmusik hasn't recorded Telemann's Tafelmusik yet.....
Don’t listen to much Baroque music, but for me these are at the pinnacle of the period, along with the Bach Suites.
The brandenburgs are far better and so are many of vivaldi's works. Handel's concerti are not really at the top.
Handel added some extra wind parts for oboes and bassoons later to a few of these. Does this make a difference to you?
Not at all. That's why I don't bother talking about them. They are just doubling parts, basically.
Luckily I picked up the Orpheus cd set at a thrift store today for $2, sealed. It can still be had quite inexpensively. I agree, it's a wonderful recording.
I remember coming across Handel Op.6 and Geminiani Concerti Grossi after Corelli Violin Sonata Op.5 by I Musici di Roma many years ago. It were so beautiful, elegant and humble, not too raw, not too stylish, overall very light-hearted and somewhat otherworldly. Afterward I find it impossible to enjoy these twos, especially the latter, on period instruments.
My favorite: Karl Richter and the Munich Bach Orchestra. Just delightful and stirring. (It's on DG/Arkiv Produktion). I'm not sure if it's still in print or not, but if you can find them, get them!
Richter was such a great Handel conductor.
Eduardo Poblete de Chile, please, David, close the álbum to camera, y thank you...
Gracias por escribir en inglés, pero no es necesario. Leo español. Estaba viendo un video antiguo. ¡Todavía estoy aprendiendo!
For me Handel has to be lush, heavy strings and "romanticized" with GRANDEUR. Karl Richter on dgg, Karajan, and Hermann Scherchen seem to really understand the grandeur of the music. The music is very capable of being stately and grand---not interlude music at all. The three I mentioned have an approach that is very different from all the recordings mentioned in the talk. This approach extends to other performances of baroque by the three. I used to like Marriner and leppard, and they are wonderful. But they present a lighter approach. I obviously dont like most HIP performances because they sound undernourisheded and lean. The melodic lines are never elaborated. Although I do find Pinnock quite satisfying. I would like to see the performance practice swing away from HIP. Klemperer, Furtwangler did baroque performances that are interesting, but the sound is not that good. The Busch recordings of bach and handel are too hard to listen to, but they understood the grandeur of baroque music.
By the way, try Scherchen, Richter and Karajan on BACH. Scherchen orchestrated both the musical offering and art of fugue and they are very fine. (Marriner performance of Musical offering is very good) For other transcriptions: karl Munchinger is great. And of course, Stokowski and ormandy.
I used to be a purist, however, Stokowski and ormandy transcriptions really convey the spirit of the music sometimes better than the original intended instrumentation, because they can differentiate texture better with a full orchestra.
When will someone do VIVALDI with the weight it deserves??? Opus 3 with I Musici is great, but there is more in the music.
Oh dear, you're not going to make many friends in HIP circles! Love the contrarian viewpoint, though. You may want to have a look at my Music Chat on Handel's Ombra mai fu...
@@DavesClassicalGuide
I am always amazed by the HIP movement. On the one hand they all agree, as schnabel said, great music is greater than any one performance can ever be.....and they know Bach, Mozart and other composers were eager to hear new instruments which offered something BETTER. Yet, they insist on compressing this great music onto instruments that simply are constrained and offer that very poor sound the great composers did NOT find adequate.
By the way. Has anyone heard the Handel organ concertos transferred to the PIANO. They are wonderful. There are several recordings where a HARP is used or a pedal harpsichord. All wonderful, not what was written, but what is the intention......Bach transcribed Vivaldi for organ and harpsichord...etc. so what is the harm.
When Handel self- published Op. 6 he titled it “Twelve Grand Concertos. “ ‘Grand’ is defined as ‘ magnificent, and imposing in size or style; large and ambitious in scope and scale; denoting the largest or most important item of its kind.’ I don’t think the meaning of the word has changed substantially since Handel’s time.
Karajan is king of this domain. Richter aint bad at all, either.