Fantom Helix RS 21.5T motor Analyzer How it compares on paper with Trinity Slot Machine Hobbywing G4
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- Опубликовано: 24 дек 2022
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I’ve been running the Helix 21.5 in my X4 all season and its been a great motor. I’m still raising the pinion to find the sweet spot as it runs so cool. Trying 96/51 on Saturday.
Awesome. Keep us posted. Are you also between 48-52 degrees of timing?
@@telecomandorc The Motolyser strip says +52.2°. Measured current 3.10A, RPM 20915, K/V 2825, Hall Sensor: 0.2, Mag Assym: 3.0°. But the phase currents show 7.5, 7.3, 7.3A which seems too high? I check the temps after each run with a HW WiFi adapter. Thats another bonus of the Fantoms...they have the same temp senor as the HobbyWings. Read into that what you will ;-)
@@bstearn1653 The phase current, that is with load or no load?
@@telecomandorc That's just what's on the slip so I assume no load, but I see all my other motor slips say the same thing so I guess it's normal? Any idea what it means?
@@bstearn1653 It is the current the motor draws per phase (A-B, B-C, and C-A). My phase current is close to 7.7A on my 21.5T and over 8A in my 17.5T. So, it must be no load.
I noticed in one shot the motor was in the car connected to the ESC. Is there any difference when the motor is tested while wired up vs. on the bench?
The difference would come from the resistence of the solder or wire connections made. But the data in the first table with the Kv data is all from testing the motors not installed.
Very impressive phantom motor they are top shelf my opinion. Excellent video love your tech videos. Have u ever tested the velineon 3500 KV or any R1 motors
Unfortunately, my motor analyzer will not work with the VXL because it is sensorless. As we speak, I am waiting on a 25.5T Helix and my Fantom Facts Machine which I have been waiting for to test the rotors. Supposedly, they are not longer backordered and processing 🤞
I am planning on testing R1 motors, but do not have a timeline yet. Many of the top guys here run them. But I only have access to old used ones. So as soon as I budget for the R1s I will. Just need to race the Fantoms first to get a feel for them, and finish my Traxxas 4-Tec requests. I have actually been off work (holiday) for 2 week so I have had more time to make and release videos.
As far as motors, I generally buy 21.5T, and 17.5T. That is what I use the most. I may also do 25.5T, and 13.5T from time to time. So I will most likely do these four R1 motors in the future. Is there a specific turn R1 that interest you so I can prioritize it?
@@telecomandorc well if u ever come across a R1 wurks motor 13.5. - 4. T just wanna see how good they actually are. Ty for great content and getting back to me
@@mikebianco7854 I should be able to do a 13.5T after January. Thank you very much for watching and making suggestions.
You can run sensorless just make sure you are on 4 pole if the kv is crazy high
@@jamesperdue2296 I tried sensorless once and it was really slow of the start in comparison to sensored. It was .4-.5 sec. slower 0-40m compared to sensorless. Just the start up. Then it took off. That is why I like the Tekin Rx8. Starts off sensored and then automatically switches to sensorless.
Are you running the 21.5 Fantom in anything at the moment? I have a Fantom Helix RS in my VTA and its been great. Im actually going to put in a 53t pinion for the next race with 92t spur. With 52t pinion it comes off the track barely warm….Considering a Fantom now for my 21.5 touring car. I have the R1 in my TC now and its fast but I think ive reached the gearing limit…
I am running the 25.5 Fantom in my F1 and I like it. In 21.5 I like the HW a bit better. I was running a Fantom, but the HW edges it out. But I prefer the Fantom 17.5 over the HW. I have a HW and Fantom in each of my Tamiya minis.
Picking one of these up this week to replace the reedy s+ motor. Should i expect a difference!???
Its the $240 works edition
Unfortunatly, I have not tested the Reedy s+ yet. Compared to Trinity, Expect a difference. So, if you have run your Reedy against Trinity motors or R1, this one is quick.
Is it the sweet spot is at 5.5 amps.
Roughly. This motor is about 5.5A. Over 6A there is not much gain but heat build up.
Is that the team spec motor or just stock spec motor
Spec
Is this the $109 dollar team edition or $149 works edition
Team Edition.
Is this the spec or team edition?
Team edition.
Which 21.5 motor would you buy?
I would get the Fantom RS over and over again. I may make a video in the future.
So its better than the Surpass V6?@telecomandorc
@@MX-CO I think it is. The Fantom is better. but someone with more skill and a V6 will beat a Fantom. But a skilled driver with a Fantom will take the field.
Im switching from a 17.5 to a 21.5 Anyone know what gearing to start with?
I currently have 72/30
Car is 2wd associated buggy
Anyone, chime in. Any feedback will be greatly appreciated.
Some thoughts: You have a 72T spur. Have you considered running the 69T. Try the 69T spur and a 35T pinion. Lock out the slipper if you are running a slipper. Slippers will slow you down a tenth or more per lap.
@telecomandorc I don't currently have a 69. I thought about trying that but they don't have one at LHS I'd have to order one, I may do that in the future.
For now I just have a 72, so not sure what to try for a pinion with 21.5 I also only have the slipper but I'm racing on High grip clay, I thought the direct drive was more for carpet?
@@MX-CO The slipper is more to save the idler gear. If you take a jump the go to throttle before the rear tires land, you can break the idler without a slipper. Carpet is higher grip than clay in my opinion since we run pins on the tires. You can always torque it down more. See what the other guys are running.
@@telecomandorc OK gotcha, I was thinking it was more for traction, and I thought the direct drive on dirt would be more likely to lose traction.
I tried both the 28 and the 30 today, both stayed cool enough, little faster with 30, I could probably go bigger though
So perhaps i should get the Fantom Helix instead of the slot machine for my 25.5....
Maybe. I do have a 25.5T on order from Fantom. It is a spec version. Not sure if you can wait, but as soon as I get it, I will run some tests.
@@telecomandorc I decided to go with the 25.5 Fantom Helix instead of the Slot Machine. I am considering swapping out my 13.5 R1 for one as well have yet to decide. I was considering going for the Helix in my 21.5 but recently saw an old video of the R1 motors testing very well on an analyzer. So Im sticking with the R1 for 21.5 for now...
BTW my trinity x-factor seems to have "wet the bed" as you say. The inner section is now loose inside the out section of the can (sorry dont know the correct terms). It was still running but i was concerned about burning up my ESC and wanted to try an R1.
@@TheNewnan3 Sound like the laminations and windings separated from the can. That can happen, I have been told by one of my race friends that runs Trinity too. My Fantom Icon v2 treated me great and liked it better than Xfactor in my buggy. But the Icon is a dog compared to the Helix.
@@telecomandorc Yeah im leaning towards replacing the R1 but dang I just got it less than a month ago lol. Honestly my lap times are only a few tenths better than the Xfactor but thats prob due to slightly better driving on my part….
@@TheNewnan3 I have a few stuff coming in including an R1. I have not made the video because I am waiting on running the Helix 21.5T mid Jan. Our last on-road race was postponed due to rain too many times. So Finally, I hope, we can finish the series. The Xfactor is defiantly my last pick between it and the HW G4 and SM.
There was a guy at our local club race tonight in the 21.5 2wd intermediate class running a helix rs, he said it was an alpha I don't see that listed anywhere, but anyway this guy's car was so so fast, it was faster than most of the 17.5 classes. He was clearing a big quad that I couldn't clear with a 17.5 . Some think he is cheating some how. He always has the fastest car in whatever classes he is in. Seems a little fishy..
Would you think he is cheating somehow, or is there a logical reason to win easily by 49 plus seconds? Is there a reason any 21.5 should be that much faster than the rest? I think there are others in his race with fantom motors as well, and he laps them with the same motor supposedly
It could be both. Now, I am a fan of Fantom RS motors. My 25.5 was a rocket. My 21.5 was awesome. I could pull on other cars and other drivers though I had something going on. They were just awesome. Now, for VTA I did take an outlaw motor and run it. I would take my time to get to the straight and then try to match people on the straight. This is how I found many people were cheating. I did tell the owner what I was doing.
The thing is the Fantom RS is truly and "alpha". So it is hard to tell. I am not sure how large your track is. 49 sec is between 2 and 3 laps here. That is a lot. The guy could be running the outlaw version. Or the guy is a pro driver and has his car dialed.
@@telecomandorcHis car is clearly faster but he isn't a pro driver, there are much better drivers at the track. But his car is very clearly faster on the straights, and clears jumps that no one else in the class can.
@@MX-CO It might be the outlaw model. The Fantom Helix RS and Outlaw versions look very similar. Just peak to see if it is an Outlaw.
Motor sounds to loud May be lube bearing.
They just vibrate on the plastic holder
When I test them sometimes they touch the plastic like James said. There are little rubber o-rings that limit vibration, but sometimes they shift. But installed it is pretty normal.