Have been thinking about this a lot lately as I come into my 2020 season. After 3 years of structured training on TrainerRoad I have found that I am really good at riding at sweet spot and threshold, but I have no endurance beyond 2 hours. Not to mention a lot of my riding tends to be in tempo/ss heart rate zones. If I look at my hr zone distribution I find that I DON'T spend much time in Z2...I tending to drift up into temp/SS zones. I think this has everything to do with lacking a strong base because I neglect doing long Z2 rides in lieu of 60-90 min trainer rides that tend to be sweet spot and/or threshold. Or if I do a training ride outside I naturally work into the sweet spot wattages because it's more enjoyable. Thanks for your video, I need more long Z2 rides in my life.
Anthony Lane I was the same way. I started doing way more Z2 rides and aiming for #nocoasting. I noticed with adding these I had more in the tank at the end of long gravel races. Like 7hrs in I was still ripping and other people were dying. I love z2 rides.
amen Anthony! Time to change things up. Really hit that z2 on the weekends and look for different stim during the week; burst workouts, or in your case, even a few 30/30 tabatas would be good to shake out the cobwebs; otherwise, any pace changes when spring comes will be BRUTAL! this depends exactly where you'll be riding in Feb-Apr, but if it's in a warm climate, people come out ready to go in late Jan! good luck and let us know if you need anything else. brendan@evoq.bike
This was fascinating to listen in, enjoyed your take and perspective on this! I'm under the impression that people tend to vary quite considerably in not only how high of a responder they are to training in general, but types of physiological demands as well, and that could dictate how much of one thing over another they may considerably benefit from in training. I'm also learning that there is a huge number of dimensions of "cycling performance" a person can train (e.g. time to exhaustion, fatigue resistance, repeatability, anaerobic capacity, muscular endurance, the list is virtually endless), and almost invariably, I think for many people there will be at least one dimension that they suck the least at (-;
I use the mid volume TR plan and add or swap in Z2 wherever I have time. It ends up as a higher volume plan (relatively) and it seems to work really well.
I've done thath too! Adding time always in Z2, after the TR session, and now I can ride up to 6 hours in a Zone 2 (on the flats) / Zone 3 - 3.5 (on the climbs) without feeling tired to crush it again on Tuesday. On rest week, I never add time, always the 2 hour ride and that's it (it was my "Coffee ride", but since COVID-19, I've just making myself a better Chef)
Great video Brendan, thanks! I am using XERT (for workouts and guidance) and sprinkle in 1-2 sweet spot workouts per week in base, and 1-2 threshold/VO2 workouts in build. The rest of the sessions in each phase is endurance (LT1 or LTP) rides. As a masters age enthusiast - it helps me not to burn out. Cheers!
Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience Brendan. I’ve been focusing too much on SweetSpot, while not reaching the extremes I did feel it harder to maintain motivation and gains. I’ve only been cycling for 3 years so a relative newcomer. I’d started to mix a little but will do more having watched this.
Great video.The secret is to always be changing your training aproach.For a season focus on climbing,other season ultra endurance,other season VO2MAX and sweetspot,etc
So if you have 10 hours a week to train right now in the off season, how do you split up that time. I can get about 1.5 hours during the week and 4 hours on Saturday. My endurance is great and have a high capacity to train hard. Something like 1 sub-threshold interval workout with 60 min intensity at 95% FTP, one sweet spot workout with 60-90 min intensity at 90% FPT, and all the rest in Z2? I don't want to start threshold too early when races start in April. And how do you progress this when you need more intensity but still restricted on time?
Eric E hey Eric! So sorry I missed this comment. Those 90 and 95% are too much like sweet spot. Incorporate some threshold or cadence work or even a vo2max once every two weeks to stay sharp. Threhsold wont make you peak too soon if that’s your worry. There’s a lot to this question with your follow up. Email me at brendan@evoq.bike if you’d like to continue it. Thanks!
With this video... were you only doing sweet spot? Or did you have at least 1-2 Z2 rides per week? Did you also sprinkle in V02 and threshold? And did you have a sweetspot focus for the entire season? Or only focused more on SS during the base phase?
Hey Austin, it was 2-3 SS a week of long duration, 40-80m per session. Yes, the rest was z2. It was base period so no vo2 Max until 6 weeks before the first early season race. Technically Ss is threshold, just low!
Great info. I’ve been using TrainerRoad structured training program and did sweet-spot base training for 12 weeks and now in the 5th week of the Build Phase (sustained power) and I notice the weekly training mixes things up between threshold training (vo2 max, 105% ftp Supra thresholds and 95-99 ftp threshold). My training is low volume training.
Hi..This is a good video. I did SS training like 3-4 times a week with 3x20min and 1 long ride on Sunday. Now, I switch to longer SS, 3x30mins, 2-3 times a week and 1 endurance ride on weekend..Since there is still no race, should I throw any threshold interval in my training block? Really appreciate your advice.Thanks
Hey Kib, I’d can the SS and move on to something else that is a weakness and related to your racing goals (RR crit CX etc). You’ve crushed SS enough IMO
No wonder.. i do 15 weeks of sweet spot and then I will fall sick, lose my gains.. recover from sickness, repeat those sweet spot workout again, improve again and then again I fall sick, always after 13 weeks.
depends why you felt cooked; if it's from the same thing, then maybe look for another option; or try a different plan of theirs. Just don't do the same thing!
Have been thinking about this a lot lately as I come into my 2020 season. After 3 years of structured training on TrainerRoad I have found that I am really good at riding at sweet spot and threshold, but I have no endurance beyond 2 hours. Not to mention a lot of my riding tends to be in tempo/ss heart rate zones. If I look at my hr zone distribution I find that I DON'T spend much time in Z2...I tending to drift up into temp/SS zones. I think this has everything to do with lacking a strong base because I neglect doing long Z2 rides in lieu of 60-90 min trainer rides that tend to be sweet spot and/or threshold. Or if I do a training ride outside I naturally work into the sweet spot wattages because it's more enjoyable. Thanks for your video, I need more long Z2 rides in my life.
Anthony Lane I was the same way. I started doing way more Z2 rides and aiming for #nocoasting. I noticed with adding these I had more in the tank at the end of long gravel races. Like 7hrs in I was still ripping and other people were dying. I love z2 rides.
amen Anthony! Time to change things up. Really hit that z2 on the weekends and look for different stim during the week; burst workouts, or in your case, even a few 30/30 tabatas would be good to shake out the cobwebs; otherwise, any pace changes when spring comes will be BRUTAL! this depends exactly where you'll be riding in Feb-Apr, but if it's in a warm climate, people come out ready to go in late Jan! good luck and let us know if you need anything else. brendan@evoq.bike
Did you do the zone 2 rides with trainerroad also? Or did you only do SS?
i know it's kinda randomly asking but do anyone know of a good site to stream newly released tv shows online?
This was fascinating to listen in, enjoyed your take and perspective on this!
I'm under the impression that people tend to vary quite considerably in not only how high of a responder they are to training in general, but types of physiological demands as well, and that could dictate how much of one thing over another they may considerably benefit from in training.
I'm also learning that there is a huge number of dimensions of "cycling performance" a person can train (e.g. time to exhaustion, fatigue resistance, repeatability, anaerobic capacity, muscular endurance, the list is virtually endless), and almost invariably, I think for many people there will be at least one dimension that they suck the least at (-;
glad you enjoyed it!! Good luck with your training!!
I use the mid volume TR plan and add or swap in Z2 wherever I have time. It ends up as a higher volume plan (relatively) and it seems to work really well.
Evan Reeves that’s awesome Evan! Glad you’ve found something that’s been working for you! Keep crushing it!
I've done thath too! Adding time always in Z2, after the TR session, and now I can ride up to 6 hours in a Zone 2 (on the flats) / Zone 3 - 3.5 (on the climbs) without feeling tired to crush it again on Tuesday. On rest week, I never add time, always the 2 hour ride and that's it (it was my "Coffee ride", but since COVID-19, I've just making myself a better Chef)
Great video Brendan, thanks! I am using XERT (for workouts and guidance) and sprinkle in 1-2 sweet spot workouts per week in base, and 1-2 threshold/VO2 workouts in build. The rest of the sessions in each phase is endurance (LT1 or LTP) rides. As a masters age enthusiast - it helps me not to burn out. Cheers!
hey Vince, that sounds like an awesome gameplan!! Thanks for sharing, and thanks for checking out the channel! Good luck with your training!
Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience Brendan. I’ve been focusing too much on SweetSpot, while not reaching the extremes I did feel it harder to maintain motivation and gains. I’ve only been cycling for 3 years so a relative newcomer. I’d started to mix a little but will do more having watched this.
awesome! VO2Max is tough stuff, but the benefits are huge!! let us know if you need any help getting the dosage right. Go harder! Good luck!
Great video.The secret is to always be changing your training aproach.For a season focus on climbing,other season ultra endurance,other season VO2MAX and sweetspot,etc
thanks for watching Enrico!
So if you have 10 hours a week to train right now in the off season, how do you split up that time. I can get about 1.5 hours during the week and 4 hours on Saturday. My endurance is great and have a high capacity to train hard. Something like 1 sub-threshold interval workout with 60 min intensity at 95% FTP, one sweet spot workout with 60-90 min intensity at 90% FPT, and all the rest in Z2? I don't want to start threshold too early when races start in April. And how do you progress this when you need more intensity but still restricted on time?
Eric E hey Eric! So sorry I missed this comment. Those 90 and 95% are too much like sweet spot. Incorporate some threshold or cadence work or even a vo2max once every two weeks to stay sharp. Threhsold wont make you peak too soon if that’s your worry.
There’s a lot to this question with your follow up. Email me at brendan@evoq.bike if you’d like to continue it. Thanks!
With this video... were you only doing sweet spot? Or did you have at least 1-2 Z2 rides per week? Did you also sprinkle in V02 and threshold? And did you have a sweetspot focus for the entire season? Or only focused more on SS during the base phase?
Hey Austin, it was 2-3 SS a week of long duration, 40-80m per session. Yes, the rest was z2. It was base period so no vo2 Max until 6 weeks before the first early season race. Technically Ss is threshold, just low!
Great info. I’ve been using TrainerRoad structured training program and did sweet-spot base training for 12 weeks and now in the 5th week of the Build Phase (sustained power) and I notice the weekly training mixes things up between threshold training (vo2 max, 105% ftp Supra thresholds and 95-99 ftp threshold). My training is low volume training.
Methodical2 that’s awesome, glad they are mixing things up and keeping you away from stagnation. Keep crushing it!
Have you already checked out the new dylan johnson video? :-D
haha sure have; he beat me to it!
Hi..This is a good video. I did SS training like 3-4 times a week with 3x20min and 1 long ride on Sunday. Now, I switch to longer SS, 3x30mins, 2-3 times a week and 1 endurance ride on weekend..Since there is still no race, should I throw any threshold interval in my training block? Really appreciate your advice.Thanks
Hey Kib, I’d can the SS and move on to something else that is a weakness and related to your racing goals (RR crit CX etc). You’ve crushed SS enough IMO
@@EVOQBIKE thanks for your advice. I’m more towards XC/XCO rider.
@@KibAgong check out the podcast with Jason Hilimire, and I'd do some XCO sims...hard starts to vo2max to threshold to low threshold...
@@EVOQBIKE that would be awesome. Can share me the link?
@@EVOQBIKE found it! Thank you✌🏽
No wonder.. i do 15 weeks of sweet spot and then I will fall sick, lose my gains.. recover from sickness, repeat those sweet spot workout again, improve again and then again I fall sick, always after 13 weeks.
oof, yeah that is SO much sweet spot; time to change it up!
So is trainerroad still worth it ? I really dont want to feel cooked again.
depends why you felt cooked; if it's from the same thing, then maybe look for another option; or try a different plan of theirs. Just don't do the same thing!