Thank you so much for this video. I have watched it several times. I am more than halfway through my novel, I know my story and my characters well. But I used this video to answer the questions you wanted me to ask myself about my protagonist. It mostly solidified what I knew, but that info that crystalized is critical to me finishing this book and to it making sense. But it also opened my eyes to a relationship my protagonist has with another character, and where that relationship needs to be at the end of the story, which is different from where I was going. Please know that these videos are incredibly helpful. Much respect to you and your business partner.
This is, frankly, a genius way of looking at character arc. When you consider what plot points you need to have to get your characters to arc the way you want to, it’s hard enough for one level, much less all six. But if you can achieve it, it will no doubt create a very satisfying story.
@@StoryGrid He is a genius, but I’m grateful for the way you communicate it all - this was clear and practical, and not sure why but in all my studies of SG, this is the first time I’ve heard of using these 6 levels like this (they stem from the genres types - of course!)
You have absolutely great content. You are converting me to your Story Grid cult/sales funnel. I could absolutely see me vying for a slot in your workshops within a year
Just found your channel, super excited to binge a bunch of these videos. Currently working on a more whimsical comic, but unsatisfied with some areas where the characters feel flat, so I can't wait to go through these lists and use these tools. Death was surprising to me because it's not something that I've considered for the comic. Also truth - considering the start and end state of belief for the protagonist will help come up with events within the story. Thanks!
Your videos are some of the best out there. You have helped me improve almost every aspect of my writing. Thank you. Just one question, do all 6 levels have to be in every story? I'll have to watch this several more times to have it sink in.
This framework is very helpful. I’ve been struggling with a story idea mostly from the standpoint of plot. This gives me an idea of approaching it from a different perspective.
Thank you! Even though I am writing a children's story, this little checklist is helping me make my little more complex than just a generic female in a pink dress.
Most surprising? For me, the most surprising dimension you laid out is renaming/refining Coyne's use of Horror Genre to Mortality. And it works. Thanks for that tweak. Altogether this video is a great thumbnail for how to think about which "values" change across a story--indeed, across a reader's (or writer's) life.
The only thing really surprising to me about this was the notion that it should all be present. Thanks for the video. Maybe I should try to read through the story grid book again. I had a hard time with it last time I tried.
I think Tim and Shawn’s style of communication is quite different from each other - I’ve had trouble understanding Shawn’s more academic style, and love Tim’s more straightforward style. One thing that’s helped is to search for the topic of interest on the SG website and read the articles written by some of the other SG editors - same philosophy but different methods of breaking it down.
These six levels of change define what makes a story strong from what makes a story not strong. If you have them, the story can be strong. If you don't have them, it can't. It really could not be more simple than that. They are one of the main things that makes a story strong. Of course there are a lot more things that are also important, but the importance here is significant. I agree with everything said here. And there is another factor, and that is the opposite of change. what I mean is that the way I see it, a good protagonist may have core beliefs and tendencies that do not change, things that make them who they are. This does not mean they must be flat characters, because they should also have the levels of change that Tim is speaking of. But just like you can't have, or identify, peaks in your story effectively if you don't include valleys to separate them (which would otherwise result in a flat story experience for the reader regardless how many peaks there are), it's good to have these solid, unchangeable aspects there as a contrast to the changes. for instance, you can have a protagonist that goes through all these levels of change, yet is still heroic on page one forward, and still knows that their role is to protect those they love, and is willing to step up. There is no need to wait for a midpoint shift or a 'look in the mirror' moment halfway through the story in order to show what their core essence really is. In other words, there is no requirement that every aspect of your character must change. Ironically, both the story and the character can be stronger if their core essence is expressed, and does not change. It ensures that they are solid, and not wishy-washy. Then just express what does change for them everywhere else. Change in story is also somewhat complex. Hercule Poirot is essentially a flat character. He's the same exact person at the beginning of every story as he is at the end of every story. In a murder mystery like that, the protagonist foments change, but most of the change happens to those around them, such as the victims and the villains. A master detective character is typically more of a catalyst for change. It doesn't appear that Poirot's belief in justice changes, that's a pretty solid part of that character's beliefs. But he understands justice to be more than just purely judicial. He also understands extrajudicial justice, sometimes referred to as frontier justice, which is the same core belief that protagonists who are antiheroes and vigilantes believe in. Murder on the Orient Express shows us how complex his concept of justice actually is, and that it is not just simplistic, and that view is not based on change. It's based on his unchanging core beliefs. What this means is that the value at stake in that sort of story, which is justice versus injustice, a form of order versus chaos, is still quite relevant to the story.
The issue with this advice is that it will probably make you write a Disney style cliché story. Most people know how these stories work and could probably write a working version. The real challenge is to apply your principles *without* ending up in Disneyland.
I respectfully disagree with you on all points. Most people can appreciate a good story, for sure, but as for why the story actually works, they'll be lost; nor can 'most people' write a decent page worthy of a novel. And getting to Disneyland is a whole lot better than being lost at sea; some thoughtful navigation with the help of a map will get the most committed of writers to shore (Disneyland if you're lucky).
@@JaneDonaldson1we disagree then. My point is: Aspiring writers come to YT and hear “the real insight is that all stories work the same, here take this Aladin-story-recipe”. Stories don’t work because of “conflict” or “character arc” etc. They work despite it! Many good stories will inherently come with these things naturally. The challenge is then to make them as invisible as possible. Because it is not the character arc that keeps the reader reading, it is everything else beside the arc. Said differently: don’t start with a bad story and add those elements; find a great story and try to remove them as much as possible. This is also why many beginning writers don’t even know about these elements. Because they were busy reading the interesting part of the story: a jinni granting wishes; a sorcery school and new amazing friends; a crazy man who thinks he is a knight…
I think there's truth to this. I don't want to stringently follow the advice of a single author, because I might handicap my writing by boxing it in too much to a singular formula.
@@jeyhey5320 An interesting perspective, but I highly disagree. There are a lot of videos that will give the impression there's only 'one way to write' or 'one way to tell a story' and so on, which is absolutely untrue, so we agree there. Nevertheless, concept is second to execution, and the points mentioned in this video are about execution. Every good story needs essential ingredients to make it interesting, and these sorts of tips are addressing those ingredients. Concept alone is not enough to make a story interesting. If something comes off as formulaic, its simply because the ingredients were not well applied or not well understood. To tell people to try to remove these elements instead of thinking them through is just bad advice, though there be something to the idea of making them invisible. Ideas are all well and good, but it all boils down to execution and these sorts of videos help aspiring writers understand the essential ingredients they need to consider and also helps them understand how to apply them in practise. All the stories you mention boil down to these same essential ingredients masterfully applied. These are the building blocks of a story, and it is important to know how to use them, else you're a child fumbling with Legos.
@@PenSwordTheFirst Actually I do enjoy the videos of this channel and they help me reflect on my own little writing that are very modest. At the end, what do I know, I‘m not a renown author or anything. Sometimes I just shout out like in my comments above. Probably, it is the incomprehensibleness of true outstanding writing (the ones that stood the test of time, not the ones in current bestseller lists) that gets the best of me.
Thank you so much for this video. I have watched it several times. I am more than halfway through my novel, I know my story and my characters well. But I used this video to answer the questions you wanted me to ask myself about my protagonist. It mostly solidified what I knew, but that info that crystalized is critical to me finishing this book and to it making sense. But it also opened my eyes to a relationship my protagonist has with another character, and where that relationship needs to be at the end of the story, which is different from where I was going. Please know that these videos are incredibly helpful. Much respect to you and your business partner.
This is, frankly, a genius way of looking at character arc. When you consider what plot points you need to have to get your characters to arc the way you want to, it’s hard enough for one level, much less all six.
But if you can achieve it, it will no doubt create a very satisfying story.
This is all Shawn Coyne’s genius. I’m just trying to teach it 😀 - Tim
@@StoryGrid He is a genius, but I’m grateful for the way you communicate it all - this was clear and practical, and not sure why but in all my studies of SG, this is the first time I’ve heard of using these 6 levels like this (they stem from the genres types - of course!)
You have absolutely great content. You are converting me to your Story Grid cult/sales funnel. I could absolutely see me vying for a slot in your workshops within a year
Excellent advice sir!
Just found your channel, super excited to binge a bunch of these videos. Currently working on a more whimsical comic, but unsatisfied with some areas where the characters feel flat, so I can't wait to go through these lists and use these tools.
Death was surprising to me because it's not something that I've considered for the comic. Also truth - considering the start and end state of belief for the protagonist will help come up with events within the story.
Thanks!
Thanks, you vidios are very helpful. Six levels of change, only recognised a couple before. Chears. Keep up the good work. 😊
Your videos are some of the best out there. You have helped me improve almost every aspect of my writing. Thank you. Just one question, do all 6 levels have to be in every story? I'll have to watch this several more times to have it sink in.
Great advice - thank you very much for these in depth videos. They are enormously helpful.
This framework is very helpful. I’ve been struggling with a story idea mostly from the standpoint of plot. This gives me an idea of approaching it from a different perspective.
Thank you! Even though I am writing a children's story, this little checklist is helping me make my little more complex than just a generic female in a pink dress.
Most surprising? For me, the most surprising dimension you laid out is renaming/refining Coyne's use of Horror Genre to Mortality. And it works. Thanks for that tweak.
Altogether this video is a great thumbnail for how to think about which "values" change across a story--indeed, across a reader's (or writer's) life.
The only thing really surprising to me about this was the notion that it should all be present.
Thanks for the video.
Maybe I should try to read through the story grid book again. I had a hard time with it last time I tried.
I think Tim and Shawn’s style of communication is quite different from each other - I’ve had trouble understanding Shawn’s more academic style, and love Tim’s more straightforward style. One thing that’s helped is to search for the topic of interest on the SG website and read the articles written by some of the other SG editors - same philosophy but different methods of breaking it down.
These six levels of change define what makes a story strong from what makes a story not strong. If you have them, the story can be strong. If you don't have them, it can't. It really could not be more simple than that. They are one of the main things that makes a story strong. Of course there are a lot more things that are also important, but the importance here is significant.
I agree with everything said here. And there is another factor, and that is the opposite of change. what I mean is that the way I see it, a good protagonist may have core beliefs and tendencies that do not change, things that make them who they are. This does not mean they must be flat characters, because they should also have the levels of change that Tim is speaking of.
But just like you can't have, or identify, peaks in your story effectively if you don't include valleys to separate them (which would otherwise result in a flat story experience for the reader regardless how many peaks there are), it's good to have these solid, unchangeable aspects there as a contrast to the changes. for instance, you can have a protagonist that goes through all these levels of change, yet is still heroic on page one forward, and still knows that their role is to protect those they love, and is willing to step up.
There is no need to wait for a midpoint shift or a 'look in the mirror' moment halfway through the story in order to show what their core essence really is. In other words, there is no requirement that every aspect of your character must change. Ironically, both the story and the character can be stronger if their core essence is expressed, and does not change. It ensures that they are solid, and not wishy-washy. Then just express what does change for them everywhere else.
Change in story is also somewhat complex. Hercule Poirot is essentially a flat character. He's the same exact person at the beginning of every story as he is at the end of every story. In a murder mystery like that, the protagonist foments change, but most of the change happens to those around them, such as the victims and the villains. A master detective character is typically more of a catalyst for change.
It doesn't appear that Poirot's belief in justice changes, that's a pretty solid part of that character's beliefs. But he understands justice to be more than just purely judicial. He also understands extrajudicial justice, sometimes referred to as frontier justice, which is the same core belief that protagonists who are antiheroes and vigilantes believe in.
Murder on the Orient Express shows us how complex his concept of justice actually is, and that it is not just simplistic, and that view is not based on change. It's based on his unchanging core beliefs. What this means is that the value at stake in that sort of story, which is justice versus injustice, a form of order versus chaos, is still quite relevant to the story.
The issue with this advice is that it will probably make you write a Disney style cliché story. Most people know how these stories work and could probably write a working version. The real challenge is to apply your principles *without* ending up in Disneyland.
I respectfully disagree with you on all points. Most people can appreciate a good story, for sure, but as for why the story actually works, they'll be lost; nor can 'most people' write a decent page worthy of a novel. And getting to Disneyland is a whole lot better than being lost at sea; some thoughtful navigation with the help of a map will get the most committed of writers to shore (Disneyland if you're lucky).
@@JaneDonaldson1we disagree then.
My point is: Aspiring writers come to YT and hear “the real insight is that all stories work the same, here take this Aladin-story-recipe”.
Stories don’t work because of “conflict” or “character arc” etc. They work despite it! Many good stories will inherently come with these things naturally. The challenge is then to make them as invisible as possible. Because it is not the character arc that keeps the reader reading, it is everything else beside the arc. Said differently: don’t start with a bad story and add those elements; find a great story and try to remove them as much as possible.
This is also why many beginning writers don’t even know about these elements. Because they were busy reading the interesting part of the story: a jinni granting wishes; a sorcery school and new amazing friends; a crazy man who thinks he is a knight…
I think there's truth to this. I don't want to stringently follow the advice of a single author, because I might handicap my writing by boxing it in too much to a singular formula.
@@jeyhey5320 An interesting perspective, but I highly disagree. There are a lot of videos that will give the impression there's only 'one way to write' or 'one way to tell a story' and so on, which is absolutely untrue, so we agree there.
Nevertheless, concept is second to execution, and the points mentioned in this video are about execution. Every good story needs essential ingredients to make it interesting, and these sorts of tips are addressing those ingredients. Concept alone is not enough to make a story interesting. If something comes off as formulaic, its simply because the ingredients were not well applied or not well understood.
To tell people to try to remove these elements instead of thinking them through is just bad advice, though there be something to the idea of making them invisible. Ideas are all well and good, but it all boils down to execution and these sorts of videos help aspiring writers understand the essential ingredients they need to consider and also helps them understand how to apply them in practise.
All the stories you mention boil down to these same essential ingredients masterfully applied. These are the building blocks of a story, and it is important to know how to use them, else you're a child fumbling with Legos.
@@PenSwordTheFirst Actually I do enjoy the videos of this channel and they help me reflect on my own little writing that are very modest.
At the end, what do I know, I‘m not a renown author or anything. Sometimes I just shout out like in my comments above. Probably, it is the incomprehensibleness of true outstanding writing (the ones that stood the test of time, not the ones in current bestseller lists) that gets the best of me.