How Hiro Mashima Is Better Than Kishimoto
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- Edens Zero is better than Samurai 8, but is Hiro Mashima better than Masashi Kishimoto?
#edenszero #hiromashima #edenszeromanga
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I do not own EDENS ZERO, the EDENS ZERO manga or the EDENS ZERO anime.
© 2018 by Hiro Mashima
I do not own Samurai 8: The Tale of Hachimaru.
© 2019 by Masashi Kishimoto, Akira Okubo/SHUEISHA Inc.
Copyright Disclaimer under section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for “fair use” for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, education and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. Non-profit, educational or personal use tips the balance in favor of fair use.
How would you rate Edens Zero and the other manga we mentioned? Where would you rank Mashima and Kishimoto?
I can’t speak on rave as I’ve never read or watched it before but Edens zero is definitely better than FT, samurai 8 and Boruto, naruto as well but barely, but that could also change once it finishes
As for which mangaka is more successful? I’d say kishimoto by a little bit but only cause of Naruto due to how popular & successful it is worldwide compared to Rave, FT & EZ, He barely has that much involvement in the Boruto series & S8 was a big failure due to how mediocre it was, meanwhile mashima’s had 3 successful ongoing manga back to back even if they’re not as popular as Naruto
@@MAMZYY_YT Telling you man. You should definitely read Rave Master.
@@ShonenOuji I’ll try to bro… maybe 1 day 😭
1.Fairy tail
2. Edens zero
3. Naruto
4.Rave master
5.Samurai 8
Series base on my liking. Haven't read Rave(planning to) and Samurai 8(Not planning to)
1 - Edens zero
2 - Fairy tail
3 - Naruto
Mangaka base on skill and my knowing.
1 & 2 - Oda and Mashima(Both different reason)
3 - Takahashi
4 - Kishimoto
5 - Togashi
Thanks for having me on! It was a joy speaking with you!
Right back at you man. We definitely have to do this again.
Yoooo its yoo boy Naruto Explained here
Mashima is highly slept on. Rave Master shines for the continuity and depth of characters with Haru, Ellie, Musica, Jet, etc. Even the villains were so well developed, Doryu is my shining example for them. Don't get my started on the stakes, especially in the final saga. Then Fairy Tail showed shine more in the character interactions as it wasn't about an adventure people joined up with, but a group going out on adventures. Despite what others say, Fairy Tail is good and those character moments hit hard in the feels because it's written like you're a part of the guild traveling with Natsu, Happy, Lucy, Gray, Erza, etc. and these are your guild mates you're learning more about it with their own backstories. Then there's Edens Zero, which takes the continuity, stakes, and depth of character from Rave; along with the character backstories, character interactions, and group identity of Fairy Tail and combines them into a perfect fusion. Edens Zero borrows aspects from both while also adding in new things like fresh examples of variation in character with the aliens and machines, much more detailed and lived in world building, and stronger commitment to both the serious/darker tones in hand with the lighter/comedic ones. Mashima is just a rare one where I have really enjoyed all of his major works and I very much feel is not given enough credit for how talented he is.
To this day, I keep wishing for them to do an anime remake of Rave so the masses, especially those outside of Japan, can see how amazing of a story it is. It happened for my other favorite, good from beginning to end manga Shaman King, so there is hope.
Mashima really is a blessing. He’s unlike most authors in that you can pretty much guarantee anything he does is gonna be great.
Let's be real mashima is so goated and talented... I can't even tell any mangaka that i know who can make a manga three in a row and all successful... not to mention he's busy on small manga like GoN, fairy tail game connected, RUclips etc.
Well for one there's Takehiko Inoue the mangaka of Slam Dunk, Vagabond and Real
And more he has time to play video games with friends he’s a game creator and has been working on it too
Closest is togashi making 2 legendary manga, even tho HxH isnt finished yet
Rumiko takahashi is goat. She has like 5 in a row all super popular.
mashima needs more appreciation no matter how much people like to make fun of it there no denying how successful fairy tail was, also when you take a good look at it he has 2 highly successful completed series and 2 successful ongoing ones(100 year quest and edens zero). And on top of already working on all of this he also worked on a few games
you gotta admit this man is probably one of the most dedicated mangaka out there
This was fire you guys killed it and be nice to see Shonen pop up on a Narutoexplained Collab sometime. You guys did great
Thank you! Really glad to see you enjoyed it as much as you did.
I think the problem with Kishimoto It's the fan base not wanting to see anything besides naruto He is in the exact same position.That Akira Toriyama was in The fan base not wanting to see anything else besides dragon ball
Mashima has always been amazing at
1. Setting up the world and allegiances
2. Original character introductions
3. Foreshadowing and setting up future plot points
4. Consistent artwork
5. Emotional scenes
He still has one problem with Edens Zero and it has to do with the Necessary Evil of having to have every character get filler fights that don't mean much as the bigger picture. These filler fights unfold in between the beginning and ending of each arc. They help the larger cast get more relevancy but Mashima has never made them interesting whatsoever. His storytelling itself especially in Edens Zero is pretty remarkable and everything progresses from one thing to another in a clear-cut manner. The cast have goals and the plot itself progresses and there are many factions that can affect the story itself.
Many people praise Togashi for progressing his stories in natural manner from arc to arc, and that's what Mashima has always been great at as well.
I hope he can sometime in the future find better use for in-between chapters instead of those filler background character fights that take place in every arc. Aside form those, Edens Zero is great.
What Kishimoto does is take one large group of people and give them arc after arc throughout hundreds of chapters, making the main storyline barely progress ever. This is what made people get connected to the cast at large but I much prefer the Togashi style of writing where the author introduces a cast of characters and lets them be individual factors that reside in the world the author creates, such as the Phantom Troupe. Mashima basically uses that same ideology as well as he doesn't want to drag his story by giving side villains too much relevancy, but he also always attempts to connect every new character to some faction or character.
I always loved Mashima’s work. He’s very good at creating characters with personality. I always felt Rave Master was ahead of it’s time, solid story. Fairy Tail always felt hated on even though it’s more of an adventure story, when most big mangas at the time focused on power leveling. But with Eden’s Zero I think he’s using everything he’s learned to make his best series yet. It’s super fun and the battles have been entertaining. I can’t wait to see where it goes!
How is FT any different? Fanssrvice and deus ex machina power ups out of nowhere! FT is not that great so just stop!
See with Rave hiro actually planned out the story from pretty much start to finish and by the time Volume 17 came out in July of 2002 the guy had already planned out the entire rest of the story and had the ending set in stone which the final volume of Rave came out in September of 2005 so he essentially had 3+ years of work already planned out
He would put in so much planning and set up into an arc that when the guy went back to check over the arc he didn’t even realize just how much foreshadowing and set up he had put into the story
And Rave was intended to be a dark story as major plot point in Rave was the theme of life and death so in Rave we had quite a few important and fan favorite characters die
With FT he went the opposite direction and had nothing planned for the story other than the MC’s backstory and he was just taking things by a week by week basis
I mean the manga was supposed to end around Volume 10 but due to its popularity Hiro kept the story going
Now with Edens Zero the guy has stated he has the major plot points of story already planned out and has an idea of how and where he wants to end the story but is still leaving himself some room to change certain things he doesn’t like or changes his mind on which is likely why time travel and time manipulation is a big plot point in Edens Zero so Hiro could change certain things he doesn’t like
So I wouldn’t really say he improves from manga to manga he just has different styles of writing each of his mangas
This is a great way of putting it, but I’d still say he’s generally improving. Both in his art and writing. Either way, the importance of planning is reflected in these stories and you can see it in the success of other manga too.
@@ShonenOuji Yea he definitely has improved in terms of art but that’s kinda given since he has been doing manga 20+ years
And he definitely has improved In terms of writing and as a mangaka as he actually listens to his fans and will change certain things In EZ based on the fans wants but still will stick to his guns and go with what he wants so like with EZ he has a balance between fans wants and his wants
Where as with Rave he listened to the fans but not as much given he already had the story set in stone and he received some hate mail based on how he killed of a certain character in Rave
And with FT I think he let the fans influence the story a little to much such as bringing Lisasnna back into the story which is what the fans wanted but wasn’t really well received due to the execution of such event
Overall good video tho👍
Fairy Tail was pretty well planned for the first 200 or so chapters. Success just got to Mashima and he stretched the story.
I would say that after Tartarus was defeated was when things went south for Fairy tail.
@@dspace4514according to others he was forced to rush through the end of FT to start on EZ
Personally, both these authors were who helped me get into manga. Rave Master was actually my first manga.
Very jealous. I wish I had been able to read Rave Master much earlier than I did.
Love the take and I will agree. Kishimoto have great success with Naruto but he doesn't 'evolved' as a writer. Hiro on the other hand , he kept going up after series after series. Hiro currently the most talented in term of making multiple series. He stand beside Oda for me in different. Oda top 1 series and Hiro top multi series. I waiting for OP to end and wonder if Oda can replicate , if he can't then Hiro number 1 talented Mangaka.
After reading edens zero to 200 chapters, in terms of writing it on the big 3 level, (my opinion)
The artstyle gets better as you go along the chapters especially the details in space.
It's better than FT, without a doubt but FT is more enjoyable
Mashima seems to be one of the most consistent manga authors out there. Three hit series. Not a lot of mangaka can say that. And since I haven't read Rave Master, I see Edens Zero as fixing everything that went wrong in Fairy Tail while also taking all the things Fairy Tail did right
Perfectly well said fellow mashima fan🤙🏻💙
Fairy Tail > Naruto
Correction: That should be Nox from Project Manga, not "Nux."
Btw, you should totally subscribe to the Project Manga podcast:
ruclips.net/user/ProjectMANGAofc
Coming back and replicating success is absolutely a mark of a good mangaka. Another example is Inagaki with Eyeshield 21 & Dr Stone. I think another aspect of this particular discussion point not brought up in the different magazines these two creators were in. Despite all the series having sales numbers recorded, there's a reason WSJ readers keep track more than than WSM readers. There are several series in WSM that don't sell the greatest but continue to thrive in the magazine while WSJ is a revolving door. I genuinely believe in a different magazine Samurai 8 could have skated by on name recognition alone then built up to something really great. Cause the science & fantasy elements were quite interesting. I understand why WSJ does this process though as it has produced some of the best shonen out there because of it.
Definitely a big factor. To some extent, Edens Zero definitely gets to sit comfy in WSM. Meanwhile, nobody is safe in WSJ. Even then, I think more fans were still interested in Edens Zero around the time Samurai 8 got cancelled.
@@ShonenOuji That's hard for me to say since it was a while ago. I recall a lot of people were interested in the early stages of Samurai 8 & EZ took till the around or the Draken Joe arc to be heavily discussed. So I guess my point is EZ had the opportunity to become as good as it is currently.
Samurai 8 was a good concept, but Kishimoto tried to just info dump to early on, what ruined the reading experience.
is samurai 8 still on going because I really thought that it is just a one-shot, the first chapter really didn't hook me whatsoever, it feels really dull and over complicated.
@@yoshihiroitabashi no it ended around 40 chapters I think
@@yoshihiroitabashi but doesn't really get any better after it
Almost every manga Mashima Sensei has made since ravemaster has been a financial success Mashima Sensei is on another level when it comes to his out put and his art consistently amazing
Love the video man and the point you both up, had think Hiro is going down as as one of the time greats. Like I feel like there will be a case study on him about his success and how there aren't many people who do that.
If there isn’t a case study on him already then there definitely should be.
Deffo great points made from you both. Another thing to think about is out of the myriad new series we've gotten from Jump as of late a lot of them that had interesting concepts for stories with decent to very impressive art didn't make it to 100 chapters much less get to tbe point of selling 10s of millions or thousands of volumes. Stuff like Zipper-Man, Hard-Boiled Cop and Dolphin, Build King (though it kinda squandered its concept), Red Hood etc etc.
Still haven't actually checked out the source material of any of Mashima's work and my only exp with it is the anime adaptaion of Fairy Tail which I also haven't finished. But your opinions are making me consider changing that so mission accomplished!
Edens Zero is definitely worth reading. Plus the pacing is really good so you fly through those chapters.
Great point about the new WSJ series. One thing I find is something like Zip-man will be really cool but just struggle to give readers a real hook. Then something like Red Hood is full of detail, but there’s so much going on that you begin to lose focus. Starting a series off the right way is a very underrated talent in my opinion.
My favorite thing about Mashima is that he’s not afraid to evolve his art! Just look at how good he has gotten from the start of Rave to the start of EZ!! You can even tell that the art at the start of EZ to now is soooo much better!!
Switching to digital was the best thing he ever did.
Great video this was definitely an interesting discussion given how both series started around the same time and had the same space sci-fi theme but only Eden Zero had gone the distance, looking back on it it feels like Kishimoto wanted to address some of things that he thought were missing in Naruto like the foreshowing and world building early on which is why it feels like he went out of his way to double down on it in the early chapters which in turn probably made it harder for new readers to digest, which is something most fans of his work (and most people in general) are not used too given how Naruto started, Edens Zero on the other hand seems to be Hiro Mashima using everything he learned writing both Rave Master and Fairy Tail to tell a new story with his mastered formula of writing which helps you understand the characters and the story in his own style, I think this could end up being his best work even if it isnt the most successful,
Foreshadowing is great, but it gets to be a bit much if it’s not spread out properly. After awhile it just makes things incoherent.
@@ShonenOuji yeah I agree
I'm not a ladies man or anything but i have met far less women who watch anime and even less who actually play games , they clearly do exist but i know about a handful of them. What I'm trying to say is that the world is big you will run into someone or several people who share your hobbies don't get discouraged.
And it's okay my damn coworker spoiled Eden for me lol so I knew about it getting dark but if comparing to these two yeah I gotta go with Eden Zero
Mashima is my favorite Manga author. I loved fairy tail, and Edens Zero is awesome, one I'm really enjoying and awaiting each volume when it comes out I read day one.
This man's has made 3 super successful names another one the way dudes super mega talented all he needs better story line tellers but definitely how to make amazing unique characters no one beats him at that 🔥🔥
Rave master got a video game
I think when it comes to art Mashima & Kubo are the two best manga artist of Shonen, or Shonen like art overall. My two idols & favorite artists by far. NO ONE DRAWS GIRLS AS HOT AS MASHIMA! Lol that’s a definite there.. mashima by far is the best at drawing girls.
And I seen the first half of Eden Zero and it is fire and samurai 8 I wish we got like ten more chapters but he definitely had his mind I believe set on other Projects
I read fairy tail 1st then Edens zero, rave master. Also short story.i only can appreciate mashima.🙂
To me, Hiro Mashima is better at creating the start of a manga. Kishimoto is the opposite, he is a slow starting engine. Also, Hiro Mashima has more creativity in world building lol (even though he keeps recycling the ether and magic stuff)
It was a great video right here, not everyone can make it to the market so many times with different products in this case manga, with so many options of mangas out, but thats when you realize mashima made a name for his artstyle, bein able to look to gate of nightmares and say: hey thats mashima's work just like when you see dragon quest and you know who's art is that its legendary, being able to recreate that succes as an artist is great, not many artist create many masterpieces speaking from books or mangas, take j.k rowling for example, she created a masterpiece like harry Potter but aside from that I dont see her recreating a new work from zero to scrath with a new world, different characters and different environment and having the same success as before, like a said not many artist can create many masterpieces of stories or art, thats why Im my opinion mashima is one of the best mangakas right now.
I feel like the odd one out when I didn't like Fairy Tail but I didn't hate it either I just said "Its not for me", move on. So that's why I was surprised that Mashima drew me in with Edens Zero. I always like Scifi anime like Outlaw Star, Cowboy Bebop and Dirty Pair and as much as like Fantasy I feel like the Isekai genre pollutated it with Video game references that I feel are cringey and overdone(the reason why I don't really care much for the Digitalis arc even though the premise was kinda cool). So seeing a return to Space Fantasy ala Outlaw Star has been a treat with Edens Zero.
Valid take on Fairy Tail. It’s just not for everyone. But glad to hear it worked out for you with Edens Zero.
i dont want to spoil but one of the character death is very impactful to me and not only that it futhur develop some character
The complaint about art being the same style is so backwards. That like saying a singer isn't good because he sounds like he did before
I like how other Edens zero RUclipsrs for these videos its nice to have other perspectives with other topics.
Braindead Mashima glazer spotted xDD
Nah samurai 8 if it went longer would be super goated
I’m sure, but that’s just the market. You have to be able to keep people’s interest to a certain extent.
This background beat iiiss 🔥
Very cool having Naruto Explained on here and I mainly know FT and Rave Master even though my memory foggy on that one but don't like Eden Zero but I'll say it's definitely better than Samurai 8 lul
Any particular reason you don’t like Edens Zero?
@@ShonenOuji To be honest none I can think of in particular I just didn't like the story from what I read or saw plus it wasn't vibing with me so I dropped it
I've never understood the art style complaint it's their art style I would expect it to stay the same maybe with some changes regardless of what story their doing plus if your following an artstst you like their style
Rave master my child hood😂😂😂😂😂😂
Ft was at something my favorite show but then the flaws of friendship and bas writing and forced fanservise made me drop it eden zero is so interesting by it has fts flaws times 10
Fairy tail is 🔥🔥🔥🔥💯💯💯
Idk, I think this is a dumb comparison. To say that Kishimoto is "worse" because he hasn't had consistent successes like Mashima did with Rave and Fairy Tail and Eden Zero isn't even a valid argument. Oda's only real success was One Piece, but is anyone going to say that Mashima is better than Oda because he only had one success while Mashima has 3 hit series? Obviously not. The fact that any of these mangaka have had a single series as big as One Piece and Naruto and Fairy Tail just shows that they're all masters at their craft.
Bro no fairy tale fan can to contradict you cause they know your right😂😂
Wow
Hot take but Eden Zero is 100 times better than Fairy Tail because it's unique.
Fairy Tail is cheap One Piece but wizards, seriously Gildarts and Shanks are twins, Evil Guilds is basically Evil Pirate Groups etc.. But One Piece arcs is still waaaaay better (Water 7, Ennies Lobby, Sabaody, Marineford etc.. )
Black Clover is also better in terms of Wizard shonen type as the world building lore, power systems, anti-magic, devils, Wizard king and more like they're relying on strategy instead of power of friendships plus Black Bulls crew captured the Straw Hats dynamic more than Fairy Tail roster (too many members) Asta and Yuno>>>>Natsu and Gray.
Might as well say “Naruto’s a cheap One Piece but ninjas” this is a dumb take (no offense) people need to stop using the “power of friendship took the show” when FTs world (magic) revolves around emotions and bonds. You compared one character and suddenly it’s a copy? The characters only look alike but are completely different. I can agree that One Pieces arcs are good however but these comparisons are ridiculous
black clover doesn't have as much emotion and personality as fairy tail. that alone fairy tail >
I loved fairy tail but I haven’t read or watched rave master or Eden zero yet. I’m still confused if Eden zero is a sequel or its own thing all together
Eden’s Zero is a separate universe. Mashima even made a manga crossover with Rave, FT, and EZ
@@bluebloo9955 oh ok 👍
W
I think in the photo of Akira Okubo is Atsushi Okubo of (Soul eater/Fire Force).
I've been binge reading edens zero. I liked rave master back when it aired and I think fairy tail is ok but I'm really loving edens zero, Dead Rock is ok too so far. I might give fairy tail another try once I'm done with EZ
I am a Naruto fan, but fairy tail is my guilty pleasure
Fairy Tail is my *proud* pleasure.
I am going to admit i did think it was fairy tail in space, but i was so happy it wasn't when i started reading, so i was wrong in the best way possible
Nice video
Thank you!
@@ShonenOuji your welcome
Art style is normal. The only nitpick I have is the main character designs because it looks too much like fairy tail’s main characters. But its just a nitpick haha. The story is still very interesting.
I honestly feel bad for samurai 8, the potential was sitting right there, and kishimoto had something special on his hands, but he took too much time trying to establish the world instead of endearing us to the characters, It was too much and that's why I dropped as well.
Yep they are in the same tier. And Edens Zero is better than Samurai 8 but i think he learnt from his mistakes coz the boruto manga after he returned to it as been great.
i would not call lucy a big brain , just really small depend on the plot .
But we can agree Naruto is better than fairytale, even tho both have their own charm
I am super impressed with Mashima for making three incredible series back to back
Kishimoto whole thing was that he thought his name alone was going to carry his work.
3:41 she is the female natsu
Kishimoto is pretty overrated as a mangaka to me. There's a reason he's only seen as the Shakespeare of manga in the west but not in Japan itself. He's a great writer don't get me wrong but from what his editor's release which to this date to me very odd because I've never seen editors leak this. But without those editors in the beginning Naruto flops hard and never happens. Samurai 8 was Kishimoto's dream and it was badly paced and had animal mentors which Naruto editors told Kishi to take out and to make the Wave arc which to this day is considered an all-time great Arc. Hiro made 2 great series Rave and Eden Zero Fairy tail isnt great to me thou
hes still better than mashima at writing tho (itachi is better than anything out of mashimas 3 series💀) but ngl naruto is overrated
I haven't read or watch either of them but Eden Zero is just Fairy Tail characters but recolored and while yes the author helps more the popularity of the manga but if you are making a new manga and the new characters are just recolors of the previous work that u worked on, for me that's just a easy cheat code to help the popularity of the new manga
That's so false.
Read Eden Zero before giving your opinion.
@Drakkenjoe look how I said nothing about the story but I was referencing the character's designs, that's why I said it's Fairy Tail recolored.
Nothing about if the story is the exact same as FT but the character's designs, the MC is literally just Natsu but with black hair (pay attention how I'm talking about his hair color and not about his personality just his hair color)
Tell them Ouji🗣️🗣️🗣️
there is no such thing as explanations and opinions.
mashima is just better in every aspect
This is how I would rate these two author's works:
Rave is 7.5/10
Naruto is 9/10
Fairy tail is 10/10
Eden's zero is 8/10
Samurai eight is 5.5/10
As you see I not only think that Mashima is a more consistent author but also a generally better one in both art and writing. I loved Naruto so much I never thought I'd like a shonen more than it. After all it was my first anime.
I'll spare you my long rants about how most criticisms that fairy tail receives are completely baised and not backed by actual evidence so I'll just tackle claim that it wasn't planned out properly. Mashima himself said that he didn't plan it out yet I'm left wondering if he was lying or severly exaggerating because several plot threads, story reveals, and even twists are hinted at hunfreds of chapters before they are relevant. One prominent twist was foreshadowed in the very first chapter yet only becomes relevant in the last two arcs. So either Mashima planned it out a hell of a lot more than he says he has or he is really damn good at remembering his canon and paying it off.
As for Samurai 8, the poor thing never had a shot because Kishimoto seemingly wanted to tell a Naruto style epic in about the tenth of the time resulting in world building and character development to be unreasonably quick and unearned. Combine that with the generally worse art than both Kishimoto and Mashima and the thing was doomed to mediocrity even if it was in a different magazine where it could hack it, i n fact it would have felt like a death from a thousand cuts. Overall it shows the curse of that generations mangaka; that these authors existed in these world fpr so long that they couldn't write anything else, I mean Kubo is seemingly returning to Bleach after so many years for god's sake.
Finally, while I think EZ is on the right track to better than both Naruto and Fairy tail, I think it's lunacy to say its better than either of them at this point in time if for nothing else that it is not finished yet and could all be ruined by a couple of bad arcs.
You’re definitely right that it’s still too early to make any definitive opinions about EZ. Still, I’d argue it’s on track to be better than RM and FT. Also, FT being 10/10 is definitely a hot take but one I love regardless.
"Fairy Tail 10/10"😭
@@ShonenOuji it's shit take
@@LazarOrthodox04 Would love to hear your take!
@@ShonenOuji Naruto is 8 or 9/10
Fairy Tail 4/10