The Mormon Mall: How God bought a Shopping Mall
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- Опубликовано: 16 окт 2024
- The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints claims to be Christs one true living restored church, so why on earth are they building a shopping mall?
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VIDEO SOURCES
City Creek Purchase
www.churchofje...
web.archive.or...
The $6 billion operating cost of the church.
www.washington...
www.wsj.com/ar...
Rainy Day Fund
• Decisions on How to Us...
• Why the Church of Jesu...
SEC Fine
www.sec.gov/fi...
Monson Beneficial Life
• Thomas S. Monson vendi...
Jacobsen Construction
www.jacobsenco...
www.deseret.co...
ww2.jacobsenco...
ww2.jacobsenco...
www.et.byu.edu...
www.lindquistm...
www.jacobsenco...
Causse - No one is getting rich
apple.news/Aii...
FAIR USE DISCLAIMER
The Media in this video (including the thumbnail) is used in a transformative way, for the purpose of review and critique. The images in the thumbnail are used as the primary means of visually identifying the subject matter of the video.
#LDS #Mormon
"dont watch hateful anti-mormon media!" the media in question: calm, collected, researched, addressing fallacies, and not even telling anyone to stop going to church. Keep it up Nemo!
Will do!
I as an active member of the Church, enjoy watching anti-Mormon media!
I have helped a lot of members not give up on the Lord, because of the folly of fools that lead the “church” these days.
@@Freerangemormonwhich media are your favorite?
@@Zodiacalesotericmatrix I am going to name Nemo’s channel here as the best, as the issues presented are systematic in nature, not just personal antidotes. There are others that will not be named, that act like leaving the church is now their entire identity, and only can share “stories” of people who have had bad experiences with their local leaders, or just no longer want to follow the teachings and blame the Evil Church for not supporting their follies.
@Freerangemormon Do you have any humorous antidotes to share?
Thank you for exposing these frauds, Nemo.
It’s an absolute disgrace
Of course Mormon Jesus needs a Billion dollar shopping mall. Follow the Profit.
I wonder which Mansion temple jebus will live in when it returns?
"Follow the profit"😂😂
Follow the profit, he knows the way! 💰💰🤑🔥🔥🔥
Follow the money trail to learn more and please share it with the courageous people who tell the truth.
@@ppgranja3well they follow the profit. What I can say more .
FYI, Jacobsen Construction is also in charge of the current massive renovation of the Salt Lake Temple, a project worth hundreds of millions of dollars. Some things never change.
Indeed they are, I covered that in my video on those who build the temples.
Lining the pockets of their “friends”! With our hard earned money that they say we need to pay for tithing! And then they tie my salvation to paying tithing. This is a cult
What approach should the Church have taken that you would find acceptable? They've got to hire someone to do the project. Someone's got to do the job. Please share the more holy and noble approach you believe the Church should've taken that would be acceptable to your standards.
@@marinade06how about being above board and giving the job to a construction company that isn’t associated with the church or its members?
Not only are they giving the job to a well known highly church connected contractor in the State of Utah, but the church gets a 10% kickback on the profits the construction company receives from the church in the form of tithing. Crooked business dealings all the way around. This is the church you’re sticking up for.
@@marinade06As a non Mormon-who has no intention of joining-awarding contracts to builders you can trust makes sense.
I have gotten contractors to do work in my house; whose work is questionable!
I am disgusted with myself for believing in this nonsense and giving them money thinking I was helping my neighbors. Or… am I extremely upset that they took advantage of me and my family? Or is it all of the above?
I don't know if you found the real Jesus or not, but it doesn't mean he isn't real just because the church lied to you. It just means they gave you a false Jesus. I recommend reading Jesus's original testament. Faithful churches of the true Jesus know it's wrong to use God's money on malls.
@@adamkaine2714 There's no "real" religion. They're all made up, some may be better than others
Do not be disgusted with yourself because the leadership lied to you and that is not your fault! 💜
I was a member of that biggest legal scam ever, glad I'm out of that crazy money making hypocritical lds crap
@@adamkaine2714Jesus dejur. It is all made up.
I at times struggle with my emotions and decision to remove myself from the toxic environment of the Mormon community. When I am reminded of things like this, my heart is buoyed, my mind is calmed and my outlook brightens.
Keep strong, brother. It gets better.
@@jeffcarlin5866 It probably is good for you if you don't believe it.
PIMO = Physically In, Mentally Out!
This is what many Jehovah's witnesses are.
So glad I left the cult before I could be completely brainwashed!
As I remember.. during the pandemic the church didn't use their rainy day funds to help the missionary efforts but instead raised the amount the missionary pays by$100 per month
I read that was the case as well. However, in dialogue with a member who had friends serving missions, it seems they announced the price increase, but didn’t follow through with it, which is funny if true, they issued a correction to the article, but haven’t reversed it.
@@kennethd.9436 Yeah. That is true. I also know that many families tapped into the missionary fund which subsidized a lot of the missionaries
@@cmr4622😆 🤣 😂 as if missionary fund goes to pay actual missionaries! It funds the mission president's lifestyle.
@@bewitched3912 I don’t necessarily disagree with your point. I was talking at the ward level where families were specifically getting help for their monthly missionary fees.
@@cmr4622 the cult is owned by the corporation. You are misinformed. Jesus never set up this horseshit
"By their fruits ...
KNOW. THEM."
How funny. KNOW THEM, because they are a fruit. You and nemo fit.
@@WatchingwaitingG2D Barry! You’re back. 😊 I suspect you do not have a temple recommend, because question 6 is definitely a “No” for you.
Exactly!!! They'll cut any corners they can find. Our family gave a lot and I regret not giving somewhere else. The church is despicable.
@@Paulapint3 be quiet liar.
@CJ-hw6br Well look. The coward, after months of psycho therapy, decides to pretend again. You're still gay.
My wife and I are both students. We have a son. We have a small amount of food benefits for our son. I told my bishop I don’t believe it is appropriate for us to pay tithing if we are relying on any kind of assistance from other people. So we aren’t temple worthy. My salvation and my sealing to my wife is denied over a tax I can’t afford to pay. I trust God understands my circumstance more than man.
I’m sorry to hear that, but unfortunately I’m also not surprised.
Yes, you’re making difficult choices constrained by the realities of a budget. They on the other hand, get a six-figure stipend, are allowed to have their expenses reimbursed, which includes gifts for to their children at Christmas time and on their birthdays. Their children get free education. They don’t have to worry about healthcare expenses. The very elite even have access to substantial corporate loans, which they do not have to pay back. Because the money is received via a loan, it is also not taxable .Yet, they will lecture us about paying tithing above providing for our families.
@@reneesquivel6449 I thought the church operated strictly on a voluntary basis. Can you provide proof that leadership is paid?
@@waterboy330 it seems the link I posted in response to your question has been removed. It was a link pointing to the frequently asked questions at the churches website. The question was: is there a paid ministry, and it explained that top church leaders receive a stipend. It didn’t specify that that stipend is over six figures, and they have numerous things they can for which they can be reimbursed to the point that the stipend is nearly entirely surplus.
That’s not even getting close to the corporate benefits, the book deals they get at Deseret books, where ghost writers do all the work, and they reap the rewards from the royalties earned on sales. There are a number of things that they enjoy that are nothing short of slush funds.
They have been enjoying this for decades, while they were extolling an unpaid ministry in general conference until they finally had to modify that to unpaid ministry at the local level.
Jesus doesn't need $.
Thanks again Nemo. Absolutely wonderful analysis. I'll keep donating and we'll see if we can get you to that 1.5$ billion.
Thank you for your support!
Corrupt and dishonest the very thing they warn us all about. Good work keep it coming x
By their green aprons and green 💚 Jello ye shall know them
Don't forget about their stash of green.💚
All tithe payers should receive interest from their investments.
This narrative that members of the Church are fuming over this ‘betrayal’ of funds is a fictional concoction by those who profess to be’ unveiling the truth’. Few, if any are upset. The LDS Church, like the Roman Catholic Church and others have the right to invest in ventures that will turn a profit be it real estate or otherwise. It does though, allow those who profess to be’Mormon’ like ‘Nemo’ to grind their axe. Your whole presentation is meant to doubt-bomb others whom you can drag with you.
@@my2cworth4U They do. It's called treasures in heaven.
@@jacobsamuelson3181what use would treasure be in heaven? If it’s metaphorical, then what features in heaven will you have that others in heaven won’t?
Love it!
@@jacobsamuelson3181they are burned in this life 😅
How Did the Cult buy those commercial entities in the first place ??? oh yeah the members !
Exactly, it IS tithing money
Correct but not the general membership - these funds are totally separate and largely from family offices and other capital funds - but it’s an easy accusation to make as so many believe this wrongful correlation.
@@martinreidart dude All the money the church got were from tithing then they had enough to buy "Companies and Insurance companies Banks and lots of Lawyers " the money didnt just magically appear nice gaslighting !
@@mslaerik66 those who actually look passed the accusations can actually find out that the funds come from donation family office funds and other capital funds that are totally separate to tithing.
@@martinreidart Do you have any sources to support that? I’d like to research your claims more.
"Tithing funds will not be used." Tithing is used, and once again, LDS leaders lie for the Lord. Rinse and repeat.
Use the whole quote and let the narrative drive itself.
So you believe the Church would be a more responsible fiduciary of 'sacred' tithes if they didn't invest any of them?
Even if the Church puts tithing in a savings account that earns interest, it's a type of investment.
Is there any type of tithe investment that you would find acceptable and appropriate and not a 'lie'? If so, what is the investment?
@@marinade06 Use the funds to help the poor and the needy among us, who are in desperate need right now. This was the original intent of tithing anyway, as described in Deuteronomy, the whole purpose of the "storehouse" was to store what was need for the poor needy, not to further enrich Babylonian billionaires on Wall Street. The leading brethren have literally turned the divine law of tithing into a racket against used to further impoverish tithe payers. Their hypocritical concern of hoarding these "sacred funds" actually enriches billionaires while further driving tithe payers into poverty and degradation, the very opposite of what tithing was to be used for.
I was 19 when Pres. Hinckley gave “the assurance” “…that tithing funds have not and will not be used…” I didn’t know then the term “fungible,” but even so, I wasn’t a dummy. I was just being told that either I or everyone sitting around me was.
Thank you, Nemo. Very informative. Just another example of how the church is a business/corporation, with a never empty ATM called members. The church has to keep the stranglehold on members to pay tithing thru threats and fear so they can keep the $ rolling in. Follow the profits and starve the poor.
@leahshaw1447 - I am a member and never once have been threatened to pay tithing. Do you think the Church sends guys with guns to say pay or else? Nope! Nobody even checks your bank account.
@@micheleh3851they threaten with loss of salvation/exaltation. Where is the only place in the world you can attain salvation exaltation? Temple. Do you need to pay tithing to go to temple? Yes.
@Bigbluedome - Tithing is NOT required for salvation. Christ already offers everyone salvation. Tithing is NOT required for exaltation either. If it were, living members would be paying tithes for deceased members the same way they do baptisms for deceased persons in Temples, because as Christ taught, and as recorded in the Bible, that baptism is required to enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Payment of tithes to enter the Temple is a gauge if someone is ready to make greater promises to God in the Temple. Payment of tithes is only one of 17 questions asked in the worthiness interview for a Temple recommend. Even if someone were a full tithe payer but could not meet the other standards, they would not be given a recommend.
@@micheleh3851 Ok. D&C 64:24 ripped by Joseph from the Bible but there it is.
@@micheleh3851 my point still stands. It’s not me keeping people out of the temple if they don’t pay tithing. Can you enter the temple/make “sacred covenants” with god if you don’t pay a full tithing? You have your answer.
I enjoyed this video, Nemo. Great information on City Creek 👊🏼
Cheers!
Too bad it is one-sided.
Fun fact about City Creek Mall: one historic piece of architecture that was preserved in the mall was the storefront of the old Zion's Cooperative Mercantile Institution (ZCMI)...which was founded in Salt Lake City's early days to discourage faithful Latter-day Saints from shopping at "Gentile" (non-Mormon)-owned businesses.
@dougmhd2006 - Your fun "fact" is incorrect. ZMCI and other entities were originally created because there were few other places in existance in the Utah Territory to buy goods or services. The early Church had to create their own society. Few people came and settled that weren't members of the Church. Most saw Utah as a place to stop temporarily on their way to California's gold, if they stopped at all. Those who did stay and set up businesses charged Church members much higher prices than what was being charged elsewhere to non-members. This is why Brigham Young decided that the Church needed to be self-sustaining. ZCMI became "America's first mall" with multiple vendors under one roof. Non-members could be included if they agreed to charge Latter-day Saints the fair market value for goods and services that was being charged elsewhere to non-members. There was never a decree not to do business with "Gentiles."
Of course not because the LDS church will take money from anybody and everybody.
@@micheleh3851Brigham wanted indigenous slaves of the captured women and children, all against their will.. who the hell wanted a piece of that garbage??
Mormon Jesus was a venture Capitalist obsessed with turning a profit. Who needs to help others in need when you can help yourselves with a big pile of cash. So Christian of them.
The value of the mall is closer to $5 billion now.
The best way to help others is to make them help themselves while the church wastes their resources
In 2009 companies were laying off workers left and right. Construction jobs came to a screeching halt. The stock market came crashing down. I went 5 months without a job and thought I was most fortunate for finally landing a job in Salt Lake. I saw the workers working on the Mall and thought how fortunate they must feel to have a job. Just before the crash, the Church had liquidated their stock holdings and had enough resources to keep workers employed during this terrible recession. If you would ask the workers, they would much rather have a job than an unemployment check. This was one of the very few major building projects going on at the time. FDR did a similar thing during the great depression. He provided jobs for people by building important infrastructure for the United States. Economies grow by providing jobs not handouts.
Exactly! Jesus quoted Malachi, “Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be jobs for a select few of my people.” Nah, I’m being sarcastic here. We think the way you are describing because we’re human. Our perfect Savior doesn’t offer his help like a business man; He gives freely.
Investing billions to generate a few hundred jobs it’s not in harmony with the will of God as described in the scriptures. They claim to be the only true church of Christ, I don’t think Christ would ever approve such a thing, let alone command them to build a shopping mall. The only thing Christ commanded to build is Zion, a city, a society with no poor nor rich, that’s something the church should be doing in order to gather the people in a place of refuge so they can be protected from the destruction and calamities that are supposed to fall upon the inhabitants of tfe earth prior to the second coming, that’s what the scriptures say. Based on the church doctrines, they are going in the opposite direction by building malls, investing in Babylon, buying properties, lands and keeping the faithful members in a scattered state totally vulnerable. See what happened in Ukraine and Haiti, their temples didn’t protect any member there. The same will happen to all other temples and members when these wars and calamities become worldwide.
You will jot receive a response to this. It doesn't fit the narrative...not only did it provide much needed jobs at a time the economy crashed but has provided jobs since then. But it won't matter to those who hate and criticize the Church. I can almost assure you these are people who would look the Savior squarely in the face and ask why He ever asked for Tithes in the first place...I mean it's OUR money.your asking for!..🙄...
@@rdancranstonI mean sure it provided jobs at the time and still does but it still defeats the purpose of this video and is not why the church did it in the first place. Acting like the church had this planned out of the goodness of their heart lol.
LDS motto: "Follow the Profit. Jesus needs your money".
ExLDS motto: Follow the profit. Nemo and friends needs your money.
Love this! ❤😂
@@jacobsamuelson3181 the first step in leaving the Mormon church is to listen to exmormon podcasts 🙌 congratulations 👏 a few more steps and you'll be pouring your own cup of coffee 😂
@@bewitched3912 The funny thing about that is Nemo isn't an Exmormon. So.....
@@jacobsamuelson3181 exactly! Nemo is trying to make the church better for those who believe in it. He's truly doing the lord's work.. while I want to burn it down, I fully support Nemo and all his efforts
Considering the amount of property, land & ventures the church owns globally the mall isn’t surprising. I think it was more surprising because of when it happened & before Ensign Peak was made public. It does make logical sense in that the church owned the land/proximity to temple square. Obviously the main reason why this is very bad is that the church is a religious non profit with tax exempt status! It baffles me how blurred the lines are (for context I’m an accountant/worked for numerous FTSE/NASDAQ listed companies & use to file 20-F’s!)
Is there a law against non-profits investing their money? I think almost all do as a secondary stream to their fund raising efforts. It sounds like the "religious" part is why people have a problem.
They need to lose the tax exemption and admit they are a private, religious-themed club for men who believe they deserve 70 virgins in the next life just like Muslims! 😅
@@cmr4622if it's "non-profit" then they invest for profit, why this mathematical equation is so difficult for you? They are a Corporation that owns a church.
@@bewitched3912 Unsure what you are answering here. I was addressing why someone thought it was baffling that the church was non-profit based on all these investments. Nothing insidious here.
@@cmr4622 when the marketing model includes "licked cupcakes" to shame children into silence while priesthood holders get a free pass to reoffend, because Bishop confidentiality. Kirtand McConkie lawyers on permanent retainer proves SCA is big business within the religious themed corporations.
Look buddy, as a retired copy editor I convinced men to buy pills, creams and sexy toys to enhance their experience. The cat's out of the bag with regard to silencing kids by insisting THEY are solely responsible to stop the abuses they are plagued with in this generational trauma inflicting culture.
I also dedicated part of my life working in criminal justice in 3 different State government agencies. Religious themed sexual crimes against children is the most egregious and horrific. You could Google that instead of actually working in the field, but you won't.
I intend to change laws to end all infant and child baptisms and make one on one interviews and confessions of minors unlawful. Children cannot consent to this toxic culture without proper information and maturity to make such a life impacting decision. No more child marriages regardless of the religious beliefs of either parent. No more tithes from minors either. Children don't know what they are paying into and shouldn't be liable for religious induced anxiety that "fire insurance" tithes is meant to inflict.
Nope, no more of that horseshit. I'm making waves, big boy.
Isn’t every dime the church spends ultimately from tithing? Sure, you can pay with investment returns, but the original investment was tithes.
"The original investment was from tithes". Exactly. And only an unethical, money obsessed corporate religion would differentiate between tithing and earnings/interest on invested tithing.
Speaking of which, don't forget to sign up for tithing settlement so you can "declare" to the Lord face to face and eye to eye in the form of his authorized servant if you've really paid all you should. Because, of course, being asked in temple recommend interviews whether you pay a "full tithe" isn't enough. After all, what's a billion extra per year when you could have two billion?!
So you're ok with the Church investing tithing? If so, which investments are acceptable to you? And which investments are not (aside from real estate [like the Mall] and private company debt [like Beneficial Life])?
@@marinade06 I’m not a member so don’t have a dog in the fight. I’m asking a clarifying question bc I’m curious. Church leaders said mall $$/insurance co. bailout didn’t come from tithing, but that seems disingenuous. It seems to me the mall money wouldn’t exist w/o the original investment of tithe $$.
@@ceciliabrown6341 When the saints arrived in the Salt Lake Valley many enterprises were founded including merchant business [like ZCMI], banking [like Zions Bank], insurance [like Beneficial Life], farming/ranching [like the church owned farmlands and ranches] and a bunch of more modern/recent businesses in TV, Marketing, etc.
These businesses are for-profit, which means they pay taxes. What is done with their excess profits? Most likely reinvested/retained in their own business or paid out as a dividend or loan to other entities for alternative investments.
Did they all originate from tithing? It's unclear. However it's likely that tithes were used for at least part of the upstart costs. Joseph Smith sold shares in some of his early business enterprises (that largely failed) and did not use tithes.
A large portion of the Church's portfolio today probably got started from excess tithes that were invested. It's impossible and futile to chase down every dollar of portfolio value today to its origins of tithes or otherwise.
This could go back half a century or more to find the origins.
At the end of the day, either It's acceptable for a non-profit, like a church, to invest its excess assets or it's not. In essence, the Church is managing an endowment (which is funded from donations, or tithes in the case of a Church ) and seeks to generate a return on the endowment to keep up with inflation and fund the needs of the Church.
The current lawsuit from Huntsman who inherited his wealth as the son of a devout Mormon Billionaire, has become disaffected from the Church. He's now on a mission to recover his years of donations. As I understand it, the Crux of the lawsuit is the claim of whether interest or earnings on principal tithing is different than primary tithing and can therefore be defined as non tithing funds. If the court ends up ruling that interest and earnings are the same as principal tithing, then the church will be found as misleading or even committing fraud through its statement that no tithing funds were used for the Mall.
Historically, this differentiation has been deemed appropriate and acceptable. The current lawsuit is challenging to change this.
Churches from around the country are watching his lawsuit closely to learn from it and protect themselves depending on the ruling on appeal
Love your videos! Well said as always!
One of your best expose’ videos yet. Keep doing the important work, Nemo!
Thanks, will do!
Great job, but you missed the most most important aspect of why City Creek Mall is spiritually wrong. THE TEACHINGS FOUND IN THE BOOK OF MORMOM.
Presumably investment in the mall is to make money. I assume the same for bailing out an insurance company they own. It is hard to find good investments that can move the needle when you have the kind of money Mormons have to invest. Look at how Berkshire Hathaway struggles to find deals.
I would love not to have to pay taxes either. Maybe I should start a non-profit and live high in the nontaxable hog
Many do...
Any issues with other Faiths who also have the same benefit or only LDS Church?
@@danpiedra3910All of them.
@@danpiedra3910 none of them use child sex abuse as the market model for slut shaming molested kids whilst the priesthood holder gets a free pass to offend, seventy times seven!! We know how the almighty dollar rules the roost 😂😅😂
@@danpiedra3910 all of them that have billions for no other reason than to have billions.
Please oh Please keep an eye on the huntsman lawsuit and provide coverage- especially if it turns in to a class action lawsuit...
It will go nowhere just like Tom Phillips lawsuit in England. Sorry kids, more pipe dreams.
Love the drum roll Nemo!!!
Thank you Nemo for disclosing the truth many people need to open their eyes and brain👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Thank you again Nemo for your courage and honesty. The leaders know things we don't know, but thanks to honest people with courage we do know a little bit more.
Of course they clothe the naked. Is there not a Victoria's Secret?
I remember working for a guy that had a small business in salt lake about 30 years ago. He had a contract with the cult. The "church" told him to stop hiring the homeless to help him! He would hire guys from the mission to help with the work. As soon as someone higher up learned this, he was told to stop hiring then.
Jebus needs bank. Big Bank.
Don’t question His profit!
@Il_pesce keep helping other TBM'S to find this podcast by posting!! You are doing the lords work by helping the algorithm!!
@Il_pesce the non member ladies needs to hear your responses to us older grandmothers who witnessed the toxicity this religion pumps out from Boy Scouts of America to the "Indian Placement Program" that intentionally harmed children. Bishops knew and did nothing but silence child victims who grew up to speak out.
This is a dying religion since half all Mormon missionaries are leaving within six months of returning from their missions. The religion is creating exmormons. If you have a problem with that, then do something about it instead of blaming those who left after learning all the nefarious crimes the leaders of this cult has engaged in since its inception.
Excellent post Nemo!!
I wonder what credit cards the Mormon Jesus accepts. Visa, Mastercard, American Express, Discover? Does he accept Bitcoin payments?
Slaves were once accepted as tithing payment.
City Creek was one of the very last things that shattered my faith, or "broke my shelf". I was visiting Utah for many months on a business trip. One Sunday, my host family & I decided to go to a historic church in downtown Salt Lake for services. I ended up having a health emergency & really needed some supplies. The Mom of the family said, "It's an 'Ox in the mire' situation, time to go shopping & I know exactly where to go!"
We went to City Creek. This was 2003 or 2004, just before construction began. But she thought that would be the best possible place to go, since if we were shopping on Sunday and breaking the Sabbath, at least it was church owned.
But... there I was thinking, wait... if it's church owned, HOW is it open on Sunday? Because I was always taught breaking the Sabbath wasn't the worst thing you could do by shopping or going out on Sunday. Rather, the worst thing would be to cause *someone else* to break the Sabbath, by expecting them to serve you. That sin was considered far worse than just violating it yourself.
So I debated that with the host family as we went to City Creek. How could the Church itself justify owning a commercial property, with funds from tithe-paying members, which then required others to violate the Sabbath by working there?! Surely that was even worse! Because sure, 'ox in the mire' situations happen, sometimes we have to violate the Sabbath. But surely running a giant friggin shopping mall on the regular, keeping it open on Sundays, and employing people to work there was a far greater sin.
Her justification? "But the employees likely aren't members!"
That never mattered to doctrine before. So why was it an exception for the Church just to make money?
Only a few weeks later my shelf broke completely when I learned the history of the endowment and washings & anointing ceremonies. I still wonder sometimes if that alone would have been enough, without that sudden lesson in absolute institutional hypocrisy and money hoarding.
It’s all so gross 🤮
How is a church even allowed to own property like a shopping mall?
Because religious denominations need funding outside of just tithes and donations. Every denomination is convinced of their own truths and do not want to ‘go under’. This is no different for Mormons. Wise denominations invest elsewhere and is sustained by those who donate (usually). We’re talking a global church here with millions of members. Lots of trust has to be placed in Mormon church leaders of course to maintain wise investments and structure. Mormons are a textbook example as to how to keep a religion alive financially. This is often why so many leaders of other denominations visit SLC and Mormon leaders.
They aren’t but they just pay the government fines and continue their illegal activities
Because the church does not own it, and investment group held by “church leaders” does…corporate shell games.
"let's go shopping" is very inspiring and reminds me of .. well not Jesus but maybe the Romans so there's a connection there !
Can’t wait for this 👍🏻
Really important financial research and findings! Thanks again, Nemo!
My pleasure!
Actually, there are so many deficiencies in this video in understanding the basic financial management principles used when managing multi billion funds and endowments. It's like a 3rd grader bragging about how rich his dad is to his classmates and believing he thoroughly understands finances and the ways his dad built his wealth. All because his dad bought him the latest Nintendo device before any of his friends on the block.
Presumably Nemo is ok with tithes being invested and generating a return. He simply finds issue with some of the specific investments the church has made.
All assets, by definition, change in value. Therefore, all assets are a type of investment.
Nemo appears to believe the church shouldn't invest in asset classes like real estate, or private businesses, or publicly traded equities since he takes exception with each of these assets class investments in the video.
So, Nemo, tell us, how and what are the types of asset classes and investments are you ok with the church making?
@@marinade06 I think the real question is, "So, Lord, how and what types of asset classes and investments are you ok with the church making?" It seems to me that His answer can be found within His text:)
@@karakeatley9510 I eagerly await your interpretation from within His text. What's His answer?
@@marinade06 LOL! Your argument was a schoolyard one and I'm not engaging in a schoolyard "debate." Good luck with your studies, and best of luck in your future endeavors. 🤣
So much for a rainy day, that ship has sailed with the pandemic, they could’ve proved it all through that period of time, wake up friends, stop writing out all those checks, it won’t get you to heaven 😢
@China-Clay. Try to imagine
how they could EASILY have sucked in AT LEAST a full BILLION during COVID alone.
Setting the groundwork for post-COVID EXPANSIONISM.
The raising of missionary costs for some countries during the pandemic shows this fund has nothing to do with alleviating pressures on missionary work during hard times!
The type of rainy day that requires $100 billion to survive is the type of catastrophe in which money no longer holds any value, it's meaningless
Ooo I want to see this!
Children should go hungry to pay tithing for this mall. Jesus demands this.....
Thank you Nemo ❤🎉
You're welcome 😊
Truly, ❤what would Jesus do??
Jesus wouldn't be making conspiracy RUclips videos about His Church for one thing.
@@jacobsamuelson3181 Jesus would tell the truth.
@@hopeinHim5160 He would. Do you? Are you a truthgiver or a liar?
@@jacobsamuelson3181 Truth.
@@hopeinHim5160 So you never lied in your life? Why do you ask what Jesus would do when you should be asking what you would do since you are not a liar?
What I find funny about the "rainy day" fund excuse, is that the apocalyptic things that they believe are around the corner would mean we wouldn't need money anymore... Pretty sure when christ is on the throne like they believe could happen any day. Then we wouldn't need money anymore.
And with everything in the stock market, if the apocalypse did happen, that "money" would totally disappear.
Or they talk about things that often come with a devaluation of stock, where their money is currently held.
@@NEMOTHEMORMON unless the church has their several hundred billions in gold and silver instead of fiat currency then their wealth could just be evaporated when the Dollar becomes worthless‼️🇺🇸🇺🇸🇳🇿
@@VioletShinobi quiet toast.
The rainy day fund goes a lot deeper than you portray. The church owns a lot of assets in the form of property. In the event of a downturn every church facility has to be maintained which includes meeting houses, temples, Bishop's Storehouses, etc... The church also helps fund a lot of charitable initiatives that it keeps on the downlow. One example are facilities that house and feed the homeless in Utah. Do you really think that those are completely funded by the state? Do you think all the food comes from local grocers? Also, the church has an interest in keeping SLC, especially the parts of SLC surrounding Temple Square, nice. Anyone who grew up in Salt Lake remembers what happened to Crossroads Mall and other parts of the property where City Creek now sits. The place became a dump, one bar tried to become a strip club, and crime increased. City Creek has accomplished the church's mission to revitalize the area and turn a profit.
Hey. No balanced comments here. They are not allowed. This channel is for only commiserating with those that already think the church is bad.
The 1000 year REIGN of Jesus Christ!
Thank you. I appreciate your videos. The church manual does not say gross income. I think there was a three year period in the sixties where it did say Gross income but now they only say that “increase” as stated in the D&C is interpreted as “income”
Profit Seekers and Regulators 😊🎉😮
If there is a market crash how does having money in the stock market help protect them? How is it a rainy day fund when the money will be lost in the crash? Does God really need money?
Furthermore….missionaries fund their own missions…so just how much does missionary work cost tscc???
@@suthatheplee2777the cost of missions is partly subsidized by the church, but yeah they could easily afford to pay all missionaries expenses and have plenty left over to invest and donate to charitable things. Sad
Billion dollar Jesus should have been the name of the mall, imo
Spot on!
Even as an active member when I had no idea the extent if the church's real wealth, I struggled with the idea of why they would need so much money when there was so much good that could be done with it. Now that I'm out, it's just one of the many nails in the coffin of the church corruption. The Jesus I knew would be ashamed of the greed and ignorance of his "so called" one true church.
If you learn about how large endowments and $multi-billion institutional funds are managed, you begin to realize that the Church is doing nothing out of the ordinary.
Let's presume Nemo is correct in asserting it costs $6bn/ year to run the church.
Let's presume the church has $100bn in investments.
All major endowments and institutional funds designed to operate in perpetuity seek returns equal to inflation + 5-7%. This is super basic knowledge in the financial industry. In achieving this target, the endowment doesn't lose value over time while growing at a healthy, and acceptable, rate that doesn't put the principal at risk while producing sufficient returns to fund whatever its objectives.
Given this, $100bn would generate approximately $5-7bn/yr of income without depreciating principal.
Which happens to be the amount Nemo claims it costs to operate the Church.
Which supports the Church's claim of a rainy day fund.
As we've all experienced, inflation erodes the buying power of the currency, so growth beyond inflation is an absolute imperative for prudent financial planning and maintaining a funds assets into perpetuity.
Now, add to that the fact that the membership of the church is constantly growing and the number of facilities, buildings, temples and more it needs to support that growing membership is increasing as well. It's no wonder their goal is not just to preserve capital, but to grow it.
“Tithing wasn’t used. The RETURNS from tithing were used, so it’s ok!”
Firstly, let’s not have illusions about this, tithing money was still used, no matter how you try to spin it. Secondly, those returns from tithing that were used to build the mall are still returns that paying members aren’t seeing, returns that could’ve went into something like retirement, something my Mormon parents keep talking and dreaming about. I wonder how many Mormons could’ve retired much earlier had they not paid tithing? Instead, their returns went into a shopping mall.
All in all, it was not a morally correct move by the church.
@Il_pesce ☝️🤓
I shopped there back in 2012 when I was in slc for a wedding. I wasn't well so I didn’t get to see all of the two block mall. I didn't get a chance to go into North storm either. But the two stores I did shop in were the only ones I could afford to shop in: The church book store and H and M.
I just drove through downtown Salt Lake. Since temple square is under construction for the foreseeable, it looks like the church provided a more consumerist alternative.
@@kyrroti quiet pretender.
@@WatchingwaitingG2Dwhat am I pretending to be?
@@kyrroti an honest person.
@@WatchingwaitingG2D I wouldn’t say I’m pretending to be honest. I’m not perfect but I make an attempt to live by my values, which include honesty, minimizing harm to others, and having an open mind.
Hinckley seemed so nice, but he was a liar
Horrible little fraud
This is gonna be good
Really excited, as I live in the valley, been to the malls, etc. Praise Nemo!
Great job Nemo 👍
Thank you!
How do members think this is ok??
Most don’t know. Even fewer care about it. If the Profit says it’s ok, no need to look further.
Because they are already brainwashed into believing anything.
Nemo, this is all so tragic and sad.
Ongoing conversation: A couple of folks have said paying tithing is not needed for salvation. But the church has made paying tithing a requirement to get a temple recommend -- which was not so in the beginning. If no recommend, you can't enter salvation (temple). I was denied a recommend (not paying tithing, and a couple of other issues regarding some of the questions -- but they are subjects for another time), and did you know if you don't have a temple recommend, you can't buy your garments? The church has you coming and going. Threats on one end and withholding items on the other.
You can buy garments on line without a recommend.
@roxanejordan4114 I'll check it out, thanks 😊
Dude I don't understand why people do not realize this just in their name their nickname Mormon Mormon does not stand for the book of Mormon or the angel Moroni or any of that it stands for more money that's what Joseph Smith started he started an organization where he could die a rich man the more money organization Mormon for short
@Il_pesce you never read the quad you were issued either
Cite your source
How much farm land do they own in the U.K? I once heard it was a massive portion of East Anglia.
I know they have something like 5 farm lands in the U.K. my memory is fuzzy but I remember a very wealthy family ran it in Huntingdon at the time the church leaders were scaremongering all members to stack up on wheat for a year because something was happening. Members were in a frenzy and we had activities to packaging it back in 02-03. We had chapels stacked with wheat. It was nuts.
NEMO is borderline brushing up against some defamation lawsuits from the LDS church, general contractors, City Creek, etc... The more you like and subscribe, the further his reach and the larger the dollar amount on that lawsuit.
I would seek clarification on if any principal (tithing funds) or the interest (gain from tithing funds) was used for City Creek.
- I thought that only gains were used but you made it seem that both were used. (this might be important for the law suit)
- Maybe the answer to the first question comes down to how one distinguish between the two. (is there a difference or does it matter for this discussion)
The LDS church helped create 2008 by investing in MBS's.
Salt Lake city above, salt town below
I think the church bought all sorts of real estate surrounding the temple to be able control what’s going on around the temple and church office building.
I remember when the church had a children’s hospital. I’m alive because of it. But they sold it. now they would rather have malls.
I don't know if they own/run any hospitals, homeless shelters, food banks (other than the storehouse which is gatekept like crazy). @nemo I'd love to know this. Are they running anything like this, like Jesus would've, around the world?
Decades ago, the church indicated they would need money just before the second coming! The world would be in turmoil!
Jesus shops in the shopping mall 😂
The ancient Egyptian translation for ‘Mormon’ is hypocrite.
“Reformed Egyptian” translation
Mormon = mor(e) mon(ey)
Do you get greenshield stamps for lds mall shopping? 😊
Mormonr has a good thing on this.
There's nothing wrong with engaging in commercial endeavors if it helps fulfill the mission of the church. ZCMI was a founding business of the church in the pioneer days and helped establish commerce in the salt lake valley. I see the mask as just another bud on the desert rose. And you have to admit it's an awesome mall.
Jesus needs his Billions.
That’s an astronomical amount, nobody can shop that much!
SHOPPING MALL. AND RESIDENTIAL
DEVELOPMENT.
As in various
other major cities.
WHERE those who are not ALREADY homeless and living in the shabby shadows of THE GLORIOUS by the entire economic/development inflationary results will merely be added to the "unwashed mass". Again.
So the BENEFICIAL, being OWNED- and managed - already by church (EPA), even so, FELL into need of a BAIL-OUT.
By church. And EPA.
Right.
Peas under walnut shells
The Church is on target to complete the Starship Nauvoo once the BYU physics department finishes cold fusion and builds a stable warp core. It can then take the membership and seed the galaxy with new faithful tithe payers on the intergalactic journey to the Kolobian ringworld.
In 2024 New Zealand has a secret tithing rainy day fund / retained earnings of $555 million. As per the most recent Financial Report submitted to the government. To understand the potential global scale of such retained earnings, consider the ratio of retained funds per member in New Zealand. With approximately 115,000 LDS members in New Zealand, the retained earnings amount to about $4,826 per member. Extrapolating this ratio to the global LDS membership of approximately 16.6 million members suggests a potential global "rainy day fund" of about $80.11 billion. This staggering amount further underscores the importance of transparency and the scriptural "Good Samaritinization"" of tithing fund, not rainy day hoarding. "Thou shalt be frugal and invest and earn interest on my tithing, so that my economic store house is full and overflowing at the second coming."
People in debt have no business tithing . . . Because tithing keeps them in debt!
@@RobbinFlowers- I own a business and will say that tithing has nothing to with debt. If people can't live on 90% of their income, having the other 10% isn’t going to make a significant difference. People just want to blame tithing instead of blame much of the expenditures within the 90% that could be streamlined. Those who are in debt at 90% would still be in debt having 100%.
@micheleh3851 You might be right, tithing while in debt does represent serious money management issues, most likely programmed to be delusional in that prosperity dogma.
@@micheleh3851 why don't religions teach budgets and debt avoidance?
@RobbinFlowers - The Church of Jesus Christ does teach and preach staying out of debt and financial management in classes and from the pulpit. The Church also practices this as well. They don't have any loans or mortgages, and all properties, buildings, facilities, EVERYTHING must be paid in full before it is dedicated for use. The Church practice self-reliance and are in a position to help others. This is why the Church owns hundreds of thousands of non-income-producing real estate like cattle ranches, farms, and orchard to produce food supplies, and why they own vast distribution networks. For example, when Covid caused much of the world's supply chains to become disrupted for an extended length of time, the Church wasn't completely reliant on other sources and sailed along just fine. I can't speak to what other religions do.
Hey Nemo you are just scratching the surface here of the LDS Churches great wealth. They own property all over the world including a condo in Hawaii and nearly 3% of Florida. The Florida property alone is estimated to be over a trillion dollars. Can you believe they own 2.3 million acres in the US? They are the 2nd largest land owner in the US even beating out Ted Turner.
Tithing started the money flow.....he's speaking with forked tongue.....
With companies or really rich I sometimes have that mental image of a dragon sitting on their hoarded gold only getting more and more…
Church is no difference
Just more misinformation. Jacobsen construction is an ESOP and is owned by the employees (maybe 50% members and 50% not members). This is just one more of 100's of examples that show NEMO is pretty ignorant. Besides Jacobsen, Layton, and Okland Construction's LDS church portfolio is small compared to all the other markets they serve across the US.
I'm begging you. Don't fall for this NEMO dude. He is a complete ignorant individual that can only take a small piece of the picture and use it to disillusion those already disillusioned. It will take you longer to heal and move on.
Let's go shopping..... same thing Geo Bush said after 911.
Did the sellers really want to sell,? Or encouraged to sell?
It's expensive, glitzy, and security chases people around who don't fit their "code". I am not exaggerating.
How i wish government was as effective and efficient as the church
How I wish the LDS followed Jesus teachings as taught in the Bible.
Thanks!
there was nothing wrong with Crossroads Plaza. loved that place. and no need to have sold out ZCMI to Macy's. ZCMI was a well-loved establishment with history and allegiance from members. far busier than Nordstrom or Macy's.
Is that one of the things the church demolished to build the new shopping center?
1. Of course, tithing is not a tax. Tithing is a voluntary donation. It does not give the donor rights or say as to how that money is used. 2. The church is a kingdom, not a democracy or a republic. 3. They owe us no explanation about what they do with the money. They DO owe God an accounting for how they acquire, manage, and prepare with the money they receive. They will also owe HIM and only HIM an explanation about whom they choose to build their buildings.
I think Nemo needs some heathier outlets than hating on a religion he doesn’t want to be apart of
"Sunshine makes the best disinfectant."
The Ensign Peak billions and billions of the green stuff is a rotting festering abscess about to pop in scandalous glory.🤑
There's a lot of fair things to criticize the church for, but finances is honestly one of the things that they do a great job at. Truth is, any consolidation of power will creative advantageous circumstances for some, and disadvantageous circumstances for others.
Here's a fantastic podcast that goes way deeper into this topic: ruclips.net/video/xO49YDaedv4/видео.html