Another Warhammer series I recommend is Ciaphas Cain. The whole thing is that we read about a war hero who has some horrible imposter syndrome. The books are written as if a second characters is editing the autobiogrpahy that the titular Ciaphas Cain wrote, and the added footnotes are sometimes the best bits.
I have read this book, and part 1 of the first book of the Wheel of Time. I'm sure Wheel of Time did the theme more justice, but I found the characters in this book to be much more interesting.
40k was made to be a parody, part of that was making things more grimdark than everything else to the point of being ridiculous. This book is the perfect embodiment of it.
It is supposed to be a parody, but people also should remember that there is a truth behind every joke. Some of the stuff you read about in 40k literally happens in current wars, for example.
I'm not going to get super into it but here's a run down on necron origins. They evolved on a radioactive planet, and because of this they were cursed to have short painful lives Back when thy still had flesh bodies with souls they were called necrontyr. The necrontyr eventually became a high-tech race capable of space travel and at some point crossed paths with another alien race, the god-like 'old ones'. Who were incredibly long-lived (possibly immortal) who were masters of science of technology and had powerful psychic abilities as well. The old ones 'uplifted' some races and created some as well. (Eldar and Orks, among others, are creations of the old ones) The Necrontyr asked the old ones for help with their situation. Old ones refused to do anything. Necrontyr do not take this well and go to war with the old ones, this doesn't go well for the necrontyr. Necrontyr bump into another group of "gods" the C'tan, who offer help with their war (they claimed to also have beef with the old ones) and the immortality thing. Their king takes up the offer, the Necrontyr get some snazzy tech for waging war on the old ones, all or nearly all of the old ones are wiped out Necrontyr are afterwards given immortal machine bodies, but the C'tan eat their souls as part of this process. Necrons overthrow, defeat, and imprison the C'tan and then take a 60 million year nap
I think a good real life allegory of the Colour of Space or Song of Seranade would be the spiral. Spirals are everywhere in nature if you look close enough.
Oh they definitely started with cockney orks and worked backwards from there. There's some videos looking at the 1st edition 40k sourcebook and it's *wild*. Some prime crazy 80's stuff, a lot of it later retconned, though surprisingly there's still little bits of continuity here and there.
As lifetime long fan I can see where you guys are coming from with the issues. For me the issues were never really there because, well lifetime fan. I feel if I talked about Wheel Of Time similar things would happen; I would get some things that you guys would consider obvious a bit sqewed or wrong and you lads would shrug it off as a new person reading about it.
40k basically sound like someone chose the Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy as there setting, and just ran with it. Feels like it’s written the way it is to account for how an actual game would play out in terms of random encounters, and rules disputes. Which just makes it even better.
I have heard this from several reviewers, new to 40K. You cannot expect every book to be a rehash of the setting. Its been going for three decades. The rehash explaining everything would be longer than the book, just for a single faction.
Necrons are the undead for 40K, that's why they feel like humans. They took the concept of undead (no soul, no guidance) and made it futuristic, with the typical lords commanding the undead armies turned into futiristic versions (so full of vices, like a vampire or a necromancer). Also, all species have the same "reality bending magic powers", but the orcs are more stupid and have WAY more faith than any other, it's because of the warp. There are a lot of similar situations, but they require more members of the other species, for example the avatar of Khaine for the Eldars (a physical manifestation of their god), or the Sanguinius for the Blood Angel (some sort of unnamed angel marine that saves them in dire situations), or Saint Celestine, a living Saint for the Sisters of Battle, or some of the demons evocations for chaos (which is way stronger, so it's way easier to manifest, plus the warp is corrupt because of what happen with all that soul eating thing with the necrons and their rival race), and so on
Orks are funny the same way that Soviet/Russian military or politics are "funny", the punchlines almost always involve the deaths of innocents. Like, Stalin once gave a speech, and the audience aplodded fir over an hour until people started passing out from exhaustion because they were terrified of what would happen if they were seen being the first to stop clapping for Comrade Stalin. That's hilarious because it's horrible, but you can still take that "scene" completely seriously(indeed you kinda have to considering it's a historical event). 40K can be approached similarly, we can laugh at it as outside observers, while also appreciating the serious in-universe horror/tragedy.
Very early on the satire aspect of 40k was much more obvious.
As had been said by others. Imagine the the cool fight scenes between the Necrons as two old men feebly hitting each other with their walking sticks.
Another Warhammer series I recommend is Ciaphas Cain.
The whole thing is that we read about a war hero who has some horrible imposter syndrome.
The books are written as if a second characters is editing the autobiogrpahy that the titular Ciaphas Cain wrote, and the added footnotes are sometimes the best bits.
I have read this book, and part 1 of the first book of the Wheel of Time. I'm sure Wheel of Time did the theme more justice, but I found the characters in this book to be much more interesting.
40k was made to be a parody, part of that was making things more grimdark than everything else to the point of being ridiculous. This book is the perfect embodiment of it.
If only some people in the fan community could remember this.
It is supposed to be a parody, but people also should remember that there is a truth behind every joke. Some of the stuff you read about in 40k literally happens in current wars, for example.
I'm not going to get super into it but here's a run down on necron origins.
They evolved on a radioactive planet, and because of this they were cursed to have short painful lives
Back when thy still had flesh bodies with souls they were called necrontyr.
The necrontyr eventually became a high-tech race capable of space travel and at some point crossed paths with another alien race, the god-like 'old ones'. Who were incredibly long-lived (possibly immortal) who were masters of science of technology and had powerful psychic abilities as well. The old ones 'uplifted' some races and created some as well. (Eldar and Orks, among others, are creations of the old ones)
The Necrontyr asked the old ones for help with their situation. Old ones refused to do anything.
Necrontyr do not take this well and go to war with the old ones, this doesn't go well for the necrontyr.
Necrontyr bump into another group of "gods" the C'tan, who offer help with their war (they claimed to also have beef with the old ones) and the immortality thing.
Their king takes up the offer, the Necrontyr get some snazzy tech for waging war on the old ones, all or nearly all of the old ones are wiped out
Necrontyr are afterwards given immortal machine bodies, but the C'tan eat their souls as part of this process.
Necrons overthrow, defeat, and imprison the C'tan and then take a 60 million year nap
I think a good real life allegory of the Colour of Space or Song of Seranade would be the spiral.
Spirals are everywhere in nature if you look close enough.
Trazyn is well known as the Universe's greatest shitposter so this is very on brand for him
A pleasant surprise for a Saturday. Glad that this podcast is back, even if temporary!
The Watcher in the Rain. That one is fairly Lovecraftian
a year late, but imagine my surprise when I saw the cover of the book next to HL's icon. definitely going to be giving this a listen :D
Moments like this make me happy that I have notifications turned on
I subscribed because you have said that you read this book. Hope you read more 40k books
The emperor in a golden chair...IS OJAMA LIME THE EMPEROR?
Was def thinking of testing this. Thanks leg friend
Oh they definitely started with cockney orks and worked backwards from there. There's some videos looking at the 1st edition 40k sourcebook and it's *wild*. Some prime crazy 80's stuff, a lot of it later retconned, though surprisingly there's still little bits of continuity here and there.
They started with football hooligans and worked backwards from there :-)
He'll yeah! They're back!
As lifetime long fan I can see where you guys are coming from with the issues. For me the issues were never really there because, well lifetime fan.
I feel if I talked about Wheel Of Time similar things would happen; I would get some things that you guys would consider obvious a bit sqewed or wrong and you lads would shrug it off as a new person reading about it.
The infinite and the divine is one of the best warhammer books. Helsreach is good as well but more dramatic
This was really funny to listen to. Great review.
Necron time boys
Yesss I was looking forward to this
Good stuff man!
40k basically sound like someone chose the Hitchhikers guide to the galaxy as there setting, and just ran with it. Feels like it’s written the way it is to account for how an actual game would play out in terms of random encounters, and rules disputes. Which just makes it even better.
Glad you’re at least covering infinite and divine, but you should get some more 40k content, the black library has some great ones
Agree
I hope you do Red Dragon by Thomas Harris or Mortal Engine by Philip Reeve at some point.
I have heard this from several reviewers, new to 40K. You cannot expect every book to be a rehash of the setting. Its been going for three decades. The rehash explaining everything would be longer than the book, just for a single faction.
There's a 40k magic colab coming out in October
Orks are modelled after 1980s British Football hooligans.
This book was uncharacteristically silly for 40k. The Ciaphas Cain novels are another example
Necrons are the undead for 40K, that's why they feel like humans. They took the concept of undead (no soul, no guidance) and made it futuristic, with the typical lords commanding the undead armies turned into futiristic versions (so full of vices, like a vampire or a necromancer).
Also, all species have the same "reality bending magic powers", but the orcs are more stupid and have WAY more faith than any other, it's because of the warp. There are a lot of similar situations, but they require more members of the other species, for example the avatar of Khaine for the Eldars (a physical manifestation of their god), or the Sanguinius for the Blood Angel (some sort of unnamed angel marine that saves them in dire situations), or Saint Celestine, a living Saint for the Sisters of Battle, or some of the demons evocations for chaos (which is way stronger, so it's way easier to manifest, plus the warp is corrupt because of what happen with all that soul eating thing with the necrons and their rival race), and so on
34.50 you would be one hundred percent correct
Hardleg reading one of my favorite 40k books!? Well my interest is piqued.
20.13 orks are scary when you read about them from a human pov
Orks are funny the same way that Soviet/Russian military or politics are "funny", the punchlines almost always involve the deaths of innocents.
Like, Stalin once gave a speech, and the audience aplodded fir over an hour until people started passing out from exhaustion because they were terrified of what would happen if they were seen being the first to stop clapping for Comrade Stalin.
That's hilarious because it's horrible, but you can still take that "scene" completely seriously(indeed you kinda have to considering it's a historical event). 40K can be approached similarly, we can laugh at it as outside observers, while also appreciating the serious in-universe horror/tragedy.