The lore for Orion fighting wood elves is that Glade Lord entered the forbidden side of Athel Loren, AKA the part where reality begins breaking down, and he was corrupted by Slaanesh there. The Dreaming Wood is Slaanesh's territory, and it exists as a separate dimension that overlaps Athel Loren, however going there also allows you to see into the future, so brave and/or stupid elves will enter it in an attempt to gain insight. Normally there isn't actually much danger from the Dreaming Wood, since the portals to it are very rare, only open for short periods, and as far as we know daemons don't leave through them, so if you ignore them they go away. Giants are actually pretty good, and they're surprisingly good at duels, including monster duels. This is because they have great animations, meaning they swing fast, connect often, and hit hard. It isn't uncommon to find battles where a Giant easily beats another monster to death because its attacks stun the opponent for long enough that the Giant is able to begin another animation before its opponent can retaliate. Yes something like a Ghorgon or Dragon Ogre Shaggoth is better against large targets, however they will beat most of the Lizardman Dino's to death, with the exceptions being the Carnosaur (sometimes they'll still stunlock it though), and the Dread Saurian, though two Giants can usually kill one. Now granted Giants are not quite as good in campaign as they are in multiplayer, and yes, missile-focused factions can just shoot them. As of right now, I think Orion is able to do this kind of playstyle still, but honestly you could probably beat the game faster by bribing people to be your friends. He certainly would be past turn 50+ after 15 hours if he'd done that, but obviously the point was to have fun tree-ball armies running around. If your military might is too great, factions that hate you will team up to take you down, and you will lose friends since they fear you'll turn on them as well, which is why you saw the bizarre Orc-Skaven alliance at the end.
My impression of the wood elves is that they aren’t “Expansionist” in the “take control” sense. They’re more like “Get off my lawn!” except they will actively grab NEW places to call “their lawn” for the sole purpose of kicking people off of it. It’s not so THEY can use it, they just want to make sure that NOBODY ELSE can take a certain piece of territory, even if they weren’t ever going to use it either. …Does this make the Wood Elves a Homeowner’s Association, kicking out and bullying the neighbors to raise the “property values”?🤔
It's actually a lil more nefarious; The forest itself is alive, sapient, shares a hivemind, and wants to expand. It also, may or may not consider wood elves disposable brainwashable pawns to utilize to its own end. So less like, Homeowner's Association, and more mafia real estate extortion... Though still a bit homeowner's association.
Worth noting that CA knew the Gaean Vale would be a hard forest to take because it is the closest to the heart of Ulthuan and therefore super insulated from everyone else. So if you're playing the Wood Elves then there's an event that will fire that goes "oh no Chaos forces have burned down the Gaean Vale" and then you can swoop in and take it
32:50 actually, it's a great observation... when choosing units, hitbox plays a big role... When a unit is surrounded, it gets attacked by all entities that are in contact with it... By that standard, giants are GREAT, against melee infantry...cause they are mostly vertical and so few entities actually touch them, as opposed to the new kislev Drake or "Horizontal" entities. On the flip side, if a unit is too vertical, it's easier for ranged to attack them, as opposed to, if they are low to the ground, the ranged units have to shoot through friendlies, or are at least hitting some of them.
32:59 So giants are weird, if you’re going against infantry and monsters they slap so hard. But against missile heavy armies they are exactly like you said, completely turned into pincushions. It’s one of those units where you really need to think before getting them since they are so high tiered and expensive, and your faction may have a better single model monster for your army. But if it is just swaths of infantry? Oh boy, it’s so fun to watch them turn people to mush.
And to answer your other question during the wild hunt Orions armies can teleport at will otherwise it has a cooldown that reduces the more forrests you have healed
The amber system is still in place but it got buffed to hell and with the extra woodgrove mechanic of protect surounding tree they became a snowballing effect
If you're fighting a strong enemy you can send two armies deep into their territory to go around razing cities. This works to pull some armies of theirs away from the frontlines where you'll be occupying, while also weakening them.
That sounds like a great strat to use when a full frontal assault won't work. Will have to remember to use it in one of my campaigns when the situation calls for it.
giants are amazing fighters, can solo many lords apart from the most powerful duelists however their size and low speed make them just the easiest ranged targets so they rarely are able to use their combat power to be a good monster you generally have to be fast, have a low profile hitbox and good attack animations, giants just stand in a spot and swing their club or roar so they never are able to dodge much
5:20 All factions in the game have many features that strengthen them at different stages of the game, and it’s actually quite difficult to say exactly who is early-heavy or late-heavy Dwarfs and lizardmans are early game heavy factions. The reason is the extremely strong T1-2 infantry. (in multiplayer, ordinary saurus warriors cost about 700 gold, which is 2-3 times more expensive than T1-2 infantry of other factions, and the price is almost the same as elite units) At the same time, both factions have a very strong late game. Dwarves due to artillery, a very powerful economy and technology tree. Lizardmen are strong in the late game due to very powerful heroes, who all receive powerful and multifunctional mounts Nevertheless, I would put the Skaven as the MOST powerful in the late game due to their underground empire, a very diverse roster of cheap units, a strong economy and the ability to instantly rebuild settlements; and the Wood Elves because of their incredibly powerful stealth archers (waywatchers ones); maybe warriors of chaos, because by the end of the game they accumulate so many souls that they can drown the world in endless daemons (+their legendary lords are definitely the strongest in the game) The only faction in the game that works on the principle of incredible potential in one stage of the game and helplessness at the other is Khorne. Skarbrand fights 2-3 times more battles per turn than other factions. VERY quickly expanding his empire of ruins. He gains level 30 when everyone else is at 10 levels. (while being potentially the strongest solo lord in the game) And he builds up a million armies on the ruins, which multiply the rate of destruction of the surrounding factions. (while simultaneously destroying the economy of Skarbrand itself). But as soon as Skarbrand loses his momentum (loses in a couple of battles, or the game drags on). Re-recruiting a new army of demons is very difficult. Khornate settlements have almost no incom. And Khornate demons LITERALLY EAT GOLD (there is no other way to explain the price tags for hiring and maintaining them). Developing settlements is again very difficult, time-consuming and expensive. As a result, Skarbrand is left alone against the whole world
Early game factions are going to be your 'sack' factions like skarbrand, tzzeench, and the greenskins (with the possible exception of Grimgor Ironhide). Basically all the armies that are really good against the weak low-level garrisons. But fall off hard due to low leadership, lack of ranged options, or both. And also their settlements don't produce all that much income. So as they tried to field the bigger armies they're just going to have to be more aggressive.
Manfred play, get boost of population and upgrade capital to lvl 5 and build all defensive building, then sneak beside the capital and wait for Setrra to attack and fight the battle army 20 + City 20 vs Setrra 20. Once defeated he is doomed.
Here to suggest Mandalore's Marathon reviews. 'Pathways into Darkness' is the first one, and the combination of innovation, incredibly ballsy choices and insane, spiralling, inter-connected lore would be fantastic to see you experience. Keep up the great work as usual!
the autoresolve seems to very highly rate armour which the woodelves sorely lack. with the stegadons i'm not 100% sure but i dont think it factors in healing so it works out that your stegadons should take enough damage to die even though in battle you woould heal them
I need to play asrai again. I've been chewing on a kislev campaign as kostaltyn, which is fun enough but it constantly annoys me that parts of norsca on the map are chaos wastes not polar. There isn't enough polar tiles on the map ffs.
If you like this sort of Warhammer content, I'd check out Brilliant Stupidity, who is another Warhammer Total War youtuber. He mostly does some pretty unhinged challenge runs, such as winning a campaign as the Skaven with only Skavenslaves, etc. Very funny and worth a look.
Standard giants for the greenskins or chaos factions are pretty trash. They're slow, nice, big targets for ranged units that don't output as much damage as you expect since each unit has a max number of entities they can hit with a single attack. So while it may send some infantry units flying back, they aren't actually all receiving damage from the giant's swing. Most other factions that have a giant like unit usually gets some good stuff along with it. Ancient Treemen are heavily armored, similar deal with Hierotitans (who also get free spells to cast), and the Necrofex Collosus and Bone Giant are primarily used as artillery pieces
The lore for Orion fighting wood elves is that Glade Lord entered the forbidden side of Athel Loren, AKA the part where reality begins breaking down, and he was corrupted by Slaanesh there. The Dreaming Wood is Slaanesh's territory, and it exists as a separate dimension that overlaps Athel Loren, however going there also allows you to see into the future, so brave and/or stupid elves will enter it in an attempt to gain insight.
Normally there isn't actually much danger from the Dreaming Wood, since the portals to it are very rare, only open for short periods, and as far as we know daemons don't leave through them, so if you ignore them they go away.
Giants are actually pretty good, and they're surprisingly good at duels, including monster duels. This is because they have great animations, meaning they swing fast, connect often, and hit hard. It isn't uncommon to find battles where a Giant easily beats another monster to death because its attacks stun the opponent for long enough that the Giant is able to begin another animation before its opponent can retaliate. Yes something like a Ghorgon or Dragon Ogre Shaggoth is better against large targets, however they will beat most of the Lizardman Dino's to death, with the exceptions being the Carnosaur (sometimes they'll still stunlock it though), and the Dread Saurian, though two Giants can usually kill one.
Now granted Giants are not quite as good in campaign as they are in multiplayer, and yes, missile-focused factions can just shoot them.
As of right now, I think Orion is able to do this kind of playstyle still, but honestly you could probably beat the game faster by bribing people to be your friends. He certainly would be past turn 50+ after 15 hours if he'd done that, but obviously the point was to have fun tree-ball armies running around.
If your military might is too great, factions that hate you will team up to take you down, and you will lose friends since they fear you'll turn on them as well, which is why you saw the bizarre Orc-Skaven alliance at the end.
My impression of the wood elves is that they aren’t “Expansionist” in the “take control” sense. They’re more like “Get off my lawn!” except they will actively grab NEW places to call “their lawn” for the sole purpose of kicking people off of it. It’s not so THEY can use it, they just want to make sure that NOBODY ELSE can take a certain piece of territory, even if they weren’t ever going to use it either.
…Does this make the Wood Elves a Homeowner’s Association, kicking out and bullying the neighbors to raise the “property values”?🤔
It's actually a lil more nefarious; The forest itself is alive, sapient, shares a hivemind, and wants to expand. It also, may or may not consider wood elves disposable brainwashable pawns to utilize to its own end.
So less like, Homeowner's Association, and more mafia real estate extortion... Though still a bit homeowner's association.
Worth noting that CA knew the Gaean Vale would be a hard forest to take because it is the closest to the heart of Ulthuan and therefore super insulated from everyone else. So if you're playing the Wood Elves then there's an event that will fire that goes "oh no Chaos forces have burned down the Gaean Vale" and then you can swoop in and take it
32:50 actually, it's a great observation... when choosing units, hitbox plays a big role...
When a unit is surrounded, it gets attacked by all entities that are in contact with it...
By that standard, giants are GREAT, against melee infantry...cause they are mostly vertical and so few entities actually touch them, as opposed to the new kislev Drake or "Horizontal" entities.
On the flip side, if a unit is too vertical, it's easier for ranged to attack them, as opposed to, if they are low to the ground, the ranged units have to shoot through friendlies, or are at least hitting some of them.
So it's mostly situational
It's really quite sad that the frost wyrm sucks, because their animations (if a little reused) and model are neato
Rip Frost worms. Giants can absolutely stomp things, though, just gotta support them right. Very damage, much smash.
"That reminds me of one scene from Vinland Saga." Me: "Oh no! Not the Thorkell's kebab!" 😂
32:59 So giants are weird, if you’re going against infantry and monsters they slap so hard. But against missile heavy armies they are exactly like you said, completely turned into pincushions. It’s one of those units where you really need to think before getting them since they are so high tiered and expensive, and your faction may have a better single model monster for your army.
But if it is just swaths of infantry? Oh boy, it’s so fun to watch them turn people to mush.
Wood elves are very much a build tall not wide faction.
waywatchers can fire while moving and have 360 firing range. Also stalk and crazy range
And to answer your other question during the wild hunt Orions armies can teleport at will otherwise it has a cooldown that reduces the more forrests you have healed
The amber system is still in place but it got buffed to hell and with the extra woodgrove mechanic of protect surounding tree they became a snowballing effect
If you're fighting a strong enemy you can send two armies deep into their territory to go around razing cities. This works to pull some armies of theirs away from the frontlines where you'll be occupying, while also weakening them.
That sounds like a great strat to use when a full frontal assault won't work. Will have to remember to use it in one of my campaigns when the situation calls for it.
@@TheLegitWeebs The wealth gathered from the razing can also let you raise some emergency armies and run a deficit for a bit. :) Love your videos man.
giants are amazing fighters, can solo many lords apart from the most powerful duelists
however their size and low speed make them just the easiest ranged targets so they rarely are able to use their combat power
to be a good monster you generally have to be fast, have a low profile hitbox and good attack animations, giants just stand in a spot and swing their club or roar so they never are able to dodge much
5:20
All factions in the game have many features that strengthen them at different stages of the game, and it’s actually quite difficult to say exactly who is early-heavy or late-heavy
Dwarfs and lizardmans are early game heavy factions. The reason is the extremely strong T1-2 infantry. (in multiplayer, ordinary saurus warriors cost about 700 gold, which is 2-3 times more expensive than T1-2 infantry of other factions, and the price is almost the same as elite units) At the same time, both factions have a very strong late game. Dwarves due to artillery, a very powerful economy and technology tree. Lizardmen are strong in the late game due to very powerful heroes, who all receive powerful and multifunctional mounts
Nevertheless, I would put the Skaven as the MOST powerful in the late game due to their underground empire, a very diverse roster of cheap units, a strong economy and the ability to instantly rebuild settlements; and the Wood Elves because of their incredibly powerful stealth archers (waywatchers ones); maybe warriors of chaos, because by the end of the game they accumulate so many souls that they can drown the world in endless daemons (+their legendary lords are definitely the strongest in the game)
The only faction in the game that works on the principle of incredible potential in one stage of the game and helplessness at the other is Khorne. Skarbrand fights 2-3 times more battles per turn than other factions. VERY quickly expanding his empire of ruins. He gains level 30 when everyone else is at 10 levels. (while being potentially the strongest solo lord in the game) And he builds up a million armies on the ruins, which multiply the rate of destruction of the surrounding factions. (while simultaneously destroying the economy of Skarbrand itself).
But as soon as Skarbrand loses his momentum (loses in a couple of battles, or the game drags on). Re-recruiting a new army of demons is very difficult. Khornate settlements have almost no incom. And Khornate demons LITERALLY EAT GOLD (there is no other way to explain the price tags for hiring and maintaining them). Developing settlements is again very difficult, time-consuming and expensive. As a result, Skarbrand is left alone against the whole world
Early game factions are going to be your 'sack' factions like skarbrand, tzzeench, and the greenskins (with the possible exception of Grimgor Ironhide).
Basically all the armies that are really good against the weak low-level garrisons. But fall off hard due to low leadership, lack of ranged options, or both. And also their settlements don't produce all that much income. So as they tried to field the bigger armies they're just going to have to be more aggressive.
Manfred play, get boost of population and upgrade capital to lvl 5 and build all defensive building, then sneak beside the capital and wait for Setrra to attack and fight the battle army 20 + City 20 vs Setrra 20. Once defeated he is doomed.
Here to suggest Mandalore's Marathon reviews. 'Pathways into Darkness' is the first one, and the combination of innovation, incredibly ballsy choices and insane, spiralling, inter-connected lore would be fantastic to see you experience. Keep up the great work as usual!
Seen this suggested a bunch and have it saved on my list. I know nothing about that series, so I'm looking forward to seeing what it has to offer.
the autoresolve seems to very highly rate armour which the woodelves sorely lack. with the stegadons i'm not 100% sure but i dont think it factors in healing so it works out that your stegadons should take enough damage to die even though in battle you woould heal them
Giants actually make great character killers.
Personally I always play Sisters of Twilight when I play Asrai
I need to play asrai again. I've been chewing on a kislev campaign as kostaltyn, which is fun enough but it constantly annoys me that parts of norsca on the map are chaos wastes not polar. There isn't enough polar tiles on the map ffs.
Like in Tariff video - Cathay autoresolve - Sky Junk againt peasant spearmen - Kill the sky junk… 😮😊
If you like this sort of Warhammer content, I'd check out Brilliant Stupidity, who is another Warhammer Total War youtuber. He mostly does some pretty unhinged challenge runs, such as winning a campaign as the Skaven with only Skavenslaves, etc. Very funny and worth a look.
Standard giants for the greenskins or chaos factions are pretty trash. They're slow, nice, big targets for ranged units that don't output as much damage as you expect since each unit has a max number of entities they can hit with a single attack. So while it may send some infantry units flying back, they aren't actually all receiving damage from the giant's swing.
Most other factions that have a giant like unit usually gets some good stuff along with it. Ancient Treemen are heavily armored, similar deal with Hierotitans (who also get free spells to cast), and the Necrofex Collosus and Bone Giant are primarily used as artillery pieces
They work very similarly to the Nagash mod. If your planning on playing it
Thorkell the tall hell yeah
you should do a vid on reggies grom vid you havnt done much on the greenskins which have the most starting factions and everyone fights
I definitely haven't checked out much Green skin gameplay. Will make sure to check out some more when I can.
Thanks for the video
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