“Pope Francis and Vatican II” (2020 Napa Institute Keynote)
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- Friends, some Catholics in America today are increasingly vocal in their attacks on the Second Vatican Council-an ecumenical council of the Church summoned and presided over by the successor of Peter. How should we understand this disturbing trend?
In this keynote talk from the 2020 Napa Institute, I trace the missionary purpose of Vatican II from the conciliar texts themselves, through the New Evangelization, and finally to the Magisterium of Pope Francis, whose influences situate him in a particular camp in this history.
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I was born in 72. I read LUMEN GENTIUM and DEI VERBUM for the very first time...I cried with joy, because they capture the call to mission, the return to original Grace and annointing of who we are and why we exist as a Church. If we keep looking back wishing for an age gone we lose sight of the blessings God wishes to bestow upon us today! God makes ALL THINGS NEW! Praise be Jesus Christ!
We must learn from Biblical history and avoid repeating what the People of Israel did; avoid becoming like the Pharisees and Saducees who Jesus challenged.
May we submit to His Divine Will and receive His Divine Mercy and repent for our bitterness, resentment and judgmental hearts.
Very well said I agree!
Well said!
Don't know anything about these books. Also born in 72. And I truly don't get it. All this fuss about the Vatican II. I devoutly receive communion in my hands as I was tought as a child doing her First Holy Communion
Vanessa Du Preez You were taught wrong, the Holy Spirit guided the church to only allow communion to be received on the tongue, one cannot receive the communion reverently and devoutly when they do so as an act of rebellion against the traditions of the church.
@@lukebrady8966 and that is how I will continue to do it until. Y Pope tells my Cardinal to tell my diocese differently. Until then I will stand behind Pope Francis 100%
First we overlook evil, then we permit evil, then we legalize evil, then we promote evil, then we celebrate evil, then we persecute those who still call it evil. "Evil may have it's hour, but God will have His Day." -Archbishop Fullton J. Sheen. (I so dearly miss this man, we need more like him."
Yes Fulton Sheen was a great man of prayer !
Well said my friend, This Bishop Barron is in a different ball park to the Heavenly Bishop Fulton Sheen. He shouldn't even be a priest let alone a Bishop.
Wayne - here is a quote from venerable Fulton Sheen -when he looked back on his life and remembered;
Every afternoon about five-thirty, when i was studying for the priesthood in St Paul's seminary,the spiritual director would give a conference.
I was paying the usual amount of attention this particular day,when suddenly i stopped listening.
my mind seemed to be suffused with light,I heard not a word he uttered,but during that experience---I don't know how long it lasted-there came to me an illumination of soul, a light that suffused my intellect, bringing with it an overwhelming conviction of the certitude of the Faith.
The Creed and the affirmation " I believe " became not only an intellectual assent: I was momentarily possesses of the absolute and irrefutable character of Faith.
He never missed an hour of prayer before THE BLESSED SACRAMENT from that time to the day of his death.
What more can I say!
Peter J thank you for that quote 'beautiful' as I read it I got chills as if a presence had suddenly come over me, very moving, Thank God for people who still listened to Fulton Sheen and Thank God for Fulton Sheen. 🙏🏼
Wayne, in the confusing age we live in , on what do believe , or where have all our cetaintes gone- a quote from Fulton SHeen about the Vatican Council;
To be part of that Council, to mingle with more than 2000 bishops from different nationalities and cultures, and to sing the Creed together with them each morning is
A Council of Nations which would make the United Nations blush for want of a common commitment.
Wayne ,If , we Catholics, would again pray and believe the Creed , we would once again , become strong in our Faith-THE WONDERFUL CREED OF CHRISTENDOM.
To know what the Ancient Catholic Church ,believed , at all times and in all places, will give us security in this life and Eternal life in the next.
I could listen to Bishop Barron all day long. And sometimes I do!
Me too!!
Absolutely. I agree 💯
LOVED THIS!!! I've been disturbed by many RUclips influencers who slam Pope Francis, Bishop Barron, V2 etc - this talk settles me a great deal and calms the noise in my Spirit. THANK YOU Bishop Barron! God Bless.
That noise is the Holy Spirit trying to wake you up.You know deep down something is not right .Pray the rosary pray for discernment. This is all misdirection the church has been infiltrated and needs to clean house so it can be respected again.God works through the evil but right now the garden is being destroyed by weeds .
@@tomthx5804 So everything is all good in the church .Business as usual .Ok stay in you're fantasy .We are on the brink Satan has been unleashed .Deception and pride are his biggest tools .Dont get me wrong God works through all of it but the garbage bishops and laity in our church need to be put on blast .Pope Francis sides with NATO and talks down the most pro life president we have .There is something very wrong about that .I have faith in the church and respect the authority of apostolic succession that came directly from Jesus but we have had bad popes before God will work through it but to blindly follow and think it's all good is stupidity on a major level.Abortion is my litmus test.Peace be with you and pray the rosary every day .The church is the moral compass of the world and it is looked on as a joke because of all the scandals and lack of accountability. I have a very hard time defending my faith.I have gone to the traditionalist catholic church and I will ne er look back fssp latin mass .
@@tomthx5804 and isn't it odd Tom that Taylor's book is entitled "Infiltration". Seems he is the Infiltration and a form of the Smoke of Satan himself. Yikes - scary. As always, appreciate your comments.
@@markgonzales8778 remember that division is the mark of Satan, and Taylor has done a good job of creating much division among Catholics. Fortunately I only put my toe into the Taylor Marshall water- and immediately knew it was ominous by the inflated claims he was making, not in humility and a spirit for Truth, but in Pride and an almost glee and spirit of Drama. Plus it's a money-maker for him, and fame, and now he's all about Donald Trump. Way too much distraction and drama for me - I'll walk with Jesus and in line with the Pope and His Church, and in the manner and guidance of the Holy Spirit and the Blessed Virgin Mary. I don't need Taylor's advice or direction whatsoever. I'm lucky to live in London where we have an abundance of Latin Mass offerings. Peace to you.
@@markgonzales8778 Why do you have a hard time defending your faith? Maybe you're not grounded enough in it. There will always be scandal and trouble in the church - your job is to walk in Faith and not engage in the drama. I can see you're a devoted follower of Taylor, referencing Pope Francis and Donald Trump -that was one of Taylor's latest uploads. Disengaged from the Taylor mean-girls drama and just get your spirit settled in Jesus, Mary, the Rosary, obedience toward the Pope, respect for good men like Bishop Barron - BE HUMBLE, and prayerful, and you'll be just fine and well able to defend the Catholic Church- and no, it is not looked on as a joke.....can you honestly assess the state of the Catholic Church with well over 1 billion Catholics world-wide and think for a second that you can say you know the actual state of the Church? You don't have that kind of vision.
I am a new to the Catholic Church . Baptist background . and thank God for Bishop Barrons sane and sensible talks . Listened to dr Taylor and co and think it’s best I subscribe to bishop baron and not dr Taylor .. U.K. ...
You’re completely right. You should subscribe to Bishop Barron instead. On the same line, you can also follow Matt Fradd, Scott Hahn, Fr Mike Schmitz. May God bless your journey friend!
Bishop Barron's words are soothing and enlightening. When I hear Taylor Marshall his words tend to be venomous in nature.
Ralph Soothing words while the world burns
I've learned more from Taylor Marshall than I learned from my V2 catechism classes. (I sat in on an RCIA class in my parish years ago, and it was watered-down mush.) Even if you don't like Marshall's approach, he's not afraid to be Catholic, unlike most of the clergy I've seen throughout my life. If you want hard-hitting, courageous priests, I highly recommend Fr. James Altman (St James the Less, LaCrosse, WI), Fr. Richard Heilman, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, and Fr. Chris Alar (Marian Fathers of the Immaculate Conception) - his homilies are great, and he teaches about the faith live on Saturdays at 11am Eastern on RUclips (Divine Mercy Official). Welcome and God bless you.
@@greenacresgirl6259 So sad when the religious are more concerned about how someone sounds than someone who's not afraid to speak the cold hard truth. Catholicism is not your Children's bubble gum flavored Tylenol.
I was on the fringe and now I’m Catholic thanks to what bishop Barron is talking about here. I might not agree on absolutely everything pope Francis says or does, but I absolutely respect and love him as our Pope and as the successor of Peter. I might never have understood Catholicism if it wasn’t for his very open and loving attitude which was attractive to me when I was standing on the outside looking in. Personally I love everything medieval and I don’t mind hiding behind walls, but I think that saving souls is more important. Thank you so much for this video, Bishop Barron. God bless you.
Thank you so much Bishop for giving light about the Council to all the faithful. Catholics need it so much!
We didn't get so much liturgical craziness in Asia after the Council. But religious relativism has devastated our evangelistic fervour
Thanks Bishop Barron for engaging the conversation. Taylor Marshall, Church Militant, Tim Gordon and the like are enormously influential voices in the church. I listen to them all regularly and I watch almost all of your videos. You offer a healthy balance to the conversations. Thanks. What more can be done to fill the beige void in our hearts. Mine included. I’ve explored The Eastern Orthodox Churches and participated in there beautiful Divine Liturgies to help me. I want the West to be the “beautiful” you claim she is but on the regular day in and day out parish, that’s not what I (we) see. Thanks again for all you do to engage the culture. Pax Vobiscum
Tim Gordon, from what I understand, believes the VII documents are completely orthodox, it's just the implementation that was bad. This is very different to Dr Marshall, who, from what I understand, believes the VII documents themselves have errors.
I am regaining my love and respect for Bishop Barron in such a powerful way! I would have tried to uncover the reasons in the shadows for the voices against Vatican Ii and Pope Francis personally, but Bishop directed us to the light. Thank you. Be blessed.
Martin - the reason is logic itself. I would have said the same thing as you here ten years ago. But the more I studied, read historical papal documents, the easier it was to see that there is a very real riff and discontinuity. In the end, because I am a rational human being, I am by necessity being forced to side with either post V2 line of thought, or pre. They are not the same, so one simply have a choice to make. For me, why would I follow a novel 2% that was sprung from the idealistic age of hippies in the 60s which was incongruent with the historical? The catholic church has never been a "flavor of the day" institution.
Superb. Thank you Father Robert Barron. Sadly, it seems to me that many of the public comments completely miss the message of his video. As Father said, we baptized are charged with bringing the light of Christ to the fringes of society. Our doors are open to all and closed to none.
Awesome - better put the coffee on 😊
Thank you, Bishop Barron, for your faithful optimism for the Holy Catholic Church! I enjoyed your humorous query about whether the Holy Spirit slept through the years of 1962-1965. Certainly, the documents of Vatican II were developed under the inspiration and grace of the Holy Spirit! it's exactly why I believe the Church may stumble at times, with immorality of clergy, lack of faith and leadership from some of the hierarchy. and so on. I trust in the Holy Spirit to still be influencing the Church as a whole. There have been arguments and difficulties throughout Church history, and I believe the Church will survive and continue to grow in faithfulness. Jesus promised us.
“What about Chalcedon? 65%? What about the Nicene Creed?” Loved that line
J U just to clarify, it’s not that Hell will never prevails against the gates of the Church. It’s the Church who will prevail against the gates of Hell. I think you have switched who is offensive and defensive in the analogy.
Pfft you guys still do the council of Nicene? I bet you kids never heard of the council of Constantinople
6:40 "There's a name for that process. It's called protestantism." Well said, Bishop.
:I think you are right, because those who criticize Vatican II are former Protestants who became Catholics: God bless.
Amen to that!!!
@@DIS6103 Without naming names to give the person the attention the person obviously craves, we know whom you are referencing. The person obviously was not properly catechized.
@@metanoia1122 :Exactly, and more, they should familiarize themselves with the law and canonical instruction, they left Protestantism but Protestantism did not left them.
: God bless.
Pray for THAT person 🙏🏼 and May he come back and be a true warrior of Christ’s bride. There’s another who was never a Protestant, no? Anyway, pray for him too
I too lived through the implementation of Vatican II in the United States. It seems like in the US the Council served only to empower liberal Catholics to attempt to revolutionize the Church. Unfortunately, their revolution was not to implement the many good things in Vatican II you pointed out. It was about making the Church politically liberal. I associate Vatican II with the moral relativism that plagues the Church. I think the relativism drove the faithful into the arms of Evangelical Protestant congregations. This then accelerated the political liberalism of the Church. This is evident in how Cardinal Gregory of Washington, D.C. allowed President Biden and Speaker Pelosi use the Church as a back drop to legitimize their views on abortion, gay marriage, critical gender theory, and other political positions abhorrent to Catholic Doctrine. Do you realize that the "Catholic" president of the United States doesn't assert that God made them male and female, that that a family with a mother and a father is not preferable to any other, that abortion through and even immediately after birth is acceptable.
How can a Catholic of good conscience not see the blessing of these heretical positions by Cardinal Gregory to be the absolute height of relativism.
Bishop Baron when I listen to you I hear truth and love. When on occasion I tune into Taylor Marshal I hear mostly accusation and division. I don’t know what can be done about the divisive voices which have a captive audience. It bothers me when they choose to protest and insult the true Shepard’s of the church including Pope Francis. It is hard to watch this play out without feeling scared that the dark forces will succeed in dividing the faithful into camps against each other. Thank you for being such an beacon of light and truth.
Laudetur Jesus Christus When personal liturgical preferences and conspiracy theories are a major part of a systematic attack on the The Church I Love and Shepard’s I respect Taylor Marshal and his minions lose all my respect. I stand by my statement when you make accusation and division your mainstay you are working from the wrong playbook.
Thank you Bishop Barron for this beautiful, interesting and truthful talk.. I have never heard Vatican II explained the ways you have done it today, I have never been against Vatican II as it is a Church Council; However, I have always questioned the implementation of the Council. Your argument today has shown me how to defend that position. God bless you for the great work you are doing on behalf of our Church.
Bishop, thank you for sharing your concern about voices speaking against the legitimacy of the V2. It is a serious issue and you give a beautiful and passionate defense of the council. I myself have read the documents many times over the years. I have found them to be beautiful and reassuring for my faith in Jesus Christ and his Church. But, unfortunately, something very very terrible happened on the road to implementation of the "spirit" of V2. It has been (almost) a universal disaster! People left in great numbers. Priests and nuns left in great numbers. I too remember the Clown Masses and the Poka Masses. It is no small miracle I am a Catholic today but by the grace of God and the simple faith of my mother. Is it not understandable why people would question the council's legitimacy? Catechesis went from teaching about salvation history and our need for Jesus Christ to focusing on the need to just be "nice person". We are called to evangelize and spread the Gospel, but are told there are "many ways" to heaven. The liturgy was "updated" to the point 75% of Catholics do not believe in the Real Presence. Corruption and lack of accountability in the Church hierarchy has almost destroyed any moral authority the Church once held (still waiting on the report on McCarrick due last year from the Vatican). JPII and Benedict XVI worked hard to clean up the mess and there are many signs of hope, but serious damage has been done. I love the Church and I know the "gates of hell will not prevail". But I also know we are being purified. I'm not so sure the problem of some Catholics questioning the legitimacy of V2 is the most important thing to be concerned about right now. God Bless you in you ministry.
Couldn’t agree more Andrew! Thanks for putting many of our thoughts into words.
@@tomthx5804 - Yes ,Tom, the Church is always in need of reform ,and it starts with me !
Thank you again Bishop Barron,an eye opening message about Vatican I I , and our beloved Pope Francis. 🙏🛐☦️
Bishop, I agree with the content of your video, however, it is my opinion that the Church needs to address what I believe has given rise to believer's distrust of the Church. I believe this loss of trust is the precipitating factor that has caused people to question everything. Not only the obvious sin and corruption within those who hold Holy Orders, who make up the magisterium, but also the the massive theological dissent among the clergy. For more than 50 years, faithful Catholics can not count on priests in the parishes to speak with one voice on essential elements of the faith. Obviously, applying THE faith to any given culture takes on various methodologies, but TRUTH is not a variable! When will the hierarchy acknowledge that they are the ones who have created the situation in which faithful Catholics have lost trust! When will Bishops return to being Apostles of Christ ! Instead of being protectionary, self-referential and erudite, our bishops, priests, pope need to “rend their garments” over the pediphilia scandal! When has the heirachy truly exhibited lemenation over the abuse and the theological confusion so often perpetrated by dissenting church leaders? I’m afraid that while I believe the content of your video to be true, you have dismissed faithful Catholic’s legitimate desire for the pastor’s of the Church to be faithful to the gospel and to faithfully shepherd. In essence, you have done the opposite of what you said the council intended. You presented your position with an expectation of the “radtrads” to “come to your position.” I believe that you need to “go to where they are” and first, listen to them directly and then pastor them. This problem wasn’t created over night and the regaining of trust shouldn’t be expected to be regained as easily either. Until the hierarchy gets “it’s own house in order,” trust will remain illusive.
Perfectly said!
Very well said!
I agree!
A one glove fits all approach is not today's worldview - the diversity is extreme - it's hard to keep a steady hand against a "MY needs must be met" attitude. Jesus' two commandments are what matters most - surely when you enter the Lord's house it's all about Him - not what you perceive it should or shouldn't be - it's about illusive humility.
This.
Constantly hearing about how it wasnt implemented correctly. I'm genuinely interested: What would the church look like if it were "properly implemented?" Would we still have communion in the hand? (Making it seem like ordinary food and reducing belief in transubstantiation.) Would we still have women all over the alter? (Confusing the women priests issue and helping the secular "theres no difference between girls and boys" agenda.) Would we still have watered down theology and a mass that looks like a protestant service? (I have to pep talk myself at every mass to remind me that there actually is something supernatural going on and we are worshipping God inspite of the fact that nothing in the music, vestments, smells, sounds, etc, supports that idea.) I left the church, like many Gen Xers. I recently returned but I feel like so much is missing. I recently went to a Latin mass and I couldn't believe the difference. It was so respectful, everything drawing your attention to God- not to the priest, not to each other. When they got on their knees for holy communion, you knew people there believed. And there were lots of men, and not just old ones. (There are barely any men at my regular mass so this stuck out to me.) Why did they rip apart that mass? What in the world was wrong with it? I'm not going anywhere but I'm very dissillusioned in the church.
Amy, I found a traditional parish and had the same experience as you! View it as a gift and work very hard to bring others there and to also help promote it! God Bless!
Amy, the Latin Masses are full while the Novus Ordo masses are half empty or sometimes only a handful.
interesting comment. As a man, I notice the lessened appeal of the mass to men. To some extent, but not all, this is due to women running everything and perhaps indirectly influencing the local homilies.
@@Ezekiel336-16 How can you follow it if it's not in the vernacular? You look on the other side of the page and it's in English. Problem solved.
Don't be so subject to your emotions. Thats not what faith is about and its really easy to be fooled into thinking that mass is supposed to make you feel a certain way. Im not judging you, ive been swayed by this in the past too and i ended up leaving the church and eventually returning.
Thankyou Bishop. When I started listening and learning about Balthazar, I then did revisit the ideas that some were saying regarding our current Pope and now I realize that our present Pope is meeting those in the fringes and on their terms and finding the beauty and the good to share with us as an example of how to evangelise those who know nothing about Catholicism and Jesus.
I'm as Catholic as they come, having found the pearl of great price. I would die for Jesus and His Church were he to ask me to. I would never leave His Bride, no matter how dismal things appeared. That being said, I feel deeply hurt, betrayed even, as if it was my own parent who betrayed me. I openly wept during Mass after the McCarrick scandal broke and there was finally mention of it at my church (it took several weeks for anyone to address it). A letter was read from Bishop Sartan, a beautiful letter, apologizing to the laity for the failure of the episcopate. O, how my soul needed to hear these words as a balm from our shepherd. I take no issue with Vat II. I'm at home in the traditional or charismatic. I get it. Everyone is a critic. I just want my shepherd to be there for me, to defend me against the wolves that circle in our world-secularism, culture of death, cancel culture, religious persecution. We need truth--truth in charity, but truth, nonetheless. I plead with you, and all the bishops, please help your flock.
Teri, i understand your pain, but the bishops need the laity to pray for them and help them,they are also wounded
Teri, what oxygen is the lungs, pray is to the soul. Jesus remains the Good Shepherd ,who died for the bishops as well (they are also His sheep )
@@peterj6740 Of course pray for them, and all priest, and all laity, and for the Church. Of course. And yes, Jesus is THE GOOD SHEPHERD, but he appointed shepherds on earth to "feed his sheep". To hope and pray and ask that our bishops be on the front lines with the laity is, in my opinion, not asking too much.
Teri, St Paul , himself ,warned the Church shepherds at Ephesus ,-------I know after my departure ,fierce wolves will come in among you,not sparing the flock; and from among your own selves will arise men, speaking perverse things,to draw away the disciples after them.Therefore be alert---( acts 20 verse 29-31)
St Paul actually admonished them with tears for 3 years.
The bishops ,today, have an impossible job -the people have stopped listening and do not trust any so-called authority be that of Church or government.
There is a number of wolves among the shepherds today- and further -----
75 % of people do not trust The American Government and over 20% hate the government.
How many Catholics, today, trust the church after the handling, and cover ups of sexual abuse of children ( involving 5000 priests and growing,over a 60 year period)
The bishops have created such a problem for themselves , that the sheep have to help the shepherds to get rid of the wolves.
May God bless you,Teri, always and in all ways
Re: pope Francis; what is the justification of 1) the Pauche mamma,2) surrounding Chinese Catholics to the communist government 3) altering what St. John Paul started in regards to the family? Three strikes against him, as I see it. Thank you, bishop.
Pope Francis said that there were no idolatrous intentions. He doesn’t condone idol worship in the slightest.
Your Excellency, much of what I'm about to say you're keenly aware of, but I'd offer this. I frequently watch the content by many of the actors on social media you're alluding to. I agree with you, we cannot on one hand say the Church is the Church with the authority it carries and then say an Ecumenical council rightly convened and presided over by a Pope is not authoritative. That being said, I'd like to offer why these critics' arguments are finding such an audience.
The people these men are finding an audience with are orphans not only of the "beige catholicism" you're referencing with regards to liturgy, music and architecture, but also of a neutered clergy that repeatedly fails to proclaim Church teaching with verve and conviction. The now ubiquitous, agreeable, smiling, milktoast priest and bishop who dare not cause offense unless it is to finger wag at the "rigidity and clericalism" of devout Catholics, are losing their flocks. We need, and increasingly are demanding, that our priests and bishops be heroes. Strong men, of courage and conviction willing to stand against the storm of the culture and not endlessly bend the knee to it.
I consider myself an intellectual person and spend a lot of time on theology and history and moral philosophy. Those things are important, very important. That's admittedly though, not what first drew me to the faith. What got my foot in the door, if not completely across the threshold, was the sense, provided by art, architecture, liturgy and my interactions with some good priests, that Catholicism was set apart from the world and pulling mankind up to something transcendent. Imagine then my disappointment when I began to encounter the malaise present in great swaths of the Church after my baptism.
A wise person once said to me when speaking about secular political matters, "If you avoid facing an uncomfortable truth because it harms your larger narrative, you surrender it to your opposition, who will use it to lead people to falsehoods." I think this lends itself well to the divide within the Church as well. If we refuse to confront the damage caused by Vatican II's poor implementation with regards to liturgy, architecture, art, and most, most importantly, the unwillingness of priests to lead, we are going to lose our flocks to those willing to lead them, even into schism.
Sad to see only 13 (so far) likes for such an important comment! The second paragraph about agreeable clergy is so true. Priests are joking during mass and making unthinkable things to "stay in touch". The church is losing its attractivity because there is no longer truth in it. 95% of the people who called themselves "christians" live in the very same way as non-believers. The christian must be recognizable to soicety not by the fact they go to church on Sunday but by their deeds! If there is no difference in lives of christians apart from Sundays mornings, their faith has no meaning. You must live it to make it having a sense. Every day ask yourself: If Christ comes today to my home according to which of my acts will he recognize me as his follower? What have I done just and only for him and not for myself? When I daily ask myself this question, I very often end up with empty hands. On the other hand I dont go to church, am not baptised and dont feel "chosen", as Barron sadly called all baptised people. Anyway, we must fight hard to live for CHrist not only speak about it.
I liked your comment, but I believe that Bishop Barron has spoken about 'bad implementation'. Also, there are billions of Catholics since Vatican II - what I object to with some SM commentators is the 'notion' that ALL Catholics on the globe have the exact same experience after Vatican 2 as them. We don't. Likewise the notion that prevails in movie making today and journalism that ALL Catholics were abused. We weren't. These commentators sound very much like protestants - they want the Church but only bits of it and the rest in their own image. They speak about idols etc. and very derogatory about our Pope, and yet dont turn that critical eye on themselves and what they are idolising. The Holy Spirit is guiding the Church through the ages...this is a Catholic belief. These commentators obviously do not believe this.....ergo are they Catholic at all? They profess to be Catholic but they don't like a vatican council, because 'they' can do a better job than the Holy Spirit? The Holy Spirit unites, and sends the Church out with the great commission - Who sows division?
@@pop6997 The Church has been through far greater tumults than the cultural revolution in the West which has infected a great many within the Church. It will survive this time as it has any other. I also agree one can not reject the validity of Vatican II and simultaneously call themselves a Catholic in communion with Rome.
That being said, we absolutely can call to question the bad practices, bad theology and outright heresies promulgated by those claiming the "spirit of Vatican II," as though that means anything.
@@flyoptimum Yes, everybody can criticize another - we only have to open our mouths or type on our keyboards. One can sow many things...words are weapons, especially online where there is very little pause.
However, staying true to the notion of what it means to answer the question, 'Who do you say I am?' and the promise of a church that will be both loved and hated but true and preserved.
How can we reconcile this with people who say....'ah yer man that priest he swore, I heard it...' and the truly divisive person who divides according to his own will, and not just admonishing a local priest, but truly sowing division.....like Luther. Well meaning, but full of pride, enough to edit scripture itself, and then declare it a 'sola'
This is not Catholic....Catholics to my mind are trusting children of God, not calculating odds and worried that evil exists! They counter it by 'action' for the good...
Exemplify, the good rather than feel good by noting bad. If we can't trust providence, we feel the need to correct the council, what are we? Yes, by all means hold people to account, but how do you hold the Holy Spirit to account? So, I think the spirit of Vatican 2 is perhaps taking into its depths far more than you or I understand or can know...or see the fruits of.
God Bless, and help us all in challenging times.
@@pop6997 Yes, "exemplify the good, rather than feeling good by noting the bad". That is a solid truth for us to practise, on our spiritual journey. Thank you!
If a sports team has a great playbook but loses every game they play, something is wrong and must be addressed.
Bishop Barron, I love your line about "Christyfying the world." One question, however: how are Catholics supposed to "go forth" into the modern world and address modern issues (abortion, gender theory), when we have been largely taught a "beige Catholicism," are surrounded by banal litugries ('spirit of V2'), and a hierarchy who does not do much to shepherd its people into an orthodox faith? When 70+ % of the Church does not believe in the Real Presence, are we really equipped to bring the lumen to the gentis? I think we first need a strong orthodox base (supported by the hierarchy and proper liturgy) before the ideals of V2 can be achieved.
Educate yourself! Read the Bible, learn the Catechism. We are responsible for our own education. We can't blame other people forever.
@@peggyp3682 yea, great idea :) thats why I tell my children not to go to school but instead learn it all themselves. I think its so dumb to go to college or university too ... why have other people teach you anything when you can obviously do it all yourself.
Peggy P No, it is the job of the Bishops, the job that Christ bestowed upon them
@@lukebrady8966 We've just got to quit blaming and get back on track. Blaming fixes nothing and is a juvenile response to a problem. The Church will survive this like she always has.
Peggy P the church will survive, but that survival could simply be the pope and one faithful bishop. The church used to be present in North Africa, but the Muslims saw to the destruction of that. The collapse of the church in the west was caused by someone and something, and without naming what that is then it is impossible to rebuild.
Bishop, I keep wishing that you were my religious teacher back in parochial grade school. I am 55; well, better late than never. God bless you.
I am 63 - and wish the same. Cradle Catholic, but after years of sin and lukewarmness, am now reconciled & just starting out to learn my faith.
Since we are all confessing our age, I’m 66 and am a recently reconciled Catholic after many years of wandering the protestant desert. Bishop Barron has been enormously influential in helping me come home. The Holy Spirit is at work. Us old guys have a job to do!
@Greg Gauthier It is big and also powerful. We may be heading into pretty rough times. Whatever is happening, I'm just thankful that Jesus has given me the time and grace to come back to Him, in line with our Catholic Church and all its problems, and so glad I'm not caught into the TLM/Traditionalist trap of criticism and conspiracy. I look forward to learning and being clear on the beauty of TLM, but more importantly, on the beauty of our wonderful Holy Roman Catholic Church and its unity to Jesus, the Father and the H.S. Happy & grateful!
@@foolonthehill5065 Would be nice if we had an old-guys/gals society of returning Catholics. That could be a lot of fun! LOL. Don't know if you've seen The Journey Home on EWTN - but lots of old shows on RUclips that are interesting and informative.
The funny/sad/unfortunate part is that although I have had many sinful moments. I "thought", I knew our catholic faith. Of course I knew there was always more to learn. But I have spent a great deal of time, teaching what I now know is "watered down". Frustrating at first and for quite a bit of time; but now I know I/we must be use our new knowledge as a forward step to move/act motivationally/enthuastically/confidently/prayfully forward. God's will be done. Happy Feast of the Assumption!
Listened to you again this evening…..just amazing…..I sometimes forget how clear and totally insightful you are…..a very clear response to some agitated voices on you tube who are unfortunately addicted to controversy….thank you Father Barron…..in some ways you remind me of Father Wojtyla
I couldn't have converted without Vatican 2. In that sense the missionary desire of the council did in fact touch my soul.
Same here
@UCrkBUHpbwZV6Bs9j4Uk7pBg but you cannot prove that is *purely* because of the council, and not because of other factors already at work. The Protestants churches didn't have a council and yet they go through the same decline. You should not blame the council itself like bishop Barron said, and start looking at the implications
And docens of millions of catholics would not leave the Church if Vaticsn II never happended
You would not have converted, but my entire country would not have fallen into apostasy, so there’s that...
Thank you Bishop. I don't know what the church would do without you. You are a voice of reason in a world that seems to want to confuse things, in our time. God bless you 🙏❤️😇.
I've been studying and reading up on Catholicism for 2 months trying to get ready to join, I'm a young man late 20s and ready to join but I am paralyzed from joining because of people like Bishop Barron and Fr James Martin. Their is such dishonesty and smug obnoxiousness as they act so harshly and divisively to install modernism into the Catholic Church. And the forces pushing back against them, are so tepid. They behave EXACTLY as the dishonest left wing modernist corrupt teachers of our academic institutions do. and I know the character when I see it. False presences of piety and charity, meanwhile Bishop Barron is blocking dissident voices on social media, refusing to platform his critiques and refusing to speak to the millions who oppose him, whilst focusing on branding and marketing to the ignorant. It sickens me and repulses me and I believe it does our Lord and Savior too. So what then, do I join such a corrupt Church. I never understood the protestant message until I saw the likes of modernist corruptors like Barron and Martin.
But as EMJ says, if the disgusted leave, only the disgusting remain.
Im truly torn in my duty to God here. God please deliver us from Bishop Barron and Martin and the other hierarchy sowing division in the Church.
@JohnPeter515 I've profited from some of his homilies, he has real insight and understanding and knowledge. Which makes it all the more tragic, when he acquiesces to modernism, rather than thunder at it. See cowardice and denial of potential in people is despairing and demoralizing, especially when its people we admire.
We know that attacks on the Council itself aren't healthy, but we really should address the awful implementation of the Council. If we can't blame the current crisis entirely on the Council, we can at least say that the Council did not help prevent it. But more often than not the hierarchy won't even recognized that there is a crisis.
Poor catechesis is a real issue. Liturgical abuse is a real issue. And if it wasn't for the failure of the hierarchy, these "radtrads" wouldn't exist. We know that the texts of the Council are sound. Now let's talk about how we failed to live up to them.
For the record, I'm very fond of bishop Barron's "Communio way".
Agree! I support the legitimacy of V2 but realize that our bad litugies and 'beige' Catholicism being taught to us does not prepare us to go out into the world and address modern issues like abortion and gender theory. We FIRST need a strong orthodox faith or we will simply drown out there.
@Ian and oppose socialism, communism and postmodern ideology. Those are things which I find to be some of the most pertinent issues facing the world and the Church today.
To be clear: just because I want the Church to more seriously prepare us and defend against those things does not mean I want them to also ignore other issues such as environmentalism. We can't fight for every cause simulatenously. I am choosing to defend against these evils at this time.
@Ian What exactly about Jordan L's "ideology" do you have a problem with? There is no "liberal Catholic vs conservative Catholic" position on the issues of abortion and gender theory-the Church teaches they are wrong. If you disagree with this...I'll let you fill in the blank
Ian so are you saying you agree with the Church’s teaching on these issues, you just think many people are too obsessed with these two issues?
@Ian Ian, I read your comments and Pascendi Domenici Gregis springs to mind.
What a treasure trove of knowledge. Thank God for Bishop Baron! Grateful for this enlightening talk. As a Layman I would never be able to make the connection and clearly appreciate the significance of the Vatican II in our lives as Christians-which
reiterates God's call for all of us to be His missionaries in the world.
Can you address other fellow bishops who are questioning V2? These social media voices you speak of are taking their lead from them (Vigano and Schneider in particular).
Pope Francis said the Lord wills other religions... it’s unjust to question that?
Infallibility doesn't mean impeccability
I am one of His sheep but I belong to His flock
He clarified that was speaking of the permissive will of God. Other religions may not be the true one, but they do teach many truths, and we know that whatever is truthful in any other religion is willed directly and inspired by God. There is no truth apart from God.
@@ThePleasent1 That's an insult to the Vicar of Christ, or the sweet Christ on earth, as St. Catherine of Sienna was fond of saying. Whoever insults the Vicar of Christ, insults Christ himself and, therefore, insults Christ's Church and, therefore, I take it personally as a member of this Church. I would think this insult is a grave sin, and I would be very grateful if you delete it, please.
Thank you Bishop Barron, as I interact with Catholic speakers on social media, it disheartens me that so many ( including priests) seem to have an agenda that displays to those of us yearning to learn how to be better at being an evangelistic Catholic, that the Church is all about ‘navel - gazing’. Our Beloved Church is truly in crisis in our world... the secularist world, satan itself, will tear her down by fragmenting the Church from within, it’s time to ‘go out and be the light to the nations’ together, not bickering like self centred siblings.
‘You are Peter, and on this rock I build my Church, and not even the gates of hell will prevail against it’ It is God’s Will yhat we make His agenda the ONLY agenda’
You help us to see the church the way it was meant to be seen. Thank You
The root of the destruction of the Latin liturgy was VII. We need to rediscover the beauty of the Roman rite.
No you need to rediscover the beauty of God's love.
@@Brian-kz1fd ahh no. Thank you for you liberal neo-modern answer but that's not what I need. Because I know that God loves us all and he is worthy of our praise I want to give him the most reverence especially when I worship him. That can be found in the TLM. The NO can never ne compared to the old mass in terms of reverence!
@@fadibuni "The devil can imitate humility but not OBEDIENCE." - St. Faustina
"He who is not with the Pope is not with God." - Sr Lucia
@@AKdon68 do you know what I don't like? Those that throw random quotes and try to put you in a "gotcha" moment without even understanding the other person's opinion!
For the first quote, I do oney the church. At the same time, the church is not infallible in how to celebrate mass or the other rites. Meaning it can make mistakes or practices that do not make sense. To those I object. Although they are not sinful, yet they at least don't make sense, and at worst represent a theology that can be understood in a wrong way. So just throwing a "let's obey the church" card on the table is not enough. Imagine you are born an Eastern Catholic. To obey the church for you would be to defend and accept ordaining married men into priesthood. Obedience for a Latin rite Catholics is to defend mandatory celibacy for priests. Now, the two Catholics are both fully Catholic, yet "Obedience" for them is different. Obedience does not answer the question of how wise or good a practice is. That is to be discussed in charity.
For the last quote, I don't know why you assume I am not with the Pope? To correct the wrong does not equal opposing the Pope. His Holiness is not infallible when it comes to practices. Only in Dogma and morality.
I grew up with Latin liturgy, but I lived a glorious opening of my spirit. After Vatican Ii, and renewal of the liturgy. Truly Holy Spirit led me in my personal renewal as one in the renewed Catholic church. Been daily Mass attendee since then.
"The devil can imitate humility but not OBEDIENCE." - St. Faustina
"He who is not with the Pope is not with God." - Sr Lucia
This quote came to mind while watching.
“Ministry can only be the sharing of the gift that was given to me. However and wherever I am, my work, like the Father’s, is to breathe a little life into those I know, help them to come to be a little more fully, a little more freely who they are.” Sister Kathleen McGuire, ASC (1937 - 1992, member of the Adorers of the Blood of Christ)
To add to the above: Sister Kathleen McGuire was one of five nuns from the Adorers of the Blood of Christ who had gone to Libera to do missionary work. Between October 20th and 23rd, 1992, Sister McGuire and the four women who she went with were caught in the crossfire of the First Liberian Civil War and unfortunately did not survive.
Excellent quote -hpa !
@@peterj6740 Thank you :)
Dear Bishop Barron I have just recentlly rejoined the catholic church. Thank you for your talk about Vat 2 if you had been against Pope Fances I would have left the faith immediatly. Thankyou so much and go bless you
Thank you so much Bishop Barron! Prayers from India!
Thank you for this video bishop, we have been waiting for it for a while now.
But there's a substantive difference between Trent and VII: one taught infallible dogma, the other made few infallible declarations and sought to change the *practises* of the Church. That difference makes Trent and VII incomparable
Every Ecumenical Council had its own historical context, bad argument. It's okay, you can deny the validity of an Ecumenical Council, so you'll just be another protestant.
He didn’t deny the validity of the council, so please don’t just putting words in his mouth. You’re right that every council has its own historical context, but he is also right that the Vatican II was different in nature than Trent and other councils.
@ I accept every honour and every claim the council made for itself, it just so happens that "infallibility" is not one of these claims. With this in mind, I am free to dispute a theological opinion expressed by the council that did not claim infallibility. I am not rejecting the council, simply looking at the situation as it stands.
@@tomthx5804 is lumen gentium infallible?
Edit: ordinary magisterium literally means its a fallible council with authority
Thank you Bishop Barron for being one of the best lights of our time defending Second Vatican Council & Pope Francis...to get out of the comfort zone & love people at the edges to bring them to Christ. Admirable!
One thing I am learning is to meet people where they are out in their journey to find a relationship with God and Jesus. We tend to forget that some are refused access to the gospels and even put in prison or worse for obtaining information. When we talk about these countries that deny access, we must remember to meet them on their level of understanding and knowledge. There is a very small opening of discourse in these countries in regard to outside faith At least this Pope is willing to utilize the "bridge" (Jesus), in a manner that may allow a crack in the severe wall that surrounds hardness of thought and heart, in a manner that may open a peek into dialogue. After reading one of the Pope's letters and reading about Balthasar's teachings, this Pope has stepped forward for dialogue with a country known for harshness. I am very pleased and I will keep hope for change.
So much to learn from you Bishop Barron and that is why I love listening to you ❤️ God Bless you 🙏
Thank you - thank you - thank you! I’ve been waiting for several years to hear someone in the Church speak of this divisive and growing problem.
Thank you, thank you, thank you! Speaking against scandalous teachings is essential leadership.
Tired of the constant changes and confusion in the last 60 yrs. The doors were thrown open and an ill wind entered. God help us. We are so worldly and sinful.
I remain Catholic because I believe in the development of doctrine. But I'm on a mission to find a church that is reverent enough to raise my children in. At our regular Novus Ordo parish where my daughter received her First Communion just last year, she has said she's no longer religious. She doesn't want to dress up for Mass and there's hardly any opportunity to pray in silence before, during, or after Mass due to the incessant "fellowship". When we visit Orthodox churches or TLM Mass, she's happy to dress up, she's on her best behavior. So I won't sacrifice my daughter's faith in order to blindly follow any and all directives from the papacy. Our faith is rooted in Christ, not the Vatican. I pray we'll be led to the unicorn church where there is still reverence for God but openness to some of the positive developments of Vatican 2. I won't stay in a church that is indistinguishable from a Protestant one. At that point, why be Catholic? Surely we can't deny the decay of faith of the laity since the tragic misapplications of the Novus Ordo Mass. We won't be a statistic of it. Our parish should be a help for families in this regard. We shouldn't have to fight uphill in spite of the complete lack of reverence and modesty at church of all places!
I repent of all I said about Francis. I have become a fan. I have learned the virtue of obedience and climbed out of the conspiracy well.
What a relief to hear someone who knows what true Roman Catholic teaching is and is prepared to answer the frenzy of hysterical nonsense perpetrated by Dr Taylor Marshall and his sad followers. May God bless Bishop Baron's work!
Amen
NOSTRA AETATE From the Second Vatican Council states things like: "Buddhism, in its various forms, realizes the radical insufficiency of this changeable world; it teaches a way by which men, in a devout and confident spirit, may be able either to acquire the state of perfect liberation, or attain, by their own efforts or through higher help, supreme illumination."
I believe that if you were to say this to Saint Peter himself or any other successor of Peter for almost 2000 years, nobody would agree.
The idea of Catholicism is that the doctrine and the apostolic tradition would remain through time also, Katholikos means "according to the whole" or "universal, but in the sense that it covers everything" and that includes TIME! so if the opposite happens, let's say TIME eats up the apostolic tradition instead of the tradition covering and remaining throughout TIME then we are not following the APOSTOLIC TRADITION of the faith.
This council WAS NOT a doctrinal council like every single council since the first one in Jerusalem. It was a "pastoral" council, and it could be corrected, or precised, in topics like the one I shared from Nostra Aetate. The many ambiguities of the council needs addressing, the results of the destruction and modernization of the Mass for example should be addressed yes or yes. More people should become aware of the things of the council that need correction, and the many things that were implemented that have destroyed the faith of the ages should be addressed, I don't understand why to avoid these issues.
Being all nice and naive about it won't solve anything.
Being CATHOLIC means being WHOLE according to Eternity, and the church has worked on that for 2000 years, one "pastoral" council cannot change the entire faith of many saints, because of modernization.
Modernism was condemned by Pope Saint Pius X and yet, we see this post conciliar church doing everything to be more "modern" instead of Catholic and Truthful.
Perhaps try going back and reading Nostra Ætate in full, in context.
Gregory Vess In what context that would be considered correct by any popes, fathers of the church, martyrs or the appostles themelves in the past?
Irod Jetson Have you gone back and read NA in its entirety? I’m not going to entertain further discussion on it unless you have.
@@gregoryvess7183 You are avoiding the fact that even though Nostra Aetate tries to "open up" dialogue between religions, and it says that "The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions", which is a very evangelical thing to do, Which is great and even the apostles and church fathers did so in order to evangelize the different parts of the world. But NO ONE would have said that perfect illumination and freedom can be found without being at least baptized.
Nostra Aetate at the very best is trying to be open to dialogue as the church has always done it from the very beginning (if you are one of those that believe in the "dark ages" then you might have to learn more history) and at the very worst it makes people be content with their false and incomplete religions thus never searching for Jesus or his Church (which is exactly what has happened all these years). And on other side it's just ambiguous and it doesn't make it clear for everyone.
Many missionaries that came to America trying to learn and being open to the religions and beliefs and languages of the natives in order to evangelize were killed or rejected because they were trying to show how their religions and prophecies would be fulfilled with Jesus Christ and his church, they were NOT ambiguous, they were open to dialogue but never being ambiguous, or never saying stuff like "you can find perfect illumination and freedom" in your current belief.
Irod Jetson Vatican II is not teaching that Buddhism is indeed a way to supreme illumination.
It’s discussing the fact that religions of all kinds have grappled with the age-old problems humanity faces and tried to come up with solutions to them. Thus it continues by observing that Buddhism teaches (other versions render this as “proposes”) a way to supreme illumination.
It’s not saying that people can obtain supreme illumination through Buddhism; it’s observing that Buddhism as a religion teaches or proposes such a way.
It really is a blessing to have someone like him making videos like these. Thanks Bishop Barron
Praise God Bishop Barron for defending the integrity of the CATHOLIC VATICAN 11. A GREAT WINDOW OF DEEPENING OF OUR FAITH IN GOD THROUGH JESUS CHRIST HIS INCARNATION, GUIDING OF THE HOLY SPIRIT IN THE CHURCH'S COMMUNAL & MISSIOLOGY ...TO BRING PEOPLE TO BELIEVE IN JESUS CHRIST, OUR SAVIOUR.
Complex teaching here, Bishop Barron. Even though it’s not easy to follow and comprehend nonetheless it sounds like music to the 👂. Jesus Christ shall continue to guide His Church and there’s no storm that will never wither away! God bless you for all you do for His Church!
Thank you so much Your Excellency, I have been waiting for your response to this vitriol that recently reared it's ugly head on social media. You were so gracious not to mention them by name. The mission is to Evangelize. "Unity Prevails Over Conflict".
What an awesome way to think.
Focusing on human flaws robs us of seeing the Graces of the Holy Spirit.
I appreciated your comment. As a protestant, I have learned it is vital to confess my sin to put my sin behind me, so that I can move forward in my Christian journey. Not to do so is to lack faith that God is willing and able to deal with my sin, and to fall behind in my own adventure of walking with Jesus Christ my Lord.
@@terryhemingway6983 Thanks for sharing Terry and yes your are spot on. Our own flaws and sin so often get in the way. Daily conversion "Metanoia" a penitent heart, and submitting our hearts to His Will, so that as His Will is brought forth we advance the Kingdom of God in our lives and are empowered by His Grace. Bless you brother! You are welcome and great to have you on here!
"Let the life out"? What exactly does that mean other than conform to modern culture? Has this new approach "Christified" the world? Whatever the intent was, the Church has modernized itself and has certainly not Christified the world. And from what I can see, the Church has not "gone forth". The evangelization I see is one of compromise and appeasement, and others see that as well. Why would people listen to a Church who has no respect for herself, who bows to popular culture and other religions, to include their idols?
As an everyday Catholic, your ivory tower references went way over my head. What I see, today, is the Eucharist being dished out from a kiosk at the back of the church like milk and cookies, by a lay person. I see a lay woman give a parish financial report in place of a homily. I see a Jesuit Priest sing in a band while a lay person returns the Body of Christ to the Tabernacle. And I had a priest try to sell Liberation Theology to me in the confessional. All this, while the hierarchy of the Church ignores sexual abuse and corruption and celebrates modern culture and other religions.
@@tomthx5804 Sure they do. The liturgical changes of Vatican II and its decree on ecumenism and interfaith dialogue are what directly led to several of the issues I noted above. And I'm just scratching the surface. Who are these "creepy, divisive extremists" you're talking about? I switched to an ICKSP parish where the TLM is celebrated and don't find them creepy or extreme at all. In fact, all the TLMs I've attended, FSSP and ICKSP, were reverent and welcoming. The reason I stopped going to NO Masses is because they were often not reverent, as noted above.
Finally!! I am so glad you are saying something. My sister is a young woman looking to be married and she says the only men she can find these days are men who are staunch traditionalists who are anti pope and anti Vatican II. Its so sad that our Church continues to splinter further and further with each passing decade. May we soon be united and may the young impressionable generation not be led astray by false shepards.
I’m so sorry to hear that. Btw catholicmatch.com might help your sister. In Christ!
Dear Bishop Barron,
I'm a Catholic from India. As a young Catholic, I am active in Social Media. Recently, I came across some American Catholics in the Social Media. And I was extremely saddened when I saw quite a lot of them Hating and Misrepresenting and Spreading Misunderstood Concepts about the Vatican Council 2 and also the Pope. The Hate towards the Vatican Council 2 by certain American Catholics who call themselves with a specific name on social media , mainly because they were unable to distinguish between the Council Itself Vs the Implementation specifically in America, is so Loud to the Point in which the Church is really Misrepresented. I always hope that these Catholics who also call themselves a specific name, stop spreading their Protestant or Luther Like Opposition towards the Catholic Church and it's Councils which is lead by the Holy Spirit! I also Hope that they look towards other nations of the Catholic Church in which the Vatican Council 2 was implemented Beautifully! I also hope that they realise the Difference Between Healthy Criticism and Straight Out useless Bashing. I am so Glad that You, Bishop Barron, are using your Platform to Truly Represent the Teachings and the Councils of the Catholic Church led by the Holy Spirit!
Thanking you from the Bottom of my Heart from the Other Side of the World, as a Fellow Catholic.
Yours Faithfully,
In Christ,
A young Catholic
Amen Amen from South Africa
@@liberator275 so when I visited Austria I went to mass and understood nothing. Not everyone is gifted with understanding languages so u r saying I must be lost in church instead of worshipping my God and my Savior. Interesting.
Where's the Mcarrick report?
Who? I don’t think I’ve ever head that name... 🤷♂️
Google him
McCarrick is a huge issue for the church and the American Bishops
Great analysis that puts Vatican II and Pope Francis in perspective and highlights the challenge within the church today by those who advance conspiracy theories against Vatican II and individual popes. I am always reminded of the fact that the sign of the presence of the Holy Spirit is unity and not strife. I cannot see those that create strife and division are motivated by the Spirit.
Matt, people are confused , because the Teaching authority is confused.
i was told decades ago that Vatican 2 was a pastoral council ,which even Pope Paul vi said it was. Now I hear the opposite !
The imagery of the laity bringing the light of Christ to the world draws a direct connection to the ceremonies of the Easter Vigil, when the Paschal Candle is lit, the congregants light candles, and the Easter Proclamation (the Exultet) is sung.
This video is the perfect invitation to American Catholics to give our misunderstood understanding of who Pope Francis' is a mulligan. I am embarrassed to say I haven't paid too much attention to Pope Francis since he was elected pope -- I listened to this video Bishop Baron fully aware of an uneasy indifference about his papacy. I LOVED Pope Benedict so I probably grieved a little after his resignation and then never reengaged 🤷🏻♀️. I haven't sought out or read anything he has written other than the paraphrases and summaries of others I admire who have been paying better attention than I. What I realize now, regrettably 🤦🏻♀️ is that the little knowledge I do have of our pope has been formed entirely in bits and pieces from the opinions of the most vocal and in this case more traditional (the ones i admire greatly!) voices in the Church. This was SO helpful! Thank you!!!
My gut instinct since Francis's arrival has been to write him off as a pinko, leftie, commo.
However.
The wisest, most genuine and saintly Catholic I know defines himself as, 'A Francis man.'
He cites the trials at Nuremberg and the finding that,'I was following orders,' was negated as an excuse for neglecting one's obligation to humanity.
He aligns this chapter with the necessity for Vatican II.
Yes, everyone has witnessed the weak-arsed priests and the bat-shit-crazy liturgies, but it has ever been thus. Before we'd even seen out the Acts of the Apostles there was division and dissent.
Barron's on the money.
@Fred Flintstone Borders create division. I'd rather live in a happy clappy world 😄
I appreciate you, Bishop Barron, for addressing social media trends head on. I'm about the same age as you; had no idea why the mass was said in Latin as a child; but welcomed the change to English, the altar being turned towards the people; etc. as a teen, I left my traditional Portuguese Catholic church. I traveled in evangelical churches for years, attended Bible school for 4 years...then no church at all for several years. I'm back in a (Protestant) church, but married to a non Christian. I listen to you and a few others, I love Pope Francis, love my catholic upbringing. I am praying for all who profess to be teachers because their job is weighty...to lead and guide the sheep. Many of those detractors of V2 or the pope (or you) are selling their merchandise, enriching themselves from their opinions. May the Holy Spirit guide us all to truth and love God & for one another.
Lagunatic Mom it has come out that Taylor Marshall was hired to bash Vat II.
Thank you Father...such a timely video that I desperately needed. I was against Pope Francis and was questioning Vatican II. Thank you for providing clarity and correction and may God bless your work!
Hitting the nail on the head. The crowd attacking Vatican II and calling it heretical is extremely vocal on social media
Maybe because the Pope and the Bishops are extremely quiet about what has happened to the church
Fr. Mike Gaitley from Marians of Divine Mercy Stockbridge MA just now put out an excellent video and addresses Vatican ll.
Hope in Mercy.
Worth a listen. God bless.
Joolz JAL Was Vatican II a mistake? Has Pope Francis departed from the teaching of his predecessors? Does the Holy Spirit have something to say about the troubles in the Church and the world today? Fr. Michael Gaitley, MIC, answers these questions and more..
ruclips.net/video/tS6n7NXe6EM/видео.html
Unfortunately, where has the message of "mercy" gotten us? It is an excuse for an acceptance of every type of sin. Remember, there is an equal balance of mercy and justice/judgement. There may not be as much mercy as we hope for, and many souls may be lost.
The Legion of Mary, founded in 1921, has been evangelizing for 100 years. Among other things, we knock on doors. Why are there not presidia set up in every Catholic parish? The aim of every parish organization ought to be evangelization.
Thank you for making this video, Bishop Barron, and for the outstanding FAQ on Vatican II at Word on Fire. God bless you!
Thank you Bishop.
What I believe will be a powerful thing to come out of Word on Fire is a course on the Constitutions of Vatican II. I have friends who don't like Vatican II but have never read it and friends who love the "Spirit of Vatican II" and never read any of it as well. A short course and study would be powerful for both sides.
What is intreating is that even as a non-catholic I would accept the authority of vatican II. Not on the basis of their infalibility, but on the basis that they are the ligitimate God ordained leaders of the catholic church. As such, one must either be a catholic and submit to the leadership of vatican II, or do neither.
I agree with 100% of Trent! Does Vatican 2 agree with all of the Council of Trent?
Mountain Stream yes that actually is heretical. St Paul said all Scripture is God breathed. The heresy of Marcion taught that the two testaments were from different Gods. I wouldn’t go there.
Mountain Stream Church Fathers such as Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, and Tertullian denounced Marcion as a heretic, and he was excommunicated by the church of Rome around 144 AD.
2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
Mountain Stream as many previous catechisms and councils affirm, there is no salvation outside of Jesus Christ.
Mountain Stream he authored the Old And New Testaments only.
You are a true Catholic Christian because you don’t create hate and anger like when I listen to Marshall and others who are know it all but has no light of Christ when they talk. Instead, you create love and understanding. Even with Pope Francis, I feel he’s misunderstood but I see our Pope as gentle, humble and a true example of Christ. Nothing like those people that says bad things about our Pope.
Great comment, walk in light, gather don't scatter.
Pope Paul VI made it clear in a public audience of January 12th, 1966 that the decrees of Vatican II were never stamped with the note of infallibility as he openly declared:
“There are those who ask what authority, what theological qualification, the Council intended to give to its teachings, knowing that it avoided issuing solemn dogmatic definitions backed by the Church's infallible teaching authority. The answer is known by those who remember the conciliar declaration of March 6, 1964, repeated on November 16, 1964. In view of the pastoral nature of the Council, it avoided proclaiming in an extraordinary manner any dogmas carrying the mark of infallibility.” (General Audience, December 1, 1966, published in the L'Osservatore Romano 1/21/1966)
Thank you, Bushop Barron for this response. I had heard these comments on several videos I was listening to, and was concerned.
Wonderful exposition. Thank you for sharing. I think you are bang on. May God bless you and your work.
I don't know what to think any more 😔 I feel a sense of despair at times, that there's so much confusion in the Church, and how can any of us get to Heaven. When I feel like this I end up thinking well maybe the "I'm ok, you're ok" mentality is right - everyone do as they see fit as per their own conscience, don't judge others, do unto them as you'd like them to do unto you, and hope for the best. I think people gravitate towards tradition because it seems to be to be a lot more clear, it's like we knew what we stood for and people desperately want that clarity and direction. I reminded of the multitude following Jesus and the disciples said should we turn them away, and he said no and had pity on them because they were like sheep without a sheperd...I Hope he still feels this way because right now I feel rudderless
Fellow believer- I have some helpful advice for you; Go back in history to the time of the Roman emperor, Constantine, 1700 years ago.
He was confused at that time, so he called together 300 bishops to Rome, from all over the Christian World, to work on an agreement, on the how and why and when of Christianity.They came up with our creed that we profess every Sunday mass
Pray that creed slowly day by day, and peace in your faith will come
Remember ,what oxygen is to the lungs, praying is to the soul
I believe in the one True God the master and sustainer of the whole universe and in the Messiah Jesus, whose love for us was stronger than death, because HE Is risen and risen in deed.This is the God, I worship,and believe in, and the God I love
Try to pray the Creed slowly, and the Our Father slowly for a fortnight, and God will reward you,-----I am certain-just try it-but persevere
May God bless you always and in all ways-God is the God of peace with no confusion
Itisntwhatyouknow it'swhoyouknow - Jesus - let Him be your rudder - He likes water and boats 😊 - He is your calm in the storm 💗
Just know that times are rough, but this only proves what Jesus has thought us. I don't fear, no matter how corrupt Church gets, God has final word and all bishops, priests and pope will be judged. It is our responsibility to pray for them. So in that sense we are also to blame. Have faith. This ship will not sink.
The word of God is the same Yesterday and today The teaching of the Church should be the same Yesterday Today and tomorrow
Marco , St Peter the Apostle, shortly before he was crucified, upside down, wrote his last letter to the Church
His last words of advice was BUT GROW IN THE GRACE AND KNOWLEDGE OF OUR LORD AND SAVIOUR JESUS CHRIST.To HIM BE GLORY BOTH NOW AND FOREVER> AMEN. Marco , as Christians we all need to grow in our understanding of 'the faith once delivered to the saints " and be continually reforming our misconceptions.
Remember at the Council of Trent, it took our fearless leaders 18 years to try an sort out the misconceptions of popular belief (1545-1563)
Marco, may God bless always and in all ways
This is just a storm for the church, the Holy Spirit will calm the storm so please don't jump off the boat. So get down on your knees.
@@joshuamoore8278 Sufficient for who, maybe those of the times.
@Leonardo's Truth But God still loves him anyway. It was a great comment.
Thank you! I shared it. I want to listen again tomorrow. It's almost midnight and I enjoyed the talk. There is a problem not just in America with Catholics attacking Pope Francis and Vatican II - the things I've seen, heard and read (online) is so disturbing. Thank you for your talk.
Thank you Bishop Barron for all your instruction and love for your virtual flock who need you so much to teach us and inform us with your God given gifts. All who have ears... LISTEN!
I’m so glad the Bishop spoke to this. I am disappointed by the Catholics who disabuse the leadership and processes so publicly which is disturbing and distracting. It’s simply their egos and the snake. Let’s get together and implement the themes therein. As a layperson that is what I need.
I love this speeh, Bishop Barron --- Plaase continue to support Pope Francis -- I pray the criticism, which is too much, would stop -- and to help I wlll post and repost this video. Please continue to support him.
Great!
I appreciate your message Msrg. Barron.
Lummen Gentium is what you have been for the people this Sunday with your message about Vatican II.
I certainly give thanks to God for this. Because if this were not this way, I think I would be protestant at this time.
Thanks for talk about our Pope Francis too. I studied with Jesuits since Pre-K to the 2nd year of college. You can say I am Jesuit without vows. Although I don’t approve some of the recent incidents, I understand most of the things Pope Francis has done. I can say that the Pope has straight good intentions for doing everything he has done. It is only that some conservative people don’t understand the Jesuit charity and empathy while try to reach all the people realms.
Thanks for your words in favor not of an ecclesial party, but in favor of the Church itself.
I do see a way to reconcile both. I think the main problem with the new evangelization is that when it is implemented, it is morphed into a protestant evangelical movement. It loses the Catholic culture and Tradition. This is the main problem the politically right Catholics see. This is why they want to go back to the old latin mass. The new evangelization needs to be like the first evangelization. It needs to be argued like the Apostles argued it, with typology. I do see a new culture being born, a new Catholic culture that is the same as the Apostle, but expressed in 21st century language. It will be a necessary culture. It will be bring many good things to the world to come.
Go forth! Go to the peripheries! BE a poor church! Bring the Lumen to the Gentium! "I AM a mission in this world" (EG, n.273). Brilliant lecture, Bishop Barron! Thanks for challenging ultra conservative, introverted Catholics whose aged, tired, joyless, Spirit-less faces and hate-filled criticisms do a great disservice to Christ. Viva il papa, Francesco! Let us move towards Synodality; for the whole Church is "Christian": anointed in The Anointed One, Christ Jesus!
Magnificent talk. Thanks Bishop Barron.
You are my "right-on" Bishop. Too much confusion going on, too much division and I don't understand a lot of it. Thank you -
Blessings and peace ♡
Hold the Lord's hand and peace will abide.
A very measured and mature response from bp Barron. Given the vitriol from the other side he would have been forgiven if he had been less measured.
It’s a fine example of Christ imitation, the bishop takes the vitriol upon himself so that his detractors may have a chance to reflect upon whether their vitriol is truly of God or if a darker power is involved.
Pax vobiscum!🙏
(Writing this from Alvastra where cistercienser monks built the first monestary in the Nordic region in the 12’th century. The ruins are an amazing, holy place.)
“Vitriol from the other side”, it’s humorous when people conveniently forget all the horrible things done and said against those who have simply sought to retain the TLM
@@lukebrady8966 I don't think Jesus would have a mass preference.
Brian Our Lord, through the Holy Spirit guided the church and its liturgical expressions, through the centuries. So yes, we can believe that god has a mass preference. For example, the Roman Canon has been in use for 1,500 years. By that continuity we must understand that god desired that this element of the mass be present in the Latin Rite.
The irony of being “more Catholic than the pope” is very sadly lost on a lot of people.
Pope Pius ix created a rod for the back of all future popes, by a setting up the first vatican council to proclaim, INFALLIBILITY FOR ALL POPES when they speak ex Cathedra.
There is now 2 classes of teaching in the Church today-infallible teachings and fallible teaching.
Pope Paul vi himself said the second Vatican Council was not ex Cathedra, so because of this statement -hence the modern confusion in the church, on what is true and what is false.The same pope said that the SMOKE OF SATAN HAD ENTERED INTO THE STRUCTURES OF THE CHURCH.Foolish statement-he should have used his charism and spoken ex Cathedra.Why did he not, because this was the time when EX CAthedra statements were urgently required.
Paul VI also made it clear that Vatican 2 was a pastoral council-how to proclaim, the faith once delivered to the saints in a modern setting
The modern Catholic Church is now in a state of confusion .I have asked in vain for years and years for a complete list of ex Cathedra statements.
No one is game enough to give an infallible list , because there are as many lists , as there are theologians.
Follow your own God- given conscience, and by your own conscience you will be judged by God.
Thank you, Bishop Barron! I wish I could hit the like button 1,000,000 times
God bless Bishop Barron for always speaking the truth in love.
You are certainly a good model, Bishop Barron, for what it means to evangelize and thank you for this talk. You spoke of spiritual treasures... and how it is time for us to open the doors and let the life out into the world. Thank you for recalling Pope John Paul II! As artist I am inspired every day by the now Saint John Paul II to do just that... let the life out... through the way of beauty... not always easy... but the LIGHT will shine!
Bishop Barron, I certainly can understand your frustration but... think of this frustration, When I was in college our Chaplain removed a very beautiful altar along with all the beautiful statues in our very beautiful St. Joseph's Chapel. In the altar's place he had a student make a macrame tree which was hung in place of the beautiful old altar. He then removed the first two rows of pews in front of the altar. This was so he could start mass by dancing in a black leotard in front of the altar before putting on his vestments to say mass. He stripped every bit of beauty out of that chapel in the name of Vatican 2.
Thanks Bishop for the informative and insghtful talk abt Vatican II. Am 34 years old and iv always bn confused by some folks who seem anti vatican II. I always knew the Holy Spirit has always guided the Church thru those councils starting from the council in the Acts of the apostles to the councils that determined the canon of the Bible, the councils that defined the creed. So to believe God didn't guide us in Vatican II bt believe He did in previous councils is a logical contradiction and a distrust of Jesus' own words - I am with u to the end of the age!
You said learn about what happened at the council, and realise that the holy spirit did not guide it, it was hijacked by an organised gang of liberal bishops.
@@lukebrady8966 -The great venerable Fulton sheen was present at the vatican Council. He said " to be part of that council, and to mingle with more than 2000 bishops from different nationalities and cultures, and to sing the creed together(in latin ) with them each morning,is a Council of nations which would make the United Nations blush for want of a common commitment." So I say to you ,Luke by way of encouragement, to pray the Creed slowly every day and confusion will subside.
I believe in one true God, because I believe about God and he is worthy of my devotion.
There were 168 general meetings and 10 plenary ones. there were 147 reports which came from 2212 speeches at the Second Vatican Council from October 1962 to December 8, 1965..
luke, there is so much we do not know, and in all humility, must admit our ignorance and pray for guidance.
luke, remember what oxygen is to the lungs, prayer is to the soul.
God ,bless you, luke
Peter J The testimony from many bishops is clear, most did not know what they were voting for. Most Bishops outside of France, Germany, Belgium and the Netherlands, had no knowledge of the liturgical movement or of nouvo theology. The council was hijacked, mostly because John XXIII allowed men, who had been condemned by Pius XII and Cardinal Ottaviani, to act as experts at the council, where they promptly reject all 70 of the prepatory schemas that had been written up by men like Marcel Lefebvre.
Luke , yes theologians who were downgraded before Vatican 2 , were promoted at vatican 2.
I think the main problem came at the first vatican council in 1870, when papal Infallibility was defined.
When a pope speaks ex Cathedra ,he is infallible. This, thereby created a huge problem for the Church.
The church now had 2 classes of teaching- FALLIBLE TEACHING AND INFALLIBLE TEACHING.
i have asked in vain for any theologian in the Church for a list of ex Cathedra statements or even how many ?
The standard answer it is very rare .OH I SAY HOW CONVENIENT !
THE POPE IN DECLARING HIS OWN INFALLIBILITY 150 YEARS AGO IS THE PROBLEM IN THE CHURCH today
Papal infallibility from a few statements, to creeping infallibility to more statements, to galloping infallibility to all statements.
Now it is starting to crash, too many catholics today believe Pope Francis is an anti-pope.
And now that is the irony of it all ! I can understand the frustration of archbishop leverbre- he was told by previous popes ,that he was doing a good job ---- and you know the rest , and the question remains did Christ promise infallibility to any human being at any time in history ?
God bless you , Luke -
@@peterj6740 Christ promised a special assistance of the Holy Spirit to Peter (and his successors). Papal infallibility is a derivation from that, but only as a last resort. In fact, it has been used only once in 150 years. It wasn't a doctrine "made up" by Vatican I, but a theological development of many centuries, and by the time of the Reformation it was pretty much a unanimous opinion among theologians and bishops. I believe it is a very necessary dogma, which Jesus himself willed when He made the promise to Peter. Think about it. The buck must stop somewhere. It may come the day when the Church will not be able to afford a state of permanent deliberation. It may come the day when the episcopal college will not be able to agree on a certain matter or, even worse, might reach a heretical conclusion which, thinking of so many bishops nowadays, doesn't strike me as too farfetched. Do you know that Humanae Vitae was given against the report of a pontifical commission that voted to approve a change in the Church's doctrine by 64 of its 69 members? Do you know that the majority of the US episcopate rejected the enciclical? (paradoxically, the dissenting vote in the commission was drafted by two american theologians... And one of them, a Jesuit!). What then? Should the Church disintegrate into its likely many different factions? Remember that the Vicar of Christ is not only a guarantor of the depositum fidei, but also of the unity of the Church. Christ delegated His authority mainly to the Apostolic Church but, being as He is God, knows perfectly well how Satan would try to tear apart His mystical body, and history has made it abundantly clear how right He was to establish a true hierarchy, and a primacy of one (a primus inter pares) among the top rung. Remember, His Church is a Kingdom, and no collegiate body has the last word in a true monarchy, not in a Davidic one, to be sure!
Bishop Barron I deeply respect you. However, as a lay person who grew up as a teenager and through my 20's in the Post Vatican II Council all we as lay people knew was the manner in which the council was implemented, particularly in the United States. I believe the council was necessary, I believe that had it been implemented the way the majority of council fathers had envisioned , it would have been incredible. However, it wasn't. Thankfully John Paul II and Pope Benedict brought back a sense of reverence to the liturgy. I have heard recently that 65% of Catholics do not believe in the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist. How deeply sad is that.